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[00:30] <Hix> who am i?
[00:31] <Hix> ahh I am back
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[00:35] <Hix> same?
[00:35] <Hix> yup
[00:35] <Hix> Cheers jonsowman, registered with Freenode
[00:36] Nick change: Hix -> HixPad
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[02:17] <EarthBreeze> is james or any of the other web site gys here?
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[04:25] <kc9mnl> hello...
[04:25] <kc9mnl> does anyone know if they located teh kb9kho/b balloon?
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[06:35] <fsphil> morning all
[06:35] <fsphil> silly mornings
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[06:43] <UpuWork> morning
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[06:59] <hix> morning
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[07:59] <WillDuckworth> hey cuddykid - how did the radio thing go?
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[08:23] <cuddykid> hiya WillDuckworth - just got back :) good thanks! Met an oscar winner and got to hold a real oscar!
[08:25] <cuddykid> apparently I've been on BBC Breakfast?! Never knew about this.. lol
[08:27] <cuddykid> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-19586774 - BBC have got reporting right
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[08:28] <daveake> " a select band of private individuals" :0
[08:31] <WillDuckworth> very select
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[08:31] <cuddykid> hahaha
[08:31] <cuddykid> brilliant
[08:31] <cuddykid> UKHAS :D
[08:32] <daveake> "The project cost Mr Cudworth £200" ... orly?
[08:33] <cuddykid> lol
[08:33] <cuddykid> In fact this launch probably cost a lot less because helium was free (thanks to j****)
[08:33] <daveake> It's cost you that in rail fares for the interviews :D
[08:33] <cuddykid> right, bbl
[08:33] <cuddykid> haha DanielRichman
[08:33] <cuddykid> *daveake
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[08:47] <costyn> cuddykid: that is a nice article on the bbc website. Just the facts, no bullcrap; very refreshing
[08:47] <cuddykid> agree costyn - for once they've reported correctly unlike many other sites
[08:48] <costyn> it's nice when they do their own fact checking and interviews instead of blindly copy/pasting it from other news sites
[08:48] <daveake> Told you BBC were good :)
[08:49] <costyn> I quite like the BBC, so many great TV programmes
[08:49] <cuddykid> yep
[08:49] <cuddykid> CNN have done a good job too
[08:50] <costyn> cuddykid: not sure if I read that one... have link?
[08:51] <cuddykid> actually, not CNN, my mistake - can't remember who it was now
[08:52] <costyn> heh
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[09:05] <fsphil> cool, I'm in a select band of private individuals
[09:06] <fsphil> hah, they got a comment from the CAA
[09:06] <fsphil> all lies of course :)
[09:06] <daveake> Wonder if they had to wait 28 days
[09:07] <daveake> Should be "We get 2 or 3 requests a month, and grant all of them except the ones from some guy in Northern Ireland"
[09:08] <costyn> hahaha
[09:08] <fsphil> I'll have to email this Richard Taylor guy
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[09:12] <UpuWork> We get 2 or 3 requests a month, Dave Akerman is quite prolific at launching despite "taking a break"
[09:12] <daveake> lol
[09:16] <daveake> Well I'm taking a break now :-)
[09:17] <MrScienceMan> how do i get my hands on some nichrome wire
[09:17] <number10> ebay
[09:18] <MrScienceMan> why didnt i check ebay
[09:18] <MrScienceMan> asked in all the shops
[09:18] <MrScienceMan> :(
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[09:19] <MrScienceMan> any suggestins about the diameter?
[09:19] <MrScienceMan> want to use it for cutdown
[09:20] <fsphil> I'm constantly forgetting about ebay
[09:20] <MrScienceMan> i asked around all the shops i know
[09:21] <MrScienceMan> they didnt even knew ot nichrome was
[09:21] <number10> I bought 42 swg - have not made anything yet, I think that was advice from daveake
[09:21] <number10> I know that works as his payload tried to escape from his car once
[09:21] <daveake> How thick depends on how long and what voltage. You will probably need some thin stuff
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[09:27] <MrScienceMan> daveake: http://www2.cs.man.ac.uk/~popovr8/tiny/img/content/nichrome_amps.jpg
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[09:28] <MrScienceMan> also http://www2.cs.man.ac.uk/~popovr8/tiny/img/content/nichrome_resistance.jpg
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[09:29] <MrScienceMan> from what i figure, i need the thinest possible
[09:29] <MrScienceMan> want to try 9v and 12v
[09:31] <daveake> OK, IME you need about 4 watts in a piece about 30mm long. So you need to know the resistance per metre to choose the correct wire for your 9-12V
[09:32] <daveake> Or, just use a resistor
[09:32] <daveake> Takes longer to heat up, but is probably more reliable. Nichrome is thin and weak
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[09:34] <MrScienceMan> can the resistor go to 300-400C ?
[09:34] <daveake> briefly
[09:34] <MrScienceMan> sounds unrealiable
[09:34] <daveake> It only needs to work once
[09:34] <daveake> Try it
[09:35] <daveake> See how many times you can melt the cord. IME it's "plenty"
[09:35] <MrScienceMan> how much resitance?
[09:35] <daveake> Well I told you 4 watts. Do the calc.
[09:35] <daveake> Just test it. I don't have exact figures - I've never flown one
[09:36] <daveake> Start with 2W or so and see how it goes
[09:36] <Laurenceb> ive used resistor cutters on all my balloons
[09:36] <daveake> Ask him ^^
[09:36] <Laurenceb> used them 5 times at altitude
[09:36] <Laurenceb> worked every time
[09:40] <MrScienceMan> ill get my hands on some low reistance Rs
[09:40] <MrScienceMan> and play
[09:42] <Laurenceb> i used 0.125watt 10 ohm with 5 volt
[09:44] <staylo_> Pretty cool. Does the resistor casing survive more than one attempt?
[09:44] <Laurenceb> yes
[09:44] <Laurenceb> heats up to about 300C and survives - just
[09:45] <staylo_> Cool :)
[09:45] <MrScienceMan> does it take long to heat up ?
[09:46] <Laurenceb> i used polypropylene
[09:46] <Laurenceb> about 1 second
[09:47] <Laurenceb> - as the part that melts to release
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[09:48] <Laurenceb> http://ukhas.org.uk/_media/projects:dscn1015.jpg?w=350
[09:48] <Laurenceb> a simple version
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[10:11] <SamSilver> Laurenceb: would that be a wire wound resistor or other type?
[10:11] <Laurenceb> carbon compound
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[10:13] <SamSilver> thanx
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[10:24] <eroomde> fsphil: found that the issue with the video playing on raspian is a bug with the player
[10:24] <eroomde> it doesn't hand control back to x if you tell it to play videos at their native framerate
[10:25] <eroomde> so i have to shell in and restartx manually to get desktop back
[10:26] <Laurenceb> raspberry rippled
[10:28] <fsphil> ah ha, was it mplayer by any chance?
[10:31] UpuWork (~Upu@2a02:b80:12:1:d4c0:c599:3103:f78d) left irc:
[10:32] <eroomde> omxplayer
[10:32] <eroomde> which i think is just the mplayer build for pi that is optimised for ther gpu
[10:33] <daveake> I see that the Rev2 Pi has those silly thermal fuses removed from the USB 5V lines
[10:34] <daveake> This saving the bother of shorting them out
[10:34] <fsphil> they've changed the gpio header too think
[10:34] <daveake> Thus
[10:34] <fsphil> +I
[10:34] <eroomde> they've change the gpio header too think I?
[10:35] <daveake> They've swapped to the a different i2c bus, because they're using the original one for their camera
[10:35] <eroomde> they've also broken out jtag completely, iirc
[10:35] <eroomde> which is nice
[10:35] <daveake> ^^ remove a word from that so it makes sense
[10:35] <eroomde> i want one of these ones
[10:35] <fsphil> I'll need to use up the ones I have before getting any more
[10:36] <eroomde> 'use up'?
[10:36] <eroomde> do they sublime?
[10:36] <daveake> I know some have shipped but I don't know if there are still some old ones "in the channel"
[10:36] <Laurenceb> if you want to do bare metal on rpi...
[10:36] <eroomde> i guess you could launch them
[10:36] <Laurenceb> you are insane
[10:36] <eroomde> better to have launched and lost than never to have launched at all
[10:36] <daveake> -a -a
[10:36] <eroomde> i do want to do bare metal on the rpi infact
[10:37] <eroomde> well, big arm anyway
[10:37] <eroomde> if not the pi as the chip is not so well documented
[10:37] <eroomde> but an omap chip certainly
[10:37] <eroomde> online soft gps/ins mit der particle filters
[10:37] <eroomde> then the world (or at least the market) will be mine
[10:39] <fsphil> use up as in probably land them in the ocean
[10:39] <Laurenceb> http://cdn.digitaltrends.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/ed-wallpaper.jpg
[10:39] <Laurenceb> my new wallpaper
[10:39] <eroomde> you are wierd Laurenceb
[10:40] <Laurenceb> i know :D
[10:40] <Laurenceb> http://olimex.wordpress.com/tag/a10/
[10:41] <staylo_> Wallpaper, meh. It all looks the same under a desktop filled with icons ;)
[10:41] <eroomde> Laurenceb: that's cool
[10:42] <eroomde> i could be v interested in that
[10:42] <fsphil> horrible name though
[10:42] <Laurenceb> they have a13 too
[10:42] <Laurenceb> http://olimex.wordpress.com/2012/04/24/cortex-a8-in-tqfp-sure-allwinner-a13/
[10:47] <Laurenceb> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-19586774
[10:47] <Darkside> The balloon burst at a set altitude
[10:47] <Darkside> no, it burst when it wanted to
[10:48] <Darkside> "I am working on an autonomous return glider - a small foam glider so that when the balloon bursts, instead of it just falling back to earth wherever, the glider will kick in and glide it back to a pre-determined location," he said.
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[10:48] <Darkside> yep
[10:48] <Darkside> sure
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[10:50] <Laurenceb> huh
[10:50] <Laurenceb> he is
[10:53] <Darkside> an autonomous glider wouldn't be allowed in the UK
[10:53] <Darkside> a parafoil maybe
[10:53] <Laurenceb> same thing
[10:53] <Laurenceb> different name
[10:54] <Darkside> er
[10:54] <daveake> Has to be a 'chute, doesn't it?
[10:54] <Darkside> yeah
[10:54] <Darkside> thats the way i understood it
[10:54] <Darkside> so a glider wouldn't be allowed
[10:54] <Darkside> but a controlled parachute (that's a parafoil, right?) might be
[10:54] <Darkside> i'm probably getting my names mixed up
[10:54] <daveake> AIUI, but that's only from reading discussions on here :)
[10:55] <costyn> Darkside: sounds about right
[10:55] <Darkside> ahh :P
[10:55] <costyn> (paraglider = parafoil = ram-air parachute)
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[10:58] <eroomde> i think so long as the thing providing the lift isn't rigig, you can get away with it
[10:58] <costyn> rules in NL say your rc aircraft has to be in sight at all times.
[10:59] <eroomde> a lot of the god-awful parachutes used in hab have glide rations of >1:1 anyway
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[11:05] <eroomde> i expect a lot of the landing prediction errors can be accounted by gliding too, fwiw
[11:05] <eroomde> accounted for*
[11:08] <cuddykid> done a clip for BBC mids today tonight :)
[11:09] <x-f> costyn, what if it's an autonomous, not a remotely controlled aircraft?
[11:09] <cuddykid> now ITV have got on the phone asking if I can go into their studio tonight - madness
[11:10] <costyn> x-f: haven't found anything yet
[11:11] <costyn> x-f: I guess I will have to search the RC forums
[11:11] <costyn> cuddykid: another trip to London? :)
[11:11] <cuddykid> costyn: birmingham this time - a little closer :)
[11:11] <eroomde> they'll come to you!
[11:11] <eroomde> stop letting them take advantage for filler
[11:11] <cuddykid> eroomde: they were going to, then they wanted me to go there
[11:11] <cuddykid> eroomde: BBC just came to me
[11:12] <eroomde> they all should
[11:12] <eroomde> if it's new worthy they'll do it
[11:12] <eroomde> newsworthy*
[11:12] <cuddykid> want to go into the studio just to experience it though
[11:12] <eroomde> but they will chance just filling time lazily by making you do all the work
[11:12] <eroomde> it's not a noble profession
[11:12] <cuddykid> lol
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[11:29] Action: Laurenceb is trying to work out if hes getting trolled
[11:29] <Laurenceb> just got a CE submission back as " No reference to risk of sensor becoming projectile in event of a RTA. Ref BS EN 1789"
[11:30] <Randomskk> haha what
[11:30] <Laurenceb> my reaction was kind of like that
[11:31] <Laurenceb> followed by a sinking feeling as i realised yet more paperwork trawling is required
[11:32] <Randomskk> enjoy that
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[11:57] <Darkside> anyone know a lot about I2C?
[11:57] <Randomskk> I did once
[11:57] <Randomskk> it was a sadder time
[11:58] <Darkside> trying to figure out why there's a continuous clock running
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[11:59] <Randomskk> trying to read data?
[11:59] <Darkside> yeah
[12:00] <Darkside> oh thats interesting, the SDA pullup is 2K, but the SCL one is 500 ohms
[12:00] <Randomskk> seems a bit low
[12:00] <fsphil> is that normal?
[12:00] <Darkside> yeah thats not right
[12:00] <Darkside> i wonder if thats where my problems are coming from
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[12:09] <Darkside> ok
[12:09] <Darkside> i think that was the problem
[12:17] <Laurenceb> what micro?
[12:17] <Darkside> AtMega328
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[12:39] <eroomde> number10: frying pan arrived
[12:39] <eroomde> it's very nice!
[12:40] <eroomde> very weildable
[12:40] <eroomde> a good choice for self defense
[12:40] <number10> lol, did you get it cheaper than amazon?
[12:41] <eroomde> £25 from local cook shop
[12:41] <number10> wow that is good value
[12:42] <eroomde> they are good in there
[12:42] <number10> I will have to look around as I would like one
[12:42] <eroomde> as i say, it's the only pan i've seen that'll do you a flambe flame when your pour 12% stuff like wine into it
[12:42] <eroomde> it really keeps its heat very well
[12:43] <daveake> which pan is this?
[12:43] <eroomde> just the thing for cooking along with gordon ramsay's rock-guitar, monosyllabic imperative videos
[12:43] <nick_> eroomde: cast iron?
[12:43] <eroomde> de buyer steel frying pan
[12:43] <eroomde> just got the 24cm one
[12:43] <eroomde> nick_: normal carbon steel
[12:44] <daveake> Was pondering last night on whether to get the Circulon wok
[12:44] <eroomde> nick_: http://www.amazon.co.uk/De-Buyer-5610-24-Mineral-Diameter/dp/B00462QP0M
[12:44] <daveake> We've been thru 2 electric woks in 2 years.
[12:44] <eroomde> the circulon stuff is nice (I have it) but i'm not sure why they need a wok
[12:45] <eroomde> woks are meant to be thin steel and used with afterburner gas
[12:45] <daveake> yes
[12:45] <daveake> We don't have gas at all
[12:45] <eroomde> and the circulon stuff is all try-ply steel ali steel thick base which gives a nice even heat, but doesn't really blast stuff to death which is what you want in a wok :)
[12:45] <daveake> true
[12:46] <eroomde> it's more like a big saute pan
[12:46] <eroomde> which is fine too. sauteeing is gods own cooking method
[12:46] <eroomde> says the french person
[12:47] <eroomde> but srly it is
[12:47] <eroomde> lots of heat, bit of oil, some kind of alcohol thing to deglaze. garlic
[12:47] <eroomde> short of chocolate, everything benefits from being done like that :)
[12:47] <eroomde> our deli who we are freidns with gave us a free pudding today
[12:47] <eroomde> chocolate and fig terrine
[12:48] <eroomde> it's weapons-grade deathly
[12:48] <eroomde> but really really nice
[12:48] <eroomde> her advice was 'have it with a bit of cream - to cut through the richness'
[12:48] <number10> did those hedgehogs the otherday with chicken- used two pans - shalots in one hedgehogs the other season - deglaze with dry cider and mustard mix the two pans - parsley, and sour creme
[12:49] <eroomde> jesus that sounds good
[12:49] <number10> was so good - having again tonight
[12:49] <eroomde> we should say to onlookers that you mean hedgehog mushrooms
[12:50] <eroomde> but christ, that does sound amazing
[12:50] <number10> :) should do, or I will be getting hate mail
[12:51] <nick_> Damn, I was hoping you were saying hedgehogs were tasty
[12:51] <eroomde> there's a gordom ramzay imperativemonosyllabico rock guitar vid that is similar (tho doesn't sound quite as good as yours!) but is pleasingly chicken/mushroom/cream
[12:51] <eroomde> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56BK1nCc67A
[12:51] <nick_> They're otherwise all round awesome, but I don't know how they taste
[12:51] <eroomde> expensive dinner for one
[12:51] <Laurenceb> ##cooking
[12:52] <number10> sorry about the diversion there Laurenceb
[12:52] <eroomde> dried morels and fresh morels. he has a better supermarket than I do
[12:56] <number10> I can get dried ones when in france in november
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[12:57] <costyn> can't we combine the 2? send up some food to 30K, have it be freezedried there and cook it after it lands
[12:57] <Laurenceb> already done
[12:57] <Laurenceb> but we dont talk about the banana incident
[12:57] <eroomde> costyn: need to find the morels in the first place
[12:57] <Darkside> i wanted to fly a timtam on my lauch the other week
[12:57] <Darkside> but i couldn't find any :(
[12:57] <costyn> Laurenceb: much like UKHAS-1 is also a hush hush project?
[12:58] <Laurenceb> heh
[12:58] <eroomde> yes
[12:58] <costyn> eroomde: morels?
[12:58] <costyn> Darkside: timtam?
[12:58] <eroomde> i think the sky-anvil-banana was also ukhas-1
[12:58] <Laurenceb> immoral food
[12:58] <eroomde> costyn: a kind of mushroom
[12:58] <costyn> eroomde: bwahaha ... sky-anvil eh
[12:58] <eroomde> number10 is the mushroom expert i'm sure he can describe them better than me
[12:59] <Darkside> wat
[12:59] <eroomde> Darkside: you were told perfectly clearly about penguins
[12:59] <eroomde> them superior option
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[12:59] <Darkside> eroomde: i've tried some
[12:59] <Darkside> they don't have the same kind of biscuit
[13:01] <eroomde> damn
[13:01] <daveake> Well, when you're in London for the conf ... http://www.angloaustraliantrading.com/AustraliaShop/AUSearchResult.aspx?KeyWords=tim
[13:02] <kc8yhw> Did someone mention Biscuits & Gravy
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[13:06] <eroomde> kc8yhw: no but we're talking food anyway so feel free to jump in!
[13:06] <Darkside> daveake: ooh
[13:07] <eroomde> i ran out of peanut butter this morning and thought 'damn, how the hell am i meant to have breakfast without peanut butter?'
[13:07] <eroomde> after a few seconds pondering i realised that you are allowed actual food at breakfast
[13:07] <eroomde> http://i.imgur.com/iCFy2.jpg
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[13:07] <Lunar_Lander__> hello
[13:07] <eroomde> no
[13:08] <eroomde> that + radio 4 and I was in a really happy place for 20 mins or so this morning
[13:09] <kc8yhw> Shucks I had oatmeal and now I find someone had Biscuits
[13:09] <Randomskk> eroomde: that looks like such a good breakfast :P
[13:09] <Lunar_Lander__> I installed AVR Studio 5 this morning
[13:09] <Lunar_Lander__> and now I just can program with C?
[13:09] <Randomskk> I covered my wok with burnt sugar last night, ugh
[13:09] <Randomskk> stupid honey based sauces
[13:09] <Randomskk> sooo tasty but I'll be chipping crap off the wok for ages
[13:10] <eroomde> Randomskk: it was!
[13:10] <Randomskk> eroomde: that said clearly poached eggs are superior
[13:10] <eroomde> infact the portabello shroom and toms actually need 10 mins to gently fry
[13:10] <eroomde> which means you can do long and slow scrabled egg
[13:10] <eroomde> which tastes really awesome
[13:10] <eroomde> really really very creamy and sily
[13:10] <Randomskk> nice
[13:10] <eroomde> don;t put salt or pepper in till the very end, as the salt splits it
[13:11] <eroomde> just a few seconds on the hob, stiring constantly like a resotto, off the hob, residual heat in the base of the pan doing the work, back on for a few secs, off again, etc
[13:11] <Randomskk> hmm I'll have to try it
[13:11] <kc8yhw> WHERES THE BALLOON?
[13:12] <Randomskk> poaching is such a faff
[13:12] <fsphil> and where are my dragons!
[13:12] <fsphil> oh sorry
[13:13] <fsphil> the one launched in the US recently is presumed lost at this point kc8yhw
[13:14] <eroomde> Randomskk: infact, you will see i copied this completely:
[13:14] <kc8yhw> Shucks!
[13:15] <Randomskk> wrong number of mushrooms tbh
[13:15] <Randomskk> though I like that even the tomatos look identical
[13:15] <eroomde> weekday
[13:15] <Randomskk> not convinced by your choice of bread though it's hard to tell for sure
[13:16] <eroomde> it's what i had
[13:16] <eroomde> remember this was last-minute :)
[13:16] <Randomskk> I'm lucky to have a weetabix for a weekday breakfast
[13:16] <eroomde> i take breakfast quite seriously
[13:16] <Randomskk> I would love to, but I take sleeping in very seriously
[13:16] <eroomde> downstairs by 7, radio 4, black coffee, breakfast and a good amount of chill time
[13:16] <eroomde> go for a run about 8.45
[13:17] <eroomde> be in the car on the way to work by about 9.45
[13:17] <Randomskk> run after breakfast?
[13:17] <eroomde> and i tend to work 10.30 till 7ish
[13:17] <eroomde> yeah, but like after an hour break
[13:17] <eroomde> not immediately
[13:17] <Randomskk> fair enough
[13:18] <Randomskk> his eggs look really great
[13:18] <eroomde> they do don't they
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[13:21] <eroomde> i like those vids
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[13:26] <Lunar_Lander__> hi nigelvh
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[13:36] Nick change: alecjw_ -> alecjw
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[13:37] <jgrahamc> Ping Upu
[13:42] <EarthBreeze> james or ny of the big guys around from the tracking page?
[13:42] <Darkside> EarthBreeze: what do you need done?
[13:44] <EarthBreeze> can you remove that false bogus tracking spot? i'm getting all sorts of mail about "YA GOT IT HOME"!!! YEAH!!! and all that
[13:44] <Darkside> yep
[13:44] <Darkside> done
[13:45] <EarthBreeze> sad that a fellow amateur cold do such a thing
[13:45] <Darkside> ?
[13:45] <eroomde> *possibly* could have been a bug or confusion
[13:45] <eroomde> do not ascribe to malace what can be as readily explained by stupidity
[13:45] <eroomde> or whatever the fella said
[13:46] <EarthBreeze> thing is except for the timestamp it matched exactly the saple of the telemetry from the web site sample.
[13:46] <eroomde> hmm
[13:47] <EarthBreeze> temps voltages lat long alt extly
[13:47] <EarthBreeze> Thanks Darkside gotta run.
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[13:57] <costyn> strange fellows those Americans
[13:59] <x-f> how come?
[14:00] <nick_> What's the bogus point?
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[14:01] <costyn> nick_: some guy uploaded a telemetry string to the tracker page, as if he'd received it; but it aint so
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[14:04] <nick_> How do you know he didn't?
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[14:04] <Laurenceb> competitive callum
[14:05] <Laurenceb> is on spacenear?
[14:05] <costyn> nick_: dunno, that's just what EarthBreeze said
[14:05] <Laurenceb> http://www.fat-pie.com/pana/episode4.htm
[14:05] <costyn> Laurenceb: no, on the earthbreeze tracker
[14:05] <costyn> I think?
[14:05] <costyn> although I don't know why hed ask to remove it then
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[14:07] <craag> His tracker is just an iframe of spacenear.
[14:08] <costyn> craag: but if you load spacenear it doesnt show his payload at all? (or has it been removed completely?)
[14:10] <craag> I didn't see it when the bogus point was on there. But it doesn't show for me on his page either, so I assume it's been cleared due to a long time without packets.
[14:11] <Randomskk> I think Darkside just cleared it from the tracker
[14:11] <Randomskk> payloads don't go away from spacenear.us until someone manually clears them
[14:11] <craag> Ok. I was thinking he had just deleted the bogus point.
[14:12] <Darkside> there was only one point on the tracker for that payload anywya
[14:12] <Darkside> so i jsut cleared it
[14:14] <costyn> ok
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[14:28] <nigelvh> Morning all
[14:28] <nigelvh> Got the 7012 working last night Randomskk
[14:29] <KT5TK> Congrats! What was the problem?
[14:29] <nigelvh> My filters
[14:29] <Randomskk> which filters? the pll loop or the output side?
[14:29] <Randomskk> (or the PA stuff?)
[14:29] <KT5TK> Oh, how did you change them?
[14:30] <nigelvh> The 7012 all along has been reporting it's been locked, but I couldn't detect any RF. Turns out my output filters (after both the 7012 and the PA) were more like a dummy load (THANK YOU VNA).
[14:31] <nigelvh> So, I dropped the band pass, and used some of the components I had ordered for the 70cm band pass to make a 2m low pass.
[14:31] <nigelvh> Used only one filter (After the PA), and now I get RF out happily.
[14:31] <Randomskk> cool
[14:32] <KT5TK> So the ADF7012 was always generating the correct RF output.
[14:32] <nigelvh> Never would have figured that out without my VNA (or using someone else's, or a tracking generator)
[14:32] <nigelvh> At 144 they were dropping something like 40-50dB
[14:33] <Randomskk> wow.
[14:33] <Randomskk> heck of a filter; )
[14:33] <Randomskk> bah, ;)
[14:34] <nigelvh> Yeah. Anyway, so I'll probably order up some new filter components, to optimize the 2m low pass, rather than the cobbled together one I've got now, but I can confirm that both the 7012 and my PA work.
[14:34] <KT5TK> I believe you didn't consider the real parasitic capacity of the coils.
[14:34] <nigelvh> Probably so.
[14:35] <KT5TK> Those data can be found in the data sheets and can be set in the simulation program. Anyways a VNA is certainly your friend.
[14:36] <nigelvh> Yes, I love mine. It's been a good investment many times over.
[14:36] <KT5TK> Up to what frequency can you measure?
[14:37] <nigelvh> Depending on what dynamic range you need, about 1.5Ghz, though others (with very specific settings) have been able to measure up to the wifi band at 2.4.
[14:37] <KT5TK> nice
[14:38] <nigelvh> Considering it wasn't $50,000 like a professional VNA, I'm extremely happy with it.
[14:40] <KT5TK> What brand is it?
[14:40] <nigelvh> These days they're selling them for between 300(pounds) and 500(pounds) depending on the accessories.
[14:40] <nigelvh> You can see it here:
[14:40] <nigelvh> http://sdr-kits.net/VNWA3_Description.html
[14:41] <nigelvh> Originally they were kits, so mine is the last generation and I assembled it myself. This new generation is pre-assembled.
[14:42] <KT5TK> Looks nice. Is there some software for Linux?
[14:42] <nigelvh> Nope, unfortunately the software is windows only, but it runs fine in a VM.
[14:43] <nigelvh> Also, the guy who designed it (Tom) is on the user forums constantly helping people with questions, and probably releases a software update at least once a month with either new features or fixes.
[14:44] <nigelvh> It's a very active community.
[14:44] <MrScienceMan> arent such devices prohibited?
[14:44] <MrScienceMan> because of the bands they cover
[14:45] <nigelvh> Not any more than any other VNA
[14:45] <nigelvh> Or signal generator
[14:45] <nigelvh> Also, output power is -17dBm
[14:45] <eroomde> like my brain atm
[14:46] <nigelvh> haha
[14:46] <MrScienceMan> might be more :)
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[14:49] <KT5TK> Seems there is quite some documentation out there for the VNA. Several articles in cq DL and QEX. Sounds like a new project to build some VNA soon.
[14:50] <nigelvh> Yeah, it's been written up a couple times.
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[15:00] <jcoxon> ping fsphil
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[15:06] <eroomde> new fuel valve machined up for gyroc
[15:06] <eroomde> http://i.imgur.com/kw8ux.jpg
[15:06] <nigelvh> Shiny
[15:06] <eroomde> smaller and lighter and with some better, digital servos which should improve the dynamic response and reduce the hysteresis from friction in the valve and torsion in the drive train
[15:07] <Randomskk> looks nice
[15:07] <nigelvh> Fancy
[15:08] <eroomde> working towards a sustained hover
[15:08] <eroomde> need to fix an issue with slop in the linear actuators that do the gimballing
[15:08] <eroomde> they need a better thrust bearing design
[15:08] <eroomde> after that would should be in business
[15:08] <eroomde> we should*
[15:08] <eroomde> *excited*
[15:09] <eroomde> also, button head screws are sexy
[15:10] <nigelvh> Is that a new position? "Button head"
[15:11] <eroomde> button head being hemispherical head with hex socket
[15:11] <nigelvh> Yes, I was attempting to make a joke.
[15:11] <nigelvh> And apparently failing
[15:12] <eroomde> oh sorry
[15:12] <jcoxon> hehe
[15:12] <eroomde> 14:45 < nigelvh> Also, output power is -17dBm
[15:12] <eroomde> 14:45 < eroomde> like my brain atm
[15:12] <Randomskk> this channel does better with puns than innuendo really
[15:12] <nigelvh> haha
[15:13] <nigelvh> Excellent point.
[15:23] <nick_> How high do amateur rockets reach?
[15:23] <nick_> Like the CUSF ones?
[15:23] <eroomde> NOBODY KNOWS
[15:24] <Darkside> >->
[15:24] <eroomde> umm, but the one we launched in may would have been between about 15-20km
[15:24] <Darkside> i wonder how you'd deal with tracking on a rockoon
[15:24] <Darkside> esp if you go above 50km
[15:24] <eroomde> not particularly altitude optimised design though
[15:24] <Randomskk> eroomde: 15-20km was with three stages, right?
[15:24] <eroomde> could build something that would do 25km with the same motors easily enough
[15:25] <Upu> ping jgrahamc
[15:25] <Upu> here now
[15:25] <eroomde> Randomskk: the 2nd stage could have apogeed about 15km
[15:25] <Randomskk> interesting
[15:25] <Randomskk> I had heard half that
[15:26] <eroomde> but in the 3 stage version the 3rd stage would have lit lower than that
[15:26] <eroomde> god no
[15:26] <nigelvh> Yes, ignition before apogee is good.
[15:26] <eroomde> the first stage got to about 4km
[15:26] <Randomskk> more pity that we never recovered the top stage really
[15:26] <eroomde> the 2nd stage would have gone much higher than 8
[15:27] <Randomskk> okay
[15:28] <eroomde> also someone has just gone 100,000ft on an N->M
[15:28] <eroomde> as a datapoint
[15:28] <Randomskk> wow. plenty high.
[15:28] <eroomde> not high enough
[15:28] <eroomde> 50km
[15:28] <eroomde> the new frontier
[15:29] <Randomskk> don't let me stop you
[15:29] <jgrahamc> Upu: when do you need my presentation by?
[15:29] <eroomde> you're not :)
[15:29] <nigelvh> Not the final frontier?
[15:29] <Upu> Thursday really I just need to check it works on the netbook
[15:29] <eroomde> i'll do my own laptop
[15:29] <eroomde> that way i can write the talk on friday night in the traditional fashion
[15:30] <Darkside> Upu: i dont think your streaming idea is going to work
[15:30] <Darkside> not if people want to use their own laptops
[15:30] <Darkside> its going to have to be aim camera at creen
[15:31] <Upu> some of it won't
[15:31] <Upu> but one of the critisms last time was people couldn't see the presentation
[15:31] <Upu> if it works it works , if not your called Darkside
[15:31] <Upu> :)
[15:31] <Upu> sorry
[15:31] <Upu> XD
[15:32] <Upu> Yours will have to be looking at the screen
[15:32] <eroomde> and mine I guess in that case
[15:32] <eroomde> shouldn't be such an issue if we can get the room dark
[15:32] <Upu> what formats yours in eroomde ?
[15:33] <eroomde> apple keynote
[15:33] <eroomde> oh i wanted to ask - what is the projector resolution?
[15:33] <Upu> no idea
[15:33] <Randomskk> yes I love how keynote wants to know that
[15:33] <Randomskk> annoys me every time
[15:33] <eroomde> it's doesnt dynamically scale very gracefully
[15:34] <jcoxon> ummmm no idea what it is
[15:34] <Upu> no player for windows I guess
[15:34] <jcoxon> i do have a picture
[15:34] <eroomde> you can just force the projector resolution but that's clunky
[15:34] <eroomde> Upu: nope
[15:34] <Upu> *stab* Apple *stab*
[15:34] <jcoxon> eroomde, http://www.flickr.com/photos/jcoxon77/7552282896/in/photostream
[15:34] <eroomde> but also every single time i've tried to copy presentations across to other pcs it's been a murdersouly messy horrific disaster
[15:34] <nigelvh> I guess this is a good time to mention I preordered my new iphone last night
[15:34] <Randomskk> yea it basically only works for still slides without multimedia exported as PDF
[15:34] <Randomskk> keynote makes such wonderful presentations, too >_>
[15:34] <eroomde> exactly
[15:35] <eroomde> it does
[15:35] <Randomskk> I use it for anything I'm giving myself now
[15:35] <Upu> fair enough we'll I'll try my best with the streaming
[15:35] <eroomde> i have lots of videos in my presentation
[15:35] <Randomskk> yea
[15:35] <Randomskk> the stills would be kinda dull :P
[15:35] <Randomskk> also my slides for most general interest talks are lots of photos and videos and very little text >_>
[15:35] <Darkside> yep
[15:35] <Darkside> my slides are going to be mostly images
[15:35] <Darkside> and some videos and stuff
[15:36] <eroomde> apart from labels on diagrams, i don't recall the last time i had text in a presentation
[15:36] <Darkside> and a bit of technical stuff, time-frequency graphs and stuff
[15:36] <eroomde> that's what my mouth is for
[15:36] <Darkside> yep
[15:36] <Darkside> thats the point
[15:37] <Randomskk> does depend on the nature of the presentation. sometimes some text is important or good. especially for things where the still slides might be distributed
[15:37] <Randomskk> but not for capturing/holding people's interest :P
[15:37] <eroomde> jcoxon: that looks like an hdmi-in on the right?
[15:37] <jcoxon> http://www.flickr.com/photos/jcoxon77/7552295810/in/photostream/
[15:38] <Darkside> ok, so VGA in?
[15:38] <Randomskk> http://www.christiedigital.co.uk/emea/business/products/projectors/lcd-display/Pages/christie-LWU420.aspx
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[15:38] <Darkside> VGA is fine
[15:38] <Randomskk> HDMI is way better if you have it
[15:38] <Randomskk> no fussing with position crap
[15:38] <Darkside> m
[15:38] <Darkside> i don't have a minidisplayport to hdmi adaptor
[15:38] <Darkside> eroomde: do you have one?
[15:38] <Randomskk> anyway ^ has the specs
[15:39] <Randomskk> I think by "HD 15x1" they mean VGA :P
[15:39] <eroomde> Darkside: in the post as we speak
[15:39] <Darkside> eroomde: cool
[15:42] <eroomde> so, 1080p basically
[15:43] <eroomde> awesome
[15:43] <eroomde> nice video action coming up
[15:43] <eroomde> nigelvh: i'm going to order one the second o2 in the uk allow
[15:44] <nigelvh> They don't have it available yet?
[15:44] <Lunar_Lander__> did you see the HackHD on Sparkfun?
[15:44] <eroomde> pre-order in the next few days
[15:45] <Lunar_Lander__> 1080p camera but $150
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[15:45] <nigelvh> Ah. Yeah, my current phone is the 4, and I'm happy with it. I considered the 4s for the camera, and now that they've done a bit more to the camera in the 5 it's time for an upgrade.
[15:46] <nigelvh> My phone really is my only camera source, so it's a big factor for me.
[15:46] <Lunar_Lander__> https://www.sparkfun.com/products/11418
[15:46] <nigelvh> The new screen/processor/whatnot are nice, but the camera set it over the edge.
[15:46] <eroomde> nigelvh: same
[15:46] <eroomde> 3gs
[15:46] <eroomde> but i want a better camera
[15:47] <eroomde> and high def vid recording in a pinch
[15:47] <nigelvh> My fiance has the 4s, and I was pretty jealous when she got it, knowing it had the better camera.
[15:47] <eroomde> though we now have an EOS5Dmk2 at work for nice video recording
[15:48] <eroomde> we're getting ready new website and a lot more pics and vids being flun up
[15:48] <Lunar_Lander__> ah i thought you are discussing balloon cameras
[15:48] <nigelvh> I do think the fifth row of icons on the home screen will be awesome.
[15:48] <HixPad> I'm attempting to try and get a Nikon D4 up sometime in the not too distant
[15:49] <nigelvh> Also, the LTE doesn't mean much to me presently either. My carrier doesn't have LTE in seattle yet.
[15:49] <nigelvh> AT&T lists seattle as a "LTE coming soon city"
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[15:50] <eroomde> HixPad: nice
[15:50] <HixPad> Hopefully
[15:51] <HixPad> Though from what someone was saying the other day it could probably benefit from a multi balloon hoist, for the lift and stability
[15:51] <eroomde> hmmm
[15:52] <eroomde> i'm not sure how true that is
[15:52] <eroomde> who was saying it?
[15:52] <jcoxon> eek multiballoons
[15:52] <HixPad> Can't remember think it was tues or weds will look at logs
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[15:53] <HixPad> Maybe Randomskk
[15:53] <Lunar_Lander__> multiballoons?
[15:53] <nigelvh> We've done smaller multiballoons (large party balloons), and ran into an issue of them rubbing together and one of them popped.
[15:53] <Randomskk> wasn't me
[15:54] <eroomde> HixPad: i don;t think multi balloon will solve stability problems over a single balloon
[15:54] <eroomde> i think careful payload and wrigging design will solve stability problems
[15:54] <Randomskk> wrigging is especially important
[15:55] <HixPad> How does density rule affect frame type payloads?
[15:55] <eroomde> i don;t think the uk has a desnity rule
[15:56] <HixPad> Is it just an advisory in the wiki then?
[15:56] <eroomde> in 17th century italy, the vatican was very powerful
[15:56] <eroomde> and society was very divided
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[15:57] <HixPad> My GoPro HD arrived today. Whoop. £123 too brand new from wiggle
[15:57] <eroomde> indeed there were indexs of books that peasant were banned from reading
[15:57] <Randomskk> HixPad: good deal
[15:57] <eroomde> famous entires in the list include gallileo's various books suggesting heliocentricity
[15:57] <eroomde> the importnant point to note is that the books were not banned
[15:57] <Randomskk> watch eroomde turn this into a relevant point
[15:58] <eroomde> they were just on a list that meant the servants and peasants and commoners weren't allowed to read them
[15:58] <HixPad> Think it was last one and got lucky with extra-10 as voucher code so an extra 10% off the silly low price too
[15:58] <eroomde> whereas the aristocracy were capable of rationally handling such information more wisely, and also the church had less influence over them in general
[15:58] <Laurenceb> interesting
[15:58] <eroomde> in this respect, ukhas is very much like renaissance italy
[15:58] <Randomskk> here we go
[15:58] <eroomde> and the wiki is very much like the vatican
[15:59] <Lunar_Lander__> how much is a GoPro?
[15:59] <eroomde> and some of the advice on the wiki is to save commoners from themselves
[15:59] <Laurenceb> /sarc
[15:59] <Lunar_Lander__> eroomde, society was divided?
[16:00] <Lunar_Lander__> Linkin Park - New Divide
[16:00] <Randomskk> a well received analogy, evidently, eroomde
[16:00] <eroomde> it seems to
[16:00] <eroomde> HixPad: the point is, we won't burn you
[16:00] <eroomde> but we might put you under house arrest
[16:01] <Randomskk> where by "house arrest" he means "write strongly worded opinions on the irc and mailing list"
[16:01] <HixPad> Surely managing to blag a D4 for a payload would justify this foolish deed
[16:01] <jcoxon> and in the future people will congratulate your forward thinking
[16:01] <eroomde> that said, i might play the role of the duke of tuscany and shield you
[16:01] <eroomde> but you'd have to serve in my court
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[16:02] <eroomde> and i'm not sure what that actually means if we translate this out of the analogy
[16:02] <Randomskk> more like serf in his court
[16:02] <HixPad> He he
[16:02] <jcoxon> i think this analogy is more a ego massage for ed
[16:02] <jcoxon> :-p
[16:02] <HixPad> I serf no mam
[16:02] <HixPad> Man
[16:02] <nigelvh> This is getting rather convoluded.
[16:02] <Upu> who turned eroomde up to 9 ?
[16:02] <eroomde> ah look, the pope
[16:02] <Upu> lol
[16:02] <HixPad> A bear....
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[16:03] <Randomskk> oh no
[16:03] <Randomskk> now where will we get our divine advice from?
[16:03] <HixPad> The spaghetti monster of course
[16:03] <Upu> FSM
[16:03] <eroomde> upu's shop
[16:04] <Upu> that does GPS modules not divine guidance misguided one
[16:04] <DanielRichman> Upu: what are you planning to use for the various streaming things at the conf?
[16:04] <eroomde> divine guidance provided you stay below 4G
[16:04] <eroomde> then the devil takes over
[16:04] <HixPad> Satellite guidance? Though it was divine we were after
[16:05] <Upu> Xsplit on a netbook
[16:05] <HixPad> The US military?
[16:05] <Upu> HD Camera
[16:05] <DanielRichman> then to batc?
[16:05] <Upu> it uses Adobe Flash Live Media encoder
[16:05] <Upu> yes
[16:06] <HixPad> I meant go past 4g and then the us military take over
[16:07] <Randomskk> eroomde: which mini dp -> hdmi adapter did you get?
[16:07] <DanielRichman> I was wondering if there's a better way to broadcast the presentation bit. Unless I'm mistaken h264 won't do very well at still slides/presentations
[16:07] <eroomde> $5 one from dx.com
[16:07] <DanielRichman> (or whatever it uses)
[16:07] <Randomskk> there's the official apple £30 one. also there's the £0.30 from amazon...
[16:07] <Randomskk> given as mini DP carries the same digital signal lines as HDMI it stands to reason it shouldn't be an expensive adapter
[16:10] <nick_> Sorry, I got distracted. Do amateur rockets ever get up to space?
[16:11] <eroomde> Randomskk: i got the smaller $5 from dx
[16:11] <eroomde> definitely not the £30 one
[16:11] <eroomde> nick_: supposedly someone has broken 100km
[16:11] <eroomde> cxt
[16:11] <DanielRichman> I googled and i couldn''t find anything that stood out as especially good. Have you tested the video quality Upu ?
[16:11] <eroomde> but details seem very sparse and they were very vague about it and the guy behind it comes across as the most untrustworthy, brash, god bless the USA and especially texus type of person you could imagine
[16:12] <nick_> I mean fairly professional amateurs
[16:12] <Randomskk> professional amateurs eh
[16:12] <Randomskk> my favourite kind
[16:12] <HixPad> Got my kerninghan and Ritchie C book today too. Pretty good, though a wee bit above me at the mo. though it does help with the syntax
[16:12] <HixPad> Like Olympic atheletes
[16:12] <eroomde> just patiently work through it
[16:12] <eroomde> it's a good book
[16:13] <HixPad> Yeah it was highly recommended on #Arduino
[16:13] <eroomde> there's also Learn C The Hard Way which gets you to correct some things in K&R that are considered unsafe by modern standards
[16:13] <eroomde> that's a free online book
[16:13] <HixPad> Ah like learn python
[16:13] <HixPad> Cool
[16:13] <eroomde> yes
[16:13] <eroomde> same dude
[16:13] Action: HixPad googles it
[16:13] <HixPad> Cheers
[16:14] <nick_> Learn C the hard way: by jumping around C++'s different languages
[16:14] <nick_> (and learning from reading physicists' code)
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[16:15] <daveake> http://abstrusegoose.com/strips/ars_longa_vita_brevis.PNG
[16:16] <HixPad> eroomde: Do you have a link to the PDF only finding HTML
[16:16] <nick_> I wonder if Go will support microcontrollers any time soon
[16:16] <nick_> That would be nice
[16:17] <Randomskk> eroomde: right, ordered the 30p one from amazon on the grounds of tons of reasonably positive reviews.
[16:17] <eroomde> HixPad: it is html only
[16:17] <eroomde> you need to pay for the pdf
[16:17] <Randomskk> it's an obvious oversight in my otherwise extensive collection of cables and adapters
[16:18] <HixPad> Ok
[16:18] <HixPad> Bookmarked
[16:18] <eroomde> nick_: Go has lots of microcontroller-unfriendly things
[16:18] <eroomde> like garbage collection
[16:18] <Randomskk> https://www.dropbox.com/s/hrygfy8g9ojaf0l/2012-08-25%2020.44.08.jpg :P
[16:18] <Randomskk> yea Go seems like a fairly bad choice for a microcontroller
[16:18] <eroomde> although you might not have to use GC, i'm not an expert
[16:18] <eroomde> jgrahamc seems to be a go-er, so to speak
[16:19] <eroomde> maybe he can comment
[16:19] <jgrahamc> Say no more, say no more.
[16:20] <jgrahamc> I can't imagine why you'd want to have Go on a microcontroller. Go is really good if you have something that supports processes/threads and is designed to exploit parallelism. It's very memory heavy (in that it uses a garbage collector).
[16:20] <jgrahamc> It has a really nice standard library of functions all of which would be pretty useless on a uC.
[16:22] <nick_> How memory inefficient is the garbage collector?
[16:22] <jgrahamc> Define inefficient.
[16:22] <Randomskk> it's not only memory inefficiency that's an issue but also that it adds unpredictable latency
[16:22] <Randomskk> and removes a lot of control of your memory from the programmer
[16:22] <Randomskk> for a memory and cpu constrained microprocessor having a GC is rarely a good idea - better to spend the human time freeing memory manually usually
[16:23] <jgrahamc> You have essentially no control over when memory gets freed (you can call runtime.GC() to give it a hint).
[16:23] <jgrahamc> I'd say that when you are dealing with HAB type situations you want absolute control over memory and execution speed. Use C.
[16:24] <eroomde> likewise, the amounts of data, and the complexity of their structures, are usually sufficiently small in a microcontroller that having it all managed by the programmer should not bethat difficult
[16:24] <eroomde> in comparison to manual memory management to run some complicated thing on a big server
[16:28] <nick_> Hmmm
[16:28] <nick_> I guess I was not thinking
[16:29] <nick_> (or if I can be more generous to myself I was thinking about something else)
[16:29] Action: nick_ needs a catchy name for my outreach project
[16:30] <eroomde> that is not to say you won't get memory management problems on a micro
[16:30] <eroomde> i definitely have
[16:30] <eroomde> but it was much easier to fix
[16:30] <Randomskk> I'm waiting for the first uplink system with a buffer overflow problem
[16:30] <eroomde> :)
[16:30] <Randomskk> ideally one where I can start sending it executable code
[16:30] <Randomskk> OTA pwn
[16:30] <Randomskk> AVR memory layout should be really predictable after all
[16:31] <DanielRichman> not von neumann
[16:31] <DanielRichman> harder to exploit?
[16:31] <Randomskk> hmm
[16:31] <Randomskk> yea I guess
[16:31] <Randomskk> didn't think that entirely through, but you're correct
[16:31] <DanielRichman> you can still do bad things to the stack so maybe
[16:31] <Randomskk> might need to know what code was loaded
[16:31] <DanielRichman> but then you really need the code to pull it off in one go
[16:31] <DanielRichman> yes
[16:31] <Randomskk> if it had the arduino bootloader on it maybe you could abuse that
[16:32] <DanielRichman> especially since static linked so you can't go returning to predictable (ish? not any more I guess if i understand aslr correctly) libc addresses
[16:33] <Randomskk> no ASLR or other protection techniques on AVR though
[16:33] <Randomskk> does it? I don't think avr-gcc will do that for libc
[16:34] <DanielRichman> maybe stack canaries? doubt it though
[16:34] <Randomskk> you just need a good way to feed data to some existing code that can write to the flash
[16:34] <DanielRichman> OTA flashing is cool enough in itself
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[16:34] <DanielRichman> OTA exploit -> flashing would be cooler
[16:34] <Randomskk> OTA pwning would be funnier though
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[16:35] <Randomskk> especially if you just then start transmitting your handle over rtty
[16:35] <Randomskk> "this payload pwned by randomskk xxxx shoutz to #highaltitude" etc
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[16:35] <Randomskk> hm
[16:36] <Randomskk> I think uplinking enough data and being sure it was correct would be tricky too though
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[16:36] <Randomskk> and you'll struggle to make a flash image that fits into RAM
[16:36] <eroomde> yus
[16:37] <Randomskk> you could probably manage rtty generation on something using an ntx2
[16:37] <Randomskk> and a short string
[16:37] <Randomskk> fitting it into enough free RAM on the existing code that it can still operate to bootload might be highly tricky.
[16:37] <Randomskk> meh
[16:38] <Upu> DanielRichman sorry cooking so running between here and cooker. Yes I tried it and quality was not bad with the bit rate up
[16:38] <DanielRichman> you could totally fit a nmea->rtty thing in 1kb
[16:38] <DanielRichman> infact this could almost be a fun exercise
[16:38] <Upu> using http://www.xsplit.com/ to switch between live, presenter and images if needed
[16:38] <DanielRichman> Upu: nice
[16:38] <Upu> in fact if you're about this weekend going to do some more testing
[16:38] <Upu> welcome to have a look in and check from a remote pov
[16:38] <DanielRichman> sure
[16:39] <DanielRichman> KCL got to have decent internets... have you negotiated to get on their wifi?
[16:39] <Upu> yeah we've requested a special unrestricted one so I can whack the bit rate up
[16:39] <DanielRichman> :D
[16:40] <DanielRichman> are the rest of us going to be allowed on the wifi too?
[16:40] <Upu> I believe so
[16:40] <eroomde> good stuff
[16:41] <eroomde> so we won't have to badge-er you
[16:41] Action: Upu pats eroomde
[16:41] <Upu> sssh now
[16:41] <eroomde> MUSHROOM MUSHROOM
[16:41] <eroomde> number10's foraging stories have put me in the mood for mushrooms
[16:41] <nick_> So I'm applying for money to do a school based cosmic ray experiments including a HAB measurement
[16:42] <nick_> And I need a cool name
[16:42] <Upu> "space art"
[16:42] <Upu> no wait taken
[16:42] <nick_> Or, just cooler than "high altitude and school based cosmic ray experiments"
[16:42] <eroomde> too slow
[16:42] <BrainDamage> space fart, referring to the ionization from the particle trails
[16:42] <daveake> number10 is a fun guy
[16:42] <eroomde> stratoray
[16:42] <number10> thats nice to know ed
[16:42] <eroomde> daveake: ouch
[16:42] <Upu> near space pew pew detector ?
[16:42] <number10> here come the puns
[16:43] <nick_> I do like the term "near space"
[16:43] <Upu> brb roasties need to go in
[16:43] <eroomde> expe-ray-ment
[16:43] <nick_> eroomde: you're the pun master, no?
[16:43] <HixPad> Cosmic rayhab
[16:43] <eroomde> rayhab does keep in with the lohan theme
[16:43] <eroomde> you'd get reg coverage of it
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[16:44] <nick_> Cosmic rays near space!
[16:44] <HixPad> Gettin high with cosmic rayhab
[16:44] <nick_> If I were a proper physicist I'd make a backronym
[16:45] <BrainDamage> near rays cosmic space!
[16:46] <Lunar_Lander__> XD!
[16:46] <BrainDamage> you could add a cosmic neutrino sensor and call it ASS, Atomic Split Sensor
[16:47] <nick_> BrainDamage: ever seen a neutrino sensor?
[16:47] <BrainDamage> altough the amount of mass to get sufficient interaction section would be impractical
[16:47] <BrainDamage> but not for a fleet of balloons, for science!
[16:47] <nick_> They like to measure them in kilo or mega tonnes :)
[16:47] <Randomskk> I think you would struggle to detect many neutrinos
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[16:47] <nick_> Randomskk: s/m//
[16:48] <HixPad> ARRSE atomic ray split sensor experiment
[16:48] kc8yhw (425707c2@gateway/web/freenode/ip. left irc: Quit: Page closed
[16:48] <HixPad> Oops one r
[16:49] <HixPad> Two ss'
[16:50] <BrainDamage> Cosmic Ray Ionizing Particles Planned Live Experiment
[16:52] <HixPad> High Altitude Ray Detection Opensource Network
[16:52] <Randomskk> *school*
[16:53] Action: HixPad chuckling like a school kid
[16:54] <nick_> MUon Observations Near Space!
[16:54] <eroomde> recursive
[16:55] <nick_> (actually, at high altitude you're mostly detecting protons...)
[16:56] <nick_> Protons take over at ~10km
[16:57] <nick_> Or MUons in Oxford and Near Space
[16:58] <nick_> Hmm
[16:58] <nick_> Based on the name I should change the project to do a dig too
[16:58] <nick_> for Muons Under Oxford and Near Space
[17:01] <HixPad> COsmic Ray Balloon Lifted Microcontroller Experiments for Youths
[17:01] <eroomde> Rays Are Counted In Altitude Layers
[17:02] <HixPad> Cosmic Rays at Altitude Programme
[17:03] <HixPad> Cosmic Ray Experiment Testing In Near Space
[17:05] <Randomskk> photon experiment near/in space?
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[17:10] <eroomde> Physical Experimental Deduction Of Particles Hitting Inducing Light Emissions
[17:12] <HixPad> Sic.... Missing altitude
[17:12] <nick_> eroomde: just need to add "R US" are the end
[17:12] <nick_> ?
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[17:13] <eroomde> exercise for you
[17:13] <eroomde> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19562101
[17:14] <eroomde> anyone got anything they want to share with the group?
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[17:19] <HixPad> I've read about this before. From my experience of hypoxia it's not a bad way to go. If you don't get too cold first. Or crushed
[17:20] <Randomskk> I think you would get very very cold first
[17:20] <Randomskk> and also crushed
[17:20] <Randomskk> plus I don't think you're in a very happy place when you start on something like that
[17:20] <Randomskk> eroomde: I thought it'd be a good way to get rid of bodies
[17:20] <Randomskk> but attaching 70kg odd to balloons is tricky
[17:20] <Randomskk> knot must have come undone
[17:21] <Randomskk> takes so many sodding 3kg balloons too. good thing we get our helium free.
[17:23] <eroomde> the man didn't have a parachute either
[17:23] <eroomde> it all points to you
[17:23] <HixPad> Ha ha
[17:23] <Randomskk> oh, shit, he fell out of his casing?
[17:23] <Randomskk> but it was taped shut!
[17:23] <HixPad> Did they find a jiffy bag in Staines
[17:23] <HixPad> A big one
[17:24] <Randomskk> "if found please return to: angolia"
[17:24] <Randomskk> hella expensive prepaid postage though
[17:26] <HixPad> Gotta be harsh trying to flee something so bad but not knowing the risk that you're taking.
[17:26] <Randomskk> eroomde: oh well. I'm just glad only one ended up falling.
[17:27] <Randomskk> flight predictions looked fine, after all. http://hourly.cusf.co.uk/
[17:27] <Randomskk> falling prematurely* I guess.
[17:27] <Randomskk> HixPad: yea.
[17:27] <Randomskk> seriously.
[17:28] <Randomskk> must be pretty terrible. it's not gonna be over quickly either
[17:29] <HixPad> Dunno HAPE or HACE will do you in pretty swiftly with the climb rate
[17:29] <Randomskk> 'pretty quickly' is relative
[17:29] <Randomskk> swiftly, whatever
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[17:30] <Randomskk> we're still talking a fair few minutes
[17:30] <Randomskk> I imagine
[17:30] <HixPad> Apparently when it's serious you become euphoric
[17:30] <HixPad> Mountaineers often start taking clothes of and laughing
[17:31] <HixPad> Off
[17:31] <Randomskk> I don't imagine that helps
[17:32] <HixPad> Nope but the thing is it affects the brain and apparently pain becomes negligible
[17:33] <HixPad> It did just make me think of always look on the bright side of life though. Mountaineers dying but laughing around and dancing near naked. Very pythonesque
[17:37] <eroomde> remainsofthegames.co.uk
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[17:37] <eroomde> for moderately cheap stuff being sold off from the olympic village
[17:38] <eroomde> thousands of bits of office quipement, beanbags, room suits, whiteboards, whatever
[17:38] <eroomde> right time to go time
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[17:56] <nick_> http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=ping-pong-ball-satellites
[17:56] <nick_> JP Aerospace are launching seven pongsat, etc, flights soon apparently
[17:58] <nick_> Is that someone here?
[17:58] <Darkside> nah
[17:58] <Darkside> JP aerospace is some japanese thing
[17:58] <Darkside> they did the samsung galaxy S II launch
[17:59] <Darkside> and look super professional, jumpsuits with logos on and all
[17:59] <fsphil> they're an american I think
[17:59] <Darkside> oh?
[17:59] <fsphil> they've "America's other space program" on the website
[17:59] <Darkside> yeah must be
[17:59] <Darkside> yeah
[18:00] <fsphil> someone we know might get a job there
[18:01] <G0DJA> nick - That should be renamed as either 'wiff-waff' or maybe just 'wiff' sat ;-)
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[18:01] <SpeedEvil> fartinabox
[18:02] Action: fsphil avoids the obvious rude one
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[18:04] <Lunar_Lander__> XD
[18:05] <fsphil> hehe, that quit reminded me of http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4com2AMqqW8
[18:11] <Darkside> haha
[18:12] <Darkside> dunno why, but reminded me of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=FwY1yWry8AM#t=61s
[18:14] <G0DJA> They call it Pong Sat anyway ;-)
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[18:20] <Randomskk> http://www.briandorey.com/post/ADC-Pi-Raspberry-Pi-I2C-Analog-to-Digital-Converter-boards-available-to-buy-online.aspx
[18:20] <Randomskk> am I the only one unconvinced by the PCB layout on that?
[18:25] <Randomskk> they seem to have stuck two 16bit delta-sigma low-noise differential-input ADCs onto a PCB...
[18:25] <Randomskk> and then autorouted it
[18:25] <Randomskk> why are they even using differential ADCs
[18:26] <Randomskk> and then end up with 15 bits per channel anyway
[18:26] <Randomskk> and then put it on a stackable header
[18:26] <Randomskk> but fix the i2c address so you can't stack ADCs
[18:27] <Randomskk> sounds like a great setup for revision 2 where they do it right
[18:28] <Darkside> heh it does look a bit autorouted doesn't it
[18:28] <Randomskk> they're using differential input ADCs and tying all the - inputs to ground apparently
[18:28] <Darkside> lol
[18:28] <Darkside> can you set the I2C address on those chips anyway?
[18:28] <Randomskk> http://www.abelectronics.co.uk/docs/stock/raspberrypi/adcpi/adcpi1.jpg
[18:28] <Randomskk> the chips have ADR0 and ADR1 pins
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[18:29] <Randomskk> he's already using two chips but that's four possible address so you could have stacked two boards
[18:29] <Randomskk> look at that photo though
[18:29] <Darkside> yep you can
[18:29] <Randomskk> watch the trace for A1
[18:29] <Darkside> yeah
[18:29] <Darkside> its scary
[18:29] <Randomskk> it goes through the top of the potential divider
[18:29] <Randomskk> then all the way down and around to the bottom middle, where there's the second half of the divider which goes to ground
[18:29] <Randomskk> then it continues going fully around until it finally hits that pin on the chip
[18:30] <Randomskk> at least it doesn't go through loads of vias unlike all the other traces
[18:30] <Darkside> mm
[18:30] <Randomskk> the resistors for the dividers appear to have just been placed on the pcb at random
[18:31] <Randomskk> as have the adc chips
[18:31] <Darkside> that board is going to pick up so much noise
[18:31] <Darkside> and hum
[18:31] <Randomskk> little to no thought appears to have been given even to grounding let along signal integrity
[18:31] <Darkside> yep
[18:31] <Darkside> grounding looks crap on that board
[18:31] <Darkside> the ground plane on th ebottom is cut up on so many places
[18:31] <Darkside> in*
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[18:31] <Randomskk> yup
[18:32] <nick_> Which board?
[18:32] <Randomskk> this might be useful for like, reading a value from a configuration pot
[18:32] <Darkside> http://www.briandorey.com/post/ADC-Pi-Raspberry-Pi-I2C-Analog-to-Digital-Converter-boards-available-to-buy-online.aspx
[18:32] <Randomskk> http://www.abelectronics.co.uk/products/3/Raspberry-Pi/7/ADC-Pi---Raspberry-Pi-Analogue-to-Digital-converter has bigger pictures
[18:32] <Randomskk> (abelectronics is the web store that briandorey.com just opened)
[18:32] <Darkside> Randomskk: its only 15HZ sample rate anyway
[18:32] <Randomskk> !!
[18:32] <Darkside> at 16 bit samples
[18:32] <Randomskk> what, the ADC?
[18:32] <Darkside> yeah
[18:32] <Randomskk> the hell
[18:32] <Darkside> http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/22226a.pdf
[18:33] <Darkside> have a look
[18:33] <Darkside> 15Hz at 16-bit, 60Hz at 14-bit, and 240Hz at 12-bit
[18:33] <Randomskk> what about 15 bit
[18:33] <Randomskk> which is what they're doing
[18:33] <Randomskk> though I think it's only 15 bit because their MSB is always 1 because they are making it single ended by tying - to gnd
[18:33] <nick_> Where is there only one GND pin for all the 8 analog inputs?
[18:33] <Randomskk> nick_: see above discussion :P
[18:34] <Darkside> yeah i think this board is only going to be for reading pots and such
[18:34] <Darkside> not for anything useful
[18:34] <Darkside> then again the i2c controller is linux
[18:34] <Randomskk> basically because it was designed from people holding a degree from the arduino university of electronics?
[18:34] <Darkside> so its not goign to be able to handle high sample rate stuff anyway
[18:34] <Darkside> Randomskk: haha
[18:34] <Randomskk> see also: makerbot
[18:34] <Darkside> yes..
[18:34] <Darkside> the makerbot is weird
[18:34] <Darkside> the huxleys board is much better
[18:35] <Darkside> much more compact anyway
[18:35] <Randomskk> I mean it's easy to shit all over this stuff, and clearly at least these people are doing a thing and putting useful electronics into people's hands
[18:35] <Randomskk> and I haven't
[18:35] <Darkside> hehe
[18:35] <Randomskk> but it's annoying that they're making easy to fix mistakes that don't even cost anything
[18:35] <Darkside> its not hard to design something
[18:35] <Randomskk> besides a few minutes' thought when routing
[18:35] <Darkside> but its costly to bootstrap a manufacturing system
[18:35] <Randomskk> yes
[18:35] <Darkside> and be able to sell stuff
[18:35] <Darkside> takes a lot of capital
[18:36] <Randomskk> and also takes a huge amount of effort to actually get a reasonably quantity of things made and tested and QA and advertised and sold
[18:36] <Darkside> thats what kickstarter is for nowdays i guess
[18:36] <nick_> I heard recently that thingiverse is good for this kind of stuff
[18:36] <Randomskk> capital and effort and dedication and so forth
[18:36] <Randomskk> if you're going to all that effort
[18:36] <Darkside> Randomskk: and time
[18:36] <Randomskk> why not make a thing that's at least technically passable?
[18:36] <Randomskk> sigh
[18:36] <nick_> People give feedback on the designs, and if you ignore the feedback then others will just make good versions of your stuff
[18:36] <Randomskk> true
[18:37] <Randomskk> relies on people being able to give good feedback but I hear it works very well for 3d stuff on thingiverse
[18:37] <Randomskk> haven't seen so much electronicsy stuff
[18:38] <cuddykid> quite fun being on ITV live
[18:38] <Randomskk> hehe :D
[18:38] <nick_> Does OSH Park do an electronics version of this?
[18:39] <Randomskk> nick_: ? the seeed thing?
[18:39] <nick_> OSH Park isn't seeed
[18:39] <Randomskk> oh
[18:39] <Randomskk> lean
[18:39] <Randomskk> ?
[18:39] <nick_> It's partly like the American version of Seeed
[18:39] <Randomskk> le--??
[18:39] <Randomskk> I forget how he spells it
[18:39] <Randomskk> yea, I got confused.
[18:39] <Randomskk> laen perhaps
[18:39] <Randomskk> yes.
[18:39] <nick_> laen
[18:39] <Randomskk> he's cool :o
[18:39] <Randomskk> sometimes he favourites my electronics photos on flickr
[18:40] <Randomskk> I would use osh park a lot if I were in the USA I think
[18:40] <nick_> Oh, it doesn't look like there's a design sharing part
[18:40] <Randomskk> sparkfun's batchpcb had a design sharing thing
[18:40] <Randomskk> but I was never very convinced it was a great idea
[18:40] <Randomskk> so many people are able to make really bad and untested PCBs
[18:40] <Randomskk> and it's all great when you're basically operating at DC
[18:41] <Randomskk> (though even then...)
[18:41] <Darkside> heh
[18:42] <Randomskk> but like, there are resources online that go into great detail on how to lay out a PCB well
[18:42] <Randomskk> and how to identify and think about grounding issues
[18:42] <nick_> I'd really benefit from a place to share and discuss electronics design
[18:42] <Randomskk> and how to preserve signal integrity and make matched transmission lines and decouple noise properly and make decent power supplies and all that
[18:42] <nick_> Or maybe the electronics guys here that I pester would benefit from it
[18:44] <BrainDamage> if it's circuit design, circuitlab.com is ok for sharing schematics
[18:44] <Darkside> Randomskk: i need to look at the noise decoupling ones
[18:44] <Darkside> my general rule has been 100nF's everywhere
[18:44] <Darkside> but that doesnt always work
[18:44] <Randomskk> it's a great rule of thumb
[18:44] <Randomskk> but yes
[18:45] <Darkside> ive seen the rf triplet used a lot
[18:45] <Darkside> 10uF, 0.1uF and 100pF
[18:45] <Darkside> or some other larget cap to replace 10uF
[18:45] <Darkside> like 4.7uF or whatever
[18:46] <Randomskk> yea
[18:47] <Darkside> i need to try that on my boost converted osiris boards, to see if it lowers the noise floor on them
[18:47] <Darkside> though i think it's picking up radiated noise from the switchmode supply, not noise in the power rail
[18:47] <Darkside> which is a pain, i made the switchmode supply as small as i possibly could
[18:48] <Upu> if I could get your code working on my board
[18:48] <Upu> I could tell you what my layout does
[18:49] <Darkside> heh
[18:49] <Upu> its certainly not affecting the GPS
[18:49] <Darkside> very weird that it doesn't work
[18:49] <Darkside> it didn't affect the gps on mine
[18:49] <Darkside> though my gps was separate
[18:49] <Upu> I think that RFM module is screwed
[18:49] <Upu> going to try it on another board shortly
[18:49] <Darkside> its possible you only have adata going one way
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[18:49] <Upu> yes
[18:49] <Darkside> since its transmitting RTTY, that makes me thing its receiving data, but not sending it
[18:50] <Upu> possibly
[18:50] <Upu> well got another board here
[18:50] <Upu> just testing it with known working code
[18:51] <Darkside> thing is, the code you're using likely only writes values
[18:51] <Darkside> doesn't read them
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[18:52] <Upu> I'm using your code
[18:52] <Darkside> oh
[18:52] <Upu> give me a few mins
[18:52] <Darkside> oh, you had it working on a uAva board or something?
[18:52] <Upu> just finishing up and i'll try it again on a new board
[18:52] <Upu> yes it works on uAVA
[18:53] <Darkside> k
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[19:05] <Arduino> Doi
[19:05] <Arduino> Godd sfter
[19:05] <Arduino> *good afternoon
[19:05] <Arduino> Does anybody know id the Uno arduino comes with a built in led for the blink (begginer) test???
[19:05] <Randomskk> yes
[19:05] <Randomskk> it does
[19:06] <Arduino> Thanks
[19:06] <Arduino> Im going to buy it. Do i need to buy anything else (potentiometer servo.....) ?
[19:07] <Randomskk> depends what you want to do. entirely by itself it doesn't do much.
[19:08] <Arduino> Im learning how to use arduinos
[19:08] <Arduino> If i do separate orders. It will be more expensive so inwant to buy it all at once :)
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[19:09] <Randomskk> it's kind of hard to suggest. you could consider buying a kit that includes lots of parts.
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[19:10] <Arduino> Okss
[19:10] <Arduino> Thanks m8
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[19:34] <nick_> Crap, I need a multimeter
[19:34] <nick_> My normal one is onnected up to a bunch of equipment
[19:34] <nick_> I probably shouldn't disconnect it
[19:43] <daveake> You can never have enough multimeters :)
[19:43] <nick_> I don't have any :(
[19:43] <jgrahamc> If it's voltage you are measuring just use your tongue: 5V, slight tingle; 9V burns a bit; 110V feel queasy; 240V miss a heartbeat; 1000V why am I lying on the floor.
[19:43] <nick_> I just use on that is usually lying around in my lab
[19:44] <Randomskk> I find with 240V I usually notice before I bring the wires to my mouth
[19:44] <jgrahamc> You are a sensitive soul Randomskk
[19:47] <Randomskk> :3
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[19:58] <EarthBreeze> Darkside, james etc. any around?
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[19:59] <Darkside> EarthBreeze: yeah
[19:59] <EarthBreeze> Hey dark, that bogus posting can you get an exact time and possible IP address?
[20:00] <Darkside> hrm
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[20:00] <Darkside> i can't, but other peop,e might be able to
[20:00] <EarthBreeze> OK, who? he he he
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[20:00] <Darkside> wait
[20:00] <Darkside> i can't
[20:00] <Darkside> hrm
[20:00] <nick_> EarthBreeze: how do you know it's bogus?
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[20:01] <EarthBreeze> it is an exact copy of the sample one from the web site checksum and all plus I think I would know if the payload was on my front deck.
[20:02] <Randomskk> if it's exactly the same as the one from the website... I wonder how it got uploaded exactly.
[20:02] <Randomskk> does the website have an example audio recording or anything?
[20:03] <EarthBreeze> nope, but I guess someone told me there is a way to send in a position report not using dl,,, but like if you had dats via a regular aprs system or a spot me etc.
[20:03] <nigelvh> Sorry to be a bother, but what's this bogus posting?
[20:03] <number10> just tunes in to bbc news 24 - seems to be a balloon story coming up
[20:04] <Darkside> k
[20:04] <Darkside> watching
[20:04] <EarthBreeze> it's gone now thnkfully. the other night a station uploaded somehow the exact sample string from the website, and it made them map track it of course back to my deck in the front of my house.
[20:05] <Darkside> you sure number10
[20:05] <nigelvh> So someone sent in a payload telemetry string, that was an example on a website, and the position report was your house?
[20:06] <Darkside> number10: all i'm seeing is stuff on kate middleton
[20:06] <Darkside> topless
[20:07] <number10> Darkside: looks like it will be cuddykid s - and will probably be towards the of the real news
[20:07] <EarthBreeze> yup when I was testing the payload I of course had it running, and when I was making the website describng the flight and how the system works I copied one of the transmissions and used it as an exmple on the website explaining what each part of the string was about.
[20:07] <Darkside> k
[20:07] <EarthBreeze> http://www.qsl.net/nss/earthbreeze.html
[20:07] <nigelvh> So I'm not sure why this is an issue EarthBreeze
[20:08] <Darkside> nigelvh: people were thinking it had been recovered
[20:08] <daveake> Have I missed it, or is it on later, or did cuddykid get photographed topless?
[20:08] <Darkside> when it hadn't
[20:08] <Darkside> daveake: heh
[20:08] <nigelvh> Ah, so just confused then.
[20:08] <EarthBreeze> I'm even thinking it may be a possible safety hazard for future flights.
[20:08] <daveake> "Kate photographed topless from weather balloon". Now that could make the news
[20:09] <number10> daveake: it was a brief whats comming up - so will be in the next 1/3 hour
[20:09] <Darkside> oh lawd
[20:09] <daveake> ok ta
[20:09] <number10> dont know if there is a story about how many ways to wire a FET daveake
[20:10] <Darkside> bhler i need to finish my talk
[20:10] <daveake> not exactly front page
[20:10] <EarthBreeze> Imagine a long duration flight, another trans atlantic flioating along and we are using this site to keep the FAA nd other aviation agencies up to date where the balloon is, and someone keeps uploading bogust reports through the flight happenening even placing the balloon where it is not.
[20:10] <BrainDamage> how many wires one have to solder, before he can call himsellf a man?
[20:10] <number10> you have a week for that Darkside ?
[20:11] <Randomskk> EarthBreeze: there's not really a huge amount we can do about it, but also it's never been an issue before and probably this one data point isn't anyone being malicious (if they wanted to be malicious, surely they would make up a new position..)
[20:11] <Darkside> number10: yeeeeah
[20:11] <Darkside> still
[20:11] <Darkside> hmm
[20:11] <nigelvh> Without going to giving each user a password, there isn't really a lot I can imagine.
[20:11] <Darkside> is regional rugby broadcast on tv?
[20:11] <Darkside> theres a rugby game on in bath, and i can hear it from where i'm staying
[20:11] <EarthBreeze> No that had to be malicious. two reasons first it matches exactly the web site even the checksum.
[20:11] <daveake> Yes, how many times must the payloads land
[20:11] <daveake> Before they're forever banned ?
[20:11] <daveake> The answer my friend is blowin' in the wind
[20:11] <Darkside> bath vs northampton
[20:12] <Randomskk> EarthBreeze: it /exactly/ matches the website
[20:12] <Randomskk> so it's not that someone has made anything up
[20:12] <Randomskk> probably just tested uploading some telemetry or something
[20:12] <Randomskk> hard to say
[20:12] <EarthBreeze> and two, there is no way he heard that string. because he is close to 70 miles away, AND when that string was made, it was when the payload had no final amp and was putting a whopping -43 dbm into a dummy load!!
[20:12] <daveake> malicious would be something believeable, IMO. This sounds much more like someone testing.
[20:13] <Randomskk> EarthBreeze: oh, I don't doubt he didn't really pick it up on the radio
[20:13] <Randomskk> but I mean it was probably testing not someone actively trying to be annoying or malicious
[20:13] <DanielRichman> my theory: he got dl-fldigi and wanted to know how it worked
[20:13] <EarthBreeze> how or what would you be "Testing" with a web site string of text?
[20:14] <Randomskk> the tracking system and so forth
[20:14] <Darkside> EarthBreeze: you'd transmit it with something else
[20:14] <Randomskk> by this point the tracker might even have been cleared or they assumed the flight was already over
[20:14] <Darkside> and receiving with dlfldigi, to chec the bar goes green like its meant to
[20:14] <EarthBreeze> exactly I guess?
[20:15] <EarthBreeze> kinda a bummer ya know?
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[20:16] <Randomskk> oh it's a massive bummer and I wish it hadn't happened
[20:16] <Randomskk> hopefully with the new tracker web page, it would have been clear that this was just an old string
[20:16] <EarthBreeze> me too I got several just as unique flights coming up soon,
[20:16] <Randomskk> and it wouldn't have appeared as a new data point or anything
[20:17] <Randomskk> there's no good way to stop people uploading this stuff but if it's an old data point we can definitely make that clearer to people watching
[20:17] <EarthBreeze> how would you do that?
[20:17] <DanielRichman> the upload came from dl-fldigi so he must have generated some rtty and then played it back
[20:18] <EarthBreeze> like he copy pasted it in and hit transmit?
[20:18] <DanielRichman> presumably
[20:18] <EarthBreeze> bummer.
[20:18] <DanielRichman> you can generate a .wav and then play it back to yourself and it decodes it
[20:19] <EarthBreeze> This is then maybe as someone said him simply testing his system.
[20:19] <Randomskk> that seems most likely
[20:19] <DanielRichman> he could have just been curious as to how the tracking syste worked
[20:19] <DanielRichman> so wanted to put the example string through it
[20:20] <DanielRichman> as mentioned, it doesn't make much sense as malicious action since he provided his callsign and name
[20:20] <EarthBreeze> this is a great exmple for having on the program web site a audio file for testing purposes, where it's bogus, and has like several locations in it so the map moves all over etc. some sample bogust test simulated recording and tell everyone to test their systems with that audio file.
[20:21] <EarthBreeze> good idea?
[20:21] <DanielRichman> most of the times that people have had issues using dl-fldigi have been easily solved with them in irc
[20:21] <DanielRichman> i don't think it's necessary to distribute test wavs to listeners
[20:22] <EarthBreeze> this gy has zero internet footprint, at least as to wats to contact him. nothing
[20:22] <number10> the program is free to download and you cant restrict the way it works as it is a distributed tracking system,
[20:23] <DanielRichman> his address is on qrz.com?
[20:23] <EarthBreeze> just snail mail
[20:26] <EarthBreeze> wow did a google for his name
[20:28] <EarthBreeze> this is strange he is a person with the Madison FAA
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[20:30] <Randomskk> maybe he was testing out the system :P
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[20:42] <Lunar_Lander__> hello radim_OM2AMR are you there at the moment?
[20:42] <radim_OM2AMR> Lunar_Lander, hi, yes
[20:43] <Lunar_Lander__> hello
[20:43] <Lunar_Lander__> how are you?
[20:43] <radim_OM2AMR> hello, I'm little bit busy now :-) and you ? How is going your launch ?
[20:44] <Lunar_Lander__> ah no real progress currently
[20:44] <radim_OM2AMR> oh, whats happend ? :-|
[20:44] <Lunar_Lander__> what I wanted to ask is if you got your code somewhere?
[20:45] <Lunar_Lander__> ah I have to invent some new parser function
[20:45] <radim_OM2AMR> oh, do you mean my messy code ? :-)
[20:45] <Lunar_Lander__> xD
[20:45] <Lunar_Lander__> yea
[20:46] <radim_OM2AMR> My code is based on Trackuino with added Upu's RTTY and some 1-wire parts
[20:47] <number10> you have to invent something new Lunar_Lander__ ? that is a good thing and something you should be doing at university :)
[20:47] <radim_OM2AMR> GPS parser in Trackuino code is not optimal, I will rewrite whole code from scratch for future flights...
[20:48] <Lunar_Lander__> xD
[20:48] <Lunar_Lander__> well someone here told me it is not a good idea to splice code
[20:48] <number10> no need to look at other peoples Lunar_Lander__ otherwise it would not be new
[20:48] <Lunar_Lander__> ok
[20:48] <number10> or invented
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[20:50] <Lunar_Lander__> yea
[20:50] <radim_OM2AMR> Lunar_Lander, yes, I think I spend more time with editing and with trying to understand that
[20:50] <Lunar_Lander__> ah
[20:51] <radim_OM2AMR> but I'm not programmer ;-) so I'm learning on it
[20:51] <Lunar_Lander__> fortunately the sensor part runs OK already
[20:51] <Lunar_Lander__> and SD recording works too
[20:51] <Lunar_Lander__> well, that is just printing out the string over Serial
[20:51] <Lunar_Lander__> xD
[20:52] <radim_OM2AMR> I used separate OpenLog from Sparkfun for SD logging, because of size of code for SD
[20:53] <Lunar_Lander__> yeah I got the OpenLog as well
[20:53] <Lunar_Lander__> :)
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[20:54] <radim_OM2AMR> I hooked it on Serial, so I save about 8 kbytes of memory :-)
[20:55] <Lunar_Lander__> yeah
[20:55] <Lunar_Lander__> :)
[20:55] <Lunar_Lander__> the same that I did
[20:56] <radim_OM2AMR> oh, I used trackuino 1.3, now there is 1.4 version
[20:57] <radim_OM2AMR> but my code is far from original trackuino 1.3 :-)
[20:58] <Lunar_Lander__> ah :)
[20:58] <Lunar_Lander__> trackuino is like Arduino with GPS?
[20:59] <radim_OM2AMR> Trackuino is Arduino+GPS+radiometrix (APRS/AX.25)
[21:00] <Lunar_Lander__> ah
[21:00] <radim_OM2AMR> I not checked the 1.4 version, maybe you can find there some inspiration for GPS parser
[21:01] <Lunar_Lander__> yea
[21:01] <Lunar_Lander__> thanks
[21:02] <radim_OM2AMR> or, on ukhas wiki there are some ideas too ;-)
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[21:03] <MrScienceMan> i like the trackuino gps parsing code, its quite simple to modify
[21:03] <MrScienceMan> https://code.google.com/p/trackuino/source/browse/trackuino/gps.cpp?repo=firmware
[21:07] <radim_OM2AMR> MrScienceMan, yes, that's it, part of my code :-D
[21:07] <radim_OM2AMR> but slightly modified due to different LAT/LON format in APRS and RTTY
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[21:15] <Lunar_Lander__> thanks
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[21:15] <nosebleedkt> http://hackaday.com/2012/09/14/checking-out-mount-olympus-from-38-km/#comments
[21:16] <nosebleedkt> respect to the author :)
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[21:24] <nosebleedkt> I hate my IRC services
[21:24] <nosebleedkt> i get DC
[21:24] <nosebleedkt> all the time
[21:25] <nosebleedkt> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=T515pU2Crcs#!
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[21:26] <Lunar_Lander__> nosebleedkt, that is not so good with the disconnect
[21:26] <nosebleedkt> its dump
[21:26] <nosebleedkt> dump
[21:27] <nosebleedkt> more dump than the word itseld
[21:27] <nosebleedkt> itself*
[21:27] <Lunar_Lander__> yea
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[21:37] <Laurenceb_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=49_IU4wzVG8
[21:37] <Laurenceb_> what the hell
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[21:47] Nick change: bobtfish -> t0m
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[22:36] <SpeedEvil> clearly people with a strong grasp of radiation physics
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[22:54] <Laurenceb_> cuddykid on bbc
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[23:01] <TBD> Hi
[23:02] <TBD> Anyone in the North of England here who does HAB flights?
[23:02] <fsphil> there are a couple but they're probably asleep :)
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[23:02] <TBD> Ah, ok
[23:02] <TBD> lol
[23:03] <TBD> Just looking for a sponsored flight
[23:03] <TBD> Where are you guys from?
[23:03] <fsphil> it's a pretty international channel these days, though I'd say it's mostly UK
[23:04] <TBD> You from the UK?
[23:04] <fsphil> depends on the time of day
[23:04] <fsphil> yea
[23:04] <TBD> Cool
[23:04] <TBD> Let me guess - London??
[23:04] <TBD> ;-)
[23:05] <fsphil> almost, northern ireland ;)
[23:05] <TBD> LOL!
[23:05] <TBD> Ok
[23:05] <TBD> Not even close
[23:05] <fsphil> although I'll be in london next week
[23:05] <TBD> Ah, ok
[23:05] <TBD> :-D
[23:05] <TBD> So do you do HAB flights?
[23:05] <fsphil> done a couple so far
[23:06] <TBD> Awesome
[23:06] <TBD> Fancy doing a sponsored one?
[23:06] <TBD> :-)
[23:07] <fsphil> I'll not be launching for a while sadly, it takes a long time to arrange it
[23:07] <TBD> How come?
[23:07] <fsphil> it takes a long time to get permission, and then with it being a small island the winds are rarely cooperative
[23:08] <TBD> Ahh, ok
[23:08] <TBD> Hmmm
[23:08] <fsphil> it might be worth emailing the ukhas list
[23:08] <TBD> How do I do that?
[23:08] <fsphil> http://groups.google.com/group/ukhas
[23:09] <TBD> Ok, will give this a shot then
[23:09] <TBD> Thanks for your help
[23:10] <TBD> Is so hard to find the right people!
[23:10] <fsphil> no probs
[23:10] <TBD> Bet it would be easy to do in the US!
[23:10] <TBD> X-D
[23:10] <fsphil> yea, the rules are a bit more relaxed in the US
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[23:11] <fsphil> interesting
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[23:37] <Lunar_Lander__> fsphil, are you still there?
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[00:00] --- Sat Sep 15 2012