highaltitude.log.20120817

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[07:05] <griffonbot> Received email: Steve Aerospace "Re: [UKHAS] Launch announcement: XABEN this weekend"
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[07:42] <KT5TK> Good morning,
[07:43] <UpuWork> morning
[07:43] <KT5TK> Is there someone around who can add my payload document to habitat?
[07:43] <UpuWork> link it via pastebin sure someone will be able to do that for yuo
[07:44] <KT5TK> http://pastebin.com/jZuvNzb8
[07:45] <KT5TK> I hope it works for PSK31
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[07:46] <fsphil> I don't think it does
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[07:46] <KT5TK> We're launching on Saturday morning
[07:46] <KT5TK> So where's the problem?
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[07:47] <KT5TK> "mode":"PSK31"?
[07:47] <fsphil> checking now, not sure if the output of the psk31 modem is scanned for data
[07:47] <KT5TK> dl-fldigi itself works fine with PSK31 & checksum
[07:48] <fsphil> ah, the old version will work it's the new version that won't
[07:48] <fsphil> new unreleased version
[07:49] <KT5TK> I compiled the git version
[07:49] <fsphil> and that's working fine?
[07:49] <fsphil> hmm
[07:49] <KT5TK> Seems so.
[07:50] <KT5TK> I get the callsign filled out and the checksum
[07:50] <KT5TK> time, lat, long, alt is empty
[07:50] <KT5TK> not sure if this is because the payload document is missing
[07:51] <fsphil> yea it needs the doc to figure out where they are in the string
[07:51] <KT5TK> I thought so
[07:51] <fsphil> ah ha, yea it'll work
[07:51] <fsphil> just found the relevant bit of code
[07:51] <UpuWork> Windows ?
[07:52] <KT5TK> No, I've Ubuntu
[07:52] <UpuWork> ok
[07:53] <KT5TK> But old Ubuntu 11.04
[07:53] <KT5TK> So I had to compile by myself.
[07:53] <KT5TK> No big deal. worked just fine
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[07:55] <KT5TK> Is my payload doc ok?
[07:59] <radim_OM2AMR> Hi UpuWork
[08:00] <radim_OM2AMR> I found your updated guide for NTX2 and Arduino and see, that you are using two stop bits in rtty code
[08:00] <radim_OM2AMR> what is your or UKHAS practice, what is better/reliable 1 or 2 stop bits ?
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[08:11] <UpuWork> morning radim_OM2AMR
[08:11] <UpuWork> two stop bits seems to be more reliable for recieving
[08:11] <UpuWork> I changed the whole guide as the 2 wire method didn't make any sense
[08:12] <radim_OM2AMR> yes, I saw, it's nice. I have to rebuild my NTX2 shield and little bit update rtty code ;-)
[08:13] <UpuWork> the old method works
[08:13] <UpuWork> the new one is more logical
[08:13] <UpuWork> and much easier to adjust the shift as you only have one resistor to play with
[08:14] <UpuWork> I just tried to include everything I've learnt over the past year and try and impart some of "eroomde's wisdom" to boot
[08:14] <radim_OM2AMR> I did experiments with old method and I found different values of resistors for 425 Hz shift
[08:14] <radim_OM2AMR> yes, you and your society is great :-)
[08:15] <UpuWork> its your society too you're here :)
[08:15] <UpuWork> I think the UK part of the name is increasingly inaccurate
[08:15] <radim_OM2AMR> it's very good source of information for HAB beginner like me
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[08:16] <radim_OM2AMR> btw, we received NOTAM/permission for our STS-1 flight on 8-th september ;-)
[08:16] <UpuWork> excellent
[08:16] <eroomde> seeing this exchange has confused me
[08:16] <eroomde> http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/209/945/D6PfW.jpg?1322673184
[08:17] <radim_OM2AMR> I just waiting for permission from Czech Republic too, as we will start near Czech/Slovak border
[08:17] <UpuWork> you'll need to send it north east so we can recieve it
[08:17] <UpuWork> along way north east :)
[08:18] <UpuWork> You have alot of pictures this morning eroomde
[08:18] <radim_OM2AMR> :-)
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[08:50] <costyn> whee... I now have a massive 165cm 55kg bottle of He in the back of my car\
[08:51] <daveake> Nah, the 75kg ones are massive :)
[08:51] <costyn> ok well I think this one is pretty big
[08:52] <radim_OM2AMR> congrats costyn :-D
[08:53] <daveake> It is :)
[08:53] <fsphil> all still good for sunday?
[08:54] <costyn> fsphil: yes
[08:54] <fsphil> nice
[08:54] <costyn> still have no fixed location we'll be launching from, might be from the east of the country seeing as the north-north-west direction has in this case the least chance of hitting water
[08:55] <costyn> so might become a little more difficult to hear it in the UK
[08:55] <fsphil> I'm gonna give it a try with a big yagi and the preamp
[08:55] <daveake> ditto
[08:55] <UpuWork> what day is it ?
[08:55] <fsphil> don't expect it to work but it'll be a nice day up on the mountain
[08:55] <costyn> UpuWork: sunday
[08:55] <fsphil> we should try a 70cm contact since we all have these big antennas now
[08:56] <UpuWork> I also will point my big antenna at you
[08:56] <fsphil> be afraid
[08:56] <daveake> Ah, Sunday. Sorry, out all day.
[08:56] <costyn> I'll be feeling self concious with all those antenna's pointing :)
[08:56] <UpuWork> you better perform :)
[08:56] <fsphil> hah
[08:56] <costyn> :)
[08:57] <costyn> today would've been a good day to launch from near home seeing the westerly direction it would've took
[08:58] <fsphil> there will need to be some woo woo going on for me to receive it
[08:58] <costyn> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=b4fe81c0afd4174e48c568c5f0fca52681b87345
[08:58] <costyn> (this is for Sunday
[08:58] <UpuWork> Costyn I suggest you contact OT1SKY
[08:59] <UpuWork> let him know you're launching, I think he follows the list but maybe worth dropping him a line
[08:59] <costyn> UpuWork: yes, thx
[08:59] <UpuWork> I'll PM you his mail address
[09:01] <costyn> UpuWork: foudn it in my email thx
[09:01] <UpuWork> OZ1SKY even
[09:01] <costyn> UpuWork: he'd already replied ot the mailing list once
[09:01] <fsphil> hehe, http://hackaday.com/2012/08/16/raspberry-pi-wedded-to-a-dslr/
[09:02] <costyn> looks nice
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[09:05] <MrScienceMan> that gives me some awesome ideas
[09:15] <costyn> yea uploading stuff wirelessly to a nearby PC would be great
[09:17] <zyp> sounds horribly clunky for that purpose, I've got an Eye-Fi SD card which does just that
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[09:51] <costyn> zyp: does it work well?
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[13:45] <costyn> tss... quiet here today
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[13:46] <PD3EM-mobile> Hi! Testing irc999 on the iPad ;-)
[13:46] <costyn> PD3EM-mobile: looks like it works
[13:47] <costyn> PD3EM-mobile: tonight I'm going to jailbreak my iphone so I can install the chase-car tracking app
[13:47] <PD3EM-mobile> Hi costyn! Getting ready for sunday
[13:47] <costyn> PD3EM-mobile: well, not right now... now I'm at work
[13:48] <PD3EM-mobile> Costyn: I left early
[13:49] <PD3EM-mobile> I'm going to use the laptop with dl-flinging in the car
[13:50] <PD3EM-mobile> Damn autocorrect.... Dl-fldigi
[13:50] <costyn> PD3EM-mobile: hehe
[13:51] <costyn> PD3EM-mobile: do you have a driver or are you going to just set the laptop and radio up and let it do it's thing
[13:51] <PD3EM-mobile> Gonna fix the rig in my car.... Got bad audio on It
[13:52] <PD3EM-mobile> I'm driving together with a ham radio friend
[13:52] <costyn> ah ok
[13:52] <PD3EM-mobile> We tested the setup last Sunday on a weather balloon
[13:53] <PD3EM-mobile> Costyn: you need anything for Sunday?
[13:54] <costyn> PD3EM-mobile: I think I have it all covered
[13:55] <PD3EM-mobile> Great! There will be a few listeners around who normally track weather balloons
[13:55] <costyn> PD3EM-mobile: nice thanks
[13:55] <PD3EM-mobile> So coverage will be good
[13:55] <costyn> PD3EM-mobile: do you know PA1JIM?
[13:55] <costyn> PD3EM-mobile: ex-collegue from long ago. He's going to be listening as well; I bought my 817 from him
[13:56] <PD3EM-mobile> Don't think so
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[13:57] <PD3EM-mobile> He is right in the centre so good place to track
[13:57] <costyn> yea
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[13:58] <PD3EM-mobile> It will be great Sunday with nice weather ;-)
[14:00] <costyn> yes
[14:01] <PD3EM-mobile> costyn: do you have a ham radio license?
[14:01] <costyn> PD3EM-mobile: no
[14:01] <PD3EM-mobile> Ah ok
[14:07] <PD3EM-mobile> Gotta go..... Gonna fix the TM-D710
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[15:30] <jonsowman> yeah
[15:30] <adzat1996> Hi. Im 16 from Newcastle upon tyne and I was wondering if you could provide me with some help of using the raspberry pi to send a hab up using a helium filled balloon. I have a budget of around £150 to cover all costs. I would like to capture images, video (not live feed), temperature and pressure readings
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[15:31] <UpuWork> afternoon adzat1996
[15:31] <adzat1996> This would be for my extended project qualification which is the equivalent to an AS level
[15:31] <Randomskk> you will struggle to do it on £150
[15:31] <UpuWork> Yeah was about to say the gas alone these days is getting close to that
[15:31] <Randomskk> you'll spend more than that on helium and petrol
[15:31] <adzat1996> Okay how much would you say it would cost?
[15:32] <Randomskk> the balloon isn't super cheap, the required electronics a bit expensive, the ground side kit you'll need can cost money
[15:32] <UpuWork> It all depends what you want really
[15:32] <UpuWork> my suggestion is as follows
[15:32] <UpuWork> read this page a few times : http://www.ukhas.org.uk/general:beginners_guide_to_high_altitude_ballooning
[15:32] <UpuWork> then read other peoples blogs (a number are linked from the UKHAS Wiki)
[15:32] <UpuWork> Specifically read this : http://www.ukhas.org.uk/guides:raspberrypi
[15:33] <UpuWork> then come back and decide if that is the way you want to go
[15:33] <adzat1996> Ive sourced the following balloon http://www.amazon.co.uk/meter-Professional-Weather-Balloon-600g/dp/B0061SUOWO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1345217573&sr=8-1
[15:33] <adzat1996> and the following parachute
[15:33] <UpuWork> have you spoken to yuor teacher about this ? They may be able to assist
[15:33] <adzat1996> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Weather-Balloon-Parachute-meter-dia/dp/B008JHRNO2/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1345217573&sr=8-3
[15:33] <UpuWork> lol
[15:33] <UpuWork> no you don't need that parachute
[15:34] <adzat1996> Yeah the school is providing the helium (I have to pay half) and also the temp/ pressure sensors
[15:34] <Randomskk> heh aether
[15:34] <adzat1996> And UpuWork..why not? :)
[15:34] <Randomskk> adzat1996: I suggest checking out http://randomengineering.co.uk/Random_Aerospace/Welcome.html for balloons and parachutes
[15:34] <Randomskk> (nothing to do with me)
[15:34] <adzat1996> Ive found http://www.daveakerman.com/
[15:34] <adzat1996> Okay thanks
[15:34] <UpuWork> Yeah Dave is usually on here
[15:35] <UpuWork> and the first thing he will tell you is don't use a Pi
[15:35] <adzat1996> Regarding gps tracking what do you guys recommend? And why?
[15:35] <UpuWork> Radio
[15:36] <UpuWork> take a GPS module and use your microcontroller to transmit its current location via a small radio module
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[15:36] <UpuWork> before you think that sounds impossible its actually fairly easy
[15:36] <UpuWork> http://www.ukhas.org.uk/guides:linkingarduinotontx2
[15:36] <UpuWork> As for GPS modules the uBlox 6 modules are proven to work at altitude
[15:37] <UpuWork> http://www.ukhas.org.uk/guides:ublox6
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[15:37] Nick change: joph_ -> joph
[15:38] <UpuWork> but part of these projects is to sit down and do alot of back ground research to work out what you think you need
[15:38] <adzat1996> Yeah im not hoping to do this until next summer so Ive got a fair amount of time to research etc
[15:38] <UpuWork> thats a realistic time scale
[15:39] <DrLuke> morning
[15:39] <UpuWork> have you any experience with Arduinos / Coding ?
[15:39] <UpuWork> Afternoon DrLuke :)
[15:39] <UpuWork> and where are you based in the UK ?
[15:39] <DrLuke> That works too :P
[15:39] <adzat1996> In total how much would you say it will cost? And nope haha Im starting fresh. Stupid I know but it just looks really interesting
[15:39] <adzat1996> Im based in Newcastle Upon Tyne
[15:39] <UpuWork> it is interesting
[15:39] <adzat1996> Well Tynemouth TO be exact
[15:39] <UpuWork> ok up north :)
[15:39] <adzat1996> Yeah
[15:39] <UpuWork> best part of the country
[15:39] <DrLuke> adzat: my setup already sets me back around 400¬ including the balloon, electronics, parachute and hydrogen
[15:40] <UpuWork> don't use hydrogen on your first launch
[15:40] <DrLuke> why
[15:40] <Randomskk> you have enough to worry about
[15:40] <adzat1996> Yeah I know. Kaboom
[15:40] <UpuWork> because its explosive
[15:40] <Randomskk> without a giant ball of explosive gas
[15:40] <UpuWork> and what Randomskk said
[15:40] <Randomskk> and are much more likely to make mistakes the first time
[15:40] <DrLuke> it's not explosive unless you mix it with oxygen
[15:40] <Randomskk> unfortunately there is a lot of oxygen around
[15:40] <jonsowman> oxygen is fairly abundant
[15:40] <Randomskk> e.g. at your launch site
[15:41] <DrLuke> yeah, so worst case the hydrogen will burn off
[15:41] <DrLuke> but not explode
[15:41] <UpuWork> adzat1996 its entirely feasible to do this as long as you're willing to put the time and effort in
[15:41] <adzat1996> Yeah I woudl prefer to stick to helium. I think that it would be illegal for the school to provide me with h2 anyways
[15:41] <Randomskk> DrLuke: you say that
[15:41] <Randomskk> but, well
[15:41] <Randomskk> no
[15:41] <DrLuke> it might burn fast, no question
[15:41] <DrLuke> but still no explosion
[15:41] <adzat1996> I am definetly willing to do that UpuWork.
[15:41] <Randomskk> the distinction between fast burning and exploding is somewhat vague
[15:42] <Randomskk> but I don't think you want to be anywhere near it when it happens
[15:42] <Randomskk> someone from here has some videos on youtube of what happens when you put a flame near a hydrogen/helium mix in a balloon
[15:42] <adzat1996> What time does Dave normally come on here? Just do you reckon he would allow me to use his code/ method?
[15:42] <UpuWork> you'd have to speak to Dave
[15:43] <UpuWork> I don't think he'll let you just have the code
[15:43] <UpuWork> and the code is quite complex, its much simpler for an Arduino
[15:43] <jonsowman> DrLuke: it will explode when in an abundance of O2
[15:43] <UpuWork> Your school may use PIC's possibly you can do it with them
[15:43] <jonsowman> it does not need a spark
[15:43] <adzat1996> Okay dokes whats his normal irc name so I know when he comes on. And yeah I would be willing to pay of course I wouldnt just expect him to "give" me the code :)
[15:43] <jonsowman> sunlight and heat will cause it to ignite
[15:44] <adzat1996> The school doesnt offer electronics :(
[15:44] <jonsowman> but believe me, it _will_ explode
[15:44] <UpuWork> lol I don't think he will sell you the code either :)
[15:44] <UpuWork> he goes by Daveake
[15:44] <DrLuke> jonsowman: that requires a pretty good mix of h2 and O2 then
[15:44] <DrLuke> like 2:1
[15:44] <UpuWork> just be very careful DrLuke
[15:44] <DrLuke> always
[15:44] <adzat1996> :( and okay I shall look out for him and yeah I agree
[15:45] <DrLuke> not my first time playing with hydrogen ;)
[15:45] <UpuWork> DrLuke http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:hydrogen
[15:45] <adzat1996> brb
[15:45] <jonsowman> i'm pretty sure any mixture with an excess of oxygen will explode when ignitied
[15:45] <jonsowman> but it most easily ignited at stoichiometric
[15:45] <jonsowman> good typing there
[15:45] <DrLuke> thanks upuwork!
[15:45] <KT5TK> Hey guys, I've made a payload document for my PSK31 beacon last night
[15:45] <KT5TK> But I didn't get confirmation that it was added to habitat
[15:46] <KT5TK> http://pastebin.com/jZuvNzb8
[15:46] <jonsowman> DrLuke: wikipedia: Hydrogen gas forms explosive mixtures with air if it is 474% concentrated
[15:46] <jonsowman> that's a pretty wide range
[15:46] <Randomskk> KT5TK: did you submit it to anyone/anywhere?
[15:46] <UpuWork> I think fsphil did it ?
[15:46] <KT5TK> yes
[15:46] <DrLuke> jonsowman: hydrogen disperses REALLY fast
[15:46] <Randomskk> DrLuke: the diffusivity of two gasses in the atmosphere is pretty high too incidentally
[15:46] <Randomskk> DrLuke: yes, and it ignites very quickly
[15:46] <jonsowman> yes
[15:46] <Randomskk> in other words you rapidly form an explosive mixture
[15:47] <KT5TK> That's what I'm not sure about.
[15:47] <Randomskk> your pure hydrogen quickly mixes with oxygen
[15:47] <Randomskk> and then explodes
[15:47] <jonsowman> quite
[15:47] <Randomskk> boom -> :(
[15:47] <Randomskk> or more like x(
[15:47] <Randomskk> ugh I should have refactored this script when I had the chance, now I'm regretting it.
[15:47] <UpuWork> I think fsphil added KT5TK's document this morning after checking PSK31 was supported
[15:47] <Randomskk> it's tooo biiig
[15:48] <jonsowman> Randomskk: unlike you not to refactor something
[15:48] <Randomskk> ikr
[15:48] <KT5TK> OK, then I just need to hope it works, correct?
[15:48] <Randomskk> the chance was yesterday before I started adding this new feature
[15:48] <Randomskk> jonsowman: the problem is this new feature is almost certainly the last
[15:48] <Randomskk> and it's not going to be used by anything else once I've done using it to make these graphs
[15:48] <jonsowman> ah
[15:48] <Randomskk> I just need these graphs
[15:48] <jonsowman> i see
[15:53] <Randomskk> hmmm the clock on my awesome panel updates every minute and is 52 seconds out of phae
[15:53] <Randomskk> phase
[15:53] <KT5TK> Is there a way for casual listeners to submit a few beacon strings manually to habitat?
[15:54] <Randomskk> hmm yes but I think it's a bit messy at the moment
[15:54] <Randomskk> when do you want it by?
[15:54] <Randomskk> I might throw together a quick thing to do that tonight if that's not too late for you
[15:55] <KT5TK> Like when they decode the string with some other PSK31 software
[15:55] <Randomskk> tonight UK time, which would be in five hours or so
[15:55] <Randomskk> yea
[15:55] <KT5TK> We're launching tomorrow
[15:55] <Randomskk> when would you want the link to give people?
[15:55] <Randomskk> basically at the moment we have http://habitat.habhub.org/transition/
[15:55] <KT5TK> I'll put it on my website
[15:55] <Randomskk> where you can in theory stick your callsign in the box, enter the string, select the right magic option from the dropdown
[15:56] <KT5TK> the beacon transmits the website URL
[15:56] <Randomskk> ignore metadata, maybe entera timestamp in time_created
[15:56] <Randomskk> etc
[15:56] <Randomskk> it's all a bit weird
[15:56] <Randomskk> ah I see okay
[15:56] <Randomskk> well then
[15:56] <Randomskk> I'll do what I can tonight
[15:56] <DanielRichman> timestamp is optional adn defaults to now() if not specified
[15:56] <Randomskk> oh good
[15:56] <Randomskk> okay
[15:56] <DanielRichman> metadata default is good
[15:56] <Randomskk> yea
[15:56] <DanielRichman> drop down default (ascii-stripped) is probably what you want: it adds the \n back on, then submits it to habitat
[15:56] <Randomskk> ah I see
[15:57] <adzat1996> Whoever runs habub I love the layout of the prediction tool!
[15:57] <Randomskk> maybe it'd be nice to have a page that has a persistent (cookie?) callsign, leaves the rest out, has a field to paste telem in
[15:57] <Randomskk> just as easy as possible to use
[15:57] <adzat1996> Yeah it sure is
[15:57] <DanielRichman> yes. Ideally would target the same thing as parser tester/that stuff but POSTing to transition would be jsut fine for now
[15:57] <Randomskk> adzat1996: most of the credit for the predictor layout is jonsowman though a lot of different people are responsible for the various parts of the habhub systems
[15:57] <Randomskk> DanielRichman: true I might actually just try and get that done tonight
[15:58] <Randomskk> well no because it's post-transition
[15:58] <adzat1996> Ah okay
[15:59] <KT5TK> At what URL would you do that.
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[15:59] <KT5TK> Sorry I'm not familiar with habitat really
[15:59] <Randomskk> that's fine
[15:59] <Randomskk> uhm
[15:59] <Randomskk> how about I look into this when I get home in a few hours
[15:59] <Randomskk> and give you a URL that's easy to use
[15:59] <KT5TK> That would be cool
[15:59] <Randomskk> like habitat.habhub.org/manual_uplaod
[15:59] <Randomskk> in fact let's spell it right
[15:59] <Randomskk> http://habitat.habhub.org/manual_upload
[15:59] <DanielRichman> basically, long story short, there's a POST interface that the old dl-fldigi uses to submit data to our server. We added a really basic html form to the front because why not (it's been useful in some cases)
[16:00] <DanielRichman> so it's not really ideal for uploaders to use
[16:00] <DanielRichman> but it does mean we can create something nicer without having to go to too much effort
[16:00] <Randomskk> DanielRichman: should be easy enough to make a javascript page that just POSTs to transition right?
[16:00] <DanielRichman> yes
[16:00] <Randomskk> okay
[16:00] <DanielRichman> ajax or whatever; just stringify some stuff and POST
[16:00] <DanielRichman> *JSON.stringify
[16:01] <Randomskk> yea
[16:01] <DanielRichman> actually might not even be necessary if we leave metadata empty or always '{"used_manual_upload": True}'
[16:01] <KT5TK> It's just for those who pick up the beacon randomly on the air and then wonder what to do with it.
[16:01] <DanielRichman> also possible is an interface that uses $.couchdb but, would take too long
[16:02] <Randomskk> yea that's more faffy
[16:05] <adzat1996> Regarding receiving data on the ground what would I require? A radio reciever/ decoder?
[16:05] <Randomskk> yea
[16:06] <adzat1996> Okay dokes haha just looked online and they are very expensive :/
[16:06] <DanielRichman> there are a couple of options that mean you don't have to buy a full ham radio (which indeed are all expensive)
[16:07] <jonsowman> local radio clubs might have ones you can borrow
[16:07] <DanielRichman> ^ this is what we did
[16:07] <jonsowman> you will need something capable of demodulating AM-SSB
[16:07] <jonsowman> the Yaesu FT-817, FT-790r and Icom IC-7000 are all popular options
[16:07] <jonsowman> but there are tens if not hundreds
[16:07] <adzat1996> Ah okay and regarding transmitters on the tracker what would you recommend
[16:08] <jonsowman> the NTX2 is usually the favourite around here
[16:08] <eroomde> i'd have a regard at the ntx2
[16:08] <adzat1996> Would anyone be interested in providing me with like a kit list?
[16:08] <adzat1996> :P
[16:08] <jonsowman> that would be too much like doing the work for you
[16:08] <jonsowman> i assure you, it's worth the effort
[16:09] <adzat1996> I was joking haha
[16:09] <eroomde> ublox 6 gps, microcontroller of your choice, ntx2, and a whole bunch of extra little electronic bits to allow them all to play together
[16:09] <jonsowman> :)
[16:09] <eroomde> that's the payload
[16:09] <adzat1996> And the NTX2 looks resonably priced
[16:09] <eroomde> the payload itself can be quite cheap
[16:09] <jonsowman> adzat1996: UpuWork sells them, if you were looking elsewhere
[16:09] <eroomde> maybe £50 all up?
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[16:10] <adzat1996> Can you provide me with a link jonsowmn
[16:10] Nick change: eroomde -> jnsowman
[16:10] <jnsowman> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/
[16:10] Nick change: jnsowman -> eroomde
[16:10] <jonsowman> lol
[16:10] <adzat1996> Thank you!
[16:11] <jonsowman> subtle
[16:11] <eroomde> the perfect crime
[16:11] <jonsowman> nobody will ever know
[16:11] <jonsowman> adzat1996: you can choose from the 434.075 & 434.650MHz flavours
[16:12] <eroomde> 650 generally seems to be quieter
[16:12] <eroomde> in terms of interference
[16:12] <Randomskk> I recommend the .650 because it's more likely to aggravate annoying hams and suffers less interference
[16:12] <jonsowman> :)
[16:13] <eroomde> 'annoying hams' means pompous amateur radio license holders, in this context
[16:13] <eroomde> rather than cured meat that has upset you in some other way
[16:13] <Randomskk> I was thinking of the latter to be honest
[16:13] <adzat1996> Okay thanks haha
[16:14] <jonsowman> i don't think cured meat has ever annoyed me
[16:14] <eroomde> adzat 1996 means you were born in 1996?
[16:14] <Randomskk> you clearly haven't encountered enough of it jonsowman
[16:14] <jonsowman> Randomskk: haha
[16:15] <Randomskk> eroomde: given this is a lower sixth project, presumably
[16:15] <eroomde> i'm getting to that age where you can start to say things like 'i feel old'
[16:15] <Randomskk> I feel old and I'm still a bit younger than you D:
[16:16] <jonsowman> i say that already
[16:16] <eroomde> did my first hab when you were 10 adzat1996
[16:16] <eroomde> that said i was 6 months old when bill brown did his first hab
[16:16] <adzat1996> Yes good observation and haha really
[16:17] <adzat1996> What is the EZCAP USB Dongle used for?
[16:17] <Randomskk> radio receiver
[16:17] <adzat1996> Is that for the payload side of things?
[16:17] <Randomskk> no
[16:17] <Randomskk> you can use it to make your computer the receiving radio
[16:18] <Randomskk> it's not as good as a proper radio
[16:18] <Randomskk> but it can work
[16:18] <Randomskk> that store linked above sells (or will soon) a pre-amp and filter you can buy to make it a lot better
[16:18] <adzat1996> Okay that sounds good so I wouldnt require an expensive radio if I used that?
[16:18] <eroomde> adzat1996: it's conventionally used to pick up ditigal tv broadcasts. but it can be retuned to listen to balloons and there is software now that will let you do this
[16:18] <eroomde> adzat1996: i would suggest the dongle should be a backup plan if you can't find a ham radio to borrow
[16:19] <eroomde> you will get better results with a 'proper' radio
[16:19] <adzat1996> Okay I shall search for a ham first
[16:19] <eroomde> worth getting one anyway for £25 or whatever, you can certainly test your payload on the becnh with it
[16:20] <eroomde> its weakness is in picking up the much weaker signals where the balloon is in the air 200km. it's basically not as sensitive as a conventional radio
[16:20] <eroomde> 200km away*
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[16:21] <adzat1996> With anntenna would a tv arial do?
[16:21] <Randomskk> no
[16:22] <Randomskk> wrong frequency
[16:22] <adzat1996> Or would parabolic be better
[16:22] <Randomskk> probably you want something like a 70cm (434MHz) whip antenna
[16:22] <Randomskk> ideally one with a magmount base (magnet) so you can stick it on the car roof when you go to find the thing
[16:22] <eroomde> adzat1996: tv antennas are a kind of antenna called a yagi antenna
[16:23] <eroomde> but while they look the same, the actual sizings of all the bars and the distance between the bars depends on the frequency you are trtying to receive
[16:23] <adzat1996> Ahhh okay I see
[16:23] <eroomde> and tv ones are designed for the tv broadcast freqs which are higher than 434mhz where we do our stuff
[16:24] <eroomde> yagi antennas are directional, they're the radio equivalent of a telescope
[16:24] <adzat1996> So this kind of thing?
[16:24] <adzat1996> http://www.kiatronics.com/rf-434mhz-antenna/ant-433-whip-mag-antenna-433mhz-heavy-magnetic-base.html
[16:24] <eroomde> they have to be pointing at the target in order to receive from them
[16:24] <DanielRichman> the ezcap dongle would be more than adequate for building and testing your payload, I think, without any extra antennae.
[16:24] <eroomde> yes that antenna will do
[16:24] <eroomde> that is nor directional
[16:24] <eroomde> or at least, not really
[16:24] <DanielRichman> but it's not enough for a flight. so if you got one then you could limit the amount of time you have to borrow an actual ham radio for
[16:24] <Randomskk> that kind of thing but that seems quite expensive and also in NZ
[16:25] <Randomskk> yea, you won't need an antenna for testing on the ground
[16:25] <eroomde> so you can just put it on a pole or on the roof of your car and it doesn't matter which way the gar is ointing, it'll still work
[16:25] <Randomskk> and you can probably borrow an antenna with the radio if you manage that
[16:25] <jonsowman> DanielRichman: it's 'antennas' for radio stuff, interestingly
[16:25] Action: jonsowman is feeling pedantic
[16:25] <DanielRichman> you know
[16:25] <DanielRichman> I wrote antennas and changed it
[16:25] <eroomde> octopussies
[16:25] <eroomde> or something
[16:25] <adzat1996> Okay dokes. Thanks for all the help btw I hope you dont mind me asking too many questions
[16:25] <Randomskk> arials
[16:25] <Randomskk> >_>
[16:25] <Randomskk> can't get it wrong
[16:26] <jonsowman> different plurals depending on meaning, don't you love english
[16:26] <jonsowman> Randomskk: except that it's aerials
[16:26] <jonsowman> ok i'm going to stop now before someone bans me for being annoying]
[16:26] <jonsowman> :)
[16:26] <Randomskk> "In the context of engineering and physics, the plural of antenna is antennas, and it has been this way since about 1950 (or earlier), when a cornerstone textbook in this field, Antennas, was published by John D. Kraus of the Ohio State University. Besides the title, Dr. Kraus noted this in a footnote on the first page of his book. Insects may have "antennae", but this form is not used in the context of electronics."
[16:26] <Randomskk> haha good point
[16:26] <eroomde> if c++ is an octopus made by nailing extra legs onto a dog, english is a langauge made by nailing extra languages onto a grunt
[16:27] <jonsowman> haha
[16:27] <jonsowman> who said that?
[16:27] <eroomde> adzat1996: questions fine. but do have a good read of the wiki
[16:27] <eroomde> a lot of the questions that people come on here to ask are often answeered by the wiki
[16:27] <adzat1996> Okay thanks I shall :)
[16:27] <eroomde> jonsowman: the first part is someone else, dunno who
[16:27] <eroomde> the second part is me
[16:28] <jonsowman> ah
[16:28] <jonsowman> :)
[16:28] <eroomde> adzat1996: and if everyone is up to speed with the wiki, which is the kinda baseline of general hab knowhow, then we can have much more interesting discussion on here :)
[16:29] <eroomde> and talk about extra things like gliders from balloons and rockets from balloons and sending pictures down and so on
[16:29] <adzat1996> Okay Thanks. I hope to speak to you again in the near future but shall be looking out for Dave on here :)
[16:30] <nick_> Someone mentioned a glider from a balloon or something on the mailing list recently.
[16:30] <nick_> Aren't they illegal here?
[16:30] <eroomde> adzat1996: why do you want dave?
[16:30] <eroomde> nick_: yeah probably
[16:31] <jonsowman> nick_: if it was ASTRA, it's only from a few hundred feet and within visual range
[16:31] <eroomde> but increasingly don't care
[16:31] <eroomde> parachutes have L/D
[16:31] <adzat1996> As he has done the same thing previously with a raspberry pi
[16:31] <eroomde> so wings are just the same but more so
[16:31] <jonsowman> adzat1996: most people on here have done this before
[16:31] <eroomde> you want to send pics down adzat1996 ?
[16:32] <adzat1996> What you mean?
[16:32] <eroomde> 'the same thing with a raspberry pi'
[16:32] <eroomde> he used a raspberry pi to send pics down
[16:32] <nick_> L/D?
[16:32] <eroomde> lift / drag
[16:33] <eroomde> i.e. parachutes glide
[16:33] <nick_> But something falling under parachaute isn't considered a UAV?
[16:33] <Randomskk> the law that allows us to do the HAB stuff specifies that the payloads must descend by parachute
[16:33] <eroomde> it is U and A and V
[16:33] <adzat1996> Oh so he didnt acctually use the pi as the mc?
[16:33] <Randomskk> he did
[16:33] <Randomskk> what do you mean by "the same thing"?
[16:34] <eroomde> yes he did. but the mc bit is really easy
[16:35] <adzat1996> Oh okay and Im wanting to use the pi as the mc without overcomplicating it by transmitting pics
[16:35] <eroomde> using a pi is probably overcomplicating it :)
[16:35] <eroomde> it's about 1000x more energy and processing power than you need
[16:35] <Randomskk> yea I'd probably investigate using just an arduino or similar
[16:35] <Randomskk> cheaper smaller easier lighter
[16:36] <jonsowman> and it's linux which isn't realtime
[16:36] <jonsowman> it will cause you all sorts of issues
[16:36] <eroomde> people have sent pics down with little linux boards for several years now, dave did it with a pi because he knew there is pi-mania
[16:36] <eroomde> raspberry piiiiiii
[16:36] <eroomde> spaaaaaaaaaaaace
[16:37] <eroomde> every tech blog will wet themselves
[16:37] <adzat1996> Hmm fair enough
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[16:37] <eroomde> but there's nothing inherently sensible about doing it that way from an engineering pov :)
[16:37] <eroomde> is my point
[16:38] <adzat1996> Yeah I suppose. Anyways thanks for the help!
[16:38] <eroomde> np
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[16:39] <Randomskk> good quitting
[16:39] <eroomde> yeah
[16:39] <eroomde> odd
[16:39] <Randomskk> 1996
[16:39] <Randomskk> :|
[16:39] <eroomde> still a foetus
[16:39] <eroomde> could launch him
[16:39] <eroomde> himself*
[16:39] <Randomskk> and yet planning on doing a hab payload
[16:40] Action: DanielRichman coughs
[16:40] <Randomskk> I know, I know :P
[16:40] <jonsowman> lower sixth did you say?
[16:40] <Randomskk> one year younger
[16:40] <Randomskk> plans to do this for L6 project
[16:41] <jonsowman> ah okay
[16:41] <eroomde> DT?
[16:41] <Randomskk> DanielRichman: with respect, you were already writing AVR code
[16:41] <Randomskk> eroomde: a general 'project' thing?
[16:41] <Randomskk> not actually doing AS levels per se
[16:41] <Randomskk> some other system
[16:41] <Randomskk> he mentioned
[16:41] <Randomskk> btw eroomde did you see my quadshot?
[16:41] <Randomskk> https://www.dropbox.com/s/atgiqwzzx5a34r8/2012-08-16%2023.03.35.jpg
[16:41] <DanielRichman> EPQ. We were offered it. Some people in the year did it, I did not
[16:42] <Randomskk> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcBa7yYqVkQ
[16:42] <DanielRichman> it tripped the "just do it to put it on your ucas" alarm
[16:42] <eroomde> epq?
[16:42] <eroomde> epique?
[16:42] <Randomskk> DanielRichman: ah, I see
[16:42] <eroomde> for when u are french and awesome
[16:42] <DanielRichman> "extended project qualification"
[16:43] <Randomskk> I remember about things for UCAS
[16:43] <eroomde> what is this new devilry
[16:43] <DanielRichman> you know the website didn't crash
[16:43] <eroomde> i just did a levels and some people had to do step
[16:43] <DanielRichman> it worked fine
[16:43] <eroomde> this is all i recall of uni applications
[16:43] <DanielRichman> well it's pretty much still like that.
[16:43] <nick_> HAB stuff could blatently get you a CREST award for ucas bonus points
[16:43] <jonsowman> DanielRichman: that's a first
[16:43] <Randomskk> nick_: CREST gets you UCAS points?!
[16:43] <Randomskk> I did a gold crest
[16:43] <Randomskk> and won 'best report'
[16:44] <Randomskk> and didn't even put it on ucas...
[16:44] <DanielRichman> they had some downtime, the site went readonly, and they said they would email us if something changed anyway (presumably to discourage f5ing)
[16:44] <Randomskk> :|
[16:44] <DanielRichman> /and/ they had a mobile site
[16:44] <DanielRichman> it was incredible
[16:44] <eroomde> this is all much more complicated than in my day
[16:44] <Randomskk> then again my offer wasn't exactly UCAS points based.
[16:44] <Randomskk> so much as "get an A in all your things"
[16:44] <eroomde> yes
[16:44] <Randomskk> well AAB actually I guess but still
[16:44] <eroomde> applied, offer, done
[16:44] <Randomskk> DanielRichman: amazed;
[16:44] <Randomskk> .*
[16:44] <nick_> Oh, not points apparently
[16:44] <jonsowman> i was trying to get onto UCAS on a sleeper train home to London from Fort William
[16:44] <eroomde> and no A* bollocks
[16:44] <Randomskk> maybe someone made them get their act together
[16:45] <jonsowman> didn't work
[16:45] <DanielRichman> eroomde: you forgot the take exams bit
[16:45] <Randomskk> after last year
[16:45] <nick_> But they are endorsed by UCAS
[16:45] <nick_> I'm now not sure what that means
[16:45] <Randomskk> nick_: fair enough
[16:45] <Randomskk> :/
[16:45] <eroomde> DanielRichman: well barely
[16:45] <eroomde> in the days of only having A as the top grade, you could usually get your a before having done all the modules
[16:45] <eroomde> which meant summer of A2 year meant you actually didn;y really have to take the exam
[16:45] <eroomde> didn't*
[16:46] <nick_> Yeah, requiring UCAS points means you probably did bad enough that you're not doing sciency extra curricula stuff
[16:46] <DanielRichman> very true. I observed this myself
[16:46] <eroomde> just turn up and write your name
[16:46] <eroomde> and maybe a poem for the examiner
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[16:46] <Randomskk> daveake: you have a new fan
[16:46] <eroomde> you just missed a groupie daveake
[16:46] <jonsowman> someone in my history GCSE just wrote the entire lyrics to an entire Queen album
[16:46] <Randomskk> bwim someone else wants to do a rpi launch
[16:46] <Randomskk> inspired by your blog
[16:46] <Randomskk> jonsowman: wow
[16:46] <eroomde> he must talk to dave
[16:46] <daveake> I've got A/C. Don't need a fan
[16:46] <Randomskk> what'd they get?
[16:46] <eroomde> dave has done this before
[16:46] <eroomde> where is dave
[16:47] <eroomde> what is dave's nick
[16:47] <daveake> lol
[16:47] <eroomde> dave has done this before
[16:47] <eroomde> with a pi
[16:47] <Randomskk> I should really finish this annoying bit of work and go home
[16:47] <eroomde> dave
[16:47] <eroomde> pi
[16:47] <jonsowman> Randomskk: not a lot, but they got a copy of the paper for posterity's sake
[16:47] <Randomskk> :D
[16:47] <daveake> Dave was at a customer site fixing a silly problem caused by a silly customer who didn't quite give me the whole story before I left
[16:47] <Randomskk> :|
[16:48] <eroomde> is the customer also trying to build a payload while completeing a physics degree in germany?
[16:48] <daveake> I think I'm glad I wasn't around then :)
[16:48] <daveake> lol
[16:48] <jonsowman> haha
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[16:48] <daveake> Though when it took nearly 3 hours to get from here to the other side of Bristol, I wasn't happy
[16:48] <daveake> UpuWork You owe me £1.09 :D
[16:49] <nick_> What were you doing in/near Bristol?
[16:49] <daveake> Murd... visiting a customer
[16:49] <nick_> Did you go to The Cornubia?
[16:50] <daveake> If I say "the what now?" does that answer it?
[16:51] <eroomde> nick_: re early discussion
[16:51] <eroomde> parafoil counts as a parachute
[16:51] <eroomde> so that could be a way in
[16:52] <eroomde> also i wonder if it has to descend by parachute the whole way
[16:52] <nick_> It was probably my favourite Bristol pub
[16:52] <eroomde> or would touching down be enough
[16:53] <nick_> Cool place, out of the way, the excitement of regular fires nearby and the only place I ever saw Bowman Ales in the wild.
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[17:30] <griffonbot> @steamfire: A beautiful @CNES_France balloon under test, STRATEOLE program ~2005 pressurized 10 meter diameter! #UKHAS http://t.co/w5VHFLX2 [http://twitter.com/steamfire/status/236515336948707328]
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[17:43] <eroomde> some awesome internet connection action going on there gonzo_
[17:43] <gonzo_> sorry, spamming the chan
[17:43] <gonzo_> trying to sort a prob involving lost of rebooting
[17:44] <gonzo_> I'll bugger off till foxed
[17:44] <gonzo_> fixed
[17:44] <gonzo_> (though TBH I was prob right first time)
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[17:45] Action: Laurenceb_ is working on a plan to send an Estes D motor to 100Km
[17:45] <Laurenceb_> cuz im that mad
[17:47] <eroomde> madness
[17:47] <eroomde> but that's easy Laurenceb_
[17:47] <eroomde> just selotape it to the top of an N motor
[17:47] <eroomde> and launch from 25km
[17:47] <Laurenceb_> lol
[17:47] <eroomde> don;t see what the problem is
[17:48] <Laurenceb_> put on lathe, trim off 80% of the cardboard and mill out the nozzle
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[17:48] <Laurenceb_> infuse the cardboard with silicone using vacuum kit (I have this setup and working)
[17:48] <Laurenceb_> then shove in CF tube with nozzle extention
[17:48] <Laurenceb_> - made from tufnol
[17:50] <Laurenceb_> maybe pretreat the inside of the tube with momentive 4004
[17:52] <Laurenceb_> only problem is how to track it
[17:56] <Laurenceb_> but it can get to 100km if launched from 38Km or so
[17:59] <eroomde> def stable enough?
[18:01] <Laurenceb_> if tis spun fast yes :P
[18:01] <Laurenceb_> at apogee its out of the atmosphere, but itd probably get damaged during re-entry
[18:01] <Laurenceb_> as its going sideways
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[18:36] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[18:36] <Lunar_Lander> I would like to share with you this plot http://s.gullipics.com/image/q/d/i/5ztqyu-jbdbzb-q4dz/DurationTest1BatteryVoltage.png
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[18:38] <Lunar_Lander> this is the battery voltage taken during my endurance run
[18:38] <Lunar_Lander> the system terminated to operate after 16 hours and 9 minutes
[18:41] <daveake> That's the same curve that Energizer publish
[18:41] <craag> 3xAA?
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[18:43] <Lunar_Lander> yes
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[18:48] <radim_OM2AMR> Lunar_Lander - nice curve, what was the discharging current ?
[18:48] <gb73d> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/96783368/LASHAM%20GLIDERS%20JULY%202008.wmv
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[18:49] <Lunar_Lander> radim_OM2AMR, that wasn't measured, sorry
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[18:49] <radim_OM2AMR> Lunar_Lander; could you estimate it ?
[18:50] <Lunar_Lander> GPS alone draws 60 mA
[18:50] <Lunar_Lander> I think it's best when I try to measure it on monday
[18:53] <radim_OM2AMR> Lunar_Lander, what about the date of your launch, still begin of the september ?
[18:54] <Lunar_Lander> maybe, maybe a bit later now
[18:54] <Lunar_Lander> have to run a cold test next week first
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[18:56] <radim_OM2AMR> we have permit from Slovak CAA for 8-th sept and as a alternative 15-th sept.
[18:56] <radim_OM2AMR> I would like to try modified NTX2 interfacing by Upu and daveake
[18:57] <radim_OM2AMR> maybe tonight :-D
[18:58] <Lunar_Lander> yeah :D
[18:58] <Lunar_Lander> I got to ask Upu something btw
[18:58] <Lunar_Lander> Upu, can we run the ublox on that power saving mode throughout the flight?
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[18:59] <Upu> you can but it can cause some issues and needs further testing. And how long are you planning on flying for that graph indicates 2 days ?
[19:01] <Lunar_Lander> no that was a bench test
[19:01] <Lunar_Lander> I wanted to look how long the batteries last
[19:01] <Lunar_Lander> turns out 16 h
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[19:03] <daveake> What's using so much current? That's about 190mA total for 16 hours.
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[19:05] <Lunar_Lander> hm we got GPS, NTX2, Openlog, the sensors and the arduino
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[19:12] <daveake> How much does the Mega use?
[19:13] <daveake> 16 hours are fine but my simple trackers run 40+ hours from AAs
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[19:20] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[19:20] <Lunar_Lander> will check the specs
[19:21] <radim_OM2AMR> daveake - great, my giant tracker draws about 350 mA in peak (atmega328, gps, NTX2, HX1, openlog, two keychain cameras)
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[19:23] <costyn> anybody recently install the iphone chase car tracker app?
[19:24] <costyn> getting a dns resolve error for cydia.skynet.ai
[19:24] <Upu> sec I'll see if I can get that sorted for you
[19:25] <costyn> thx
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[19:34] <costyn> I tried some googling, but coulnd't find the chasetracker anywhere
[19:35] <Upu> he's afk
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[19:36] <costyn> "then who was keyboard?" :)
[19:36] <Upu> the guy who wrote it
[19:37] <costyn> ah I thought someone meant you were afk and typed it into irc :)
[19:37] <costyn> someone else at your house
[19:37] <Upu> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/08/17/lohan_gps/
[19:38] <costyn> Upu: ok, if you could ping him and see if he has a new cydia repository, would be great
[19:38] <Upu> I have and I will
[19:38] <costyn> you rock!
[19:38] <Upu> I try
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[19:41] <MrScienceMan> q/fq 4
[19:41] <costyn> anyways, jailbreaking it has been useful with all the extra lock screen buttons you can install
[19:42] <DrLuke> upu: the ntx2 still didn't arrive :C
[19:42] <DrLuke> it's been almost 2 weeks
[19:42] <DrLuke> are you sure you wrote "germany" on it? :P
[19:42] <Upu> where did I send it ?
[19:42] <Upu> country ?
[19:42] <DrLuke> germany
[19:43] <Upu> remind me of your first name ?
[19:43] <DrLuke> Lukas
[19:43] <DrLuke> order ID 185
[19:43] <Upu> hmm
[19:44] <Upu> this is why I don't like non recorded mail
[19:44] <Laurenceb_> looks like my soldering iron
[19:44] <Upu> If its not there by next Friday let me know
[19:44] <Upu> I'll send you another
[19:44] <DrLuke> ok
[19:45] <DrLuke> usually it doesn't take that long for british mail, but maybe it's just some delay
[19:45] <DrLuke> weather related or whatever
[19:47] <fsphil> wrong leaves on the track
[19:48] <Upu> parcels are slow
[19:49] <radim_OM2AMR> DrLuke, I'm waiting patiently too, order ID 183, (to Slovakia), so I can inform you in advance :-)
[19:50] <radim_OM2AMR> It takes usualy 2 weeks from UK to SK
[19:50] <DrLuke> hmm
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[19:50] <DrLuke> oh well
[19:50] <Upu> I assure you they all got posted :/
[19:51] <Upu> never had one go missing yet, one took 4 weeks to get to the US
[19:51] <DrLuke> well the US is kinda far away :P
[19:51] <Upu> use international signed ...
[19:51] <radim_OM2AMR> it was opposite jetstream :-D
[19:51] <DrLuke> I'm just so impatient because my parents are gone for a week and I have sooo much time right now
[19:52] <DrLuke> :P
[19:52] <DrLuke> the time after school and before university is awesome
[19:52] <DrLuke> kinda pains me to know that I'll never again have this much free time :(
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[19:55] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[19:56] <Randomskk> anyone know decent places (online) for cat5 cabling?
[19:56] <Randomskk> need like 50m of preferable made-up patch
[20:00] <eroomde> monster cable
[20:00] <eroomde> their audio-grade stuff is really good
[20:01] <Randomskk> oh yes I forgot they have ethernet cable
[20:01] <eroomde> the bits have more composure and a more immersive soundstage
[20:01] <Lunar_Lander> eroomde, did you see my voltage plot?
[20:01] <eroomde> I did not
[20:01] <Lunar_Lander> http://s.gullipics.com/image/q/d/i/5ztqyu-jbdbzb-q4dz/DurationTest1BatteryVoltage.png
[20:01] <costyn> Upu: i'm going afk now, if you get a reply just answer here, I'll see it tommorow
[20:02] <Upu> nps
[20:02] <eroomde> Lunar_Lander: nice
[20:03] <eroomde> are you happy with the performance?
[20:03] <eroomde> was it what you were expecting?
[20:03] <Lunar_Lander> well I got 16 hours of running time
[20:03] <Lunar_Lander> I hoped it would last longer
[20:03] <Lunar_Lander> because I once thought of a roof test over the weekend
[20:04] <eroomde> you might find there are things you can do with the arduino code and gps to reduce the power consumtpion
[20:05] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:05] <Lunar_Lander> I already asked Upu about the GPS power save mode
[20:05] <daveake> The GPS is only 1/3rd of the total
[20:06] <daveake> I'd be looking to see what's using the rest
[20:06] <eroomde> gps should be the thirstiest thing on a payload typically
[20:06] <daveake> Indeed
[20:06] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:07] <daveake> Pi payloads excepted :p
[20:07] <eroomde> badger 2 was about 250mA at 5v
[20:07] <eroomde> still not entirely figured out why it had to be that much
[20:07] <eroomde> but time pressure was such that the engineering solution selected was MOOAAARRR BATTRRYYY
[20:07] <daveake> :)
[20:08] <Lunar_Lander> :P
[20:09] <eroomde> this was our PM
[20:09] <eroomde> http://fatmouse66.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/ffffuuuu1blog.jpg
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[20:10] <daveake> lol
[20:11] <adzat1996> You do know its quite easy to read through the chat logs
[20:11] <eroomde> yes we know perfectly well that it's likely you would see that
[20:11] <eroomde> don't worry it's affectionate
[20:11] <fsphil> weirdly enough it was designed that way
[20:12] <eroomde> daveake meat adzat1996
[20:12] <adzat1996> haha
[20:12] <eroomde> er, meet
[20:12] <eroomde> freudian sorry
[20:12] <Upu> adzat1996 wants to launch a Pi
[20:12] <daveake> lol
[20:12] <adzat1996> Not the best of intros
[20:12] <fsphil> I dropped my Pi earlier,, it was a sort of flight
[20:12] <daveake> Not the best choice of tracker computer either
[20:12] <Lunar_Lander> btw, temperature recording: http://s.gullipics.com/image/f/c/k/5ztqyu-jbdg9b-rje0/DurationTest1Temperature.png
[20:13] <eroomde> as a nod to hab history, on the brain at the mo, the first uk flights were done by a gumstix
[20:13] <adzat1996> Yeah but Im up for the challenge plus got a few pi's around 3 of them now (dont ask how)
[20:13] <eroomde> avionics written in bash
[20:13] <eroomde> allow that to sink in for a sec
[20:13] <eroomde> avionics written in bash
[20:13] <Laurenceb_> you know you can increaswe bmp085 performance
[20:14] <eroomde> replace it with something better
[20:14] <fsphil> Tim's flight was all driven by bash
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[20:14] <daveake> and powered by luck
[20:14] <eroomde> shouldn;t bash it till you try it
[20:14] <eroomde> i guess
[20:14] <russss> eroomde: well you've got to use all that CPU power up with something, right?
[20:14] <russss> Might as well be bash.
[20:14] <eroomde> it would be nice if that's why we could say the ukhas standard payload identifier starts with $
[20:14] <eroomde> but it would be a big lie
[20:14] <daveake> Mine had some bash
[20:14] <Lunar_Lander> btw, temperature recording: http://s.gullipics.com/image/f/c/k/5ztqyu-jbdg9b-rje0/DurationTest1Temperature.png
[20:14] <daveake> Just for the pix
[20:14] <eroomde> just picked out out of my bum one evening chatting with james i think
[20:15] <fsphil> copying gps
[20:15] <Darkside> eroomde: nmea
[20:15] <Upu> what they said
[20:15] <fsphil> nmea nmea nmea nmea ... bat man!
[20:15] <eroomde> that would be sensible
[20:15] <Darkside> heh
[20:15] <eroomde> but actually it honestly was
[20:15] <eroomde> 'shall we use !'
[20:15] <eroomde> 'meh'
[20:15] <eroomde> 'or $?'
[20:15] <eroomde> 'meh'
[20:15] <adzat1996> Dave any tips (apart from ditching the pi) on how to launch the pi? What os etc did you use?
[20:15] <eroomde> 'ok'
[20:15] <Darkside> heh
[20:15] <eroomde> something like that
[20:16] <daveake> I used Debian
[20:16] <daveake> But use whatever you're familiar with
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[20:16] <eroomde> i think it might have been $$ as opposed to just $ in order to be kind to nmea pasters tho
[20:16] <eroomde> that rings a bell
[20:16] <adzat1996> Right so would I run python script or what?
[20:16] <eroomde> bash!
[20:17] <eroomde> actually Laurenceb_ - didn;t you use python for that sampler?
[20:17] <Darkside> eroomde: how many just streamed nmea?
[20:17] <eroomde> running on the atmel linux jobby?
[20:17] <daveake> Use whatever language you like that will do the job
[20:17] <eroomde> Darkside: no one
[20:17] <Darkside> heh
[20:17] <fsphil> any language, as long as it's C
[20:17] <natrium42> :)
[20:17] <daveake> I was trying not to preach :)
[20:17] <natrium42> i mean C:
[20:17] <Darkside> i wonder if you can set the ublox modules to 300 baid
[20:17] <eroomde> Darkside: actually i think one of the v early payloads by a guy called mike castle just saved a nmea string and sent it over morse
[20:17] <eroomde> so it might have been that
[20:18] <Randomskk> I'm sure someone once just sent nmea raw
[20:18] <eroomde> but i don;t think the payload ever worked properly
[20:18] <Randomskk> the parser used to handle it
[20:18] <eroomde> possibly. but cannot recall
[20:18] <Randomskk> in theory still can actually
[20:18] <daveake> xor8 loveliness
[20:18] <Darkside> hmm
[20:18] <Darkside> would be an interesting payload
[20:18] <fsphil> project cirrus just cut up the nmea string a bit
[20:18] <Darkside> gps + radio
[20:19] <eroomde> Darkside: indeed
[20:19] <eroomde> that was the hope once
[20:19] <Darkside> plus flash for gps config
[20:19] <eroomde> before we realised 4800 was just too much on 10mW
[20:19] <eroomde> but i think we tried
[20:19] <Darkside> i dobt thinknthe ubx gpses go that slow
[20:19] <Laurenceb_> yes i used python
[20:19] Action: Laurenceb_ is cooking steak
[20:19] <Laurenceb_> what i was saying about bmp085
[20:20] <Laurenceb_> if you oversample the temp sensor
[20:20] <eroomde> Darkside: i think the ublox 4 did
[20:20] <Laurenceb_> then rewrite the correction code you can get increased temp accuracy
[20:20] <eroomde> i *think*
[20:20] <Laurenceb_> and improve performance a little
[20:20] <eroomde> which is what the early nova flight computers used
[20:20] <Laurenceb_> - ~40% lower noise
[20:20] <eroomde> but it wanted something like 100mA
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[20:21] <Laurenceb_> but the measurement spec sensors blow bosch out of the water
[20:21] <eroomde> so switched to lassen iQ for badger 1. that also would do 4800
[20:21] <Darkside> hrm
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[20:21] <Laurenceb_> you just need to find the right person to email
[20:22] <Darkside> theres some TIM-4 modules floating around bath uni
[20:22] <Laurenceb_> and ask pleasey pleasy please could i have some sensors
[20:22] <Darkside> might see whatbthey can do
[20:22] <Darkside> lol
[20:22] <Lunar_Lander> temperature during the http://s.gullipics.com/image/f/c/k/5ztqyu-jbdg9b-rje0/DurationTest1Temperature.png
[20:22] <Lunar_Lander> *run
[20:23] <eroomde> Darkside: sure! you'd get a few old sacrifical trackers no prob
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[20:23] <eroomde> i think we still have some of the old 'circuit design' 434mhz modules that lost the great radio wars to the ntx2
[20:23] <eroomde> they were sh!t tho so only if ure desparate
[20:24] Action: Laurenceb_ is wondering about an 868mhz si4432 based rocket tracker
[20:25] Action: eroomde is working on a rocket tracker atm infact
[20:25] <Randomskk> hey daveake, quick question
[20:25] <Randomskk> what's the device name for the serial port on an rpi?
[20:25] <Randomskk> /dev/...?
[20:25] <Laurenceb_> anyone know how to get electrical bond to CF?
[20:25] <eroomde> ftdpi01
[20:26] <Randomskk> ...really?
[20:26] <eroomde> no
[20:26] <eroomde> i just thought ftdi - ftdpi
[20:26] <eroomde> i have no idea
[20:26] <eroomde> sorry
[20:26] <Laurenceb_> /dev/fail
[20:26] <fsphil> not the obvious, ttyS0?
[20:26] <Randomskk> maybe?
[20:26] <Randomskk> I don't have one
[20:26] <fsphil> hmm
[20:26] <Randomskk> but need to know for reasons
[20:26] <eroomde> oh no wait i do! we made a wireless atmega programmer out of a pi to reprogram the hovering rocket on ther, er, fly
[20:26] <Randomskk> ....
[20:26] <fsphil> very good
[20:26] <Randomskk> wow, really?
[20:26] <Randomskk> nice
[20:27] <eroomde> not while it's actually flying
[20:27] <Randomskk> oh okay
[20:27] <Randomskk> was going to say
[20:27] <Randomskk> that would be a bit
[20:27] <Randomskk> xtreme
[20:27] <eroomde> but because it was infront of the test bay and the flight computer was on the top of the rocket which was on a vertical stand which meant we needed a ladder to get to it
[20:27] <fsphil> over the air updates
[20:27] <eroomde> and tbh cba
[20:27] <eroomde> so made a link that let us preprogram it from the control room using wifi
[20:28] <daveake> randomskk /dev/ttyAMA0
[20:28] <fsphil> easyflash
[20:28] <eroomde> flashgordon we called it actually
[20:28] <eroomde> fo real
[20:28] <Randomskk> daveake: great, thanks
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[20:29] <eroomde> how to make a good first impression on an irc channel offering help ^
[20:30] <daveake> Flash, Flash, I love you, but we only have fourteen minutes to program the rocket!
[20:30] <Randomskk> eroomde: do you typically use ipython, out of interest?
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[20:30] <eroomde> y
[20:31] <eroomde> for numerical stuff anyway
[20:31] <Randomskk> I should really get into it
[20:31] <eroomde> ipython --pylab
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[20:31] <fsphil> AMA short for Advanced Microcontroller Bus Architecture
[20:31] <eroomde> ipython qtconsole has doc popups
[20:31] <eroomde> but also seems buggier
[20:32] <Randomskk> fsphil: haha. :|
[20:32] <fsphil> not sure where the B went
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[20:33] <eroomde> busy entombing insects
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[20:35] <fsphil> bee back later
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[20:47] <eroomde> http://www.ftdichip.com/Products/ICs/FT311D.html
[20:47] <eroomde> potentially useful
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[21:10] <Lunar_Lander> have a look at the humidity sensor
[21:11] <Lunar_Lander> http://s.gullipics.com/image/t/v/6/5ztqyu-jbdhg2-n2t0/DurationTest1Humidity.png
[21:11] <Lunar_Lander> the dropoff happens when the battery died
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[21:17] <DrLuke> Lunar_Lander: what does ÖRNEN stand for
[21:17] <Lunar_Lander> that is Eagle in Swedish
[21:17] <Lunar_Lander> in honour of Salomon August Andree
[21:18] <Lunar_Lander> swedish explorer who wanted to try to reach the North Pole by his balloon Örnen in 1897
[21:18] <DrLuke> aaah
[21:18] <DrLuke> pretty cool
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[21:22] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[22:04] <kristianpaul> just in case http://www.gnss-sdr.org/documentation/gnss-sdr-operation-realtek-rtl2832u-usb-dongle-dvb-t-receiver
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[22:52] Nick change: heathkid|2 -> heathkid
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[23:12] <DrLuke> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVLPXfF3l_U
[23:12] <DrLuke> holy crap
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[23:36] <KT5TK_QRL> I've written up some details about our upcoming BLT-31 launch tomorrow:
[23:36] <KT5TK_QRL> http://kt5tk.tkrahn.com/blt31.html
[23:36] <Randomskk> that reminds me
[23:36] Action: Randomskk gets on making that manual upload page
[23:36] <KT5TK_QRL> good point
[23:37] <KT5TK_QRL> Thanks very much!
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[23:47] <Lunar_Lander> hi KT5TK Randomskk
[23:47] <Randomskk> KT5TK_QRL: http://habitat.habhub.org/manual_upload/
[23:47] <Randomskk> it's basic and ugly but
[23:47] <Randomskk> it should work and be pretty easy
[23:50] <KT5TK_QRL> Randomskk: Perfect. That's all what I needed.
[23:50] <Randomskk> great
[23:51] <KT5TK_QRL> Can you check if my payload doc is properly set up? I've never done this before.
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[23:52] <Randomskk> will check. BLT-31?
[23:52] <KT5TK_QRL> Yes, call sign is KT5TK
[23:53] <Randomskk> the payload callsign is KT5TK? ok
[23:53] <Randomskk> oh of course, forgot you can transmit with your ham callsigns
[23:53] <KT5TK_QRL> yes
[23:53] <KT5TK_QRL> With 1.5 kilowatt if we want to...
[23:54] <Randomskk> I don't see it
[23:55] <Randomskk> yea, nothing starting KT is set up.
[23:55] <KT5TK_QRL> wait I'll send you a pastebin link
[23:57] <Randomskk> I've got it (the link)
[23:57] <KT5TK_QRL> http://pastebin.com/jZuvNzb8
[23:57] <Randomskk> heh yea
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[23:58] <KT5TK_QRL> A bit unusual because of PSK31
[23:58] <Randomskk> indeed
[23:58] <Randomskk> added
[23:58] <Randomskk> it's in the database now
[23:59] <KT5TK_QRL> cool tnx. I'll test it when I come home from work
[23:59] <Randomskk> np
[23:59] <Randomskk> should be a cool flight. don't think I've seen any PSK ones before now.
[23:59] hextic (~hextic@unaffiliated/hextic) left irc: Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi
[23:59] <KT5TK_QRL> BTW we're actually required to use our ham calls when we transmit on 14.07 MHz
[00:00] --- Sat Aug 18 2012