highaltitude.log.20120804

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[02:13] <DrLuke> does anybody know how much lift I could expect from a party balloon filled with hydrogen?
[02:23] <Darkside> not much
[02:23] <Darkside> maybe 10-20g?
[02:23] <Darkside> the 30" diameter silver balloons have something like 30g lift
[02:38] <DrLuke> oh
[02:38] <DrLuke> so I need quite a few of them
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[02:52] <griffonbot> Received email: MrScienceMan "[UKHAS] Launch @ 10:00 UTC+3"
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[08:47] <griffonbot> Received email: James Coxon "Re: [UKHAS] Launch @ 10:00 UTC+3"
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[08:59] <jcoxon> morning all
[09:23] <Upu> morning
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[09:26] <fsphil> morn!
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[09:29] <jcoxon> so we should have a flight in bulgaria today
[09:30] <jcoxon> though they are a little lae
[09:30] <jcoxon> late*
[09:30] <jcoxon> and then a US flight as well
[09:30] <jcoxon> so all go today
[09:31] <fsphil> the us one is pretty early
[09:32] <fsphil> for them anyway
[09:32] <jcoxon> yeah
[09:32] <jcoxon> i hope it works
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[09:37] <gonzo_mob> what's the predicted path of the US one?
[09:37] <gonzo_mob> is it likely to be coming this way?
[09:38] <jcoxon> i think its a standard flight
[09:38] <jcoxon> not a floater
[09:38] <gonzo_mob> rgr
[09:39] <jcoxon> though they should do it one day
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[10:29] <fsphil> 434.650 is so much quieter here than .075
[10:30] <eroomde> historically in cam too
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[12:01] <Laurenceb_> saturday the 5th?!
[12:01] <Laurenceb_> lulwut
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[12:07] <nosebleedkt> hi all
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[12:47] <nosebleedkt> why I get DC all the time?
[12:47] <nosebleedkt> its tiring
[12:48] <costyn> nosebleedkt: DC?
[12:48] <costyn> hm... nothing happening in bulgaria yet I see
[12:51] <nosebleedkt> my modem had an IRC enabled option
[12:51] <nosebleedkt> ALG
[12:51] <nosebleedkt> i disabled it
[12:52] <costyn> Application Level Gateway
[12:53] <costyn> checks for suspicous traffic
[12:53] <costyn> and with DC you meant disconnected :)
[12:54] <costyn> anyways, gotta go do some more cleaning up of the garden shed
[12:54] <costyn> afk
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[13:28] <SP9UOB> Hi all
[13:29] <SP9UOB> any news about WB9SA's launch ?
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[13:31] <jcoxon> SP9UOB, the first flight is up (the repeater payload)
[13:31] <jcoxon> the second (with the 28mhz beacon is still on the ground
[13:31] <SP9UOB> and the 10m beacon?
[13:31] <SP9UOB> jcoxon: ok, thanks
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[13:33] <SP9UOB> jcoxon: I did some experiments with 10m from the HAB's: http://aprs.fi/#!mt=roadmap&z=11&ts=1339200000&te=1339286400&call=a%2FSP9UOB-11
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[13:47] <jcoxon> SP9UOB, yes i remember
[13:47] <jcoxon> did you recover?
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[14:09] <SP9UOB> jcoxon: no
[14:11] <SP9UOB> but i wasnt plan to recover
[14:18] <DrLuke> I wonder if there's anything like the UKHAS in germany
[14:18] <fsphil> no word on Bills launch?
[14:21] <jcoxon> DrLuke, there are growing interest in germany
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[14:21] <jcoxon> ukhas is very inclusive
[14:22] <jcoxon> fsphil, few emails bouncing around
[14:22] <jcoxon> no one is hearing anything on 10m
[14:22] <SP9UOB> silence...
[14:23] <fsphil> ah
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[14:28] <jcoxon> bbl
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[14:37] <JTell> Hi, I'm new to IRC and highaltitude/kick #highaltitude zyp No warez here!
[14:40] <JTell> Hello?
[14:41] <DrLuke> ...
[14:42] <JTell> Hi Anyone interested in HAB?
[14:42] <DrLuke> Nah, I only come here for the naked chicks
[14:43] <JTell> Hi DrLuke, I'm in Cornwall UK
[14:44] <JTell> Who's the expert on ssdv?
[14:44] <Darkside> fsphil:
[14:44] <Darkside> he's the one that wrote/invented it
[14:45] <Darkside> don't think he;s around atm tho
[14:45] <JTell> Thanks Darkside
[14:45] <daveake> I've used it. But I'm not an expert.
[14:46] <JTell> Hi dave what platform have you run it on?
[14:46] <daveake> Raspberry Pi - Debian
[14:47] <Darkside> not a recommendation :P
[14:47] <daveake> lol
[14:47] <Darkside> well, not as a primary tracker ayway
[14:47] <daveake> I used Phil's program that converts from jpeg to the SSDV format, then wrote some code to send the SSDV packets along with the usual telemetry
[14:48] <daveake> Darkside You should enjoy my conf talk on the subject :p
[14:48] <Darkside> oh?
[14:48] <daveake> Phil and I are doing a talk. He's doing "how SSDV works" and I'm doing "SSDV on the Pi"
[14:48] <Darkside> heh
[14:49] <daveake> One slide is for you :D
[14:49] <Darkside> >_>
[14:49] <Darkside> a big red disclaimer?
[14:49] <daveake> Wait and see :)
[14:49] <Darkside> :P
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[14:51] <Darkside> i still need to write my talk
[14:51] <JTell> Down in Cornwall there is little chance of camera recovery so I wish to try ssdv.
[14:52] <Darkside> don't launch from cornwall?
[14:53] <Darkside> even the cheapest SSDV payload is still going to cost a few hundred pounds
[14:53] <Darkside> i think
[14:53] <Darkside> i know the UART cameras aren't cheap
[14:53] <daveake> £50 for a UART camera
[14:54] <Darkside> hmm thts not so bad
[14:54] <Darkside> but then you need to make a normal tracker for it to go on :P
[14:54] <daveake> yup
[14:55] <daveake> Well you need one of those anyway if you're running something as complex as a Pi
[14:55] <JTell> I'm a parent at a local Primary school we have launched non tracking already and I'm doing for there science.
[14:55] <Darkside> what did you launch?
[14:56] <JTell> Just a message in a bottle. 800g Howyee
[14:56] <Darkside> with a NOTAM?
[14:57] <JTell> Lifted an slr to 180 feet tethered aswell.
[14:57] <JTell> Yes NOTAM
[14:57] <Darkside> just checking :-)
[14:57] <JTell> :)
[14:58] <daveake> Wouldn't be the first newbie to turn up having flown without !
[14:58] <JTell> Was hoping to use a PIC with ssdv.
[14:59] <daveake> Well Phil's source code is on github so you could start with that
[14:59] <Darkside> may be a bad idea using a PIC
[14:59] <SP9UOB> JTell: Im working on SSDV on dsPIC33
[14:59] <Darkside> dsPIC maybe
[14:59] <Darkside> normal pic, probably not so much
[14:59] <Darkside> hell, taoking to the UART camera is a pain in teh ass itself
[15:00] <Darkside> goddamn autobauding pisses me right off
[15:00] <daveake> Exactly why I went the webcam route
[15:00] <JTell> Whats problem with camera UART?
[15:00] <Darkside> the camera uses autobauding
[15:00] <Darkside> where it tried to determine the communication baud rate automatically
[15:01] <daveake> and gets it wrong, presumably?
[15:01] <Darkside> problem is, as the temperature drifts, so does the serial baud rate
[15:01] <Darkside> and it doesn't lock on
[15:01] <daveake> ah
[15:01] <SP9UOB> heres my tracker: http://sp9uob.verox.pl/20111123_201703.jpg
[15:01] <Darkside> also problems with clock division cause the baud rate to be slightly off
[15:01] <Darkside> and it doesn't lock on
[15:01] <SP9UOB> http://sp9uob.verox.pl/20111123_201726.jpg
[15:01] <Darkside> fsphil solved the problem by using a non-standard crystal
[15:02] <Darkside> SP9UOB: is that a RS232 port i see?
[15:02] <JTell> I'll have a lok SP9UOB
[15:02] <SP9UOB> 2 uarts + radio port
[15:02] <Darkside> on the DB9?
[15:02] <SP9UOB> yes
[15:02] <JTell> How does the autobaud work?
[15:03] <Darkside> JTell: you send it commands, and it supposedly figures out the baud rate you sent them at
[15:03] <Darkside> never really worked for me
[15:03] <Darkside> i put my finger on the micro's clock crystal and warmed it up, and it stopped communicating
[15:04] <JTell> Is there a clock output off the camera?
[15:05] <daveake> That's just ridiculous. RS232 devices can normally copy with a about 5% difference in baud rates; no way you can shift a crystal that much with finger!
[15:05] <JTell> what camera?
[15:05] <daveake> Their implementation is broken
[15:06] <Darkside> JTell: can't remember now
[15:06] <Darkside> i think they're an australian mob
[15:06] <SP9UOB> and with radio daughterboard: http://sp9uob.verox.pl/traker.jpg
[15:07] <Darkside> grr the baud doesn't even have any markings on it
[15:07] <Darkside> board*
[15:08] <Darkside> i *think* its a C328
[15:08] <Darkside> http://www.4dsystems.com.au/prod.php?id=75
[15:08] <Darkside> there it is
[15:09] <JTell> Thanks.
[15:09] <Darkside> i would not suggest trying to control it with a PIC though..
[15:10] <JTell> SP9UOB Home-manufactured PCB?
[15:10] <daveake> I'd have thought some of the PIC24 range would have no problem ... 64KB RAM, plenty of program space, up to 4 serial ports
[15:11] <Darkside> yeah maybe the higher end pics
[15:11] <Darkside> the single register thing still bothers me
[15:11] <JTell> Why not a PIC?
[15:11] <Darkside> depends on the PIC i guess
[15:11] <number10> world record altitude for HAB is a PIC
[15:11] <Darkside> if you're experienced in using it, then i guess you could try and use one
[15:12] <daveake> :)
[15:12] <number10> PICs R us
[15:12] <daveake> The better ones are designed for C
[15:12] <Darkside> all the SSDV code is targeted for AVR anyway
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[15:13] <number10> ah I forgot to mention the world record for a camera payload also uses a PIC ;)
[15:14] <daveake> lol
[15:14] <Darkside> pff
[15:14] <nigelvh> PICs and AVRs all do the same stuff. Just choose what you're confortable with.
[15:14] <Darkside> not a SSDV payload though
[15:14] <daveake> Let's not mention the highest SSDV then :D
[15:14] <Darkside> daveake: lol
[15:14] <number10> ah well not that :(
[15:14] <daveake> The highest helium is an AVR
[15:14] <number10> and I am sure my record for the camera will soon be gone
[15:15] <number10> too mant of you lot using AVRs
[15:15] <daveake> Well I just stocked up on balloons :)
[15:15] <number10> many
[15:15] <nigelvh> We have this same discussion all the time between myself and my cohort over here, I'm an AVR guy, and he's a PIC guy. They do the same things.
[15:15] <number10> how many have you got daveake ?
[15:15] <number10> yea nigelvh - its just a processor running some code so doent matter which one
[15:15] <Darkside> depends if you want performance or not
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[15:16] <Darkside> though i'm biased as i had to deal with PIC16'd for a while
[15:16] <number10> dont think you need much performance at 50 baud
[15:16] <SP9UOB> JTell: no professional
[15:16] <nigelvh> I haven't independently checked this, but apparently a lot of instructions the AVR will do in one cycle, and the pic in four, but in reality it's not a big deal.
[15:16] <Darkside> nigelvh: more the SSDV stuff
[15:16] <Darkside> where you do need to process a fair bit of data
[15:16] <Darkside> number10:
[15:17] <number10> what Darkside ?
[15:17] <daveake> number10 How many what?
[15:17] <Darkside> writing PIC assembly was weird, one register.
[15:17] <SP9UOB> I use dsPIC33FJ128GP804
[15:17] <Darkside> also PAGED MEMORY on the goddamn PIC16's
[15:17] <Darkside> that pissed me right off, especially when the C compiler didn't handle it properly
[15:18] <daveake> nigelvh It's like the old Z80 vs 6502 wars from 30 years ago. Z80 ran at 4Mhz vs 6502 at 1Mhz, and needed 4 cycles for simple stuff vs 1. Swings and roundabouts.
[15:18] <Darkside> maybe these newer PIC18s or PIC24s are okay, i haven't worked with them. dsPICs are great from what i've heard
[15:18] <SP9UOB> my tracker has 2 way AX25 connection (i wrote modem: http://sp9uob.verox.pl/dstnc.html)
[15:18] <number10> that is a problem darkside - I did give up on pic16 when trying to process the ublox nmea - it couldnt do it
[15:18] <JTell> I programmed PIC ASM about 20 years ago.
[15:18] <daveake> The PIC24 I've used was fine
[15:18] <Darkside> JTell: don't write the tracker code in Assembly :P
[15:19] <JTell> THings have changed a lot since then
[15:19] <Darkside> not if you want to retain your sanity
[15:19] <nigelvh> Yep. We always bring it down to whatever you're comfortable with and works.
[15:19] <nigelvh> Though I'm still trying to get him to start using C. He's an old boeing engineer and only write assembly.
[15:19] <Darkside> mm
[15:19] <Darkside> ouch
[15:19] <Darkside> JTell: if you want somethign that'll work *fast* then use an AVR. the SSDV code already works on that.
[15:20] <JTell> I have a job just reading the instructions to get on IRC Today!
[15:20] <Darkside> and has been written for an ATMega644
[15:20] <nigelvh> I don't much care if he uses assembly for his personal projects, but I KNOW that at some point he's going to be on vacation or something and I'm going to have to figure out his code.
[15:20] <JTell> Ha
[15:20] <Darkside> https://github.com/fsphil/hadie
[15:20] <Darkside> thats fsphil's flight code
[15:20] <daveake> I've never understood these people who continue to use assembly language for entire applications. It's handy very, very rarely for speeding up heavily used code. I haven't needed to do that for many years
[15:21] <DrLuke> I've had to do it for my tesla coil
[15:21] <nigelvh> He just never learned any C.
[15:21] <nigelvh> So he does everything in assembly, it's just the programming "language" he knows.
[15:21] <daveake> Sure, but the time spent doing that will be repaid many times after
[15:21] <DrLuke> that way I reduced the instruction amount for controlling the DDS-ic by a factor of 4
[15:22] <DrLuke> yep
[15:22] <nigelvh> Anyway, He got a book on C for PICs recently, so hopefully he'll have a go at that.
[15:22] <daveake> :)
[15:23] <nigelvh> Make my life easier when I inevitably have to support it.
[15:23] <gonzo_> I know someoen who insists on writing windlws apps in assembler
[15:23] <DrLuke> pics.. eugh... why not avrs
[15:23] <Darkside> DrLuke: we just had this discussion :P
[15:23] <nigelvh> I'm not sure I'll be able to convince him to go to AVRs
[15:23] <DrLuke> hehe
[15:24] <DrLuke> I think I'll go write a library for the nokia F-Bus
[15:24] <Darkside> from what i can gather, in terms of MIPS/MHz, dsPIC>AVR>PIC
[15:24] <nigelvh> I figure one of these days I'll build some new systems to replace his older ones and I'll use an AVR, and he'll have to get used to it, but until then he'll use PICs
[15:24] <Darkside> though maybe PIC24s or whatever are good nowdays
[15:24] <Darkside> nigelvh: he'll just write all his code using one register
[15:24] <nigelvh> haha
[15:25] <DrLuke> lol
[15:25] <nigelvh> I think for the most part he's using the 18F series, which should be pretty decent.
[15:25] <number10> anyone know if WB9SA-1 has been cancelled or is it going to go up later?
[15:25] <nigelvh> He FINALLY got an ICSP. Until now he's been taking the chips out of the boards, and putting them in a zif socket programmer.
[15:26] <daveake> Rocketboy uses the 18F I think in his payloads, and he does landing point prediction and other stuff as well as basic tracking
[15:26] <daveake> nigelvh waaaahhh!!!
[15:26] <nigelvh> I KNOW!
[15:26] <daveake> How, erm, 70's
[15:26] <gonzo_> pic 18f are ok. I use them a lot
[15:26] <nigelvh> Like I said, a retired boeing engineer.
[15:26] <number10> I still have a UV eraser if anyone wants to go back a step
[15:27] <nigelvh> Anyway, now that he got an ICSP I can move him to the surface mount PICs. (I design the boards for his projects).
[15:28] <daveake> number10 No, I've left that behind, fortunately :)
[15:28] <nigelvh> I keep joking to myself "Oops! How could I have thrown the AVR footprint on this board!? Oh we don't have time to order a new revision? Guess you'll have to work with these!"
[15:29] <Darkside> i think some of the attiny's are pin compatible with some of the smaller PICs too :P
[15:29] <nigelvh> Anyway, gotta head out for now. Have a great day!
[15:30] <nigelvh> I'm going to breakfast you people from the future!
[15:30] <Darkside> lol
[15:30] <Darkside> 1am here
[15:32] <number10> when are you in uk Darkside ?
[15:33] <Darkside> a bit under 2 weeks :-)
[15:33] <Darkside> so not far away!
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[15:34] <number10> have you ordered a balloon yet - for when you are here?
[15:34] <Darkside> haha nope
[15:35] <Darkside> i'll probably tag along to one of dave/upu's launches, and provide a cutdown payload :P
[15:35] <number10> steve sometimes runs out you could be stuck ;)
[15:35] <number10> ah OK, not going for any records this time
[15:35] <Darkside> nah
[15:36] <daveake> I've got a full set from 800 to 1600g :)
[15:36] <number10> greedy bu**er
[15:36] <daveake> lol
[15:36] <number10> ;)
[15:36] <Upu> its because I turn up to launches with everything and then remember shit I forgot to buy a balloon
[15:36] <daveake> exactly!
[15:38] <Darkside> heh
[15:38] <Darkside> well, i have my cutdown payload working of 2xAAAs :-)
[15:38] <Darkside> so at least it'll be nice and light!
[15:38] <Upu> I saw it cut down and fall off the table
[15:38] <Darkside> :P
[15:38] <Darkside> yeah
[15:38] <Darkside> that was my fault
[15:40] <Darkside> daveake: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Of97CekXnLU
[15:40] <Darkside> reckon you could make a foam thing i could fit that into?
[15:41] <Darkside> i'd need to run wires outside for the nichrome wire though
[15:41] <Upu> you cam make a foam thing round anything
[15:42] <Darkside> :P
[15:42] <Darkside> the problem with this is you don't want much tension on the nichrome wire
[15:42] <Upu> I just made it in slices and hot glued it together
[15:43] <Upu> well theres your issue
[15:43] <daveake> Darkside lol
[15:43] <Darkside> and you don't want the nichrome wire to be pulled up when it gets cut away
[15:43] <Upu> and why more gas is better than cut down
[15:43] <daveake> Next time use some blutak to stop the boatd moving :)
[15:43] <Darkside> daveake: haha yes
[15:43] <Darkside> Upu: the cutdown is there for when something goes wrong :P
[15:43] <Darkside> ideally we never have to use it
[15:43] <Upu> nothing goes wrong
[15:43] <Darkside> but it's nice to have it there when something does
[15:44] <Darkside> its also useful to strip away the leftover balloon
[15:44] <Upu> yeah there is that
[15:44] <daveake> Also a "get me down from this tree" cutdown could be useful
[15:44] <Upu> well
[15:44] <Darkside> haha
[15:44] <Upu> knowing your luck it would fire
[15:44] <Upu> drop one branch and stick again
[15:45] <Darkside> daveake: how about a "screw it, lets burn the tree down" device
[15:45] <daveake> lol
[15:45] <daveake> :D
[15:45] <daveake> Short out the lithiums
[15:45] <Darkside> haha
[15:45] <Darkside> crowbar them
[15:45] <Darkside> they don;t explode
[15:45] <Darkside> :(
[15:45] <gonzo_mob> agent orange!
[15:45] <Darkside> they vent nicely though
[15:45] <daveake> Try lipos then
[15:46] <daveake> The R/C ones can go up nicely
[15:46] <Darkside> hehe
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[16:14] Action: fsphil was out enjoying our allotted one day of summer
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[16:20] <fsphil> someone did run the ssdv code on a pic recently, one of the higher end ones anyway
[16:21] <fsphil> they tested it by flying it on a handglider
[16:21] <fsphil> http://www.flickr.com/photos/78067472@N07/sets/72157629628067516/with/7155079186/
[16:23] <fsphil> paraglider sorry
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[16:24] <daveake> nice
[16:24] <fsphil> can't find the url to the project now
[16:25] <fsphil> the joy of replacing the hdd, can't find anything :)
[16:25] <G0DJA> Try Windows 7 - It hides things very effectively from me
[16:27] <fsphil> you'll love windows 8
[16:29] <G0DJA> I'm (hopefully) not going there for a while - Only just got this new works PC
[16:30] <G0DJA> I am thinking that I need to replace the shack PC as it's getting to be very slow
[16:30] <JamesBurton> windows 8 is different to windows 7
[16:30] <G0DJA> Not the one that I currently use for DL-FLDigi though
[16:33] <fsphil> someone launch so I can test this preamp :)
[16:33] <Darkside> :P
[16:36] <daveake> fsphil Can't you launch a pico for that?
[16:40] <JTell> Hi fsphil may I question you on JPEG image format?
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[16:47] <nosebleedkt> hi
[16:47] <nosebleedkt> where is a well known website with GPS&GSM modules in one part?
[16:47] Lunar_Lander (~gd-compto@p54A07B81.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #highaltitude.
[16:47] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[16:48] <Lunar_Lander> we got flyers from Bulgaria now too?
[16:48] <Lunar_Lander> according to spacenear
[16:48] <nosebleedkt> lol
[16:48] <Lunar_Lander> hi nosebleedkt
[16:48] <nosebleedkt> yo
[16:48] <Lunar_Lander> how are you?
[16:48] <nosebleedkt> cool
[16:48] <nosebleedkt> and u?
[16:48] <Lunar_Lander> same here
[16:49] <nosebleedkt> did u fly your hab ?
[16:49] <Lunar_Lander> not yet
[16:49] <nosebleedkt> ah
[16:49] <Lunar_Lander> but almost ready
[16:49] <nosebleedkt> come on!
[16:49] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[16:49] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[16:49] <Lunar_Lander> as I said almost done
[16:49] <nosebleedkt> what's missing?
[16:50] <Lunar_Lander> well the code needs one more overhaul
[16:50] <nosebleedkt> hehe
[16:50] <Lunar_Lander> then we need to see how to pack the payload
[16:50] <Lunar_Lander> we discovered that the DC plug for the arduino makes the arduino not to fit in the box
[16:50] <nosebleedkt> be careful for the leading zeros in the coordinates
[16:50] <Lunar_Lander> today I bought one of these 90° plugs, that should work better
[16:50] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[16:52] <daveake> Plug?? I would not use a DC plug on a HAB. Solder it.
[16:52] <daveake> Too much chance of a reboot when it falls or lands
[16:52] <Lunar_Lander> solder the power leads to the arduino?
[16:52] <daveake> yes
[16:52] <Lunar_Lander> ok
[16:53] <daveake> And if you are using a battery holder, tape the batteries down, and tape the connector on top of the holder (if it has one)
[16:53] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[16:53] <Lunar_Lander> I learned that already when the holder fell down once
[16:53] <Lunar_Lander> and one of the batteries jumped out
[16:53] <daveake> Well there you go
[16:53] <daveake> Initial descent, and landing, can both be violent
[16:54] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[16:54] <fsphil> JTell: walking the dog now, be back in a few minutes
[16:54] <Lunar_Lander> what do you suggest for all the data wires?
[16:54] <daveake> Does your Arduino have a reset button?
[16:54] <Lunar_Lander> what we did so far is plugging them into the arduino headers
[16:54] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[16:54] <daveake> Remove it
[16:54] <JTell> thx sphil
[16:54] <Lunar_Lander> OK
[16:54] <Lunar_Lander> I got the pro mega
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[16:54] <Lunar_Lander> so it is a bit different than the standard button
[16:54] <Lunar_Lander> have to look how it could be removed
[16:55] <daveake> It's a reset button. Remove it. Soldering iron or cutters - whatever works
[16:55] <Lunar_Lander> ah just 4 solder points
[16:55] <Lunar_Lander> should be doable
[16:55] <daveake> The little flat ones have a leg sticking out at each corner
[16:56] <daveake> Small/pointy cutters will work for thos
[16:56] <daveake> e
[16:56] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[16:56] <Lunar_Lander> https://www.sparkfun.com/products/10744
[16:56] <Lunar_Lander> like on there?
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[16:56] <nosebleedkt> there used to be some website selling gsm&gps modules in one part
[16:56] <daveake> Same thing
[16:56] <nosebleedkt> does anyone have those links?
[16:57] <Lunar_Lander> OK
[16:57] <daveake> You mean something you call and it sends a position text back?
[16:57] <daveake> ebay, Amazon
[16:57] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, thanks
[16:57] <Lunar_Lander> what do you suggest for all the data wires?
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[16:58] <Lunar_Lander> what we did so far is plugging them into the arduino headers
[16:59] <nosebleedkt> daveake, no. Some arduino shields with embedded gps&gsm module
[17:00] <daveake> Ah, OK. Have you tried sparkfun, coolcomponents, proto-pic/
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[17:00] <daveake> LL Those are more robust
[17:01] <daveake> Hardly likely to fall out :-)
[17:01] <daveake> Use the "jcoxon test" :-). "Will it still work if you drop the payload down the stairs?"
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[17:02] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[17:02] <Lunar_Lander> can I do that with the canon camera in it?
[17:05] <daveake> The idea is that you design your payload so you can
[17:05] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[17:06] <Lunar_Lander> so everything needs to be tied down and so on
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[17:07] <Lunar_Lander> the one guy of my team considered either some construction of wooden sticks or that wire that gardeners use
[17:08] <daveake> Most people just use partitions made from foam
[17:11] <fsphil> loving this weather
[17:12] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[17:13] <Lunar_Lander> but I think the idea to drop the cutdown was good
[17:13] <Lunar_Lander> because I still don't know why it failed on test
[17:14] <daveake> The more you put in the more there is to fail, so don't be over-ambitious
[17:14] <daveake> After the first launch you can fix stuff then add things (but don't add too much) then try again
[17:14] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[17:15] <Lunar_Lander> so far we got GPS, Radio, Barometer, Thermometer, Hygrometer
[17:15] <Lunar_Lander> the Canon and the 808 work on their own
[17:15] <daveake> plenty
[17:15] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[17:15] <Lunar_Lander> shall I reduce that program?
[17:16] <daveake> I can't answer that
[17:16] <daveake> Only you can
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[17:16] <daveake> Fly what you trust
[17:18] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[17:18] <Lunar_Lander> currently the thermometer acts up again
[17:18] <Lunar_Lander> and somehow I think that the current barometer code is the problem
[17:19] <Lunar_Lander> so maybe I leave out the BMP085 but retain the DS18B20
[17:22] <daveake> Doesn't sound "nearly ready" to me then
[17:23] <daveake> Those two should be straightforward
[17:24] <fsphil> JTell, what are you thinking of flying?
[17:26] <JTell> Any ssdv would do it's mainly for the kids but I have been out of electronics for over 20 years so finding learning curve steep.
[17:27] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[17:27] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, I'll brb, thank you very much for your advice!
[17:28] <fsphil> the simple way is with an avr and that 4d-systems camera Darkside mentioned
[17:29] <fsphil> but sadly they're quite pricy
[17:29] <fsphil> and fussy with the baud rates
[17:30] <fsphil> there is also the linksprite camera, but that's untested with this code
[17:31] <fsphil> it's a bit cheaper
[17:31] <JTell> I wanted to keep it simple. My programming is pretty lame although I have programmed for iPhone recently. When I look at your code for ssdv I fel lost.
[17:32] <fsphil> yea the main code itself is quite twisty and spooky
[17:32] <fsphil> but using it is really simple
[17:32] <fsphil> you feed it jpeg data, and it returns packets to be transmitted
[17:34] <JTell> Ok,my original idea was to read JPEG format with a PIC add some error correction and send it. I always take on too much though!
[17:34] <fsphil> I did that on my first flight
[17:35] <fsphil> the jpeg format sucks at handling gaps
[17:35] <JTell> How is a JPEG file formatted? Is there one chunk of data that can be extracted?
[17:35] <fsphil> I ended up with half complete images
[17:35] <fsphil> http://www.flickr.com/photos/fsphil/4526373286/in/set-72157623870036944
[17:36] <fsphil> it's a collection of headers, followed by the image data
[17:36] <fsphil> the data itself is composed of huffman symbols and numbers
[17:36] <JTell> so from one camera model, the data would always begin and end in the same place in the file?
[17:37] <fsphil> For the C328 at least, yes
[17:37] <fsphil> begin at the same place
[17:37] <fsphil> the end is variable
[17:38] <JTell> varies even with same picture size? or does the coding increase size?
[17:38] <fsphil> what ssdv does is remove the headers, and just send the image data. the header in each packet contains hints that can allow the decoder to fill in any gaps
[17:38] <fsphil> the size of the image depends on the details of the image
[17:38] <fsphil> noisy images , like trees or clouds, are larger
[17:38] <JTell> ok I see
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[17:39] <JTell> I remeber doing huffman and reed solomon t uni but when youv'e been away from it for so long it's very daunting!
[17:40] <fsphil> I like huffman coding
[17:40] <fsphil> oooh thunder
[17:40] <JTell> sunny here!
[17:40] <fsphil> it was here too just a few minutes ago
[17:42] <JTell> The huffman code is known at the receiver or sent with message? (I probably sound like I know nothing!)
[17:42] <fsphil> nah, good question. it's known to both sides
[17:42] <fsphil> sending it would create a single point of failure
[17:42] <fsphil> if you lost that you lost the image
[17:43] <JTell> ok I do remmeber self error correcting codes but I spose that defeats the object for compression.
[17:43] <JTell> codes could even correct the error code.
[17:44] <JTell> I feel that producing an ssdv on a pic would have a lot of mileage.
[17:45] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, I concur that the code has faults
[17:45] <fsphil> the ssdv.c file should be pretty portable, if you have a C compiler?
[17:45] <fsphil> my last work on PIC was all assembly
[17:45] <Lunar_Lander> i.e. the phenomenon of the DS18B20 just returning an error value
[17:45] <daveake> Lunar_Lander Well, if it doesn't work, then yes that's pretty obvious :D
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[17:45] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[17:45] upix (4e3d97f9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.61.151.249) joined #highaltitude.
[17:45] <upix> good day everyone
[17:45] <Lunar_Lander> hello upix
[17:45] <fsphil> hullo upix
[17:46] <JTell> hello
[17:46] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, I got a sort of strange theory
[17:46] <Lunar_Lander> if the Mega offers that many inputs, I think it should be able to handle them
[17:46] <Lunar_Lander> otherwise the number of inputs doesn't make sense
[17:46] <fsphil> I'm not sure how much memory the ssdv code uses, something to watch out for
[17:47] <SP9UOB> WB9SA-1 postponed ?
[17:47] <hialt> can anyone help.... we have filled in payload generator so how do we get our flight in the dl-fldigi payload list???
[17:48] <Lunar_Lander> hi SP9UOB
[17:48] <Lunar_Lander> hi hialt are you the person from Bulgaria?
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[17:48] <fsphil> brb, thunder is closer
[17:48] <hialt> no we are in the UK
[17:48] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[17:48] <Lunar_Lander> hi DrLuke
[17:49] <SP9UOB> Lunar_Lander: no - SP - Poland
[17:49] <Lunar_Lander> yeah SP9UOB that I know, I asked hialt
[17:49] <DrLuke> Hey lunar_lander
[17:49] <DrLuke> how's it going
[17:49] <SP9UOB> ooh sorry :-)
[17:49] <Lunar_Lander> no problem :)
[17:49] <Lunar_Lander> I know that the ham radio prefixes are strange
[17:49] <Lunar_Lander> i.e. why does Germany have D (which makes sense) and like Poland has SP and not PL
[17:49] <Lunar_Lander> DrLuke, quite OK thanks and you?
[17:49] <SP9UOB> blame ICAO :-)
[17:50] <Lunar_Lander> yea :)
[17:50] <Lunar_Lander> we share ours btw
[17:50] <DrLuke> lunar_lander: My ears hurt from listening to all the noise while playing with my SDR
[17:50] <Lunar_Lander> i.e. DA to DR is germany
[17:50] <Lunar_Lander> DS and DT are south korea
[17:50] <Lunar_Lander> and the rest, DU to DZ are philippines
[17:50] <Lunar_Lander> DrLuke, oh :(
[17:51] <DrLuke> but I manages to listen to a melody my arduino played :P
[17:51] <DrLuke> managed*
[17:51] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[17:51] <DrLuke> It's just very very noisy, even though both antennas are in the same room
[17:51] <JTell> Does your latest code alow for lost packets sphil?
[17:51] <DrLuke> it's probably because the dvb-t antenna isn't made for 433 MHz
[17:52] <DrLuke> I'll have to build a yagi antenna
[17:52] <DrLuke> does anybody know where I can get metal rods for one?
[17:52] <JTell> plumbers merchant?
[17:53] <DrLuke> we don't have such things here
[17:53] <DrLuke> we only have 3 hardware stores
[17:53] <SP9UOB> DrLuke: try this: http://seeingstone.net/dokuwiki/lib/exe/fetch.php/radio/img_4653.jpg
[17:54] <DrLuke> hahahaha
[17:54] <JTell> Bamboo and wire?
[17:54] <DrLuke> that's super awesome
[17:54] <SP9UOB> DrLuke: foldable :-)
[17:54] <SP9UOB> very portable :-)
[17:54] <SP9UOB> and... IT WORKS !
[17:54] <DrLuke> amazing
[17:55] <JTell> excellent!
[17:55] <JTell> will it measure?
[17:55] <SP9UOB> https://www.google.pl/search?q=measuring+tape+yagi&hl=pl&newwindow=1&safe=off&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=GWIdUPi_FPHP4QS-qoGYDA&ved=0CF4QsAQ&biw=1920&bih=1030
[17:55] <DrLuke> you can measure the wavelength with it
[17:56] <SP9UOB> LOL
[17:56] <DrLuke> is that a folded dipole
[17:56] <DrLuke> lmao
[17:57] <DrLuke> I have a question: I've often read something about impedance matchign and 50 Ohms, what is it and is it important?
[17:58] <JTell> maximum power transfer
[17:58] <SP9UOB> http://theleggios.net/wb2hol/projects/rdf/tape_bm.htm
[17:59] <SP9UOB> just scale it down to 434 MHz
[17:59] <griffonbot> Received email: Peter Browne "[UKHAS] Payload Document Upload"
[18:01] <G0DJA> DrLuke people use 50 ohm because that's a common coaxial feeder impedance but you can get 75 ohm as well
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[18:02] <G0DJA> 75 ohm is nearer to feed impedance of a half wave dipole but if you use a vertical with several rods for the 'ground' the impedance may be more like 35 ohms anyway
[18:03] <DrLuke> ok
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[18:09] <fsphil> JTell: yea it does
[18:09] <fsphil> it can fill the gaps
[18:19] <Lunar_Lander> do british pharmacies have like customer magazines?
[18:19] <Lunar_Lander> in germany we have "Apotheken Umschau"
[18:19] <Lunar_Lander> and they have a commercial song
[18:19] <Lunar_Lander> which goes like
[18:19] <Lunar_Lander> Today is our day, we let it happen in any way, we stay togehter, whatever it takes, from time to time relax and have a break, today we celebrate, life is a gift, so many things to be made, it feels so good to be alive, now's the time and we sing: Whatever we do we feel OK, we feel allright on every single day, whatever we do, we feel OK, we feel allright on every day
[18:20] Action: daveake hums Spam Spam Spam Spam ....
[18:20] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] Payload Document Upload"
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[18:23] <DrLuke> lunar_lander: sound like something you'd sing with a suicidal person
[18:25] <Lunar_Lander> ohhh
[18:26] <DrLuke> so, who's going to watch the landing of curiosity?
[18:28] <daveake> Quite a few of us I think
[18:29] <Lunar_Lander> DrLuke, it's about 8 in the morning on monday when it lands, right?
[18:29] <DrLuke> 5:30 AM
[18:29] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[18:30] <DrLuke> that's the time they tell us in every video
[18:30] <DrLuke> but I wonder whether that's the actual landing time
[18:30] <DrLuke> or that's when the coverage starts and the landing will be 4 hours later
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[18:38] <fsphil> mmm doughnuts
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[19:04] <craag> Looks like my accident with the soldering iron the other day also fried the RFM22. :(
[19:04] <Lunar_Lander> what sort of accident?
[19:04] <craag> I started soldering on some more components when the power supply was still connected.
[19:05] <craag> The current limit is broken, so ~8A.
[19:05] <craag> Left some scorch marks on the arduino!
[19:06] <craag> Got a new arduino, GPS is working, blink is working but no RF output and the RFM22 inputs are pulling a lot of current..
[19:07] <Lunar_Lander> ohhhhh!
[19:08] <Lunar_Lander> oh well
[19:08] <Lunar_Lander> I thought if that lightning flash was just a thing I made up in my mind
[19:08] <Lunar_Lander> but it thundered
[19:09] <fsphil> we only had two rumbles here
[19:10] <fsphil> still a lot of activity around yorkshire
[19:10] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[19:10] <fsphil> glad I didn't head over this weekend
[19:11] <daveake> Much better to come over in summer. Erm ....
[19:11] <JTell> fsphil where might I get information on c328 JPEG format? Could I implement a simple encoder by finding the start of the JPEG Image data and the end of image data? I'm guessing there's information of file size stored in the format? Or am I too nieve?
[19:12] <fsphil> the camera will tell you the size of the file before it transfers it
[19:13] <fsphil> if you can I'd use the ssdv.c file to encode it, it'll handle all the jpeg bits
[19:14] <griffonbot> @adamcudworth: New 2M antenna for tracking HABs! #UKHAS http://t.co/57yOeoTo [http://twitter.com/adamcudworth/status/231830376610418689]
[19:14] <fsphil> hope that does 70cm too :)
[19:14] <daveake> I was wondering what HABs exactly ...
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[19:17] <fsphil> hey cuddykid, that antenna do 70cm too?
[19:17] <cuddykid> fsphil: hiya :) yup!
[19:17] <cuddykid> friend of mine gave it to me earlier
[19:18] <fsphil> phew, was worried there for a sec :)
[19:18] <cuddykid> haha
[19:19] <fsphil> looks good, what do you have currently?
[19:20] <JTell> fsphil I suck when it comes to reading well written code! I feel that if went down the line of trying to port code I could get lost if I don't understand what I'm porting!
[19:22] <fsphil> can you use it as is?
[19:22] <fsphil> it would be tricky doing this in assembly
[19:26] <fsphil> but if you can compile the C code, there's very little porting needed
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[19:31] <JTell> I would use C for any implemntation. I can not read code at all well! what are the functions I would call?
[19:33] <fsphil> there are only four, at the bottom of this file: https://github.com/fsphil/hadie/blob/master/ssdv.h
[19:34] <fsphil> you call _init() which sets up a new image
[19:34] <fsphil> _set_buffer() tells it where you want your packet stored
[19:34] <fsphil> then _feed() the jpeg data as you get it from the camera
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[19:35] <fsphil> _get_packet() will return SSDV_OK when a complete packet is ready
[19:35] <fsphil> or SSDV_FEED_ME if it needs more data
[19:35] <fsphil> loop until done
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[19:38] <JTell> sphil Many Thanks! I will look over the file.
[19:39] <fsphil> np, any questions just ping me
[19:44] <JTell> sphil I have "Signal Coding and Processing" by one of my old lecturers Graham Wade. apart from the simple stuff. It was always a bit beyond me - would you like it?
[19:49] <DrLuke> does anybody know whether this ublox module can go higher than 14km? http://www.ebay.de/itm/Ublox-NEO-6M-GPS-Module-Aircraft-Flight-Controller-For-Arduino-MWC-IMU-A100-/251101600322?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a76d25a42
[19:50] <fsphil> JTell: thanks, I suspect it's a bit over my head too :)
[19:50] <fsphil> DrLuke: they can definitely, but they need to be configured to do so
[19:51] <DrLuke> ok thanks
[19:51] <fsphil> all the ublox-5 or ublox-6 modules can at least
[19:52] <fsphil> you might be cheaper getting it from http://ava.upuaut.net/store/ DrLuke
[19:52] <daveake> See http://www.ukhas.org.uk/guides:ublox6
[19:52] <DrLuke> thanks :)
[19:53] <DrLuke> fsphil: the one on ebay doesn't cost that much more and it has an sma connector
[19:53] <fsphil> true
[19:53] <JTell> http://www.u-blox.com/images/downloads/Product_Docs/u-blox6_ReceiverDescriptionProtocolSpec_%28GPS.G6-SW-10018%29.pdf **page 2**
[19:54] <Lunar_Lander_> daveake, you know one of the prime advantages of leaving the cutdown?
[19:54] <Lunar_Lander_> leaving that 6 Ah battery on the ground
[19:54] <fsphil> you don't need tha tbig a battery for a cutdown
[19:55] <daveake> indeed
[19:55] <fsphil> my lead acid batteries are not much more than that
[19:55] <Lunar_Lander_> yea
[19:55] <fsphil> a PP3 will do
[19:55] <fsphil> or two AA's
[19:55] <Lunar_Lander_> yeah we had that yesterday
[19:55] <Lunar_Lander_> I just wanted to mention it
[19:55] <Lunar_Lander_> btw
[19:56] <fsphil> why? :p
[19:56] <Lunar_Lander_> why are E-Blocks so inefficient?
[19:56] <Lunar_Lander_> the 9V I mean
[19:56] <Lunar_Lander_> just so :)
[19:56] <fsphil> dunno what that is
[19:56] <Lunar_Lander_> ah that is a PP3
[19:57] <DrLuke> wow, what, ublox6 also has i2c support?
[19:58] <DrLuke> that's awesome
[19:58] <Lunar_Lander_> fsphil, interesting we call it a "E" you call it PP3
[19:58] <fsphil> ah
[19:59] <DrLuke> energizer pp3 are awful
[19:59] <SP9UOB> in poland 9V block is.... 6F22 :-)
[19:59] <fsphil> I'd just stich with the AA batteries
[19:59] <Lunar_Lander_> :)
[19:59] <Lunar_Lander_> yeah
[19:59] <DrLuke> I've had a batch of them, they died faster than some noname brand
[19:59] <fsphil> stick
[19:59] <fsphil> 3v is more than enough for a cut-down
[19:59] <Lunar_Lander_> I got Carrera AA batteries in my canon
[19:59] <DrLuke> haha
[19:59] <Lunar_Lander_> and they were EMPTY after using the flash for about 5 times
[20:00] <Lunar_Lander_> now I got two of the energizer ultimate lithium
[20:00] <Lunar_Lander_> that is way better
[20:01] <DrLuke> sony eneloops are awesome
[20:01] <daveake> PP3s are less efficient vs weight than AAs
[20:02] <Lunar_Lander_> that is what my question meant
[20:02] <fsphil> it's odd that, they should be better but always seem to have less capacity
[20:02] <daveake> Possibly all the insulation/connections between each layer
[20:03] <fsphil> that's right, it has more cells
[20:03] <daveake> yup
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[20:29] <Lunar_Lander__> hello mclane
[20:33] <mclane> Hallo Lunar Lander
[20:35] <SP9UOB> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATXuZdltPi8 my last launch :-) Burst at 4:30
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[20:36] <Lunar_Lander__> SP9UOB, COOL!
[20:37] <Lunar_Lander__> I saw that some time ago and wondered if you plan to upload the full flight
[20:37] <Lunar_Lander__> ah nevermind, I see that you uploaded it :)
[20:38] <SP9UOB> yes I have uploaded full video :-)
[20:40] <SP9UOB> also launch video from local TV http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6eMkB24Ypqo
[20:40] <Lunar_Lander__> cool thanks
[20:40] <SP9UOB> and recovery: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrTBohWikzo&feature=relmfu
[20:40] <Lunar_Lander__> yeah that I know already :)
[20:42] <radim_OM2AMR> great landind place :-) I wish we will have such place :-)
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander__> ah what was the CD for?
[20:43] <SP9UOB> hmmm wait i must look into the dictionary :-)
[20:43] <Lunar_Lander__> was ist for the parachute lines?
[20:44] <SP9UOB> yes to avoid muddling (?)
[20:44] <SP9UOB> or jumble - i cant find propre word :-)
[20:45] <SP9UOB> proper
[20:45] <DrLuke> Aaaah polska
[20:45] <SP9UOB> Polska :-)
[20:45] <DrLuke> my family lives in jastrzebie if you know where that is
[20:45] <DrLuke> I think it's near gliwic
[20:46] <SP9UOB> Yes, I know, in Silesian Viovodeship
[20:46] <Lunar_Lander__> ah
[20:46] <SP9UOB> not so far - aboput 30-40 km
[20:46] <Lunar_Lander__> that is a good Idea
[20:46] <G0DJA> SP9UOB do you mean tangling ?
[20:46] <Lunar_Lander__> I have struggled to find a wooden ring or so for that
[20:46] <SP9UOB> Tangling :-)
[20:46] <Lunar_Lander__> but the CD is a great idea as it weighs next to nothing
[20:46] <SP9UOB> thanks G0DJA
[20:46] <DrLuke> lunar_lander__ why don't you cut one out of a board?
[20:47] <DrLuke> and then use a drill to make holes
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[20:47] <SP9UOB> CD is lighter than any woodden ring
[20:47] <DrLuke> indeed
[20:47] <Lunar_Lander__> yeah cause I didn't do any wood work yet
[20:47] <DrLuke> depends on the wood though
[20:47] <Lunar_Lander__> yeah
[20:47] <DrLuke> hehe
[20:47] <Lunar_Lander__> Balsa is awesome
[20:47] <DrLuke> yep
[20:48] <DrLuke> it's almost lighter than air
[20:48] <Lunar_Lander__> yea
[20:48] <DrLuke> I always tie mine down so it doesn't go flying
[20:48] <DrLuke> :P
[20:48] <Lunar_Lander__> XD
[20:48] <SP9UOB> ;-) But balsa is not common ;-)
[20:48] <Lunar_Lander__> XD Aerogel
[20:48] <DrLuke> haha
[20:48] <DrLuke> that would be awesome as an enclosure
[20:48] <DrLuke> it would be both sturdy and insulating
[20:48] <DrLuke> and light
[20:48] <Lunar_Lander__> yea
[20:48] <Lunar_Lander__> and flame resistant
[20:49] <DrLuke> because that's very important, right
[20:49] <Lunar_Lander__> xD
[20:50] <DrLuke> I've recently accidentally aquired a 4,8 ohm 50W resistor
[20:50] <DrLuke> it's perfect for a heater
[20:51] <Lunar_Lander__> yea
[20:51] <DrLuke> Well, in the next 2 months I will plan and aquire all parts for my first HAB
[20:51] <Lunar_Lander__> yea
[20:51] <Lunar_Lander__> what will it do?
[20:52] <DrLuke> hopefully not get lost
[20:52] <DrLuke> :P
[20:52] <SP9UOB> Lunar_Lander__: my friend advised me to send a windows install CD ;-)
[20:52] <Lunar_Lander__> XD!
[20:52] <radim_OM2AMR> Tomek :-D
[20:52] <DrLuke> :P
[20:52] <SP9UOB> DrLuke: good luck
[20:52] <DrLuke> thanks
[20:52] <SP9UOB> radim_OM2AMR: :-)
[20:53] <radim_OM2AMR> what about heater, it's really necessary ?
[20:53] <DrLuke> can't hurt to have one
[20:53] <DrLuke> I need to build a yagi antenna and get my SDR up and going
[20:54] <radim_OM2AMR> DrLuke, maybe such passive, like SP9UOB used, I would like to save my batteries as much as possible :-)
[20:54] <SP9UOB> DrLuke: take one measuring tape, some pipes :-)
[20:54] <DrLuke> hehe
[20:54] <Lunar_Lander__> yea water pump, propane burner and radiator
[20:54] <SP9UOB> radim_OM2AMR: are You plan to launchfrom Slovakia ?
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[20:55] <radim_OM2AMR> Tomek, yes, we are planning to flight 8-th sept
[20:55] <SP9UOB> DrLuke: ... and You have yagi http://radio.jseanmcvey.com/projects/tape-measure-yagi
[20:55] <SP9UOB> radim_OM2AMR: Aprs tracker? some other trackers?
[20:56] <radim_OM2AMR> APRS and UKHAS RTTY tracker
[20:56] <radim_OM2AMR> two radios, but just one Arduino :-)
[20:56] <radim_OM2AMR> we will compare two tracking systems and choose best one for the next flights ;-)
[20:57] <Lunar_Lander__> SP9UOB, btw the news journalist has a dutch name
[20:57] <Lunar_Lander__> van der Coghen
[20:57] <SP9UOB> radim_OM2AMR: ill put my fldigi on :-)
[20:57] <SP9UOB> Lunar_Lander__: :-)
[20:57] <radim_OM2AMR> Great Tomek ! our payload is already there STS-1
[20:59] <SP9UOB> on my next flight i put ukhas RTTY on 10m band
[21:00] <SP9UOB> and APRS ofcourse (here in Poland we can run airborne with HAM radio license)
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[21:00] <radim_OM2AMR> when do you plan the next flight Tomek ?
[21:01] <SP9UOB> radim_OM2AMR: I dont know yet - autumn. Some tests with hydrogen.... BUM ;-)
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[21:02] <radim_OM2AMR> ohh, hydrogen, I said - Safety First, so we will flight expensive Helium now
[21:02] <SP9UOB> its no so dangerous ;-)
[21:03] <Lunar_Lander__> XD
[21:03] <radim_OM2AMR> I know, I'm smoker :-D
[21:03] <Lunar_Lander__> XD
[21:04] <SP9UOB> radim_OM2AMR: cancer will kill you first ;-)
[21:05] <Lunar_Lander__> ROFL
[21:05] <radim_OM2AMR> oh, I hope, that don't :-)
[21:06] <SP9UOB> radim_OM2AMR: so, nothing too loose - try hydrogen ;-)
[21:06] <Lunar_Lander__> Curiosity will land in 32 hours from now!!
[21:06] <nigelvh> I'm so excited about curiosity.
[21:07] <Lunar_Lander__> yeah
[21:07] <Lunar_Lander__> hi nigelvh
[21:07] <nigelvh> Howdy
[21:07] <SP9UOB> or will crash because somone mess meters with feets ;-)
[21:07] <Lunar_Lander__> XD hopefully not
[21:07] <nigelvh> It's going to be exciting in either case.
[21:08] <Lunar_Lander__> yea
[21:08] <nigelvh> Excitingly terrible, or terribly exciting.
[21:08] <radim_OM2AMR> Tomek,for the upcoming flight we ordered pure Helium, 200 Eur for 20l bottle ;-(
[21:08] <SP9UOB> radim_OM2AMR: let me calculate currency.. wait
[21:09] <radim_OM2AMR> Gass reseller offered to us for a quarter price also so called Ballon Gas, which is He + Oxygen (up to 40 percent of oxygen),
[21:09] <SP9UOB> radim_OM2AMR: 20L here in Gliwce (Helium 2.2) costs about 89 euros
[21:10] <radim_OM2AMR> great price
[21:10] <SP9UOB> bootle lease fee 35 cents per day
[21:11] <radim_OM2AMR> bottle lease about 50 eur per week :-(
[21:11] <SP9UOB> radim_OM2AMR: where (city) do You live?
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[21:12] <radim_OM2AMR> SP9UOB - Near Piestany
[21:15] <SP9UOB> its 272km from Gliwice - maybe its cost efective to drive to Poland ;-)
[21:15] <SP9UOB> to buy helium
[21:15] <SP9UOB> btw: 5.5 m^3 of hydrogen here costs about 10 euro
[21:16] <Laurenceb_> sup
[21:17] <radim_OM2AMR> great, I will count with it for the future flights ;-)
[21:17] <SP9UOB> ok, see You All
[21:18] <SP9UOB> radim_OM2AMR: Hindenburg disaster look great ;-)
[21:18] <SP9UOB> bye
[21:18] SP9UOB (~verox@matrix.verox.pl) left irc: Quit: "Man that have sex with hole in ground have piece on earth."
[21:18] <radim_OM2AMR> bye 73!
[21:18] Action: Laurenceb_ has been palying with http://www.dowcorning.com/applications/search/default.aspx?R=539EN
[21:18] <Laurenceb_> i have 5 litres
[21:19] <Laurenceb_> seems to be amazingly good for superpressure construction
[21:19] <Laurenceb_> sticks to everything accept PTFE
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[21:54] <jcoxon> evening
[21:54] <Upu> evening
[21:54] <number10> evening
[21:55] <number10> do you know what happened with WB9SA-1?
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[21:56] <jcoxon> number10, not really
[21:56] <jcoxon> it seems that no one could hear it
[21:57] <number10> OK, I suppose we will find out
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[22:05] <Lunar_Lander__> hello jcoxon Upu number10
[22:05] <Upu> evening Lunar_Lander__
[22:05] <Lunar_Lander__> wait
[22:05] Nick change: Lunar_Lander__ -> Lunar_Lander
[22:05] <number10> hello Lunar_Lander
[22:06] <Lunar_Lander> yea we are about 31.5 h from curiosity's landing
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[22:15] <jcoxon> ping russss
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[22:29] <Laurenceb_> haha
[22:30] <Laurenceb_> <Lunar_Lander> yea we are about 31.5 h from curiosity's completed destruction after being tangled in cable
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[22:31] <Lunar_Lander> ohhhhhhhh
[22:32] <Upu> Bet you £10 it gets there successfully Laurenceb. Anything that ridiculously audacious has to succeed
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[22:33] <Upu> 20s leeway on fuel, 78 pyros that have to fire, winds to contend with
[22:34] <Upu> besides its normally the martians that shoot down the probes so NASA have got wise to this and thats why its fitted with a nuclear powered laser
[22:34] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[22:36] <Lunar_Lander> It'll work
[22:36] <Lunar_Lander> it's from JPL
[22:36] <Lunar_Lander> and Howard made it
[22:36] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[22:36] <jcoxon> night all
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[22:36] <Lunar_Lander> (for the Big Bang Theory viewers)
[22:36] <Upu> sounds like a plan
[22:36] <Upu> nn
[22:36] <Lunar_Lander> good night Upu
[22:37] <fsphil> Elvis made it Lunar_Lander
[22:38] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[22:39] <Laurenceb_> not sure if i can be bothered to get up
[22:39] <Laurenceb_> 6:30am?
[22:39] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:39] <Lunar_Lander> but on monday
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[22:41] <nigelvh> I'll just stay up till 10:30 here.
[22:41] <fsphil> silly near-spherical planet
[22:42] <nigelvh> Yay ellipsoids!
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[22:48] <DrLuke> Woop, bought the ublox6 board :)
[22:48] <DrLuke> I'm really feeling ready to launch a balloon soon
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[23:04] <Lunar_Lander> yay
[23:05] <DrLuke> I just wondered, how precide do yagi antennas have to be?
[23:05] <DrLuke> for example my transmitter likes to drift a little bit over temperature
[23:05] <DrLuke> will I still get a good reception when the frequency is off by a few khz?
[23:06] <DrLuke> or even by a whole mhz
[23:06] <Lunar_Lander> good question
[23:07] <craag> Very much. At 434 MHz it'll give you at least 5MHz leeway I'd say.
[23:07] <craag> Probably 10.
[23:08] <DrLuke> oh
[23:08] <DrLuke> that's nice
[23:08] <DrLuke> then I don't have to worry that much about that
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[23:54] <G0DJA> Also, if you use a thick rod for the element, or large tube, the frequency coverage will increase
[23:54] <G0DJA> But only up to a point, so using copper water tube wont be a good idea :-)
[23:54] <natrium42> .
[23:55] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[23:55] <natrium42> whoops
[23:57] <gonzo_> if the chat is still on the bandwidth of a yagi, it depends very much on the design
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[23:58] <gonzo_> the ones that try and squeeze the last bit of gain out of them tend to be narrow band
[23:59] <gonzo_> and I've found that those designs tend to be difficult to reproduce.
[00:00] --- Sun Aug 5 2012