highaltitude.log.20120705

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[00:32] <G0ATW> not updating at all still sending same lat / long / hight as it did at 23:00 but now in Hell?
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[04:25] <griffonbot> Received email: Rob "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Launch tonight (20:00 BST) from Kent heading North"
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[05:24] <M0UPU> yeah its still up
[05:24] <M0UPU> I can hear it
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[05:39] <M0UPU> 4093 meters
[05:42] <RocketBoy> is the altitude working - i thought it was stuck along with the lat/lon?
[05:43] <M0UPU> not sure
[05:43] <M0UPU> can't get a full string
[05:43] <KT5TK> Hell?
[05:43] <RocketBoy> still if its still up :-)
[05:43] <M0UPU> yeah its HELL
[05:43] <M0UPU> at the moment
[05:43] <M0UPU> though it drifts alot when transmitting
[05:43] <M0UPU> batteries might be on the way out
[05:44] <KT5TK> I hope he's not stuck in hell
[05:44] <M0UPU> PICO,857,041111,523691597,10980986,4193,12,799,326*C3A6
[05:44] <M0UPU> well its getting time
[05:45] <M0UPU> though that string didn't upload
[05:46] <KT5TK> Hmm, looks like still the same position & altitude
[05:47] <M0UPU> yes it is
[05:47] <M0UPU> transmitting now
[05:49] <M0UPU> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63720513/Images/HAB/Untitled-1.png
[05:50] <M0UPU> see what happens in 10 mins when it switches to RTTY
[05:50] <KT5TK> Thanks. Nice to see what you're talking about. Difficult to read though.
[05:51] <M0UPU> its drifting when transmitting so I have to keep clicking
[05:51] <KT5TK> Doesn't fldigi have AFC?
[05:51] <RocketBoy> 9min to rtty
[05:52] <M0UPU> it does but it doesn't work with Slow held
[05:52] <M0UPU> I'll switch to RTTY
[05:52] <M0UPU> really interested to know where its got too
[05:52] <KT5TK> Good luck. Hope the GPS recovers
[05:54] <M0UPU> we'll find out in 8 mins :)
[05:57] <fsphil> morning
[05:58] <M0UPU> morning Phil
[05:59] <fsphil> well this has to be the longest duration pico flight so far
[05:59] <M0UPU> 20 seconds
[06:00] <M0UPU> its peeping
[06:00] <M0UPU> not transmitting though
[06:01] <M0UPU> 2 beeps
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[06:02] <jcoxon> hey all
[06:02] <M0UPU> slow held again
[06:02] <M0UPU> morning
[06:02] <jcoxon> its okay
[06:02] <jcoxon> ummm
[06:02] <jcoxon> may have read through the code...
[06:03] <jcoxon> rtty is while(hour > 6 && hour < 23)
[06:03] <M0UPU> tis now
[06:03] <jcoxon> no its not
[06:03] <jcoxon> gps is GMT remember
[06:04] <M0UPU> UTC
[06:04] <jcoxon> yeah yeah
[06:04] <M0UPU> ah >=
[06:04] <jcoxon> so it won't turn on rtty till hour = 7
[06:04] <jcoxon> yeah another mistake
[06:04] <M0UPU> right let me get remote setup
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[06:04] <jcoxon> good signal?
[06:04] <M0UPU> drifting
[06:05] <M0UPU> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63720513/Images/HAB/Untitled-1.png
[06:05] <M0UPU> goes up and down as it transmits
[06:05] <M0UPU> but its definitely alive
[06:05] <M0UPU> would love to know where
[06:05] Action: fsphil is checking
[06:05] <fsphil> what frequency?
[06:06] <M0UPU> 434.200
[06:06] <griffonbot> Received email: James Coxon "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Launch tonight (20:00 BST) from Kent heading North"
[06:07] <jcoxon> i've got to be in work at 0800
[06:07] <M0UPU> Yeah I have to set off soon
[06:07] <jcoxon> could someone reply to the ukhas list with a positon
[06:07] <jcoxon> so that i can find out where it is
[06:07] <M0UPU> sure
[06:07] <M0UPU> want texting ?
[06:07] <jcoxon> being a pico it has to still be in the air for anyone to get a signal
[06:07] <jcoxon> email is fine
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[06:07] <M0UPU> nps
[06:07] <RocketBoy> gonna catch a snooze then <-lightweight BBL
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[06:08] <jcoxon> M0UPU, had to close dl-fldigi as it crashed when switching to slow-hell
[06:08] <M0UPU> its ok
[06:08] <jcoxon> didn't want to re-open it...
[06:08] <M0UPU> thanks :)
[06:09] <M0UPU> yeah I need to work out how to stop that key up
[06:10] <Darkside> so yeah, i wonder where it is!
[06:10] <Darkside> jcoxon: what did you break in the code?
[06:11] <fsphil> I can tell you where it's not :)
[06:11] <M0UPU> > where there should be a >=
[06:11] <M0UPU> no where near NI :)
[06:11] <fsphil> yea, not a trace
[06:12] <fsphil> once a minute isn't it?
[06:12] <Darkside> can anyone get a bearing on it?
[06:12] <Darkside> or, more importantly, can multiple people get bearings on it
[06:12] <Darkside> then we can figure out roughly where it is
[06:12] <fsphil> I do have a line very near 434.200
[06:12] <fsphil> probably just qrm
[06:12] <jcoxon> Darkside, by the time we get the bearings it'll be time for some RTTY
[06:12] <jcoxon> :-p
[06:13] <g4tnx> getting decodes but cant keep up with the freq changes
[06:13] <jcoxon> last night it settled nicely
[06:13] <jcoxon> i wonder if its still warming up in the sun
[06:13] <jcoxon> anyone got a batt V reading?
[06:15] <Darkside> jcoxon: bah
[06:15] <Darkside> just get out some yagis guys
[06:15] <Darkside> only need 2 of you to do it :P
[06:15] <jcoxon> hehe
[06:15] <Darkside> see now that would be an interesting sytem for tracking floaters
[06:16] <Darkside> have a website where people can input their position, and a bearing
[06:16] <jcoxon> i've fixed the bug that stops the hell tx'ing the lat/lon
[06:16] <jcoxon> bit late now though :-p
[06:16] <Darkside> would be interesting to see the cross-bearing locations vs the actual location
[06:16] <jcoxon> we did have that once
[06:16] <jcoxon> someone quickly did a script for it
[06:17] <jcoxon> not sure where it is now
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[06:18] <M0UPU> I have to head to work
[06:18] <M0UPU> back shortly
[06:18] <M0UPU> remote box is on Darkside if you want to have a look
[06:19] <M0UPU> btw don't reboot dl-fldigi as your amp is in line and it TX's up
[06:19] <g4tnx> string 871 061048, 5236.....
[06:19] <Darkside> M0UPU: heh
[06:19] <Darkside> M0UPU: oh, you built an amp?
[06:19] <M0UPU> in fact leave it on RTTY as it crashed last night
[06:19] <Darkside> niiice
[06:19] <Darkside> you guys need to sort out the transmitting issue
[06:19] <M0UPU> yeah I need to drive - stay on line - for the record it works very very well
[06:19] <Darkside> like.. disconnect the ptt line
[06:21] <g4tnx> 523691597
[06:22] <g4tnx> Boo, have to go to works and its a goodish signal
[06:23] <jcoxon> g4tnx, thanks for listening
[06:23] <jcoxon> not long till rtty
[06:23] <jcoxon> i hope
[06:25] <fsphil> yea definitely no trace here, which means it's probably still near the coast or over the north sea
[06:26] <fsphil> although in saying that, with the low altitude there might be something blocking it
[06:27] Action: jcoxon fixes the code for next time...
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[06:30] <g4tnx> 062741 5236x1597 10980986,4193
[06:30] <g4tnx> string no 873
[06:30] <g4tnx> oh for rtty
[06:30] <jcoxon> g4tnx, did you get the number after that?
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[06:33] <g4tnx> 523691597,10980986,4193,8,836,348+
[06:33] <nosebleed_> CAA not responding
[06:34] <g4tnx> from a sting a few mins ago
[06:34] <nosebleed_> Did anyone here flied his balloob without permission ?
[06:34] <jcoxon> okay so teh battery voltage is good
[06:34] <fsphil> nice
[06:34] <jcoxon> though it'll drop once we power up the rtty
[06:34] <jcoxon> as the gps will draw current and pull the voltage down a bit
[06:35] <jcoxon> right i better go to work
[06:35] <jcoxon> fingers crossed...
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[06:36] <fsphil> I'll have a listen again later
[06:36] <number10> what is the current freq
[06:36] <fsphil> last I heard 434.200
[06:37] <number10> tnx fsphil
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[06:49] <g0mjw> GM everyone
[06:49] <UpuWork> morning
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[06:55] <g0mjw> Just a bit too weak to copy.
[06:56] <UpuWork> where are you located ?
[06:56] <g0mjw> Oxford
[06:56] <UpuWork> its due to switch to RTTY in 4 mins
[06:57] <UpuWork> ok its likely to be up north
[06:57] <g0mjw> Will head of for work just after 8
[06:58] <jdtanner_> If it is up north I'm guaranteed not to hear it ;)
[06:58] <jdtanner_> Morning btw
[06:58] <UpuWork> morning
[06:58] <UpuWork> try it jdtanner_
[06:58] <UpuWork> its there
[06:58] <UpuWork> 434.200
[06:58] <fsphil> t minus 60 seconds
[06:58] <jdtanner_> I'll have a look
[06:59] <fsphil> lets hope the gps bug is a fault of it being in hell mode
[06:59] <UpuWork> 45secs
[06:59] <fsphil> which sounds like a doom difficulty level
[06:59] <fsphil> "wimp mode ... hell mode"
[07:00] <UpuWork> ok
[07:00] <number10> dont think my antenna is high enough here at work
[07:00] <UpuWork> wake up little pico
[07:00] <fsphil> it's just past the hour now
[07:00] <jdtanner_> Nowt
[07:00] <UpuWork> pips
[07:01] <UpuWork> 2 pips
[07:01] <jdtanner_> ...although I do have a particularly nice cup of tea on the go
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[07:01] <fsphil> lol
[07:01] <UpuWork> RTTY
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[07:01] <fsphil> result!
[07:01] <UpuWork> ffs
[07:02] <g0mjw> Got it. Bit weak but might get something.
[07:02] <UpuWork> and dl-flgi crashes
[07:02] <fsphil> nooooooooo
[07:02] <jdtanner_> Got something very weak
[07:02] <UpuWork> ok here we go
[07:02] <fsphil> yes!
[07:02] <junderwood> Dial freq?
[07:02] <UpuWork> lol
[07:02] <fsphil> it's right beside M0DTS
[07:02] <UpuWork> Newscastle
[07:03] <junderwood> That explains why I can't hear it
[07:03] <fsphil> altitude has risen
[07:03] <junderwood> Oop north
[07:03] <fsphil> lol
[07:03] <fsphil> horizon is just a bit too far for me too
[07:03] <fsphil> right, gotta go to work
[07:03] <number10> bit far for me and this scanner
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[07:03] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Launch tonight (20:00 BST) from Kent heading North"
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[07:04] <UpuWork> dl-fldigi isn't happy at all
[07:04] <g0mjw> Variable freq
[07:04] <jdtanner_> Yep, all over the place
[07:04] <UpuWork> batteries probably
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[07:05] <g0mjw> Too weak.
[07:05] <jdtanner_> 434.1995
[07:05] <g0mjw> 434.200 for me
[07:06] <g0mjw> Drifting too fast for copy. Pity
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[07:07] <UpuWork> AFC can keep up with it
[07:07] <UpuWork> jsut
[07:09] <jdtanner_> Nothing again I'm afraid
[07:09] <UpuWork> might be behind the hilsl for you
[07:09] <UpuWork> hills
[07:09] <UpuWork> its very odd, stable then drifts like a bugger
[07:09] <jdtanner_> Yep, probably right
[07:09] <UpuWork> what was the battery raw last night ?
[07:10] <junderwood> 360
[07:11] <UpuWork> 360 ?
[07:11] <UpuWork> its 783 now
[07:11] <junderwood> OOps that was temp
[07:11] <junderwood> 865
[07:11] <junderwood> @ 19:42
[07:11] <junderwood> according to the tracker
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[07:12] <UpuWork> 1.35v per cell
[07:13] <UpuWork> I'll give it another hour tops
[07:13] <g0mjw> It is very weak here but it is a long way away. No chance of a full decode
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[07:15] <jdtanner> I think I need to get an antenna on the roof
[07:15] <UpuWork> if it drops below 700 battery reading as long as its linear thats on the cliff and it will have about 5 mins left
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[07:20] <UpuWork> morning Darkside
[07:20] <UpuWork> err
[07:20] <UpuWork> daveake
[07:21] <daveake> morning Lunar
[07:21] <daveake> er UpuWork
[07:21] <number10> XD
[07:21] <UpuWork> hah a fsck off
[07:21] <daveake> lol
[07:21] <number10> XDXD
[07:21] <daveake> Isee a bonnie fligth this morning
[07:21] <UpuWork> yeah don't think it has long left
[07:22] <UpuWork> 1.35v per cell by my calcs
[07:22] <daveake> And the countries are labelled on spacenear. That's handy :p
[07:23] <daveake> How come "Pico_chase" is in Germany? That's not gonna help
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[07:24] <fsphil> is someone expecting some kind of wormhole?
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[07:25] <number10> I think it has been added to let the pico chase driver he is in the wrong country
[07:25] <daveake> :)
[07:26] <daveake> Maybe the wormhole will happen if he hits 88mph .....
[07:26] <fsphil> hah
[07:26] <fsphil> the battery voltage needs to be in the gigawatt range
[07:26] <daveake> true
[07:27] <daveake> I'll ignore you equating voltage with power as it's early :p
[07:29] <fsphil> yea was wondering if you'd spot that :p
[07:29] <fsphil> it's really low current :)
[07:29] <UpuWork> its a very manual job this tracking
[07:30] <junderwood> battery seems to be improving - 824
[07:30] <junderwood> Warming up?
[07:30] <UpuWork> is the temp going up ?
[07:31] <daveake> I lost telemetry last night a short while before it switched to hell
[07:31] <junderwood> If the GPS has a good solution it may be going into a lower power mode.
[07:31] <UpuWork> thats because its up narf
[07:31] <daveake> Only running a yagi in the loft with cheap coax
[07:31] <daveake> and without a working pre-amp
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[07:34] <UpuWork> telemetry line 1000
[07:34] <UpuWork> is corrupt
[07:34] <UpuWork> :)
[07:34] <UpuWork> 434.198 now
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[07:37] <UpuWork> Shame M0DTS had to go to work
[07:37] <daveake> tsk, priorities ....
[07:37] <number10> shame I had to go to work aswell
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[07:57] <jdtanner> I can see Pico in the waterfall&but it is up and down the freqs like a fiddler's elbow
[07:57] <UpuWork> it settles down
[07:57] <UpuWork> then gets bored and goes for a wander
[08:00] <Darkside> that went a fair way
[08:00] <jdtanner> Yeah, and it is very very weak. No decodes here.
[08:01] <jdtanner> Going to call it a day I think&sorry for not being much help.
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[08:02] Nick change: jdtanner_ -> jdtanner
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[08:17] <UpuWork> I'm struggling with this PICO now
[08:17] <fsphil> you're our only hope :)
[08:18] <number10> bunk off work and head north
[08:19] <UpuWork> lol
[08:21] RocketBoy (~steverand@b01a8048.bb.sky.com) joined #highaltitude.
[08:22] <fsphil> looks like it's heading back to land
[08:22] <UpuWork> too much drift really
[08:24] <UpuWork> $PICO,1260,08:23:52,553256582,-1377196,5395,10,824,357*FA1
[08:24] <UpuWork> so close...
[08:25] <UpuWork> got one
[08:25] <fsphil> would a wider rtty filter help?
[08:26] <UpuWork> possibly
[08:26] <UpuWork> signal just isn't strong enough
[08:26] <UpuWork> Is suspect its heading into my blind spot
[08:26] <fsphil> yea
[08:27] <fsphil> it's as close as it's going to get to me now, and still just too far
[08:27] <fsphil> we need scottish hams :)
[08:31] WillDuckworth (c2498332@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.73.131.50) joined #highaltitude.
[08:32] <WillDuckworth> is it still going?
[08:33] <fsphil> it is!
[08:33] <WillDuckworth> nice one
[08:33] <fsphil> though nearly out of coverage
[08:33] <fsphil> upu's the last receiver, and signal is fading
[08:33] <Darkside> damn, would be nice if M0DTS was about
[08:34] <fsphil> yea
[08:37] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Launch tonight (20:00 BST) from Kent heading North"
[08:37] <UpuWork> he's at work
[08:37] <UpuWork> he tagged it at 4am this morning
[08:42] <UpuWork> I think I'm out
[08:42] <UpuWork> can see it but I can't decode it any more
[08:42] <UpuWork> needs moar yagi
[08:42] F5APQ (5a01c54f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.90.1.197.79) joined #highaltitude.
[08:44] <UpuWork> ICO,1369,08:43:07,554009504,-14824500,5389,0,816,357*6BB
[08:46] <eroomde> if you were to only put a webcam on it you would see the entire uk coast
[08:47] <eroomde> which i think is filled with bbc presenters with massivly strong regional accents felluming (filing) pieces about how exciting our coast line is
[08:47] <eroomde> (filming*)
[08:48] <Darkside> lol
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[08:51] Nick change: M0UPU -> UPu
[08:51] Nick change: UPu -> pu
[08:51] <pu> fail fail fail
[08:51] <eroomde> nice one
[08:51] <jonsowman> lol
[08:51] Nick change: pu -> Upu
[08:52] <daveake> lol
[08:53] F5APQ (5a01c54f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.90.1.197.79) left irc: Quit: Page closed
[08:53] Nick change: eroomde -> Oopu
[08:53] Action: Oopu makes hab tutorials for java programmers
[08:54] Nick change: daveake -> YagiBare
[08:54] Nick change: Oopu -> DiPolanski
[08:54] Action: DiPolanski makes arty films about hab
[08:54] <UpuWork> XD
[08:55] Nick change: YagiBare -> daveake
[08:55] Nick change: DiPolanski -> eroomde
[08:56] <UpuWork> don't mock me or I will force you to watch "an introduction to dl-fldigi" video
[08:56] <eroomde> come with me if you want to hab
[08:56] <UpuWork> lol
[08:59] <UpuWork> oo shiny things turned up
[09:00] <eroomde> my pens arrived yesterday
[09:00] <eroomde> excitement reached fever pitch in the office
[09:00] Action: SpeedEvil imagines that in 'Pauline's' voice.
[09:00] <eroomde> who is Pauline?
[09:00] <SpeedEvil> Paulines Pens.
[09:01] <SpeedEvil> The League of Gentlemen.
[09:02] <eroomde> i distantly recall
[09:02] <daveake> Were they delivered by Veet Voojagig?
[09:05] <eroomde> there is some serious reference hopping going on
[09:05] <eroomde> making me dizzy
[09:06] <UpuWork> https://www.dropbox.com/s/e16w1sws629aw54/2012-07-05%2010.02.12.jpg
[09:07] <UpuWork> right got a meeting, PICO is still up there somewhere
[09:08] <eroomde> nice
[09:09] <kokey> ruddy hell that's pico's done a nice trip
[09:09] <kokey> s/\'//
[09:09] <kokey> and s
[09:09] <kokey> nevermind my typos
[09:10] <eroomde> the dutch influence again
[09:10] <kokey> ja
[09:10] <eroomde> thatsch picosch donesch a nisch trip
[09:10] <kokey> haha
[09:11] <kokey> no one in scotland has a radio?
[09:13] <SpeedEvil> Not here.
[09:13] <eroomde> worth an ask on #hamradio
[09:13] <eroomde> perhaps
[09:14] <kokey> yeah better tell them it's not from libya
[09:15] <eroomde> would be a nice way to distribute al magrahi's (sp) ashes
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[09:22] <craag> Does anyone know of any launches planned for this weekend?
[09:23] <craag> I'm getting kit together of VHF NFD and wondering if I should take HAB-tracking gear.
[09:25] <UpuWork> Its still in the air
[09:25] <UpuWork> I can still see it faintly on the water fall
[09:26] <UpuWork> not sure about this weekend
[09:26] <UpuWork> I know there are a few in the wings
[09:27] <UpuWork> just waiting on better weather
[09:27] <craag> Ok, I'll pack it if I have space :)
[09:27] <craag> Yeah.. weather is not looking good for tents and masts at the moment tbh..
[09:27] <UpuWork> in fairness people usually announce it
[09:28] <eroomde> there are some happy storms this weekend
[09:28] <eroomde> a good opportunity for a storm-hab is nothing else
[09:28] <UpuWork> PICO is 434,196,200 now
[09:31] <griffonbot> Received email: Rob Swinbank "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Launch tonight (20:00 BST) from Kent heading North"
[09:32] nick_ (~nick_@ltbs.vm.bytemark.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[09:33] <UpuWork> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63720513/Images/HAB/weakpico.png
[09:36] <eroomde> is that your tuning knob or is it feeling a bit drunk?
[09:36] <UpuWork> been doing that all morning
[09:38] <eroomde> whta's the payload case like o you know?
[09:38] <craag> It obviously had a hell of a night..
[09:38] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Launch tonight (20:00 BST) from Kent heading North"
[09:39] nosebleed_ (~nosebleed@kotama.dataways.gr) joined #highaltitude.
[09:39] <UpuWork> not sure what James launched
[09:40] <UpuWork> I think I'm going to loose any signal shortly as its going to be heading behind all the hills
[09:41] <UpuWork> oh G0DJA got a position
[09:41] <UpuWork> nice one
[09:42] <eroomde> he used his devine powers
[09:42] <eroomde> divine, even
[09:42] <Laurenceb> heading towards speedevil
[09:43] <Laurenceb> http://i.imgur.com/oC6jW.jpg
[09:43] <Laurenceb> meanwhile in stm32 land
[09:44] <UpuWork> it'll fly
[09:44] <nosebleed_> Hi, have anyone worked with linux systems on UEFI machines?
[09:44] <griffonbot> Received email: James Coxon "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Launch tonight (20:00 BST) from Kent heading North"
[09:45] <UpuWork> I'm out
[09:46] <nick_> Are UEFI machines on the market already?
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[09:49] G0ATW (51909922@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.144.153.34) joined #highaltitude.
[09:49] <nosebleed_> nick_, of course. And I have one right next to me :)
[09:50] <nick_> Does that mean you can only run Fedora on it?
[09:51] <WillDuckworth> ubuntu works
[09:51] <WillDuckworth> sles / vmware ok too
[09:52] <nick_> How do they manage to boot?
[09:52] <WillDuckworth> magic ;) just works
[09:52] <nick_> Don't they need some magic key from windows?
[09:53] <nosebleed_> my question is how they determine in the setup procedure whether the system is under UEFI or BIOS
[09:53] <nosebleed_> because BIOS and UEFI need different partition schemes
[09:53] <nosebleed_> it's so odd
[09:55] <griffonbot> Received email: Dave "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Launch tonight (20:00 BST) from Kent heading North"
[09:59] <Laurenceb> anyone here going to farnbough air show?
[10:00] <russss> me
[10:00] JFS1 (d4550d8f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.212.85.13.143) joined #highaltitude.
[10:00] <kokey> I guess UEFI is not an issue if you bought a machine that didn't have the Microsoft OEM tax applied to it
[10:01] <nick_> Ah, yeah.
[10:01] <nick_> Windows 8 isn't out yet is it?
[10:02] <kokey> doubt it
[10:03] <Laurenceb> russss: do i just need a £35 ticket?
[10:03] <kokey> it's Microsoft we're talking about here
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[10:03] <russss> Laurenceb: yes. Well, I'm going on the Friday when it's £30
[10:03] <Laurenceb> ah
[10:03] Action: Laurenceb cheacks train fares
[10:04] <Laurenceb> saturday works out cheapest for me
[10:05] <Laurenceb> Print At Home orders will be charged a transaction fee of £0.50.
[10:05] <Laurenceb> lol
[10:09] <daveake> ooh update
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[10:10] <SpeedEvil> http://xkcd.com/ Genius.
[10:11] <daveake> http://xkcd.com/874/ seems appropriate lately
[10:13] <SpeedEvil> JHas anyone tried one of those USB SDR TV receivers, and the filter proposed?
[10:16] <Laurenceb> £1 transaction charge
[10:16] <Laurenceb> wtf
[10:16] <Darkside> SpeedEvil: Upu was using one today
[10:16] <Darkside> it works
[10:17] <Darkside> needs more testing
[10:17] <kokey> what filter?
[10:17] <Darkside> the HAMAmp board
[10:17] <kokey> I got two of those rtl sdr dongles, one e4000 and one the fc<historical date>
[10:17] <Darkside> SAW filter + LNA
[10:19] <X-Scale> Air France AF 447 report due today. Can't wait to read it from cover to cover.
[10:19] <kokey> that the one with the pilots in the storm screwup?
[10:20] <X-Scale> exactly...in the middle of the Atlantic
[10:21] <kokey> yeah that was quite something
[10:21] <X-Scale> http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/flight.af.447/reports.php
[10:23] <SpeedEvil> Are the interrim reporrts available?
[10:23] <SpeedEvil> Am I clicking the wrong bit?
[10:24] jcoxon (~jcoxon@212.183.128.49) joined #highaltitude.
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[10:32] <eroomde> found out what was causing the valve problems on our rocket
[10:32] <eroomde> o-rings failing in the cold due to the nox expansion
[10:32] <eroomde> stop me when this sounds familiar
[10:33] <kokey> sounds like some of our weekends with nox
[10:34] <russss> heh
[10:34] <eroomde> why do you spend weekends with nox?
[10:35] <kokey> well, ok, just parts of weekends
[10:36] <eroomde> car racing or more dutch stuff?
[10:36] <kokey> but it's good to have at least one spare whipped cream dispenser around in case one freeze up
[10:38] <daveake> eroomde Hmmmm ... can't think where I've heard of that happening before ....
[10:38] <jcoxon> Can someone pop on to spacenear.us and give me an update
[10:38] <kokey> russss: I moved out of reflection house in feb, good thing since I think it's taken years off my life
[10:38] <daveake> PICO Time: 2012-07-05 10:10:41 Position: 55.732387,-1.966556 Altitude: 5658 m Rate: 0.1 m/s Max. Altitude: 5658 m Battery Raw: 815 Satellites: 9 Temperature Internal Raw: 365 Receivers: G0DJA
[10:38] G8KNN-Jon (~Jon@cpc1-cmbg10-0-0-cust144.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com) joined #highaltitude.
[10:39] <Laurenceb> need some receivers
[10:39] jonquark (jonl@nat/ibm/x-avmdzbblpjcqwfim) joined #highaltitude.
[10:41] <jcoxon> Wow
[10:41] <daveake> Nice flight well done!
[10:41] <daveake> Upu dropped out a while back; G0DJA has had a couple of packets or so since then
[10:42] <jcoxon> Anyone know anyone up north that could help?
[10:42] <kokey> perhaps there's a scottish ham forum somewhere
[10:42] <jcoxon> Could try on #hamradio
[10:43] <daveake> http://www.dxzone.com/catalog/Ham_Radio/Clubs/Europe/UK/Scotland/
[10:44] <nick_> so the sensor guy I spoke to said he might give me one of the deals I asked for :)
[10:44] <jcoxon> I'm stuck at work
[10:46] <nick_> So I could get 8 sensors for £400
[10:46] <nick_> Instead of 2 for £220
[10:47] <kokey> what kind of balloon is this for the pico?
[10:48] <kokey> I wonder if it's swinging and spinning much
[10:49] <UpuWork> M0DTS is back home at 14:30 jcoxon
[10:50] <UpuWork> whats the run time on the batteries ?
[10:50] <Darkside> jcoxon: i'mt rying to get hold of hibby
[10:50] <Darkside> he's at strathclydei think
[10:50] <Darkside> which is up that way i guess
[10:50] <nick_> So now I need to see if I can scrape together another ~£200
[10:51] <jcoxon> It should hold, I got 24hrs I think
[10:51] <kokey> nick_: what sensor?
[10:51] <UpuWork> ok cool
[10:52] <nick_> SiPMs
[10:52] <nick_> The prices are crazy
[10:52] <nick_> £150 for a one off, £110 for 2, £50 for 10
[10:56] <nosebleed_> what happens if i fly the balloon without permission from CAA ?
[10:57] <fsphil> depends on your laws
[10:57] <UpuWork> Do you have Secret Police ?
[10:57] <fsphil> well if he knows about them, they're not very secret
[10:58] <fsphil> you know, this pico could be up there for days
[10:59] <jcoxon> I think solar panels are the next step
[10:59] <fsphil> absolutly
[10:59] <fsphil> +e
[10:59] <cuddykid> +1
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[11:00] <eroomde> jcoxon: what is the mass of this pico?
[11:00] <jcoxon> 29
[11:00] <kokey> yeah I guess those light solarv films could do
[11:00] <fsphil> this time of year you could almost go without a battery
[11:00] <jcoxon> Yeah interest how it wasn't a total disaster with no location
[11:01] <kokey> i wonder what configuration, perhaps a bit like a ring of a cone
[11:01] <fsphil> a cone shape maybe
[11:01] <fsphil> ah
[11:01] <fsphil> echo :)
[11:01] <kokey> :)
[11:02] <fsphil> have a couple on the cord
[11:02] <jcoxon> Quite low alt
[11:02] <Darkside> welp, thats another miniseries down
[11:02] <kokey> actually, it could be an upside down cone even, since there's probably always good reflection off the clouds
[11:02] <fsphil> good point
[11:02] <Darkside> sheeit, 29 grams
[11:03] <Darkside> jcoxon: got a pic of it?
[11:03] <cuddykid> http://habe.acudworth.co.uk/blog/ - some graphs on there of solar data
[11:03] <jcoxon> Not to hand
[11:03] <cuddykid> fairly consistent in the clouds
[11:04] <fsphil> the flexible panels should be pretty light
[11:05] <fsphil> they probably won't have enough push to get the gps locked though
[11:05] <fsphil> will need some kind of storage
[11:05] <Darkside> mm you'd need decent panels, like, cubesat rated stuff
[11:05] <Darkside> but they'll break on landing
[11:05] <Darkside> and $$
[11:05] <fsphil> the cheaper panels would do though, just with a bit less current?
[11:06] Lunar_Lander (~gd-compto@p54A06190.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #highaltitude.
[11:06] <fsphil> maybe charge it up in a supercap
[11:06] <Lunar_Lander> WOW PICO HAS AN AWESOME PERFORMANCE
[11:06] <fsphil> I had to read that twice
[11:06] <Lunar_Lander> why?
[11:06] <Lunar_Lander> the balloon reached Scotland
[11:06] <Lunar_Lander> that is enormous
[11:07] <jcoxon> Any new data?
[11:08] <kokey> yeah it's thanks for playing better tennis
[11:09] <fsphil> weird, maplin just emailed me about solar panels
[11:09] weissbier (mtnGaDl1Lj@2001:470:1f14:198a::2) joined #highaltitude.
[11:10] <Darkside> THEY KNOW
[11:12] <kokey> you can always get small solar cell sections for cheap but they're the heavy glass ones
[11:12] <kokey> the factory reject bits
[11:12] <jcoxon> Any new telemetry?
[11:12] <UpuWork> negative jcoxon
[11:12] <UpuWork> M0DTS home in 2 hours
[11:13] <UpuWork> Where is Hibby ?
[11:13] <Darkside> he didn't respond on G+
[11:13] <Darkside> and he's now offline
[11:14] <UpuWork> Global Tuners ?
[11:14] <Darkside> nothing that far north i think
[11:14] <kokey> doing a google for scottish ham has made me hungry
[11:14] <Darkside> ill have a look tho
[11:15] <fsphil> there where a couple of stations near edinburgh at one time
[11:15] <UpuWork> someone tried #hamradio ?
[11:16] <Darkside> yep
[11:16] <kokey> or maybe post on uk.radio.amateur?
[11:16] <Darkside> nothing
[11:16] <kokey> they seem to be fairly active
[11:16] <UpuWork> I'd be surprised if it wasn't out of M0DTS's range in 2 hours
[11:17] <Darkside> just seens to be local noise at isle of man
[11:17] <Darkside> but the antenna there is crap
[11:17] <Darkside> Receiver: Icom PCR-1000
[11:17] <Darkside> Antenna: Icom supplied telescopic in attic...
[11:17] <Darkside> receiver isn't that good either
[11:17] <fsphil> dem yorkshire hills will be hiding it from the isle of man
[11:17] navrac (545c0e05@gateway/web/freenode/ip.84.92.14.5) joined #highaltitude.
[11:18] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "[UKHAS] HIBBY Wake up :)"
[11:18] <Darkside> looool
[11:18] <jcoxon> Oh well
[11:19] <jcoxon> It seems like a stable float
[11:19] <navrac> nice one jcoxon - sadly only just seen the email so quickly put the aerial up - but i guess i'm too late
[11:19] <UpuWork> transmissions were very odd
[11:19] <jcoxon> So no reason why it won't keep going
[11:19] <UpuWork> drifted badly, then stablised then drifted back up stablised etc
[11:20] <Darkside> maybe call up some IRLP nodes up there and ask for help?
[11:20] <UpuWork> but it was decodable
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[11:25] <fsphil> I have emailed GM8OTI
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[11:27] <UpuWork> I'll mail the Aberdeen Radio Society, they meet this evening might pick it up
[11:27] <daveake> [20:40] <jcoxon> now for the sweepstake on float altitude
[11:27] <daveake> [20:41] <daveake> 5750
[11:27] <daveake> Not far off now :D
[11:28] <fsphil> doesn't that just mean the altitude it begins to float at? :)
[11:28] <daveake> Well I was the only one to guess so I win anyway :p
[11:28] <fsphil> lol
[11:28] <fsphil> yep, you where closest
[11:28] <navrac> I'll make a retrospective guess if it helps
[11:29] <daveake> Depends if that means I'm first or last
[11:29] <fsphil> it is a lovely float
[11:29] <UpuWork> whats it transmitting 50 baud 7n1 ?
[11:30] <fsphil> 8 bit
[11:30] <fsphil> 8n2
[11:30] <fsphil> 470hz shift
[11:30] <fsphil> PICO isn't it?
[11:30] <UpuWork> yes
[11:30] <fsphil> yea, that's right
[11:31] wack (5195132f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.149.19.47) joined #highaltitude.
[11:31] <kokey> I've made a post on uk.radio.amateur
[11:31] <griffonbot> Received email: Dave "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Launch tonight (20:00 BST) from Kent heading North"
[11:36] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[11:36] <UpuWork> wow
[11:36] <UpuWork> new location
[11:37] <fsphil> look how far it is!
[11:37] <fsphil> hmm.. that horizon has gotten closer to me
[11:37] <Lunar_Lander> awesome!
[11:38] <UpuWork> in caps please Lunar
[11:38] <fsphil> lol
[11:38] <UpuWork> I mailed Aberdeen
[11:38] <Lunar_Lander> AWESOME
[11:39] <UpuWork> result
[11:39] <UpuWork> G0EHV
[11:39] <UpuWork> why hello
[11:39] <UpuWork> thats almost in your range fsphil
[11:39] <fsphil> just what I was thinking
[11:39] <fsphil> checking now
[11:40] <Darkside> more positions!
[11:41] <Darkside> fsphil: get a big yagi
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[11:42] Rob_M0DTS_work (d917e473@gateway/web/freenode/ip.217.23.228.115) joined #highaltitude.
[11:43] <UpuWork> hey Rob
[11:43] <fsphil> I'm at work Darkside :)
[11:43] <Rob_M0DTS_work> HI, managed to get Eddie up north to tune in for us!
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[11:43] <UpuWork> I wouldn't rush home its going to be out of your range
[11:43] <hibby> someone called me?
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[11:43] <UpuWork> Hibby !
[11:43] <UpuWork> you got a radio mate ?
[11:43] <UpuWork> http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[11:43] <hibby> have I been spamming?
[11:43] <UpuWork> James sent you a present
[11:43] <hibby> I've only got 144 access these days :(
[11:43] <hibby> however, I'll motivate the natives
[11:43] <UpuWork> many thx
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[11:44] <UpuWork> 434.200 ish 8n2
[11:44] <UpuWork> 50 baud RTTY
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[11:44] <hibby> split?
[11:44] <UpuWork> split ?
[11:44] <fsphil> shift
[11:44] <kokey> 470hz
[11:44] <kokey> ?
[11:44] <UpuWork> oh sorry
[11:45] F5APQ (5a01c54f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.90.1.197.79) joined #highaltitude.
[11:45] <hibby> yeah. it's been a while since I've been near a radio. no longer an academic/new (cool) job
[11:45] <Rob_M0DTS_work> I will look later but probably out of range, just came on to check g0ehv got my email...GL ttfn
[11:45] <UpuWork> he did Rob_M0DTS_work
[11:45] <UpuWork> thanks
[11:45] <UpuWork> no probs hibby I mailed Aberdeen radio amateur club
[11:45] <UpuWork> and someone called Geoff in Inverness but his mail bounced
[11:46] <hibby> I'm moving there next week
[11:46] <kokey> Inverness, is it nice?
[11:46] <Darkside> cold i bet
[11:47] <Rob_M0DTS_work> will see if i can find any more noth listeners.. right must go..byeee
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[11:47] <fsphil> scotland isn't always cold
[11:47] <hibby> Aberdeen, not Inversneck. It's noticably colder than Glasgow
[11:47] <hibby> also, however, significantly drier
[11:47] <Laurenceb> what envelope is this?
[11:47] <fsphil> no sign of a signal here still
[11:48] <fsphil> although if it keeps increasing in altitude
[11:48] <hibby> but it's ok, as I'll be rich enough to heat the house accordingly.
[11:48] <Laurenceb> SpeedEvil: binoculars?
[11:48] <hibby> UpuWork: i've sent some messages around the glasgow hams I know
[11:49] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Launch tonight (20:00 BST) from Kent heading North"
[11:49] <UpuWork> ok cool
[11:49] <UpuWork> see if we can get anything its moving quicker now
[11:50] <Darkside> you guys should put velocity in your payload packets
[11:50] <Darkside> its damn useful
[11:50] <hibby> calculate it yourself!
[11:50] <kokey> hard to do if you're missing lots of data points
[11:50] <Darkside> i find it useful to be able to see it on the incoming data stream
[11:51] <hibby> I know, I was being daft. It's a straight pull in from the gps as well, none of that maths, eh?
[11:51] <Darkside> yes
[11:51] <Darkside> i'm not sure what standard NMEA sentence it's in, but we pull it out of the ublox PUBX sentence
[11:51] <jonsowman> RMC i think
[11:52] <Darkside> we use it quite often to get an idea of where it's going to land
[11:52] <hibby> that's because PUBX is awesome
[11:52] <Darkside> esp when the wind data is inaccurate, as it often is
[11:52] <Darkside> well, towards the later stages of a flight anyway
[11:58] <navrac> is this a single balloon pico launch? mass? expected battery life? Sorry trying to catch up here
[11:59] <UpuWork> yes, low, 24 hours
[12:00] <eroomde> 30g=ish i think jcoxon said
[12:00] <UpuWork> I mailed someone in Stornoway
[12:00] <UpuWork> not quite there yes but might as well ask
[12:00] <eroomde> he's probably stornaway from his desk at the moment
[12:00] <UpuWork> why can't radio amateurs keep their mail addresses/websites upto date
[12:00] <UpuWork> bounce
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[12:01] <eroomde> so i am having earl grey now whenever i want coffee, as an experiment
[12:01] <fsphil> hot?
[12:01] <nick_> lady grey >> earl grey
[12:01] Action: hibby suggests masala chai too
[12:01] <eroomde> the results so far are that i had a headache and couldn't keep my eyes open at 9.30pm yesterday
[12:01] <hibby> hahah
[12:01] <hibby> caffeine is a natural headache solution
[12:01] <fsphil> I'm glad I never tried caffine :)
[12:01] <eroomde> but hopefully i will break through
[12:02] <nick_> I had a friend who cut down from 8 to 4 coffees a day and had a hell of a first week.
[12:02] <eroomde> i was on about 9 or 10 cups of quite strong balck coffee a day until tuesday so it's time to cut back
[12:02] <navrac> I switched from 10 a day to decaf. Not a pleasant experience
[12:02] <nick_> Don't you get more caffeine from tea anyway?
[12:02] <hibby> oh, yes, that is time
[12:02] <eroomde> i'm still having a mug with toast at 7am because there is litterally no way I would get any work done if i were to go completely cold turkey
[12:02] <fsphil> the smell of the stuff is enough to make me ill
[12:03] <hibby> fsphil: mrs h says that. when I'm grinding it or using the espresso machine in the house.
[12:03] <eroomde> i adore the smell
[12:03] <nick_> My fiancée is addicted to iced tea.
[12:03] <eroomde> more than anything
[12:03] <eroomde> we roast all our own coffee beans at work
[12:03] <daveake> I'm with fsphil
[12:03] <nick_> When she's forced to use stuff available here she uses pg tips
[12:03] <daveake> Well not physically
[12:03] <eroomde> it's a very very serious coffee office
[12:03] <daveake> And not on the onions issue
[12:03] <hibby> eroomde: amazing
[12:04] <eroomde> we have 2 roasters and a big grinder and a couple of large cafetieres
[12:04] <eroomde> for 3 employees
[12:04] <WillDuckworth> cool beans
[12:04] <fsphil> lol
[12:04] <nick_> You should move from coffee to espresso
[12:04] <nick_> (although a decent espresso machine is not cheap)
[12:05] <eroomde> i don't like cheap espresso machines and am not sure the budget will cover a proper one atm
[12:05] <eroomde> also more maintenance
[12:05] <nick_> My friend got a really good one cheaply because it was broken.
[12:05] <nick_> One 5chf valve later he was up and running again.
[12:05] <eroomde> but the coffee thing does work. in combination with expensive biscuits, we get loads of people just stopping by the office from other similar companies, just for coffee
[12:06] <eroomde> and then of course they see the hoverig rocket or whatever and start talking shop
[12:06] <eroomde> and cool stuff happens
[12:06] <nick_> Are you based at a "science park" or similar?
[12:07] <eroomde> yes
[12:07] <eroomde> there are a couple of other spacey companies on site
[12:07] <eroomde> it used to be the rocket propulsion establishment
[12:08] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: ?
[12:10] <hibby> only person to get back says he can't hear it.
[12:11] <UpuWork> rgr thx
[12:11] <fsphil> still nothing here
[12:11] <hibby> but he has a lot of kit, so the chance still exists for him to rig something together to hear it. He's mental like that..
[12:11] <UpuWork> lol
[12:11] <UpuWork> We need people on the Isle of Skye next
[12:12] <UpuWork> Then Stornoway
[12:12] <eroomde> or really north
[12:12] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: Oh
[12:12] <UpuWork> then we are screwed :)
[12:12] <eroomde> it's heading towards the resting place of the upper stage of our rocket
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[12:12] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: Damn - that (last point) is right overhead almost.
[12:12] <fsphil> we need boats!
[12:12] <eroomde> which is about half way between inverness and john -o-groats
[12:12] <fsphil> boats are awsome!
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[12:12] <SpeedEvil> (for values of overhead that include slightly above the horizon)
[12:13] <SpeedEvil> The last point was 2 mins, or 1h 2 mins ago?
[12:13] <UpuWork> 2 mins
[12:13] <UpuWork> UC
[12:13] <UpuWork> UTC
[12:13] <UpuWork> current telemetry is best telemetry
[12:13] <fsphil> 434.200 is quite noisy here
[12:13] <jcoxon> Details?
[12:13] <UpuWork> its still transmitting and currently location is valid jcoxon
[12:14] <SpeedEvil> So, east-northeast, and 5km up/40km away
[12:14] <UpuWork> about to land fall in scotland
[12:14] <jcoxon> Where? Who rxing
[12:14] <UpuWork> M0DTS got G0EHV who is in Sunderland on it
[12:14] Action: SpeedEvil wishes he had a radio.
[12:15] <SpeedEvil> I could damn near pick it up on a coherer.
[12:15] <SpeedEvil> About to try binocs.
[12:15] <UpuWork> I don't think G0EHV is on here
[12:15] <UpuWork> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=eb62222bea6f841af27628f0eef01e2ad22f6c89
[12:15] <UpuWork> Storoway or bust
[12:15] <fsphil> I believe +100 hab points for a confirmed visual sighting :)
[12:16] <SpeedEvil> Did not try binocs, as it's doing the hazy thing today.
[12:16] <hibby> I was in stornoway a couple of weeks ago
[12:16] <hibby> lovely
[12:16] <UpuWork> know any one with a radio there ? :)
[12:16] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: +10000 if you catch it on the way down.
[12:17] <UpuWork> I just noticed battery rraw
[12:17] <eroomde> meow
[12:17] <UpuWork> lol
[12:18] <fsphil> it's catching birds and bringing them home?
[12:19] <daveake> Accounts for the extra paws between setences
[12:19] <UpuWork> right
[12:19] <UpuWork> I have to do some real work
[12:19] <UpuWork> bbl
[12:19] <fsphil> ok that was quite good
[12:20] Action: SpeedEvil ponders.
[12:20] <SpeedEvil> It's heading for dundee - where my brother is.
[12:20] <SpeedEvil> But I don't think (pretty sure) he's not got a radio either.
[12:20] <SpeedEvil> s/not//
[12:20] <eroomde> speedevil's evil twin
[12:21] <fsphil> SpeedGood?
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[12:23] <Elwell> if it really goes west I'm sure the folks on Kilda may fancy a change in normal tracking activities
[12:25] <SpeedEvil> What's the battery actually at?
[12:27] <daveake> Dunno, but believe it should run for ~24 hours so it's got till sometime this evening
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[12:29] <SpeedEvil> Still at >85% original voltage
[12:30] <navrac> so if its a lithium then its probably got 6 hours or so left
[12:31] <navrac> depends on what the regulator is though
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[12:37] <ingersol_> please give details of the telemetry settings jon
[12:38] <fsphil> 434.200
[12:38] <Darkside> ingersol_: are you using dl-fldigi?
[12:38] <fsphil> rtty, 8n2
[12:38] <fsphil> but yes, dl-fldigi will configure the rtty modem for you
[12:38] <fsphil> the payload is called PICO
[12:39] <fsphil> ooh, sondes up
[12:40] <fsphil> ooh it's actually quite close
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[12:49] <ingersol_> can't get the autocinfig to work..please the manual details...gm4jtj
[12:50] <fsphil> dl-fldigi is running yea?
[12:50] <ingersol_> yep in hab mode
[12:50] <fsphil> are you hearing the signal?
[12:50] <ingersol_> 40 over 9
[12:50] <fsphil> sweet
[12:51] <fsphil> is the payload list showing PICO?
[12:51] <ingersol_> yes
[12:51] <fsphil> what happens when you select that, and press Autoconfigure
[12:52] <G0ATW> Try manual RTTY 50 hab if auto does not work
[12:52] <fsphil> (it *should* switch the data mode to rtty, and setup the parameters)
[12:52] <ingersol_> it puts me into rtty 50/23
[12:52] <fsphil> aah
[12:52] <fsphil> the shift
[12:52] <fsphil> you'll need to adjust the shift manually
[12:53] <fsphil> configure -> modems
[12:53] <fsphil> RTTY
[12:53] <fsphil> set shift to either custom or 425hz
[12:53] <fsphil> if custom, use the box below to set it to 425 or whatever fits it best
[12:53] <fsphil> that should get you going
[12:54] <ingersol_> what parity and stop bits?
[12:54] <fsphil> no parity, 2 stop bits
[12:54] <fsphil> 8-bit ascii
[12:55] <simrun> What is pico's float method?
[12:56] <fsphil> it's really close to you ingersol_, you could probably see it :)
[12:56] <fsphil> it's a foil balloon, so super pressure
[12:56] <fsphil> doing really well
[12:56] <simrun> awesome
[12:56] <fsphil> tis
[12:56] <fsphil> that's it now ingersol_
[12:56] <ingersol_> decoding now first greenie!!
[12:56] <fsphil> this is brilliant
[12:57] <fsphil> I'm also tracking a met office sonde, looks to be landing about 15km from me
[12:57] <fsphil> on a mountain so I'll probably not be chasing it
[12:59] <simrun> fsphil, i assume the met office won't bother recovering it?
[13:00] <WillDuckworth> well done ingersol_
[13:01] <fsphil> they don't simrun
[13:01] <ingersol_> i can't see the bottom of the garden let alone a balloon.too misty!!
[13:02] <fsphil> lol
[13:02] <fsphil> I've not seen a heavy mist in ages
[13:03] <eroomde> yeah same
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[13:03] <eroomde> though we've had plenty of cloud bases more or less coming down to the ground in the last few weeks
[13:03] <ingersol_> massive frequency swings almost 1500HZ i'm having to afc manually!!
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[13:17] <fsphil> so bets on how long it'll last for
[13:20] <Laurenceb> eroomde: will you be at Farnborough airshow?
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[13:20] <eroomde> Laurenceb: i hope so yes
[13:20] <eroomde> not sure which day just yet
[13:20] <eroomde> probably friday
[13:20] <Laurenceb> ive books a ticket
[13:20] <Laurenceb> getting spammed already
[13:20] <Laurenceb> i booked for saturday as its cheaper
[13:20] <Laurenceb> - including train
[13:21] <eroomde> i'm not paying
[13:21] <Laurenceb> friday trains are expensive
[13:31] <fsphil> "Process Successful: An error has occured. Please try again later."
[13:32] <fsphil> k
[13:32] <jonsowman> :\
[13:32] <fsphil> that's from the 1and1 control panel
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[13:32] <fsphil> and the process was successful :)
[13:33] <jonsowman> lol
[13:33] <eroomde> does anyone pythony have a sec to try something for me?
[13:33] <eroomde> i seem to have come across something very pernicious
[13:33] <eroomde> will just take 1 sec
[13:34] <eroomde> pretty please anyone?
[13:35] <russss> ok
[13:35] <eroomde> fire up python or ipython
[13:35] <eroomde> from numpy import *
[13:35] <eroomde> genfromtxt('http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=cDYLeJ5G',delimiter=',')[1:,1:]
[13:36] <eroomde> you should get a 2D aray of numbers
[13:36] <eroomde> ?
[13:38] <russss> yes
[13:38] <eroomde> ok now try this
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[13:38] <eroomde> genfromtxt('http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=cDYNeP5G',delimiter=',')[1:,1:]
[13:38] <eroomde> same output?
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[13:39] <russss> yes. Isn't that the same line?
[13:39] <eroomde> no
[13:39] <russss> ah wait, P
[13:39] <eroomde> i randomly changed a couple of characters in the identifier
[13:39] <eroomde> genfromtxt('http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=i_am_spartacus!',delimiter=',')[1:,1:]
[13:39] <russss> hah
[13:40] <eroomde> so it's happeneing to you too huh?
[13:40] <russss> yeah it ignores the get params
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[13:40] <eroomde> cheeky bastards
[13:40] <eroomde> that's cost me a lot of time
[13:41] <eroomde> i'm not sure where in the chain the fault lies
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[13:42] <eroomde> i thought it might be some kind of perverse local chaching somewhere in my network/isp
[13:43] <Rob_M0DTS> wow pico still going! my antennas will go up shortly, been like a monsoon up here today!
[13:44] <eroomde> oh wel thanks russss, that prunes a lot of stuff on my wtf-tree
[13:44] <russss> :/
[13:44] <fsphil> it's the energiser bunny of hab flights
[13:48] <Rob_M0DTS> ha S9 here now antennas are up!
[13:48] <daveake> :)
[13:48] <Rob_M0DTS> drifting like hell though!
[13:50] <Rob_M0DTS> one feature request for dl-fldigi... could do with AFC on tone as well as rtty.
[13:50] <fsphil> yea
[13:50] <fsphil> tricky though
[13:50] <ingersol_> i agree
[13:50] <fsphil> I'd rather people did continous rtty
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[13:51] <fsphil> continuous
[13:51] <Rob_M0DTS> yes i guess that would fix it too
[13:51] <eroomde> fast frequency tracking would be super useful
[13:51] <eroomde> we had big problems with our scotland rocket
[13:51] <eroomde> not unexpected
[13:51] <eroomde> but the doppler means you basically just loose it for the duration of the burn and coast
[13:52] <Rob_M0DTS> that will be big dopler?
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[13:52] <eroomde> big relative to the 3khz passband yep
[13:52] <eroomde> the two traces just went at about 45 degrees off the edge of the passband
[13:53] <Rob_M0DTS> sdr receiver should cope with it mind using large bandwidth rx.
[13:53] <Rob_M0DTS> ha
[13:53] <eroomde> yes indeed, bought one for precisely that reason :)
[13:53] <Rob_M0DTS> rtl?
[13:53] <eroomde> yep
[13:53] <Rob_M0DTS> yeah cool little thing, i have one too, even works on 1.2GHz ssb ;-)
[13:54] <eroomde> also want to try and spot some gps sats with it
[13:54] <Rob_M0DTS> should not be a problem, i think others have done that
[13:54] <Rob_M0DTS> right off for a cuppa...bbl
[13:55] <ingersol_> expect some increase in altitude as it is getting towards some serious hills at Kirriemuir!!
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[14:02] <Rob_M0DTS> PICO just stopped...Good flight
[14:03] <Rob_M0DTS> now just carrier 434.200
[14:04] <craag> "Battery: 421" @ 14:01 UTC yeah..
[14:04] <Rob_M0DTS> totally stopped now.
[14:05] <ingersol_> yep went to carrier and no further modulation and nothing here
[14:06] <Rob_M0DTS> Congrats, best pico flight so far?
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[14:07] <ingersol_> thats very close to the angus beacon and a huge hill behind Tealing
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[14:12] <eroomde> keep listening chapses!
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[14:12] <eroomde> the number of times LD payloads 'die' then come back on again 45 minutes later is surprising
[14:12] <Futurity> Is PICO still up?
[14:12] <Futurity> Hi BTW ;)
[14:12] <eroomde> just 'died' apparently
[14:13] <Futurity> oh dear. Mind you had a good life fo a fun test
[14:13] <Rob_M0DTS> ok still listening on freq anyway.
[14:13] <Rob_M0DTS> will be out of range for me if it comes on!
[14:13] <eroomde> :)
[14:14] <ingersol_> I'll continue to monitor as it was still very strong ........Jon GM4JTJ
[14:15] <eroomde> cool
[14:15] <eroomde> i'm not sure what is the mechanism, i think maybe the battery chestry recovers a little
[14:15] <kokey> who is GM4JTJ
[14:16] <eroomde> 14:14 < ingersol_> I'll continue to monitor as it was still very strong ........Jon GM4JTJ
[14:16] <hibby> !qrz gm4jtj
[14:16] <hibby> aww :(
[14:16] <hibby> Elwell: baconista is required!
[14:16] <hibby> (in another channel, elwell has that set up so it tells you name and country)
[14:16] <kokey> cool
[14:16] <hibby> 15:16 < baconista> hibby: GM4JTJ: J.T. JOYCE (England)
[14:17] <hibby> Country may be off, or qrz could be doing that thing again where it says Scotland is englandshire
[14:17] <eroomde> it is isn't it?
[14:17] <Elwell> baconista needs cleanup
[14:17] <eroomde> it's like england's hat
[14:18] <eroomde> you would say a hat was a separate person to the guy wearing it
[14:18] <hibby> eroomde: most hats aren't mostly self governing :p
[14:18] <eroomde> oh cool my monthly pay cheque from alex salmond has arrived
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[14:21] <hibby> lol
[14:22] <hibby> has he got you doing pro-scots propaganda now?
[14:22] <kokey> my hat tends to self govern in the wind
[14:22] <eroomde> i say v english things to engender zenophobia
[14:22] <eroomde> xenophobia too
[14:22] <hibby> lol, nice
[14:23] <hibby> 'salright, I'm Irish (By birth, and... neutral by accent) and have a different agenda from him, so it's fine
[14:25] <kokey> I act racist to play up to my stereotype of being South African
[14:25] <SpeedEvil> Neutral Chaotic?
[14:26] <hibby> SpeedEvil: level 8 dwarven neutral wellspoken
[14:26] <hibby> speaking of which, I need new dice!
[14:27] <griffonbot> @adamcudworth: great flight @jamescoxon #UKHAS http://t.co/7OGVCnQn [http://twitter.com/adamcudworth/status/220886518573707266]
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[14:29] <fsphil> it's still going?
[14:30] <Darkside> nope
[14:31] <Darkside> battery dead
[14:31] <fsphil> aww
[14:31] Action: fsphil orders some solar panels
[14:31] <fsphil> I was planning a pico launch next week but if the winds keep in this direction, there's no point
[14:32] <fsphil> unless I can find someone willing to follow it in a boat
[14:32] <Laurenceb> ouch
[14:32] <Laurenceb> so Farnborough cost me £97
[14:32] <fsphil> pain!
[14:32] <Laurenceb> train+ticket + tons of silly extras
[14:33] <Laurenceb> have to leave house at 6:30am too
[14:33] <Laurenceb> :(
[14:34] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: Many panels?
[14:35] <fsphil> not sure, just gonna look tonight when I get home
[14:35] <fsphil> I'd like to get a few strips of the flexible stuff
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[14:38] <fsphil> or at least three small panels, one for each 120 degrees
[14:38] <SpeedEvil> Or just one, and size the charger to be OK with pulses
[14:39] <eroomde> Laurenceb: how much was just the farnborough ticket?
[14:39] <Laurenceb> £36.5
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[14:39] <fsphil> that risks the payload settling down, with the panel facing away from the sun
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[14:39] <eroomde> tha's a lot on travel :(
[14:40] <Laurenceb> yeah
[14:40] <Laurenceb> i dont travel by train enough for it to be worth a railcard
[14:40] <Laurenceb> 8 hours at airshow and 7hours on train
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[14:41] <eroomde> i think i'll just drive
[14:42] <WillDuckworth> some of these fsphil?
[14:42] <WillDuckworth> http://www.selectsolar.co.uk/cat/26/solar-cells-under-4v
[14:42] <Laurenceb> heh
[14:42] <navrac> I might have a go launching ozzie3 on Sunday/Monday if the weather holds - a bigger pico ( about 0.2m3 fully inflated ) superpressure with AA's instead of AAA's and solar cells
[14:42] <navrac> those are the ones ozzie2 used, quite impressive
[14:42] <Laurenceb> 6hours from derby in a car
[14:42] <SpeedEvil> On the topic of alternate energy.
[14:43] <SpeedEvil> I just got two large pork joints to chop up for diced pork.
[14:43] <SpeedEvil> Chopped off the fat, and put it on the random pile of wood I was burning.
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[14:43] <SpeedEvil> Fwoosh!
[14:44] <Laurenceb> at 50mpg id save £10
[14:44] <Laurenceb> heh
[14:45] <Laurenceb> but if you count insurance and tax etc etc, cars are about as expensive as train now fuel costs are so high
[14:45] <UpuWork> battery flat ?
[14:46] <UpuWork> Still epic flight
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[14:47] <nigelvh> Did we lose pico?
[14:47] <kokey> SpeedEvil: must have smelled good
[14:47] <SpeedEvil> :)
[14:47] <SpeedEvil> Very little actually - pretty complete combustion
[14:48] <UpuWork> looks like the battery has gone on it nigelvh
[14:48] <UpuWork> shame as it was still floating fine
[14:48] <nigelvh> Yeah, the last few points on the tracker show it dropping precipitously
[14:48] <SpeedEvil> Oh yeah
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[14:48] <SpeedEvil> Cliff!
[14:48] <UpuWork> the discharge curve is like a cliff
[14:49] <daveake> yup
[14:49] Action: SpeedEvil wonders.
[14:49] <nigelvh> Was it running the energizer lithiums?
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[14:49] <UpuWork> I would say yes
[14:49] <kokey> Laurenceb: yeah and on saturdays driving around london is dodgy, you never know what will happen with the traffic
[14:49] <SpeedEvil> Green is the 5 degree line?
[14:49] <nigelvh> Yeah, That curve is expected.
[14:49] <UpuWork> We got a Scottish HAM online
[14:49] Action: SpeedEvil wonders if the cloud has burned off that far.
[14:49] <SpeedEvil> Probably not.
[14:50] <nigelvh> That's still a good flight though. running all through the night.
[14:50] <SpeedEvil> I was just looking at it - and if I'd have been able to see through clouds...
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[14:53] <daveake> notjustforchristmas
[14:54] <JFS1> what's happened to the pico - has it died?
[14:54] <daveake> sadly yes
[14:54] <daveake> Data stopped
[14:54] <eroomde> but maybe not forever!
[14:54] <JFS1> Batteries?
[14:55] <daveake> yes
[14:55] <kokey> would be amazing if it manages to hit the faroe islands
[14:55] <JFS1> Great flight though - must have been 18-19 hours
[14:56] <eroomde> they'll probably think it's a witch and sacrifice someone
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[14:59] <JFS1> Daveake - any Cloud/Buzz flights planned?
[14:59] <daveake> Trying to sort one out
[15:00] <daveake> Hopefully one up in Notts on the 28th, with a scout group
[15:00] <daveake> Also trying to get this pi up in the sky soon
[15:01] <jcoxon> All over then?
[15:01] <JFS1> Am just getting myself equipped with an FT-817 so will be keen to track, especiaaly if you have any from Brightonwalton as that isn't too far from me
[15:01] <jcoxon> Still at work :(
[15:01] <daveake> Well I've asked DM for permission but no reply yet
[15:01] <eroomde> JFS1: where are you based?
[15:02] <daveake> jcoxon Great flight :)
[15:02] <JFS1> South London - have a good view to the west, but rubbish to the east
[15:02] <eroomde> not so good for the east anglian launches then
[15:03] <eroomde> there are a few south london trackers around
[15:03] <jcoxon> Payload actually died? Or run out of trackers
[15:03] <nigelvh> Looks like battery
[15:03] <eroomde> died while being heard, apparently
[15:03] <eroomde> might pop back to life again, never know
[15:03] <JFS1> Kent wasn't great for me last night either - block of flats in the way
[15:03] <eroomde> jcoxon: was there any insulation?
[15:04] <daveake> Yeah, from here the best direction is Cambs, which is kinda handy :)
[15:04] <jcoxon> Single layer of bubble wrap
[15:04] <eroomde> i wonder what was causing the signal variation
[15:04] <eroomde> i wonder if it was rotating in and out of the sun
[15:05] <jcoxon> Yeah
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[15:05] <jcoxon> Home time...
[15:05] <jcoxon> Bbl
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[15:09] <fsphil> dundee, not bad!
[15:09] <daveake> piece of cake
[15:10] <eroomde> pico cake
[15:10] <daveake> mmm pecans
[15:10] <fsphil> mm.. tastes of helium
[15:10] <eroomde> i had a pork belly sandwich for lunch today
[15:11] <eroomde> it was v pleasing
[15:11] <eroomde> thick slices of belly, some cheddar and wholegrain mustard, and some v thick slices of homemade brown bread
[15:11] <fsphil> nice
[15:11] <fsphil> bananna sandwich for me. mmm radiation
[15:12] <gonzo_> we had a cake call at work, so I decided to forego lunch
[15:12] <gonzo_> hab food is bacon butties though!
[15:12] <eroomde> true that
[15:12] <eroomde> pork really is a gift from heaven
[15:12] <gonzo_> does that mean that pigs do fly?
[15:13] <eroomde> gift from heaven
[15:13] <eroomde> not gift to heaven
[15:13] <eroomde> there's no lift requirement to satify the former
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[15:15] <daveake> I'll have to see how my friend is getting on with his "SPIDERPIG" tracker
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[15:17] <gonzo_> for worshiping Offler the crocodile god, saussages are traditional
[15:18] <nick_> eroomde: I spoke to a school teacher today about launching a cosmic ray detector.
[15:18] <nick_> She thought it was really cool and something they could get the kids involved with a lot of different skills if they wanted.
[15:19] <eroomde> ah grand
[15:19] <eroomde> sounds very promising
[15:20] <eroomde> how self-contained is your detector going to be?
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[15:20] <eroomde> does it need any electrical or electronic interfaces to something else?
[15:20] <nick_> Hopefully it will run on it's own.
[15:21] <eroomde> cool
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[15:21] <nick_> But pass some data to a flight computer for in flight trasnmission
[15:21] <eroomde> ah that's the bit specifically i'm interested in
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[15:21] <eroomde> do you know what the interface will be for that?
[15:21] <nick_> It could be anything.
[15:22] <eroomde> uart?
[15:22] <nick_> potentially
[15:22] <eroomde> 'm just wondering what i should break out of this board i'm making
[15:22] <eroomde> might aswell make it compatible
[15:23] <eroomde> 'for the kids' is a good enough reason to pull my finger out otherwise it's yet-another-hab
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[15:23] <eroomde> and i'll be dicking around on the rocket instead
[15:23] <nick_> What are the options?
[15:24] <eroomde> serial (TTL level ideally) or spi
[15:24] <eroomde> i2c sucks balls i think
[15:24] <nick_> OK
[15:24] <eroomde> or other things if desparate
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[15:24] <nick_> Serial is easy
[15:24] <eroomde> cool
[15:24] <nick_> I've got 3 serial interfaces to play with.
[15:25] <eroomde> i'll have a nice isolated serial interface so people can't kill the flight computer (no offence)
[15:25] <nick_> Or a couple of spi
[15:25] <nick_> I would expect that.
[15:25] <eroomde> i guess it'll be a fairly low data rate from the detector? eg number of detections in the last x seconds?
[15:25] <nick_> Of course is my 30V gets into that part I'll be dead already
[15:25] <nick_> Probably, yeah
[15:25] <nick_> Although there could potentially be occasional high rates.
[15:26] <eroomde> or model it as a poisson process and had over the statistics too
[15:26] <nick_> Like running through an in flight calibration check
[15:26] <eroomde> that could be interesting
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[15:26] <eroomde> yeah i am a really big fan of self-check
[15:26] <jcoxon> hey all
[15:26] <jcoxon> wow
[15:27] Action: jcoxon just saw spacenear.us
[15:27] <eroomde> i strongly encourage your instrument to be able to check all the major voltage levels, continuity etc on startup
[15:27] <eroomde> it saves so much time when debugging
[15:27] <nick_> Especially for a protoype I'd look to do a lot of extra measurements on top of just counting rates to get as much info as possible.
[15:27] <eroomde> v v good idea
[15:27] <nick_> But it doesn't all have to be sent back in real time.
[15:27] <jcoxon> so teh battery voltage properly fell off their
[15:27] <jcoxon> as is expected with lithiums
[15:28] <eroomde> it's one of the things i've noticed when developing things which are products more recently rather than just my own prototype hardware - having a lot of onboard diagnostics and well coded error reporting is so so helpful
[15:28] <eroomde> and really adds to reliability
[15:28] <navrac> yep - drop off like a cliff when you hit 1.3v
[15:28] <UpuWork> jcoxon they went off the cliff
[15:28] <jcoxon> thanks everyone for tracking!
[15:28] <UpuWork> but that was an epic flight
[15:28] <UpuWork> but next time
[15:28] <nick_> Basically if I have data rate constraints then I'll just try to work within those.
[15:28] <eroomde> on the hot wire cutdown it checks every voltage level, its current consumption, the current consumption of the hot wire, the current consumption of the relay coil and whether or not it's stuck in a position, and so on
[15:28] <navrac> sorry i missed most of it
[15:28] <UpuWork> use AA's :)
[15:29] <jcoxon> UpuWork, no mass
[15:29] <daveake> or panels
[15:29] <jcoxon> can't take AAs
[15:29] <jcoxon> panels
[15:29] <eroomde> panels + batt?
[15:29] <UpuWork> one AA has more capacity than 2 AAA's ?
[15:29] <daveake> it has
[15:29] <navrac> it has inspired me to get off my backside and try my homemade superpressure on sunday - just redoing the calcs for AA's instead of AAA's
[15:29] <daveake> 3000 vs 2 x 1200
[15:29] <jcoxon> but teh voltage of 2xAAA is better
[15:29] <UpuWork> does your power run from 1 cell ?
[15:29] <jcoxon> and your conveter is more efficient
[15:29] <UpuWork> true
[15:30] <UpuWork> well if you want to launch another one I'll send you one with a boost on it
[15:30] <daveake> yep
[15:30] <UpuWork> was fun
[15:30] <jcoxon> i was thinking of using the spare eurus board
[15:30] <jcoxon> i've got a step up
[15:30] <jcoxon> and solar panels
[15:30] <UpuWork> ok
[15:31] <WillDuckworth> do you wire the solar panel and battery in parallel?
[15:31] <kokey> I think jcoxon has all the helium
[15:31] <UpuWork> that would be even better
[15:31] <jcoxon> kokey, only a small disposable canister
[15:31] <kokey> jcoxon: one of those asda ones?
[15:31] <navrac> I stuck the solars diode mixed into the output of the battery step up
[15:31] <jcoxon> WillDuckworth, could use a diode network
[15:31] <nick_> I want to design part of a board this weekend and maybe get it made even if it doesn't do anything fun, just to go through the process and try out seeed or someone.
[15:31] <mattbrejza> id imagine you can get integrated solar chargers and regulators, i should probably have a look
[15:31] <kokey> jcoxon: what type of balloon did you use for this last pico?
[15:32] <mattbrejza> linear do that sorta stuff
[15:32] <jcoxon> kokey, a 92cm foil balloon
[15:32] <jcoxon> off ebay
[15:32] <Laurenceb> jcoxon: what envelope was that?
[15:32] <hibby> http://www.chromoscope.net/ this is waaaaaay cool
[15:32] <jcoxon> Qualatex
[15:32] <Laurenceb> latex?!
[15:32] <jcoxon> no
[15:32] <kokey> jcoxon: aaah, makes sense now
[15:33] <jcoxon> thats the make
[15:33] <kokey> mylar style
[15:33] <fsphil> very slow ascent rate
[15:34] <Laurenceb> has it been flown before?
[15:34] <Laurenceb> the same type of envelope?
[15:34] <navrac> there have been quite a few flights with the 92cm qualtex
[15:35] <jcoxon> Laurenceb, yeah thats what we've been flying
[15:35] <jcoxon> the key is a single balloon
[15:35] <Laurenceb> interesting
[15:35] <jcoxon> and slow ascent rate
[15:35] <jcoxon> and calm launch
[15:35] <navrac> and getting the ascent rate right
[15:35] <jcoxon> hence yesterday (2-3mph)
[15:36] <navrac> winds killed one of mine and it was only 8mph at the time
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[15:40] <eroomde> ntx2 question - does anyone know what the enable pin is internally connected to?
[15:40] <eroomde> eg an enamle line on its ldo reg?
[15:40] <mattbrejza> yea its the enable
[15:41] <eroomde> on the reg?
[15:41] <mattbrejza> yep
[15:41] <eroomde> cool ta
[15:41] <mattbrejza> theres an internal view of it somewhere
[15:41] <jcoxon> i think this might be the first flight to make it to scotland
[15:41] <eroomde> d'oh!
[15:41] <eroomde> yes it's right there on page 2 of the datasheet
[15:41] <UpuWork> eroomde its the EN pin on the voltage regulator
[15:42] <UpuWork> internally it runs at 2.8v
[15:42] <fsphil> I believe so jcoxon
[15:42] <fsphil> there's been flights from scotland, but not the other way
[15:43] <fsphil> you're also the first to fly a payload to NI
[15:43] <UpuWork> eroomde naked NTX2 https://www.dropbox.com/s/qdlvrqlpztdnvdl/NTX2.pdf
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[15:45] <eroomde> ah thanks
[15:45] <eroomde> that's useful
[15:46] <UpuWork> it might not be totally accurate
[15:47] <UpuWork> I pulled the module from original AVA apart to make that
[15:47] <eroomde> useful still
[15:47] <eroomde> right home time
[15:48] <eroomde> ttfn
[15:48] <UpuWork> laters
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[15:53] <jcoxon> 638km direct between launch and loss of contact
[15:58] <kokey> good gas mileage that
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[15:59] <jcoxon> yeah
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[16:00] <gonzo_> is that a pico record?
[16:01] <jcoxon> its a pico float record
[16:01] <nick_> eroomde: if you want to be isolated is serial better than spi just in terms of isolating less lines?
[16:01] <navrac> certainjly is
[16:02] <jcoxon> navrac, so i think float is possible with pico
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[16:03] <navrac> oh definatly -
[16:03] <jcoxon> hehe
[16:04] <navrac> you are the first overnighter that weve seen
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[16:04] <navrac> sorry about the spelling
[16:04] <jcoxon> hehe
[16:04] <fsphil> it all looked set to be floating another day
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[16:05] <navrac> I'm in two minds about ozzie3 - I dont really want to put an all singing & dancing solar payload on with an untested homemade balloon though
[16:05] <jcoxon> navrac, indeed
[16:05] <navrac> but now the weather has improved and ive got some free time I cant resist doing a launch!
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[16:05] <jcoxon> hehe
[16:06] <navrac> hopefulkly further than the last 5 mile one
[16:06] <jcoxon> i think we should make a rule of not launching in winds more then 5mph
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[16:06] <navrac> well i did a plot for a sunday am launch and it looked really good for tracking
[16:07] <navrac> belgium, netherlands then sweden and denmark]
[16:07] <navrac> and ending up in finland
[16:07] <navrac> so very trackable
[16:08] <jcoxon> :-)
[16:08] <jcoxon> interesting about the overnight section of this flight
[16:08] <jcoxon> wasn't really a disaster not having gps
[16:08] <navrac> but the metoffice wont give me a wind forecast for sunday at the moment
[16:09] <jcoxon> use accuweather
[16:09] <navrac> yes - also its height profile seemed interesting overnight
[16:09] <jcoxon> i've fixed the bug that stopped the lat/lon
[16:09] <jcoxon> but might spread out hte slow-hell even more
[16:09] <jcoxon> perhaps every 10mins
[16:10] <navrac> 7mph sunday
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[16:11] <navrac> I think with the larger envelope i can lift 2xAA so it should give me at least 3 days
[16:11] <fsphil> jcoxon: how about a burst of rtty along with the hell
[16:12] <jcoxon> fsphil, it'll drift a lot between the switch
[16:12] <fsphil> can use the hell to get tuned up
[16:13] <fsphil> would save having to transcribe the data if the signal is strong enough
[16:13] <jcoxon> maybe just have rtty
[16:13] <nigelvh> If they're spaced out that much, giving a good leader and some rtty is the route I'd do.
[16:14] <fsphil> yea, or just rtty with a beacon
[16:14] <fsphil> 1 second low, 1 second hight
[16:14] <fsphil> high
[16:14] <nigelvh> Or maybe just a blip every 30 seconds
[16:14] <fsphil> repeated twice
[16:14] <fsphil> oog yea
[16:14] <fsphil> ogg agree
[16:14] <nigelvh> Keep tuned via the blip, then rtty comes through.
[16:14] <jcoxon> slow-hell is very efficient in regards to power
[16:14] <fsphil> I've gone all caveman
[16:14] <fsphil> rtty is quicker though
[16:14] <fsphil> it might outweight it
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[16:15] <fsphil> the peep might not work so well though, the ntx2 takes ages to tune up
[16:15] <jcoxon> so we had blips last night
[16:15] <nigelvh> What do you mean by "tune up"
[16:16] <nigelvh> Like frequency stabilize?
[16:16] <fsphil> it takes a while for the frequency to steady
[16:16] <fsphil> yea
[16:16] <fsphil> more of a "woooop" than a beep
[16:16] <nigelvh> Yeah, then a good leader before rtty would be better
[16:16] <nigelvh> enough of a leader to be able to catch and tune it, then get the data done with
[16:16] <nigelvh> Should be quicker than hell
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[16:17] <G0MJW> So where is it?
[16:17] <nigelvh> Somewhere
[16:17] <nigelvh> Batteries died.
[16:17] <G0MJW> Oh dear. When
[16:17] <nigelvh> A while ago
[16:18] <G0MJW> I can see dundee on the map.
[16:18] <SpeedEvil> I would have been able to see it.
[16:18] <SpeedEvil> (but for lack of clear sky)
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[16:18] <G0MJW> What - after such a nice sunny day for a change?
[16:18] <SpeedEvil> It's been hazy here all day.
[16:18] <SpeedEvil> It's still not clear to the north
[16:19] <nigelvh> fsphil, jcoxon, doing a test on the actual power consumed in either scenario, hell or rtty with a leader would be interesting to do.
[16:19] <jcoxon> yeah
[16:19] <G0MJW> I guess the hell was a waste of time - maybe power down over night?
[16:20] <jcoxon> thats what we are discussing
[16:20] <jcoxon> perhaps chirps/blips
[16:20] <jcoxon> then a couple of RTTY strings
[16:20] <nigelvh> Something to know it's still goign
[16:20] <G0MJW> Is there anyway to scroll backwards if you just got home and logged in?
[16:21] <G0MJW> 5 minse, one an hor perhaps
[16:21] <G0MJW> hour....
[16:21] <jcoxon> G0MJW, ummm data? or logs?
[16:21] <G0MJW> messages
[16:22] <jcoxon> http://habhub.org//zeusbot/
[16:22] <G0MJW> Perfect
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[16:26] <griffonbot> Received email: James Coxon "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Launch tonight (20:00 BST) from Kent heading North"
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[17:23] <jcoxon> ping navrac
[17:26] <Upu> nice flight jcoxon
[17:26] <Upu> needs more solar :)
[17:26] <jcoxon> well
[17:27] <jcoxon> your board + step up + 2xAAA = 21.8g
[17:27] <Upu> what was the one lauched today ?
[17:28] <jcoxon> 29g
[17:28] <Upu> how much does the step up weigh ?
[17:28] <jcoxon> and my 100mA 3.6v solar panel
[17:28] <jcoxon> makes it
[17:28] <jcoxon> 24.9g
[17:29] <Upu> interesting
[17:29] <Upu> can the step up you have pull power from panels when availble and switch to batteries when not ?
[17:29] <jcoxon> yeah using diodes
[17:30] <jcoxon> now i could add a 110mAh lipo as well
[17:30] <jcoxon> so have a solar/lipo setup + 2xAAA
[17:30] <jcoxon> two seperate systems
[17:31] <Upu> got a circuit diagram on how that lot is wired up ?
[17:32] <Upu> that should go on for days
[17:32] <jcoxon> the lipo would be an issue in regards to cold
[17:33] <Upu> yeah especially as it would me more use at night
[17:33] <jcoxon> perhaps stick to simple
[17:33] <Upu> I hear simple is best
[17:33] <Upu> so launching tonight then ?
[17:33] <Upu> :)
[17:33] <daveake> You could probably get away with charging the energizers from solar
[17:34] <jcoxon> Upu, goodness no
[17:34] <jcoxon> going to a bbq
[17:34] <jcoxon> :-p
[17:34] <daveake> NASA tried this @60mA
[17:34] <daveake> No BBQ
[17:34] <number10> someone mention HAB BBQ?
[17:34] <daveake> That was quick
[17:37] <Upu> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?325030-Recharging-Energizer-Ultimate-Lithiums-Controlled-experiments
[17:37] <Upu> I don't think any of us are crazy enough to try and charge lithium primaries....I know I'm not! They can vent hydrofluoric acid I believe which is really scary stuff!
[17:37] <SpeedEvil> http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2012/07/entire-san-diego-fireworks-show-exploded-in-15-seconds-ruining-show.html - oops
[17:38] <Upu> Science! http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=ZwD8uTpXet4C&pg=PA516&lpg=PA516&dq=nasa+lithium+iron+disulfide&source=bl&ots=l_lbu3l5fy&sig=3c2cBvA0ifgzQVzHhFdlok1tW44&hl=en&ei=az6qTvmYE6Hj0QHr3vnNDw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=nasa%20lithium%20iron%20disulfide&f=false
[17:41] <daveake> I don't disagree, but in the paper I found a while back they were recharged at low current and nothing untoward happened
[17:42] <daveake> 20mA max
[17:42] <daveake> ^^ same paper I think
[17:44] <jcoxon> Upu, https://www.circuitlab.com/circuit/pw7t3u/solar_lithium/
[17:44] <Upu> interesting
[17:45] <Upu> drive the board from the solar direct
[17:45] <Upu> I suppose its 3.3v with the drop
[17:45] <jcoxon> actually the step up acts as a diode
[17:45] <jcoxon> so we can remove that
[17:45] <Upu> D1 ?
[17:45] <jcoxon> yeah
[17:46] <Upu> woo woo
[17:46] <jcoxon> the issue would be voltage drop
[17:47] <Upu> I thought the solar would go before the step up
[17:47] <daveake> In D2? Use an FET
[17:48] <Upu> surely the voltage won't be that consistent from a panel ?
[17:48] <SpeedEvil> Very much not.
[17:48] <SpeedEvil> It may be sort-of-consistent if you have a 4 bit panel arranged in a square
[17:48] <jcoxon> so if the voltage off the panel drops below 3.3v then the lithiums take over
[17:49] <jcoxon> navrac did experiements and foundthe stepup couldn't draw enough from the panel
[17:49] <jcoxon> solar gives out as much as it can
[17:49] <SpeedEvil> Solar is - broadly - a constant current source in parallel with a diode.
[17:49] <SpeedEvil> Open circuit, all of the current is taken by the diode.
[17:50] <SpeedEvil> Short - none.
[17:50] <Upu> ok
[18:00] Action: daveake fires up BBQ
[18:01] <daveake> and no it's not powered by lithiums
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[18:05] <russss> eroomde: I just spotted that numpy is doing the most ridiculous caching ever. In my working directory I just found a directory pastebin.com and in that is a file called raw.php...
[18:09] <zyp> numpy?
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[18:27] <mclane> I just saw the nice track of PICO - lost in space?
[18:27] <hibby> ccp are launching more things to space today as well
[18:28] <hibby> again, live stream of video from the balloon
[18:30] <hibby> http://www.own3d.tv/CCPGames/
[18:38] <fsphil> ccp?
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[18:44] <fsphil> and space, or "space"
[18:45] <eroomde> russss: ah ok
[18:45] <eroomde> that sounds.... ill thought out
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[18:46] <Upu> hmm
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[18:48] Action: daveake has finished his BBQ :)
[18:50] <Upu> I guess your not having the weather we are, it just monsooned down
[18:50] <eroomde> nice and bright here
[18:50] <eroomde> ate outside
[18:50] <daveake> Sun
[18:50] <daveake> Warm
[18:50] <daveake> Nice
[18:52] <fsphil> same
[18:52] <number10> for once, but I think we have heavy rain expected tomorrow
[18:52] <fsphil> walked the dog in a bit of sunshine, makes a nice change
[18:53] <Upu> its the heaviest rain I've seen this side of Iceland here about 10 mins ago
[18:55] <daveake> Heaviest I've seen was in Houston a few years back. It was bouncing off the ground 2 or 3 feet. Between the car and the hotel door - no more than 5 metres - I got soaked. Not a dry spot.
[18:56] <daveake> But here it's dry and lovely :)
[18:57] <Upu> yeah it did that 3 minutes after I got in my first left hand drive car in Florida
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[18:59] <mclane> Hi guys, any news from PICO?
[18:59] <Upu> dead
[18:59] <Upu> batteries died about 14:30
[18:59] <eroomde> a floating grave
[18:59] <mclane> nice flight nevertheless!
[19:01] Action: hibby returns to previous msp430 suggestion
[19:01] <hibby> 87uA in high power mode!
[19:02] <mclane> the micro is not the biggest current consumer (in my setup at least)
[19:02] <hibby> it always helps, however
[19:03] <hibby> I think arduino has a sleep function that'll help too, but doing timers and getting round the arduino bootloader can be a dick
[19:04] <hibby> if you can use it to put other components to sleep too, that'll help. If we were really stretching it, 1 message every few minutes with a hot sleep in the middle wouldn't be a bad thing
[19:10] <nigelvh> In my systems, my biggest power draw (while not transmitting) is the GPS. Though, proc sleep helps a lot too.
[19:12] <mattbrejza> so how much does an AVR draw out of interest?
[19:13] <eroomde> hibby: nonesense and guff
[19:13] <eroomde> the microcontroller is the least of your worries
[19:13] <nigelvh> mattbrejza, it depends on what voltage you're running at, what speed it
[19:13] <nigelvh> 's running at
[19:14] <nigelvh> what your outputs are set to, any internal features on or off, what sleep mode you are or arent in
[19:14] <mattbrejza> suppose, but when its getting close to 10mA then thats close to the ublox in low power mode
[19:14] <nigelvh> There are a LOT of factors. You can get down to very low <mA levels, depending on what you're willing to turn off
[19:14] <eroomde> the avr datasheet for the 1284 i'm currently uses advertises its power save mode as 0.1uA (low xtal speed)
[19:15] <mattbrejza> people run avrs normally >10MHz which is 9 more then is needed too
[19:15] <eroomde> sorry 0.6uA
[19:15] <eroomde> and power down mode is 0.1uA
[19:15] <mattbrejza> yea but power save mode doesnt do much
[19:15] <mattbrejza> i suppose you can be in it most of htte time and interrupt out, but noone seems to bother
[19:16] <hibby> I was thinking you could put the gps to sleep too, and find a way to control power on the radio
[19:16] <hibby> and have those written into your uC sleep/wake routines
[19:16] <nigelvh> The radio is easy to control power on.
[19:16] <nigelvh> Sleep on the AVR is miniscule compared to 10mA low power on the GPS.
[19:16] <mattbrejza> also doesnt need to be full power between or leading upto transmission, just enough to get the AFC working
[19:17] <hibby> transistors for on/off can be very (comparatively) power hungry - they ruined power consumption on something low power-long term I was doing lately.
[19:17] <eroomde> but all this chat of microcontroller power is silly really when they can all be powered down to nothing (uA)
[19:17] <eroomde> consider you add battery monitoring
[19:17] <eroomde> via potential divider
[19:18] <eroomde> even with 2 x 5k resistors in the potential dividers, that's using 0.3mA constantly
[19:18] <mattbrejza> mind you there are plenty of reasons to use a msp430 over avr other then power
[19:18] <eroomde> there are a whole bunch of things taking a lot more power than a micro
[19:18] <mattbrejza> i would normally use something 10x that for battery monitoring mind you
[19:18] <eroomde> an op-amp will have a qiestcent current higher than the micro!
[19:19] <mattbrejza> well depends whether you get a low power one, havnt seen an opamp on a pico
[19:20] <mattbrejza> (havnt looked equally)
[19:20] <eroomde> tru maybe but lack of imaginiation
[19:20] <mattbrejza> if you wanted sensors then theres easily a case for one i suppose
[19:21] <eroomde> eg an accurate temp sensor like a PT100
[19:21] <eroomde> just running the gps once a minute would help
[19:22] <nigelvh> Yeah, if I were to go for low power, I'd completely power down the gps, and bring it up once every five minutes or so.
[19:22] <nigelvh> Perhaps with the exception of when descending.
[19:22] <mattbrejza> also run at 1.8V instead of 3.3V
[19:22] <nigelvh> (I run barometers on mine so I can tell altitude without GPS).
[19:22] <mclane> I dont know what you want to do: my setup (arduino +gps+2 temsensore+sdcard) consumes 80 mA; with the 3 Ah of an AA Li cell that gives 37h of operation
[19:23] <mattbrejza> +radio i assume?
[19:23] <eroomde> mclane: huh?
[19:23] <eroomde> what voltage is your arduino?
[19:23] <mclane> yes radio included
[19:23] <mclane> 3.3V 8 MHz
[19:23] <eroomde> and what voltage is your AA cell?
[19:24] <mclane> 1.5V (I am using 3 of them + a LDO regulator)
[19:24] <eroomde> well anyway we're talking about pico payloads here
[19:25] <eroomde> yours is definitely not pico
[19:25] <mattbrejza> a pico could have 1 AAA cell, slightly less energy avaliable
[19:25] <nigelvh> So who's going to make the first femto payload? Power it off a watch battery?
[19:26] <eroomde> i have had a thunk about this infact
[19:26] <mattbrejza> whats the max Iout from a watch battery?
[19:26] <eroomde> like 2mA
[19:26] <eroomde> for a god one
[19:26] <eroomde> good*
[19:26] <eroomde> but the energy densities are great
[19:27] <mattbrejza> could you get lipos lighter that could do the job?
[19:27] <eroomde> i think you sacrifice capacity for internel resistence
[19:27] <number10> peak current is an issue with the coin cells
[19:27] <eroomde> but a single solar cell and a tiny lipo might work
[19:28] <mattbrejza> how much lighter then 7.6g could you get a solar cell and lipo?
[19:28] <mattbrejza> bearing in mind it has to point up
[19:28] <mattbrejza> equally it could stay up a lot longer
[19:28] <eroomde> i don;t know how light solar cells come
[19:29] <eroomde> lipos certainly go light
[19:29] <eroomde> and obviously coic cells are really light
[19:29] <eroomde> but i don;t know how you'd run a locating device oboard with so little current
[19:29] <mattbrejza> beamforming reciever
[19:30] <mattbrejza> beamforming probably isnt the correct term...
[19:30] <mattbrejza> DOA and so forth
[19:31] <fsphil> is it possible to do something similar to what (I think) the met sondes do, and just repeat the gps data received?
[19:31] <eroomde> it sort of it the right term
[19:31] <eroomde> reciprocity and all that
[19:31] <fsphil> do all the work on the ground
[19:31] <eroomde> yes probably
[19:31] <eroomde> tho they have more tx power i think
[19:31] <fsphil> 50mw I last heard
[19:32] <mattbrejza> although any reason to create such a light payload? so they can be flown on a normal party balloon?
[19:33] <eroomde> exactly the reason
[19:33] <fsphil> the datasheet for the RS92 claims 200mw
[19:33] <mattbrejza> so target weight?
[19:33] <eroomde> <30g
[19:33] <mattbrejza> well ive made one thats 21g...
[19:34] <fsphil> sorry, wrong model. the ones they fly in the UK are 60mW
[19:34] <mattbrejza> but you would need a few/large balloons for that
[19:34] <eroomde> i think jcoxon uses a single foil balloon
[19:35] <mattbrejza> also gps-less payload could be made super cheap
[19:35] <eroomde> yes of course
[19:35] <eroomde> that changes everything completely
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[19:36] <eroomde> u could just have a coin cell charging a cap that discharges through a radio as a ping
[19:36] <eroomde> a sputnik
[19:36] <eroomde> and DF on the ground
[19:37] <mattbrejza> DF?
[19:37] <fsphil> duke forever
[19:37] <eroomde> direction find
[19:37] <fsphil> although direction finding is probably more fun
[19:37] <mattbrejza> could always have three+ gps synced recievers which measure time of arrival
[19:37] <eroomde> tricky for scenarious like today though
[19:37] <eroomde> everyone would be saying 'er... it's north of us'
[19:37] <fsphil> yea only a couple of receivers
[19:38] <fsphil> all I could say is that it wasn't here :)
[19:38] <mattbrejza> if it were going on latex balloons more would hear of course
[19:38] <mattbrejza> but 10mW would be pushing the radio side
[19:40] <eroomde> a 30km floater with a kilo of payload solves all problems yep
[19:40] <eroomde> but we're not there yet reliably so far as i can see :)
[19:42] <eroomde> but when last did the sums you could get about 2-3 weeks of running time from a 1kg payload if you just wanted tracking
[19:42] <eroomde> which should get you a decent chunk of the way round the world
[19:42] <mattbrejza> solar panels...
[19:43] <eroomde> they'd get you all he way
[19:58] <fsphil> just browsing solar cells now
[20:00] <mattbrejza> at least you wont have cloud issues for most of it
[20:04] <mattbrejza> also http://parametric.linear.com/energy_harvesting
[20:06] <fsphil> three of these, all facing outwards, http://proto-pic.co.uk/solar-cell-small-0-45w/
[20:07] <daveake> 60g
[20:07] <fsphil> I'm hoping a lot of that is the cord
[20:07] <fsphil> actually I have one, I can weight it
[20:07] <daveake> I don't have the URL but someone posted where there are some ~6g ones
[20:07] <eroomde> still, you can buy the naked cells
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[20:18] <nigelvh> Those are encapsulated. You don't need that, just put raw cells on the side.
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[20:27] <eroomde> nick_: io lines not a big constraint
[20:27] <eroomde> chips i like have 4 channels
[20:27] <eroomde> 3 varients: 4/0, 1/3, 2/2
[20:28] <eroomde> in terms of the distribution of direction
[20:28] <nick_> OK
[20:28] <nick_> Is there any real advantage to using SPI over serial?
[20:28] <eroomde> no
[20:28] <eroomde> i would go for serial
[20:29] <nick_> OK
[20:29] <nick_> I'll keep that at the back of my mind.
[20:29] <eroomde> as you dont need any master-slave stuff
[20:29] <nick_> Earlier I was looking at the lpc1768/mbed layout.
[20:29] <nick_> What I want to do may be crazy
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[20:37] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[20:38] <eroomde> nick_: what sort of crazy?
[20:39] <nick_> Crazy in the way that I don't know how they managed to ram so much stuff into such a small form factor
[20:39] <nick_> Luckily I have a bit less stuff to put in
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[21:36] <kokey> wonder what small arduino 3.3v clone I should get
[21:38] <Lunar_Lander> pro mega
[21:38] <Upu> I think you missed the "small" bit lunar
[21:38] <Upu> Arduino Pro is great
[21:38] <Upu> small and does the job
[21:40] <Upu> though its pretty easy to make your own
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[21:40] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[21:52] <kokey> that's it... arduino pro mini
[21:52] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:53] <kokey> I think I'll go for making my own stripboard arduinos after that
[21:53] <kokey> I just want a proper set of known to work stuff
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[21:54] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:55] <Lunar_Lander> kokey, this one here did not work http://s.gullipics.com/image/7/v/e/5yvpn0-j96y4s-t6i4/IMG0177.jpeg
[21:56] <kokey> Lunar_Lander: I think you soldered the atmega into something else on another table
[21:56] <kokey> that might be the problem
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[21:57] <Lunar_Lander> no, I had that when the arduino was disconnected and stuff
[21:58] <fsphil> are you testing with lithiums?
[21:58] <fsphil> gonna get expensive :)
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> ah I got alkalines :)
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[21:59] <Lunar_Lander> the Lithiums are like left over :)
[21:59] <hextic> Hi everyone, how goes? :)
[21:59] <fsphil> aah
[21:59] <fsphil> howdy hextic
[21:59] <SpeedEvil> hey
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[21:59] <hextic> So, questions as usual. x3
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[21:59] <kokey> lithiums are cheap I'm sure, from nokia phones
[22:00] <hextic> As I understand, people like to use the Radiometrix NTX2.
[22:00] <hextic> I can never find it on EBay, but I found this.
[22:00] <hextic> http://www.ebay.com/itm/RADIOMETRIX-UHF-FM-Data-Transmitter-and-Receiver-Modules-TX2-433-40-5V-RX2-433-/180908188921?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a1ef7e4f9
[22:01] <hextic> How similar is this module?
[22:02] <fsphil> if you don't mind ordering from the uk, you can get the ntx2 here: http://ava.upuaut.net/store/
[22:02] <Upu> hextic
[22:02] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/category&path=71_63
[22:03] <Upu> cheers fsphil
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[22:21] <jdtanner> Evening
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[22:22] <fsphil> evnin
[22:22] <jdtanner> Peasouper here tonight!
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[22:31] <Lunar_Lander> hi jdtanner
[22:31] <jdtanner> Evening
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[22:32] <jdtanner> Sorted out your circuit?
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> no
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> decided to start over
[22:33] <jdtanner> Sometimes for the best
[22:33] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[22:43] <nick_> Is it bad to put a bunch of vias underneath a chip?
[22:44] <fsphil> not if the bottom of the chip is insulated
[22:45] <fsphil> or the vias are covered
[22:45] <fsphil> (is tented the term? I've heard it used)
[22:50] <nick_> Ah, I solved some of my headache by moving something correct distance apart
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[23:06] <Lunar_Lander> good night
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[00:00] --- Fri Jul 6 2012