highaltitude.log.20120701

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[01:41] <kristianpaul> hmm, where i can get free licensed sources/planes for cutting (cnc) a glider..
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[07:48] <Upu> morning
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[07:54] <Upu> How are Leap Seconds added? At the Prime Meridian, 12:00:00 normally follows 11:59:59pm but will instead follow 11:59:60pm
[07:55] <Upu> in other news Voyager1 is 16 hrs 40 mins 27 secs of light-travel time from Earth (2012:182:1L)
[08:02] <fsphil> it's also Baked Beans month ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QN14knt9_bE
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[09:09] <mclane> Hello, does someone have a good (power saving) chdk intervallometer script for the cannon a800?
[09:09] <mclane> up to now I was not able to switch off the creen
[09:09] <mclane> i mean screen
[09:11] <Upu> easy way to turn the screen off
[09:11] <Upu> take a BIC pen
[09:12] <Upu> cut about 1.5cms of the ink tube (bit with out ink in it!)
[09:12] <Upu> and shove it in the av socket ot the side
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[09:17] <mclane> thanks for the hint, will try immediately
[09:19] <eroomde> if that doesn't work, take a hammer
[09:19] <eroomde> and take a screwdriver
[09:19] <eroomde> so that it covers about 1.5mm of the pcb powerline track to the screen
[09:19] <eroomde> then bring the hammer hard down on the end of the screwdriver
[09:20] <eroomde> (this is not a serious suggestion obviously, please don't try)
[09:27] <eroomde> i don't know if everyone's seen James Burke's Connections tv series, but they really don;t make tv like that anymore
[09:27] <eroomde> if you want to be sold on it, just watch this little segment: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TcBGpcFwung
[09:27] <eroomde> like a boss, if ever there was an excuase to use that phrase
[09:31] <fsphil> well timed
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[09:32] <gonzo_mob> i managed to download all 3 series
[09:33] <gonzo_mob> another to look for is 'the secret life of machines'
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[09:34] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[09:35] <eroomde> yes i'm a big fan of the secret life of machines
[09:35] <gonzo_mob> i was hooked on the first series of connections when i was a kid. didn't realise it was so long ago?
[09:36] <eroomde> i met Rex Garrod via robot wars (he was tim hunkin's assistant in the secret life of machines) and was amazed by him
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[09:36] <eroomde> so i know i'd like the tv show
[09:36] <gonzo_mob> slom is proper men in sheds tv
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[09:36] <eroomde> gonzo_mob: yeah it was about a decade before I was born
[09:36] <eroomde> only discovered it via youtube in the last couple of years
[09:37] <Lunar_Lander> Rex Garrod is cool
[09:37] <gonzo_mob> i a
[09:37] <Lunar_Lander> I didn't see so much of Cassius II when I saw robot wars here
[09:38] <Lunar_Lander> but then he had a section in the "Real Robots" magazine
[09:38] <eroomde> the original cassius was inspirational
[09:38] <eroomde> the first proper self-righting mechanism
[09:38] <Lunar_Lander> I saw it last year on youtube then
[09:38] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[09:38] <Lunar_Lander> which was like changing everything
[09:38] <fsphil> eroomde: I still remember when they first did that flip
[09:39] <Lunar_Lander> before that, any toppled over robot would be the loser of the match
[09:41] <eroomde> it was A Moment
[09:41] <eroomde> purest michael bay
[09:41] <eroomde> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NAYjPlRzU8
[09:42] <eroomde> his voice has a very similar timbre to alan bond
[09:44] <fsphil> hehe, may contain nuts
[09:46] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[09:46] <Lunar_Lander> did he compete in robot wars with Cassius III?
[09:47] <Lunar_Lander> I know that he build it from real robots
[09:47] <Lunar_Lander> but I also remember that he didn't like some safety issues at RW
[09:48] <eroomde> nice youtube comment:
[09:48] <fsphil> the early series had quite a few
[09:48] <eroomde> "i trick or treated at his house, but hed forgotten to get any sweets so he showed us round hisÿ workshop- it was amazing!! so many different brums :D"
[09:48] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[09:49] <eroomde> he never competed with cassius3 now
[09:49] <eroomde> it was amazing though
[09:49] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil, yeah, I think they should have had the boxed arena from Series 4 on from the start
[09:49] <eroomde> no one realised they'd be powerful enought to warrant it
[09:49] <Lunar_Lander> eroomde, are there any specs about it?
[09:49] <eroomde> Lunar_Lander: there were on his old site
[09:49] <Lunar_Lander> yea, but then Hypnodisc came
[09:49] <eroomde> it was tiny and massively dense
[09:49] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[09:49] <Lunar_Lander> did it have a secondary weapon?
[09:50] <eroomde> it had 2 of his beloved bosch 400" motors per wheel, overvoltaged from 12 to 24V
[09:50] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[09:50] <eroomde> it had a 69bar co2 pneumatic system running 2 rams on the front, modified motorcycle forks
[09:50] <eroomde> and it had a further 2 bosch motors powering a spinning disk on the back
[09:50] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[09:50] <eroomde> armous was v think aircraft ali plte
[09:50] <Lunar_Lander> vertical spinner?
[09:50] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[09:50] <eroomde> yep
[09:51] <Lunar_Lander> nice
[09:52] <Lunar_Lander> so it was never used?
[09:53] <eroomde> not so far as i know
[09:53] <eroomde> rex got a bit dissiulusioned by RW and mentorn i think
[09:53] <eroomde> a lot of people got a bit annoyed with mentorn
[09:53] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[09:54] <fsphil> hehe, good they added the box: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8cvVYzvQQB4
[09:54] <Lunar_Lander> yea IIRC he didn't like some procedures in the pits
[09:54] <Lunar_Lander> I remember him saying something about it was not safe enough to his point of view
[09:54] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil, yeah! (already know the battle xD)
[09:55] <fsphil> yea that's another moment I remember :)
[09:55] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[09:55] <Lunar_Lander> the music when driving the robots in is awesome
[09:55] <fsphil> wheely big cheese never really got many good flips
[09:55] <eroomde> there was an incident with cassius 2 year
[09:55] <Lunar_Lander> that was only from Series 5 on IIRC
[09:55] <fsphil> but that one was amazing
[09:55] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[09:55] <eroomde> a techie who armed the robot stood over the rear spike as he turned it on
[09:55] <Lunar_Lander> ohhhhh
[09:55] <fsphil> eek
[09:55] <eroomde> which would have gone straight through his chest if it had glitched
[09:56] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[09:56] <eroomde> the guys who wrote the rules were also a bit ignorant
[09:56] <eroomde> but a bit arrogant too
[09:56] <eroomde> which is a dangerous combination
[09:56] <fsphil> I know someone lost the tip of their finger from a robot accident
[09:56] <fsphil> can't remember who now
[09:56] <eroomde> i clearly remember one of them (ex bbc special effects guy i think) declaring forcefully that there is no science to choosing antenna length, just pick a practical size
[09:56] <fsphil> lol
[09:57] <eroomde> i was 14 or 15 at the time but if it was nowadays i'd have ripped him a new one
[09:57] <eroomde> politely natch
[09:57] <fsphil> lots of robots seemed to have RF problems
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[09:58] <fsphil> anyways, food!
[09:58] <eroomde> the arena was a f*cking rf nightmare
[09:58] <eroomde> 2000 dimmer channels, 40 radio mics, wireless cameras, a free-for-all on pvr
[09:59] <Lunar_Lander> ohhh
[10:00] <Lunar_Lander> was it good that you had to use PCM?
[10:00] <Lunar_Lander> btw
[10:00] <Lunar_Lander> never knew that
[10:01] <Lunar_Lander> could that be the reason that it happened sometimes that robots won't move from the start?
[10:01] <Lunar_Lander> but again if you had to use PCM you should be able to get through interference?
[10:01] <eroomde> yes mostly used pcm
[10:02] <eroomde> for heavies i think it was made mandatory
[10:02] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[10:02] <eroomde> oh it was good fun
[10:02] <eroomde> i wish it was still around and active
[10:03] <eroomde> i could make an awesome one nowadays :)
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[10:03] <Lunar_Lander> :) yeah
[10:03] <Lunar_Lander> but
[10:03] <Lunar_Lander> could that be the reason that it happened sometimes that robots won't move from the start?
[10:04] <eroomde> i'm sure it could be a factor
[10:04] <eroomde> there are lots of plausible causes
[10:05] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[10:06] <Lunar_Lander> XD do you remember that teacher with the two girls from his class who made the robot "Napalm"?
[10:07] <Lunar_Lander> in Series 1 it was "Detonator"
[10:07] <Lunar_Lander> and the one girl was supposed to drive and it had a very slow start
[10:07] <Lunar_Lander> and he was like frantic and was like "Hand me the remote!!"
[10:07] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[10:08] <Lunar_Lander> what do you think about the style of the show in it's first two years?
[10:08] <Lunar_Lander> i.e. the gauntlet and trial rounds
[10:10] <gonzo_mob> seems a lot of the modelers have moved to 2.4gig
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[10:11] <gonzo_mob> gets away from the electrical noise but 2.4 is busy
[10:11] <gonzo_mob> thouhh for rc planes they are usually out in remote fields
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[10:20] <fsphil> eroomde: they still do live events
[10:21] <fsphil> my own robot never got past the "ooh that would be a cool idea" stage
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[10:25] <eroomde> fsphil: yes i used to do some of the live events
[10:25] <eroomde> but they just got boring
[10:25] <eroomde> they were too regular as jonno was trying to make a living out of it
[10:25] <eroomde> so no one was willing to damage each other too much as they wouldn;t have time to patch up before the next weekend
[10:25] <eroomde> and general enthusiasm for doing outlandinsh things waned
[10:26] <eroomde> and spinners weren't allowed as the arena would have to be too expensive to be easi;y maintained and transported
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[10:28] <Lunar_Lander> eroomde, what do you think about my question about RW series 1 und 2
[10:29] <eroomde> i don't know what your question about RW series 1 or 2 is
[10:29] <Lunar_Lander> what do you think about the style of the show in it's first two years?
[10:29] <Lunar_Lander> i.e. the gauntlet and trial rounds
[10:29] <eroomde> straight combat is much better
[10:30] <eroomde> i think the robots should be like icmbs
[10:31] <eroomde> you have a weapon, you need some way of deliveraing that weapon to a target
[10:31] <eroomde> so having to design for arbitrary cases like knocking over barrles and going up ramps is just a distraction
[10:33] <eroomde> i have had a few ideas for comabt robots since working on rockets
[10:33] <eroomde> there's some crossover stuff that i think could be quite cool
[10:34] <Laurenceb_> http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/19441822.jpg
[10:34] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: IC powered pogo-bot with the foot as the weapon
[10:34] <eroomde> glass houses
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[10:40] <Lunar_Lander> yeah think so to eroomde
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[11:13] <eroomde> I am having to have a correspondence with someone called Chris Peakcock
[11:13] <eroomde> say it quickly
[11:13] <eroomde> it's too delicious
[11:15] <Lunar_Lander> ?
[11:15] <fsphil> lol
[11:15] <Lunar_Lander> I just think as you think in respect of robot wars series 1 and 2
[11:16] <Upu> hah I use to work with a C Peacock
[11:16] <Upu> much merriemnt was had
[11:16] <Upu> also use to have a customer called C A Willey
[11:17] <eroomde> in my gap year job we had a japanese customer called Mr Takenoshita (pronounced takky-noshee-tah)
[11:18] <eroomde> we joked that you couldn't mess him around on the phone
[11:18] <Upu> lol
[11:18] <fsphil> brilliant
[11:22] <Lunar_Lander> hi up
[11:22] <Lunar_Lander> Upu,
[11:22] <fsphil> aye up :)
[11:23] <fsphil> didn't know you where from the north Lunar_Lander
[11:23] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[11:23] <Laurenceb_> SpeedEvil: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__14426__Turnigy_CA80_80_Brushless_Outrunner_50_80cc_Eq_.html
[11:23] <Laurenceb_> your personal quadcopter has arrived
[11:24] <SpeedEvil> :)
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[11:24] <Laurenceb_> or in eroomdes case, turbopump motor
[11:25] Action: SpeedEvil is annoyed at the lack of a max current rating
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[11:26] <Laurenceb_> 200A?
[11:26] <SpeedEvil> that's the rating of the ESC
[11:26] <SpeedEvil> so will be a bit more
[11:27] <SpeedEvil> Even if we assume 100A though - that's still 5kW
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[11:27] <fsphil> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1iqx-kjGFM
[11:27] <SpeedEvil> Actually - that seems a bit much for a 1.5kg motor going at only 8000RPM
[11:27] <Laurenceb_> they got 18.5Kg thrust
[11:28] <SpeedEvil> where?
[11:28] <Laurenceb_> thats almost enough for a quad if the pilot is light
[11:28] <Laurenceb_> see comments
[11:28] <SpeedEvil> ah
[11:28] <Laurenceb_> but thats just randomers trying
[11:28] <Laurenceb_> a large prop is more efficient
[11:28] <SpeedEvil> Of course
[11:28] <SpeedEvil> you want the outside to hit ~mach 1
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[11:29] <SpeedEvil> 133 revs a second, 2.5m/rev = 80cm diameter
[11:29] <Laurenceb_> http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__8872__Turnigy_Type_A_Beech_wood_24x12_propeller.html
[11:30] <Laurenceb_> sounds similar to what the commenter was using
[11:30] <Laurenceb_> very light
[11:30] <Lunar_Lander> do they talk like this in the north fsphil ?
[11:30] <SpeedEvil> The 6" prop is probably not actually unreasonable
[11:30] <SpeedEvil> 26
[11:30] <Laurenceb_> which 26 inch one?
[11:31] <Laurenceb_> i dont see any large props on hobbyking :(
[11:31] <SpeedEvil> In comments
[11:31] <SpeedEvil> 26x12 Menz S peak 170A-135A /17,2Kg / 6000 U/min
[11:31] <Laurenceb_> ah
[11:31] <Laurenceb_> hmm odd, less thrust
[11:31] <Laurenceb_> maybe reduced voltage
[11:31] <Lunar_Lander> btw is "the secret life of things" a quite old show?
[11:32] <Lunar_Lander> or "secret life of machines" as it is called
[11:32] <eroomde> secret life of machines?
[11:32] <eroomde> yes
[11:33] <SpeedEvil> Proper motor data would be nice.
[11:33] <SpeedEvil> Actual max current for 10s/continuous
[11:33] <eroomde> yes they rc manufacturers provide almost nothing
[11:33] <eroomde> its v annoying
[11:33] <eroomde> need a proper dyno rig
[11:33] <SpeedEvil> you really, really care about how much you can safely boost the thrust.
[11:33] <SpeedEvil> When about to intersect the ground
[11:33] <Laurenceb_> hmm they used 12s for that 26" test
[11:33] <Laurenceb_> same as the 18.5Kg test
[11:34] <Lunar_Lander> eroomde, so rex was famous even before RW?
[11:34] <Laurenceb_> i wonder if it was the cell esr, the 18.5kg test measured only 40.6v output
[11:34] <Laurenceb_> it looks complex :P
[11:34] <Laurenceb_> maybe you'd need a hexacopter with those
[11:34] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: Well - people are probably measuring with a multimeter
[11:34] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: At least some of them
[11:34] <SpeedEvil> And - well - multimeter with ESC load
[11:35] <SpeedEvil> I guess you'd actually want to go somewhat smaller than a 26" prop, so you have some thrust reserve
[11:35] <SpeedEvil> you really don't want to be trying to push the prop ends supersonic
[11:36] <SpeedEvil> I wouldn't be comfortable with much less than a nonacopter
[11:36] <Laurenceb_> http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__23591__Turnigy_RotoMax_100cc_Size_Brushless_Outrunner_Motor_USA_Warehouse_.html
[11:36] <Laurenceb_> hmm
[11:37] <eroomde> i wonder if one can learn anything about just going supercitical in the flow
[11:37] <eroomde> and going way beyond supersonic
[11:37] <eroomde> taking a page from liquid compressors
[11:37] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: you mean for props?
[11:37] <eroomde> yeah
[11:37] <Laurenceb_> I just got back from flying a homemade paramotor powered with this motor. It has plenty of thrust! I was able to climb at a good rate with a 27X10 prop. I weigh 165lbs so I think this is really great
[11:37] <Laurenceb_> ^insane
[11:37] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: There was a _LOT_ of research done on supersonic props in the 40s
[11:37] <eroomde> an analogy might be something we were looking at for the turbopump
[11:37] <SpeedEvil> but...
[11:38] <eroomde> cos everyone spends ages trying to avoid the liquid from cavitating
[11:38] <eroomde> but instead of trying to avoid cavitation you can embrace it and just design it to cavitate stably and run at much, much high wpeeds
[11:38] <SpeedEvil> The efficiency always sucked
[11:38] <SpeedEvil> - supersonic props
[11:38] <SpeedEvil> AIUI
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[11:39] <SpeedEvil> I vaguely remember reading some NACA reports on it
[11:40] <eroomde> yes indeed for compressible flows it might be a different story
[11:40] <eroomde> ianaa
[11:40] <eroomde> (i am not an aerodynamacist)
[11:40] <eroomde> right, time to go and start the day finally
[11:40] <eroomde> ttfn
[11:40] <SpeedEvil> Have fun.
[11:42] <Laurenceb_> hmm
[11:42] <Laurenceb_> propcalc time
[11:43] <SpeedEvil> Conservatively, the above motor might want 2kg+2kg (prop and mount and ring shield) + 1kg of structure, plus 2kg of batteries. So say 7kg per. That's probably ~30% of the thrust.
[11:44] <SpeedEvil> You want at least twice the emergency thrust, so you'd need to take that into account, WRT the props not going supersonic.
[11:44] <Laurenceb_> hmm looks like maybe 30Kg thrust with that turnigy motor
[11:45] <SpeedEvil> So maybe a hexacopter - with a little margin
[11:45] <SpeedEvil> octacopter should be fairly safe.
[11:46] <SpeedEvil> Oct would probably have a decent stab at engine out too.
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[11:50] <SpeedEvil> I wonder how well a completely isolated control scheme would work
[11:51] <SpeedEvil> As in - each prop has a completely seperate set of GNC sensors
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[14:45] <jdtanner> afternoojn
[14:45] <fsphil> jowdy
[14:47] <jdtanner> bloomin weather
[14:47] <fsphil> dare I say it, but it's lovely here
[14:48] <Lunar_Lander> hi jdtanner
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[14:56] <jdtanner> piddling as per usual up here
[14:57] <Upu> afternoon jdtanner
[14:57] <Upu> sunny here
[14:57] <Upu> for about 10 mins
[14:57] <Upu> hi Lunar_Lander
[14:57] <jdtanner> afternoon
[14:57] <Lunar_Lander> hi Upu
[14:57] <Lunar_Lander> how are you two?
[14:57] <Upu> hows the payload coming along ?
[14:57] <Upu> I'm well
[14:57] <jdtanner> Alright thanks
[14:57] <jdtanner> :)
[14:58] <jdtanner> i got my capture usb gadget from DX yesterday
[14:58] <Upu> oh the EZCAP
[14:58] <jdtanner> looking for a moment to have a play...yep
[14:58] <Upu> yeah just take the dongle out
[14:58] <Upu> and throw everything else away
[14:58] <jdtanner> lol
[14:59] <jdtanner> For once, Chinese manufacturinjg shortcuts seem to help...the dongle just comes apart in the hands
[14:59] <Upu> yeah lol
[14:59] <jdtanner> easy to replace the aerial connector :)
[14:59] <Upu> I just stuck a BNC into it
[14:59] <jdtanner> That place is a goldmine of rubbish
[15:00] <Upu> yeah I got my torches from there
[15:00] <Upu> some monster powerful ones
[15:00] <Upu> the single cell 1200 lumens ones are insane
[15:01] <jdtanner> Re BNC: I'll probably do the same as well tbh. I've just ordered a new laser pointer, a knife sharpener, and something else (can't rememebr what)...all for about £10
[15:01] <jdtanner> I might get a new torch as well :)
[15:01] <Upu> haha
[15:01] <Upu> well if you work in dark outdoor places
[15:01] <jdtanner> You can never have too many otrches
[15:01] <jdtanner> torches
[15:01] <Upu> Let me get the one I got
[15:01] <jdtanner> cool...muchos lumens = good
[15:01] <Upu> it has the tactic strobe mode a la Hit Girls torch in Kick Ass
[15:01] <jdtanner> in a torch anway
[15:02] <Upu> which is geninuely disorientating
[15:02] <Lunar_Lander> well the payload is OK
[15:02] <jdtanner> lol
[15:02] <Lunar_Lander> if you asked me as well Upu
[15:02] <Upu> indeed Lunar_Lander
[15:02] <Lunar_Lander> I want to install debug LEDs
[15:02] <Lunar_Lander> but then I came across this
[15:02] <Lunar_Lander> wait
[15:02] <jdtanner> cool :)
[15:02] <Lunar_Lander> https://www.sparkfun.com/products/105
[15:02] <BrainDamage> the new ezcap dongles mount a shitter downshift chip
[15:02] <Lunar_Lander> what do you say about that?
[15:02] <Upu> http://www.dealextreme.com/p/ultrafire-m3-t60-xm-lt6-5-mode-1200-lumen-white-led-flashlight-black-1-x-18650-100157?item=20
[15:03] <BrainDamage> check if it's the elonics one
[15:03] <Upu> you'll need a battery and charger
[15:03] <Upu> Elonics went bust
[15:03] <Lunar_Lander> elonics?
[15:03] <Upu> they make the sought after E4000 chip
[15:04] <Lunar_Lander> jdtanner, well first thought of having a red, yellow and green LED collection
[15:04] <Lunar_Lander> but maybe the RGB LED is a better idea?
[15:04] <jdtanner> Upu: Christ...that looks like it would punch a hole in space time
[15:05] <Lunar_Lander> I don't know maybe individual LEDs are better to discern
[15:05] <jdtanner> If it is only for debug then it doesn't matter too much I suppose?
[15:05] <Upu> anything lunar
[15:06] <BrainDamage> if you want I can take a pic of my diving flashlight
[15:06] <Upu> HID one ?
[15:06] <BrainDamage> it can be seen outside, in plain day, in summer
[15:06] <BrainDamage> 1kLm output
[15:07] <fsphil> you've seen the light?
[15:07] <Upu> I saw the light , it wasn't for me
[15:07] <Upu> I've always had a thing for torches
[15:07] <Upu> I have loads
[15:07] <Lunar_Lander> Upu, how do you mean
[15:07] <jdtanner> Ok...I need one. I have several LED Lensers...but the max output on my biggest is 200lm (P7)
[15:07] <Lunar_Lander> jdtanner, yea
[15:07] <fsphil> got a new one last weekend that is charged by squeezing it
[15:08] <Upu> I like bright torches
[15:08] <jdtanner> lol
[15:08] <fsphil> TOPHAT -- totally over powered hight altitude torch
[15:08] <fsphil> -t
[15:09] <Upu> I used to have a 1 million candle power hunting lamp my mates referred to as the "dogging torch"
[15:09] <Upu> and I'm not explaining that if you don't know what dogging is
[15:09] <jdtanner> Yeah, we have one of those at work precisely for that purpose...Dragon Light of something
[15:09] <fsphil> at work?
[15:10] <jdtanner> (Police)
[15:10] <Upu> still at my parents but the battery pack is long dead
[15:10] <fsphil> I may have mixed up two conversations...
[15:10] <jdtanner> Yeah...I remember that the batteries weren't very good
[15:10] <Upu> well when your 17 and not getting any the best thing to do is go disrupt some people who are
[15:10] <jdtanner> fsphil: no...you are still in the right one ;)
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[15:10] <fsphil> aaaaaaah
[15:11] <jdtanner> Ok..so I need one of those torches Upu linked to. Birthday soon...but can I convince the missus that I can have it in addition to my Raspberry Pi???
[15:11] <Upu> lol
[15:11] <Upu> don't forget battery(s) and charger
[15:12] <Upu> the best ones are the trustfire ones
[15:12] <Upu> they have flames on the side
[15:12] <fsphil> good name for a torch
[15:12] <Upu> may be a premonition I don't know
[15:12] <jdtanner> Trustfire torch or battery?
[15:12] <Upu> http://www.dealextreme.com/p/trustfire-protected-18650-3-7v-true-2400mah-rechargeable-lithium-batteries-2-pack-20392?item=34
[15:12] <Upu> batteries
[15:13] <Upu> http://www.dealextreme.com/p/ultrafire-3-6-3-7v-battery-charger-1251
[15:13] <Upu> charger
[15:13] <Upu> http://www.dealextreme.com/p/trustfire-tr-3t6-xm-l-t6-5-mode-3800lm-memory-3-led-white-flashlight-black-3-x-18650-121720?item=16
[15:13] <Upu> "lol"
[15:14] <Upu> Trustfire Facemelter 2000
[15:14] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[15:14] <jdtanner> Bookmarked in folder "Upu is a bad man who is making me spend money again"
[15:14] <jdtanner> ;)
[15:14] <Upu> haha
[15:14] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[15:15] <Upu> my boss got one for his cabin in Scotland, he was extremely impressed
[15:15] <jdtanner> I think Georgina will go ape...oh well :)
[15:15] <Upu> "its for the job"
[15:15] <joph> Upu, lol, I orderd yesterday 3 1000Lumen LED :D
[15:15] <jdtanner> Exactly.."mumble mumble..safety...crime...mumble"
[15:15] <Upu> I have 3 friends in the force and all dumped their Maglites for one of those 1200 lumen ones
[15:16] <jdtanner> joph: christ..are you trying to light up the moon?
[15:16] <joph> i already have one of these lamps, just the headlamp version :D
[15:16] <joph> jdtanner, no, just my workdesk :D
[15:16] <jdtanner> Maglites...only good for one thing...and that isn't a torch
[15:16] <Upu> 6 cell head knocker
[15:17] <jdtanner> couldn't possibly comment
[15:17] <jdtanner> I've heard of them used for just about everything apart from as a torch
[15:18] <joph> these flashlights that cause disorientation are also nice
[15:19] <SpeedEvil> 6 D cell flashlights are best for causing disorientation.
[15:19] <Upu> haha
[15:19] <SpeedEvil> Applied vigourously behind the ear.
[15:20] <jdtanner> lol
[15:20] <joph> flashbang: useless against this flashlight :D
[15:20] <jdtanner> I have a little clippy light for exactly that purpose...just angled correctly it leads to disorientation
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[17:18] <Lunar_Lander> hi daveake
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[18:03] <tomm_> hello! may i ask a quick question?
[18:03] <Upu> of course
[18:08] <tomm_> thanks :) i'm buying resistors for the ntx2/arduino connection, and I just want to double check the watt value I should be getting of the resistors (as I don't want to invest in the wrong ones, inexpensive though they are!) for example, is this ok for the 22k ones?
[18:08] <tomm_> http://www.rapidonline.com/Electronic-Components/22k-0-4w-Metal-Film-Resistor-Pack-of-100-62-2662
[18:08] <Upu> yeah absolutely fine
[18:09] <Upu> theres not much going through them
[18:10] <Lunar_Lander> hello tomm_
[18:11] <tomm_> hi! thanks for your help. I'm having trouble finding 4.7k resistors, searching now, please could you point me to some?
[18:12] <tomm_> no results for 4.7k on rapidonline
[18:13] <joph> try 4k7
[18:13] <Randomskk> 4.7k is really common, rapid should definitely sell them, but probably not by searching for that
[18:13] <joph> or 4700R
[18:13] <Randomskk> you might find it more productive to buy a set of resistors
[18:13] <Randomskk> rapid have a box for less than £10 that has a set of ten of pretty much every common value
[18:13] <Randomskk> which is really handy for prototyping stuff
[18:15] <Lunar_Lander> aren't there any local electronic stores left in the UK?
[18:15] <Lunar_Lander> i.e. where you can go for resistors and so on
[18:15] <Randomskk> maplins... sometimes
[18:15] <daveake> Not much else
[18:15] <Upu> Agree with what Randomskk says get a resistor kit
[18:15] <Randomskk> there's just not much demand for that sort of thing as there perhaps used to be
[18:15] <Upu> Maplins are sh1t these days
[18:15] <tomm_> i tried at my local one, they said they didn't stock them :(
[18:16] <Upu> I've given up with them tbh
[18:16] <tomm_> http://www.rapidonline.com/Electronic-Components/MR25-Metal-film-resistor-kit-6519 <-- is that the kit?
[18:16] <daveake> 4k7 is possibly the most common value
[18:16] <daveake> If they don;'t sell them they don't sell any
[18:16] <tomm_> my mistake, I was searching for 4.7k instead of 4k7
[18:16] <tomm_> should've thought to try that
[18:16] <Upu> http://www.rapidonline.com/Electronic-Components/Mr25-Metal-Film-Resistor-Kit-13-0270/?sid=571fa636-2864-45e2-8db4-e9d8caae8835
[18:17] <Upu> yeah that one is perfect
[18:17] <Upu> what are you running the NTX2 from an Arduino ?
[18:17] <Randomskk> wow rapid have a whole new site since last time I looked
[18:17] <daveake> But if you can, get a kit
[18:17] <Randomskk> probably goes to show how often I shop at rapid really
[18:17] <Upu> I just use Farnell these days
[18:17] <Randomskk> same. well, onecall
[18:18] <Upu> RS annoy me with their silly "on its in stock for next day" and you place the order and its "Lead time 8 weeks"
[18:18] <Upu> Only think I get from them now is the Sarantel antennas
[18:19] <tomm_> wait i'll have to wait 8 weeks for delivery?
[18:20] <Randomskk> no
[18:20] <Randomskk> some things sometimes
[18:20] <Upu> no sorry I was complaining about RS electronics
[18:20] <Laurenceb_> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-18663075
[18:20] <Laurenceb_> slightly smoother than the chinese one
[18:21] <tomm_> oh good, had me worried for a second!
[18:22] <tomm_> and what do you mean by what am i running the ntx2 from the arduino, you mean am i using a breadboard or strip board or?
[18:22] <tomm_> or in terms of wiring?
[18:22] <tomm_> sorry if i'm misunderstanding
[18:23] <Upu> no are you using an Arduino ?
[18:23] <Upu> full stop :)
[18:24] <tomm_> oh right sorry, yeah I'm using an arduino uno :)
[18:24] <Upu> oh so 5V
[18:24] <tomm_> and the radio I'm planning to use is the £20 dongle that was linked in the mailing list the other day, i was told thats ok for testing
[18:24] <Upu> Yep it will be fine
[18:24] <tomm_> yeah 5v
[18:24] <tomm_> so I should buy that kit?
[18:25] <Upu> I would (did)
[18:25] <tomm_> great, thanks :)
[18:26] <tomm_> oh, as I'm asking, are there any wires you'd recommend? i'm using the ones that came with the inventors kit at the moment, and they're a bit cumbersome
[18:26] <Upu> I just use some I got from, ahem, Maplins
[18:26] <tomm_> as in any particular types i should get/avoid?
[18:26] <Upu> I don't use breadboard any more
[18:26] <Upu> but just some with pins on the end
[18:27] <tomm_> ok, will do! what do you use intend, strip board?
[18:27] <tomm_> *instead
[18:28] <tomm_> i was thinking it'd be better to prototype on the breadboard before soldering everything?
[18:28] <Upu> no I make PCB's
[18:28] <Upu> afk a few
[18:30] <tomm_> oh right, fair enough
[18:30] <Lunar_Lander> tomm_, breadboard is OK for testing I would say
[18:30] <tomm_> i don't have access to pcb making equipment
[18:30] <Lunar_Lander> but I had it several times that I made the radio circuit on breadboard
[18:30] <Lunar_Lander> and then I would leave it and come back the next day and connect the arduino with the radio program and it wouldn't work
[18:30] <Lunar_Lander> even when reuploading the radio code
[18:31] <tomm_> yeah they can be unreliable
[18:31] <Lunar_Lander> only thing that helped was taking it apart and beginning from the start
[18:31] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[18:31] <Randomskk> tomm_: not that you need it: $10 gets you ten PCBs made up in China
[18:31] <Lunar_Lander> $10?
[18:31] <tomm_> made custom?
[18:31] <Lunar_Lander> I only found offers for about $200
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[18:33] <Randomskk> http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/fusion-pcb-service-p-835.html?cPath=185
[18:33] <Randomskk> http://iteadstudio.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=19_20
[18:34] <Lunar_Lander> ohhhh seeed has been hacked last year
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[18:37] Nick change: earthshine_ -> earthshine
[18:39] <tomm_> oh, one more thing, when i'm following the guide, is it possible to work form the pictures (i.e. in the picture the resistor goes in say D10-11, so i put mine in d1011 in my breadboard) or should i be working wholly from the schematic?
[18:40] <Randomskk> either should be okay. working with the schematic is more likely to help you understand what's going on though, I guess
[18:40] <Randomskk> personally I'd be working from the schematic
[18:40] <Randomskk> you could refer to the pictures to check, too
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[18:42] <tomm_> yeah for sure, i won't be ignoring the schematic completely, but i prefer to have a visual reference. i was just think that as the breadboards are different sizes, the physical layout may be different even if the circuit is the same
[18:42] <tomm_> *thinking
[18:43] <Randomskk> oh, no, that should be fine
[18:44] <tomm_> oh good :) thanks for the help everyone, i'll probably be back when the bits arrive and i'll start work on my tracker!
[18:46] <jcoxon> evening all
[18:46] <Randomskk> hi
[18:47] <jcoxon> hey Randomskk
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[18:49] <jcoxon> any launches from you guys planned?
[18:49] <Upu> evenign jcoxon
[18:49] <Randomskk> hmm. should be two or three sponsor launches in the next month or so
[18:49] <jcoxon> oh cool
[18:50] <Upu> got 5 mins ?
[18:50] <jcoxon> you still up in Cam?
[18:50] <Randomskk> I plan to do wombat r2 over the summer to iron out some little issues and once that's working I want to try some digital image transmission
[18:50] <Randomskk> nah, back home now
[18:50] <jcoxon> Upu yup
[18:50] <jcoxon> Randomskk, ssdv?
[18:50] <Lunar_Lander> hello jcoxon and wb Upu
[18:50] <Randomskk> maybe implement that
[18:50] <Randomskk> but this chip has DSP, 192kB RAM and a 160MHz CPU
[18:50] <Randomskk> with FPU and stuff
[18:51] <Randomskk> so I want to try a few other fun ideas
[18:51] <jcoxon> :-D
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[18:51] <Lunar_Lander> what's FPU?
[18:51] <Randomskk> floating point unit
[18:51] <Randomskk> there are all sorts of exciting things I could try, like fountain codes or raptor codes
[18:51] <Randomskk> which are rateless -- you can just keep on transmitting data for as long as you want, and when the receiver has listened for long enough it gets the whole image
[18:52] <Randomskk> but it only needs to listen for just a little longer than the full data length, at any point in the transmission, with breaks
[18:52] <Randomskk> in other words if the image is 100 chunks big and you transmit 200 chunks and your receiver starts getting them at chunk #20 and then misses ten or twenty but eventually ets to #150, it'l have the whole image
[18:52] <Randomskk> doesn't matter which ones it missed or when it started
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[19:03] <Lunar_Lander> ah, thanks
[19:04] <SpeedEvil> I tried using raptor codes once, but couldn't automate the eagle-feeding.
[19:07] <Randomskk> a common issue. those eagles are very hungry
[19:13] <fsphil> Randomskk: ssdv would be too simple for a computer like that :)
[19:13] <Randomskk> fsphil: but still a very handy starting point and a thing to get working
[19:14] <Randomskk> not to mention exisiting ground side ssdv decoding
[19:14] <Randomskk> but first, revision two hardware
[19:15] <fsphil> I'd like to make an image format that contains a low resolution version of the entire image in each packet
[19:15] <fsphil> each new packets just improves the quality
[19:15] <fsphil> doesn't matter the order they're received in
[19:15] <fsphil> unfornatually I can't think of anything :)
[19:16] <jcoxon> fsphil, eurus
[19:16] <Randomskk> progressive jpg is similar
[19:17] <Randomskk> not sure how far it can be pushed
[19:17] <Randomskk> but that's potentially not a bad idea either
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[19:17] <Randomskk> you could even do progressive jpeg combined with raptor or similar codes, though... dunno how well it'd work with data received out of order
[19:18] <fsphil> yea, later data gets more specific
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[19:21] <Lunar_Lander> hi mclane
[19:23] <mclane> Hi Lunar Lander
[19:27] <Lunar_Lander> how are you?
[19:32] <mclane> waiting for Helium!!
[19:33] <mclane> we hope to launch in a few weeks
[19:33] <mclane> final integration of payload is ongoing
[19:34] <nick_> mclane: what's your payload?
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[19:35] <mclane> Canon A800 camera + CamOne action cam for videos + GPS tracker + Arduino flight computer
[19:35] <nick_> cool
[19:36] <mclane> if everything goes well (and we retrieve the payload) we plan a second launch adding a Geiger counter
[19:37] <mclane> some trackers would be welcome...
[19:38] <mclane> I mean listeners
[19:39] <Randomskk> be sure to email the UKHAS list with launch details near the time and I'm sure you'll get listeners
[19:40] <mclane> well, I am located in south Germany...
[19:40] <nick_> mclane: cool
[19:40] <nick_> Lunar_Lander plans to do that too.
[19:40] <nick_> I'm working on a scintillator detector to launch...
[19:41] <Randomskk> that doesn't help admittedly but still worth a shot :P
[19:41] <mclane> nick_: any details??
[19:41] <nick_> Of what I'm doing?
[19:42] <mclane> yes; specifically the detector
[19:42] <nick_> :D
[19:42] <nick_> I can bore you to death about it.
[19:42] <nick_> But basically I've got a scintillator + SiPM with a microcontroller DAQ system.
[19:42] <mclane> Radomskk: I will provide the data; maybe there will be someone...
[19:43] <mclane> nick_: I am physicist by education, so not boring...
[19:43] <nick_> :D
[19:43] <nick_> Cool
[19:45] <nick_> You can find some more details on my g+ page: https://plus.google.com/110529057212701972281/posts
[19:45] <nick_> Or feel free to ask about it.
[19:46] <nick_> So far I've kinda shown that it can detect stuff, though I need to make some improvements to definitively show it's detecting cosmic rays.
[19:46] <Laurenceb_> http://www.st.com/internet/mcu/class/1734.jsp
[19:46] <Laurenceb_> ^hell yeah
[19:46] <Lunar_Lander> yeah, true nick :)
[19:46] <Laurenceb_> F5 still to come it seems
[19:46] <Laurenceb_> apparently its going to be a 250MHz F4
[19:47] <nick_> I went with scint+SiPM because a fairly large detection area is possible with a low mass budget, it's a low voltage system and SiPMs are pretty robust.
[19:48] <mclane> nick_: thanks, will look into it
[19:48] <nick_> http://hackaday.com/2012/07/01/test-firing-the-largest-amateur-built-liquid-fuel-rocket-engine/ might be of interest to some here.
[19:49] <Lunar_Lander> sorry I have to monitor that chat and like Lars Golenia's Livestream (television critic) and stuff like that
[19:49] <Lunar_Lander> XD
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[19:51] <nick_> mclane: what do you do now?
[19:53] <mclane> reading your google + stuff
[19:54] <mclane> where did you get the SiPM from?
[19:54] <nick_> A guy who is the SiPM expert from T2K
[19:54] <nick_> Although I'm about to buy a couple of my own.
[19:55] <nick_> (By now I mean professionally, if you're no longer doing physics)
[19:55] <mclane> i am working for a big automotive electronics company
[19:56] <mclane> (not BOSCH)
[19:56] <mclane> (but similar size)
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[20:40] <Lunar_Lander> yay Spain is european champion!
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[20:42] <Laurenceb_> italy got annihilated
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> also
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> AFAIK there has been at least one HAB in Spain
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> and none in Italy yet
[20:43] <Laurenceb_> haha
[20:44] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[20:46] Action: Laurenceb_ is reading F3 specs
[20:50] <Laurenceb_> i cant actually think of any nice uese for the adc
[20:50] <Laurenceb_> its just too slow really :S
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[20:56] <SpeedEvil> how slow?
[20:59] <Laurenceb_> 50Ksps
[20:59] <SpeedEvil> Fast enough for lots that doesn't involve SDR I guess
[20:59] <Laurenceb_> it has up to x8 PGA and differential inputs
[20:59] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[21:00] <Laurenceb_> but you can oversample with F1 adc and get almost the same performance
[21:00] <SpeedEvil> Great for slow sensors
[21:00] <Laurenceb_> it has M4 and FPU tho
[21:00] <Laurenceb_> and comes in lqpf48 with 256KB flash
[21:00] <Laurenceb_> which is better than the rest of the stm stuff
[21:01] <SpeedEvil> Of course, more and more sensors are going digital.
[21:04] <Laurenceb_> you could connect a thermocouple directly and get ~1C accuracy
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[21:05] <SpeedEvil> Nice.
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[21:06] <Laurenceb_> apparently F5 is coming next, an F4 at 250MHz
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[21:11] <eroomde> F5 - Cortex Reloaded
[21:11] <eroomde> (geddit!!?!?!?!??)
[21:13] <Laurenceb_> lawl
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> oooh
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> some of the 48pin F3s have a 5Msps 12bit adc
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> that _is_ worth getting
[21:15] <Laurenceb_> but you dont have many clocks to process the data - 14clks/sample
[21:16] <Laurenceb_> italy deserved to get annihilated, they gave us arduino
[21:22] <Laurenceb_> jtag?! no we'll use printf for everything
[21:22] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[21:26] <Laurenceb_> grr i should make a payload
[21:26] <Laurenceb_> stm32+ublox6+si4432 locked to gps frequency
[21:31] <BrainDamage> Lunar_Lander: you're wrong about the HAB
[21:31] <BrainDamage> some irl friends actually did it
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> cool!
[21:32] <BrainDamage> the weird thing is that I met one of the guys at a scuba diving course :p
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> and then he told you about it?
[21:32] <BrainDamage> yes
[21:34] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[21:34] <Lunar_Lander> what was their payload?
[21:35] <BrainDamage> custom board from one of their sponsors
[21:35] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[21:35] <Lunar_Lander> what did it do?
[21:35] <Laurenceb_> ADC clock frequency : TBD
[21:35] <Laurenceb_> ^nice
[21:38] <BrainDamage> firmware, this is him http://www.signal-eleven.com/ and this is the association he co-founded: http://www.isaa.it/
[21:38] <Lunar_Lander> ah, thanks BrainDamage
[21:38] <Lunar_Lander> and you are from I too?
[21:39] <BrainDamage> yes
[21:39] <BrainDamage> in the latter link there's the hab project descrition, altough in italian
[21:46] <Lunar_Lander> ah thanks
[21:46] <Lunar_Lander> can you give me a short summary?
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[21:50] <BrainDamage> which of the 4? :p http://www.stratospera.com/
[21:50] <BrainDamage> here's the pics of the flight: http://www.stratospera.com/archives/1753
[21:52] <Lunar_Lander> wait
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[21:53] <Laurenceb_> hmm looks like the 5Msps 12bit adc F3s have some interesting stuff
[21:54] <Laurenceb_> opamps with some sort of analogue switching matrix
[21:54] <Laurenceb_> but reference manual hasnt been released :(
[21:55] <Lunar_Lander> BrainDamage, any technical info on the payload would be interesting
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[21:58] <BrainDamage> they had a wide angle cam monitoring the balloon, a geiger-mueller counter and a panoramic cam
[21:58] <BrainDamage> here's the hw, armv7 based, from their sponsor: https://www.develer.com/gitweb/pub?p=users/batt/bsm-2.git;a=tree
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[21:58] <BrainDamage> running bertos
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> HW?
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> ah hardware
[22:03] <Lunar_Lander> BrainDamage, so that is the control code of their uC?
[22:04] <BrainDamage> should be
[22:04] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[22:04] <Lunar_Lander> did they only fly Geigers and cameras?
[22:06] <BrainDamage> check the schematic, there's not much hw description on their blogs
[22:07] <BrainDamage> I see at least temp and humidity in panel 1
[22:07] <Lunar_Lander> do I need to go to "Tecnica"?
[22:07] <BrainDamage> http://www.stratospera.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/BSM-21.jpeg
[22:08] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[22:13] <Laurenceb_> routing is a bit eww
[22:13] <Lunar_Lander> BrainDamage, my stuff so far: http://s.gullipics.com/image/w/6/n/5zttxp-j9zljn-vsi/IMG0063.jpeg
[22:15] <Upu> looks great lunar
[22:15] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[22:16] <Upu> neater than mine was anyway
[22:16] <Lunar_Lander> really
[22:16] <Lunar_Lander> ?
[22:16] <Upu> yup my bread boards got messy
[22:17] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[22:17] <Lunar_Lander> do you have a photo?
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[22:18] <BrainDamage> after debugging this http://dl.dropbox.com/u/40949413/mess.jpg , anything looks neat to me
[22:18] <Upu> BrainDamage wins
[22:19] <Upu> somewhere Lunar_Lander
[22:19] <Upu> can't find them
[22:19] <Lunar_Lander> ah
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[22:20] <Upu> right i'm off nn
[22:21] <Lunar_Lander> good night Upu
[22:21] <Lunar_Lander> xD BrainDamage what is it?
[22:21] <BrainDamage> it's one of my classmates' insane creations
[22:21] <BrainDamage> it's 4 bit SAR ADC
[22:22] <Lunar_Lander> a SAR analog-digital-converter?
[22:23] <BrainDamage> yes
[22:23] <Lunar_Lander> what is SAR?
[22:23] <BrainDamage> successive approximation rsomething
[22:23] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[22:23] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[22:24] <Lunar_Lander> does an atmel chip has such a thing?
[22:24] <BrainDamage> basically binary search applied to adc
[22:24] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:24] <BrainDamage> yes
[22:24] <BrainDamage> it does that a single chip does, much slower, much more power hungry, much worse
[22:24] <BrainDamage> and much worse
[22:24] <BrainDamage> oh and much more expensive
[22:24] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:25] <Lunar_Lander> look how giant it is
[22:25] <Lunar_Lander> and imagine how small it is in one AVR chip
[22:25] <BrainDamage> the schematic is actually rather weird
[22:26] <SpeedEvil> Up to 8 bit SAR ADC should be easyish to do, if you don't care about speed
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[22:26] <SpeedEvil> I doubt it'd need more than 4 chips though
[22:27] <BrainDamage> this wasn't about doing in the best efficient way
[22:27] <BrainDamage> all the opposite
[22:27] <nick_> Lunar_Lander: on your pic: what are the four small breakout boards?
[22:27] <nick_> (red, presumabily sparkfun ones)
[22:28] <Lunar_Lander> the ones in the middle?
[22:28] <nick_> yeah
[22:28] <Lunar_Lander> light sensor
[22:28] <Lunar_Lander> humidity
[22:28] <Lunar_Lander> and then pressure
[22:28] <Lunar_Lander> and I think the 4th is below the SD card?
[22:28] <nick_> From top to bottom?
[22:28] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[22:28] <Lunar_Lander> click on the picture to zoom
[22:28] <nick_> On, no, I see you have something red above the humidity sensor, but it's not actually a baord
[22:29] <Lunar_Lander> ah that is a capacitor
[22:29] <BrainDamage> it has a 2 discrete shift registers, a combinatorial logic to reset the registers, tristate buffers to supply an r-2r dac, and a mux I forgot why is there
[22:29] <BrainDamage> by discrete, I meant implemented using flip flops
[22:30] <BrainDamage> oh and a transtor + opamp input buffer :p
[22:30] <nick_> Lunar_Lander: Are you going to bake this into a single board sometime soon?
[22:30] <Lunar_Lander> currently working on that
[22:30] <Lunar_Lander> will take a photo of that the next days
[22:31] <nick_> How much did your sensors cost?
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> I think 30 euros for both pressure and humidity and the light one was 3 euro IIRC
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> and the temperature one I got as a sample from MAXIM
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> (temperature is the black transistor-like thing next to the resistor at the left)
[22:33] <nick_> This is kinda what's holding me back from making up a logger board
[22:33] <nick_> Finding sensors I want to use.
[22:33] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:33] <Lunar_Lander> I just grabbed what they had at SFE
[22:41] <nick_> I also had a cool idea that may make the board design slower.
[22:41] <nick_> I was thinking it might be cool to try and make a single board that could either house an mbed or solder on a raw lpc chip
[22:41] <Lunar_Lander> what's lpc
[22:42] <nick_> LPC1768 is the chip the m3 version of the mbed uses.
[22:42] <nick_> Made by NXP
[22:42] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[22:42] <Lunar_Lander> the CPU so to speak
[22:42] <nick_> It's the microcontroller
[22:43] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[22:43] <nick_> The CPU is the Cortex M3
[22:43] <nick_> At least this is my understanding of the terminology
[22:43] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[22:44] <nick_> ARM design the CPU (and some parts around it), and various manufacturers design a uC with this CPU and some other toys around it.
[22:44] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:45] <SpeedEvil> Arm design the core, makers put balls on it.
[22:46] <nick_> I think it would be nice to have a single board design that can be tested with the mbed and then used with the much cheaper bare chip on the same design.
[22:46] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:47] <nick_> Especially if you are using a service that gives you multiple boards as standard (as the cheap ones seem to do)
[22:48] <SpeedEvil> same as arduino and AVR, sorta
[22:48] <nick_> Yeah
[22:48] <nick_> Imagne an arduino shield that you could also just hook up an AVR to instead
[22:49] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:51] <Laurenceb_> http://www.emcu.it/STM32F3xx/STM32F3xx.html
[22:51] <Laurenceb_> ^lol
[22:51] <Laurenceb_> quite useful i guess
[22:53] <BrainDamage> nick_: but you can
[22:53] <nick_> ?
[22:53] <BrainDamage> even if you cannot do a custom pcb
[22:53] <BrainDamage> you can still buy a breakout, and the bare chip
[22:54] <BrainDamage> it'll be 5-10$ most
[22:54] <BrainDamage> and will work with perboard, etc
[22:57] <Lunar_Lander> again where can you have PCBs made?
[22:57] <nick_> I think I will go with seeed
[22:57] <nick_> They are really cheap
[22:59] <Lunar_Lander> ah
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[00:00] --- Mon Jul 2 2012