highaltitude.log.20120805

[00:10] <G0DJA> That's true as well gonzo
[00:14] <G0DJA> I find the YU7EF designs to be good http://www.yu7ef.com/
[00:16] <G0DJA> Although optimised for the 432MHz end on receive they should be OK up to 434MHz
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[00:19] <G0DJA> Or you could make or buy one designed for the Amateur TV 70cm frequencies of course
[00:19] <G0DJA> Off to bed now - GN all
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[06:44] <griffonbot> Received email: MrScienceMan "[UKHAS] Re: Launch @ 10:00 UTC+3"
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[07:34] <jcoxon> morning all
[07:39] <daveake> morning jcoxon
[07:39] <number10> morning jcoxon - did you find out what happened with WB9SA
[07:41] <jcoxon> haven't heard anything
[07:44] <Upu> morning
[07:46] <daveake> morning
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[07:49] <fsphil> not long till mars now
[07:51] <natrium42> :)
[07:52] <daveake> 1 million HAB points to the first HABber to recreate the landing sequence :)
[07:52] <Darkside> lol
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[07:53] <daveake> Come on eroomde your project awaits :)
[07:56] <fsphil> R/C car dropped from a hab
[07:56] <fsphil> with 2-way satellite comms
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[07:56] <daveake> It's the hovering-with-rockets bit that we'd all struggle with :)
[07:57] <Upu> drives itself back to the launch side ?
[07:57] <daveake> lol
[07:57] <Upu> site
[07:57] <daveake> MrScienceMan: What's the story about the lack of permission from the aviation authority?
[07:58] <daveake> Obviously different to how it works in the uk
[07:59] <nosebleedkt> fsphil, I think my pictures are overexposed to light
[08:00] <fsphil> which camera?
[08:00] <daveake> For the HAB-Curiosity rover, how about landing in Norfolk and have it look for signs of intelligent life?
[08:01] <Darkside> newport?
[08:01] <fsphil> the pictures from pie1 after landing where a bit like those first images from mars... except for the blue sky and the grass
[08:01] <daveake> lol
[08:03] <number10> having seen the picture of that warning sign you were definately in alien territor on the pi recovery
[08:04] <daveake> That was the scout one
[08:04] <daveake> Do keep up :D
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[08:06] <number10> ah yes - you launch so many daveake its difficult to match my memory with the flight name
[08:06] <daveake> :)
[08:06] <fsphil> just wait for CloudBuzzPieScout-1
[08:06] <daveake> I did a table as I started to forget them too :)
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[08:51] <MrScienceMan> daveake: they didnt recieve some letter from another
[08:52] <fsphil> that sucks
[08:52] <MrScienceMan> yeah, nothing we could do
[08:52] <MrScienceMan> even tho, the regulation says that if its a light aircraft
[08:52] <MrScienceMan> we dont need to register it at all
[08:53] <MrScienceMan> decided we'll get it sorted over the next few weeks
[08:55] <daveake> So when did you find out?
[08:55] <daveake> Here, if I'm launching at a weekend, the permission comes through on the friday
[08:56] <daveake> So I would know at least 1 day before the launch
[08:56] <MrScienceMan> we had the permission for last week
[08:56] <MrScienceMan> there were some technical issues so we postponded
[08:56] <fsphil> or indeed the weekend after the launch one
[08:57] <MrScienceMan> we had permission for this one
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[08:57] <MrScienceMan> but apperantly, they didnt recieve some letter or smth
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[08:57] <daveake> Sorry hit the wrong key
[08:58] <daveake> So you had permission for this one? Then what?
[09:03] <MrScienceMan> then nothing :)
[09:04] <daveake> Sorry I'm still confused. Here, once you get permission, you can fly (though depending on where you are you may need to call Air Traffic control just before launching)
[09:05] <daveake> So once that permission comes in there's nothing else to wait for
[09:05] <daveake> How is it there?
[09:06] <MrScienceMan> we have 3 authorities, 4 if you can military
[09:06] <MrScienceMan> but the military are all ok now
[09:07] <MrScienceMan> 1 is the air traffic control
[09:08] <MrScienceMan> but they cant give us a go, because they didnt recieve a letter from on of the other
[09:08] <daveake> ok now I get it
[09:08] <MrScienceMan> its bureacracy at best
[09:12] <fsphil> that makes our system look sensible
[09:12] <gonzo_mob> our permission is at least 3 weeks late now
[09:25] <MrScienceMan> fsphil: :)
[09:26] <MrScienceMan> i figured, nobody around here has done HABing
[09:26] <MrScienceMan> or they did it with out any permission :)
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[09:44] <fsphil> always fun being the first :)
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[10:39] <Laurenceb_> hi all
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[10:52] <samisupidupi> good morning
[10:53] <Upu> hi there
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[10:54] <samisupidupi> anyone here knows how we can use http://spacenear.us/tracker/ for our own near space experiment?
[10:54] <Upu> yeah as long as you follow the UKHAS telemetry format and prepare a payload document I'm sure that can be accomdated
[10:55] <Upu> what country are you in ?
[10:55] <samisupidupi> switzerland
[10:56] <Upu> how are you transmitting your telemetry ?
[10:57] <samisupidupi> we are just about to start planning the whole thing
[10:57] <samisupidupi> I'm just checking what possibilities there are
[10:58] <Upu> oh ok
[10:58] <Upu> well in the UK we tend to use RTTY transmitted on the license exempt frequencies @ 10mW
[10:58] <Upu> this has proven very sucessful
[10:59] <Upu> you may be able to fly APRS however I would check your local laws
[10:59] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/communication:protocol
[10:59] <samisupidupi> I think using the tracker we would have to submit data through radio transmitter
[10:59] <Upu> we can import APRS data to it
[10:59] <samisupidupi> thanks
[10:59] <Upu> but yes natively RTTY is the best option
[11:01] <samisupidupi> cool, the link above seems to be very useful
[11:03] <samisupidupi> we thought about transmitting just the final position through gsm/text message, but we fear we might land in a place with no cellphone reception
[11:03] <samisupidupi> even though i have seen several projects esp. in europe which were successful using this method
[11:04] <Upu> Thats always the issue
[11:04] <daveake> Handy as a backup on a valuable payload. Wouldn't want to rely on one.
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[11:04] <Upu> and cellphones rarely work above 2km so you won't know where it is, with radio telemetry you'll know where it is all the time
[11:05] <Upu> also with radio you open it up to the tracking network, not sure how many listeners we have near you though
[11:05] <samisupidupi> yeah i wouldn't worry about that
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[11:08] <Upu> ok walking the dog
[11:13] <samisupidupi> thanks a lot, i will read into it, maybe come back with more questions :-)
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[11:41] <costyn> nobody launching today? it's such nice weather here
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[12:06] <DrLuke> holy crap, awesome
[12:06] <DrLuke> nasa is trying to point the camera on board of MRO on curiosity while it's landing
[12:10] <eroomde> it worked for phoenix
[12:10] <eroomde> they got a picture of it under chute
[12:11] <Darkside> i'll certainly be glued to the screen tomorrow afternoon
[12:18] <costyn> hmmm 7:30 AM for me. most inconvenient, time to get up and feed the kids and go to work and stuff like that
[12:21] <costyn> that last bit with the rocket crane is just... was that really the best solution they could come up with? seems so complicated :)
[12:23] <eroomde> i'm sure they were all ears at the time!
[12:23] <eroomde> but i don;t really see any other way of doing it
[12:24] <DrLuke> costyn: yes, they can't land directly as that would kick up too much dust
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[12:56] <cuddykid> current prediction for next weekend - heading up to Upu :P clearly it's a homing PCB - going back to where it was soldered
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[13:10] <fsphil> if you're launching on sunday I could chase it cuddykid :) I'm gonna be up yonder
[13:10] <fsphil> er, saturday even
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[13:49] <costyn> DrLuke: ok, guess it makes sense. How did Viking land way back when?
[13:50] <DrLuke> I think it landed directly with rockets, but it didn't have as sensitive instruments and mechanics on board
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[13:53] <eroomde> viking was retrorockets and energy absorbing legs
[13:54] <eroomde> i don;t think kicking up dust was a massive driver
[13:55] <eroomde> there are other reasons for keeping rockets away from the ground
[13:55] <eroomde> to do with how predictable they are to control when their exhaust interacts with the ground
[13:55] <eroomde> and having fuel tanks landing on spikey rocks is game over
[13:56] <eroomde> and it's difficult to make rovers drive off of big platforms
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[14:03] <eroomde> also knowing when to turn the off is a very hard problem (false positive of landing = lost mission) so being able to keep them on constantly is a win
[14:04] <Laurenceb_> as long as they modelled rover on a cable correctly
[14:04] <eroomde> fuel slosh take 2
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[14:05] <cuddykid> fsphil, oh nice :) whereabouts are you going to be?
[14:05] <cuddykid> hopefully it'll be sat
[14:06] <eroomde> they've got the confluence point of the winch right at the centre of gravity of the skycrane at least
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[14:08] <fsphil> I'm heading to the yorkshire dales cuddykid, gonna have a look for that payload I lost there last year
[14:08] <cuddykid> fsphil: bang on where it's predicted to land atm :D
[14:10] <fsphil> plenty of time for that to change, but I'll bring the funcube dongle and an antenna just incase
[14:12] <daveake> fsphil When your payload was lost, how far off the ground was the last position?
[14:12] <eroomde> good old storm ontop of me
[14:13] <eroomde> lots of water lots of thunder
[14:13] <daveake> just thunder here so far
[14:14] <fsphil> a few km daveake, it's a fairly wide search area but mostly open fields
[14:15] <eroomde> nice to go for a god stroll with purpose right
[14:15] <eroomde> good*
[14:15] <fsphil> indeed
[14:15] <fsphil> I do need proper boots though
[14:15] <eroomde> like the opposite of golf
[14:15] <daveake> Sounds like a job for a search party
[14:15] <fsphil> lol
[14:15] <daveake> lol
[14:15] <Upu> glad I'm not the only one who thinks Golf sucks
[14:15] <daveake> Is Upu helping?
[14:16] <Upu> depends which day it is
[14:16] <fsphil> saturday
[14:16] <Upu> probably not then
[14:16] <Upu> I have a family BBQ at mother in laws
[14:17] <Upu> and I'd like to cover the launches
[14:17] <fsphil> I've an early boat to catch sunday so can't stay longer
[14:17] <daveake> I need to get some proper boots
[14:17] <Upu> I have boots :)
[14:17] <daveake> I wrote off the last semi-proper boots in Oxfordshire recently ... D:
[14:17] <daveake> :D
[14:17] <Upu> well
[14:17] <Upu> I had a waterproof jacket and hiking boots in the car but sensibly I'd decided to call it off :/
[14:17] <daveake> lol
[14:18] <daveake> These got left wet
[14:18] <daveake> And a colony of smelly bugs took over
[14:18] <fsphil> eek
[14:19] <Upu> ah yes you'll need some new ones
[14:19] <daveake> yep
[14:19] <Upu> still free payload
[14:19] <daveake> Tried to kill 'em off
[14:20] <daveake> Didn't 100% work
[14:20] <daveake> Yeah, free payload :D
[14:20] <Upu> just hacking this power saving code back together
[14:20] <eroomde> do peeps have curiosity landing plans?
[14:20] <Upu> yep
[14:20] <daveake> yep
[14:21] <Upu> I'm meeting you here about 5.45am tomorrow Ed
[14:21] <eroomde> lol
[14:21] <eroomde> cool
[14:21] <eroomde> i'll be at work
[14:22] <eroomde> with bacon
[14:23] <Darkside> i'll be in the uni workshop most likely
[14:23] <Darkside> watching with a bunch of other people
[14:23] <fsphil> I'll be awake but zombie like
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[14:28] <eroomde> i hopefully won't be zombie
[14:28] <eroomde> i was gonna have a nice big pub dinner earlyish and then head to work and overnight
[14:28] <eroomde> can really bash some gps
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[14:32] <Laurenceb_> what you doing with gps?
[14:33] <Darkside> http://i.imgur.com/SquAz.jpg
[14:33] <Darkside> that should do for a small poster :-)
[14:33] <Laurenceb_> nano gps on each water molecule for antifrost?
[14:34] <fsphil> Darkside, shiny!
[14:40] <joph> Darkside, 45x30cm is available for 1¬ ;)
[14:45] <DrLuke> bautiful
[14:45] <DrLuke> beautiful*
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[14:51] <MrScienceMan> fsphil: hey
[14:51] <fsphil> howdy MrScienceMan
[14:52] <MrScienceMan> i found the problem with my build
[14:52] <MrScienceMan> SoftwareSerial is hooking up timer2
[14:52] <fsphil> ah ha
[14:52] <MrScienceMan> and its messing up my transmissions
[14:52] <fsphil> software serial is quite a drain on interrupts
[14:53] <MrScienceMan> there is no way to pause it
[14:53] <MrScienceMan> ?
[14:53] <fsphil> I'm not familiar with the code, but there must be
[14:54] <MrScienceMan> couldnt find anythnig
[14:54] <fsphil> what timer is the aprs modem running from?
[14:54] <MrScienceMan> timer2
[14:54] <fsphil> ah
[14:54] <MrScienceMan> im sure now, that i tested it
[14:55] <fsphil> software serial has caused many people here pain
[14:56] <MrScienceMan> cant even handle 9600 baud
[14:57] <eroomde> you can quickly bump up against the stops in arduino-land
[14:58] <daveake> yep
[14:58] <MrScienceMan> arduino land?
[14:58] <fsphil> last time I looked at software serial there was no way to disable it, but that might have changed since then
[14:58] <MrScienceMan> is it a magical place
[14:58] <MrScienceMan> for where all the arduinos go ?
[14:58] <eroomde> a magical place yes
[14:58] <MrScienceMan> imaginary i suspect
[14:58] <eroomde> where plugging in a servo is as simple as servo(pin, pulsewidth)
[14:59] <eroomde> with no hint that you've not got a a bunch of timer sna dinterrupts hooked up which will collide with other functions like softserial trying to do the same thing
[14:59] <eroomde> it's all just unicorns and pixies
[14:59] <daveake> not good for your elf
[14:59] <eroomde> until you walk towards the horizon and see it's actually a pianted landscape on the wall of a small set
[14:59] <MrScienceMan> sounds boring
[14:59] <eroomde> metaphor is being strangled here
[14:59] <fsphil> Game of Interrupts
[15:00] <MrScienceMan> lmao
[15:00] <eroomde> if you want to get this soft serial to work with everything else, you'll have to do it properly yourself
[15:00] <eroomde> pay the register price
[15:00] <eroomde> not the library price
[15:01] <eroomde> right ok must actually do something now
[15:01] <eroomde> ttfn
[15:01] <daveake> I used it for a GSM connection. But for Tx only you might as well bit-bang yourself inside an existing timer routine
[15:02] <MrScienceMan> i can always hook the gps to tx/rx
[15:09] <kristianpaul> What's a tolerable _fast_ Ascent Rate for a 500g payload and 1000g balloon?
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[15:09] <kristianpaul> I mean this is something is caculate after the build or i guess can be anticipated and fixed?
[15:10] Action: kristianpaul Using the Burst Calculator
[15:11] <daveake> There's diminishing returns as you add gas to get a higher rate
[15:11] <daveake> The balloon gets bigger and presents more resistance
[15:11] <daveake> Why do you need fast?
[15:12] <kristianpaul> well, trusting simulation if i have a 10m/s or more i have better change not sending my balloon to pacific ocean :)
[15:13] <daveake> Good luck with getting 10m/s
[15:13] <Upu> whats the emoticon for raised eye brows
[15:13] <daveake> Anyway play with the calc
[15:13] <Upu> 8m/s is about the max realistically
[15:13] <kristianpaul> yeah, playing right now
[15:13] <fsphil> you might be cheaper investing in a cut-down system
[15:13] <fsphil> all that helium will be expensive
[15:13] <kristianpaul> hmm
[15:14] <kristianpaul> but still, i cant cut down over the 4Km high mountain formations...
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[15:15] <kristianpaul> i just have like 20km of valley until hit mountains..
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[15:15] <fsphil> if you need that much control, you best not rely on the burst altitude of the balloon
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[15:16] <kristianpaul> u have more information about this cut-down trigger?
[15:17] <fsphil> I don't but others might. it's a fairly broad area
[15:17] <kristianpaul> can imagine :)
[15:18] <daveake> Unlike the launch country by the sound of it
[15:18] <kristianpaul> haha
[15:18] <kristianpaul> 3.7573 -76.2395
[15:18] <kristianpaul> we just want to get fun a weekedn with some friends
[15:19] <fsphil> that's loads of space!
[15:19] <kristianpaul> where??!! :)
[15:19] <kristianpaul> try run simulations..
[15:20] <Upu> keep running them
[15:20] <kristianpaul> my altitude is 990m btw
[15:20] <Upu> weather will cnage
[15:20] <Upu> lol nice
[15:20] <kristianpaul> ...
[15:20] <fsphil> recovery could be an issue
[15:20] <fsphil> those are big hills!
[15:20] <kristianpaul> i said it..
[15:20] <kristianpaul> well
[15:20] <kristianpaul> can this simulation be automated
[15:21] <Upu> yes
[15:21] <kristianpaul> so you can get 12hr warning of a better probable launch time !
[15:21] <Upu> http://hourly.upuaut.nt
[15:21] <Upu> http://hourly.upuaut.net
[15:21] <MrScienceMan> fsphil: there seems to be a end() method to softserial
[15:21] <MrScienceMan> which removes the interrupt
[15:21] <fsphil> win!
[15:21] <fsphil> does it work?
[15:21] <MrScienceMan> will test in a minute
[15:22] <Upu> one thing is sure you're going to get some epic pictures
[15:22] <Upu> kristianpaul I'll set up the hourly predictor for your location
[15:22] <Upu> you can keep an eye on it over the next week or so
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[15:22] <kristianpaul> Thanks !
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[15:23] <Upu> ok its running check that website again in 30-35 mins
[15:24] <kristianpaul> k
[15:25] <DrLuke> wait, is that a semi-permanent balloon?
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[15:29] Action: Laurenceb_ has been palying with http://www.dowcorning.com/applications/search/default.aspx?R=539EN
[15:30] <Laurenceb_> sticks to everything accept PTFE - might be perfect for superpressure
[15:32] <Laurenceb_> youd still need a lot of precision cut mylar to do it properly tho
[15:33] <Laurenceb_> 3M 91022 is equivalent
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[15:45] Nick change: ms7821_ -> ms7821
[15:53] <craag> Anyone know how to get the HTML5 stream of NasaTV on android?
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[16:09] <Burninate> Is ripstop nylon the standard for chutes, or are there better, lighter materials?
[16:12] <eroomde> Burninate: it's the standard
[16:12] <eroomde> even for landing on mars or titan
[16:13] <eroomde> but, 'better, ligher' is highly ambiguous
[16:13] <eroomde> if you specifically need lighter, there are ;robably lighter things
[16:14] <eroomde> better can mean anything as a function of your design constraints
[16:16] <Burninate> what weight is typically used?
[16:16] <Burninate> It looks like 1-2oz/yard is strong enough to hold a human being as a hammock
[16:16] <Burninate> but that's what I see at the parachute stores as well
[16:20] <eroomde> in hab, there is very little science applied
[16:20] <eroomde> whatever is available, typically things sold by rocket shops for model rockets
[16:20] <eroomde> but of course that's usually over-engineered because the forces in a hab are tiny
[16:20] <eroomde> with pre deployed chutes there is no large deployment shock
[16:21] <eroomde> so tissue paper would probably work
[16:21] <Burninate> good to know, thanks
[16:21] <eroomde> soi can;t answer your question as to what is typically used other than whatever people find. of the 'named' brands, people sometimes use spherachutes for their hab parachutes
[16:24] <eroomde> aeroconn systems also sell chutes
[16:25] <eroomde> their are some joys among their range but it's all military surplus and so rather pot luck
[16:25] <eroomde> there*
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[16:26] <eroomde> but they are often designed a bit better than the hobby rocketry ones. the problems with parachutes is that it's very easy to design something that looks like a aprachute and provides drag, but it's difficult to design a good parachute
[16:26] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[16:28] <eroomde> hello Lunar_Lander
[16:28] <Lunar_Lander> hi
[16:28] <Lunar_Lander> do you happen to know what "tfido" means in linux?
[16:29] <eroomde> no
[16:29] <eroomde> nor in english
[16:29] <Lunar_Lander> ok
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[17:00] <Laurenceb_> https://maps.google.com/?ll=28.588589,-80.652449&spn=0.610161,1.056747&t=m&layer=c&panoid=tgD6X6agbHvDNHOYebi-Ug&cbp=12,121.84,,0,9.18&z=11&cbll=28.588589,-80.652449
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[17:20] <MrScienceMan> fsphil: got the code working fairly well now
[17:21] <MrScienceMan> spotted that the main code is actually not pausing while the radio is TXing
[17:22] <MrScienceMan> removed some calculation of in the code that could be static
[17:22] <MrScienceMan> rearranged a few parts
[17:22] <MrScienceMan> and it works like charm
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[17:31] <fsphil> nice
[17:41] <MrScienceMan> could've fixed it on flight day
[17:41] <MrScienceMan> but didnt notice it in all the fuss
[17:41] <MrScienceMan> ;\
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[17:49] <Lunar_Lander> hi MrScienceMan
[17:49] <Lunar_Lander> you flew?
[17:49] <MrScienceMan> no
[17:49] <MrScienceMan> we didnt get clear from the air control people
[17:50] <MrScienceMan> we are rescheduling for end of august
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[17:51] <MrScienceMan> GPS cant get lock from the window
[17:51] <MrScienceMan> just 4 sats
[17:51] <MrScienceMan> apperantly is not enough
[17:51] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[17:51] <Lunar_Lander> what's your flight computer?
[17:54] <MrScienceMan> arduino/hx1/ublox6
[17:54] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[17:54] <Lunar_Lander> sensors?
[17:55] <Lunar_Lander> and you are not from England right?
[17:55] <Lunar_Lander> as you got the HX1
[17:55] <MrScienceMan> yeh
[17:55] <MrScienceMan> just a ST160 for temperature
[17:56] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[17:56] <MrScienceMan> might add a BMP085 for presure
[17:56] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[17:56] <Lunar_Lander> where are you from?
[17:57] <MrScienceMan> bulgaria
[17:57] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[18:01] <MrScienceMan> got few packets decoded by the a statnio 68km out
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[18:02] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[18:02] <Lunar_Lander> are you the first HAB in Bulgaria?
[18:02] <MrScienceMan> seems like it
[18:04] simrun (~simrun@gateway/shell/freebnc/x-uxikhrjpcwkhtjfw) got netsplit.
[18:04] weissbier (pIZEu4QTSw@2001:470:7a5e::) got netsplit.
[18:04] fergusnoble (fergusnobl@repl.esden.net) got netsplit.
[18:04] KingJ (~kj@2001:41d0:8:408b::1) got netsplit.
[18:04] staylo (~staylo@unaffiliated/staylo) got netsplit.
[18:05] <Lunar_Lander> cool
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[18:05] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, you also got a Canon PowerShot A490?
[18:06] <Lunar_Lander> I got a question
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[18:06] <Lunar_Lander> I just wanted to turn it on and then the focus part got stuck in the middle and the "Canon" screen came up and then it went dark
[18:06] <Lunar_Lander> and I tried the power button several times again and only got a slight motor sound
[18:07] <Lunar_Lander> then I took the energizer lithiums out and put new batteries in and it turned on fully
[18:07] <Lunar_Lander> did you experience that too?
[18:07] <Lunar_Lander> when it doesn't have enough power it normally turns on fully and then shuts down
[18:08] <Lunar_Lander> the two energizers have 1.3V according to that battery test we have
[18:08] <fsphil> things often don't work when you use drained batteries :p
[18:09] <daveake> indeed
[18:10] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[18:12] <Lunar_Lander> only 11 more hours till Curiosity
[18:12] <MrScienceMan> will there be live feed?
[18:12] <Lunar_Lander> yeah I think so
[18:12] <Lunar_Lander> the NASA presskit said so
[18:13] <MrScienceMan> can they get live feed from mars?
[18:13] <Lunar_Lander> ah I don't think so
[18:13] <Lunar_Lander> i.e. the descent camera photos will be transmitted the days after landing
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[18:28] <craag> Their telemetry will be 19 minutes behind, but I'm guessing they'll say on NasaTV as soon as they have indications of a successful landing.
[18:28] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[18:29] <Lunar_Lander> I think the countdown on the NASA site is adjusted for the first signal from Mars
[18:29] <craag> Ah ok.
[18:30] <fsphil> yea all times are for earth-rx time
[18:30] Nick change: M0JSN -> jonsowman
[18:30] <craag> Makes sense.
[18:31] Merv (52453c6d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.69.60.109) joined #highaltitude.
[18:32] <Lunar_Lander> balloon landings are important
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[18:36] <Laurenceb_> now theres a thought
[18:36] <Merv> Hi upu Merv 2E0WVE here. I am working with Peter Browne on the HAM-1 project. Peter forwarded me your email re the payload you loaded for us and I understand there is a problem?
[18:37] <Laurenceb_> landing on mars with a humongous balloon
[18:37] <Upu> hi Merv
[18:37] <Upu> $$HAM-1,319,092930.00,+5102.7866,-00003.6257,00082,*5651
[18:37] <Upu> [11:03] <DanielRichman> are they on IRC or did they email you?
[18:37] <Merv> Hi Anthony
[18:37] <Lunar_Lander> hi Upu
[18:37] <Upu> basically need to drop the .00 in the time field and lose the final comma
[18:37] <Upu> hi lunar
[18:37] <Upu> normally time is 09:29:30
[18:37] <Lunar_Lander> how are you today?
[18:38] <Upu> but that format is fine if you drop the .00 at the end
[18:38] <Upu> and drop that final comma
[18:38] <Upu> if you do that it should work
[18:38] <Merv> Ok no pfroblem will do
[18:38] <Upu> And finally can I suggest you post a mail to the list advise when you intend to launch and what frequency you intend to use
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[18:39] <Upu> best to "claim" the frequency in advance so people can work around it
[18:39] <Upu> fine Lunar_Lander thx :)
[18:39] <Upu> ok afk a few
[18:39] <Lunar_Lander> that is good to hear
[18:39] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[18:39] <Lunar_Lander> hi Merv
[18:40] <Merv> Ok noted. As a matter of interest can I upload the payload myself ?
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[18:41] <Merv> Hi lunar lander
[18:41] <daveake> Merv Not yet but I believe the guys that work on that stuff will have it ready RSN :)
[18:42] <Lunar_Lander> Merv, what's your payload computer?
[18:44] <Merv> Arduino
[18:44] <Merv> Hi Kevin
[18:45] <Merv> With a Larsen Iq gps
[18:46] <Merv> Larsen iq
[18:46] <Merv> Lessen iq
[18:46] <jonsowman> try Lassen
[18:46] <nigelvh> I believe you're looking for "Lassen IQ"
[18:47] <jonsowman> :)
[18:47] <Merv> Yes flaming iPad
[18:47] <jonsowman> haha
[18:48] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[18:48] <Lunar_Lander> Merv, where do you know my name?
[18:48] <daveake> Everyone knows your name. Your fame spreads wide :)
[18:48] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[18:50] <Lunar_Lander> Merv, ah ok
[18:56] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, why am I a star now?
[18:57] <nigelvh> It was in all the papers. Didn't you see?
[18:57] <Lunar_Lander> no
[18:58] <nigelvh> Ah, it was a big article about that thing you did. Man they sure had an opinion on you.
[18:58] <Lunar_Lander> what thing?
[18:58] <nigelvh> You know. That one thing you did recently.
[18:59] <Lunar_Lander> I haven't even launched
[18:59] <nigelvh> Seriously just go look it up. I don't want to spoil the article for you.
[19:00] <costyn> I was amazed and delighted
[19:01] <nigelvh> daveake what were your opinions on the article?
[19:01] <daveake> Never seen anything like it
[19:01] <daveake> He's an enigma
[19:02] <nigelvh> I have to agree, I thought it was very well written.
[19:03] <Lunar_Lander> OK people I am sweating like shit
[19:03] <Lunar_Lander> what is that all about?
[19:03] <nigelvh> It's not that hard to find. Just google it.
[19:04] <nigelvh> costyn, what do you think the best keywords would be to find it?
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[19:10] <Lunar_Lander> nigelvh, what happened.
[19:11] <Lunar_Lander> I already figured that this was a joke
[19:12] <costyn> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dI6mPDCqEo
[19:12] <Laurenceb_> can anyone help me fix firefox?
[19:12] <Laurenceb_> its not connecting to www
[19:12] <costyn> no
[19:12] <costyn> :P
[19:13] <Laurenceb_> "server cannot be found"
[19:13] <Lunar_Lander> costyn, ROFL
[19:13] <costyn> Laurenceb_: sounds like DNS issue
[19:13] <Laurenceb_> was working fine until wifi went down 10 minutes ago
[19:13] <costyn> Laurenceb_: does the address resolve on the command line?
[19:13] <Laurenceb_> yes
[19:13] <Laurenceb_> i can ping stuff
[19:13] <costyn> ok, I guess you tried restarting firefucks?
[19:13] <Laurenceb_> yes
[19:13] <Laurenceb_> same issue
[19:14] <costyn> what about telnet www.youraddress.com 80 ?
[19:14] <costyn> (on cmdline)
[19:14] <costyn> or are no websites at all working?
[19:15] <costyn> which OS?
[19:15] <Laurenceb_> ubuntu
[19:15] <Laurenceb_> hmm cants ping my work pc
[19:15] <costyn> so is it all websites or just one?
[19:15] <Laurenceb_> all websites
[19:16] <Laurenceb_> i can ping www.google.com for example
[19:16] <Laurenceb_> 64 bytes from we-in-f105.1e100.net (173.194.66.105): icmp_seq=1 ttl=44 time=28.2 ms
[19:16] <nigelvh> Did proxy somehow get turned on in firefox?
[19:16] Action: Laurenceb_ checks
[19:16] <costyn> sounds plausible
[19:17] <Laurenceb_> no proxy
[19:17] <costyn> Laurenceb_: did google.com resolve to we-in-f105.1e100.net ?
[19:17] <Laurenceb_> yes
[19:17] <Laurenceb_> ^above
[19:17] <costyn> WTF
[19:17] <costyn> oh wait
[19:17] <russss> 1*10^100 is a googol
[19:17] <costyn> the whois on the ip checks out
[19:18] <nigelvh> Yeah.
[19:18] <russss> 1e100.net is google's networking domain
[19:18] <costyn> looked a bit shady for a bit
[19:18] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[19:18] <costyn> Today I Learned...
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[19:18] <Laurenceb_> heh
[19:18] <Laurenceb_> hmm this is very odd
[19:18] <costyn> Laurenceb_: I dunno dude. maybe try this ? http://www.ubuntugeek.com/howto-clearflush-dns-cache-in-ubuntu.html
[19:18] <nigelvh> Do you have anything like lynx installed?
[19:19] <nigelvh> I don't think it's DNS if he's resolving google.com
[19:19] <Laurenceb_> cant read that :P
[19:20] <costyn> Laurenceb_: derp, sorry :)
[19:20] <nigelvh> Do you have something like lynx installed?
[19:20] <costyn> Laurenceb_: what nigelvh says
[19:21] <nigelvh> Or try sudo apt-get update
[19:21] <nigelvh> If that works then you know the internet and DNS are working.
[19:21] <Laurenceb_> hmm odd
[19:21] <nigelvh> If that works, then you can reinstall firefox.
[19:21] <Laurenceb_> 0% [Connecting to gb.archive.ubuntu.com (91.189.92.179)]
[19:22] <Laurenceb_> maybe i need to reboot my router
[19:22] <nigelvh> That's also entirely plausible.
[19:22] <Laurenceb_> ill try that
[19:22] <Laurenceb_> brb
[19:22] <nigelvh> Is it a linksys?
[19:22] <costyn> can't hurt
[19:22] <costyn> he's gone (and lost forever)
[19:22] <nigelvh> Bum bumm BUUUMM!!
[19:23] <Lunar_Lander> XD
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[19:24] <nigelvh> Welcome back Lunar.
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[19:25] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[19:26] <Laurenceb__> fixed
[19:26] <Lunar_Lander> I just discovered that my Canon has a built-in feature to remove red eyes on photos
[19:26] <nigelvh> Enjoy that bit on the article costyn sent you?
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[19:28] Nick change: Laurenceb__ -> Laurenceb_
[19:28] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[19:28] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[19:28] <nigelvh> Good
[19:29] <nigelvh> I have to give daveake and costyn some big credit for working with me in stride.
[19:29] <nigelvh> Anyway, cool on the red eye business on your camera.
[19:30] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[19:30] <Lunar_Lander> XD
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[19:33] <upix> good evening
[19:33] <nigelvh> Evening
[19:33] <nigelvh> Laurenceb_ are things sorted?
[19:33] <Laurenceb_> yeah thanks
[19:33] <Laurenceb_> router issue
[19:34] <nigelvh> Is it a linksys?
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[19:35] <Lunar_Lander> hi upix how are you?
[19:36] <Laurenceb_> no bt thingy
[19:36] <nigelvh> Hmm.
[19:36] <upix> Hey Lunar_Lander, two teeth less, but good in general :)
[19:37] <nigelvh> I've experienced that some of the older linksys routers get "hung" if there's any power fluctuations. Maybe the BT one got upset over something.
[19:37] cuddykid (~acudworth@host-78-145-193-219.as13285.net) joined #highaltitude.
[19:38] <Lunar_Lander> oh why is that upix ?
[19:40] <upix> One was growing 90 degrees off
[19:40] <nigelvh> That sounds less than fun.
[19:41] <upix> the other came as 2 in 1 package
[19:41] <Lunar_Lander> ohhh
[19:42] SamSilver_ (2985f5c8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.41.133.245.200) joined #highaltitude.
[19:45] <Lunar_Lander> hi SamSilver_
[19:45] <SamSilver_> Hi LL
[19:46] <SamSilver_> how is sep 9 looking for launch?
[19:48] <SamSilver_> my launch date was planned for May but $ probs and wrong parts ordered has pushed the date back
[19:49] <SamSilver_> my 2000g How-woowoo long life lubber is sitting and waiting in a dark draw
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[19:51] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[19:52] <Lunar_Lander> what's your flight computer?
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[19:54] <SamSilver_> evening dave
[19:56] <daveake> ditto ditto
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[19:59] <Lunar_Lander> SamSilver_
[19:59] <Lunar_Lander> what's your flight computer?
[20:00] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, I had some fun with the thing about the newspaper article
[20:00] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[20:38] <nigelvh> mmm, lunch of champions. Leftover taco meat, cheese, and hot sause mixed together on a plate.
[20:38] Action: fsphil is having cornflakes
[20:38] <fsphil> nice and soggy
[20:38] <eroomde> what is 'taco' meat - do I even want to know? some kind of bush animal?
[20:39] <nigelvh> Ground beef with taco seasonings.
[20:40] <nigelvh> It's like a cereal fsphil. Just with meat and cheese.
[20:40] <eroomde> ah nice
[20:40] <fsphil> I'd eat that
[20:40] <eroomde> looking at what constitutes taco herbs
[20:40] <eroomde> like bbq sauce
[20:41] <nigelvh> http://www.mccormick.com/products/seasoning-mixes/mexican/taco-seasoning-mix.aspx
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> yay
[20:41] <nigelvh> It's delicious.
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> what a contrast!
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> tomorrow: http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=596d906547e74d3889914bcf9ffb6d3d4a57536d
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> tuesday: http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=a6e378655f2042870b52b7f1ba9ea6954efeda86
[20:44] <jcoxon> whos paylaod is Picotex?
[20:45] DrLuke (~Im@p5481D7D3.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #highaltitude.
[20:45] <Lunar_Lander> is it in Bulgaria?
[20:46] <jcoxon> nope
[20:47] <mattbrejza> mine
[20:47] <mattbrejza> remove if wanted jcoxon
[20:47] <jcoxon> oh i was just interested
[20:47] <jcoxon> i was wondering if 'tex' was heptex?
[20:47] <mattbrejza> oh ok, plan was to use a 100g totex
[20:47] <jcoxon> oh i see
[20:48] <jcoxon> cool
[20:48] <mattbrejza> the payload is about 11g, single AAA cell, fits in the neck
[20:48] <jcoxon> oh yeah i saw pics
[20:48] <jcoxon> cool
[20:49] <jcoxon> launch soon?
[20:49] <mattbrejza> be nice to fly it, but i dont have the time to finish it off
[20:49] <mattbrejza> a few little things still to do
[20:50] <mattbrejza> it puts out 7.5dBm, should still be good, people run their rfm22bs on lower power?
[20:50] <jcoxon> people have done it
[20:50] <jcoxon> the issues with rfm22b is that sometimes the under output
[20:50] <jcoxon> so i've been running them at 11dbm
[20:50] <eroomde> it's about like not wearing any trousers and underwear
[20:50] <eroomde> it's possible
[20:50] <eroomde> but why?
[20:51] <mattbrejza> well it runs on 1.8V so that might be reducing it slightly
[20:51] <jonsowman> good analogy eroomde
[20:51] <mattbrejza> i know it puts out 7.5dBm though (measured)
[20:51] <eroomde> yeah i try
[20:51] <eroomde> mattbrejza: have you spectrally analysed the output as you take the voltage down?
[20:51] <mattbrejza> equally a slightly crappy indcutor might be sucking up the powre
[20:51] <eroomde> i wonder if the rails start dropping it might be boming up against diode drops and being distorted
[20:52] <eroomde> bumping*
[20:52] <mattbrejza> ive been meaning to vary the voltage and measure the output power
[20:52] <eroomde> if it's designed to work at 1.8V then of course it's probably fine
[20:52] <mattbrejza> had to look away for 9.6s there
[20:52] <mattbrejza> well its designed to work from 1.8V but the datasheet doesnt specify the power at 1.8V, just 2V
[20:53] <jcoxon> indeed
[20:53] <jcoxon> mattbrejza, well the DL system will help
[20:53] <mattbrejza> 7.5dBm should still be fine if people run at 8dBm
[20:53] <jcoxon> may not break a distance record
[20:53] <jcoxon> though ensure a good antenna
[20:54] <mattbrejza> well less so if we launch b4 the airport opens but we'll be chasing
[20:54] <mattbrejza> yea about the antenna...
[20:54] <mattbrejza> its gonna have to be a dipole
[20:54] <mattbrejza> because its in the neck
[20:54] <nigelvh> A coaxial dipole does pretty well. I've flown those.
[20:55] <mattbrejza> i might be able to be really checky and put in an anechoic chamber
[20:55] <mattbrejza> tht does depend on me finishing it
[20:55] <Lunar_Lander> Bolt won the sprint
[20:56] <mattbrejza> omg Lunar_Lander you spoilt it !!!
[20:56] <mattbrejza> na was watching
[20:57] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[20:59] <Lunar_Lander> oh Camera Segway
[20:59] <mattbrejza> if you pay attention theyre waving 3D cameras around
[20:59] <Lunar_Lander> 3D?
[20:59] <nigelvh> More accurately 4D
[20:59] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[21:03] <Lunar_Lander> xD they already updated his Wikipedia entry
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[21:30] <Lunar_Lander> 8 hours until Curiosity
[21:31] <Upu> http://eyes.nasa.gov/launch2.html?document=$SERVERURL/content/documents/msl/edl.xml
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[21:32] <jcoxon> this is dougs baby
[21:33] <fsphil> I no java :(
[21:35] <Upu> no flash
[21:35] <Upu> no java
[21:36] <Upu> you me be secure but you can't access 68.5% of the web content
[21:36] <Upu> may
[21:36] <fsphil> oh I have flash, that didn't last long
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[21:36] <fsphil> not sure where java's gone
[21:36] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[21:36] <Upu> of all the things done in Java
[21:36] <Upu> its one of the better ones
[21:36] <fsphil> I know.. not sure why it's not loading
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[21:38] <Upu> its on you have 7 hours to fix it
[21:39] <Upu> ok
[21:39] <Upu> damn my typing
[21:40] <daveake> Whatever happens, it won't land in a tree
[21:40] <fsphil> that would be quite something if it did
[21:41] <daveake> though what a result if it did
[21:41] <fsphil> or a sea
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[21:41] <Upu> I think if either of those happened the scientists would be more than interested
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[21:41] <Upu> this time landing in a tree would be considered a total success
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[21:42] <Upu> just think daveake you're doing it right, just on the wrong orbital body
[21:42] <fsphil> not sure even your yagi could track it to mars
[21:42] <fsphil> ooh did you get that going?
[21:42] <Upu> couldn't at the moment the PL259 fell off
[21:42] <fsphil> ah
[21:42] <Upu> No I've lost my spade connectors
[21:43] <Upu> so I haven't wired the rotator up yet
[21:43] <Upu> I think they must be at work
[21:44] <fsphil> well that page is still loading, not complaining about not having java anymore
[21:44] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[21:46] <fsphil> and there goes the browser
[21:47] <Lunar_Lander> does anybody know if eurosport has been forbidden to show the olympics live?
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[21:49] <fsphil> you're not allowed to talk about this, freenode is not the official irc network of the olympics
[21:51] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[21:51] <Lunar_Lander> (is that a joke or true?
[21:52] <daveake> It's true
[21:52] <daveake> It was in that same newspaper we discussed earlier.
[21:52] <Lunar_Lander> ohhhhh
[21:52] <Lunar_Lander> XD
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[21:55] <DrLuke> Just bought my first NTX2 module ever =)
[21:56] <Upu> did you get it from me ?
[21:56] <mattbrejza> we all remember our first...
[21:56] <DrLuke> yep
[21:56] <Upu> good man :)
[21:56] <DrLuke> :P
[21:56] <DrLuke> Do you ship with candy?
[21:57] <DrLuke> many german shops put candy in the package
[21:57] <Upu> no
[21:57] <DrLuke> aww
[21:57] <Upu> I tend to forego sweets and just keep them cheap
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> DrLuke, you mean like lipoly.de ? :)
[21:58] <Upu> anyway nn
[21:58] <DrLuke> exactly!
[21:58] <DrLuke> night
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> gn8 Upu
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> DrLuke, yeah :)
[22:01] <DrLuke> also every second german ebay shop
[22:01] <DrLuke> but it seems like only german shops do that
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[22:01] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[22:19] <fsphil> each of these rovers seem to get larger and more complicated. I wonder what the next one will be like
[22:25] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[22:26] <Lunar_Lander> when this is the size of a small road car
[22:26] <Lunar_Lander> a van maybe
[22:26] <DrLuke> alright
[22:26] <DrLuke> I've set my alarm to 6:30 AM
[22:26] <eroomde> i'm not sure money will stretch to it for a while
[22:26] <DrLuke> 1 hour before the landing
[22:26] <DrLuke> it better be good
[22:27] <DrLuke> good night everyone!
[22:27] <eroomde> i image sample return must be ready to pop off the stack soon
[22:27] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:27] <Lunar_Lander> good night DrLuke
[22:27] <eroomde> DrLuke: where are u?
[22:27] <Lunar_Lander> eroomde, yeah the Landing Press Kit said that in the next years, sample return is a top priority
[22:27] <DrLuke> germany
[22:27] <eroomde> ah right fine
[22:27] <eroomde> just checking
[22:27] <eroomde> so u dont miss it :)
[22:27] <DrLuke> here's a timer: http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/msl/index.html
[22:28] <eroomde> ta
[22:29] <eroomde> sample return would be a real feat
[22:30] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[22:30] <Lunar_Lander> I think there is another orbiter due first next year
[22:30] <fsphil> mars, difficult to land on and difficult to take of from
[22:30] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:32] <eroomde> hmm
[22:32] <eroomde> well the things that make it hard to land on work in your favour for taking off from
[22:32] <eroomde> gravity, drag
[22:33] <fsphil> there is enough gravity to need a big rocket if they're gonna return anything more than dust
[22:35] <eroomde> indeed but drag will make a huge difference
[22:35] <eroomde> especially at the samm end of the cube square law
[22:35] <eroomde> small*
[22:35] <eroomde> where a sample return rocket would be
[22:37] <fsphil> shame the russian phobos mission failed
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[22:39] <eroomde> sucks bigtime
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[22:42] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:42] <Lunar_Lander> also it was to be the technological base for several new probes
[22:42] <Lunar_Lander> a new Venus flight, Russia's first Mercury probe, a return to the Moon
[22:42] <Lunar_Lander> also mars-grunt was planned
[22:43] <Lunar_Lander> basically sample return
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[00:00] --- Mon Aug 6 2012