highaltitude.log.20120408

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[00:08] <Lunar_Lander> sorry
[00:09] <Lunar_Lander> had to drop out for some time there
[00:09] <Dan-K2VOL> hey lunar
[00:09] <fsphil-laptop> quiet tonight anyway
[00:09] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[00:11] <Lunar_Lander> I looked at Upu's code in the meantime
[00:11] <Lunar_Lander> the one he posted on pastebin
[00:11] <Lunar_Lander> and I don't know what it does really
[00:11] <Lunar_Lander> does it just print out everything the GPS says?
[00:12] <fsphil-laptop> upus code? yea
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[00:16] <Lunar_Lander> ah I see
[00:17] <fsphil-laptop> useful to see if the gps is working well
[00:17] <Lunar_Lander> he creates a softwareserial object that is called GPS which reads the GPS pins and then he can say "GPS.read" or so right?
[00:18] <fsphil-laptop> yep
[00:19] <Lunar_Lander> ah I see
[00:19] <fsphil-laptop> .read() returns the byte received, or -1 if nothing was received
[00:20] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[00:20] <Lunar_Lander> write() could be used to send a command?
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[00:20] <fsphil-laptop> indeed
[00:21] <Lunar_Lander> ah I see
[00:21] <Lunar_Lander> but what I didn't get yet
[00:21] <Lunar_Lander> we'd want to use the hardware UART
[00:21] <Lunar_Lander> we need to change the program for that, right?
[00:21] <fsphil-laptop> only the serial object
[00:22] <Lunar_Lander> I mean I was told that the hardware UART is better in some way
[00:22] <fsphil-laptop> it's better in every way
[00:22] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[00:22] <Lunar_Lander> so we'd remove software serial, I would say?
[00:23] <fsphil-laptop> if you have a free hardware uart, then yea
[00:23] <Lunar_Lander> well on Mega are 4 afaik
[00:23] <fsphil-laptop> that's loads
[00:23] <Lunar_Lander> so there would be definately space
[00:23] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[00:23] <fsphil-laptop> the basic arduinos have only one, and that's shared with the programmer
[00:23] <Lunar_Lander> even on uno I don't have a device that needs the pins 0 and 1
[00:23] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[00:23] <fsphil-laptop> so it might make sense to use nss on that
[00:23] <Lunar_Lander> oh the ICSP pins?
[00:23] <Laurenceb_> you could grab an olimexino
[00:24] <Lunar_Lander> ah, on Uno we'd use NSS
[00:24] <Lunar_Lander> is that a bigger one?
[00:24] <Laurenceb_> http://www.coolcomponents.co.uk/catalog/olimexino-stm32-development-board-p-808.html
[00:24] <Lunar_Lander> I once saw a big board with far more pins than mega but it wasn't compatible with the IDE or so
[00:24] <Lunar_Lander> by Diligent or somewhere
[00:25] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[00:25] <Lunar_Lander> thanks Laurenceb
[00:26] <Lunar_Lander> what does the thing between the DC jack and USB do?
[00:27] <Laurenceb_> interface plug
[00:30] <Lunar_Lander> ah, for what exactly?
[00:31] <Laurenceb_> interfacing
[00:32] <r2x0t> looks like JTAG to me
[00:33] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[00:33] <Lunar_Lander> here is the one I meant btw
[00:33] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.digilentinc.com/Products/Detail.cfm?NavPath=2,892,894&Prod=CHIPKIT-MAX32
[00:33] <r2x0t> that's nice board
[00:34] <Lunar_Lander> yeah, as I can tell it has much more pins
[00:34] <Lunar_Lander> I think it said there are 100
[00:34] <r2x0t> I wouldn't be scared of it not being 100% compatible with arduino
[00:34] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[00:35] <Lunar_Lander> oh look
[00:35] <Lunar_Lander> they have their own IDE now I think
[00:35] <Lunar_Lander> see the download link?
[00:35] <r2x0t> yes
[00:35] <r2x0t> chipKIT32
[00:36] <Laurenceb_> r2x0t: jtag is the 0.05" heade ron the top
[00:36] <Laurenceb_> or rather SWD/JTAG
[00:36] <Laurenceb_> SWD is nice
[00:37] <r2x0t> it's pretty fast as well.. 80 Mhz 32-bit MIPS
[00:37] <Laurenceb_> ARM
[00:37] <r2x0t> yeah
[00:38] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[00:38] <Lunar_Lander> wow their european reseller is just two train stations from here!
[00:39] <r2x0t> this is also nice thing from digilent: http://www.digilentinc.com/Products/Detail.cfm?NavPath=2,400,798&Prod=CMOD
[00:42] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[00:47] <Dan-K2VOL> kevin would you like to join our simulation for a little bit tonight?
[00:48] <Dan-K2VOL> anyone else is invited as well!
[00:48] <Dan-K2VOL> We need remote mission controllers, and these simulations are how you will train
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[00:49] <Lunar_Lander> well one moment
[00:51] <Lunar_Lander> Dan-K2VOL, what do I need the ts to be set to?
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[00:54] <Lunar_Lander> Dan-K2VOL,
[00:59] <Dan-K2VOL> sorry
[00:59] <Dan-K2VOL> back
[00:59] <Dan-K2VOL> getting people set here
[01:00] <Dan-K2VOL> ts.kg4ymg.com
[01:01] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[01:02] <Lunar_Lander> "No reply from server"
[01:03] <Dan-K2VOL> hmm
[01:03] <Dan-K2VOL> interesting
[01:03] <Dan-K2VOL> that's the correct address, is it teamspeak 3
[01:03] <Lunar_Lander> it is 2, that's all they have for ubuntu
[01:03] <Dan-K2VOL> ahh
[01:03] <Dan-K2VOL> that may be the problem
[01:04] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[01:06] <Dan-K2VOL> let me see if I can enable anything to make it work
[01:11] <Lunar_Lander> wait I am setting up TS3
[01:11] <Dan-K2VOL> AWESOME
[01:11] <Dan-K2VOL> thank you
[01:11] <Lunar_Lander> one moment
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[01:23] <Lunar_Lander> YAY Dan-K2VOL
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[01:41] <Dan-K2VOL> :-)
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[01:52] <WhiteStarMC-49> check
[01:53] Nick change: WhiteStarMC-49 -> weiz
[01:53] <weiz> check
[01:54] <Dan-K2VOL> mailto:KGlinka@gmx.net
[01:54] Nick change: weiz -> Whitestar-Weiz
[01:55] Nick change: Whitestar-Weiz -> WhitestarMC-Weiz
[01:58] <Dan-K2VOL> white star about to start a simulation
[02:09] <WhitestarMC-Weiz> not online
[02:12] <Dan-K2VOL> ok, weiz you can also switch to voice-activated
[02:13] <Dan-K2VOL> WhitestarMC-Weiz
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[03:45] <Lunar_Lander> Dan-K2VOL, still on?
[03:45] <Dan-K2VOL> Yep!
[03:45] <Dan-K2VOL> awesome job, sorry to keep you so late!
[03:49] <Lunar_Lander> no problem :) It was fun
[03:49] <Lunar_Lander> but I wanted to ask
[03:50] <Lunar_Lander> why is it necessary to start the payload and then drive to the launch site?
[03:50] <Dan-K2VOL> ahh good question
[03:50] <Dan-K2VOL> we cannot launch balloons in this city
[03:51] <Dan-K2VOL> and the launch site is a 1.5 hour drive from here
[03:51] <Dan-K2VOL> and there are a lot of things to check, as you see in this list, all of this is done while driving
[03:51] <Dan-K2VOL> TRANSPORT person will be in a van doing all this on a laptop connected to the van
[03:52] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[03:52] <Lunar_Lander> and why isn't it like possible to have like a house at the launch point?
[03:55] <Dan-K2VOL> well, it's a long story I'll tell you when we've had some sleep :-)
[03:57] <Lunar_Lander> ok :)
[03:57] <Lunar_Lander> and a final thing
[03:57] <Lunar_Lander> why was the last launch scrubbed?
[03:58] <Dan-K2VOL> Actually
[03:58] <Dan-K2VOL> We stopped tonight right where that last launch scrubbed
[03:58] <Dan-K2VOL> we never got any data received at mission control at this point
[03:58] <Dan-K2VOL> no data on the dump, nor the track page
[03:59] <Dan-K2VOL> and the launch crew troubleshooted the payload for hours
[03:59] <Dan-K2VOL> it turned out that the ORBCOMM antenna was not receiving the signal strong enough from the satellites
[03:59] <Dan-K2VOL> it did not have enough gain
[03:59] <heathkid> Dan-K2VOL: what list are you talking about?
[04:00] <Lunar_Lander> oh I see
[04:01] <Dan-K2VOL> heathkid
[04:01] <Dan-K2VOL> https://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=1TdEprcg4-uNBTTwm4OPQ_vTQNI6XACIIEHpig_Vp2io
[04:03] <heathkid> are you saying >300 meters per minute there are problems with telemetry?
[04:04] <Dan-K2VOL> yes, at that rate you may experience problems with satellite antenna signal lock due to tumbling
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[04:08] <heathkid> sorry... I'm new to this. why would it be tumbling?
[04:10] <SpeedEvil> because it's probably falling.
[04:10] <SpeedEvil> And in general when it's doing that, an is not well aerodynamically damped, it swings around a _lot_
[04:11] <heathkid> I see
[04:14] <Dan-K2VOL> thanks speedevil, yes
[04:20] <heathkid> you realize that's only just above 11 miles per hour ascent and problems with telemetry?
[04:20] Action: heathkid is confused
[04:21] <SpeedEvil> oh - I misread 300m/min.
[04:21] <SpeedEvil> That's not very fast
[04:22] <SpeedEvil> I suspect >>300m/min - maybe >10m/s is where it can often be tumbly
[04:22] <heathkid> per second I might understand... not per minute
[04:22] <heathkid> if so... need a better antenna
[04:23] <heathkid> that's why I'm confused
[04:24] <heathkid> and why would it be tumbling?
[04:24] <heathkid> what is the rate of ascention we're talking about here?
[04:24] <heathkid> from what I've been reading it's all over the place
[04:35] <Dan-K2VOL> sorry guys, where is that reference?
[04:35] <Dan-K2VOL> heathkid
[04:36] <Dan-K2VOL> so I can see what you mean
[04:56] <heathkid> does anyone have a chart of the ascention rate from launch altitude to burst altitude?
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[05:20] <NigelMoby> need sleeeeeep
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[06:56] <Morseman> Anyone about yet?
[06:56] <Darkside> no
[06:56] <Darkside> :P
[06:56] <Darkside> (4:30pm here)
[06:56] <Morseman> 07:56 here :-)
[06:57] <Morseman> Been up since 07:20 when Megan got up
[06:58] <Morseman> Apparently the Easter Bunny has been...
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[07:08] <x-f> happy easter!
[07:10] <x-f> it's snowing :|
[07:13] <x-f> how did the WhiteStar simulation go last night?
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[07:21] <griffonbot> @DutchMillbt: High altitude balloon flight #ukhas OZZIE2 08/04/12 1100 GMT Framlingham, Suffolk #hamradio 434.200Mhz SSB RTTY see: http://t.co/bNJiOVFL [http://twitter.com/DutchMillbt/status/188889217068306433]
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[07:49] <navrac> good morning
[07:51] <Upu> morning
[07:51] <Upu> all set ?
[07:52] <navrac> pretty much - still have some worries. Not sure this rfm is working properly
[07:52] <navrac> it doesnt seem as strong a signal as ozzie1 and seems to draw more power - cant find a fault though and too late to change it
[07:54] <navrac> And the rfm heatsing became dislodged after I glued it and its drifting a bit more than I'd like - but with filters set at 130hz it kept in track for the entire period including the nightime off mode
[07:54] <navrac> and after 24 hours the results are - total draw 424mAH
[07:55] <Upu> what was the previous one ?
[07:55] <navrac> could drop that by 60mA hours by turning off the xtal oscillator.
[07:56] <navrac> ozzie 1 had a draw of 1600mAH per day
[07:56] <Upu> Unfortunatley won't be about have a Christening
[07:56] <Upu> quite a saving
[07:57] <navrac> yep - and I've increased the output power by 3dB which is 240mAH more per day
[07:57] <Upu> hopefully it'll stil be in the air when I get back
[07:58] <navrac> I hope so - throuble is you never know whether its going to dump in the sea or float.
[07:58] <navrac> lot of work for a 2 hour up and down job!
[07:59] <Darkside> navrac: are you broadcasting rf noise floor this time?
[07:59] <Darkside> because thats really important data
[07:59] <navrac> no - this one doesnt go into receive -
[07:59] <Darkside> oh ok
[08:00] <navrac> its purely to test solar power and nighttime low poer modes etc and drift control
[08:01] <Darkside> ok
[08:02] <navrac> next flight is measuring balloon internal v's external pressures.
[08:02] <navrac> then the final flight is all of them at once - which will have retransmission
[08:03] <Darkside> m
[08:03] <Darkside> i've got my board ready for testing
[08:03] <Darkside> will be flying it on our next launch
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[08:04] <navrac> whens that? will look forward to seeing what range you get - my calculations show 160km is possible
[08:05] <navrac> right time to put the mast up
[08:05] <navrac> upu - enjoy your christening
[08:05] <Darkside> navrac: we wo't be using a RFM22B on the ground
[08:05] <Upu> oh yeah can't wait
[08:05] <navrac> lol
[08:05] <Upu> nothing I like better to do with my holidays than sitting in a church
[08:05] <Darkside> i'm expecting ranges far more than 160km
[08:05] <Darkside> with the right antenna
[08:06] <navrac> oh i would think so darkside
[08:06] <Upu> surprised I don't start fizzing and popping the moment I walk through the door
[08:06] <navrac> 160kM is with 100mW EIRP
[08:06] <Darkside> i've got a guy 400km away ready to test
[08:07] <navrac> lol - nah, Ive survived loads of church visits - you should be ok - just watch for the gagoyles falling off the tower as you enter
[08:07] <Upu> :)
[08:07] <navrac> get past that and you're ok
[08:08] <navrac> wheres eroomde when you need knots tying...
[08:09] <Upu> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtPeAac8EYk&feature=player_embedded#!
[08:09] <schofieldau> Darkside: so are you going to be transmitting /to/ your next payload?
[08:10] <schofieldau> ah yes the cutdown
[08:12] <Darkside> shenki: yep
[08:12] <Darkside> sco*
[08:12] <Darkside> argh
[08:15] <schofieldau> so when's the launch?
[08:16] <Darkside> likely on sunday
[08:16] <Darkside> still sorting out chase cars
[08:16] <Upu> it is Sunday Darkside
[08:17] <Darkside> Upu: next sunday
[08:17] <schofieldau> haha
[08:17] <Upu> :)
[08:19] <schofieldau> Darkside: is there likely to be a spare seat or too early to say?
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[08:20] <Darkside> depends which car we have
[08:20] <Darkside> we alreayd need a second chase car as it is
[08:21] <Darkside> else we won't have enough seats at all
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[08:30] <schofieldau> alright.
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[08:41] <navrac> morning james
[08:41] <griffonbot> Received email: navrac "[UKHAS] Re: Launch Announcement Sunday 8/04/2010 12:00 BST (11:00GMT)
[08:42] <jcoxon> evening navrac
[08:42] <jcoxon> :-)
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[08:43] <navrac> long shift?
[08:43] <jcoxon> yeah
[08:43] <jcoxon> just one more to go
[08:43] <navrac> ughh
[08:43] <jcoxon> going to get some sleep in a second
[08:43] <jcoxon> probably miss most of the flight
[08:43] <jcoxon> shall i clear the tracker?
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[08:44] <navrac> oh yes please
[08:44] <navrac> test show: average daytime current when not on solar 44mA
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[08:45] <navrac> average nighttime current 28mA - leaving the rfm crytal on is costing me power
[08:45] <navrac> but gives 3 days life expectancy
[08:45] <Colin-G8TMV> navrac: just seen your email "launch as planned at 11:00 GMT 10:00 UTC" Doh!
[08:46] <navrac> yeah - I know
[08:46] <Colin-G8TMV> I assume thats really 11BST
[08:47] <navrac> trouble is that the overall title is launch at 12 BST....
[08:47] <Colin-G8TMV> lol
[08:47] <Colin-G8TMV> well it's currently raining here in Cambridge
[08:47] <navrac> yep - I'd like to get it up at 11 incase the rain moves across
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[08:48] <navrac> its cloudy but dry here
[08:48] <jcoxon> navrac good luck
[08:48] <jcoxon> bbl
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[08:48] <Colin-G8TMV> which direction is the forcast track?
[08:48] <navrac> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=21ad9cde829549f8ad0c46027db8dc94eb374605
[08:49] <Colin-G8TMV> Ta
[08:50] <Darkside> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=63e13d0abda30c8aa47b51289ed0278cc0b59bb8
[08:50] <Darkside> oh that looks nice
[08:50] <Darkside> schofieldau: http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=63e13d0abda30c8aa47b51289ed0278cc0b59bb8
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[08:54] <navrac> IF it floats....
[08:54] <griffonbot> Received email: navrac "[UKHAS] Re: Launch Announcement Sunday 8/04/2010 12:00 BST (11:00GMT)
[08:55] <navrac> wrong window
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[09:00] <fsphil-laptop> mornin' navrac, good luck with the flight today!
[09:01] <daveake> +1. If this floats it could be epic
[09:03] <navrac_> thanks - I hope so, its a lot of work if it just leaks over the sea...
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[09:03] <daveake> or lands in a tree on the way up :p
[09:03] <navrac_> just have to reopen the payload to sort out the rfm heatsink if I can
[09:04] <navrac_> yes the winds are particularly treewards today
[09:04] <daveake> Trees suck
[09:04] <daveake> Or at least they seemed to that time :)
[09:06] <franck_> With fl-digi, what format for OZZIE2, pico ?
[09:06] <navrac_> select ozzie2 from the drop down and put in 312Hz shift manually
[09:07] <navrac_> hmm hers an issue - one receiver shows ozzie2 at 434.201 and one shows it as 434.204 - I wonder which one is righty?
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[09:19] <franck_> Merci navrac
[09:19] <Upu> want me to update the launch time on spacenear.us navrac ?
[09:21] <navrac_> yes pleas
[09:21] <Upu> what time are you aiming for atm ?
[09:22] <navrac_> 11:30 bst - trying to get launched before the rain
[09:22] <Upu> ok done
[09:24] <navrac_> thanks
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[09:24] <Bob_G8NSV> good morning gents
[09:25] <navrac_> good morning
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[09:25] <Rob_M0DTS> morning all.. where is the launch from today?
[09:25] <Bob_G8NSV> all preparations made navrac? saw your test tracks
[09:26] <navrac_> yep just doing final checks
[09:26] <Bob_G8NSV> what frequency are you going to be using?
[09:27] <schofieldau> Darkside: cool - will you be cutting it down earlier than predicted burst?
[09:27] <navrac_> 434.2 nominally - but one receiver here is showing it as 434.201 and one as showing 434.204 -one is out of calibration - but im not sure which one!
[09:28] <navrac_> trying to find a frequency reference to check
[09:28] <Bob_G8NSV> great thanks will get that into the dongle. will be testing a newyagi I built yesterday
[09:28] <Rob_M0DTS> that is near enough ;-)
[09:29] <navrac_> well once ( assuming it doesnt hit trees/lightenig/early leak etc) as son as someone else gets it we can get a better idea of freq.
[09:30] <navrac_> There is a slight shift at the start of each packet and a ~20Hz wobble while txing. The glue has dried and i cant get the heatsink back on the rfm22 properly
[09:30] <navrac_> nothing the afc in fldigi cant cope with.
[09:30] <navrac_> theres 25 secs of signal then about 15 secs of silence to save power.
[09:31] <navrac_> which withthe solar wetc gives 3 days life
[09:32] <Bob_G8NSV> navrac fantastic thats a real result. solar cells were worth the effort then!!
[09:33] <cuddykid> GM
[09:34] <navrac_> well its a combination - I could save more but turning off the xtal on the rfm is a disaster
[09:35] <navrac_> the biggest saving was getting the gps to work in proper powersaving mode - took a lot of work to get round the 'peculiarities' - the gps now averaegs at 9mA instead of 40mA
[09:36] <SpeedEvil> Is that while spitting out occasional positions?
[09:36] <navrac_> yep - it updates every 5 seconds
[09:36] <SpeedEvil> Nice
[09:36] <SpeedEvil> @?v
[09:36] <navrac_> 3v3
[09:36] <cuddykid> very good navrac - looking forward to this launch!
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[09:37] <navrac_> trouble is I expected nothing from ozzie1 and it went well. This one worries me as it could leak really early and be a damp squib.
[09:38] <navrac_> I've also put on 4g over ozzie1 for the solar and power monitoring circuitry which could tip the balance
[09:38] <danielsaul> Just remoted into our tracking station at school to find there is something else on 434.2 :(
[09:38] <navrac_> 434.204 -should give you a bit of clearance!
[09:39] <cuddykid> how many foil balloons?
[09:39] <navrac_> just one
[09:39] <navrac_> I think two causes problems from what I've seen
[09:40] <cuddykid> yeah, I guess if 1 bursts then it goes into a slow descent
[09:41] <danielsaul> http://saul.im/cZfO << Does that all look correct?
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[09:43] <Bob_G8NSV> what is the predicted track?
[09:43] <navrac_> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=21ad9cde829549f8ad0c46027db8dc94eb374605
[09:44] <Bob_G8NSV> thanks will take a look
[09:44] <griffonbot> Received email: Spike (Chris Foote) "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Launch Announcement Sunday 8/04/2010 12:00 BST
[09:44] <navrac_> looks correct - but no absolute guarantes on the frequency danielsaul
[09:44] <danielsaul> Sure
[09:44] <Bob_G8NSV> similar to last one then
[09:46] <griffonbot> Received email: navrac "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Launch Announcement Sunday 8/04/2010 12:00 BST
[09:46] <navrac_> lol - thats the second time I've put bst and utc wrong!
[09:46] <Dutch-Mill> and the year too ;-)
[09:46] <Bob_G8NSV> UTC for notams and similar!!
[09:46] <Rob_M0DTS> 250km to start with from here is a bit far for me to rx... good luck.
[09:47] <Bob_G8NSV> or zulu time!
[09:47] <Dutch-Mill> Ahh te good old NATO time standard..
[09:49] <Bob_G8NSV> we still refer to it as zulu at work, all my work colleagues are ex-RAF!
[09:50] <Upu> I put it right on spacenear.us navrac :)
[09:51] <navrac_> thanks - im glad someone round here knows what they are doing :-)
[09:51] <navrac_> its going up in 39 minutes anyway!
[09:53] <Bob_G8NSV> ready and waiting, got the yagi pointed in what looks about the right direction
[09:54] <navrac_> time for a coffee and a sandwich then
[09:55] <navrac_> well its going to be a while before the signal gets that far bob
[09:55] <Bob_G8NSV> mrs is doing me toasted hot cross buns in a few minutes
[09:55] <navrac_> ooh good idea..
[09:55] <navrac_> biab
[09:58] <Morseman> Urgh! I hate setting up a new PC...
[09:58] <Bob_G8NSV> hi morseman
[09:59] <Bob_G8NSV> no it s not fun nothing where you want it
[09:59] <Bob_G8NSV> even worse if its a new os
[09:59] <Morseman> Found the old version of DL-FLDigi but it wont update the list of payloads and I can't find the link to the windows version of the newer DL-FLDigi
[09:59] <Morseman> Hi Bob_G8NSV
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[09:59] <fsphil-laptop> Morseman, https://github.com/downloads/danielrichman/dl-fldigi/dl-fldigi-3.21.38_setup.exe
[10:00] <Morseman> Plus it doesn't look or feel like the old PC even though the same version of XP and same folder/display settings
[10:00] <Morseman> Thanks Phil - I hope I can remember that when I go upstairs :-)
[10:00] <fsphil-laptop> lol
[10:00] <fsphil-laptop> got any USB disks?
[10:01] <Bob_G8NSV> i finally rebuilt my old xp machine after around 4 years last week. it now is like new fast!!!
[10:01] <Morseman> Not loading IRC on it to see how it performs 'on its own'
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[10:06] <fsphil-laptop> mmmm easter eggs
[10:09] <Morseman> I could probably do it from the USB backup USB box but that would be cheating...
[10:10] <Morseman> Got it installed and running now :-)
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[10:12] <Morseman> Now just set the rig to 434.200...
[10:13] <navrac_> filling starting
[10:14] <daveake> I was too stupid to realise how to fill mine :D
[10:15] <number10> are you trying out FCD today daveake ?
[10:15] <daveake> Sure am
[10:15] <Darkside> i'm pretty much setup now to use one of these tv tuner dongles :P
[10:15] <Darkside> *finally* got gnuradio compiled and working on OSX
[10:16] <number10> just got one myself, did you upload any firmware
[10:16] <daveake> Are those better/worse than FCD or just cheaper?
[10:16] <daveake> number10 Yes get the latest firmware
[10:16] <daveake> And you need HDSDR
[10:16] <Darkside> daveake: depends on the tuner
[10:16] <Darkside> uhh
[10:16] <Darkside> you don't need HDSDR
[10:17] <daveake> And either loop the audio back from line out to in, or use a virtual audio cable, to connect from HDSDR to dl-fldigi
[10:17] <Darkside> i use spectravue with my FCD
[10:17] <daveake> No but it works well
[10:17] <Darkside> will probably be using gnuradio from now on :P
[10:18] <number10> HDSR - I have spectravue and FCHID -whats HDSDR?
[10:18] <number10> ah
[10:18] <Bob_G8NSV> I use SDR-Radio here
[10:18] <number10> #another SDR
[10:18] <daveake> Just what navrac recommended and it works for me too
[10:19] <number10> ok - always happy to accept advice :)
[10:19] <daveake> He saved me a lot of time getting ot going
[10:19] <daveake> it
[10:22] <number10> does that still use the basic front end FCHID ... I suppose I will find out soon enough
[10:22] <Morseman> I'll use the Persues again once it's set up again
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[10:22] <Morseman> HDSDR is a good program - much prefer to SpectraVue and even the Perseus program that came with it
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[10:24] <Morseman> Can more easily spot the bounced signals from G0GHK/B on 10GHz from dissused water tower with HDSDR over SDR-Radio or Perseus
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[10:28] <daveake> Yeah I tried Spectravue and didn't get on with it. Not that I tried for long mind
[10:30] <Bob_G8NSV> navrac external temp showing 85C?
[10:31] Action: SpeedEvil remembers 85C.
[10:31] <navrac> ok - launch in 2 minutes plus slight delay till updates as i get back to tune the receiver - only me here today
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[10:31] <navrac> - dont worry - doesnt read external when running off outboard power
[10:32] <Bob_G8NSV> ahh ok explains that then
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[10:40] <navrac_> its up -but worryingly low ascent rate
[10:40] <SpeedEvil> :/
[10:41] <cuddykid> lol
[10:41] <navrac_> in fact its coming down...
[10:41] <cuddykid> wtf
[10:41] <cuddykid> lol
[10:41] <cuddykid> I guess the minus shouldn't be there..
[10:41] <SpeedEvil> :/
[10:41] <Darkside> maybe a bird got it
[10:42] <SpeedEvil> Most rapid flight?
[10:42] <SpeedEvil> Actually - no.
[10:42] <daveake> I've done shorter :D
[10:42] <navrac_> and up?
[10:42] <cuddykid> woo
[10:42] <SpeedEvil> You were saying something about GPS powersaving earlier?
[10:42] <SamSilver_> up again
[10:42] <daveake> just GPS bounce probably
[10:42] <SamSilver_> thermal
[10:43] <daveake> Yeah mine went up then down then up then tree
[10:43] <cuddykid> :(
[10:43] <navrac_> when i got to the launch site the balloon had shrunk quite a bit - too much temperature differential - just wait and see i guess
[10:44] <SpeedEvil> What was the real launch altitude?
[10:44] <navrac_> 80m
[10:45] <cuddykid> I guess it'll U turn soon
[10:45] <navrac_> intereesting to see it is runing completely on solar at this point
[10:45] <SpeedEvil> This smells like GPS
[10:46] <gonzo_web> the solar voltage exceeding the batt volts?
[10:47] <navrac_> yep - the solar goes into a seperate regulator from the batteries
[10:47] <r2x0t> graph of "voltage solar" would be cool to have on OZZIE2 tracker page
[10:48] <navrac_> looks like the valve is leaking
[10:48] <SpeedEvil> Oh - there's a valve?
[10:48] <SpeedEvil> Dump?
[10:48] <navrac_> its a mylar
[10:48] <r2x0t> going down?
[10:48] <SpeedEvil> Oh!
[10:49] <navrac_> hope it comes down nearby - I can get the payload back at least and refil and go again
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[10:50] <Bob_G8NSV> hot melt glue in fill valve hole might stop poor valves leaking?
[10:50] <navrac_> b*gger - wifes got the car!
[10:51] <SamSilver_> get 2nd wife
[10:51] <Bob_G8NSV> quick phone call !!
[10:51] <SamSilver_> call gf
[10:51] <navrac_> and its come down
[10:51] <navrac_> gf lives in kent
[10:51] <daveake> gf2?
[10:52] <Bob_G8NSV> right near somewhere with the word W**d in the name
[10:52] <navrac_> trying to piece together the last partials
[10:53] <Bob_G8NSV> at least it didnt go too far for a recovery mission
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[10:53] <Bob_G8NSV> helps when you know the terrain i suppose
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[10:55] <navrac_> well if i can its going back up this afternoon - not going to waste the lithiums!
[10:56] <Bob_G8NSV> do you have another balloon?
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[10:56] <navrac_> 52.3044,+1.4104
[10:56] <navrac_> yes got a spare
[10:57] <Bob_G8NSV> do the seals give much trouble?
[10:57] <navrac_> never have before
[10:58] <navrac_> well i better find some transport and a long pole....
[10:58] <Bob_G8NSV> a rouge one then, hope it's not the batch!
[10:58] <navrac_> ughh - dont say that
[10:58] <Bob_G8NSV> do you reckon hot melt in the hole would work?
[10:58] <navrac_> worth a try
[10:58] <SpeedEvil> That is really close to a blue line.
[10:59] <SpeedEvil> Ah - it's a ditch
[11:00] <Bob_G8NSV> puts it in a farmyard
[11:01] <g0mjw> Sorry I am late.
[11:03] <Bob_G8NSV> good luck navrac
[11:04] <navrac> two daughters and a wife - all with the cars and all out, neighbours out , friends in village out not doing well on getting there
[11:04] <navrac> might have to pump up the bikes tyres
[11:05] <SpeedEvil> Haven't you heard of the wonderful public transport system?
[11:05] <SpeedEvil> Aha - that's something msising from the tracker.
[11:05] <SpeedEvil> Walking directions!
[11:05] <navrac> yep we have one bus a day here - in the opposite direction - except sundays
[11:06] <SpeedEvil> Actually - it's only 5 miles. A nice walk.
[11:06] <navrac> thanks guys!
[11:06] <SpeedEvil> :) Good luck!
[11:06] <navrac> at least the solar worked well!
[11:06] <SpeedEvil> It did!
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[11:07] <jm> Good Day!
[11:09] <Bob_G8NSV> can UPU cvhange the tracker symbol for a bicycle?
[11:09] <Bob_G8NSV> should be in his new app!!! ;)
[11:10] <Bob_G8NSV> as well as a bloke in wellies
[11:10] <Bob_G8NSV> and a lumberjack
[11:10] <fsphil-laptop> and a boat
[11:10] <Bob_G8NSV> LOL
[11:10] <Bob_G8NSV> selectable tracker symbols, thats on the wish list then!
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[11:12] <g0mjw> I take it there was a problem - meanwhile, what is the data format "packet"? Is that AX25? 300baud, 1200baud or RTTY?
[11:12] <fsphil-laptop> g0mjw, it's rtty. not really packet
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[11:13] <g0mjw> I expected it would be - AX25 is so inefficient
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[11:13] <fsphil-laptop> it certainly is
[11:13] <g0mjw> RTTY 50-HAB?
[11:13] <fsphil-laptop> in dl-fldigi select OZZIE2 from the dropdown list of payloads
[11:14] <fsphil-laptop> and press autoconfigure
[11:14] <fsphil-laptop> it should set up all the details automatically, except the rtty shift
[11:14] <fsphil-laptop> which was 310hz I think?
[11:14] <g0mjw> Didn't spot the autoconfigure. Was setting up manually...
[11:14] <SpeedEvil> Ozzie2 has fallen down again - and is only going to be pickable up _very_ close to it
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[11:15] <SpeedEvil> Maybe a mile around Heveningham or so
[11:15] <SpeedEvil> (though propagation of course may vary, and you might get lucky)
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[11:16] <g0mjw> Woops - forgot the sign
[11:16] <SpeedEvil> The blue circle at http://spacenear.us/tracker/ - is assuming the geound is at sea-level - so it's very optimistic
[11:17] <fsphil-laptop> hopefully going to be launched again later if navrac can pick it up
[11:17] <jm_> Good afternoon all, just got in and looking at Ozzie2
[11:17] <SpeedEvil> Does he have the helium and spare balloons?
[11:17] <fsphil-laptop> seems to SpeedEvil
[11:17] <fsphil-laptop> hiya jm_
[11:17] Action: SpeedEvil waves.
[11:18] <navrac_> yep got spares - just getting a recovery kit together
[11:18] <cuddykid> oh no :(
[11:19] <cuddykid> hopefully 2nd launch will be better! good luck navrac_
[11:20] <g0mjw> One coldtake terrain into account in the prediction - given sufficient processing power.
[11:20] <jm_> tracked my first balloons last week and built my first arduino gps logger project yesterday with intent of own launch later in year - watching with interest...
[11:20] <schofieldau> hey jm_
[11:21] <fsphil-laptop> just programming a new tracker at the moment myself
[11:21] <Bob_G8NSV> got most of the bits here for my payload, and fiddling with plastic welding for the envelopes
[11:22] <Matt_soton> is this now the shortest/lowest flight?
[11:22] <fsphil-laptop> I think daveake still has that honour
[11:22] <g0mjw> Shortest is probably one that got stuck in a local tree at launch.
[11:22] <cuddykid> daveake's is the shortest I think!
[11:23] <Matt_soton> i think i flight has to be up and down rather then up and stuck?
[11:23] <fsphil-laptop> he's got the lowest and highest altitude records :)
[11:23] <Matt_soton> (or did that happen)?
[11:23] <g0mjw> Not fair - lowest altitude is always going to be Cambridge...
[11:23] <Matt_soton> i think to be fair we can take off ground level :P
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[11:24] <g0mjw> OK - what is max as a matter of interest?
[11:24] <Matt_soton> 42km at one point
[11:25] <g0mjw> Pretty high then.
[11:25] <fsphil-laptop> UK records is 40.986km
[11:25] <fsphil-laptop> that's dave's Buzz2 flight
[11:26] <Matt_soton> oh the world record is 42km
[11:26] <fsphil-laptop> http://ukhas.org.uk/general:uk_records
[11:26] <Matt_soton> should this page get removed? http://ukhas.org.uk/uk_records
[11:27] <fsphil-laptop> a very expensive japanese balloon got to 53km
[11:27] <fsphil-laptop> was just thinking that Matt_soton
[11:27] <Matt_soton> was that latex?
[11:28] <Matt_soton> we probably need to have a balloons type recorded for records
[11:28] <cuddykid> I'm possibly going for the altitude record on friday, if I can get sponsorship..
[11:28] <fsphil-laptop> "polyethylene film balloon"
[11:28] <jonsowman> yeah, ZPs are cheating :P
[11:28] <fsphil-laptop> http://www.jaxa.jp/article/interview/vol42/p2_e.html
[11:31] <cuddykid> I wonder if navrac's is stuck in a tree..
[11:32] <cuddykid> just right by a stream/river with trees either side
[11:33] <cuddykid> some of them are reasonably tall by the looks of it from street view
[11:33] <Bob_G8NSV> google earth shows a farmyard with barns as well, hopefully somewhere safe!
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[11:39] <F5MVO> good afternoon all
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[11:40] <fsphil-laptop> hi F5MVO
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[11:40] <F5MVO> fsphil-lapto , hi , OZZIE2 news ?
[11:41] <F5MVO> fsphil-laptop , hi , OZZIE2 news ?
[11:41] <fsphil-laptop> F5MVO, there was a fault with the balloon, it landed quickly after launch
[11:41] <fsphil-laptop> navrac is going to recover it, and hopefully re-launch
[11:41] <F5MVO> ok i waiting
[11:53] <F8TIW> Hi ALL waiting departure , good luck !
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[11:55] <Laurenceb_> ozzie2 died?
[11:55] <Bob_G8NSV> no leaked and landed soon after launch
[11:55] <Bob_G8NSV> navrac off to recover and hopefully re-launch
[11:56] <Laurenceb_> oh
[11:56] <Bob_G8NSV> fingers crossd its an easy recovery
[11:56] <Laurenceb_> these off the shelf ballons arent too good
[11:57] <Bob_G8NSV> his last foil launch ran out of power over France, this one should run for nearly 3 days I think
[11:58] <Elmar_PD3EM> WX forecast is good enough to sent it to S France or Spain http://imgur.com/GIJux http://imgur.com/sAwjy
[11:58] <fsphil-laptop> I guess it would be really difficult to make a foil balloon from scratch
[11:59] <Laurenceb_> nope
[11:59] <Laurenceb_> just make a tetroon using proper mylar and amalgamating tape
[11:59] <Bob_G8NSV> if you had a decent welder ultrasonic or rf you could prob do it
[11:59] <Bob_G8NSV> tape is way to heavy, got to weld so no extra weight
[11:59] <fsphil-laptop> well I've got amalgamating tape, but it's pretty heavy
[12:00] <Laurenceb_> you can get <1mm thick stuff
[12:00] <Bob_G8NSV> am playing with thermal impuse welder design for my solar balloons envelope
[12:00] <Laurenceb_> i was thinking for something large
[12:00] <Laurenceb_> interesting
[12:01] <Bob_G8NSV> welding is the only viable way. It does not add any weight to the envelope other than what is needed for the envelope
[12:01] <Bob_G8NSV> still welding!
[12:01] <fsphil-laptop> how reliable is it?
[12:02] <Bob_G8NSV> they weld foils
[12:02] <Bob_G8NSV> but I think RF or Ultrasonic
[12:02] <Bob_G8NSV> thermal is the only practical diy, like those freezer bag sealers
[12:03] <Bob_G8NSV> but you need to make a longer element
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[12:04] <Bob_G8NSV> thin copper or ally tape on a insulated bar press down on the seam and apply a burst of voltage to the element. It gets hot and fuses the seam
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[12:04] <Bob_G8NSV> to hot and you melt the plastic and it sticks to the element!!
[12:05] Nick change: jim -> Guest98652
[12:05] <Bob_G8NSV> you need a timed pulse, thats why they call them impulse welders
[12:05] <fsphil-laptop> have you done this yet?
[12:05] <fsphil-laptop> it sounds tricky :)
[12:06] <Bob_G8NSV> still getting the bits together, there are designs on the net for home brew bag sealers, but I need to scale it up to say a 500mm long weld
[12:07] <Bob_G8NSV> got a timer relay and a nice toroid for the psu
[12:07] <Bob_G8NSV> the bag sealers like they use in supermarkets on food bags do a nice clean weld
[12:09] <Bob_G8NSV> the trick is an element with very low mass so it heats quick and cools quick
[12:09] <Bob_G8NSV> buttoo much power and you melt it!
[12:09] <r2x0t> maybe look for replacement heating element for industrial sealers?
[12:10] <Bob_G8NSV> looked at those they are big money for the machines
[12:10] <r2x0t> and the home ones are probably too small
[12:11] <Bob_G8NSV> yea only a few inches long but the weld is great
[12:12] <Bob_G8NSV> trouble is they have a support at each end for an envelope you need one with no end pillars so you can just move down the seam in sections
[12:12] <r2x0t> but I have seen some with no end pillars
[12:12] <fsphil-laptop> what about a heated disk, press on it and roll up the seam
[12:12] <r2x0t> that had just < shape
[12:12] <Bob_G8NSV> You probably only need a few mi about 5l wide weld
[12:13] <Bob_G8NSV> people have used discs but heating it and temperature control could be tricky
[12:13] <Bob_G8NSV> 5mm wide weld
[12:14] <Bob_G8NSV> a disk would be great but I cant work out how to do the heating easiliy and control the temp for consistancy
[12:14] <r2x0t> something like this may work: http://www.sousvidetools.com/bag-sealer-300-mm
[12:15] <Bob_G8NSV> thats the sort of thing but you cant have a support at any end or you cant move down a long seam
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[12:17] <r2x0t> then there are these: http://www.roger.pitiot.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/CSC-vacuum-Bag-sealer.jpg
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[12:17] <r2x0t> but probably too small
[12:17] <Bob_G8NSV> if I see a second hand one cheap I will buy it and pull it apart!!
[12:18] <Bob_G8NSV> 300mm would do at a push, it would just take a bit longer but maybe be easier to control quality of the weld?
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[12:18] <r2x0t> that may be true
[12:19] <Bob_G8NSV> as well as solar you could make envelopes for low pressure floaters. Use a valve to limit the differential pressure at altitude?
[12:20] <Bob_G8NSV> am looking round the local second hand shops for a suitable machine that doesent cost too much if its no use or I wreck it!
[12:20] <r2x0t> there are some on ebay: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/JML-Vacuum-Food-Sealer-System-Preserves-and-Protects-/230770987030?pt=UK_HomeGarden_Kitchen_FoodStorage_GL&hash=item35bb05d016
[12:21] <Bob_G8NSV> I think somethink like cannibalising these is the way to go for welding machines. The tricky bit is we need to weld very light film, around 12mil. I think these food bags are much thicker
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[12:22] <Bob_G8NSV> but I guess just a shorter pulse?
[12:22] <r2x0t> yes, but these are cheapest way to get it
[12:22] <r2x0t> then add pulse control
[12:22] <r2x0t> and just try it...
[12:22] <Bob_G8NSV> indeed that I think is the way forward
[12:23] <Rob_M0DTS> 40-50 quid for replacement 400mm elements & teflon strips on some sites.
[12:23] <Bob_G8NSV> a decent power supply that can supply way more power than you require is needed to prevent unpredictable voltage changes and give a constant pulse
[12:24] <Bob_G8NSV> thats not too bad for a 400mm welder
[12:24] <Rob_M0DTS> even cheaper: http://www.kitepackaging.co.uk/scp/Heat_Sealer_Spare_Parts/Basic_Heat_Sealer_Spare_Parts.html
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[12:25] <Bob_G8NSV> they are using 2 wires on that one
[12:26] <Bob_G8NSV> prob nichrome
[12:27] <Bob_G8NSV> Time to pull an old electric fire apart ;)
[12:27] <Rob_M0DTS> could probably remove the top section quite easily from these and make alternative mount so you can do longer runs.
[12:27] <Rob_M0DTS> ha
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[12:28] <Bob_G8NSV> yes that would be the way
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[12:30] <Bob_G8NSV> the disc idea is great if only I could work out a simple way of heating it and keeping the temp constant rount the whole circumferance
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[12:31] <Bob_G8NSV> you could just roll it down the seam,and do curves and complex shapes, that would be great
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[12:31] <Rob_M0DTS> i'l stick with 18" latex balloon for my first pico flight.... much easier, but not much lift though!
[12:32] <Morseman> Has Ozzie2 launched yet?
[12:33] <Bob_G8NSV> my only thought is to use a metal ring on the edge of an insulated disc and use induction to heat it. It would apper as a "shorted turn" and get hot?
[12:33] <Rob_M0DTS> it's being recovered and possibly re-launch, early descent.
[12:34] <Morseman> Ah OK - Thanks Rob
[12:34] <r2x0t> induction may work
[12:35] <Rob_M0DTS> if it did work would be a neat solution
[12:35] <r2x0t> but probably much harder to setup than simple heating element
[12:35] <Bob_G8NSV> you would have to turn it constantly to keep heat even round circumferance
[12:35] <Bob_G8NSV> much harder, the simple element is the first plan
[12:35] <Bob_G8NSV> Ultrasonic would be the way but the transducers cost shed loads
[12:37] <r2x0t> canibalizing the bag sealer seems to be easiest way... just to see what can be done with it, learn what temperature is best etc.
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[12:37] <Bob_G8NSV> yes thats the easiest, 300mm would not be too bad just take more time
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[12:44] <Bob_G8NSV> wonder how navrac is going with the search and rescue mission?
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[12:54] <navrac> funny you should say that - not well. Going back in a couple of hours with a yagi - can hear a faint signal but not enough to decode - cant tell where its coming from either
[12:54] <navrac> come back for coffee a raincoat and to get the yagi off the mast
[12:56] <navrac> no 3g or gprs up there either - so i'd have to come back if i do get any co-ordinates to look it up on google
[12:58] <navrac> going to check the spare balloon out while im back
[12:59] <cuddykid> next week looking very good for predictions here
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[13:02] <SpeedEvil> navrac: :) (signal at least)
[13:03] <SpeedEvil> Good luck!
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[13:04] <navrac> yes - but annoyingly i think the gps has lost lock as its in nighttime mode
[13:04] <SpeedEvil> Oh.
[13:04] <navrac> so its old fasioined direction finding
[13:05] Action: SpeedEvil blows the hunting horn, and fetches the dogs.
[13:05] <schofieldau> hahahaha
[13:05] <navrac> If i took my dogs with me they would run off and i'd spend the day tracking them
[13:05] <SpeedEvil> They clearly need GPS fitted!
[13:06] <schofieldau> implanted*
[13:08] <daveake_> Dogs any good at tracking? Give them a sniff of helium then send them off :)
[13:08] <navrac> I think the probelm is that the balloon had no helium!
[13:09] <cuddykid> haha
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[13:14] <griffonbot> Received email: navrac "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Launch Announcement Sunday 8/04/2010 12:00 BST
[13:18] <gonzo_p> was it a poor mix in the cylinder?
[13:18] <navrac> same cylinder as last time
[13:18] <r2x0t> it looked like it's gaining altitude nicely
[13:19] <Laurenceb_> you dont want a poor mix if its hydrogen
[13:19] <r2x0t> then suddenly big drop and went down
[13:20] <Laurenceb_> its flying now?
[13:20] <navrac> I filled it and checked the lift outside - then walked for 3 mins to the launch site and it seemed less inflated than it did when filled. Let go and it dragged across the ground and struggled to take off
[13:20] <r2x0t> no, landed
[13:20] <Laurenceb_> got you
[13:20] <navrac> no it went up - then came down
[13:21] <Laurenceb_> thats what she said
[13:22] <SpeedEvil> How was it sealed?
[13:22] <SpeedEvil> Is there a plastic plug or something?
[13:22] <schofieldau> http://instantthatswhatshesaid.org/
[13:23] <navrac> no its a magic self sealing valve - sadly i only taped it over just before letting go of it - I suspect it didnt seal properly
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[13:37] <jdtanner> Afternoon chaps.
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[13:46] <Laurenceb_> so is there a relaunch?
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[13:49] <r2x0t> right now it's recovery
[13:49] <r2x0t> relaunch is possible if payload is found and OK
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[14:02] <Bob_G8NSV> Hope navrac has better luck with the yagi
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[14:09] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[14:10] <Lunar_Lander> happy easter!
[14:13] <fsphil-laptop> any easter eggs Lunar_Lander?
[14:13] <Lunar_Lander> didn't check yet, sorry
[14:16] <Rob_M0DTS> mmm chocolate egg
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[14:18] Nick change: Gillerire_ -> Gillerire
[14:18] <Bob_G8NSV> MMM just been doing some fairly unscientific tests welding bin bags
[14:19] <Bob_G8NSV> have achieved welds as strong as the plastic very easily
[14:19] <r2x0t> sounds promising
[14:20] <Bob_G8NSV> used a strip of copper with a flat edge about 3mm wide. held in mole grips and heated with a camping stove
[14:20] <Bob_G8NSV> need to borrow a little thermocouple or contactless thermometer and see what sort of temp range the weld works at
[14:21] <Laurenceb_> interesting
[14:21] <fsphil-laptop> be interesting to see how hot it gets before it melts
[14:21] <Laurenceb_> doesnt it shrink?
[14:21] <Bob_G8NSV> seems to weld with a few seconds pressure without melting no shrinkage
[14:21] <fsphil-laptop> do you just overlap the sheets or do any kind of fold?
[14:21] <Laurenceb_> interesting
[14:21] <Laurenceb_> it doesnt stick to the copper?
[14:22] <Bob_G8NSV> accurate control with a temp feedback loop /PWM looks good
[14:22] <Bob_G8NSV> no doesent stick even when it melted
[14:22] <Laurenceb_> ive tried this before but it cept sticking
[14:22] <Laurenceb_> think i used aluminium
[14:22] <Laurenceb_> no oil on the copper?
[14:23] <Bob_G8NSV> I have some lengths of copper earth strip from lightning conductors thats what I used.
[14:24] <Bob_G8NSV> no oil
[14:24] <Laurenceb_> interesting - maybe it sticks less redity to copper
[14:24] <Laurenceb_> readily
[14:24] <fsphil-laptop> could be the material too
[14:24] <Bob_G8NSV> I need to measure the temps accurately
[14:25] <Bob_G8NSV> I have a thermocouple meter somewhere
[14:26] <Bob_G8NSV> found meter but not probe!!
[14:26] <fsphil-laptop> sounds like you're using my sorting method
[14:27] <Bob_G8NSV> god knows where that is, its just a bit of wire with junction on end could have got lost
[14:27] <Bob_G8NSV> will have to order one off evilbay
[14:33] <cuddykid> any news from navrac?
[14:35] <fsphil-laptop> hah, went to get my 6x AA holders and I've lost them. damn you chaos-sorting method!
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[14:37] <fsphil-laptop> ah found 'em
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[14:44] <daveake_> fsphil-laptop For batter holders and clips, my organisational method is ....
[14:44] <daveake_> .... buy bucket-loads of them
[14:44] <daveake_> mostly works :)
[14:53] <Laurenceb_> http://www.ladyada.net/make/x0xb0x/
[14:53] <Laurenceb_> nice
[14:54] <Darkside> hehe
[14:54] <Darkside> got a friend building one of those
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[15:01] <Bob_G8NSV> Just found the ideal anti stick coating for plastic welder elements should it be needed. Baking sheets! some sort of silicone coated cloth. The Mrs wont let me nick hers tho so will have to buy my own, cheap tho!!
[15:01] <Bob_G8NSV> sadly only in about 300mm lengths
[15:02] <r2x0t> you can get them in a roll
[15:02] <r2x0t> then the long side will be .... long
[15:02] <Elmar_PD3EM> so the width is 300 mm ;-)
[15:02] <r2x0t> yeah, but that should be enough
[15:03] <Elmar_PD3EM> and a few meters long ;-)
[15:04] <Elmar_PD3EM> btw, geeting some nice $GPGGA and $GPVTG strings from my GPS now
[15:04] <Bob_G8NSV> aha didnt know they did em in rolls as well! lubbly Jubbly!!
[15:04] <Elmar_PD3EM> but how about vertical velocity?
[15:04] <Elmar_PD3EM> yep they do Bob_G8NSV
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[15:05] <Bob_G8NSV> lost my breadboard now will need that to put my gps, rfm22b and arduino on for development
[15:06] <Bob_G8NSV> useful Elmar, from cooking shops I suppose??
[15:06] <Elmar_PD3EM> hope the Mrs didn't use it for baking ;-)
[15:06] <Elmar_PD3EM> yep... buy it in the supermarket here
[15:07] <Bob_G8NSV> not nicked it yet she is cooking now so using it, says she will get me some
[15:07] <Elmar_PD3EM> got a roll here: 8m x 38 cm
[15:08] <Bob_G8NSV> wow, so could make a really long element. Just did some crude tests and it did not stick but would be best to make sure
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[15:08] <Bob_G8NSV> cant measure temp tho cant find the thermocouple for my meter
[15:09] <Elmar_PD3EM> same problem here... lost that somewhere but it should be here in the shack ;-)
[15:10] <Elmar_PD3EM> any news on navrac and Ozzie2?
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[15:12] <Morseman> I take it from the track that OZZIE2 hasn't relaunched yet?
[15:13] <Elmar_PD3EM> no news from navrac yet
[15:13] <Bob_G8NSV> or my breadbord, really need that right now
[15:15] <Morseman> I used to have one as well Bob_G8NSV - can't remember what I did with it
[15:15] <Morseman> Let's hope navrac can sort out the problem Elmar_PD3EM
[15:16] <Morseman> I had some small square blue ones as well as a rectangular white one
[15:16] <Bob_G8NSV> not used mine for ages but sure I saw it a week or 2 ago!!
[15:16] <Elmar_PD3EM> He should be recovering the first launch of Ozzie2 now
[15:16] <Morseman> What happened to the 1st launch?
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[15:17] <Elmar_PD3EM> Like this Morseman http://yfrog.com/z/nx1mysdj
[15:17] <Bob_G8NSV> leak and came down a mile or 2 from launch
[15:17] <Upu> afternoon
[15:17] <Elmar_PD3EM> hi upu
[15:18] <Morseman> Nearly Elamr but only one bus each side
[15:18] <Morseman> GA Upu
[15:18] <Upu> hey Elmar I had another go with NSS this morning but couldn't get much better out of it
[15:18] <Upu> Going to try switch the GPS down to 4800 and try again
[15:18] <Morseman> Elmar - even
[15:18] <Darkside> what are you using NSS for >_>
[15:18] <Upu> testing Darkside don't worry go back to sleep
[15:18] <Darkside> >_>
[15:19] <Elmar_PD3EM> getting good data now with ss
[15:19] <Darkside> its only 1am.
[15:19] <Upu> :)
[15:19] <Morseman> I usually locate things I can't find when I'm looking for something else
[15:19] <Upu> I would recommend you use the hardware UART on a real payload
[15:19] <Darkside> yes.
[15:19] <Elmar_PD3EM> $GPGGA,151901.00,nnnn.55733,N,eeeee.52056,E,2,08,1.31,6.9,40,0*
[15:19] <Darkside> +1
[15:19] <Elmar_PD3EM> $GPVTG,,T,,M,0.101,N,0.187,K,D*28
[15:19] <Bob_G8NSV> Yes Im finding loads of stuff looking for it
[15:19] <Darkside> +1000
[15:20] <Morseman> 1am eh? The time when most essays that have to be in tomorrow are started
[15:20] <Darkside> i don't have essays anymore..
[15:20] <Upu> So can someone give me a one line sit rep on Ozzie ?
[15:20] <Morseman> Neither do I ;-)
[15:20] <Elmar_PD3EM> good... need to look into that. Kinda new to all that ;-)
[15:20] <Darkside> Upu: up, down, not very far, helium leak.
[15:20] <Upu> ah ok
[15:20] <Upu> going again or is that it for the day ?
[15:21] <Darkside> nfi
[15:21] <Upu> at the christening today they had 3 foil helium balloons per table
[15:21] <Darkside> i think they're hunting for it
[15:21] <jonsowman> i dont think it's been located yet
[15:21] <Upu> I was going to nick them all and send one up
[15:21] <Morseman> Darkside, is that the data set for balloons? ;-)
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[15:28] <jcoxon> morning all
[15:28] <Elmar_PD3EM> GA James
[15:29] <Morseman> Hi James
[15:29] <Upu> afternoon :)
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[15:30] <jonsowman> jcoxon: been on nights by any chance?
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[15:31] <jcoxon> done 3, one more to go
[15:31] <jonsowman> doesn't sound fun
[15:32] <Upu> nope don't envy you there at all
[15:32] <jcoxon> yeah its been busy - bank holiday weekends result in lots of unwell people
[15:32] <jcoxon> no GP to go and see
[15:32] <jcoxon> so they come to us
[15:33] <Laurenceb_> they come and ask #highaltitude?
[15:33] <cuddykid> guess it brings in the money nicely though!
[15:33] <jcoxon> good idea Laurenceb, i'll direct them
[15:33] <Laurenceb_> lol
[15:34] <number10> I always meant to ask jcoxon, what sort of doctor are you?
[15:34] <Upu> proper one :)
[15:34] <jcoxon> i'm currently work on a medical admissions unit
[15:34] <jcoxon> working*
[15:34] <jcoxon> but we don't have an A+E so will see anyone apart from trauma
[15:36] <number10> were you working in another department a while back
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[15:39] <jcoxon> yeah i've just finished doing renal medicine
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[15:42] <jcoxon> hey jonsowman, just had an interesting idea for a feature for cusf landing predictor
[15:42] <jcoxon> could we add an option to add 5deg horizon
[15:42] <schofieldau> Sufjan Stevens, anyone?
[15:42] <jcoxon> (like a tick box)
[15:43] <Darkside> schofieldau: :D
[15:43] <schofieldau> :D
[15:43] <Darkside> schofieldau: i don't mind a bit of sufjan now and again
[15:43] <schofieldau> Illinois is amazing
[15:43] <jonsowman> jcoxon: so it shows the 5 degree horizon as you mouse over the flight path?
[15:43] <jcoxon> yeah
[15:43] <Darkside> all things go
[15:43] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[15:43] <jcoxon> cause i was thinking about floating flights
[15:43] <jonsowman> jcoxon: yea that should be pretty simple really
[15:43] <jcoxon> nice to be able to work out if its near people
[15:43] <Darkside> hmm i should sleep
[15:44] <schofieldau> haha I was getting that feeling too
[15:44] <schofieldau> but I just started this album
[15:44] <jonsowman> jcoxon: whack a github issue in for it :)
[15:44] <jonsowman> i do gradually work through them, just other things have a habit of getting in the way
[15:45] <jonsowman> either that or if you've got some time to work on it, i'll pull it into mainstream and onto kraken
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[15:45] <schofieldau> also I'm playing with Fritzing
[15:46] <jcoxon> jonsowman, done
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[15:46] <jonsowman> ta
[15:46] <jonsowman> :)
[15:46] <jcoxon> shame about ozzie :-(
[15:47] <jonsowman> hopefully it'll be found
[15:48] <jcoxon> yeah
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[15:53] <Colin-G8TMV> Who is responsible (or coordinator) for the spacenear.us tracker?
[15:53] <Laurenceb_> isnt it transmititng?
[15:53] <jonsowman> idk Laurenceb_, i assume not
[15:53] <r2x0t> it's txing, but navrac said no GPS lock
[15:54] <Colin-G8TMV> I believe it doesn't have gps lock on the ground
[15:54] <jonsowman> ah
[15:54] <jonsowman> i see :)
[15:54] <r2x0t> also no GPS coverage there
[15:54] <jonsowman> Colin-G8TMV: Upu does a lot of it these days, why?
[15:54] <r2x0t> err GSM
[15:54] <jonsowman> unfortunate really
[15:54] <r2x0t> so he can't look it up on google maps or chat or anything..
[15:55] <r2x0t> small GSM yagi may be another good thing to have...
[15:55] <Colin-G8TMV> jonsowman: because on an iPad it's almost impossible to use - it seems the touch interface is adversly affected by the code - it's almost impossible to move the map by touch/slide
[15:55] <jonsowman> oh yeah it's totally useless for mobile devices at the moment
[15:55] <jonsowman> as is the predictor
[15:55] <Colin-G8TMV> and attempts to zoom the screen cause all sorts of bad jumpyness
[15:55] <jonsowman> it's a work in (slow) progress
[15:55] <Bob_G8NSV> same on android
[15:55] <jonsowman> we are bearing this in mind with the new habitat stuff
[15:56] <Colin-G8TMV> it's a real pain. The PC I use for tracking is too old/slow to run dl-fldigi and the tracker reliably at the same time - so I've been trying to use the iPad for the map
[15:57] <jonsowman> well it's all open source, if you'd like to rewrite it ;)
[15:57] <Colin-G8TMV> considering how useful tablets are for things like chase car use can we increase the priority of fixing it please
[15:58] <jonsowman> Colin-G8TMV: the people working on it are doing so in their free time and for nothing, and have no obligation to do so
[15:58] <Colin-G8TMV> jonsowman: I do that for my day job and I'm not allowed to do much stuff on ARM powered devices because I work for them
[15:58] <Upu> I'd blame Upu for Spacenear.us not working on iThings(TM) ;)
[15:59] <Colin-G8TMV> jonsowman: I *know* and I'm a Debian developer - but as I just said - I'm not allowed to work on stuff like that - unless you want the code to be owned by my employer and become closed
[16:00] <jonsowman> Colin-G8TMV: of course not, but you have to realise that this is a voluntary thing and people will not appreciate being nagged to do things, especially by someone who is not contributing
[16:00] <Colin-G8TMV> I know - I say exactly that to people who ask why Debian doesn't have blah packaged
[16:01] <jonsowman> several people have put a huge amount of effort into both the new and old tracking/listener systems, and continue to do so
[16:01] <Colin-G8TMV> I'm just pointing out a major failing of the tracker which would help chase teams
[16:01] <Colin-G8TMV> if it was fixed
[16:01] <jonsowman> Colin-G8TMV: absolutely, we know that it's an issue
[16:01] <jonsowman> and the new generation tracker/predictor will be designed with that in mind
[16:01] <jonsowman> but the timescale is not something on which anyone will make any promises
[16:02] <Colin-G8TMV> good, as long as people are aware and it's on the list
[16:02] <jonsowman> it's certainly on the list
[16:02] <Colin-G8TMV> RSN is the usual promise
[16:05] <Randomskk> no promises
[16:05] <Randomskk> other priorities
[16:05] <Randomskk> if you have a specific bug, please do file a report
[16:05] <Randomskk> we can fix specific bugs much quicker
[16:06] <Randomskk> but the tracker itself is going to be redone extensively, however some other work needs to be completed first
[16:06] <Bob_G8NSV> poor old navrac has been ages now really hope he can find ozzie2
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[16:06] <RocketBoy> who sets the priory of features anyway - surly its down to whoever wants to work on them
[16:06] <griffonbot> @LVL1WhiteStar: Great mission control training last night! Hope to get someone to curate the audio/video streaming so you all can be here too! #UKHAS [http://twitter.com/LVL1WhiteStar/status/189021520104931328]
[16:07] <jonsowman> RocketBoy: exactly
[16:07] <RocketBoy> tablets wouldn't be my priority - i don't have one
[16:08] <jonsowman> me neither
[16:08] <Bob_G8NSV> nor me, but would be nice on android phones. Till then I'll just make do like everyone else
[16:08] <jonsowman> Bob_G8NSV: agreed
[16:09] <jcoxon> you can load the kml onto google maps
[16:09] <jcoxon> that works okay
[16:10] <Randomskk> there might be a proper android app one day soon
[16:10] <Bob_G8NSV> not tried that. a nice little android app called ham gps lets you enter last known lat long and givers a range and bearing and direction to target arrow. cant wait to try that
[16:10] <Randomskk> but yea priority on habitat is basically blocking order, while other stuff is whatever people do
[16:11] <Randomskk> we don't do the proper web interface until a few other things are sorted out
[16:11] <Randomskk> actually though Colin-G8TMV
[16:11] <Randomskk> you might want to try this on your tablet
[16:11] <daveake> Must get round to finishing something I started, which is a gateway to Google Latitude, so the balloon shows up as a "Friend"
[16:11] <Randomskk> http://habitat.habhub.org/testing-web/demo.html
[16:11] <Randomskk> click GMaps, wait for it to load, click a flight
[16:11] <Randomskk> no promises but in theory it might work on tablets
[16:11] <daveake> Android phones can give you a route to your friend
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[16:37] <Colin-G8TMV> Randomskk: It seems to do the same on my iPad as it does on my Desktop
[16:37] <Colin-G8TMV> and the zooming does work on the iPad
[16:39] <Randomskk> in which case that may work for tracking -- it will show you the current path/position and the latest packet data including a list of receivers
[16:39] <Randomskk> it's obviously just a technology demonstration but it may be better than nothing working
[16:39] <priyesh> confirmation, the testing-web version works better on android tabs too
[16:39] <priyesh> :0
[16:39] <priyesh> * :)
[16:39] <Randomskk> cool
[16:40] <Randomskk> well that's promising
[16:40] <Colin-G8TMV> so I looked at the Ozzie1 data - the track is obvious, but what are the straight black lines?
[16:40] <Randomskk> probably just connecting up points where the payload moved under other locomotion e.g. car
[16:41] <Randomskk> lemme check, one sec...
[16:41] <priyesh> yeah- that's an issue with people using a single flight doc for testing & multiple flights
[16:41] <Randomskk> wow
[16:41] <Randomskk> there sure are a lot of them
[16:41] <Colin-G8TMV> Randomskk: they look like a cone originating at the launch point
[16:41] <Randomskk> yea, those are spurious position points that were reported and the page tries to join them
[16:42] <Randomskk> Colin-G8TMV: I suspect that was the payload issuing a whole load of random points
[16:42] <Randomskk> e.g. while gaining lock
[16:42] <Randomskk> and then coming to its proper location
[16:42] <Randomskk> the lines connect up all the received points in order
[16:42] <Colin-G8TMV> Ah, ok
[16:42] <priyesh> we need a slider with a timescale on it so specific points are shown :P
[16:43] <Colin-G8TMV> and the range circles too
[16:45] <Randomskk> indeed
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[17:24] <Bob_G8NSV> any news from navrac?
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[17:29] <navrac_> yep navrac just got home after driving in circles for hours
[17:29] <Laurenceb_> i think he got abducted by aliens
[17:30] Nick change: navrac_ -> navrac
[17:31] <fsphil-laptop> satnavrac
[17:33] <navrac> not a squeak heard on any road in the 5 mile area around the 100m position
[17:33] <navrac> although I did df someones oil tank
[17:33] <navrac> it gives out pipa at 2 second interval just like ozzie did with no gps time
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[17:36] <Bob_G8NSV> do you think it drifted further?
[17:37] <navrac> no - i think the aerial probably got damaged as it got pulled along the ground - there were strong winds.
[17:37] <Bob_G8NSV> oh dear you would have to be nearly on top of it with no aerial
[17:38] <Bob_G8NSV> before you heard it
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[17:39] <navrac> well i had a 12 ele yagi and the funcube - as long as there was line of sight i would think i would have found a trace - trouble is the terrain was so bumpy it was difficult to find suitable places
[17:39] <Colin-G8TMV> navrac: does it have your contact info on it?
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[17:40] <navrac> nope - had wwww.ukhas.org.uk on it though sadly the marker didnt work so it has half my phone number as well
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[17:41] <navrac> well it should have 3 days battery life if its face up and if someone picks it up i might just hear it
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[17:53] <Morseman> Sorry to hear of the loss of OZZIE2 navrac
[17:55] <navrac> well not a great financial loss - but a lot of time getting it all together. I'll have a beer and start again I guess - thanks for the thought, it funnily enough is a bit sad
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[17:56] <navrac> Im going back in the house - fed up of looking at an empty waterfall!
[17:56] <AlexaD> Hello
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[17:59] <jcoxon> hey navrac
[17:59] <jonsowman> hi
[18:02] <jdtanner> sorry to hear about the loss navrac&it might still turn up
[18:03] <Dan-K2VOL> hey guys
[18:03] <cuddykid> it may be that someone has already picked it up?
[18:04] <navrac> thanks for the thoughts. still watching the waterfall in vague hope
[18:04] <cuddykid> guess it's not stuck in a tree, as you'd have probably heard it even with a broken antenna
[18:04] <Dan-K2VOL> a beer sounds in order navrac
[18:05] <navrac> Ive had two of those - now onto the wine with the rs catalog in the other hand
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[18:06] <fsphil-laptop> lol
[18:06] <Lunar_Lander> back
[18:06] <navrac> lost it at 100m - since ground level is 80m I think it must have died
[18:07] <navrac> apart from the exposed aerial it should have survived any impact - although it came down very fast
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[18:08] <fsphil-laptop> something in the payload may have gotten shaken about and disconnected
[18:09] <Lunar_Lander> was it a foil balloon?
[18:09] <navrac> All the critical lines were hard wired and held in place with adhesive - you could have played football with it
[18:09] <navrac> yep
[18:09] <navrac> its the solar cells that i'm annoyed about - i bought the remaining stock
[18:10] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[18:10] <jcoxon> navrac, i've got spare
[18:11] <navrac> i might take you up on that jcoxon if they dont get any new stock soon
[18:11] <navrac> ive got spares of everything else
[18:12] <griffonbot> Received email: Brian "[UKHAS] Re: Globalstar? (And ADS-B)"
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[19:22] <Bob_G8NSV> night all
[19:22] <navrac> night bob
[19:22] <Bob_G8NSV> hope you manage to locate ozzie shame about today
[19:23] <navrac> well it happens, if it was easy everybody would be doing it
[19:28] <fsphil-laptop> foil balloons especially difficult to get right
[19:29] Action: daveake concurs :)
[19:29] <navrac> from the graph it looks like it popped at 600m - would have to be really overfilled
[19:32] <daveake> Doesn't sound li
[19:32] <daveake> likely
[19:32] <daveake> any chance the payload popped it? aerial stabbed balloon for example/
[19:33] <navrac> the balloon was wuite floppy and the payload might possibly have been further away than the 2m no notam rule permits - and the antenna would bend first and had a plastic tip
[19:34] <navrac> but not impossible
[19:35] <daveake> Yeah, just seems very strange that it came down so soon, with no real pressure on the envelope
[19:36] <daveake> Those balloons seem quite tough too
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[20:11] <Elmar_PD3EM> what arduino boards are you using for flightcomp?
[20:12] <jdtanner> I got this the other day after asking the same question http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220924291039&ssPageName=ADME:L:OC:GB:3160
[20:13] <Elmar_PD3EM> tnx! I have a Uno (now used for testing) and a 5V pro mini
[20:14] <jdtanner> I have no idea how it will perform, but another chap on here is using it with great success.
[20:15] <Elmar_PD3EM> looks all good indeed but yesterday the advice was to use UART for the GPS and there's just 1 UART (pin0,1) on those boards
[20:16] <Elmar_PD3EM> then how can it be hooked up on the computer and use GPS at the same tmie (when testing)?
[20:16] <jdtanner> Ah, yes I see&there was a discussion about this
[20:17] <Elmar_PD3EM> i can read NMEA data from the GPS via SoftwareSerial
[20:17] <jdtanner> (dunno..I'm still waiting for my first arduino :D )
[20:18] <Elmar_PD3EM> but looks impossible to use the pins 0 and 1 for GPS and PC (via usb) at the same time
[20:18] <Elmar_PD3EM> It's fun jdtanner ! I hope you'll receive it soon
[20:18] <jdtanner> There was somediscussion about putting a 10k resistor in series with the TxRx pins of the GPS&but somebody else will know more that me :)
[20:19] <Elmar_PD3EM> I'm just learning all recently, and still learning ;-)
[20:19] <jdtanner> Hopefully :)
[20:20] <jdtanner> Seems like a few of us are on here! :)
[20:20] <Elmar_PD3EM> haha... the rest is eating or sleeping ;-)
[20:21] <Elmar_PD3EM> my test setup at the moment: http://yfrog.com/nx1mysdj
[20:23] <jdtanner> Looks neat&what have you got connected up there?
[20:23] <jdtanner> I recognise the GPS and the RF module&and the Arduino in the background
[20:23] <Laurenceb_> is that a torture device in the background?
[20:24] <Elmar_PD3EM> testing the GPS and a MS5607 barometric Pressure module
[20:24] <jdtanner> Nice&the thing in the bg looks painful :p
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[20:24] <Elmar_PD3EM> torture device? I think you mean the CW paddle
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[20:25] <Elmar_PD3EM> for making dots and dashes in morse ;-)
[20:25] <jdtanner> :)
[20:26] <Elmar_PD3EM> but I must admit that I still need to pickup the learning again
[20:26] <mfa298> CW is torture for some people isn't it?
[20:26] <Elmar_PD3EM> yep but also a great (DX) mode
[20:27] <fsphil-laptop> cw is a digital mode for the brain
[20:27] <mfa298> I need to get back into learning it as well. Seems like it could be a lot of fun, but hard to do much until you understand most of it.
[20:27] <Elmar_PD3EM> haha
[20:28] <Elmar_PD3EM> yep.. learn it and keep doing it
[20:28] <fsphil-laptop> any good methods to learning it? or just practice
[20:28] <mfa298> I think it's mostly practice
[20:28] <mfa298> and learn what it sounds like rather than learning . and -
[20:28] <Elmar_PD3EM> most learn via the koch method
[20:29] <Elmar_PD3EM> don't try to copy the dots and dashed... just hear it as normal words
[20:29] <Elmar_PD3EM> excactly mfa298
[20:30] <mfa298> I found this to be quite good at learning what it sounds like
[20:30] <mfa298> http://www.justlearnmorsecode.com/
[20:30] <fsphil-laptop> funny the few letters I know I remember from the sound -- the message beeps on my old phone
[20:30] <Elmar_PD3EM> yep. know that site and used it a few times
[20:30] <fsphil-laptop> it keys out "SMS"
[20:30] <Elmar_PD3EM> ... -- ...
[20:30] <fsphil-laptop> that's it
[20:31] <mfa298> and it's possible to set the FT817 up to not tx with the key which helps practice sending morse
[20:31] <fsphil-laptop> I didn't even know it was morse code at first
[20:33] <fsphil-laptop> downloaded that program, will try it later
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[20:43] <jdtanner> Elmar_PD3EM: I checked back through yesterdays' logs and UPU did suggest putting a 10k resistor in series with the TxRx pins of the GPS to leave the USB and GPS both connected.
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[20:44] <Elmar_PD3EM> jdtanner: thanks! I must have missed that one :-(
[20:44] <Laurenceb_> arggg stupid wifi
[20:44] <jdtanner> I wasn;t sure I understood the explanation& :)
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[20:44] <Elmar_PD3EM> gonna read back on that
[20:44] <jonsowman> jdtanner: Elmar_PD3EM: http://www.billporter.info/how-to-add-multiple-uart-connections/
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[20:45] <Elmar_PD3EM> your own wifi Laurenceb?
[20:45] <jdtanner> jonsowman: thanks :)
[20:45] <Elmar_PD3EM> jonsowman: thanks!
[20:45] <jonsowman> no prob :)
[20:49] <jdtanner> That is a very useful and well written article&and explains it perfectly&which considering I'm a numpty is saying something!
[20:50] <jonsowman> yes i thought so too :)
[20:51] <jdtanner> I'm learning so much on here...
[20:51] <jonsowman> excellent
[20:51] <jonsowman> what's your background?
[20:53] <jonsowman> do you work in electronics/engineering or more of a hobby?
[20:53] <jdtanner> Erm&rather embarassing to admit but I've got quite a hefty background in physics/astrophysics&but just interested in this as a hobby really.
[20:53] <jdtanner> I've realised that I learned nothing about electonics after a few physics degrees :/
[20:54] <jonsowman> oh cool
[20:54] <jonsowman> well arduinos are a great place to start
[20:54] <jonsowman> as i'm sure you've discovered
[20:54] <jdtanner> I can tell you how a resisitor works&but not why they are used :D I'm expecting my first arduino in a few days&really excited!!!
[20:54] <fsphil-laptop> I enjoy writing for microcontrollers more than PCs :)
[20:54] <jonsowman> fsphil-laptop: oh me too
[20:55] <jdtanner> Incidentally, I'm hoping to use my new found knowledge to work on enhancing another project I had a few years ago&bat detectors :)
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[20:55] <jonsowman> i think embedded programming forces you into good software practices
[20:56] <jonsowman> jdtanner: oh that sounds cool
[20:56] <jonsowman> sound based detection i assume?
[20:56] <fsphil-laptop> jdtanner, I'd be interested in that too
[20:56] <fsphil-laptop> I tried to make my FT817 into a bat detector. It didn't work :)
[20:56] <jonsowman> i remember seeing a picture of you holding a small bat fsphil-laptop
[20:56] <jdtanner> Exactly&little untrasonic transcievers.
[20:56] <jonsowman> it was very cute
[20:56] <fsphil-laptop> it was!
[20:56] <fsphil-laptop> we did that again last year
[20:57] <fsphil-laptop> when releasing the bat it decided to fly backwards into the building we where outside
[20:58] <jonsowman> haha
[20:58] <jonsowman> typical
[20:58] <jdtanner> This is a nice little part to play with http://uk.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=255-400SR16-ROX
[20:59] <fsphil-laptop> ah ha
[20:59] <fsphil-laptop> I was wondering where to get those
[20:59] <fsphil-laptop> all the ones I seen seemed to be digital devices
[21:00] <jdtanner> This is a great little project http://home.earthlink.net/~bat-detector/SBD2Parts.html
[21:00] <jonsowman> http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/search/browse.jsp?N=2031+203854&Ntk=gensearch&Ntt=ultrasonic&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial
[21:00] <jonsowman> any of these any good?
[21:00] <jonsowman> idk what i'm looking for really
[21:00] <jonsowman> just farnell or something will be cheaper than mouser due to shipping...
[21:01] <fsphil-laptop> I'd like to setup an ultrasound detector page, a bit like the websdr radio pages
[21:06] <jdtanner> http://uk.farnell.com/murata/ma40s4r/sensor-ultrasonic-0-2-4m-rx/dp/1777668 maybe?
[21:07] <jonsowman> been a long time since i did ultrasound... i made a distance measuring thing for my AS level electronics project :D
[21:08] <jdtanner> Interestingly, they used something similar on the Huygens mission to Titan to measure the speed of sound (and atmospheric composition).
[21:09] <jdtanner> Might be a nice little project for HABing
[21:09] <jonsowman> yeah :)
[21:09] <jdtanner> http://www.mrc.uidaho.edu/entryws/presentations/Papers/svedhem.pdf
[21:10] <jdtanner> You might need a stiff drink :)
[21:11] <Elmar_PD3EM> aahh need to rewrite the gps code first after putting 2 resistors in between gps and arduino.....
[21:12] <Elmar_PD3EM> and getting fedd up with the Arduino IDe not seeing my com port...
[21:15] <Upu> Evening jonsowman thanks for posting that link thats what I was looking for but couldn't locate it last night
[21:15] <jdtanner> Yep, it was very useful
[21:15] <jonsowman> no worries Upu :)
[21:15] <Upu> so 1K not 10k sorry guys :)
[21:15] <jonsowman> tbh 10k would probably be fine
[21:16] <jonsowman> i assume Ozzie hasn't been found?
[21:16] <Elmar_PD3EM> ok.. have no 1k now so gonna give it a try
[21:16] <Elmar_PD3EM> but need to re-code first ;-)
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[21:18] <fsphil-laptop> jonsowman, wasn't nope :/
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[21:19] <jonsowman> ah shame
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[21:24] <jdtanner> I don't suppose anyone has a scanner they'd be willing to loan in a few weeks time (I'm in the Peak District)? I have a feeling that this is going to be the major blocking issue in our project :/
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[21:25] <jonsowman> jdtanner: perhaps grab one off ebay?
[21:25] <jonsowman> the postage is going to be a fair amount either way as they're pretty delicate
[21:25] <jonsowman> shame you're not two weeks earlier, just got rid of a canon n1240
[21:26] <jdtanner> That is the problem&the cost :( We've already spent our meagre budget twice over. I'm hoping that I might be able to find a friendly radio operator nearby. Bugger!
[21:26] <fsphil-laptop> wrong kind of scanner :)
[21:26] <jonsowman> oh..
[21:26] <jdtanner> haha&.I see
[21:26] <jdtanner> Yeah, I meant a radio scanner
[21:26] <jonsowman> those are also delicate
[21:27] <jonsowman> and heavy
[21:27] <Randomskk> good save
[21:27] <jonsowman> hmm?
[21:27] <jdtanner> seamless
[21:27] <jdtanner> :)
[21:27] <jonsowman> jdtanner: when do you want it?
[21:27] <fsphil-laptop> I can't even remember who mentioned the Canon now
[21:28] <jonsowman> me neither actually
[21:28] <jonsowman> convenient
[21:28] <jdtanner> haha! Well, I hope to be up and running and ready to test within a fortnight if all goes well (optimism is a good thing isn't it)
[21:28] <jonsowman> local radio clubs is always a good bet
[21:28] <fsphil-laptop> you're going to need a receiver on launch day too
[21:29] <jdtanner> Yeah, I know :/
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[21:29] <jonsowman> jdtanner: come and launch from cambridge if you like
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[21:29] <jdtanner> not sure where all this cash is coming from tbh
[21:30] <fsphil-laptop> there are cheap 70-cm-ssb-capable scanners on ebay now and the
[21:30] <jdtanner> I would, but we are hoping to make this a Peak District "thing" as we all work for the authority that looks after the national park
[21:30] <fsphil-laptop> +n
[21:30] <jonsowman> jdtanner: ah ok, i'd get applying for a NOTAM now then :P
[21:30] <jdtanner> Done...
[21:30] <jonsowman> ah good
[21:30] <jonsowman> fsphil-laptop: http://www.radioworld.co.uk/catalog/second_hand_yaesu_ft-790-p-1741.html?osCsid=923dea8a92aa7d57f33fda617b479548
[21:31] <jonsowman> and jdtanner ^
[21:31] <fsphil-laptop> hey that's not bad
[21:31] <jonsowman> yeah quite cheap
[21:31] <fsphil-laptop> wonder what's on the CD
[21:31] <jonsowman> has been there a few days, surprised it hasn't gone yet at that price
[21:31] <jdtanner> I'm not liking "cheap" and >£100
[21:31] <jdtanner> ;)
[21:32] <jonsowman> heh
[21:32] <fsphil-laptop> they got expensive recently
[21:32] <jonsowman> that's cheap for a sensitive SSB receiver
[21:32] <fsphil-laptop> If you're lucky you could get one <100 on ebay
[21:32] <Elmar_PD3EM> is it possible to read out GPS and print (debug) data to the serial console on PC at the same time?
[21:32] <Elmar_PD3EM> .. when both on UART?
[21:32] <jdtanner> My definition of cheap would be a few decimal points shifted in the oppoite direction :D
[21:32] <jonsowman> Elmar_PD3EM: not really...
[21:33] <Elmar_PD3EM> thats what i was thinking.. (and seeing.. ;-)
[21:33] <fsphil-laptop> jdtanner, it's cheap compared to an FT817 :)
[21:33] <jonsowman> jdtanner: keep an eye on ebay items 230771741653 and 170821270057
[21:33] <r2x0t> but you can use soft serial for output
[21:33] <r2x0t> that should be easy, no RX issues
[21:33] <r2x0t> only need one pin
[21:34] <Elmar_PD3EM> or parse all data to the 70cm TX ;-)
[21:34] <fsphil-laptop> I do that Elmar_PD3EM
[21:34] <jonsowman> me too ;)
[21:35] <Elmar_PD3EM> tnx! gonna dig into the combining of those sketches
[21:35] <Randomskk> I forgot how nice it is to program things that not only have several serial ports, they also have a dedicated debug interface :P
[21:35] <Randomskk> none of this malarky
[21:35] <fsphil-laptop> there's still some error messages in there, that would be printed during the flight if something happened
[21:35] <Randomskk> I can just put the gps on one serial port, the computer on another, other things on the third/fourth/fifth/sixth and still debug over jtag :P
[21:36] <jonsowman> fsphil-laptop: haha yes joey does the same at the moment
[21:36] <Elmar_PD3EM> what board do you use Randomskk ?
[21:36] <fsphil-laptop> I was going to remove them, but thought it would actually be useful if something odd happened
[21:36] <Randomskk> Elmar_PD3EM: right now I'm mostly working on wombat which is http://cusf.co.uk/wombat
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[21:37] <jonsowman> yes that was my thinking too. i didn't... forget, or anything like that. >.>
[21:37] <fsphil-laptop> lucky that
[21:37] <jonsowman> :D
[21:37] <Elmar_PD3EM> looks great Randomskk
[21:37] <jdtanner> jonsowman: thanks for those links
[21:38] <jonsowman> no worries jdtanner
[21:38] <jonsowman> worth keeping an eye on
[21:38] <jonsowman> :)
[21:38] <fsphil-laptop> jdtanner, say if a payload happened to, I dunno, land somewhere in the peak district. what are the odds of finding it? :)
[21:38] <fsphil-laptop> (I landed in another national park a bit to the north of you, no trace since)
[21:41] <Upu> jdtanner when you come to launch if you do it from "up north" I'll come assist
[21:41] <Upu> if you want me that is
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[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> oh hi Upu
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[21:41] <Upu> oh hai Lunar_Lander
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> how are you?
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[21:42] <Upu> and as for a radio I can't lend you one but if you want to drive to west yorkshire you're free to come here to test
[21:42] <Upu> very well thanks bit damp, its raining
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[21:48] <Elmar_PD3EM> Upu, how do you get the vertical velocity from the uBLOX?
[21:48] <Upu> I don't I calculate it in the code
[21:49] <Upu> I know the previous time and altitutde
[21:49] <Elmar_PD3EM> ok.. thats why i don't see it in the nmea ;-)
[21:49] <Upu> "maths"
[21:49] <fsphil-laptop> eek
[21:49] <Upu> easy maths :)
[21:49] <fsphil-laptop> phew
[21:50] <Upu> munching the time up so its all in seconds
[21:50] <Upu> tbh I've not tested it at midnight so it will probably go horribly wrong
[21:50] <Randomskk> hehe
[21:50] <Elmar_PD3EM> haha... but that is just for 1 sentence ;-)
[21:50] <Randomskk> suddenly, very fast descent :P
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[21:51] <Upu> http://pastebin.com/ELknWK8M
[21:52] <Elmar_PD3EM> thanks Upu!
[21:52] <Randomskk> cruise control for cool?
[21:52] <Upu> damn right
[21:52] <Upu> all my variables are in caps
[21:52] <Randomskk> and all your constants in lower case, I guess?
[21:53] <Upu> This is my coding you're talking about
[21:53] <fsphil-laptop> if PREVIOUSTIME>TIMETICKS you could just add 24 hours to timeticks
[21:53] <Randomskk> "what constants?" :P
[21:53] <Upu> whats a constant ? :)
[21:53] <fsphil-laptop> I just think his caps lock is stuck Randomskk
[21:53] <Randomskk> I make all my code recalculate pi before starting up, just in case
[21:53] <Elmar_PD3EM> a variable that won't chance? ;-)
[21:53] <Upu> Trying to work out what that first bit of code does
[21:53] <jdtanner> Upu: definately!
[21:54] <Upu> I always do my variables in caps :)
[21:54] <Elmar_PD3EM> nothing wrong with that
[21:54] <fsphil-laptop> it's confusing to us who don't :)
[21:54] <Upu> I've never had any formal training in programming
[21:55] <jdtanner> Upu: I might very well take you up on the offer of driving up to you for a test as well :)
[21:55] <Upu> not a problem jdtanner
[21:55] <Elmar_PD3EM> and luckely there a difference between caps and lowercase (as long as you forget about window$
[21:55] <Upu> I guess this isn't "done" in programming circles ?
[21:55] <jdtanner> fsphil-laptop: as for the odds of finding a payload in a national park&I'd say they are pretty low if you haven't got some idea where it is
[21:55] <fsphil-laptop> constants are traditionally done in all caps
[21:56] <Lunar_Lander> happy easter btw
[21:56] <fsphil-laptop> so that when reading the code you can tell straight away
[21:56] <fsphil-laptop> jdtanner, are you launching in the park?
[21:56] <jdtanner> fsphil-laptop: 555sq miles in the Peaks and 38,000 residents
[21:56] <Lunar_Lander> good to know fsphil-laptop, I didn't pay attention to that so far
[21:56] <Elmar_PD3EM> tnx LL anyone wants some easter eggs? ;-)
[21:56] <Lunar_Lander> :) why not?
[21:56] Action: fsphil-laptop had a lovely egg earlier
[21:56] <jdtanner> Yep, from one of my fields actually&just outside Bakewell
[21:56] <fsphil-laptop> excellent
[21:57] <Upu> "my fields"
[21:57] <jdtanner> I know...
[21:57] <jdtanner> grander than it sounds...
[21:57] <Upu> might have to borrow those :)
[21:57] <fsphil-laptop> I read that in Jonny Kingdom's voice
[21:57] <jdtanner> 30 acres of cow $hit
[21:57] <Elmar_PD3EM> I pichk up a few fresh ones every morning Lunar_Lander
[21:57] <fsphil-laptop> +h
[21:57] <Upu> yeah btw if you use my code without checking it you're an idiot I am an appalling programmer be warned
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> eggs and dioxine1
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> *!
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[21:58] <Elmar_PD3EM> haha
[21:58] <jdtanner> In fact, I'd quite like to get one of the fields designated as a launch site a'la the southern ones&I'd be more than happy for people to use it
[21:58] <fsphil-laptop> there are hens not far from here. they're quite noisy even now
[21:59] <fsphil-laptop> they also have a sheep in that garden. You'd think I live near a farm sometimes
[21:59] <Upu> Rob Harrison and I would love you forever
[21:59] <fsphil-laptop> lol
[21:59] <fsphil-laptop> they would too
[21:59] <jdtanner> You are welcome to use the site whenever anyway
[21:59] <Upu> might take you up on that
[21:59] <Lunar_Lander> ohh don't attach the sheep to the balloon
[21:59] <Upu> try get a NOTAM first :)
[22:00] <jdtanner> We've got one
[22:00] <Elmar_PD3EM> haha
[22:00] <Upu> issued already ?
[22:00] <Upu> or have you just applied ?
[22:00] <jdtanner> They were quite cooperative&no issued
[22:00] <Upu> whens it for ?
[22:00] <jdtanner> Every weekend in April
[22:01] <Upu> seriously :)
[22:01] <jdtanner> Yep...
[22:01] <Upu> no I mean seriously David Miller
[22:01] <jdtanner> (frantically checking)
[22:01] <Upu> you have a PDF
[22:01] <Upu> from David Miller CAA
[22:01] <Upu> with every weekend in April on it for your location ?
[22:01] <jdtanner> Erm, my colleague from work has it stuck up on the wall at work&a bit of an achievement
[22:02] <fsphil-laptop> did money exchange hands? :)
[22:02] <jdtanner> I can ask him&but it is the bloke who is quite difficult to contact at the CAA
[22:02] <Upu> Sure Rob will love that one we've only been trying to get one for 12 months
[22:02] <Randomskk> or "favours" :P
[22:02] <Upu> going to have a payload ready ?
[22:02] <jdtanner> We have the payload&just not the ability to track it with anything other than GSM at the moment
[22:03] <Upu> you can have me 21st ,28th/29th possibly 15th if you are very very early launch
[22:03] <jdtanner> everything is ready to go&I just got cold feet with regards to tracking using GSM only
[22:03] <Upu> I'd get cold feet with that too
[22:04] <Upu> pm me the launch coordinates pls
[22:04] <jdtanner> Indeed&I came to the project a little late, and the NOATM had already been applied for...
[22:05] <jdtanner> well, not quite&we'd agreed on GSM&but I've got a little concerned that it might not be the best way forwards&I don;t want to lose the payload
[22:06] <Upu> what launch coordinates (PM me if you wish)
[22:06] <jdtanner> Done, but it is basically outside Bakewell for those of you that know the area
[22:06] <Upu> how much does your payload weigh ?
[22:07] <jdtanner> I'm not the expert on this bit&I can tell you what is in it.
[22:07] <Upu> and what balloon do you have ?
[22:08] <jdtanner> 1xPanasonic HD (flip stye camera), a Canon A570 (??), GSM/GPS Tracker, a Garmin eTrex, all in a poly box. The balloon and parachute are bought and delivered&but I'm afraid that I don;t know the specifics&sorry :(
[22:09] <Upu> ~1kg possbly
[22:09] <jdtanner> I think the balloon is 1200g
[22:09] <jdtanner> from memory
[22:10] <jdtanner> 4ft rocketman parachute
[22:10] <jdtanner> (PowerShot A530&not A570)
[22:11] <Lunar_Lander> do you know your approx payload weight?
[22:16] <jdtanner> Not off the top of my head I'm afraid&I'll find out though
[22:16] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[22:17] <jdtanner> But it is going to be roughly a kilo
[22:17] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[22:19] <Lunar_Lander> approx. 3.7 m/s vertical descent speed near the ground
[22:20] <fsphil-laptop> not too bad
[22:20] <fsphil-laptop> still wouldn't want it landing on my head though
[22:21] <Lunar_Lander> I thought 5 m/s is a absolute max.
[22:21] <Lunar_Lander> 4 is OK I think
[22:21] <Lunar_Lander> what do you say?
[22:21] <Lunar_Lander> I mean for a payload of about .5 kg
[22:22] <fsphil-laptop> I aim for 5m/s, but my payloads are well padded and quite small
[22:22] <fsphil-laptop> a slower descent increases the odds of it landing somewhere wet
[22:23] <jdtanner> Indeed!
[22:23] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:23] <Lunar_Lander> I got a styrodur box from the pharmacy
[22:24] <BrainDamage> styrodur sounds like a penis enlargment pill packaging, the dur root from lating means hard
[22:25] <Lunar_Lander> XD yeah I know
[22:25] <Lunar_Lander> it is actually a BASF brand name as far as I know
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[22:25] <Lunar_Lander> it is for those insulation plates for buildings
[22:26] <Elmar_PD3EM> although it's almost good programming time..... I'm going to put a bed on my back ;-)
[22:27] <Elmar_PD3EM> gn and cul
[22:27] <fsphil-laptop> night El!
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[22:31] <Laurenceb_> https://www.silabs.com/products/audiovideo/HybridTVTuners/Pages/default.aspx
[22:37] <jdtanner> right, night all
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[22:38] <fsphil-laptop> nite jdtanner
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[22:52] <Lunar_Lander> is Upu here still?
[22:52] <Upu> I am
[22:52] <Lunar_Lander> what is the pastebin from up there for?
[22:52] <Lunar_Lander> is it the same code as yesterday?
[22:53] <Upu> It was just my code for working out the rate of de/accent
[22:53] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[22:54] <Lunar_Lander> strange, when I try to start arduino 1.0 here on linux it works sometimes, sometimes it doesn't
[22:54] <fsphil-laptop> that's java for you
[22:54] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:54] <Lunar_Lander> I copied the folder from my one folder onto the desktop
[22:54] <Lunar_Lander> now it runs I think
[22:56] <Lunar_Lander> yay
[22:56] <Lunar_Lander> incoporated the mega pro 3.3V
[22:57] <Lunar_Lander> or integrated it
[23:00] <Lunar_Lander> oh no
[23:00] <Lunar_Lander> "Balloon_Science_Radio_Code_H.cpp:99:21: error: expected initializer before < token"
[23:00] <Lunar_Lander> can't localize that
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[23:01] <fsphil-laptop> line 99 :P
[23:01] <fsphil-laptop> 21st character in
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> line 99 is "*buf++ = '.';"
[23:02] <fsphil-laptop> that's what the :99:21 means
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> in Windows he jumps right to the next error
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[23:03] <fsphil-laptop> look for a < symbol near that line
[23:04] <Lunar_Lander> the surroundings look like this
[23:04] <Lunar_Lander> if((precision > 0) && (bufLen > 0))
[23:04] <Lunar_Lander> {
[23:04] <Lunar_Lander> *buf++ = '.';
[23:04] <Lunar_Lander> if(--bufLen > 0)
[23:04] <Lunar_Lander> buf += fmtUnsigned((unsigned long)((val - (unsigned long)val) * mult), buf, bufLen, precision);
[23:04] <Lunar_Lander> }
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[23:05] <Lunar_Lander> I'll check on the windows box
[23:06] <fsphil-laptop> syntaxlly (such a word?) that looks fine
[23:06] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[23:06] <fsphil-laptop> the windows and linux versions should be identical -- they're both the same program running in java
[23:06] <Lunar_Lander> yeah and the windows one looks the same
[23:06] <Lunar_Lander> and doesn't act up
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[23:08] <Lunar_Lander> the numbering is wrong
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[23:08] <Lunar_Lander> I have mistyped ADDRESS in line 223
[23:08] <Lunar_Lander> and it says Balloon_Science_Radio_Code_H.cpp:244:26: error: BMP085_ADRESS was not declared in this scope
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[23:12] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil-laptop, I succeeded
[23:13] <fsphil-laptop> victory is yours!
[23:13] <Lunar_Lander> thanks :)
[23:13] <Lunar_Lander> but the enumberation was totally wrong
[23:13] <Lunar_Lander> the 99:21: was in line 78
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[23:16] <fsphil-laptop> night all
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[23:20] <griffonbot> Received email: "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Globalstar? (And ADS-B)"
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[23:26] <griffonbot> Received email: "Re: [UKHAS] GPS questions - Lassen IQ? And UARTs in general?"
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[23:33] <griffonbot> Received email: "Re: [UKHAS] GPS questions - Lassen IQ? And UARTs in general?"
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[23:59] <NigeyS> ping Randomskk
[00:00] --- Mon Apr 9 2012