highaltitude.log.20120924

[00:20] <DrLuke> finished with the 2 4k7 resisotrs :) http://i46.tinypic.com/2m43nl3.jpg
[00:20] <DrLuke> another angle: http://i47.tinypic.com/k24jp.jpg
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[00:29] <russss> "Occupy has become a dirty word, so it is not used"
[00:29] <russss> heh
[00:41] <Lunar_Lander> DrLuke, looks professional!
[00:41] <Lunar_Lander> why did you cover the resistor bodys with heatshrink?
[00:43] <DrLuke> yeah
[00:44] <DrLuke> tomorrow I will solder short wires to all 4 pins, so I can easily connect everything to a micro
[00:44] <DrLuke> and a power supply
[00:45] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[00:45] <Lunar_Lander> why did you cover the resistor bodys with heatshrink?
[00:45] <DrLuke> so it won't make contact with anything else
[00:45] <DrLuke> I've just put the whole thing in heatshrink
[00:45] <DrLuke> was easier that way
[00:46] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[00:46] <DrLuke> the heatshrink isn't shrunk yet
[00:46] <DrLuke> so it'll probably look a lot better once it is
[00:47] <DrLuke> my lighter is out of gas and I don't want to use the hair dryer in the middle of the night...
[00:47] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[01:24] <DrLuke> http://www.ebay.de/itm/Amateurfunk-70-cm-TONNA-Yagi-Richtantenne-2-35-m-lang-/330794310282?pt=DE_Handys_Kommunikation_Antennen&hash=item4d04e09a8a#ht_2529wt_1397
[01:24] <DrLuke> sweeeet
[01:40] <Lunar_Lander> cool!
[01:45] <Lunar_Lander> good night!
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[06:11] <griffonbot> @daveake: Very cute, and a great video - "A Toy Train in Space": http://t.co/0t1A7oqJ via @youtube #UKHAS [http://twitter.com/daveake/status/250115196541095936]
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[07:50] <griffonbot> Received email: Merv "Re: [UKHAS] Update to Android Chase Car App"
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[08:10] <griffonbot> Received email: Neil Baker "Re: [UKHAS] Conference 2012"
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[08:56] <WillDuckworth> hey is eroomde about?
[08:57] <WillDuckworth> have a question I forgot to ask at the conf during the rocket talk..... the doppler shift: any ideas(anyone) on how to take that into account for tracking?
[09:01] <jonsowman> don't use narrowband RTTY telemetry
[09:03] <jonsowman> the issue is that it leaves the audio passband too fast
[09:03] <jonsowman> so use a telem system that 1) has more bandwidth and 2) is more resilient to drift
[09:06] <eroomde> WillDuckworth: yes
[09:07] <eroomde> what jonsowman says
[09:07] <eroomde> so for example, fm modulation
[09:07] <eroomde> if you were to do fm modulation, the doppler on the carrier becaomes just a dc offset when you demodulate
[09:07] <eroomde> and that gets filtered out anyway usually because you're only interested in the mark and space freuqnecy, in the case of rtty
[09:08] <eroomde> but the energy you need per transmitted bit, for a given error rate, for fm modulation vs ssb modulation, is much higher
[09:08] <eroomde> so basically it's probably pushing it a bit (though maybe not? not done the sums) with a 10mW Tx
[09:09] <eroomde> but if you had say 1W, FM and job's a good'n
[09:09] <fsphil> I guess that is why afsk is so popular on satellites
[09:10] <eroomde> yeah
[09:13] <WillDuckworth> cool - was floating that out there and was curious. cheers
[09:15] <Darkside> hmm
[09:15] <Darkside> i think i might try and make a Si570 based WSPR beacon
[09:15] <Darkside> class E amp
[09:15] <Darkside> and fly it
[09:15] <Darkside> would be intersting to use it with just locators
[09:16] <Darkside> it'll only give a few km precision
[09:16] <Darkside> but it'd be super reliable
[09:16] <Darkside> the problem will be drift
[09:17] <Darkside> i dont know how WSPR handles drift...
[09:20] <fsphil> probably not well
[09:22] <fsphil> where it would be really useful is on the ground, where drift won't be as much of an issue
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[09:36] <Laurenceb> ewww
[09:36] <Laurenceb> the weather is horrible
[09:37] <griffonbot> @steamfire: Had a great time at the United Kingdom High Altitude Society Conference this weekend! #UKHAS [http://twitter.com/steamfire/status/250167094648393728]
[09:37] <Darkside> fsphil: the fun part will be tryin gto put useful data into it
[09:38] <Darkside> as what you can send is extremely limited
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[09:41] <Darkside> well i might see about adding it to my multimode DDS beacon code
[09:42] <Darkside> since someone has already done the hard work of doing all the FEC and stuff for it
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[10:20] <Pixel> Anybody around that can approve a flight plan on habitat?
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[10:23] <eroomde> Pixel: ping Randonskk or DanielRichman
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[10:23] <DanielRichman> hi
[10:23] <eroomde> Randomskk even
[10:23] <eroomde> voila
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[10:23] <DanielRichman> Pixel: what's the name of the flight (or its doc id?)
[10:24] <Pixel__> SPASO UP 1 from memory
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[10:25] Nick change: Pixel__ -> Pixel
[10:26] <DanielRichman> Pixel: done
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[10:26] <Pixel> Thanks
[10:27] <Pixel> Don't know how much data we will get up but wrought we whould give it a go.
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[10:34] <Pixel> Other random request if anybody could email the old python upload script to justin@omatic.net I whould most grateful
[10:34] <DanielRichman> which python script do you mean? the very oldest version of dl-fldigi?
[10:34] <Pixel> The I can merge my SMS tracker data with the ntx2 data on your awsome interface
[10:35] <DanielRichman> we have a new python script which might be easier to use
[10:36] <Pixel> Sound good I've got data coming from SMS to a python server whould live to get that data up to the tracker
[10:36] <DanielRichman> okay so basically
[10:36] <DanielRichman> get this: https://github.com/ukhas/habitat
[10:37] <DanielRichman> then do this: import habitat; u = habitat.uploader.Uploader("SMS"); u.payload_telemetry("$$SPASO etc. etc. etc.*CHECKSUM")
[10:37] <Pixel> That the full new tracker is it not?
[10:37] <DanielRichman> yeah but the uploader is in there.
[10:37] <DanielRichman> default arguments to habitat.uploader.Uploader will send data to habitat.habhub.org and then on to spacenear.us
[10:38] <Pixel> Cool
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[10:38] <DanielRichman> "SMS" in the line above is the callsign it will display as so you can pick whatever you want there
[10:38] <Pixel> I'm in a restraint in Griffith on a iPhone I will check it out in a bit
[10:38] <DanielRichman> it does however need to be a full telemetry string that would be sent via the radio
[10:39] <DanielRichman> which hopefully is okay? I don't know what your SMS tracker sends (mine just sent the same as it would send by radio, forex)
[10:40] <DanielRichman> http://habitat.habhub.org/ docs and other fun cool stuff is linked here
[10:41] <Pixel> Thanks very much awesome project
[10:43] <DanielRichman> :-)
[10:45] <kokey> hmmm, wondering how to use the new turn by turn navigation on the iphone
[10:45] <kokey> it might be possible to feed it landing prediction destination dynamically
[10:47] <daveake> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fja3qfm7rwU lol
[10:48] <Pixel> Is there a checksum function or do I need to add that to the string ?
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[10:49] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[10:49] <eroomde> no
[10:49] <eroomde> Pixel: CRC16
[10:50] <eroomde> please not XOR, to reiterate danielrichman's plea
[10:50] <Pixel> Thanks
[10:50] <DanielRichman> you can find code to calculate crc16 on the ukhas wiki
[10:50] <DanielRichman> habitat has some python crc16 code that it uses to check strings that come in. It's in habitat.utils.checksums
[10:51] <DanielRichman> http://ukhas.org.uk/communication:protocol?s[]=checksum
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[12:11] <griffonbot> Received email: Oliver de Peyer "[UKHAS] Thoughts and questions after Saturday: Satellite uplinks,
[12:14] <pjm> btw its a real pity we in .eu dont have 420MHz 70cms band, there are russian milsats with 420 up, and 480 down that are super sensitive
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[12:15] <justinatomatic_> habitat install sudo python setup.py install gives error: file '/home/user/ukhas-habitat-4a2e903/bin/habitat' does not exist
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[12:19] <griffonbot> Received email: "Re: [UKHAS] RFM22 transmitter ...."
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[12:21] <DanielRichman> Pixel__: yeah sorry; the deployment/setup.py stuff is a bit broken becuase we arn't using it on habhub.org yet
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[12:21] <DanielRichman> quickest fix I guess is to vim setup.py and delete the scripts= line
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[13:01] <DrLuke> can anybody give me an opinion on this yagi? http://www.ebay.de/itm/350-500-MHz-70cm-Band-Richtantenne-9dBi-YAGI-ABY7LB-/110953378105?pt=DE_Handys_Kommunikation_Antennen&hash=item19d5563139#ht_1488wt_1397
[13:01] <DrLuke> I think it's a bit weird that it is so broadband... it goes from 350 MHz to 500 MHz
[13:03] <costyn> DrLuke: looks nice, a bit unwieldy. Are you going to mount it on a rotator?
[13:03] <costyn> DrLuke: oh wait
[13:03] <DrLuke> no, I want to hold it by hand
[13:03] <costyn> DrLuke: tahts a different one than you posted last night
[13:03] <DrLuke> yeah
[13:03] <DrLuke> that really would be unwieldy :)
[13:03] <DrLuke> although I am considering buying both
[13:03] <costyn> DrLuke: looking at the picture, I have this exact one :)
[13:04] <costyn> DrLuke: it work fine for HAB
[13:04] <DrLuke> alright, thanks! :)
[13:04] <costyn> DrLuke: http://i.imgur.com/9zsNgh.jpg?1
[13:04] <DrLuke> indeed, haha
[13:04] <DrLuke> did you modify it for the tripod?
[13:04] <costyn> my "portable" setup :)
[13:05] <DrLuke> because it looks damn sexy on that tripod
[13:05] <costyn> DrLuke: I made a U bracket from some simple plate iron
[13:05] <costyn> DrLuke: but no modifications to the antenna itself
[13:05] <DrLuke> nice
[13:05] <costyn> hardest part is finding a bolt for the camera screw (which isn't metric)
[13:06] <DrLuke> at first I thought about making my own yagi, but with prices like these, it's just not worth the hassle
[13:06] <costyn> luckily I found one in my box-o-bolts
[13:06] <DrLuke> ah
[13:06] <costyn> no, it's really worth it
[13:06] <costyn> the only problem is it's a bit fragile
[13:07] <costyn> I saw Darkside using a yagi with tubes, looks a lot sturdier for use out in the field
[13:07] <costyn> this one is meant to be mounted once I believe
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[13:08] <DrLuke> oh
[13:08] <DrLuke> oh well, it's still 15¬ including shipping, so even if it breaks... eh :)
[13:09] <costyn> and you'll need some connectors & converters ; I got mine from Tim, he had an SMA cable on it, so I got a sma-bnc converter to connect it to my 817
[13:09] <DrLuke> oh hum
[13:09] <DrLuke> I've got a SDR
[13:09] <costyn> ah
[13:09] <costyn> what connector?
[13:10] <DrLuke> if I knew...
[13:10] <costyn> upload a pic :)
[13:10] <DrLuke> hold on a second
[13:10] <costyn> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FME_connector this is what the antenna has according to the description
[13:10] <DrLuke> http://www.ebay.de/itm/251053485117?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
[13:10] <costyn> ugh
[13:10] <DrLuke> well
[13:10] <costyn> that's your standard antenna coax connector
[13:10] <DrLuke> I can just snip off the connector and solder it
[13:11] <costyn> DrLuke: Upu replaces the coax connectors with sma on the dongles he sells http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=71_63&product_id=70
[13:11] <costyn> DrLuke: yea best replace it with something better
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[13:13] <DrLuke> or I'll just buy an adaptor
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[13:13] <costyn> DrLuke: http://www.antennendiscount24.de/WebRoot/Store19/Shops/61821063/4BA3/CA87/76E8/669A/492C/C0A8/28B9/C7C0/Adapter_SMA-FME.JPG <-- from FME to SMA. Mine has this
[13:13] <Lunar_LanderU> hello
[13:13] <DrLuke> hi
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[13:16] <DrLuke> I think I'll just get a spare FME female connector, and solder it to the rest of the antenna cable I've got
[13:16] <DrLuke> DIY adapters are best adapters
[13:16] <costyn> :)
[13:16] <costyn> less converters = better
[13:16] <DrLuke> yeah yeah whatever :P
[13:17] <costyn> DrLuke: what antenna cable? don't use tv coax plz :)
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[13:17] <DrLuke> why not
[13:17] <costyn> crappy quality afaik
[13:17] <DrLuke> well
[13:18] <DrLuke> I could directly mount an fme connector
[13:19] <costyn> well maybe someone around here with actual ham license could give us more details
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[13:20] <DrLuke> or I could snip off the connector and directly solder it onto the usb dongle
[13:20] <DrLuke> :)
[13:21] <Lunar_LanderU> XD
[13:22] <DrLuke> I actually like that idea
[13:23] <costyn> might just work
[13:23] <DrLuke> do you know what diode is supposed to go on there?
[13:23] <DrLuke> I'm going to order a few on farnell
[13:24] <costyn> no idea
[13:24] <costyn> DrLuke: ping Upu
[13:24] <UpuWork> hello
[13:24] <UpuWork> nah don't buy one I'll send you it
[13:24] <UpuWork> or just buy the dongle from my shop its got one on
[13:24] <UpuWork> BAV99 though
[13:24] <DrLuke> I'm ordering from farnell anyways
[13:25] <UpuWork> up to you
[13:26] <DrLuke> I'll order one when I place my next order with you though :)
[13:26] <costyn> DrLuke: are you going to use the HABAmp?
[13:26] <DrLuke> probably not with my first launch
[13:27] <DrLuke> those hammond enclosures, they don't come predrilled with holes, right?
[13:28] <costyn> DrLuke: well keep in mind that you will need to connect it to your usb dongle if you decide to buy it; probably an SMA connector on there would be wisest
[13:28] <DrLuke> yeah
[13:28] <DrLuke> that's why I'd buy it together with upu's dongle
[13:28] <DrLuke> (that sounds wrong :)
[13:28] <costyn> hehe
[13:28] <UpuWork> haha
[13:28] <Lunar_LanderU> ROFL
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[14:25] <griffonbot> Received email: Dave Hibberd "Re: [UKHAS] Conference 2012"
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[15:30] <DrLuke> who's been behiny PYSY?
[15:30] <DrLuke> behind*
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[16:03] <kokey> looking at the images done by the masat-1 guys
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[17:01] <stilldavid> can anyone recommend a good 2m antenna for hab use?
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[17:10] <eroomde> stilldavid: receiving or transmitting?
[17:10] <stilldavid> transmitting. I'm building an aprs beacon this afternoon.
[17:10] <stilldavid> I have the 70cm bazooka antenna made from coax that's great, but I'm sure there's a better home-made option for 2m
[17:10] <eroomde> j-pole or slimjim could be fun
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[17:55] <DrLuke> upu: ping
[17:55] <DrLuke> we gotta talk some business
[17:55] <Upu> lol ok
[17:55] <Upu> I might have to go very shortly but feel free to PM
[17:55] <eroomde> christ
[17:55] Action: eroomde gets popcorn
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[18:07] <DrLuke> eroomde: :)
[18:10] <costyn> DrLuke: you make it sound as if you want to become a dealer for Upu's warez
[18:10] <DrLuke> what? no! I just wanted to buy 100kg of heroin
[18:10] <DrLuke> :P
[18:11] <eroomde> my wee office has a 3 phase socket
[18:11] <eroomde> so i can use the 5kW fan heater
[18:11] <DrLuke> lol
[18:11] <eroomde> it's tropical in here now
[18:11] <DrLuke> sounds hot
[18:11] <daveake> back to shorts then
[18:11] <eroomde> never left them
[18:12] <costyn> :D
[18:12] <daveake> :)
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[19:10] <Laurenceb_> hi
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[19:13] <Laurenceb_> so following the conference, i was thinking about superpressure
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[19:14] <Laurenceb_> a 1m diameter superpressure with ~20Km cruise altitude might just be feasible
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[19:14] <Laurenceb_> not sure if a lightweight HF transmitter could be built
[19:14] <Laurenceb_> but at that size its more feasible for amateur construction
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[19:16] <bertrik> Laurenceb_: for tracking bats, there are transmitters weighing 2 grams, including battery, transmitting at around 150 MHz
[19:16] <Laurenceb_> interesting
[19:16] <Laurenceb_> what does the antenni look like?
[19:16] <LazyLeopard> How lightweight is "lightweight"
[19:17] <LazyLeopard> ...and where in the HF? There comes a point the antenna is going to be the significant weight.
[19:18] <Laurenceb_> im not the person to ask
[19:18] <Laurenceb_> IANAH
[19:19] <Laurenceb_> I Am Not A Ham :P
[19:19] <LazyLeopard> There are "altoids compatible" HF CW transceivers a plenty in the QRP world. Most are CW rigs, though.
[19:19] <bertrik> For bats, it's a simple wire. Here's the lightest one in use: http://www.holohil.com/lb2x.htm
[19:20] <bertrik> it just beeps, not coded or anything
[19:20] <Laurenceb_> hmm thats just an end driven wire
[19:20] <Laurenceb_> cant be very good?
[19:21] <jcoxon> haha Upu
[19:21] <LazyLeopard> It's intended to be stuck on a small animal, so it's probably a case of needs must.
[19:21] <Upu> :)
[19:21] <Laurenceb_> i guess you need 10m band for long range
[19:22] <bertrik> yeah, I guess no good for HAB, but it's a nice example of the possibilities for very lightweight transmitters
[19:22] <LazyLeopard> ...if the band's open. ;)
[19:22] <Laurenceb_> so thats a 5m dipole
[19:22] <SpeedEvil> there are bee track era
[19:22] <SpeedEvil> bats are nothing
[19:22] <Laurenceb_> wonder if twisted pair with enamled copper wire would work
[19:22] <SpeedEvil> bee trackers
[19:22] <Laurenceb_> - for the upper 2.5m
[19:22] <Laurenceb_> interesting, but im guessing very high frequency
[19:23] <SpeedEvil> indeed
[19:23] <bertrik> SpeedEvil: I thought those were tracked by harmonic radar, so not actively transmitting
[19:23] <SpeedEvil> radar, too
[19:23] <Laurenceb_> ive got some Dow Corning silicone PSA
[19:23] <SpeedEvil> so, aorta cheating
[19:23] <SpeedEvil> sorta
[19:23] <Laurenceb_> so ill try some creep tests and low temperature tests
[19:23] <Laurenceb_> with mylar when i get time
[19:23] <Laurenceb_> their FAE said -90C adhesion is ok
[19:24] <Laurenceb_> 1m diameter seems quite buildable
[19:26] <Laurenceb_> especially with a bond alignment jig
[19:26] <Laurenceb_> which could be made from MDF + vaccum cleaner for suction
[19:26] <bertrik> IANAH, but I think for line-of-sight transmission, the frequency doesn't really matter much
[19:26] <Laurenceb_> im not talking line of sight
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[19:27] <Laurenceb_> - for long duration superpressure
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[19:29] <DrLuke> compostable plastic packaging? what have I missed in the past years?
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[19:32] <SpeedEvil> fucking annoying shit that decays if you they to store stuff in it,
[19:33] <SpeedEvil> if you try
[19:38] <DrLuke> oh
[19:39] <Laurenceb_> yeah
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[19:44] <Laurenceb_> http://www.digikey.co.uk/product-detail/en/AD9850BRSZ/AD9850BRSZ-ND/621913
[19:44] <Laurenceb_> power hungry :(
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[19:44] <Lunar_Lander_> hello
[19:44] <DrLuke> hi
[19:44] <DrLuke> Oh, I used the 9850 for my tesla coil
[19:44] <Lunar_Lander_> it's getting cold in Europe!
[19:46] <DrLuke> I suggest you get one of those ready-to-go daughterboards from ebay, they go for like 15¬
[19:46] <Laurenceb_> i see, thanx
[19:46] <DrLuke> or else you'll have to get all the extra components and stuff...
[19:46] <Lunar_Lander_> brb
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[19:47] <Lunar_Lander_> so
[19:47] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: what four do you need?
[19:48] <SpeedEvil> fout
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[19:51] <Laurenceb_> i was looking for something for a superpressure balloon
[19:51] <Laurenceb_> but its probably more sane to use a transistor oscillator
[19:51] <Laurenceb_> or a stm32 and DAC
[19:52] <Laurenceb_> the envelope is probably a more important consideration
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[19:54] <Lunar_Lander_> wait
[19:54] <Lunar_Lander_> wtf
[19:54] <Lunar_Lander_> * Lunar_Lander (~gd-compto@p54A06BF2.dip.t-dialin.net) hat #highaltitude betreten
[19:54] <Lunar_Lander_> * Lunar_Lander hat die Verbindung getrennt (Client Quit)
[19:54] <Lunar_Lander_> what does that have to mean?
[19:59] <Laurenceb_> it means you have to go outside
[19:59] <Laurenceb_> and find a girlfriend
[20:01] <DrLuke> haha
[20:01] <DrLuke> http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/23527564.jpg
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[20:38] <KyleYankan> Hey, to those who helped em with the TinyTrack 3 last night: getting better results. Still tweaking. Thanks
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[20:44] <Hix> two kinds of people in this world apparently.... http://www.thepoke.co.uk/2012/09/23/there-are-only-two-kinds-of-people/
[20:45] <fsphil_pi> those with flash, and those without :)
[20:46] <SpeedEvil> what about those stuck on flash 9
[20:46] <Hix> apple or the rest of the wold
[20:47] <Hix> world
[20:47] <DrLuke> but everybody knows there's only 10 kind of people on the world
[20:47] <Laurenceb_> flash9 from outer space
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[20:47] <stilldavid> those who know binary...
[20:47] <fsphil_pi> flash .... aaaahhhh
[20:47] <fsphil_pi> he saved everyone of us
[20:47] <DrLuke> there are only 2 kinds of people on the world: those who know which way to go, and those who use iOS 6 :)
[20:48] <Upu> ping mattbrejza
[20:48] <Hix> An iPhone user walks into...a bar, a hotel, a field. He's not too sure.
[20:49] <DrLuke> haha
[20:49] <fsphil_pi> flash ruined my computer, but at least it's very clean inside now
[20:49] <Upu> anyone got an image of Matt's crazy small board ?
[20:50] <fsphil_pi> so small I missed it :(
[20:50] <jonsowman> mattbrejza: ^
[20:51] <jonsowman> it's called Picotex btw
[20:52] <daveake> My little tracker looked mahoosive compared to that
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[20:53] <fsphil_pi> that's too big a name, it needs to be called P
[20:53] <fsphil_pi> or, p
[20:53] <daveake> I'd call it .
[20:53] <fsphil_pi>
[20:53] <fsphil_pi> oh that's too small
[20:53] <daveake> lol
[20:53] <Upu> lol
[20:55] <Upu> 51.51117, -1.38851
[20:55] <Upu> fire missles...
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[20:56] <daveake> what's a missle and why are you aiming one at me? :0
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[20:57] <Upu> pasted by accident :)
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[20:57] <daveake> :)
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[20:58] <daveake> nn off to Belgium tomorrow at silly o'clock
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[20:59] <M0JSN> huh
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[21:26] <Lunar_Lander_> hi nigelvh
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[21:56] <Lunar_Lander_> hi nigelvh
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[22:33] <Guest61871> Received email: Philip Crump "[UKHAS] Re: Launch Announcement CRAAG1 Pico (24th/25th September)"
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[23:52] <DrLuke> http://i50.tinypic.com/30xfmu9.jpg - I love heatshrink
[23:53] <Lunar_Lander_> cool!
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[00:00] --- Tue Sep 25 2012