highaltitude.log.20121019

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[00:33] <daveake> Hi Lunar
[00:34] <daveake> Upu up late or early? :p
[00:34] <daveake> Dodgy ipv6 probably
[00:42] <Lunar_Lander> :P
[00:43] <Lunar_Lander> I got dl-fldigi to run with PulseAudio, so I could try to receive balloons approaching
[00:43] <Lunar_Lander> jcoxon said that one of his balloons could fly here on saturday
[00:51] <daveake> So you'll be tracking? When was the last time? :)
[00:51] <Lunar_Lander> :P Apex Alpha was my first and only flight to track so far
[00:52] <daveake> wow
[00:52] <daveake> We shall have to send some more your way
[00:52] <Lunar_Lander> :)
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[00:56] <daveake> How's your project going?
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[00:59] <Lunar_Lander> ah I haven't done much due to one remaining exam
[00:59] <Lunar_Lander> but I know what to change in the code to make it work
[01:00] <daveake> Good
[01:01] <daveake> So, any idea when the launch might be?
[01:02] <Lunar_Lander> good question
[01:02] <Lunar_Lander> given that DFS wants two weeks to work on a NOTAM request maybe in late November or so
[01:05] <daveake> Sounds good
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[01:05] <daveake> I think I have one each month (Oct, Nov, Dec)
[01:07] <Lunar_Lander> cool
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[02:24] <heathkid> anyone here near Indiana?
[02:27] <WillieNL> ola heathkid, heh ony people from india i know do you know also :)
[02:27] <heathkid> Indiana, USA
[02:28] <WillieNL> ahh thats in a other country indeed :)
[02:28] <heathkid> slightly
[02:28] <WillieNL> yeah couple miles :)
[02:28] <heathkid> same tech support though
[02:29] <heathkid> but yea, a few too many miles away to find someone doing launches
[02:29] <WillieNL> heh
[02:30] <WillieNL> mosth amateur launched are reported on blogs i think
[02:30] <WillieNL> launches*
[02:32] <WillieNL> anyway bbl
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[02:47] <heathkid> sorry if this is a *really* stupid question... but how do you calculate the ascent rate of helium and/or hydrogen?
[02:53] <daveake> heathkid: http://www.cusf.co.uk/calc/
[02:54] <daveake> Generally people aim for 5m/s (metres per second) ascent rate
[02:56] <heathkid> wow! thank you daveake
[02:56] <daveake> There's a box on the right to choose the gas
[02:56] <heathkid> I was looking at the Kaymont 600 for my first launch... a good choice???
[02:57] <heathkid> under 1kg payload
[02:58] <heathkid> I don't want to jump straight to the 3000 with a 1kg payload just yet...
[02:58] <heathkid> not for a first launch
[02:58] <heathkid> and no one helping me
[02:59] <daveake> Completely depends on what you want to achieve, and how much you want to spend!
[02:59] <heathkid> they just don't do this stuff out here
[02:59] <daveake> Roughly, a 1kg balloon and 1kg payload will get you to 100,000 feet
[02:59] <heathkid> ah
[02:59] <heathkid> now this is making sense
[03:00] <heathkid> so a 2kg balloon and a 2kg payload gets me to 100,000 feet
[03:00] <daveake> Not that simple!
[03:00] <heathkid> or a 2kg balloon and a 1kg payload is a waste of money
[03:00] <heathkid> never is
[03:01] <daveake> You'll get the "blackness of space" from 70,000 feet ish
[03:01] <heathkid> I want 125k feet
[03:02] <daveake> Play with the calc to see what you need for that
[03:02] <daveake> Why 125 in particular?
[03:02] <heathkid> sounds like a good number
[03:03] <daveake> Well you can do it, but you'll need a bigger balloon and quite a bit more gas
[03:03] <daveake> The photos aren't any better at 125k really, though you will of course get more of them
[03:04] <heathkid> I'm actually more interested in monitoring the temperature inversion
[03:04] <heathkid> though of course I'll be sending a live video feed
[03:05] <heathkid> well... sort of live (probably 5fps)
[03:05] <heathkid> at low-res
[03:05] <heathkid> with an onboard HD cam that I *hope* to recover! :)
[03:06] <daveake> If it's low-res, use something cheap and lose-a-ble
[03:07] <heathkid> the HD cam won't be loseable
[03:07] <heathkid> the low-res is just for real-time
[03:07] <daveake> You said "at low-res" and then "with an onboard HD cam"
[03:07] <heathkid> right
[03:08] <daveake> low-res < HD
[03:08] <heathkid> low-res live... onboard HD recording for later download
[03:08] <daveake> ok
[03:08] <heathkid> multiple cameras
[03:09] <heathkid> though I could probably do HD photos... just not a live video stream at 1080P
[03:09] <daveake> OK. You also said "won't be loseable". Don't fly anything not loseable
[03:09] <heathkid> you mean I might lose my new Yaesu HT?
[03:09] <heathkid> lol
[03:09] <heathkid> I know
[03:10] <heathkid> it's not flying on the first flight... Beofeng
[03:10] <heathkid> disposable dual-band
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[03:20] <heathkid> I need to find someone near me in the US who is doing this....
[03:22] <daveake> Ask on the GPSL list
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[03:25] <heathkid> looks like a Kaymont 3000 with a 1kg payload will do what I want...
[03:26] <heathkid> could push it to 1.5 kilos
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[03:30] <heathkid> GPSL list?
[03:36] <MLow> what i want to know is
[03:36] <MLow> when, i fix a problem, why it comes back as a problem
[03:36] <MLow> the amount of set backs in this project is too damn high
[03:41] <MLow> is it so much to ask, that i get 100% packet decoding success from 3 feet away
[03:44] <MLow> so far im 2 out of 4
[03:44] <MLow> woo 50%
[03:44] <MLow> can i send someone a packet sound file and they help me see if they can decode it
[03:44] <MLow> aprs
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[04:01] <MLow> <30% decode
[04:20] <MLow> the smaller my packet it seems the more often it decodes
[04:21] <MLow> would it be within aprs rules to do multiple packets, as in like one for gps into and one for telemetry
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[04:22] <x-f> UKHAS wiki is now pretty pretty
[04:22] <x-f> good morning and other time-of-the-day, people from different timezones
[04:25] <CanadaWest> x-f: good evening!
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[04:27] <Darkside> haha
[04:27] <Darkside> 3pm here
[04:40] <CanadaWest> 9:40pm here
[04:40] <CanadaWest> gonna reboot to play with tech
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[04:57] <MLow> i think i nailed it down
[04:57] <MLow> because if i tune to 144.385 i get way better decodes
[04:57] <MLow> it drifted down :(
[04:57] <MLow> now...how do i tune an hx1
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[05:06] <KT5TK> MLow: You tune a hx1 with the bias voltage that you apply to the varactor input.
[05:06] <KT5TK> Aka modulation pin.
[05:07] <KT5TK> For APRS try to make a longer series of 0s at the preamble
[05:07] <KT5TK> How do you generate the packet?
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[05:09] <MLow> KT5TK: :O
[05:09] <MLow> i meant the center frequency
[05:09] <MLow> but VERY HELPFUL
[05:09] <MLow> my mind is now open to many possibilities
[05:09] <MLow> can we actually send data over these?
[05:10] <KT5TK> Not sure if you can send an audio file. better put it somewhere on a webserver
[05:11] <MLow> i pulled the sticker off and there are some knobs
[05:11] <MLow> twisting the flat head knob seems to tune the center frequency a bit
[05:11] <MLow> with some trial and error im now at 90% or so decode
[05:11] <MLow> 20 packets good
[05:12] <MLow> out of 23
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[05:13] <MLow> whats a good rate of transmit for tracking, 61 seconds or so?
[05:14] <KT5TK> Depends on how much battery power you need to save.
[05:14] <KT5TK> I usually use 2 minutes
[05:14] <MLow> hm
[05:14] <MLow> good point
[05:14] <MLow> how long will 8 AA ultimate lithiums last
[05:14] <MLow> I suppose once it hits the ground your golden as long as it got the final make
[05:15] <KT5TK> With what power?
[05:15] <MLow> no clue
[05:15] <KT5TK> HX1? 100 mW?
[05:15] <MLow> HX1 300mw
[05:16] <KT5TK> OK, double 300 mW and calculate for 1s per cycle.
[05:16] <MLow> you maked my brain hurt
[05:16] <KT5TK> Then you need to add what the GPS consumes
[05:16] <MLow> i just worked a double shift lol
[05:17] <KT5TK> Understand, but when you know how it works you can always calculate it with the current values that you have
[05:17] <KT5TK> I have no way to guess what your GPS is.
[05:18] <MLow> total capacity in batteries AH, divide by consumption of devices = hours of operation?
[05:18] <KT5TK> yes, correct, but the consumption is not constant over time.
[05:19] <MLow> for some it is
[05:19] <MLow> like gps
[05:19] <MLow> and possibly other things
[05:19] <MLow> but i mean gps+radio is probably good enough to get a rough estimate
[05:19] <KT5TK> yes, unless you switch it off when you have the position like I do
[05:20] <MLow> wouldnt you also waste time waiting for a lock?
[05:20] <KT5TK> your APRS beacon is only 1 second per cycle.
[05:21] <KT5TK> Usually the GPS is the biggest power hog
[05:21] <MLow> so, npn transistor to turn on gps
[05:21] <MLow> wait for lock, beacon, sleep for interval...something like that?
[05:22] <KT5TK> That's one way to do it. I use a power regulator with an enable input pin.
[05:22] <MLow> gps in my case runs off of same supply
[05:22] <KT5TK> Yes. Check out my Pecan code/info
[05:23] <MLow> lol your call sign is the same backwards
[05:23] <MLow> ;B
[05:23] <KT5TK> http://kt5tk.tkrahn.com/download/PecanNut/
[05:23] <KT5TK> Yes the call is a palindrome :)
[05:24] <KT5TK> it's even the same backwards in cw
[05:24] <MLow> neeeerd
[05:24] <MLow> :)
[05:25] <MLow> uBlox?
[05:26] <KT5TK> Yes, it goes up to 50km altitude.
[05:27] <MLow> that is one godly board
[05:28] <KT5TK> A bit fiddly to solder, but I'm quite happy how the Pecans work
[05:28] <KT5TK> There are a few errors, but I'm about to make a version 2 and fix them
[05:29] <MLow> did you hot skillet solder them?
[05:29] <MLow> or no mask?
[05:29] <KT5TK> exactly
[05:29] <MLow> good lord
[05:29] <MLow> i bet you have a good iron
[05:29] <MLow> or grip
[05:30] <Darkside> soldering QFNs by hand is fun
[05:30] <KT5TK> No mask. I just dipped a wire in solder paste and dipped it on the PCB
[05:30] <Darkside> its possible to solder big QFNs without reflow, you just need lots of flux and patience
[05:30] <KT5TK> Darkside: actually not worse than the ADF
[05:30] <Darkside> and ideally large vias underneath the chip, so you can solder the ground pad
[05:30] <MLow> http://kt5tk.tkrahn.com/download/PecanNut/datasheets/si571.pdf this part intrigues me
[05:31] <Darkside> MLow: good luck getting some
[05:31] <Darkside> they're a bitch to get hold of, and bloody expensive
[05:31] <Darkside> but they are a very awesome part
[05:31] <KT5TK> I generally use a 19.44 MHz VCXO for $9 now
[05:32] <KT5TK> Just wanted to have the I2C lines in place so that I could use a Si
[05:32] <Darkside> footprint comparible?
[05:32] <Darkside> compatible*
[05:32] <KT5TK> 100%
[05:32] <Darkside> nice
[05:32] <Darkside> ok im off
[05:32] <Darkside> back later
[05:33] <MLow> im jelly of your skillz
[05:34] <KT5TK> https://www.mouser.com/ProjectManager/ProjectDetail.aspx?State=EDIT&ProjectGUID=f23a581d-3969-4fda-8e3e-b7dcedd1698f these are the parts I use atm
[05:34] <KT5TK> You can get an ADF7012 and a PA IC as a sample from Analog
[05:35] <MLow> waaaaay over my head
[05:36] <MLow> i can barely follow instructions to get a trackuino working
[05:36] <KT5TK> Only the BMP085 is from digikry
[05:36] <MLow> ofcourse you also made the pcb im sure
[05:36] <KT5TK> I started with Trackuino and the MX145 module
[05:37] <KT5TK> PCB from Seeed
[05:39] <Upu> morning
[05:40] <KT5TK> Morning Upu.
[05:40] <KT5TK> I soon need some more uBloxs
[05:40] <Upu> sure always have them in stock
[05:41] <MLow> i need to send my balloon up or I will lose it
[05:41] <Upu> might get some 1.8v ones this time round too
[05:41] <KT5TK> good. I still have 3
[05:41] <MLow> work another double tomorrow though
[05:41] <KT5TK> Yep maybe 1.8V. Have to redesign some parts of Pecan anyways.
[05:42] <Upu> makes a huge difference to battery life
[05:42] <Upu> cool payload just died so with a 3.3V board, uBlox and Adafruit GPS on it still get 10 hours from a single AA
[05:42] <KT5TK> My GPS is off 80% of the time, but yes, that's another saving
[05:43] <Upu> well
[05:43] <Upu> 3.3V board with MAX6 = 13 hours run time TXing continuous
[05:43] <Upu> exactly same board but running at 1.8V, and the µC @ 4Mhz = 27.5 hours
[05:44] <Upu> from a single AA
[05:44] <KT5TK> I wonder if I can still do 1200 baud APRS at 4 MHz
[05:44] <Upu> on the boost converter I'm using anyway
[05:44] <KT5TK> would be cool
[05:47] <KT5TK> Did you use sleep mode at your flight that died?
[05:47] <KT5TK> maybe brown out detection?
[05:49] <Upu> no turned it off
[05:49] <KT5TK> The uBlox GPS?
[05:50] <Upu> no the brown out detection
[05:50] <Upu> ok afk gtg to work
[05:50] <KT5TK> OK
[05:50] <MLow> thanks for all the help KT5TK
[05:50] <MLow> time for bed though
[05:51] <KT5TK> NP. check your Trackuino code for the 0s in the preamble.
[05:51] <MLow> ?
[05:52] <KT5TK> Works much better than the original trackuino code
[05:52] <KT5TK> You'll find comments in the Pecan code modem.c
[05:53] <KT5TK> modem.cpp actually
[05:55] <KT5TK> ax25_send_sync() in ax25.cpp
[05:56] <MLow> i think
[05:56] <MLow> we have very different code bases
[05:57] <MLow> trackuino 1.4 is what I started with and added my sensors
[05:57] <KT5TK> Not really. My stuff is mostly based on trackuino code
[05:58] <MLow> on a side note, for my bday my gf bought me a hakko fx-888 soldering station
[05:58] <MLow> how awesome is that
[05:59] <MLow> i have no ax25_send_sync
[05:59] <KT5TK> add ax25_send_sync to your code.
[05:59] <KT5TK> Nice soldering tool!
[06:00] <MLow> in ax25.cpp right?
[06:00] <MLow> just making sure
[06:01] <MLow> and this sends a tone of -
[06:01] <KT5TK> yes. Sending 0s before the actual packet will get the receiving modem easier in sync than sending flags
[06:01] <MLow> 0's before the main packet data?
[06:02] <KT5TK> in the encoding it will send 01010101010101...
[06:02] <MLow> i think I understand the principal
[06:02] <KT5TK> for the series of 0s
[06:02] <MLow> just not the nuts and bolts
[06:03] <MLow> and in my code here, it seems most of what you have in modem is in afsk_avr.cpp
[06:04] <MLow> the funtion ax25_send_flag()
[06:04] <MLow> looks a lot like your send_sync
[06:04] <KT5TK> The trackuino code sends a few ax25_send_flag(); if I remember correctly.
[06:04] <MLow> http://pastebin.com/D4eNXpaj
[06:05] <KT5TK> I send 30 0s and then the flag
[06:06] <MLow> send flag is sent once after the tx delay
[06:06] <KT5TK> Yes, but also when the frame gets opened
[06:06] <MLow> and you replace that with sending 30 0's and the flag?
[06:06] <MLow> "flag"
[06:07] <KT5TK> I reduce the number of flags, but I prepend the 0s
[06:08] <MLow> i see your code isnt using the TX_DELAY at all then?
[06:10] <KT5TK> In deed it appears I've dropped it
[06:10] <KT5TK> with enough 0s it's sufficient to open the squelch or DCD of the receiver
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[06:12] <MLow> i cant seem to find where this trackuino version stores "
[06:12] <MLow> modem_packet_size
[06:15] <KT5TK> it's a local variable in ax25_send_header()
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[06:16] <MLow> ah
[06:17] <MLow> you have modem_ added to your vars
[06:17] <MLow> they dont
[06:17] <MLow> ok it seems to compile now
[06:18] <MLow> and i altered header like yours
[06:18] <x-f> this is how programmers are kept awake :)
[06:18] <MLow> hm
[06:18] <MLow> there is a lot of silence at the begining of the packet now
[06:20] <MLow> interesting
[06:20] <MLow> well im decoding it less now
[06:20] <KT5TK> There should be no silence but a regular noise at the start
[06:22] <MLow> it seems to decode less reliably but maybe thats just a fluke
[06:22] <MLow> i suppose any number of factors could be at play with my problem of decoding
[06:24] <KT5TK> Silence at the begining is wrong
[06:24] <MLow> the rx radio could be too close or something
[06:25] <SamSilver> or you are suffering from "double-shift-titus"
[06:25] <MLow> lol
[06:25] <MLow> my code is all gibberish and i see godly lines of miracle code
[06:25] <MLow> wait that would be normal
[06:26] <KT5TK> you should be able to hear the 0s as a regular beeep sound
[06:26] <MLow> there is a delay from the squelch to the signal for sure
[06:27] <KT5TK> open the squelch completely for now
[06:28] <KT5TK> and make 60 or more 0s for testing
[06:29] <MLow> i can definitely hear the added tone
[06:29] <MLow> but still the silence
[06:29] <KT5TK> What receiver are you using?
[06:29] <KT5TK> What modem?
[06:29] <MLow> crappy ht
[06:30] <KT5TK> Cheap ht is sometimes the best for APRS.
[06:30] <MLow> well the car has a proper 2m rig
[06:30] <KT5TK> No filtering in the sound channel
[06:31] <MLow> the 2m rig is pretty damn old i bet it doesnt have squat
[06:34] <MLow> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12996303/silence.wma
[06:35] <fsphil> morning all
[06:36] <arko> good morning
[06:36] <arko> although its 11:36pm here
[06:36] <fsphil> 7:36 here.. wishing I was still in bed
[06:36] <KT5TK> MLow: i think I can hear the 0s. there is all kind of junk before it though
[06:36] <MLow> yeah
[06:37] <arko> haha
[06:37] <MLow> having a hard time decoding it still
[06:37] <MLow> 1 out of 3 is bad
[06:37] <MLow> from 4 feet
[06:37] <fsphil> typically this is probably when coffee would be useful
[06:37] <KT5TK> increase the deviation a bit
[06:37] <MLow> sure
[06:38] <MLow> how?
[06:38] <KT5TK> How do you modulate the htx?
[06:39] <MLow> with an arduino
[06:39] <KT5TK> are there any resistors or caps between them?
[06:40] <MLow> i have a tiny cap
[06:40] <KT5TK> value?
[06:40] <MLow> um lets see
[06:41] <KT5TK> Anything else versus GND?
[06:41] <MLow> 230pf
[06:42] <MLow> everything else i have is smaller
[06:42] <KT5TK> change this to 1000 pF ... 10 nF
[06:43] <KT5TK> or put a parallel cap to the existing one
[06:43] <MLow> i have a 100nf
[06:44] <KT5TK> That may be too big already. But try if you don't have anything else.
[06:44] <KT5TK> In case you're too high, you may put a resistor to ground
[06:45] <KT5TK> or decrease the amplitude in software.
[06:46] <MLow> it is much louder
[06:47] <MLow> but i dont think it is decoding any better
[06:47] <KT5TK> It may be too much deviation now.
[06:48] <KT5TK> http://kt5tk.tkrahn.com/download/PecanNut/code/pecan/scale_audio.ods
[06:49] <MLow> ods?
[06:50] <KT5TK> Open office spreadsheet
[06:51] <KT5TK> or Libre Office if you want
[06:51] <KT5TK> I think even Excel can import it nowadays
[06:51] <MLow> i use google docs :(
[06:51] <MLow> drag and drop worked
[06:52] <KT5TK> This is to scale the audio in the code
[06:52] <MLow> whoa now
[06:53] <MLow> ok so
[06:54] <KT5TK> Play around with that until you have the optimal deviation
[06:54] <MLow> i added a bunch of the 230pf together for nothing then?
[06:55] <KT5TK> :-D
[06:56] <KT5TK> 100 nF may be ok if you scale the audio down
[06:57] <MLow> it sounds like a siren
[06:57] <MLow> with that bugger on there
[06:58] <KT5TK> Start with scale factor 0.25 then
[06:58] <MLow> not sure i understand how this works
[06:58] <MLow> surely its not copy pasta?
[06:59] <KT5TK> copy & paste into a text editor and replace the tabs with commas
[06:59] <MLow> gotcha
[06:59] <MLow> hm
[07:00] <KT5TK> Obviously you need the range A29:U53
[07:01] <MLow> it stills sounds...
[07:02] <MLow> odd
[07:02] <MLow> compared to other local traffic
[07:02] <KT5TK> Still to much deviation?
[07:02] <MLow> ringy sounding
[07:03] <KT5TK> Do you have a waterfall for the audio spectrum? fldigi or so?
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[07:04] <MLow> a very tiny one in agwpe
[07:04] <KT5TK> Try to estimate the deviation in comparison to a good reference
[07:05] <MLow> well mine has red lines
[07:05] <MLow> none of the others do
[07:05] <MLow> i think thats the 0's
[07:05] <KT5TK> Doesn't that refer to signal intensity?
[07:05] <MLow> believe so
[07:05] <KT5TK> So only the width of the trace is important
[07:06] <MLow> i can screen shot if you wish
[07:06] <KT5TK> Do you have a rtl_sdr?
[07:06] <MLow> with comparison
[07:06] <KT5TK> ok
[07:08] <KT5TK> Maybe a sound file would be good
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[07:09] <MLow> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12996303/waterfall.png
[07:09] <MLow> middle one is mine
[07:09] <MLow> other 2 arent mine and decoded
[07:11] <KT5TK> If you're in the middle, then you'd need to increase audio
[07:12] <MLow> i am the middle one for sure
[07:12] <MLow> i mean it sounds quieter, but at the same time ringy
[07:12] <KT5TK> Was that at 0.25
[07:12] <KT5TK> ?
[07:12] <MLow> it was
[07:12] <KT5TK> ok then try 0.5
[07:14] <MLow> how would i?
[07:14] <MLow> i dont think its as simple as doubling all those values
[07:14] <tekbwainz> oi lads
[07:15] <KT5TK> change scale factor to 0.5; Copy & paste A29:U53 etc
[07:16] <MLow> :O
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[07:19] <MLow> it looks closer to those other packets
[07:19] <MLow> but is still very odd sounding
[07:20] <KT5TK> all that counts is how it will decode
[07:20] <MLow> doesnt
[07:21] <KT5TK> hmm, strange
[07:22] <MLow> it looks very close to others
[07:22] <MLow> but it has a much bigger "hot spot" on the waterfall
[07:23] <KT5TK> send me a screenshot & a sound file
[07:27] <MLow> 0.5x?
[07:28] <KT5TK> yes
[07:30] <MLow> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12996303/blleeerrrrp.wma
[07:30] <MLow> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12996303/waterfall.png
[07:32] <KT5TK> I believe blleeerrrrp.wma was cut off too early. I hear just a partial packet
[07:32] <MLow> you dont hear the squelch at the end?
[07:32] <MLow> when i play it locally i hear everything
[07:35] <MLow> ill do a longer one otherwise
[07:35] <KT5TK> Seems like my Mozilla crashes from the audio file. Trying wget
[07:35] <MLow> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12996303/bllrrp2.wma
[07:35] <MLow> much longer one
[07:37] <MLow> i can run to radio shack sometime and get a cap in the range needed
[07:37] <KT5TK> got it. Sounds actually ok
[07:38] <MLow> i just couldnt find any information on the trackuino wiki that i was supposed to
[07:38] <MLow> it sounds very different from the local traffic but ok
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[07:38] <MLow> may just be because mine is a module theirs are 2m rigs
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[07:39] <KT5TK> All I can see from the spectrum is that the high tone is a bit lower as compared to the others
[07:39] <KT5TK> How many 0s do you transmit?
[07:39] <arko> does anyone here have the spatial exponential factor for earths atmosphere?
[07:40] <MLow> 60
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[07:40] <KT5TK> OK. Did it decode better with only the flags?
[07:40] <MaTTFuRY_> i like jumping off building
[07:40] <MLow> havent tried with this cap
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[07:41] <MaTTFuRY_> if you know how to land from a high distance without breaking ur legs its fun
[07:41] <KT5TK> OK, I don't want to keep you from your double shift.
[07:42] <MaTTFuRY_> powersauce bar anyone?
[07:42] <KT5TK> At least I think the Audio level is good now.
[07:42] <MLow> i commented out the part that sends 0's and uncommented the old truckuino flags for the delay code
[07:42] <MLow> and no decode either
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[07:43] <KT5TK> :-(
[07:43] <KT5TK> Try again tomorrow.
[07:44] <MLow> this has been a multi-month ordeal
[07:44] <MLow> lol
[07:45] <KT5TK> If you can, try to decode with a Kenwood TH-D72. They have the best decoders afaik
[07:46] <KT5TK> Someone in your club may have one
[07:47] <MLow> im not in a club :(
[07:47] <MLow> but i have a roof antenna
[07:47] <KT5TK> I'll change over to the horizontal polarization now...
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[07:48] <MLow> aim the lasors
[07:49] <MLow> seems to be decoding from someone locally running an igate
[07:49] <KT5TK> That's funny :)
[07:49] <MLow> last 3 packets have anyways
[07:50] <MLow> missed one
[07:50] <KT5TK> happens
[07:50] <MLow> but yeah my roof antenna is up there though
[07:50] <MLow> lets see
[07:50] <MLow> it was picked up by a WD5IYT
[07:50] <KT5TK> what's your call?
[07:51] <MLow> KF5KWE
[07:51] <KT5TK> You seem to be quite close to me ...
[07:51] <MLow> no gps data though it cant get a lock in here half the time its off by a mile
[07:52] <MLow> serious?
[07:52] <MLow> austin tx
[07:52] <MLow> yeah they seem to be decoding it just fine
[07:52] <MLow> missing once in a while though
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[07:53] <MLow> mind you this antenna is a bit larger than I would put on a box
[07:53] <KT5TK> May get filtered out because of the 00 posits
[07:54] <MLow> 00 posits?
[07:54] <KT5TK> But your box is high up on a balloon
[07:54] <KT5TK> /000000h0000.00N/00000.00EO000/000/A=000000/Ti=77
[07:55] <MLow> oh yeah its in raw packets though
[07:55] <MLow> 6.2 miles away
[07:55] <MLow> so i just have to get 6.2 miles away
[07:55] <KT5TK> yes, but some servers consider it as spam and filter it out
[07:56] <KT5TK> not bad for 300 mW
[07:56] <MLow> 30ft up though
[07:56] <MLow> and im on a bit of a hill
[07:57] <KT5TK> good for you
[07:57] <MLow> :\
[07:57] <MLow> just trying to nail this down
[07:57] <KT5TK> If others can decode, i may be your rx setup
[07:58] <MLow> mayhaps
[07:58] <MLow> but the only way to know is to hop in the car with full setup then
[07:58] <MLow> where could the problem lie
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[08:04] <MLow> got a gps lock
[08:05] <MLow> i can hear it getting repeated lol
[08:05] <MLow> ok gunna try the 0's
[08:06] <MLow> this crappy HT cant decode crap :(
[08:08] <MLow> hm
[08:08] <MLow> i think when im repeated it removes the 0's
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[08:11] <MLow> perfect decoding from them
[08:11] <MLow> sadface
[08:12] <MLow> all alone
[08:12] <Laurenceb_> FOREVER
[08:12] <Laurenceb_> forever alone
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[08:15] <MLow> ill see about decoding on the go when i head to work
[08:15] <MLow> maybe get setup and drive to work seeing how long i can track it
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[08:36] <x-f> completely offtopic, but i just have to share this view today - http://91.190.32.50/cgi-bin/guestimage.html
[08:38] <x-f> it's Slitere national park, that shadow is from a lighthouse
[08:39] <x-f> when we will finally launch our HAB, i hope it won't land in a similar place..
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[09:11] <costyn> x-f: that does look like an awful place for landing
[09:12] <tekbwainz> oh x-f :D
[09:15] <griffonbot> Received email: Steve Aerospace "[UKHAS] Launch Announcement XABEN-38"
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[09:30] <SamSilver> this helps put things in order > http://imgur.com/gallery/nvdaH
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[09:43] <griffonbot> Received email: John Underwood "[UKHAS] Launch announcement: Vortex"
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[10:01] <griffonbot> @DhrTjibsma: @MissMontreal Kom je ook naar das Coen und Sander Fest? @coenensander #CUSF. [http://twitter.com/DhrTjibsma/status/259232770008690688]
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[10:05] <fsphil> Sander Fest... sounds bad
[10:39] <costyn> heh
[10:40] <costyn> hashtag misuse
[10:40] <costyn> abuse
[10:45] <gonzo__> for ages, I was asking prople what server their feed was on and getting blank faces in reply. As I assumes a ~xxx was IRC
[10:45] <gonzo__> #xxx
[10:49] Nick change: gonzo__ -> gonzo_
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[11:04] <craag> Dang, now I see why people are launching Tuesday. Predictions are sweet!
[11:05] <eroomde> super teusday
[11:10] <Laurenceb> http://i.imgur.com/HWA9z.jpg
[11:14] <navrac_work> thats nothing - my desk is far untidier than that!
[11:14] <x-f> can you focus for a moment?
[11:16] <Laurenceb> heh
[11:16] <Laurenceb> F3discovery
[11:22] Action: fsphil looks around his desk, which is absent of an F3discovery
[11:26] Action: costyn too
[11:27] <costyn> although that's not for lack of Laurenceb's efforts in promoting this (apparently) fine product
[11:28] <Laurenceb> well once its gone itll be gone until next year apparently
[11:31] <fsphil> I'll get it in monday probably, then spend the next week trying to build the toolchains
[11:31] <navrac_work> if i had one i wouldnt be able to find it under this mess - but since i never ordered one its not worth looking
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[11:32] <fsphil> ah, great timing. email from RS telling me it's been despatched
[11:33] <Laurenceb> fsphil: tnt works well
[11:33] <Laurenceb> https://github.com/EliasOenal/TNT
[11:34] <eroomde> i have some discovery F4s ere
[11:34] <eroomde> and an olimex f4 board
[11:34] <eroomde> the olimex one is nice as it has built in ethernet and phy and sd card
[11:34] <fsphil> ooh that is good
[11:34] <eroomde> which are exactly what we want to develop the next-gen data loggers
[11:35] <Laurenceb> heh
[11:36] <Laurenceb> my desk is covered in dataloggers
[11:36] <Laurenceb> eroomde: have you tried chibios?
[11:39] <eroomde> only the getting started demo
[11:40] <eroomde> but it seems to promise to integrate nicely with lwIP
[11:40] <eroomde> which we're probably going to use
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[11:45] <Laurenceb> yeah
[11:45] <Laurenceb> im running chibios on a custom F4 board currently
[11:47] <eroomde> nice
[11:48] <eroomde> it looks like a good thing
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[11:51] <Laurenceb> the users are a little fanboyish
[11:52] <Laurenceb> and the drivers are a little limiting as they all use dma
[12:02] <eroomde> i think for a lot of stuff we'll want to control all that ourselves
[12:02] <eroomde> really just want an os for lightweight threads
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[12:09] <zyp> it's possible to use the chibios kernel without the hal
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[12:12] <Randomskk> indeed
[12:12] <Randomskk> it's really nice for just microthreads
[12:12] <zyp> but on the other hand, threading is not hard to accomplish from scratch
[12:14] <zyp> or rather, context switching is not hard, so threading is about as hard as the scheduling algorithm you use :)
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[12:24] <eroomde> Opera's image problem: a proposed solution
[12:24] <eroomde> just translate everything to english
[12:24] <eroomde> La Traviata by Giuseppe Verdi
[12:24] <eroomde> posh people, black tie, expensive seats, offputting warbling
[12:24] <eroomde> but then we just translate it to english
[12:25] <Laurenceb> same but in english
[12:25] <eroomde> The Slut, by Joe Green
[12:25] <Laurenceb> lol
[12:25] <eroomde> it's basically just ITV2 all of a sudden
[12:31] <Laurenceb> there an opera on irc apparently
[12:31] <Laurenceb> http://operawiki.info/OperaIRC
[12:32] <eroomde> it's like dalston
[12:32] <eroomde> but digital
[12:32] <eroomde> i am not sure i can cope
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[12:49] <UpuWork> ping x-f
[12:49] <x-f> hi, UpuWork
[12:50] <UpuWork> can you see PM ?
[12:50] <x-f> nope
[12:50] <UpuWork> from my home account ?
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[12:52] <Darkside> UpuWork: thankee
[12:52] <UpuWork> nps
[12:58] <tekbwainz> what's going on peeps
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[13:13] <navrac_work> stupid parcelforce/rs 1/3 of the order lost in post, 1/3 of the order shipped late and now not till monday 1/3 of the order changed from instock to back order due nov
[13:16] <Randomskk> this is why I love farnell
[13:16] <Randomskk> they are good at that stuff
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[13:21] <navrac_work> thats the annoying bit - only one of the items had to come from rs - the one bit that i dont hugely need, I should have stuck with farnell
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[13:56] <fsphil> What carrier do RS use?
[13:58] <navrac_work> parcelforce
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[14:33] <DrLuke> well
[14:33] <DrLuke> farnell just took little under a month to process my university verification
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[14:35] <griffonbot> Received email: John Underwood "Re: [UKHAS] Launch announcement: Vortex"
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[14:40] <chris_99> DrLuke, do you get cheaper prices after that?
[14:40] <DrLuke> yeah you get a little bit off
[14:40] <DrLuke> but most importantly you can actually order stuff
[14:41] <chris_99> i don't think i did anything fancy to be able to order stuff of them, and i'm a student
[14:41] <jonsowman> CUSF have a onecall account
[14:41] <DrLuke> well, I had to send them a confirmation that I'm a student
[14:41] <jonsowman> which is about 20% off and no MOQ
[14:41] <DrLuke> nice
[14:41] <DrLuke> ah fuck
[14:42] <DrLuke> I made a solder bridge on an smd part
[14:42] <DrLuke> :(
[14:42] <jonsowman> solder braid + flux
[14:42] <DrLuke> and I have no solder wick
[14:42] <jonsowman> ah
[14:42] <DrLuke> or flux for that matter
[14:43] <DrLuke> I'll go with the brute method: reheat it and scrape some off
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[14:46] <DrLuke> ok nevermind this IC has had it
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[14:47] <DrLuke> is it odd that I found soldering mlfs easier than sots?
[14:48] <Laurenceb> milfs
[14:48] <MLow> thats what I read at first
[14:49] <DrLuke> dirty boys
[14:51] <DrLuke> next time I'm ordering a stencil with my PCBs
[14:51] <SamSilver> man I could kill a malt
[14:52] <SamSilver> eyes and ears are not so hot after a few ales
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[14:59] <MLow> 300mw heard from 10miles and im on ground level
[14:59] <MLow> that seems odd
[15:00] <MLow> KT5TK: sorry for passing out last night, cant thank you enough for helping
[15:00] <MLow> let me know when your next launch is I want to come check it out if possible
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[15:09] <number10> moved on from yosemite daveake ?
[15:09] <daveake> Yup
[15:09] <daveake> That was 2 days ago ... do keep up :p
[15:09] <number10> did uyou do nevada falls?
[15:10] <daveake> Nope
[15:10] <number10> sorr I have not been reading up
[15:10] <number10> +y
[15:10] <daveake> s'ok :)
[15:10] <number10> where are you
[15:10] <daveake> I wasn't online there .... I did try downloading some emails on my phone and it eat up nearly half my credit!
[15:11] <daveake> Eventually found an internet kiosk at 25c/min
[15:11] <daveake> So used that to catrch up on emails
[15:12] <daveake> Now at Lake Isabella. Spent yesterday driving through Sequoia firest. Great fun on roads not really meant for 30-foot RVs ;)
[15:12] <daveake> forest*
[15:13] <number10> nice
[15:15] <Laurenceb> freudian slip
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[15:23] <fsphil> internet seems oddly expensive and difficult to find there daveake
[15:24] <daveake> Yep. Amazing since it's so popular. All the shops/museums/etc have closed wifi. Only 1 place has anything for the public
[15:25] <daveake> I'm talking about Yosemite ... elsewhere all the RV parks have wifi internet, almost always free
[15:26] <DrLuke> woo, my first dc-dc converter: http://i.imgur.com/RiKCb.jpg
[15:26] <DrLuke> :)
[15:26] <fsphil> it looks like a spider
[15:26] <fsphil> with telescopic eyes
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[15:28] <DrLuke> it will crawl into your mouth at night
[15:28] <DrLuke> and you will eat it
[15:28] <DrLuke> while sleeping
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[15:29] <fsphil> someone should make a movie about that
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[15:33] <LazyLeopard> Hmmm... Launch May 19, recovery Oct 6. ;) http://www.uk.amsat.org/?p=11094
[15:34] <LazyLeopard> Wonder how many lakes they had to cross and how many trees they had to cut down...
[15:36] <Laurenceb> https://www.sparkfun.com/products/11316
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[15:36] <BrainDamage> upu should reckognize this board: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/11466
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[15:37] <fsphil> hehe, "Weight: Our scale doesn't go this low"
[15:37] <BrainDamage> except for 2/4th of the price
[15:37] <BrainDamage> 1/4*
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[15:50] <jonsowman> stencil from Mitch arrived :D
[15:50] <jonsowman> http://www.flickr.com/photos/cuspaceflight/8102965578/in/photostream
[15:50] <jonsowman> eroomde: ^
[15:54] <number10> so you wont be hand soldering all theose JOEYs then jonsowman
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[15:54] <jonsowman> well I'll be hand placing the parts
[15:54] <jonsowman> though I might recruit/bribe some help
[15:55] <number10> :)
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[16:20] <arko> good morning
[16:20] <arko> woah nice solder stencil
[16:20] <jonsowman> arko: yeah, very pleased
[16:20] <jonsowman> only $25 as well
[16:21] <arko> did you have it made?
[16:21] <jonsowman> yes
[16:21] <arko> oh nice
[16:21] <arko> i milled a few myself,
[16:21] <arko> didn't come out too bad
[16:21] <jonsowman> nice
[16:22] <jonsowman> should make soldering a bit happier
[16:22] <arko> haha
[16:22] <arko> yeah
[16:22] <arko> huge different
[16:22] <arko> difference*
[16:22] <mattbrejza> yay trying to take photos of shiney things
[16:22] <jonsowman> :)
[16:22] <jonsowman> mattbrejza: yes
[16:22] <arko> rather than sitting there tackling it leg by leg
[16:22] <jonsowman> arko: yeah, just need a pick & place now
[16:22] <arko> come to LA :)
[16:22] <arko> we have one
[16:23] <jonsowman> cool, I'll put in a trip to LA on the CUSF expenses system
[16:23] <arko> http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullspacelabs/8096189458/in/photostream
[16:23] <jonsowman> I'm sure that'd be fine
[16:23] <arko> we just got that
[16:23] <arko> :D
[16:23] <jonsowman> very nice :D
[16:23] <Randomskk> jonsowman: so long as I can come too
[16:23] <jonsowman> so jealous
[16:23] <jonsowman> Randomskk: yeah sure
[16:23] <Randomskk> fine with me then
[16:24] <jonsowman> arko: that flickr account contains so much cool
[16:24] <arko> http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullspacelabs/6165234267/in/photostream
[16:24] <arko> http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullspacelabs/7350495086/in/photostream
[16:24] <jonsowman> oh wow
[16:24] <arko> our hackerspace is srs buz :P
[16:24] <jonsowman> :D
[16:24] <arko> not a makerspace :D
[16:24] <daveake> I'm back in LA on Sunday. Can I send the tab to CUSF? :p
[16:25] <arko> sadly everyone will be at Toorcon till monday
[16:25] <arko> http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullspacelabs/7990463971/in/photostream
[16:25] <arko> this is going in our next highaltitude balloon
[16:25] <jonsowman> looks nice
[16:26] <Randomskk> why do you hate ground planes so much D:
[16:26] <jonsowman> haha
[16:26] <Randomskk> or does it have four layers?
[16:26] <arko> two layer
[16:26] <arko> well it's just unused copper
[16:26] <jonsowman> is there a groundplane there that eagle hasn't rendered?
[16:26] <Randomskk> yes
[16:26] <Randomskk> you can tell by the dashes
[16:26] <jonsowman> yeah
[16:26] <Randomskk> but it's not really much of a ground plane
[16:26] <Randomskk> >_>
[16:26] <arko> you dont need it
[16:27] <arko> all the rf is done in sim908
[16:27] <Randomskk> in fact I'd be a bit concerned given as you're actually using it for ground routing too
[16:27] <Randomskk> mreh
[16:27] <arko> we did rats nest and looked for pinches
[16:27] <Randomskk> I mean it'l work
[16:27] <Randomskk> probably
[16:27] <arko> it should be fine
[16:27] <arko> :)
[16:28] <Randomskk> but it still makes me sad
[16:28] <Randomskk> you have no ground routing but your ground plane is gonna be all torn up
[16:28] <Randomskk> even the power supply traces
[16:28] <Randomskk> so the current return path is going to be all over the shop
[16:28] <arko> whats the concern?
[16:28] <arko> noise?
[16:28] <Randomskk> meh, anything
[16:28] <Randomskk> brownouts, rfi, noise
[16:29] <Randomskk> GSM modems tend to take a chunky current when keying up
[16:29] <Randomskk> I imagine there are some big caps on the module
[16:29] <Randomskk> because you don't seem to have any
[16:29] <Randomskk> but even so there's going to be a nice current spike when it txs
[16:29] <Randomskk> and the return path for that is going to have to do all sorts of silly things down narrow strips of ground plane to get back to the battery connector
[16:29] <Randomskk> so causes a big noise spike
[16:29] <Randomskk> but might also cause enough of a brownout to make things sad
[16:29] <Randomskk> or other issues?
[16:30] <Randomskk> I mean yea, it will probably still work
[16:30] <arko> hmm
[16:30] <Randomskk> but it's nice to do things right or follow best practises
[16:30] <arko> thanks for the feedback
[16:30] <arko> yeah
[16:30] <arko> best practice helps prevent issues in the future
[16:31] <Randomskk> the actual signal routing does look nice enough but I don't know how much thought has been given to rfi stuff vs just a neat geometry
[16:31] <Randomskk> it is still a lot nicer than many PCBs :P
[16:31] <Randomskk> also you do have a fairly serious number of nets to route so it'd be hard to do hugely better
[16:31] <Randomskk> meh
[16:31] <Randomskk> there's always r2 :P
[16:31] <Randomskk> it'l probably work, you just likely reduce the margin where it can only just work
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[16:32] <Randomskk> I assume this is mostly for recovery after landing?
[16:32] <Randomskk> does the SIM908 have a builtin antenna?
[16:32] <Randomskk> or an external connector?
[16:32] <Randomskk> external by the looks of it
[16:32] <arko> external
[16:32] <Randomskk> I take it you have something omnidirectional? ;P
[16:32] <arko> yes
[16:33] <arko> and then a gps antenna too
[16:33] <Randomskk> separate?
[16:33] <Randomskk> oh yes
[16:33] <Randomskk> I see the other connector
[16:33] <Randomskk> cool
[16:33] <arko> yeah
[16:33] <arko> the 900 was cell only
[16:33] <arko> the 908 has gps
[16:33] <Randomskk> handy
[16:34] <arko> pretty handy
[16:34] <arko> hah yeah
[16:34] <Randomskk> so long as it's a good GPS anyway :P
[16:34] <Randomskk> still, should be cool
[16:34] <arko> i'll find out!
[16:34] <Randomskk> do you have a radio transmitting position too?
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[16:35] <Randomskk> (brb 15min, good luck with your project!)
[16:36] <arko> thanks for your advice
[16:36] <arko> i'll consider them in r2 (already ordered the board)
[16:37] <arko> yes to your question
[16:38] <zyp> routing looks rather nice
[16:39] <zyp> but definitely add ground planes
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[17:35] Lunar_Lander (~gd-compto@p54A076D3.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #highaltitude.
[17:35] <Lunar_Lander> hello
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[18:29] <arko> hallo
[18:30] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[18:30] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[18:30] <arko> tis a nice day
[18:41] <fsphil> nice night here
[18:41] <fsphil> dry at last
[18:41] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[18:42] <Lunar_Lander> I am expecting a balloon by jcoxon tomorrow
[18:42] <arko> you guys launching tomorrow?
[18:42] <fsphil> oh yes, I need to setup my antenna
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[18:43] <fsphil> james is doing a couple of launches
[18:43] <fsphil> one of them may float, so could be heading Lunar_Lander's way
[18:43] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[18:44] <arko> awesome
[18:44] <fsphil> that or Denmark
[18:44] <arko> where can i track?
[18:44] <fsphil> http://spacenear.us/
[18:45] <fsphil> I must try a prediction
[18:45] <arko> awesome
[18:47] <arko> is there a map of aprs coverage?
[18:48] <arko> im just wondering how those antennas are showing up
[18:48] <fsphil> that isn't aprs (we can't use that from balloons in the UK)
[18:48] <arko> really?
[18:48] <fsphil> they're running a program called dl-fldigi
[18:48] <arko> aprs isn't allowed in the UK?
[18:49] <fsphil> yea, amateur radio is not permitted while in the air
[18:49] <arko> woah
[18:49] <fsphil> fine on the ground
[18:49] <arko> bummer
[18:49] <fsphil> from balloons we're limited to low power license-exempt modules
[18:49] <arko> :(
[18:49] <fsphil> although they've done some amazing things with them
[18:50] <arko> heh, at least you work with what you have
[18:50] <fsphil> it's surprising how far 10mw can get
[18:50] <arko> yeah seriously
[18:50] <arko> my last balloon was 35W
[18:50] <arko> then i was like
[18:50] <fsphil> hah
[18:50] <arko> wtf
[18:50] <arko> thats insane
[18:50] <arko> why
[18:50] <arko> learned my lesson
[18:50] <fsphil> line of sight does wonders
[18:51] <arko> dude, what the hell is with these ham sites having websites from 1994
[18:51] <arko> cutting edge tech my ass
[18:51] <fsphil> the 10mw modules are regurlarly tracked from over 500km away
[18:51] <arko> yeah line of sight is crazy
[18:51] <fsphil> <blink>yea, it's madness</blink>
[18:51] <arko> hahaha
[18:51] <fsphil> I commented once that our local club website was "a bit geocities"
[18:52] <fsphil> I don't think they got it
[18:52] <mfa298> technically I don't think there's a reason why us in the UK can't use aprs on 70cm's it's just there's no aprs network we can use for it and rtty is easier.
[18:52] <DrLuke> what's aprs
[18:52] <fsphil> well you could transmit aprs packets at 300 baud over 434mhz
[18:53] <fsphil> but the aprs-is users might not live having igates receiving traffic from non-amateurs
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[18:53] <mfa298> it has been done but I don't think many people were tracking it.
[18:53] <arko> haha
[18:53] <fsphil> 869mhz is suited for that too, with the higher power levels
[18:53] <fsphil> 500mw
[18:53] <arko> good ol geocities
[18:55] <fsphil> assuming 10am launch, 33km float and the launch location was guessed :) http://habhub.org//predict/#!/uuid=cce5be92e54a4f4d1e04d2eab69fda362e6a943e
[18:56] <fsphil> should be within range for you Lunar_Lander
[18:56] <fsphil> but perhaps a bit low
[18:56] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[18:57] <fsphil> if it floats lower, then it'll probably head for Denmark
[19:00] <gb73d> i have looked at baumgartners leap i rec
[19:00] <gb73d> what a view
[19:00] <gb73d> i also thought digital voice radio link did abs crap job
[19:01] <gb73d> because of it the kittenger lost contact w him
[19:01] <gb73d> if they used AM he could have stayed in 100% copy all the way
[19:01] <gb73d> digital voice comms rubbish
[19:02] <fsphil> I was wondering why they just didn't do analogue
[19:02] <fsphil> they had HD video but couldn't do voice, and even when they did the bitrate was very low
[19:02] <fsphil> the quality was awful
[19:03] <gb73d> it was so delayed distorted kittenger lost contactw the man
[19:03] <gb73d> they would not put up w that in the milirary
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[19:06] <griffonbot> Received email: James Coxon "[UKHAS] Re: UK launches this weekend"
[19:08] <Lunar_Lander> I like the new UKHAS website btw
[19:10] <fsphil> tis rather well put together
[19:14] <chris_99> ooh nice, well done
[19:14] <eroomde> the 2 ukhas logos are different
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[19:19] <DanielRichman> eroomde: yes, yes they are
[19:19] <Upu> oh nice upgrade
[19:19] <DanielRichman> the one in the picture of the earth is (I think) an older one that I couldn't get hold of
[19:19] <DanielRichman> it was just a quick thing
[19:19] <DanielRichman> I'm not really a logos person
[19:20] <arko> whats a good windows based software that takes radio audio and translates packets
[19:20] <arko> like aprs
[19:20] <DanielRichman> I might be able to crop and clean up the one in the banner to use as a logo (it looks like it would scale down better, maybe)
[19:26] <DanielRichman> http://i.imgur.com/fYh15.png
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[19:31] <Lunar_Lander> arko, dl-fldigi maybe?
[19:31] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.ukhas.org.uk/projects:dl-fldigi
[19:32] <griffonbot> @AnthonyStirk: 1.8V pAVA Maiden flight being launched by James Coxon tomorrow under a mylar pico #ukhas [http://twitter.com/AnthonyStirk/status/259376460840722433]
[19:32] <griffonbot> @AnthonyStirk: also the UKHAS Badgeboard is flying under a big latex floater #ukhas [http://twitter.com/AnthonyStirk/status/259376559549476866]
[19:37] Action: SpeedEvil buys another chainsaw.
[19:38] <arko> does it work well?
[19:38] <SpeedEvil> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Ryobi-RYBRPP720-720W-Pole-Pruner/dp/B001SN8OCO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1350674780&sr=8-1
[19:38] <arko> i'll try it out after work
[19:38] <griffonbot> Received email: "Re: [UKHAS] Re: UK launches this weekend"
[19:40] <Upu> ping navrac
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[19:41] <MickMondo> Hello ...
[19:41] <SpeedEvil> hello.
[19:41] <MickMondo> You back from hols Upu ..?
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[19:42] <Upu> I am yes, evening Mick
[19:42] <MickMondo> Hi ya, did you have a good time, thought you was going to bring some sun back ha ha
[19:42] <Upu> Greeks wouldn't let me bring it back, sun is all they have left
[19:43] <Upu> but yes great time thanks
[19:43] <MickMondo> lol yes thats true ... ha ah
[19:43] <fsphil> you couldn't have sun here, people would complain ;)
[19:43] <MickMondo> Im working thought Id have a look on here..
[19:44] <Upu> oh late one ? Friday nights are a bit hit and miss
[19:44] <Upu> sometimes busy sometimes quiet
[19:44] <MickMondo> I'm working all weekend and through to tuesday,, all for £200,000 a year hardly seems worth it ................ I wish
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[19:45] <Upu> £200k ? Yeah I'd do weekends for that
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[19:46] <MickMondo> you launching soon Upu
[19:46] <Upu> next weekend hopefully
[19:47] <MickMondo> Ah cool, this your new board
[19:47] <Upu> yes with a passenger
[19:47] <Upu> got a second GPS strapped to it
[19:47] <MickMondo> what dave hanging off the end lol
[19:48] <Upu> need more than a 1600g for that
[19:48] <MickMondo> ha ha
[19:48] <fsphil> poor dave
[19:48] <Upu> hi Daveake looking through the logs
[19:48] <MickMondo> is not on here then ha ha
[19:48] <fsphil> dave of the future will be angry with you both
[19:48] <fsphil> I tried to stop them dave
[19:49] <MickMondo> got my new board up and running, but I've redesigned it as I didnt like it..
[19:49] <fsphil> hi future fsphil, hope that RS order has arrived
[19:51] <Upu> Daves in america at the moment
[19:52] <Upu> these solar panels weigh 0.7g each
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[19:52] <Carlosataman> hello
[19:52] <Upu> evening
[19:53] <MickMondo> hi
[19:53] <fsphil> howdy
[19:53] <Upu> what was up with the board MickMondo ?
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[19:54] <MickMondo> Nothing really just didnt like the way it looked and it was a bit bigger than I wanted it, workes a treat though, on the ground that is.
[19:54] <griffonbot> @adamcudworth: Last weekend's escapade - http://t.co/qrIRrVE6 a lot of fun, a few unexpected things but that's HABing! #ukhas [http://twitter.com/adamcudworth/status/259382077470957568]
[19:55] <paula> hola hablas español
[19:55] <Upu> only english really sorry paula
[19:55] <Upu> unless anyone speaks Spanish ?
[19:55] <MLow> another morning
[19:55] <MickMondo> its the size of a standard SD card but I've got it much smaller now and its laaid out better too, just etched the board today, probably start putting it together end of next week.
[19:56] <MLow> another issue with the trackuino board
[19:56] <Upu> any pics Mick ?
[19:56] <paula> nothing hapeds
[19:57] <Upu> btw Carlosataman don't be polite if you have questions and stuff just pile straight in
[19:57] <MickMondo> arrrr, theres one on flickr
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[19:57] <Upu> or not
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[19:57] <MickMondo> lol
[19:58] <MickMondo> I see steve launched a kitkat then..
[19:58] <Charlyataman2> que haces ?
[19:58] <Upu> http://www.flickr.com/photos/52455043@N03/8091238571/in/photostream/lightbox/
[19:58] <Upu> oh you put a boost on it
[19:58] <Upu> cool
[19:58] <Charlyataman2> where are you from?
[19:58] <Upu> UK Charlyataman2
[19:58] <MickMondo> yes, get rid of a battery then
[19:58] <Upu> some of us anyway
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[19:59] <MickMondo> 4 grams
[19:59] <Upu> is there a µC on there ?
[19:59] <Charlyataman2> really
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[19:59] <MickMondo> uC ..?
[19:59] <Upu> microcontroller
[20:00] <Upu> jesus
[20:00] <MickMondo> ha ha sorry ... laughing to myself ,,,
[20:00] <Upu> sorry thats a bloody big rocket Mick
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[20:00] <MickMondo> yes on the other side and the Trans too
[20:00] <Upu> thats very small
[20:01] <MickMondo> yeah that rocket had drop off boosters and 14 motors all lit at once
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[20:02] Nick change: grumbleist_ -> grumbleist
[20:03] <MickMondo> the new one is smaller still, not quite half the size,,, Just wanted to see what size I could get it, doesnt really matter at the end of the day but good for Pico stuff
[20:03] <Upu> would love to see the flip side of that when you get chance
[20:04] <fsphil> you call that a big rocket? yea... actually that is pretty big
[20:05] <Lunar_Lander> Saturn V!!!
[20:05] <Upu> evening lunar
[20:06] <Lunar_Lander> hi Upu
[20:06] <Upu> we are rationing you to one '!' per sentence
[20:06] <Lunar_Lander> OK
[20:06] <Upu> nps
[20:06] <Upu> you got your tracking gear ready Lunar ?
[20:07] <Upu> might be some stuff coming your way later on tomorrow night
[20:07] <Lunar_Lander> I know, radio is ready, set to 4.200.0 and pulseaudio works also with dl-fldigi
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[20:08] <Upu> super
[20:09] <RG-lz1dev> wow, that rocket has two boosters
[20:09] <RG-lz1dev> and its huge
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[20:10] <MickMondo> I,ve got onboard video of the booster dropping off somewhere
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[20:11] <Upu> sorry for trawling your pics but I was impressed :)
[20:11] <Upu> was that at Elsworth ?
[20:11] <MickMondo> Upu, I'll upload some pics of the other side, the Trans is piggy backed
[20:11] <Upu> ok
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[20:12] <MickMondo> lol thats ok
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[20:12] <Upu> be interested to see what you've done :)
[20:12] <Upu> as it doesn't look like there is enough space there
[20:12] <MickMondo> ah what one, the booster one ..?
[20:12] <Upu> sorry two conversations at once yes the rocket launch
[20:13] <MickMondo> the Talon six was launched in Scotland a few year s back now
[20:13] <Upu> ah ok
[20:13] <MickMondo> and the one with the boosters was launched at EARS
[20:13] <Upu> how high did that go
[20:13] <Upu> ?
[20:15] <MickMondo> the Talon six was only a few miles, the booster one can go quite high but I was only testing it all worked at EARS and without an airstart after the boosters dropped off,, I was meant to launching it at Scotland after the EARS launch but I run out of cash,, that cost £600 in motors
[20:16] <Upu> lol wow
[20:16] <MickMondo> Yeah balloons is a bit cheaper
[20:16] <fsphil> I'm not sure I want to do rockets now :)
[20:16] <fsphil> nah, I do
[20:16] <MickMondo> and the fun last a lot longer lol
[20:16] <Upu> and go higher
[20:17] <MickMondo> yep
[20:17] <Laurenceb_> if you combine the two...
[20:17] <Upu> however a slightly flacid balloon pales in comparison to that rocket for looks
[20:17] <fsphil> ballocket
[20:17] <MickMondo> yes I did look into that
[20:17] <Upu> you have to go to Australia Laurenceb
[20:18] <MLow> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12996303/hab%20pics/hx1_naked.jpg
[20:18] <MLow> hmmmmmm
[20:18] <MLow> i probably shouldnt have twisted those knobs
[20:18] <Laurenceb_> MickMondo: can you linky rocket pic?
[20:18] <MickMondo> lol,, yeah I guess so, it was quite amazing to see it lift off even if I say so myself
[20:19] <gb73d> gnite
[20:19] <fsphil> I really have to visit EARS
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[20:19] <fsphil> how about it, a UKHAS daytrip :)
[20:20] <Upu> we are doing that to the Arctic remember
[20:20] <MickMondo> I think Upu put a link earlier,,, I can but my pc will crash, it doesnt like me on here and going online too.. for some reason
[20:20] <Upu> http://www.flickr.com/photos/52455043@N03/7826072206/in/photostream/lightbox/
[20:20] <MickMondo> Upu, can you put a link on here for
[20:20] <Upu> http://www.flickr.com/photos/52455043@N03/7826065904/in/photostream/lightbox/
[20:20] <MickMondo> ah you beat me to it ...cheers Upu
[20:20] <Upu> not surprised you're grinning in that pic
[20:21] <Upu> "my toy"
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[20:22] <MickMondo> Yeah its just hanging in my shed at the mo
[20:22] <Lunar_Lander> cool excelsior
[20:22] <MickMondo> Id love to launch it again with the airstart too,,
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[20:23] <fsphil> there's a good kickstarter project
[20:23] <MickMondo> cheers guys for your comments
[20:23] <Adam_> bloody hell, big rocket!
[20:24] <MLow> not every day we get a real rocket man in highaltitude
[20:25] <MickMondo> Its a great hobby but can be so expensive
[20:25] <MLow> your telling me...hab is expensive enough for me and i havent even got a working tracker
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[20:25] <MLow> almost ready to throw in the towel and buy a premade tracker
[20:25] <Upu> nooooo
[20:25] <Upu> whats the issue ?
[20:26] <MLow> everything possible...
[20:26] <MickMondo> Nooooooooooooooooo too
[20:26] <MickMondo> never give up
[20:26] <MLow> basically it just doesnt decode...cant figure out why
[20:26] <Upu> what have you got at the moment ?
[20:26] <MickMondo> thats what makes is such an amazing thing
[20:26] <Upu> i.e GPS, microcontroller ?
[20:26] <MLow> arduino uno rev 3
[20:26] <MickMondo> to do
[20:26] <Upu> ok
[20:26] <MLow> HX1-144.390-3, prolific gps unit
[20:26] <Upu> using software serial ?
[20:26] <MLow> and a home made 1/8th wave 2m made from copper cable
[20:27] <Upu> for the GPS
[20:27] <MLow> the gps works, the debug packets over serial come out fine
[20:27] <Upu> yeah but are you using software serial to get that data from the GPS ?
[20:27] <MLow> i can hear the packet, and every once in a blue moon i hit an IGATE and they decode
[20:27] <MickMondo> not uk then ..?
[20:27] <MLow> nope
[20:27] <MLow> Texas
[20:28] <MLow> and no on the software serial, it's barely modified trackuino code
[20:28] <Upu> ok
[20:28] <MLow> so it uses the RX pin on the arduino for gps
[20:28] <Upu> I don't have much experience with APRS
[20:28] <Adam_> ive got a similar problem, cant get it to work with software serial
[20:28] <DrLuke> woop, my dc-dc converter only weighs 3 grams
[20:28] <Upu> it works with SS you just need to disable interupts when you TX
[20:29] <Upu> or it messes up the timing
[20:29] <Adam_> ah
[20:29] <DrLuke> don't use SS
[20:29] <DrLuke> jeez
[20:29] <MLow> im ok with using the hardware serial, i just have to unplug the gps to program the arduino
[20:29] <Laurenceb_> lol
[20:29] <Upu> however what DrLuke said
[20:29] <DrLuke> damn masochists
[20:29] <Laurenceb_> use a decent micro
[20:29] <MickMondo> yeah picaxe lol
[20:29] <fsphil> yea, 6502 people, get with the program :)
[20:29] <Adam_> how can i use a hardware serial then?
[20:29] <Upu> meh 6510
[20:29] <DrLuke> you can easily build a simple multiplexer
[20:30] <DrLuke> use i2c on your ublox (assuming you're using one)
[20:30] <Upu> just plug the GPS in to the hardware via a 10k resistor
[20:30] <Upu> let me see if I can find the link
[20:30] <MLow> earlier today it was working fine, decoding almost every packet, then randomly with no changes i get home for my break and nothing
[20:30] <DrLuke> the magic of electronics and programming
[20:31] <DrLuke> it's like #DEFINE work_today random(1)
[20:31] <RG-lz1dev> or some chicky gremilins
[20:31] <Upu> Adam_ http://www.billporter.info/how-to-add-multiple-uart-connections/
[20:31] <DrLuke> oh yeah if you use a breadboard, that's your source of errors 95% of the time
[20:31] <Upu> again +1 to what DrLuke said
[20:31] <MLow> i can hear my other half barking now
[20:32] <Upu> I gave up on breadboard
[20:32] <DrLuke> I still use it
[20:32] <MLow> all you do is sit over that board listening to aliens, take me out to dinner blah blah
[20:32] <fsphil> I still find it handy
[20:32] <DrLuke> but I try to move to solder as fast as possible
[20:32] <MickMondo> Yeah me too
[20:32] <MLow> yeah im using a tiny breadboard
[20:32] <Upu> simple stuff I use it for
[20:32] <Upu> but nothing complex any more
[20:32] <Adam_> ive got a breadboard
[20:32] <Adam_> thanks for the link upu
[20:32] <Upu> nps
[20:32] <Adam_> if i can get my head around it haha
[20:32] <MickMondo> I hear lots of problems with breadboard
[20:32] <Upu> well basically wire the GPS to the RX and TX via some 1K resistors
[20:32] <Upu> job done
[20:33] <Adam_> okey
[20:33] <DrLuke> basically this: http://i.imgur.com/QhEk2.jpg
[20:33] <Upu> lol
[20:33] <DrLuke> please proceed in printing this image out
[20:33] <fsphil> eek
[20:33] <Adam_> woah..
[20:33] <DrLuke> in A3 paper
[20:33] <Adam_> that simple?
[20:33] <Adam_> haha
[20:33] <Adam_> so how will the resistor act as a switch for the software serial then?
[20:33] <DrLuke> "that simple"
[20:33] <Adam_> i dont get it haha
[20:33] <Upu> yup have a read of the article so you understand why
[20:33] <DrLuke> it only took like 3 hours to find!
[20:33] <Adam_> ok
[20:33] <Adam_> thanks!
[20:33] <Upu> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ccqYB3d1Ct0
[20:34] <Upu> now with pIKTURz
[20:34] <MLow> so your saying
[20:34] <MLow> etch a board and this will all go away?
[20:34] <MLow> somehow i find that hard to believe
[20:34] <Upu> probably
[20:35] <Adam_> hmm
[20:35] <Upu> I was going to redo the Trackuino board
[20:35] <DrLuke> MLow: use mitch to make proper PCBs
[20:35] <Adam_> tbh, i just want the thing to work, then i can work out how to expand it via more coding etc
[20:35] <DrLuke> it might seem like it's more expensive to go that route, but trust me
[20:35] <Upu> well that that Adam_
[20:35] <Adam_> and hopefully eventually get a proper PCB etched
[20:35] <DrLuke> in the end you'll save time and maybe even money
[20:35] <MLow> if i can finally decide on what all sensors i want i will make a board in eagle
[20:35] <Upu> happy with your PCB's from Mitch DrLuke ?
[20:35] <DrLuke> Indeed I am
[20:35] <MLow> i have made some nice boards before
[20:36] <MLow> i think at least
[20:36] <DrLuke> one pcb actually was botched up by the pcb manufacturer
[20:36] <MLow> i spent some time learning
[20:36] <Upu> he does a good job
[20:36] <DrLuke> but I got a free replacement
[20:36] <Upu> yep
[20:36] <DrLuke> and of course goodies
[20:36] <Upu> you can speak to him which is good
[20:36] <DrLuke> yeah
[20:36] <DrLuke> he's a super cool dude
[20:37] <DrLuke> and some of his PCBs even went to space
[20:37] <MLow> ok so see now, im decoding fine
[20:37] <DrLuke> if that isn't a selling point, then I don't know what is
[20:37] <Upu> which ones ?
[20:37] <DrLuke> apparently he made some cubesat PCBs
[20:37] <Upu> ok cool
[20:38] <DrLuke> so I am going to get a camera next week
[20:38] <DrLuke> but it needs 2 AAs to operate
[20:38] <DrLuke> which sucks
[20:38] <Adam_> anyone got a spare 1k resistor i could have/buy?
[20:38] <DrLuke> ebay does
[20:38] <Adam_> farnell has the £10 min order
[20:38] <Adam_> good iea
[20:38] <Adam_> idea
[20:39] <DrLuke> you might be interested in buying a whole sortiment
[20:39] <MLow> and now its not decoding
[20:39] <Upu> Adam_ mail me your address and I'll post you a few out on Monday
[20:39] <DrLuke> Upu: when can we expect goodies from you? :P
[20:39] <fsphil> sweets!
[20:39] <Upu> hah
[20:39] <Upu> when I start making money on it...
[20:40] <DrLuke> haha
[20:40] <Upu> Mitch goes to a Chinese Electronics market
[20:40] <DrLuke> yeah
[20:40] Nick change: grumbleist -> markdownunder
[20:40] <Upu> if I did that you'd get Asian spices and ethnic cloth and cords
[20:41] <DrLuke> Orphan tears went into the production of our goodies
[20:41] <Adam_> haha
[20:41] <DrLuke> Which is nice, because quite frankly orphan tears have the best taste
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[20:43] <DrLuke> man, if I can shrink my dc-dc converter a little, I could use it to replace the linear regulator on raspberry pis
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[20:44] <Upu> Dave's replaced the regulators on his with switch mode ones
[20:45] <DrLuke> yeah but there has to be a way to monetize the whole thing
[20:45] <Laurenceb_> ive replaced mine with beagleboards
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[20:46] <DrLuke> wait
[20:46] <DrLuke> the arm on mine is seated on a tiny pcb
[20:46] <DrLuke> like a tiny little adapter board
[20:46] <DrLuke> what the hell
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[20:47] <zyp> isn't that just PoP chips?
[20:47] <zyp> memory chip is mounted on top of arm chip?
[20:47] <DrLuke> oh
[20:47] <zyp> so the pcb is actually the arm chip
[20:47] <DrLuke> that's cool, I didn't know that
[20:47] <DrLuke> fascinating
[20:48] <DrLuke> I wonder how high one could stack a tower of ICs like that
[20:48] <zyp> haven't seen it used for anything else than stacking a single memory package on top of a SoC
[20:48] <DrLuke> it certainly would need some clever heatsink
[20:49] <DrLuke> oh man it's so amazing being an EE student, I can choose to specialize on whatever I want
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[20:49] <zyp> not if there aren't much heat to sink
[20:49] <DrLuke> I shall be the first IC-stacker
[20:49] <zyp> :p
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[20:49] <zyp> I did EE, but took some software courses as well
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[20:49] <DrLuke> well, we won't get around doing that
[20:50] <DrLuke> we actually got a workshop on AVRs too
[20:50] <DrLuke> so it'll be playing on home turf for me
[20:50] <zyp> so did we
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[20:50] <zyp> but I also took a couple of courses from CS, that was outside my program
[20:50] <DrLuke> I've already got requests from like 6 or so groups to join them
[20:50] <DrLuke> but I'm sticking with my friends :)
[20:51] <zyp> I had all my friends in CS anyway :p
[20:51] <DrLuke> haha
[20:51] <zyp> I never made any close friends with my EE classmates
[20:51] <DrLuke> well, what advantage did you get from taking CS courses?
[20:51] <zyp> I now work with embedded software :)
[20:52] <DrLuke> ah
[20:52] <zyp> I've always been interested in just that
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[20:52] <zyp> lowlevel software, where it meets the hardware
[20:52] <DrLuke> well, my course officially is called Electrical Engineering and Information Technology
[20:52] <DrLuke> so it involves a lot of programming, too
[20:52] <zyp> sounds good :)
[20:52] <DrLuke> it's basically EE and CS mashed together
[20:52] <DrLuke> but as you said, on a low level
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[20:53] <zyp> that's where the fun part is
[20:53] <DrLuke> yep
[20:53] <DrLuke> I love to do some script-language programming now and then, but if I had to choose, I'd stick with low level C
[20:53] <zyp> dealing with user interfaces is pretty much dealing with idiot interfaces, considered most users can be considered idiots from time to time, so I'd rather avoid that :p
[20:54] <zyp> considering*
[20:54] <DrLuke> yeah
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[20:54] <DrLuke> which is quite sad, I wish all devices had some sort of un-idiotize button in the settings
[20:54] <DrLuke> the best example would be the kindle
[20:54] <zyp> is it bad?
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[20:55] <DrLuke> I understand that they want to keep it so super simple that even seniors and their dogs use it
[20:55] <zyp> I've considered getting one, but haven't yet
[20:55] <DrLuke> but there are some little things I'd like to change but can't
[20:55] <DrLuke> well, it's an excellent ebook reader
[20:55] <DrLuke> so go ahead
[20:55] <DrLuke> the hardware is really nice
[20:55] <DrLuke> I espcially love the buttons to turn the page
[20:55] <DrLuke> they're so tactile :3
[20:56] <zyp> didn't they remove them in the newer ones?
[20:56] <DrLuke> uh no Idea
[20:56] <zyp> I think I read that they only use touch now?
[20:56] <zyp> or is that only certain models? maybe not all have touch?
[20:56] <DrLuke> I actually bought the kindle 4 two weeks ago, thinking they wouldn't relese the paperwhite in germany for some time
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[20:57] <DrLuke> yeah, the kindle 4 also came as a non-touch model
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[20:57] <zyp> do you have a seperate kindle store in germany?
[20:57] <DrLuke> yeah, we also don't have kindlets
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[20:57] <DrLuke> which is like, the stupidest thing on earth
[20:57] <DrLuke> (kindlets are like apps for the kindle, games etc)
[20:57] <DrLuke> they're all USA only
[20:58] <zyp> I live in norway, when I got my sister a kindle for christmas I just ordered it from the US store
[20:58] <DrLuke> I also had to chuckle about the seal for "frustration free packaging" on the packaging
[20:58] <DrLuke> which coincidentally is an owned trademark of amazon, lol
[20:58] <DrLuke> well yeah that's probably the best thing to do
[20:58] <DrLuke> but I didn't really care for some stupid kindlets
[20:59] <DrLuke> it's not like I'm going to play sudoku
[20:59] <DrLuke> I want to read books, lol
[20:59] <zyp> amazon doesn't have a norway-store anyway, so it's not like I have a choice
[20:59] <DrLuke> really?
[20:59] <zyp> really.
[20:59] <DrLuke> I thought norway would be big enough for that
[20:59] <zyp> I don't really see any point either, from a consumer point of view
[21:00] <DrLuke> why?
[21:00] <zyp> UPS shipments from US arrive as fast as domestic shipments here
[21:00] <DrLuke> magic
[21:00] <DrLuke> oh well
[21:00] <DrLuke> what I like about the kindle is the way you buy books
[21:01] <DrLuke> they pretty much instantly download onto your kindle
[21:01] <DrLuke> it's so super hassle free
[21:01] <zyp> I've heard it's petty easy to spend money that way ;)
[21:01] <DrLuke> yeah
[21:01] <DrLuke> What I hate is that books still cost the same
[21:01] <DrLuke> it's just stupid, I think atleast a 50% reduction would be only fair
[21:01] <zyp> well, the content is still the same
[21:02] <DrLuke> it is, but it doesn't have to be printed and shipped
[21:02] <DrLuke> they just need to send it over the internet
[21:02] <DrLuke> and how much could a server for doing that cost
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[21:02] <DrLuke> peanuts compared to the books they sell
[21:02] <DrLuke> amount of*
[21:05] <zyp> so they have less revenue on the paper books then
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[21:05] <DrLuke> yeah
[21:05] <zyp> they should just increase the price of the paper books so the revenue would match, then you would be happy, right? :)
[21:05] <DrLuke> the ebooks basically are almost 100% revenue
[21:05] <DrLuke> haha
[21:05] <DrLuke> no
[21:05] <DrLuke> I'm a poor student, I'm poor
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[21:06] <DrLuke> (yet I'm going to launch a HAB, hmm...)
[21:06] <DrLuke> also I've never been really reading that much
[21:06] <DrLuke> but after I got the kindle I tore through a 350 page book pretty fast
[21:06] <DrLuke> a little more than a week
[21:06] <DrLuke> it's just comfortable to read on it
[21:07] <DrLuke> also, you can ssh into it
[21:07] <DrLuke> so it also is a very neat toy
[21:07] <DrLuke> I might try to use it as a display for the RPi
[21:07] <Lunar_Lander> cool!
[21:08] <DrLuke> just think of the possibilities... maybe a mobile HAB tracker?
[21:08] <DrLuke> with a daylight-capable display
[21:08] <DrLuke> all running on a rather small battery
[21:08] <DrLuke> you could even mount everything onto a yagi itself
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[21:20] <RG-lz1dev> Upu: ping
[21:23] <arko> aww, the tracking info is gone on spacenear.us
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[21:24] <fsphil> I hate the trend in making devices so closed to tweaking
[21:24] <DrLuke> fsphil: indeed. My kindle didn't even come with any SSH client, I had to install one myself
[21:24] <DrLuke> Using a jailbreak and a faked kindle update package
[21:25] <fsphil> a proper linux on a kindle would be amazing
[21:25] <DrLuke> install it yourself then
[21:26] <DrLuke> it's just pretty easy to brick it
[21:26] <fsphil> can you though?
[21:26] <Upu> hey RG-lz1dev
[21:26] <BrainDamage> afaik some run android
[21:26] <Upu> back now
[21:26] <DrLuke> of course you can
[21:26] <RG-lz1dev> kindle aprs igate ?
[21:26] <BrainDamage> which means normal linux should run just as well
[21:26] <RG-lz1dev> Upu: can you link me that diagrams showing the HAB elements
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[21:26] <fsphil> kindle runs android, but is it possible to completly replace that?
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[21:26] <DrLuke> I've seen some people run debian on it
[21:26] <Upu> http://hollandshoogte.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/hohoho-i-schematic.jpg this ?
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[21:26] <Upu> from http://ukhas.org.uk/general:beginners_guide_to_high_altitude_ballooning
[21:26] <RG-lz1dev> thats the one
[21:27] <BrainDamage> you can chroot into a more normal linux distro
[21:27] <BrainDamage> I don't know if the vanilla kernel has drivers for the hw tough
[21:27] <fsphil> yea I've seen the chroot trick
[21:27] <DrLuke> probably not
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[21:28] <DrLuke> oh well
[21:29] <fsphil> or for someone to release a similar screen with a raspberry-pi compatible interface :)
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[21:30] <BrainDamage> the rpi system is very closed
[21:31] <BrainDamage> and eink dev screens are 600¬+ :/
[21:31] <fsphil> yea the gpu is annoying
[21:32] <DrLuke> maybe the full datasheet will mircaulously leak some day
[21:33] <fsphil> or enough info reverse engineered
[21:34] <fsphil> there's a lot of them out there in a lot of smart hands :)
[21:34] <staylo> I've done some e-reader hacking, though not the Kindle. The Nook Simple Touch is probably the nicest android-based e-ink device for hacking, and any of the Kobos are the easiest linux-based devices.
[21:34] <DrLuke> but where's the fun in hacking easy devices?
[21:34] <arko> http://www.ultratechie.com/2012/10/pigate/
[21:34] <arko> did one of you do this?
[21:34] <Laurenceb_> internet explorer?!
[21:35] <DrLuke> I want that case
[21:35] <fsphil> I'm having trouble getting soundmodem working on my pi
[21:35] <DrLuke> No, I NEED that case
[21:36] <fsphil> it transmits fine, but does no decoding. and only uses about 2% cpu time so it' sprobably not even trying to decode
[21:36] <BrainDamage> did someone cut his dose?
[21:36] <DrLuke> I wonder if using an rtlsdr on a pi is feasible
[21:36] <DrLuke> I mean, for a 50 baud signal your sample rate doesn't have to be terribly high, right?
[21:36] <BrainDamage> depends on sample rate
[21:36] <fsphil> that's the same case my rig interface is in DrLuke
[21:36] <arko> i can laser cut cases
[21:36] <arko> anyone who sends me the file
[21:36] <arko> dxf or vector of some sort
[21:36] <arko> i need one for mine, im just too lazy to find a good case
[21:36] <arko> :P
[21:36] <DrLuke> :P
[21:36] <BrainDamage> 50 baud you can get away with low sampling rate, so I guess you'll be ok
[21:36] <DrLuke> BrainDamage: most interesting
[21:37] <fsphil> I've streamed data from the rpi using rtl_tcp
[21:37] <fsphil> not tried actually decoding
[21:37] <fsphil> doubtful
[21:37] <DrLuke> yeah, but processing it directly on the field is the goal
[21:37] <fsphil> if you could decimate the sampling rate
[21:37] <BrainDamage> but I don't know if the rtl chip can sustain say 1kHz sampling rate
[21:37] <DrLuke> 100k should be more than enough
[21:37] <fsphil> or configure it to work at a much slower rate
[21:38] <DrLuke> I'm sure there's some way to do it
[21:38] <BrainDamage> ask in ##rtlsdr for min sampling rate
[21:38] <BrainDamage> then decimate from that
[21:38] <fsphil> I got it working at 200000hz-ish
[21:38] <fsphil> but again, just rtl_tcp
[21:38] <DrLuke> what's the problem with the sampling rate being lower?
[21:39] <fsphil> was streaming and demodulating over the internet, which was neat :)
[21:39] <fsphil> the hardware doesn't seem to like it
[21:39] <DrLuke> hmm
[21:39] <fsphil> although it's fussy
[21:39] <DrLuke> time to make my own sdr then
[21:39] <DrLuke> it clearly is the only way to go
[21:39] <BrainDamage> if it uses a buffer for instance
[21:39] <DrLuke> :P
[21:39] <BrainDamage> with too low sample rate it can fill up and overflow
[21:39] <zyp> you can't just drop samples to downsample, you need to lowpass first to avoid aliasing
[21:39] <fsphil> exactly
[21:39] <BrainDamage> ofc
[21:39] <DrLuke> ah
[21:40] <BrainDamage> but say a 5th order fir
[21:40] <fsphil> what about averaging
[21:40] <BrainDamage> is not heavy
[21:40] <BrainDamage> averaging is lowpassing
[21:40] <fsphil> average every 16 samples
[21:40] <DrLuke> well, the pi runs on 700 MHz, so a 200 kHz sampling rate should be possible
[21:40] <zyp> averaging is a shitty way of lowpassing
[21:40] <fsphil> yep, but it's fast
[21:40] <DrLuke> ^
[21:40] <DrLuke> it's not about getting audio fidelity
[21:41] <DrLuke> 23:41| (@steve|m) I've seen 56 ksps work
[21:41] <DrLuke> that would totally work
[21:42] <fsphil> ah nice
[21:42] <fsphil> I'll try that now
[21:46] <fsphil> got noise anyway
[21:46] <fsphil> oh gqrx crashed
[21:48] <fsphil> it's on 217.169.18.115:1234 if anyone wants to try it
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[21:50] <fsphil> not working for me now
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[22:01] <jcoxon> evening all
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[22:02] <fsphil> howdy jcoxon
[22:02] <Upu> evening
[22:02] <JFS1> Evening James - about what altitude are you expecting for the Pico tomorrow?
[22:03] <jcoxon> JFS1, 4000m
[22:04] <fsphil> the latex floater's gonna be interesting
[22:04] <fsphil> below 30km it goes to denmark, above that it's germany
[22:06] <JFS1> Ta - a few of my students are hoping to track-4km might be a bit low for getting a signal so they'll probably look for the other.
[22:06] <Upu> got a prediction for the latex ?
[22:07] <jcoxon> i better get payload building :-p
[22:07] <fsphil> who needs early nights :)
[22:08] <Upu> yeah thats kinda fundemental to launching :)
[22:09] <jcoxon> Upu, with the pico do i need to halve the baud rate
[22:09] <Upu> just the delay part
[22:10] <Upu> i.e 10000
[22:10] <Upu> everything else is as is
[22:10] <Upu> baud rate for gps etc
[22:10] <Upu> sorry just the delay part of the RTTY tx bit
[22:11] <arko> did you guys launch?
[22:11] <Upu> tomorrow arko
[22:11] <arko> oh
[22:11] <arko> is that today for me?
[22:11] <Upu> the Arduino delaymicroseconds assumes 8Mhz min
[22:11] <Upu> so you half it
[22:11] <Upu> no tomorrow
[22:11] <Upu> are you PST or EDT ?
[22:11] <Upu> or somewhere in the middle
[22:11] <arko> PST
[22:11] <Lunar_Lander_> hello jcoxon
[22:12] <Lunar_Lander_> I would be ready to listen to balloons
[22:12] <arko> oh ok
[22:12] <Upu> so about...
[22:12] <arko> i see ya
[22:12] Action: Upu does maths
[22:12] <Upu> 9am you time tomorrow
[22:12] <Upu> ?
[22:12] <Upu> ish
[22:12] <arko> oh cool
[22:12] <Upu> +/- 3 hours
[22:12] <Upu> keep an eye on here and www.spacenear.us/tracker
[22:12] <arko> website to track is spacenear.us
[22:12] <arko> oh cool
[22:12] <arko> ive always wanted to watch one live
[22:13] <Upu> 1500 UTC
[22:13] <arko> cool
[22:13] <Upu> ish
[22:13] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/ish
[22:15] <fsphil> our launches are preciseish
[22:15] <arko> ISH is not an officially recognised time zone
[22:15] <arko> hahaha
[22:15] <arko> excellent
[22:17] <fsphil> I've yet to have a Livestock issue yet
[22:17] <fsphil> I seem to have one too many yets in that last sentence
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[22:27] <jcoxon> Upu, so you cant flash at 1.8v it seems :-)
[22:27] <Upu> sure you can
[22:28] <Upu> did you put the hardware definition on ?
[22:28] <Upu> before you flash it
[22:28] <jcoxon> oh wait
[22:28] <Upu> if you switch it on @ 434.200 it will be TXing something
[22:29] <jcoxon> Upu, can you foward me the board info
[22:29] <Upu> sure 1 sec
[22:29] <jcoxon> e.g. what is NSEL
[22:29] <Upu> NSEL = PB2 (Arduino 10)
[22:29] <Upu> http://pastebin.com/ypfNPn6N
[22:30] <Upu> want my code ?
[22:30] <jcoxon> nah its okay
[22:31] <jcoxon> its working
[22:31] <jcoxon> with my code
[22:31] <Upu> cool
[22:31] <jcoxon> is batt v on A0
[22:31] <jcoxon> ?
[22:31] <Upu> yes
[22:32] <Upu> now
[22:32] <Upu> are you using 1 cell ?
[22:33] <jcoxon> yeah
[22:33] <jcoxon> AA
[22:33] <Upu> you could probably do with removing R8
[22:33] <Upu> its on a 10:1 voltage divider
[22:34] <Upu> if you remove R8 it puts the battery straight into the A0 via 100k
[22:34] <Upu> trouble is you don't get much resolution with the divider in place
[22:35] <Upu> you could just literally use some snips and cut the resistor in half
[22:35] <jcoxon> r8 isn't soldered
[22:35] <Upu> on
[22:35] <Upu> is R6 ?
[22:36] <jcoxon> nope
[22:36] <Upu> oops
[22:36] <Upu> got any 0603 resistors of a high value ?
[22:36] <jcoxon> nope
[22:36] <jcoxon> not in suffolk
[22:36] <Upu> no battery monitoring then
[22:36] <jcoxon> fair enough
[22:36] <Upu> sorry
[22:37] <jcoxon> not a problem
[22:37] <Upu> if you're feeling brave you could put a normal sized resistor on the pads
[22:37] <jcoxon> means that the code is identical on Pico and Atlas
[22:37] <Upu> with a delicate hand and a bit of bending
[22:38] <Upu> R6 with a high value resistor
[22:38] <Upu> otherwise no worries
[22:38] <Laurenceb_> wow theres receivers all over poland
[22:39] <Laurenceb_> if we had a floater heading over there we could get good coverage
[22:39] <Upu> yeah thats SP9UOB's fault
[22:39] <Laurenceb_> hehe
[22:40] <Upu> anything else you need from me jcoxon before I call it a night ?
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[22:42] <jcoxon> Upu, nah all good\
[22:43] <Upu> cool well good luck with launches tommorrow, will be tracking
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[22:44] <fsphil> indeed, hope all goes well and there is bacon butties
[22:46] <SpeedEvil> on the sort of related topic to large low pressure valves.
[22:47] <SpeedEvil> anyone know of cheap valves to do natural gas to petrol generator?
[22:48] <jcoxon> ping Upu
[22:48] <Upu> heh
[22:48] <Upu> still here
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[22:49] <jcoxon> oh don't panic
[22:49] <jcoxon> just not got the gps working
[22:50] <Upu> you mean lock or at all ?
[22:50] <jcoxon> at all
[22:50] <Upu> oh
[22:50] <jcoxon> but i realised i haven't added the arduino bit
[22:56] <fsphil> Kazakhstan?
[22:56] <jcoxon> its not got a lock yet
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[23:00] <jcoxon> hehe
[23:00] <Lunar_Lander_> XD
[23:13] <daveake> I have a public service announcement to make. Something that I'm sure some HABber somewhere will make use of. It is now possible to buy ....... Justin Beiber Duct Tape.
[23:14] <jcoxon> yeah i saw that
[23:14] <daveake> And if anyone does use it, don't ask me to help with the recovery :)
[23:14] <daveake> Saw a rack of the stuff in Walmart earlier.
[23:14] <daveake> Not sure what demographic they're going for there
[23:15] <daveake> Mind you, I did buy myself some pink duct tape :D
[23:16] <daveake> Good luck with the launches tomorrow jcoxon. I won't be back in Blighty till Monday afternoon so I can't help track.
[23:16] <Lunar_Lander_> hello daveake
[23:16] <jcoxon> thanks daveake
[23:16] <daveake> hello LL
[23:16] <Lunar_Lander_> oh dawkins, justin bieber duct tape?
[23:16] <daveake> yup
[23:17] <daveake> You want some? :p
[23:17] <Lunar_Lander_> XD dear dawkins, no
[23:17] <daveake> Saves me a trip then
[23:17] <Laurenceb_> i never used to believe justin bieber was for real
[23:17] <Laurenceb_> thought it was some sort of esoteric joke
[23:19] <daveake> brb Off to buy ice cream :)
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[23:30] <gonzo_> pft, you can go right off some people!
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[23:38] <daveake> 32C outside. A/C on, and we have a tub of Ben & Jerry's :)
[23:39] <Darkside> lol
[23:40] <Lunar_Lander_> daveake, XD
[23:40] <jcoxon> night all
[23:40] <daveake> nn
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[00:00] --- Sat Oct 20 2012