highaltitude.log.20120326

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[00:04] <Lunar_Lander_> good night
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[00:14] <SpeedEvil> Randomskk: That doesn't say anything about signed.
[00:14] <Randomskk> hmmm
[00:14] <Randomskk> true, actually.
[00:15] <Randomskk> then again
[00:15] <Randomskk> the whole thing is very very unclear
[00:15] <SpeedEvil> Indeed.
[00:15] <Randomskk> if your protocol is undocumented the distinction between encrypted and not is a bit vague
[00:15] <SpeedEvil> yep.
[00:15] <Randomskk> frankly the difference between a cleartext command plus signature
[00:15] <Randomskk> vs encrypted command
[00:15] <Randomskk> is essentially null
[00:16] <Randomskk> if your command structure isn't a standard
[00:16] <Randomskk> it's a bit of a weird restriction
[00:16] Action: SpeedEvil pulls the trigger on his most extravagent purchase for some time.
[00:16] <Randomskk> whatcha getting?
[00:16] <SpeedEvil> 30" second-hand monitor.
[00:17] <SpeedEvil> Whihc is somewhat annoying - as I need to upgrade stuff to drive it.
[00:17] <Randomskk> a vicious cycle :P
[00:17] <SpeedEvil> My existing 'main' box only has VGA
[00:20] <SpeedEvil> digital camera filters - doing it wrong. http://www.dealextreme.com/p/creative-protective-back-case-with-special-lens-filter-turret-for-iphone-4-4s-red-123473
[00:21] Action: SpeedEvil has realised that aerated autoclaved concrete is quite doable at home.
[00:22] <SpeedEvil> Of course - this raises the question of it being a good idea.
[00:22] <SpeedEvil> Alas, I don't think it can quite be gotten dense enough for balloons
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[01:08] <WB8ELK> hearing the Blue Horizon balloon directly: N 40.238 W 40.680 23000m at 0040 utc
[01:09] <WB8ELK> now listening on the Sekule, Slovakia GlobalTuners radio....my 5 watt signal gets through to it from here in Alabama
[01:14] <Darkside> nice
[01:20] <SpeedEvil> :()
[01:20] <SpeedEvil> :)
[01:24] <AL0I_Todd> Good luck on the balloon. 'Night.
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[01:26] <Darkside> PBH's balloon should be coming into range of the azores soon
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[01:36] <PsionicOz> howdy darkside
[01:37] <Darkside> hey
[01:37] <Darkside> WB8ELK: still about?
[01:53] <WB8ELK> yes....trying different internet radio at the moment...hearing the Blue Horizon directly but very weak
[01:53] <WB8ELK> not quite in range of the Azores....be interesting to see APRS when they do
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[01:54] <Darkside> they'll have to retune, like they did for the K6RPT balloon, right?
[01:54] <Darkside> or is the PBH transmitter frequency agile
[01:55] <Randomskk> they'll have to retune
[01:55] <Randomskk> I believe they've been informed already though
[01:56] <Darkside> mm
[01:56] <Darkside> PBH are using a zero pressure balloon aren't they...
[01:56] <Randomskk> think so
[01:56] <Darkside> bah
[01:56] <Darkside> thats cheating :P
[01:56] <Darkside> 'amateur' my ass
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[02:06] <WB8ELK> a relatively expensive Raven Aerostar 54,000 cubic footer
[02:07] <WB8ELK> think it's part of a student intern program
[02:08] <Darkside> they're sponsored by lockheed martin i think
[02:08] <WB8ELK> the road leading to the building they launched from said "IBM Drive"...so that might be a clue as to the sponsor
[02:08] <Darkside> and yeah, they have a waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay bigger budget than any other amateur group
[02:08] <WB8ELK> or Boeing?....not sure
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[02:08] <Darkside> there'd have to be a few thousand bucks of gas in those zero pressure balloons
[02:09] <WB8ELK> not really....about 1.5 tanks worth is all....about $300 bucks worth
[02:09] <WB8ELK> but the balloon is not cheap
[02:09] <Darkside> really?!
[02:09] <Darkside> mm
[02:09] <Darkside> we can't even get permission to launch ZPs here
[02:09] <WB8ELK> balloon weighs 13.6 pounds....flight train 12 pound
[02:09] <WB8ELK> Alice Springs does it all the time with very large research ZP's
[02:10] <Darkside> groups like the CSIRO can get permission
[02:10] <Darkside> we can't
[02:10] <WB8ELK> ah....gotcha
[02:11] <WB8ELK> I know a fellow named Kirby Ikin....he might have some pull in Australia
[02:11] <Darkside> the other problem is where you launch from
[02:11] <Darkside> we'd have to launch from woomersa
[02:11] <Darkside> woomera*
[02:11] <Darkside> and thats a bloody long away away
[02:12] <Darkside> long way away*
[02:12] <WB8ELK> I might be able to pull some strings through my contacts....I'll have to chase them down
[02:12] <WB8ELK> but yes....that's a long way for you
[02:12] <Darkside> we can certainly get permission to launch from woomera, we have contacts for that
[02:12] <WB8ELK> not that you wouldn't drive all the way across the country chasing balloons as they land in the sea ;-)
[02:12] <Darkside> hah, we didn't get horus 16 back...
[02:12] <Darkside> we gave up after about a thousand km >_>
[02:13] <WB8ELK> I was hoping it would wash up on shore someplace
[02:13] <Darkside> cliffs
[02:13] <Darkside> lots of cliffs
[02:14] <WB8ELK> be back in a bit...photographing the conjunction of the Moon, Venus and Jupiter...spectacular sight tonight
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[04:41] <schofieldau> hey Darkside
[04:41] <schofieldau> I'll be passing through the city tomorrow night
[04:41] <schofieldau> at about 6:30ish I think
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[05:59] <Upu> PBH still looking good
[06:00] <SpeedEvil> Indeed.
[06:00] <Upu> drops a fair bit in the night
[06:00] <SpeedEvil> I thought it had landed - I saw the 200m height
[06:00] <Upu> yeah I wonder if they are vetting the data correctly
[06:00] <Upu> its just a submission form
[06:00] <SpeedEvil> Oh
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[07:11] <F6AIU> PBH received in France S1 07:00 utc on 10146.5 but qrm, just decode call N2XE
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[07:23] <x-f> cool
[07:27] <SpeedEvil> :)
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[07:40] <fsphil> ah, my remote rig doesn't have HF
[07:40] <fsphil> was suppose to set that up
[07:40] <number10> just pop home - you have done enough work on saturday
[07:41] <fsphil> not sure they'd see it that way :)
[07:44] <daveake> :)
[07:44] <daveake> I'm knackered after the weekend ... I could do with the week off now :)
[07:45] <fsphil> how's treebuzz?
[07:45] <number10> you would have been building a new payload for next weekend had you not recovered it
[07:46] <daveake> Good point number10
[07:46] <daveake> But I do have to take that one apart to replace the batteries. It's hot-melt glued together, so I'll need to make another egg anyway
[07:46] <daveake> Not sure about treebuzz. I'll go take a look.
[07:48] <x-f> it's not transmitting anymore?
[07:48] <fsphil> think it only had batteries for 16 hours
[07:48] <daveake> No - batteries would have lasted about 16 hours or so. I checked Sunday morning (24 hours after power-on) and no transmission then
[07:49] <daveake> So I can't remotely check if he's made land by himself
[07:49] <SpeedEvil> daveake: if you heat it gently to 50c...
[07:49] <daveake> in the microwave? :p
[07:50] <fsphil> you need to add an uplink function daveake, so you can command it to go into "tree mode"
[07:50] <fsphil> where it only transmits once every hour
[07:51] <daveake> Could do :-)
[07:51] <daveake> I'll leave that for another time
[07:57] <griffonbot> Received email: Sophie Hart "[UKHAS] Launch Announcement - University of Southampton Project SHARP
[07:58] <fsphil> fastest relaunch?
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[07:59] <fsphil> hiya Graeme_SHARP
[07:59] <daveake> Morning Graeme_SHARP. I have some pix from yesterday I can send to you
[07:59] <Graeme_SHARP> Morning All, Thanks for everyone that tracked yesterday, GPS has been fixed, cutdown fixed, camera batteries enlarged, we're about to leave southampton for the launch site for round 2!
[08:00] <daveake> Good job I left my aerial up then :)
[08:00] <Graeme_SHARP> Morning Daveake, that would be brilliant, what ever method is convient for you! (Or see you at the landing site and exchange SD cards :) )
[08:01] <daveake> :-) What's the prediction today?
[08:01] <Upu> morning Graeme_SHARP I can clear the tracker down ready do you want to take any screen shots before I do ?
[08:01] <Upu> and what time are you launching ?
[08:01] <Upu> I'll take a +/- 6 hours :)
[08:02] <fsphil> lol
[08:06] <daveake> My SHARP pix (some not that sharp as it happens) uploading now
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[08:14] <Graeme_SHARP> Hehe, Upu, waiting for Maplins to open to a few minor components for our new improvised camera battery then we are hitting the road!
[08:15] <Graeme_SHARP> so 1pm BST provisionally
[08:15] <Upu> your launch is relying on Maplins ?
[08:15] Action: Upu millhouse HAHA
[08:15] <fsphil> they're handy for emergencies
[08:15] <Upu> do you want me to clear the tracker of yesterdays launch Graeme_SHARP ?
[08:15] <Upu> never have anything in these days
[08:15] <Upu> my local store is crap
[08:16] <Graeme_SHARP> We should have worked out most of the kinks yesterday so hopefully no 6 hours of ground faffing today!
[08:16] <daveake> s/millhouse/nelson
[08:16] <Upu> thanks daveake
[08:16] <Upu> GPS in flight mode ?
[08:16] <Graeme_SHARP> Just going to take some SS now upu, so give me 10 minutes
[08:16] <fsphil> well spotted daveake
[08:16] <UpuWork> no problems just say when
[08:16] <Graeme_SHARP> Yep, we've double checked the GPS
[08:17] <UpuWork> Same balloon / payload etc ?
[08:17] <UpuWork> it burst a little early by my reckoning ?
[08:17] <daveake> fsphil I think the fastest relaunch was me on Saturday :)
[08:18] <Darkside> grr
[08:18] <Darkside> want to do HF packetr on windows 7
[08:18] <Darkside> but AGWPE just crashes
[08:18] <daveake> UpuWork The balloon needs replacing
[08:19] <daveake> :p
[08:19] <UpuWork> funny daveake :)
[08:19] <UpuWork> Darkside never had an issue, sound card drive problem ?
[08:20] <Darkside> i dunno
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[08:22] <Graeme_SHARP> Okay Upu, feel free to clear it when you get a spare moment
[08:22] <UpuWork> cheers
[08:22] <Graeme_SHARP> Yep same payload and balloon combination
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[08:22] <Graeme_SHARP> hopefully a bit more accurate with filling today though!
[08:23] <Graeme_SHARP> We had a lot of latex left on it when we recovered it yesterday, pretty much the whole thing
[08:23] <UpuWork> tis done
[08:23] <UpuWork> you seemed to be on the mark for the ascent rate yesteday
[08:24] <Graeme_SHARP> We we're hoping for 4.5, got around 3.9 - to be honest we didn't have any decent scales with us to weigh anything (rectified for today)
[08:25] <Graeme_SHARP> Hence why we were a bit east of reading instead of west when it came to reestablishing lock
[08:25] <number10> anyone run a prediction?
[08:25] <Upu> pre weigh a milk container with water in it
[08:25] <Darkside> hah, someone is experimenting with what i'm pretty sure is WinDRM on HF
[08:26] <fsphil> could be easypal
[08:27] <UpuWork> running one now number10
[08:27] <UpuWork> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=ee41a453116be937c31cee2a1359fdf65e44a2bd
[08:27] <Darkside> fsphil: possibly
[08:27] <number10> next week end - rough location http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=be8ffdda831b0c9d8c6575f94136370f9816b2db
[08:28] <UpuWork> you launching next weekend ?
[08:28] <number10> no - you are I hope
[08:28] <UpuWork> ping priyesh
[08:28] <UpuWork> Ineed
[08:28] <daveake> Not from there :)
[08:28] <UpuWork> but not from there
[08:28] <daveake> or there
[08:28] <number10> I forgot where you are exactly its there abouts though?
[08:29] <daveake> 1 sec
[08:29] <daveake> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=b3903328f1bb11264e9436c8a7aac31a5a40e5a8
[08:29] <daveake> Overflying PicoBuzz's landing spot
[08:30] <daveake> I don't think I'll go to the SHARP landing today then :)
[08:31] <Darkside> fsphil: they're chatting about it now
[08:31] <Darkside> havent heard what software yet
[08:32] <number10> I brought radio in - but I suppose by the time they launch I will be back at home
[08:33] <daveake> Pix from the SHARP recover yesterday - http://imgur.com/a/7Vr3P#0
[08:34] <number10> is that the drive up to the big house?
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[08:34] <daveake> number10 Yep
[08:35] <daveake> Had the camera set to ISO100 and it was getting a bit dim hense the general blurriness
[08:35] <daveake> -s+c
[08:38] <number10> looks like next weekend flights are not heading my way
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[08:41] <daveake> No :(
[08:41] <number10> daveake: I am going to give up with that small PIC - the banked memory is causing problems - I could work a way round it but would make for nasty code (not that any of my code is nice)
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[08:44] <fsphil> I forgot about the banked memory in pics
[08:45] <number10> interesting - RS are doing complince testing on Raspberry Pi - likely to delay delivery
[08:45] <daveake> PIC - yeah, I feel your pain
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[08:45] <daveake> PI - Yes, saw that. I suspect they're thinking "What have we let outselves in for"
[08:46] <number10> some of the PICs are optimised for C - I juat wanted a small one that obviously is noy - shame I made up two boards :(
[08:46] <number10> just
[08:46] <number10> nevermid the code runs on the larger pic so I shall make up a couple of thos
[08:46] <daveake> :)
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[09:08] <gonzo_> I only get probs with banked mem in PICs if I can''t get a buffer in one bank
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[09:09] <gonzo_> they are about the biggest thing in my code
[09:10] <gonzo_> (writing the ublox init stuff into my 16F876 code)
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[09:26] <griffonbot> Received email: Dave "Re: [UKHAS] Launch Announcement - University of Southampton Project
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[09:27] <Morseman_G0DJA> I've seen the email saying that BUZZ is having another launch today but unfortunately it doesn't say what time. Anyone any idea of what approximate launch time is please?
[09:27] <daveake> No, that's SHARP not BUZZ
[09:28] <daveake> BUZZ is taking a rest till next weekend
[09:28] <daveake> No ETA for SHARP yet
[09:28] <Morseman_G0DJA> Sorry, I meant Sharp
[09:29] <x-f> e-mail subject says 1pm BST
[09:30] <Morseman_G0DJA> AH - I didn't read that bit x-f - DOH!
[09:30] <daveake> So it does :)
[09:30] <Morseman_G0DJA> In my defence, that bit had scrolled off the side of my email system window...
[09:31] <daveake> In my defence, I'm blind
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[09:49] <Nick_SHARP> SHARP Mission Control is now active in Southampton, Good luck launch and recovery teams!
[09:53] Graeme_SHARP (~Graeme_SH@82.132.248.220) joined #highaltitude.
[09:55] <fsphil> nice. there isn't enough people in my team to have a mission control :)
[09:56] <pjm> i'm ready to monitor sharp too
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[10:01] <Graeme_SHARP> Currently enjoying the driver along the A34 in the direction of the launch site. :)
[10:02] <Graeme_SHARP> ETA to Launch site ~12:30 - we'll see how much ground faff we before launch today
[10:02] <daveake> Graeme_SHARP My (blurry) pix from yesterday - http://imgur.com/a/7Vr3P#0
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[10:04] <Graeme_SHARP> Yep, I noticed them earlier, thanks you very much, we should have all the video edited later in the week and be able to put it on youtube.
[10:04] <daveake> good stuff
[10:04] <Nick_SHARP> First Prediction has a landing zone outside of Swindon, texting co-ords to Trev now.
[10:04] <eroomde> Graeme_SHARP: 1pm BST is it?
[10:04] <Graeme_SHARP> Speak of the devil - our resident film guy - DeanyBabey!
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[10:06] <Graeme_SHARP> 1pm BST is bit optimistic atm - ETA to launch site is 12:30 BST - we shouldn't have has may kinks on the ground as yesterday so 1:30pm - 2pm BST might be more realistic
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[10:32] <NigelMoby> ping pjm
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[10:37] <pjm> pjm reply!
[10:37] <NigelMoby> hey
[10:37] <pjm> hello
[10:37] <NigelMoby> that ezcap turned up
[10:37] <pjm> ahh
[10:37] <pjm> cheap and cheerful but seems ok
[10:38] <pjm> i finally got mine working after installing about 982345217651 deps for GNU radio
[10:38] <NigelMoby> yeah, looks alright for 10 quid!
[10:38] <pjm> and demodulated a local band2 radio station
[10:38] <pjm> the DVB-T performance is excellent
[10:38] <pjm> and it also does DAB L-Band
[10:38] <pjm> which is novel
[10:38] <NigelMoby> oh brill
[10:38] <pjm> but it does seem quite a good RX for the $
[10:39] <pjm> although it will be as selective as an xtal set / funcube given remotely strong signals i suspect
[10:39] <Laurenceb> you got the ezcap from cozycave?
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[10:39] <Laurenceb> mine hasnt turned up :S
[10:39] <NigelMoby> yup Laurence
[10:39] <NigelMoby> came tday, rec delivery
[10:39] <pjm> i see the cosycave buggers upped the price too
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[10:40] <Laurenceb> dismantled it yet?
[10:40] <Laurenceb> to see what chips it uses
[10:40] <NigelMoby> not Yet its literally just git here
[10:40] <Laurenceb> ok cool
[10:40] <pjm> yeah i took mine to pieces prior to plugging it into the lappy
[10:41] <Laurenceb> pjm: you have one too?
[10:41] <Laurenceb> same thing?
[10:41] <pjm> yeash
[10:41] <Laurenceb> awseome
[10:41] <Laurenceb> what ics?
[10:42] <pjm> tuner is e4000edg
[10:42] <Laurenceb> good
[10:42] <pjm> rtl2832v usb
[10:42] Action: Laurenceb checks osmocom site
[10:42] <pjm> and some eeprom on the back side of the board
[10:43] <Laurenceb> ok cool
[10:43] <Laurenceb> it should work
[10:43] <Laurenceb> brilliant
[10:43] <Laurenceb> time to git clone git://git.osmocom.org/rtl-sdr.git
[10:44] <NigelMoby> schweet, should keep me busy for a while
[10:44] <pjm> the osmocom driver compiles very easily
[10:45] <Laurenceb> its a bit lame
[10:45] <NigelMoby> least it compiles.
[10:45] <Laurenceb> if it had a bit more work done so it e.g. provided a jack audio server
[10:45] <Laurenceb> or at least a wav file as a named pipe
[10:46] <Laurenceb> thats how i hacked together the cc1020 sdr
[10:46] <NigelMoby> ahhh
[10:46] <Laurenceb> then fldigi can connect
[10:47] <Laurenceb> the pro way would be a jack audio server
[10:47] <NigelMoby> ill have a bash at the src this afternoon
[10:47] <Laurenceb> it looks really simple to me - just some libusb transfers
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[10:47] <NigelMoby> jack audio would be much better
[10:47] <Laurenceb> yeah - i thought itd be really hard
[10:47] <Laurenceb> but the examples look easy
[10:48] <Laurenceb> libsamplerate is easy to use too - to resample the data at 8khz
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[10:48] <NigelMoby> yup
[10:49] <pjm> http://pjm.dyndns.org/twtr/cosy.jpg photo of tuner ic's etc
[10:50] <Laurenceb> oh epic
[10:50] <Laurenceb> with mine would turn up
[10:50] <Laurenceb> its really small
[10:50] <NigelMoby> nice, that USB casing cone off easy enough?
[10:51] <NigelMoby> come*
[10:51] <pjm> yeah although its the ususal design with top half having 4 brittle plastic pegs that fit into mating holes bottom half
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[10:51] <pjm> so i used a sharp knife in the join to prize apart equally all around until it pops open
[10:52] <NigelMoby> ah Oki, cheers.
[10:53] <Laurenceb> muha
[10:53] <Laurenceb> poor mans funcube
[10:54] <NigelMoby> lol yup
[10:55] <UpuWork> PBH back on APRS ?
[10:55] <r2x0t> not yet
[10:55] <Laurenceb> looks like it survived another night
[10:55] <UpuWork> oh ignore that
[10:55] <UpuWork> should be in range of Azores now just
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[10:56] <r2x0t> not sure if there is any APRS GW on first island
[10:56] <r2x0t> aprs.fi shows none
[10:56] <UpuWork> yeah
[10:57] <r2x0t> http://www.projectbluehorizon.com/#flight < aprs positions should be green on map
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[10:57] <UpuWork> yeah
[10:57] <UpuWork> ok lunch time
[10:59] <daveake> Just (carefully) removed the Buzz tracker from the insulation. No damage so he'll be fine for the weekend.
[11:00] <daveake> I'll sort out those zero altitudes, and start using CRC16
[11:01] <SpeedEvil> :)
[11:02] <daveake> I read thru the chat log from Saturday to see what I missed during the chase car drives :D
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[11:03] <Darkside> woo
[11:03] <Darkside> i am SSTVing
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[11:03] <daveake> I was a bit concerned that I might damage something taking it apart - e.g. I used hot-melt glue to attach the batteries to the rfm22b to stabilize the temperature and hence reduce drift
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[11:04] <daveake> woo Darkside
[11:04] <SpeedEvil> hotmelt is easy
[11:04] <SpeedEvil> just jam it in the oven at 80C for half an hour
[11:04] <daveake> Yes, peeled off fine
[11:04] <daveake> Could have :D
[11:04] <Laurenceb> or in the freezer
[11:04] <SpeedEvil> Or that, yes
[11:04] <Laurenceb> oh wait
[11:05] <Laurenceb> that probably means its bad for hab
[11:05] <SpeedEvil> To a degree
[11:05] <Laurenceb> lol
[11:05] <SpeedEvil> the adhesion seems to go way down
[11:05] <daveake> :)
[11:05] <Laurenceb> -ive degree
[11:05] <SpeedEvil> I should offer a materials testing service at -45C
[11:05] <daveake> Well it was there for some thermal connection. I had a cable tie to keep it all together
[11:05] <SpeedEvil> Mail me it, and I put it in the freezer
[11:06] <Laurenceb> grrr wheres my usb dongle
[11:07] <Laurenceb> i want to try this now i know itll work
[11:07] <SpeedEvil> the TV one?
[11:07] <Laurenceb> yeah
[11:07] <navrac_> oh BGGR I've lost one of the chip aerials for the gps
[11:09] Action: SpeedEvil passes navrac plans for a helical.
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[11:12] <navrac_> aw thanks - but i think I'll just pester upu's site -
[11:12] <Laurenceb> is that a MCX connector on the dongle?
[11:16] <navrac_> ping upuwork
[11:23] <Laurenceb> pbh heading up again XD
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[11:25] <pjm> Laurenceb yeah i think it is mcx
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[11:26] <Laurenceb> you could try sticking a choke onto it and grabbing 3.3v from somewhere
[11:26] <Laurenceb> then have an lna on the ant
[11:27] <Laurenceb> ive got an antenni with inbuilt lna
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[11:27] <r2x0t> it may already have 5V on the antenna pin
[11:28] <r2x0t> because that's how DVB-T active antennas are powered
[11:28] <Laurenceb> ah
[11:28] <Laurenceb> doh
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[11:49] <UpuWork> hi navrac
[11:49] <UpuWork> lost the antenna ? :)
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[11:51] <UpuWork> ping priyesh
[11:52] <Graeme_SHARP> At the launch site. :)
[11:52] <UpuWork> 8 mins till launch then ? :)
[11:52] <UpuWork> updating live prediction
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[11:56] <Laurenceb> how many launches ?!
[11:56] <Laurenceb> theres going to be a hab in the air 24/7 soon
[11:57] <UpuWork> Dave Millers ears are going to have steam coming out
[11:57] <navrac_> hi upu - dont suppose you have any low vf schottky diodes kicking about there I could order at the same time?
[11:58] <UpuWork> SMD ones ?
[11:58] <navrac_> dont mind really - just dont want to have to order £25 or whatever from farnell for things i dont want to get two diodes!
[11:59] <pjm> r2x0t theres not any +5v present on these cozy usb's, but that would be a good idea to add one from the USB psu via 100r or similar
[11:59] <UpuWork> Got some of these : http://uk.farnell.com/on-semiconductor/mbr0520lt1g/diode-schottky-0-5a-20v/dp/9556915?Ntt=955-6915
[11:59] <UpuWork> how many do you want ?
[12:00] <navrac_> 3 would be good
[12:00] <navrac_> incase i break one!
[12:00] <UpuWork> they are small :)
[12:01] <UpuWork> what do you want the chip antenna ?
[12:01] <UpuWork> jsut put an order in and I'll pop 3 diodes in
[12:02] <navrac_> yep - i think my other one is in the carpet somewhere - I'll probably ordr a built up pico board as well - saves me loosing the parts!
[12:02] <UpuWork> lol ok
[12:02] <UpuWork> Going to need to order some new GPS chips
[12:02] <navrac_> I'll get onto that now - thank upu
[12:02] <UpuWork> it'll be tommorrow I post it is that ok
[12:02] <UpuWork> ?
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[12:04] <Morseman_G0DJA> Any news on launch time for Sharp?
[12:07] <mfa298> Morseman_G0DJA: I think they've arrived at the launch site (about 10 minutes ago).
[12:07] <Morseman_G0DJA> Thanks mfa298
[12:07] <mfa298> earlier they seemed to be hoping for 13:30 - 14:00 BST.
[12:08] <navrac_> yep no problem - still waiting for the solar panels anyway
[12:10] <navrac_> you should think about buying some of the cheap 1800 temp sensors from china and selling those too - you can buy cheap and then sell them on in more usable quantities.
[12:10] <navrac_> and arduinos
[12:10] <navrac_> and balloons
[12:10] <navrac_> and helium
[12:11] <UpuWork> lol
[12:12] <UpuWork> I keep thinking of making a 3.3v Arduino but its just a slipper slope
[12:13] <UpuWork> might as well put a GPS on it
[12:13] <UpuWork> might as well put a radio on it
[12:13] <UpuWork> oh boom HABduino
[12:13] <zyp> might as well put a decent microcontroller on it
[12:13] <daveake> step-up ... cutdown ... temp sensors ... pressure sensor ....
[12:13] <zyp> and a kitchen sink
[12:13] <BrainDamage> use a stm32, and perhaps libmaple if you want to stay with arduino libs?
[12:14] <Laurenceb> PBH will be breaking duration record soon
[12:14] <UpuWork> haha you're not disagreeing with something again are you zyp ? :)
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[12:14] <Laurenceb> you could use a dactyl board :P
[12:14] <zyp> what did I disagree with last time? :p
[12:14] <zyp> Laurenceb, yeah, sounds like that's what he's describing
[12:14] <Laurenceb> https://github.com/Laurenceb/Dactyl/tree/master/Hardware
[12:14] <UpuWork> personally Arduino is line with my programming skill
[12:15] <navrac_> sounds like a useful board - but it musnt weight more than 8g all in
[12:15] <Laurenceb> dactyl is about 15 with the connectors
[12:16] <Laurenceb> could be redone with max6 and stuff now
[12:16] <Laurenceb> zyp: how much does your board weigh?
[12:16] <zyp> haven't checked
[12:16] <zyp> remind me to check when I get home in two hours time
[12:16] <Laurenceb> wheres that pic you posted?
[12:17] <zyp> I've posted several
[12:17] <zyp> http://bin.jvnv.net/f/sTW8U.JPG <- this is the latest
[12:17] <futurity> Hi All.  Does anyone know when the launch of SHARP is happening today?
[12:18] <Laurenceb> sexy
[12:18] <Laurenceb> what are you using for the jtag?
[12:18] Action: Laurenceb just uses a discovery board
[12:18] <zyp> same here, so far
[12:18] <DeaneyBabey> futurity: latest estimate is sometime between 1330 and 1400
[12:18] <futurity> cool
[12:18] <number10> futurity: approximately some time today is the safest bet
[12:18] <DeaneyBabey> lol
[12:18] <futurity> all set to track
[12:18] <futurity> just happen to be working from home today :)
[12:18] <BrainDamage> zyp: what's the cpld for?
[12:19] <zyp> IO flexibility
[12:19] <Laurenceb> what connector is that for the CAN etc?
[12:19] <BrainDamage> rerouting io as digital crossbar?
[12:19] <zyp> Laurenceb, JST-XH
[12:19] <Laurenceb> ah ok
[12:19] <zyp> IIRC
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[12:20] <zyp> I just chose that since I already have a lot of wires with precrimped connectors
[12:20] <Laurenceb> ok
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[12:20] <zyp> BrainDamage, yes, and muxing/bus logic aswell
[12:21] <Laurenceb> the silabs stuff has crossbar now
[12:25] <DeaneyBabey> Interesting prediction for SHARP, based on yesterday's predictions. http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=21977de8e5ca7148b6b90b8deff4e74cc326ffa6
[12:28] <Laurenceb> looks like pbh is going to break the duration record in a few hours
[12:30] <UpuWork> Just waiting for the APRS to kick back in, but its alot slower than the last one
[12:32] <fsphil> anyone receiving pbh directly yet on hf?
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[12:33] <UpuWork> French station got the call sign this morning
[12:34] <futurity> is there a page about the frequencies PBH is transmitting on?
[12:34] <UpuWork> yep
[12:34] <UpuWork> Good HF data received by CR8ABA in the Azores at 0920, 0940 UTC, Beacon KD2AUC-1 144.39 MHz should be on APRS in several hours #PBHVI #ARHAB (3/26/2012 @ 11:45)
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[12:35] <UpuWork> http://www.projectbluehorizon.com/#input
[12:35] <UpuWork> but I think the timing is off
[12:35] <UpuWork> andrew_apex you here ?
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[12:36] <Laurenceb> lol i just noticed
[12:36] <Laurenceb> the PBH takeoff area is censored
[12:36] <andrew_apex> Hello Upu
[12:36] <UpuWork> hi andrew_apex are you guys launching this weekend ?
[12:36] <Laurenceb> odd
[12:37] <Laurenceb> how come area51 isnt
[12:37] <andrew_apex> Upu - at the launch site now
[12:37] <UpuWork> no at the weekend Andrew
[12:38] <UpuWork> talk when you're not so busy :)
[12:40] <andrew_apex> :)
[12:47] <priyesh> UpuWork: pong
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[12:49] <UpuWork> hey priyesh
[12:50] <UpuWork> quick question are you launching this weekend ?
[12:50] <priyesh> no. not as far as i know
[12:50] <UpuWork> oh ok
[12:51] <UpuWork> daveake and I are stealing all the frequencies on Saturday
[12:51] <UpuWork> oh sorry ignore me
[12:51] <UpuWork> its Sharp that might be flying again
[12:51] <priyesh> hehe. no problem
[12:52] <UpuWork> Sharp chase is on the map
[12:52] <priyesh> ill be tracking though
[12:52] <UpuWork> ok cool
[12:52] <LazyLeopard> Hmmmm.... Does that mean they've launched?
[12:53] <UpuWork> nope unless they are trying to launch a car
[12:53] <jonsowman> lol
[12:53] <daveake> They're going to need a considerably bigger balloon
[12:54] <eroomde> eta?
[12:54] <UpuWork> 11am eroomde
[12:54] <daveake> today
[12:54] <eroomde> ?
[12:54] <UpuWork> what daveake said
[12:55] <eroomde> when was it meant to be?
[12:55] <UpuWork> 2 weeks ago
[12:55] <daveake> what Upuwork said
[12:55] <priyesh> im off
[12:55] <priyesh> bye
[12:55] <UpuWork> serious face
[12:55] <UpuWork> they are at the launch site and are setting up
[12:55] <eroomde> ok thanks
[12:55] <UpuWork> launch should be sometime in the next hour or so
[12:55] <LazyLeopard> The last estimate we had was 13:30-14:00, though whether BST, UT or HAB...
[12:55] <UpuWork> ISH
[12:56] <UpuWork> The question is will SHARP launch before PBH hits the Azores ?
[12:56] <UpuWork> *APRS
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[12:57] <UpuWork> Well I need to go out back later on good luck SHARP will probably track when I get back
[13:00] <griffonbot> Received email: Jon Sowman "[UKHAS] Wombat/Joey/HF Launch Wednesday"
[13:01] <fsphil> ah, the diff sensor should be interesting
[13:02] <jonsowman> yep
[13:03] <eroomde> putting antenna up temporarily
[13:03] <eroomde> on a tripod
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[13:13] <navrac_> antenna up
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[13:16] <navrac_> I should be able to track on wed. I can remote in and control the pc while at work
[13:17] <jonsowman> thanks navrac_
[13:17] <jonsowman> the more people the better :)
[13:17] <navrac_> well 3 radios to follow on a weekday is going to spread it thin
[13:18] <mfa298> I think the 13:30 - 14:00 was supposedly BST. But is probably what's locally known as Projection time - which is probably the same as HAB time (i.e. when it happens)
[13:18] <jonsowman> navrac_: yes indeed
[13:19] <navrac_> does the old sharp need to come off the tracker
[13:19] <jonsowman> we are tracking ourselves so that's ok
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[13:20] <eroomde> wahoo
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[13:21] <navrac_> wahoo?
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[13:21] <eroomde> sharp on map
[13:22] <daveake> internal temp seems a bit low
[13:22] <junderwood> so does internal pressure
[13:22] <eroomde> the air temp is not much today
[13:22] <eroomde> it'#s just hot in the sun
[13:22] <daveake> not sure about the "cutdown 42" .... I think that goes up 50 for every cutdown trigger, and 1 for something else, but I don't remember for sure
[13:22] <DeaneyBabey> as far as I know cutdown should read 0 before cutdown and 1 after
[13:23] <DeaneyBabey> sounds like they still have some programming bugs in there...
[13:23] <DeaneyBabey> *looks
[13:25] <mfa298> I think someone might need to update their long/lat for tracking. Either that or someone in Southampton is recieving very well!
[13:26] <Matt_soton> tahts andrew whos driving around with them
[13:27] <mfa298> Matt_soton: I was aware of it being andrew. I'm guessing that's a feature that would be nice to add into dl-fldigi. Keep the operator position updated based on GPS - Although it could make some of the data more interesting.
[13:28] <Darkside> mfa298: it can do that already
[13:29] <Darkside> it just doesn't show as a car, it makes the antenna symbol move though
[13:29] <mfa298> Darkside: ah fair enough. I could see the option to set the operator position but I didn't know if it kept it updated as GPS changed.
[13:29] <mfa298> We'll have to tell andrew_apex to get a gps unit on his laptop.
[13:29] <Darkside> he probably has one
[13:30] <Darkside> hence SHARP_Chase
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[13:30] <Darkside> that updates via a different system though
[13:30] <Darkside> i.e. not via the habitat backend (unless things have changed)
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[13:36] <andrew_apex> Yes, darkside is right :)
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[13:36] <andrew_apex> Cutdown 42 shows the gps us in flight mode :D
[13:36] <andrew_apex> *is
[13:37] <daveake> good :)
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[13:37] <Matt_soton> so alomost ready to go?
[13:37] <andrew_apex> Pretty much!
[13:37] Nick change: R -> Guest75465
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[13:42] <Laurenceb> wtf
[13:42] <Laurenceb> pbh refuses to loase altitude
[13:43] <Darkside> ?
[13:43] <Darkside> it dropped in altitide overnight
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[13:50] <Laurenceb> yeah but its almost up to the same altitude now
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[13:51] <Darkside> Laurenceb: you know its a zero pressure envelope, right?
[13:51] <Laurenceb> yes
[13:51] <Laurenceb> but its flying very well
[13:51] <kokey> wow
[13:52] <kokey> PBH was impressive
[13:52] <Laurenceb> have they dumped any ballast?
[13:52] <kokey> how was telemetry broadcast?
[13:52] <Darkside> kokey: its still going
[13:52] <Darkside> APRS and HF CW comms
[13:53] <Darkside> HF is 1W on 30m and 40m alternating, not sure what power on APRS
[13:54] <kokey> that's a good solution for flying over Russia etc. I guess
[13:54] <kokey> is it mylar balloons?
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[13:55] <Darkside> kokey: not sure about mylar, but some kind of zero pressure thing
[13:55] <Darkside> apparently quite expensive
[13:57] <kokey> can't find details on the pbh web site
[13:59] <x-f> yeah, they're not very social and open :)
[14:00] <kokey> yeah seems like they are competitive
[14:00] <kokey> so they're being secretive
[14:00] <kokey> I think I should e-mail that company again for prices on mylar balloons for research
[14:02] <kokey> though I suppose they are custom made and won't really get much cheaper on scale
[14:05] <kokey> seems like there was a little project that lifted a 63 pound payload to 145,000 feet
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[14:05] <kokey> in 1957, using a mylar balloon
[14:06] <Graeme_SHARP> Hey all, sorry for the slight delays, we had a duff balloon, just inflating our spare now (good thing we brought that and some spare helium!)
[14:06] <kokey> sucks to lose helium
[14:10] <NickB1> kokey, cool :) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skyhook_balloon
[14:10] <Graeme_SHARP> we probably only lost about 1000L - we luckily enough have a whole spare 9000L canister.
[14:11] <futurity> I'll be back about 4pm BST to track
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[14:12] <kokey> someone's going to have to surf the severn
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[14:13] <kokey> I think we should do bets on it ending up in the Severn
[14:13] <daveake> seven to one?
[14:13] <Darkside> >_>
[14:13] <Darkside> <_<
[14:14] <jonsowman> lol
[14:14] <kokey> russs: are you able to set up bets easily?
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[14:14] <kokey> haha
[14:14] <NSS-WB9SBD> Morning, Anyone around?
[14:14] <eroomde> plenty
[14:14] <eroomde> it's afternoon here
[14:14] <gonzo_> only us chickens
[14:14] <eroomde> on this patch of electrons
[14:15] <Darkside> almost 2am here
[14:15] <NSS-WB9SBD> 9 am here
[14:15] <Darkside> 1am*
[14:15] <NSS-WB9SBD> so whats up with PBH?
[14:15] <Darkside> NSS-WB9SBD: well, it's up
[14:15] <Darkside> thats about it
[14:15] <Darkside> NSS-WB9SBD: did you get linked here from reddit?
[14:15] <NSS-WB9SBD> no details huh?
[14:16] <NSS-WB9SBD> reddit?
[14:16] <Darkside> nvm
[14:16] <Darkside> anyway, it appears to be slowly approaching the azores, where it should appear on aprs again
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[14:16] <Darkside> apart from that, no idea
[14:17] <Darkside> i need to sleep, its way past my bedtime...
[14:17] <Darkside> night all
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[14:19] <NSS-WB9SBD> have a good night.
[14:20] <NSS-WB9SBD> I forgot what call they are using on APRS, anyone?
[14:21] <NickB1> KD2AUC-SP
[14:22] <eroomde> sharp latest?
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[14:23] <eroomde> Graeme_SHARP: eta?
[14:23] <navrac_> any more news graeme?
[14:24] <NSS-WB9SBD> Gotta run for a few hours c ya all later!
[14:25] <Graeme_SHARP> (2nd) Balloon is inflated - flight batteries are installed - just checking GPS lock the sealing the top on
[14:25] <Randomskk> on the critical path of launching balloons I try and position "check GPS lock" before "inflate" :P
[14:26] <jonsowman> wise
[14:26] <DeaneyBabey> Randomskk: I am guessing switching from test batteries to flight batteries would cause a system power down and thus lose GPS lock...
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[14:27] <DeaneyBabey> A better way of switching power might be a plan
[14:27] <jonsowman> does it really need so much power that it can't be running on flight batteries before filling?
[14:27] <Randomskk> DeaneyBabey: my GPS has a battery backup
[14:27] <DeaneyBabey> jonsowman: They are running Gadgeteer& so who knows!
[14:27] <Randomskk> so warm starts
[14:28] <jonsowman> haha oh that's true
[14:28] <jonsowman> it probably needs an amp or so continuous
[14:28] <Randomskk> but I guess so
[14:28] <Randomskk> haha
[14:28] <DeaneyBabey> Randomskk: From what I have seen of their system, the GPS is a gadgeteer module - no idea if that has warm start capabilities!
[14:28] <Randomskk> heh
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[14:30] <mfa298> I suppose some of it depends on how the warm start works as well. I picked up a GPS module that can do warm start but requires an additional battery for it to keep state - But that can just be a small button cell.
[14:32] <Randomskk> this one has a small coin cell: http://www.flickr.com/photos/randomskk/6808385184
[14:33] <NigelMoby> as does swift.
[14:34] <DeaneyBabey> This is what SHARP is using& http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/net-gadgeteer-gps-module-p-971.html
[14:34] <DeaneyBabey> The only connections are via the ribbon cable to the main gadgeteer board. I have no idea if you can attach a backup battery to it...
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[14:38] <kokey> should use a generator with a RC plane motor
[14:38] <Graeme_SHARP> We running debugging of everything just before flight connected to a laptop - so it is powered through USB at the point, once we are confident its working, we unplug USB, plug in the lithium Ions, check lock through rtty, put on the top (the other half of the team is inflating the balloon as this is happening), seal it and connect the balloon to the full train and away we go!
[14:38] <Graeme_SHARP> definitly within the next 20 minutes!
[14:39] <kokey> ok, Severn, at night
[14:39] Action: daveake starts stop-watch :)
[14:39] <Randomskk> Graeme_SHARP: can't you keep the USB connected while you plug in batteries?
[14:40] <DeaneyBabey> Sunset is 1933 BST
[14:40] <Matt_soton> what was the launch time yday for comparison?
[14:41] <DeaneyBabey> Matt_soton: yesterday's launch was at 1600 BST
[14:41] <Matt_soton> so it was leading zeros yday, what is it today?
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[14:42] <DeaneyBabey> Matt_soton: hopefully they have solved the GPS's vertigo
[14:43] <Matt_soton> i thought they would have done that last night...
[14:43] <DeaneyBabey> I believe that cutdown: 42 means its running in flight mode now
[14:43] <Matt_soton> waiting for pressure to get >200 and wondering where it was going to appear was kinda nice novelity
[14:43] <mfa298> Matt_soton: I believe there was probably some late night coding going on to fix the issues in the software.
[14:44] <DeaneyBabey> its a bit hard to test at ground level though
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[14:55] <futurity> Hi, is there a URL for SHARP's predicted path please?
[14:55] <r2x0t> it's on tracker
[14:55] <r2x0t> http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[14:55] <DeaneyBabey> futurity: or here if you wanted to tweak the details: http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=edea9af40ddb4147b8cb6fd14530e7f009487a49
[14:56] <jonsowman> heh i'm so glad i put that #! thing into the predictor
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[14:56] <daveake> #!?
[14:56] <futurity> Thanks, I may need to adjust my aerial a bit ;)
[14:56] <jonsowman> daveake: the old predictor didn't give an url for a prediction
[14:57] <jonsowman> so you couldn't link people to it
[14:57] <daveake> Ah
[14:57] <daveake> Yes very useful :)
[14:57] <eroomde> eta?
[14:57] <eroomde> etl*
[14:57] <jonsowman> <30 mins
[14:57] <jonsowman> apparently
[14:58] <DeaneyBabey> launch was 'within 20 mins' 20 minutes ago
[14:58] <jonsowman> look a flying pig
[14:58] <fsphil> easyoink
[14:58] <daveake> Now there's an idea
[15:00] <gonzo_> you have tio be over battersea for pigs
[15:00] <eroomde> which is the definitive github for dl-fldigi for ubuntu?
[15:00] <jonsowman> dunno if DanielRichman has put an 11.10 binary in his ppa yet
[15:00] <jonsowman> otherwise build it from source
[15:01] <Randomskk> eroomde: jcoxon is the definitive github though
[15:01] <Randomskk> maybe that should move to habhub or somehing
[15:01] <jonsowman> habhub github organisation
[15:01] <Randomskk> yea
[15:01] <jonsowman> too many 'hubs' perhaps
[15:02] <eroomde> one stop shop for 'i want to build me a listening station right now' would be good
[15:03] <eroomde> because we've found an old p4 box on which to run a permenant listener
[15:03] <eroomde> the antenbna is currently just on a tripod on the roof though
[15:03] <eroomde> about 3m lower than its eventual home
[15:04] <Randomskk> we really need to get this points game system achievements thing done
[15:04] <Randomskk> it'd be so cool
[15:04] <fsphil> hab points!
[15:05] <Laurenceb> wut
[15:06] <eroomde> but not retroactively
[15:06] <Randomskk> of course
[15:06] <eroomde> else upu would be the winner for all eternity
[15:06] <Randomskk> haha
[15:06] <Randomskk> only once the cusf trackotron is set up with a phasing harness and both yagis :P
[15:07] <fsphil> we need a handicap system :p
[15:07] <daveake> :)
[15:07] <jonsowman> haha
[15:07] <eroomde> yes i'd be keen to compete properly in such a thing
[15:07] <eroomde> 2 x 2 array or something
[15:07] <Randomskk> everyone else seems to be winning with just a vertical
[15:08] <Graeme_SHARP> Current altitude 1 m above ground level.....
[15:08] <eroomde> etl Graeme_SHARP ?
[15:08] <eroomde> or are we just waiting on a lock?
[15:10] <Graeme_SHARP> everything is tapped together....just and tied together , the balloon is attached....and we just stop recieving packets in the van....:/
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[15:11] <NickB1> did PBH burst?
[15:12] <TheoMC> yeah
[15:12] <Matt_soton> i doubt you would get a signal if it had burst
[15:12] <Matt_soton> someone just forgot to enter altitude
[15:13] <LazyLeopard> More likely it's just had a GPS glitch
[15:13] <navrac_> could be -
[15:13] <NickB1> hope so
[15:13] <NickB1> but it seems they already have the duration record
[15:14] <navrac_> its all a bit too secretive for my liking - 90% of habbers share all their info. This lot seem to keep it very tight.
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[15:15] <Graeme_SHARP> just had to reset the electronics, minor glitch single digit minute delay
[15:16] <eroomde> Graeme_SHARP: cool cool
[15:18] <NickB1> ah PBH has good telem again
[15:20] <Graeme_SHARP> fixed....good to go!
[15:20] <DeaneyBabey> NickB1: looks like its done a U-Turn!
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[15:21] <Graeme_SHARP> ballooon now 20 feet off the ground...slowly raising it on the tether
[15:21] <gonzo_> I'm assuming that PBH telem is manually received off HF, so the time is down to the op entering it correctly
[15:22] <navrac_> As of 1500UTC: PBH18 is still ascending for the day, Batteries @ 8.9V and 0 ballast expelled. Thanks CR8ABA for all the data! - from twitter
[15:22] <gonzo_> I may even be home in time to see sharp above my horizon!
[15:22] <Graeme_SHARP> launch!
[15:22] <DeaneyBabey> whooo!
[15:22] <daveake> See it on the trace now
[15:22] <gonzo_> celebrate with a jam sandwich
[15:23] <junderwood> got it here as well
[15:23] <daveake> 486 metres
[15:23] <junderwood> and a good decode at 496m
[15:23] <daveake> Not a full sentence yet tho
[15:23] <fsphil> you people with your living near the launch site
[15:23] <daveake> lol
[15:23] <DeaneyBabey> new position on the tracker
[15:24] Nick change: junderwood -> junderwood_M0JCU
[15:24] <mfa298> what dial frequency are you using ?
[15:24] <mfa298> running my tracking via RDP makes tuning more fun
[15:24] <kokey> that's quick
[15:24] <junderwood_M0JCU> 434648.1
[15:24] <eroomde> hear it loud and clear
[15:25] <daveake> My house is in the way
[15:25] <kokey> I think a rocket has fired
[15:26] <DeaneyBabey> Prediction is putting it in the Severn...
[15:26] <kokey> would be nice if it lands by tintern abbey
[15:26] <daveake> $HARP
[15:27] <DeaneyBabey> Graeme_SHARP are you using remote cutdown today?
[15:27] <kokey> would be tricky west from that, really lovely but lots of hills and trees
[15:27] <daveake> Got 1st sentence
[15:29] <mfa298> Not seeing anything obvious on the waterfall yet. But then I'm going to need a fairly decent signal as the antenna is indoors at the moment.
[15:29] <pjm> signal appearing in poole!
[15:29] <Matt_soton> signal is in southampton
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[15:30] <mfa298> Matt_soton: I think your antenna is in a better position to mine today :P
[15:30] <Matt_soton> mines ontop of Lanchester :P
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[15:31] <kokey> there's a place called lanchester?
[15:31] Nick change: LazyLeopard -> LazyL_M0LEP
[15:31] <Matt_soton> theres a building called lanchester
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[15:31] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[15:32] <LazyL_M0LEP> Pffff... Go to get a cuppa, and the launch! ;) Shoulda done that earlier! ;)
[15:32] <mfa298> If it wasn't for Chemistry I could probably see your Antenna from the office. Mines in my flat so good for height but no way to permanently mount it outside :(
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[15:33] <navrac_> yep getting it here
[15:33] <NickB1> Hey Lunar
[15:33] <Randomskk> I can't remember, has anyone made an android app to upload chase car position?
[15:33] <Lunar_Lander> hi NickB1
[15:33] <Matt_soton> what antenna do you have anyway mfa298
[15:33] <Graeme_SHARP> Remote cutdown shiuld be in operation today anyway
[15:33] <Graeme_SHARP> if we need it:)
[15:33] <daveake> Anyone else see this about a minute ago? http://i.imgur.com/ov4lM.png
[15:34] <mfa298> I'm using a home made dipole (cut for 2m but good match on 70cms)
[15:34] <navrac_> 222km at 3466m not too shabby
[15:34] <navrac_> yes i did daveake
[15:34] <LazyL_M0LEP> daveake: Yep
[15:34] <pjm> ah yes copying valid data now
[15:34] <daveake> Good, not my receiver then :D
[15:34] <pjm> just added an LNA for 433
[15:34] <daveake> Think I saw the same once yesterday
[15:34] <LazyL_M0LEP> Did it yesterday on occasions, too.
[15:35] <Matt_soton> mfa298: this colinear is very good mind you too
[15:35] <mfa298> Matt_soton: I've got a GP15 as well but nowhere to use it at home.
[15:35] <Laurenceb> now we just need a way for sharp to talk to PBH
[15:35] <NigeyS> Laurenceb
[15:35] <LazyL_M0LEP> Saw at least one occasion when it did something like that several times in one batch of lines.
[15:36] <mfa298> daveake: saw some slighlty worse blips than that yesterday. I think it jumped a few hundred Hz and then back
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[15:36] <NigeyS> Laurenceb: http://www.flickr.com/photos/nigeys/7017877133/in/photostream note the 666 not 668 model number on the pcb
[15:37] <daveake> Anyone know what setup they've got? NTX2 from a D/A for example?
[15:37] <daveake> Wondering what's causing the glitches and also the "whooooop" startup noise
[15:37] <Matt_soton> i think resistive divider from a digital pin
[15:38] <eroomde> yeah it is a bit of a hail mary
[15:38] <daveake> PWM?
[15:38] <Matt_soton> also the whoop is the noise the NTX2 makes on startup
[15:38] <daveake> Oh sorry just read what you said :D
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[15:38] <daveake> Not seen either issue elsewhere
[15:38] <Laurenceb> NigeyS: i know
[15:38] <Laurenceb> thats why i was worried it wouldnt work
[15:38] <NigeyS> same chips though
[15:39] <NigeyS> so should be alright
[15:39] <daveake> Matt_soton Of course, they're turning it off (via the enable pin I assume) so they can Rx. Makes sense.
[15:40] <Laurenceb> yeah it looks like it uses mcx connector and a smaller board
[15:40] <Upu> afternoon
[15:40] <Upu> oo its up
[15:40] <LazyL_M0LEP> Seen the whoops on previous flights using on and off sequences. Don't remember seeing frequency shifts quite as abrupt as that one before yesterday though.
[15:40] <Laurenceb> NigeyS: how long did it take to arrive?
[15:41] <Matt_soton> anyone else heard interference then?
[15:41] <eroomde> fading a bit
[15:41] <daveake> I did
[15:41] <daveake> Assumed it was local
[15:41] <Upu> solid signal here
[15:41] <pjm> whats the S shaped wobble of the carriers caused by?
[15:42] <NigeyS> Laurenceb: ordered thursday, came today
[15:42] <junderwood_M0JCU> Anyone here who could add a payload doc to the tracker?
[15:42] <NigeyS> recorded delivery from jersey
[15:42] <Laurenceb> hmm
[15:42] <Laurenceb> ill emailt hem
[15:42] <Randomskk> junderwood_M0JCU: yea
[15:42] <Laurenceb> oh
[15:42] <Randomskk> did you recently add one? I can't remember
[15:42] <NigeyS> even has a customs sticker .. labeled as gift..lol
[15:42] <Laurenceb> Nigeys: i guess postie could have lost the "you were out" notice
[15:42] <Laurenceb> ill ring local sorting office
[15:42] <NigeyS> possible, email him for the tracking number ?
[15:42] <daveake> My DSO came with a "value £25" label ....
[15:42] <junderwood_M0JCU> Randomskk, http://pastebin.com/t89TMuS7
[15:42] Action: Laurenceb checks email
[15:43] <eroomde> woahh
[15:43] <eroomde> it's going mental
[15:43] <daveake> wtf
[15:43] <eroomde> either than or my LO is going mental
[15:43] <Upu> I saw that
[15:43] <junderwood_M0JCU> that was wierd
[15:43] <Upu> steady again
[15:43] <Matt_soton> same here
[15:43] <Randomskk> junderwood_M0JCU: added
[15:43] <junderwood_M0JCU> thanks
[15:43] <daveake> http://i.imgur.com/4TvW7.png
[15:45] <NigeyS> its raving! :D
[15:45] <daveake> If it's just processor pin --> res network --> NTX2, I wonder if the supply to the processor is jumping around. O they have a dodgy earth.
[15:45] <NickB1> could be a power issue
[15:45] <NickB1> oh daveake beat me ;)
[15:45] <NigeyS> ntx2 has int vreg, as long as its above 3v it should be stable
[15:46] <daveake> Maybe lots use when it writes to SD or does some other occassional thing
[15:46] <eroomde> fading in and out slightly. still quite decodable but not a particularly stable snr
[15:46] <daveake> Yes, but the processor power is critical
[15:46] <NigeyS> hey eroomde :)
[15:46] <daveake> Since that's what's setting the voltage that tells the NTX2 what frequency to transmit at
[15:46] <eroomde> ntx2's vreg doesn't matter is the VCO input is a ratiometric function of a histrionic power line
[15:46] <eroomde> if*
[15:46] <eroomde> woah
[15:46] <eroomde> and again
[15:47] <daveake> I'll name that tune in 7
[15:47] <eroomde> something is seriously amiss
[15:47] <jonsowman> dial frequency?
[15:47] <LazyL_M0LEP> ...and they start transmitting RTTY before the NTX2 has settled...
[15:47] <NickB1> probably better to give the processor a seperate supply
[15:47] <eroomde> 648 USB
[15:47] <jonsowman> ta
[15:47] <LazyL_M0LEP> 434.648
[15:47] <jonsowman> thanks :)
[15:47] <eroomde> and again
[15:48] <daveake> Yes, or have a buffer with a local regulated supply. A trannie and a zener could do it
[15:48] <daveake> Wow
[15:48] <pjm> yeah .648 USB here with about 1700Hz FSK centre
[15:49] <NickB1> ah yes
[15:49] <NickB1> or do power demanding stuff in between transmissions
[15:49] <r2x0t> I think that's what they already do
[15:49] <LazyL_M0LEP> Hmmm... It's kinda hard to decode RTTY when it's jumping up and down by a third (or so) of its shift...
[15:50] <r2x0t> if it's strong, change tone filter BW
[15:50] <daveake> It's definitely a challenge
[15:50] <r2x0t> to even 200Hz
[15:50] <r2x0t> or more
[15:50] <jonsowman> yeah try increasing the rx filter bandwidth
[15:50] <jonsowman> idk if fldigi will cope
[15:50] <jonsowman> worth a try
[15:50] Action: LazyL_M0LEP has the bandwidth wider than half the shift...
[15:50] <eroomde> the jumps are fast
[15:50] <eroomde> stable so far this string
[15:51] <r2x0t> is cutoff active this launch ?
[15:51] <LazyL_M0LEP> If the jump's small it may cope, but chances are it loses a bit or two.
[15:51] <LazyL_M0LEP> r2x0t: allegedly, yes
[15:51] <daveake> r2x0t Believe so
[15:51] <navrac_> looks like the shift has gone up too
[15:52] <daveake> I've written up my flight/s on Saturday - http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=396
[15:52] <LazyL_M0LEP> About 380 at the moment. Was nearer 360 when I first received signal.
[15:52] <daveake> navrac_ Yeah I had to adjust shift up
[15:53] <navrac_> yep - and widened the filters for the autotracking
[15:54] <Randomskk> what shifts are people using?
[15:54] <Graeme_SHARP> Coming up on the 12km barrier, lets see if our flight mode fix worked
[15:54] <r2x0t> falling?
[15:55] <daveake> looks like it
[15:55] <daveake> 2 in a row lower
[15:55] <r2x0t> that was short flight :/
[15:55] <daveake> 84 --> cutdown
[15:56] <LazyL_M0LEP> Well, I guess each liine's being sent three times, so there's a good chance one of them gets through, and at a pinch one might try to reconstruct a correct line from three garbled versions...
[15:56] <pjm> r2x0t feeding to TS if u want to listen along
[15:56] <r2x0t> nah
[15:57] <Graeme_SHARP> Hmmmm, 84 means auto cutdown...GPS probably got some erronous data for a long time that triggered it...
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[15:59] <LazyL_M0LEP> Hmmm... Time to get chasing out west of Worcester I guess...
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[16:00] <Upu> data looked ok from here
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[16:00] <Randomskk> I can almost decode bits of it from home on my whip
[16:00] <Randomskk> but no full sentences yet :P
[16:01] <LazyL_M0LEP> Did it hit the altitude limit and switch off again?
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[16:01] <jonsowman> it's already cut down Randomskk
[16:01] <jonsowman> so that's unlikely to improve
[16:01] <LazyL_M0LEP> ...or didn't it even get that high?
[16:01] <futurity> i'm just setting up tracker, but I'll be lucky to get anything before it lands ;)
[16:01] <Upu> didn't get that high LazyL_M0LEP
[16:02] <number10_M0MDB> mmm, just put up antenna
[16:02] <futurity> Good signal strength though
[16:03] <futurity> number10: same here
[16:03] <futurity> But these things happen. just one of those things
[16:03] <number10_M0MDB> just signed in - what happened?
[16:03] <Lunar_Lander> number10_M0MDB, cutdown struck in
[16:03] <Upu> balloon is still going up
[16:03] <Upu> tracker is going down
[16:03] <Lunar_Lander> ?
[16:03] <Lunar_Lander> XD now I got it
[16:04] <number10_M0MDB> its good to test cutdown devices from time to time - was it a test?
[16:04] Action: Upu pats Lunar_Lander
[16:04] <Lunar_Lander> what were the cutdown criteria?
[16:04] <Graeme_SHARP> Haha number 10....we'll go with that :p
[16:04] <number10_M0MDB> ;)
[16:05] <Lunar_Lander> Graeme_SHARP,
[16:05] <Lunar_Lander> what were the cutdown criteria?
[16:05] <Upu> PBH is back on APRS
[16:05] <LazyL_M0LEP> Hmmm... Think it's not going to decode here any more.
[16:05] <Graeme_SHARP> Not sure off the top of my head (I'm not the software guy)....
[16:06] <eroomde> Graeme_SHARP: do you have a link to your cutdown test video?
[16:06] <Upu> its great eroomde :)
[16:06] <Randomskk> woop looks like I got one decode ;D
[16:06] <mfa298> eroomde: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qig-LVW1yb4
[16:07] <mfa298> I'm guessing that's the one you're after.
[16:07] <Graeme_SHARP> Yep, thats the one mike
[16:07] <Upu> lost it here
[16:07] <futurity> Lost it here
[16:07] <priyesh> lost it too
[16:07] <futurity> didn't get any decodes :(
[16:08] <pjm> still here in poole + decoding!
[16:08] <LazyL_M0LEP> Hmmm.... Got that one OK.
[16:09] <eroomde> still can hear it fairly clearly
[16:09] <daveake> Jumped again
[16:09] <daveake> Gap down
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[16:09] <LazyL_M0LEP> Yeah. Down to about 320
[16:10] <LazyL_M0LEP> Not decodable any more.
[16:10] <navrac_> yeah gone here
[16:10] <LazyL_M0LEP> Line #44 was the last I got...
[16:11] <futurity> nothing here on audio either
[16:11] <pjm> yep too weak here to decod now
[16:13] <Lunar_Lander> is "project sharp test launch 1" by jacobdeane also by you?
[16:13] <Lunar_Lander> Graeme_SHARP, I mean by your team
[16:13] <Graeme_SHARP> Yep, Jacob is a guy videoing us
[16:13] <futurity> Is PBH still up does anyone know? Last line seems to be at 15:04 (1 hour ago)
[16:13] <Graeme_SHARP> I'm the one talking in it mostly.
[16:14] <daveake> Dropped out here at 1983m
[16:14] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[16:14] <daveake> Still see the lines but very little decoding
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[16:14] <eroomde> oh Graeme_SHARP name and face together now
[16:14] <eroomde> it's ed moore from cusf
[16:14] <eroomde> (formerly)
[16:15] <eroomde> can't really decode anything anymore
[16:15] <fsphil> wait, launch over already?
[16:15] <daveake> yep
[16:16] <Graeme_SHARP> Phil, slightly premature cutdown...
[16:16] <fsphil> ah
[16:16] <eroomde> can anyone else hear it?
[16:16] <daveake> not now
[16:16] <number10_M0MDB> no
[16:16] <eroomde> in the noise for me
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[16:19] <Graeme_SHARP> Both chase cars are about half an hour away, it might be a yagi job....
[16:20] <kokey> what was the cutdown mechanism?
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[16:27] Nick change: LazyL_M0LEP -> LazyLeopard
[16:28] <Graeme_SHARP> Kokey, a plastic tube that hasa small explosive match inside that shatters the tube when fired
[16:28] <Graeme_SHARP> it is placed about 2m above the paracute
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[16:31] <navrac_> pbh now being received in the azores on 2m
[16:31] <kokey> Graeme_SHARP: cool, what triggers it?
[16:33] <futurity> great PBH news
[16:33] <eroomde> the better question is what's *meant* to trigger it
[16:33] <fsphil> has it been up longer than the last trans-atlantic floater?
[16:34] <Laurenceb> dunno
[16:34] <Laurenceb> almost
[16:34] <navrac_> yep - i think it beat it a while back
[16:35] <Graeme_SHARP> Just a pulse that triggers a fet that dumps 5v from a capacity through it
[16:35] <navrac_> its done 60hours now - the last one was 57?
[16:35] <Laurenceb> ah
[16:35] <Laurenceb> yeah its taken the record
[16:35] <Graeme_SHARP> With regards to the trigger conditions, I dont know, we'd have to ask Rich/Andrew
[16:36] <futurity> Is there a web page about the balloon and payload? I guess a zero pressure balloon?
[16:37] <Laurenceb> be interesting to see if they try and fly it into europe
[16:37] <kokey> futurity: http://www.projectbluehorizon.com/ but it's very low on details
[16:37] <Laurenceb> anyone know if they dropped any ballast yet?
[16:37] <kokey> my guess it's a big mylar bag
[16:37] <futurity> kokey: thanks
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[16:40] <jcoxon> evening all
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[16:40] <Graeme_SHARP> We got half a pack at lower altitude so have a better idea.
[16:40] <jcoxon> PBH keeps on going...
[16:40] <futurity> Evening
[16:41] <Graeme_SHARP> About 3 miles out...
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[16:42] <Upu> anyone know the battery life on PBH ?
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[16:43] <nigelvh> Howdy all
[16:44] <griffonbot> @AnthonyStirk: @PBHVI Congratulations flight looks great, whats the battery life on the transmitters ? #ukhas [http://twitter.com/AnthonyStirk/status/184319803182419969]
[16:45] <navrac_> they hadnt dropped any ballast by this morning - may need to later tonight though
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[16:45] <Graeme_SHARP> Found by a member of the public
[16:46] <Graeme_SHARP> about 1 mile out. :)
[16:46] <Randomskk> oh lkucky
[16:46] <Graeme_SHARP> Hanging from a phone line
[16:46] <r2x0t> hah
[16:46] <r2x0t> better then power line
[16:48] <Upu> at least I think its a phon ZZKK!!***BANG!
[16:48] <priyesh> Upu: just letting you know that you've got a server error on http://ava.upuaut.net/tracker/track.php
[16:48] <r2x0t> PBH getting updates from APRS now
[16:49] <Upu> I'll fix that 2 mins priyesh
[16:49] <priyesh> :)
[16:49] <Upu> its out of date that tracker anyway
[16:49] <jcoxon> are people still following pbh on spacenear.us?
[16:49] <Upu> I am yes
[16:49] <priyesh> Upu: yeah
[16:49] <r2x0t> also predicted flight path updated: http://www.projectbluehorizon.com/#flight
[16:50] <jcoxon> okay i'll keep the script running
[16:50] <Upu> fixed priyesh
[16:50] <priyesh> thanks
[16:50] <Upu> its better than aprs for this
[16:52] <nigelvh> "Wrong password!"
[16:52] <eroomde> poor romania
[16:52] <Upu> though something just took a sweve
[16:52] <Upu> predictions aren't working for me on that site
[16:53] <eroomde> a big package owned by lockheed martin falls out of the sky and lands on them
[16:53] <eroomde> better hope it does stop over romania and not russia
[16:53] <Upu> could be worse could be china :)
[16:54] <eroomde> right bbl
[16:54] <r2x0t> in Romania, it will be stolen before anyone can get to it...
[16:54] <Upu> Russia will shoot it down
[16:59] <DeaneyBabey> Has SHARP Chase been driving at 88mph again?
[16:59] <DeaneyBabey> I swear they were in 2013 this morning, now 2017...
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[17:04] <mfa298> DeaneyBabey: With Rich's driving anything is possible.
[17:04] <eroomde> kml files have been known to incrominate people before when they've left the payload on in the car boot driving home
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[17:04] <eroomde> incriminate*
[17:05] <andrew_apex> Recovered!
[17:05] <daveake> well done :)
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[17:06] <daveake> eroomde My chase car update code seems to be reluctant to send speeds > 70mph. For some reason
[17:06] <jonsowman> andrew_apex: you didn't mentioned the 10km cutdown criterion
[17:06] <mfa298> well at least SHARP have the recovery part sorted.
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[17:07] <craag> eroomde: I've been done on APRS tracking. It must have been inaccuracies in my programming officer!
[17:07] <mfa298> I'm guessing they managed to fit the 1.21 jiggawatts and flux capacitor in the van.
[17:07] <Randomskk> happily neither admissible nor likely to lead to prosecution :P
[17:07] Nick change: SAIDias -> W0OTM
[17:08] <W0OTM> Howdy
[17:08] <DeaneyBabey> mfa298: lol
[17:14] <andrew_apex> Jonsowman: no one mentioned it to us either
[17:14] <jonsowman> andrew_apex: lol
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[17:15] <DeaneyBabey> probably something along the lines of: if(problems == 0 and flight time > 3600)
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[17:15] <W0OTM> can someone flush habhub cache?
[17:15] <mfa298> I almost started wondering if it still had the (if GPStime == 16:10) line in it
[17:16] <craag> DeaneyBabey: Hmm, given the issues with gpstime last time..
[17:16] <mfa298> But I think it triggered a bit before we reached that (assuming GPS was doing GMT still)
[17:16] <DeaneyBabey> for those who don't know 16:10 was the hard coded time for the first cutaway test of the tethered balloon
[17:17] <craag> Ah I see.
[17:17] <DeaneyBabey> but it was at least an hour early!
[17:17] <eroomde> exactly an hour early?
[17:17] <eroomde> ...
[17:17] <DeaneyBabey> it went at 15:10 GMT or thereabouts?
[17:17] <priyesh> lol
[17:18] <eroomde> about 15:50
[17:18] <DeaneyBabey> I was driving home and missed most the fun!
[17:18] <eroomde> random oclock
[17:18] <DeaneyBabey> probably not that then!
[17:19] <DeaneyBabey> I wonder if they still had the 500m fall criteria and what sort of error protection they wrote in
[17:19] <craag> Could losing gps lock, and therefore gps time, have triggered that line?
[17:19] <craag> But then I guess it would have happened yesterday.
[17:19] <DeaneyBabey> craag: I suspect it was something to do with a GPS error in altitude...
[17:20] <daveake> Losing lock doesn't lose time
[17:20] <DeaneyBabey> but thats just a guess
[17:20] <mfa298> I think yesterday didn't have the cutdown as it had triggered earlier by accident
[17:20] <mfa298> Hopefully the 16:10 line got removed from the code.
[17:20] <craag> daveake: The RTTY string lost time when the gps lock went yesterday though?
[17:21] <mfa298> although I wonder if the remote cutdown was active and got triggered somehow. I'm not sure quite what the test was. I think early on it might have just been a do we see some signal.
[17:22] <craag> mfa298: andrew told me it was watching for a RTTY string, somthing like "SHARP-KD"
[17:22] <Randomskk> KutDown?
[17:22] <craag> Yes, apparently a typo that made it into the code!
[17:23] <Randomskk> haha nice :D
[17:23] <mfa298> good one, security by obscurity
[17:24] <daveake> craag - That wasn't losing lock, that was th GPS deciding it was too high and not in flight mode
[17:24] <craag> Ah kk.
[17:25] <daveake> Not trying to pedantic, though probably succeeding :)
[17:26] <craag> Hopefully the logs will tell us what actually happened all the way up there!
[17:28] <NigeyS> Laurenceb: success!
[17:30] <andrew_apex> Error protection?
[17:30] <andrew_apex> Rich said it did exactly what it was programmed to.
[17:31] <DeaneyBabey> andrew_apex: which was?
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[17:34] <Upu> oh boy GPSL list is debating the record submission already
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[17:34] <Randomskk> haha
[17:34] <eroomde> what are the arguements for and against?
[17:34] <Randomskk> presumably this centres around them being "amateurs"?
[17:34] <eroomde> whether or not they're amateur? (my favourite)
[17:34] <Upu> mind you wait till the QRZ.com crowd realised there is a blatant disregard for local laws in the air above them
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[17:35] <Upu> Zp vs latex
[17:35] <Randomskk> aah
[17:35] <Randomskk> haha yes
[17:35] <eroomde> ah yes there should really be a demarkation
[17:35] <eroomde> they're not really comparable
[17:35] <Upu> and that is what people are saying
[17:36] <Upu> its entirely probably this one could circumnavigate the globe if it doesn't burst/leak and if the batteries last
[17:36] <Upu> be interested to know what batteries are i it
[17:36] <Upu> in it
[17:36] <eroomde> i thought it was out of ballast?
[17:36] <Upu> must be fairly sizable if its running 3 transmitters
[17:37] <Upu> no idea
[17:37] <eroomde> yeah it's an enormous balloon and the previous payloads have been sort of carry-on-lugge size
[17:37] <Upu> won't come down immediately over night thoough will it
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[17:38] <andrew_apex> Dodgy internet here...
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[17:56] <DeaneyBabey> Any SHARP people still about?
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[17:59] <andrew_apex> DeanyBabey: just leaving the landing site
[17:59] <DeaneyBabey> cool - did you guys find out what caused the cutdown?
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[18:02] Nick change: xfireguru -> xfire|afk
[18:06] <jcoxon> hey eroomde
[18:11] <jcoxon> ping navrac
[18:13] <navrac> hello james
[18:14] <jcoxon> hey
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[18:42] <DeaneyBabey> night all
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[19:00] <ajwillink> hate my internet
[19:00] <ajwillink> sorry to drop out
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[19:12] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[19:12] <Lunar_Lander> spacenear doesn't work
[19:12] <Lunar_Lander> firefox says it can't get a connection to spacenear.us/tracker
[19:13] <jcoxon> works for me
[19:13] <Lunar_Lander> hm ok
[19:13] <Lunar_Lander> even when I try the link on HabHub
[19:14] <nigelvh> Working for me.
[19:14] <mfa298> front page seemed to work for me but that might have been cached
[19:14] <LazyLeopard> Down for me. Down for http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/http://spacenear.us too.
[19:14] <jcoxon> actually
[19:15] <jcoxon> its down for me on another refresh
[19:15] <nigelvh> Yeah, failing now.
[19:15] <mfa298> tracker didn't work and ctrl-r on the front page doesn't work
[19:15] <jcoxon> ssh is still online
[19:16] F5MVO (52e6b25d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.230.178.93) joined #highaltitude.
[19:17] <Lunar_Lander> thanks jcoxon mfa298 LazyLeopard nigelvh
[19:17] <F5MVO> goog evening all
[19:18] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[19:18] <F5MVO> soory, good evening all
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[19:19] <Upu> evening F5MVO
[19:19] <jcoxon> back
[19:19] <Upu> picking up PBH ?
[19:19] <priyesh> spacenear.us is back
[19:19] <nigelvh> YAY
[19:20] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[19:20] <Lunar_Lander> OK cu tomorrow probably :)
[19:20] <Lunar_Lander> good night
[19:20] <Laurenceb_> PBH refuses to die
[19:20] <NigeyS> Laurenceb: :)
[19:20] <Laurenceb_> only lost a few Km
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[19:21] <Laurenceb_> have they dumped ballast?
[19:21] <nigelvh> jcoxon, are you running the spacenear.us server?
[19:21] <NigeyS> success with the ezcap
[19:21] <Laurenceb_> really?
[19:21] <Upu> natrium42 runs it nigelvh
[19:21] <Laurenceb_> using the osmocom software?
[19:21] <jcoxon> nigelvh, not me, but i have ssh access
[19:21] <F5MVO> PBH is inhabited ?
[19:21] <Laurenceb_> inhabited lol
[19:21] <jcoxon> F5MVO, no, but its a big balloon
[19:22] <Laurenceb_> NigeyS: what do you mean success?
[19:22] <nigelvh> Well, as a sysadmin, i might recomment moving to a non-standard ssh port. I frequently see the standard ssh ports spammed for sytstem accounts, or random passwords.
[19:22] <Laurenceb_> you have raw data file?
[19:22] <Randomskk> nigelvh: really though
[19:22] <NigeyS> Laurenceb: yup, and i used the fm demodulator flow blocks that were on the list for checking the out file
[19:22] <Laurenceb_> this is using gnu-radio?
[19:23] <Randomskk> you just only allow specific users and turn off password authentication
[19:23] <NigeyS> yup
[19:23] <F5MVO> its nice flight
[19:23] <Laurenceb_> sweet
[19:23] <nigelvh> Probably not a big deal as long as you're using strong passwords, but a good little extra step.
[19:23] <NigeyS> crap antenna though, so its a bit scratchy
[19:23] <Randomskk> you shouldn't be using passwords for ssh at all..
[19:23] <Laurenceb_> so have you received any 434mhz hab stuff?
[19:23] <Laurenceb_> hmmm
[19:23] <NigeyS> nah, i need to hook up a diff antenna for that
[19:24] <nigelvh> Yes, keys are preferred, but people still run passwords, so that's what it is.
[19:24] <NigeyS> it uses the weird mmcx connector
[19:24] <Laurenceb_> maybe we could interface directly to fldigi just using gnu-radio
[19:24] <Laurenceb_> ive never played with it
[19:24] <NigeyS> not sure tbh
[19:24] <Laurenceb_> i guess itd need a jack server
[19:24] Action: Laurenceb_ reads gnu-radio docs
[19:24] <F5MVO> have you JOEY info ?
[19:24] <nigelvh> Ideally you limit users, require keys, and limit to specific IPs/ranges.
[19:24] <NigeyS> haha have fun!
[19:25] <Randomskk> nigelvh: I'm not sure I'd limit to specific IPs, that's a total pain when you need to log in remotely. keys should really be secure enough
[19:25] <Randomskk> but once you have keys, using a non standard port is just annoying
[19:25] <Laurenceb_> http://gnuradio.org/redmine/projects/gnuradio/wiki/CompGrAudioJack
[19:25] <jonsowman> F5MVO: it's just me, testing
[19:25] <jonsowman> ignore it :)
[19:25] <Laurenceb_> looksd like its possible
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[19:25] <nigelvh> And moving to a different port gains a bit of security through obscurity. Then things won't show up in a lazy scan of port 22.
[19:25] <NigeyS> Randomskk: for the server admin i do we use combo of both keys and ip restriction via the cisco firewall
[19:26] <F5MVO> jonsowman, ok thanks
[19:26] <NigeyS> Laurenceb: oo!!
[19:26] <futurity> Hi, Just spotted JOEY on spacenear.us. Do we have another launch on today?
[19:26] <Randomskk> nigelvh: I don't think it really gains you anything
[19:26] <jonsowman> futurity: no, just me testing
[19:26] <Randomskk> jonsowman: see what you've done :P
[19:26] <Laurenceb_> NigeyS: ive never used gnu-radio
[19:26] <jonsowman> launching weds :)
[19:26] <NigeyS> its umm.. weird hehe
[19:26] <jonsowman> sorry Randomskk
[19:26] <Laurenceb_> NigeyS: is it all command line or is there a gui?
[19:26] <Randomskk> oh jonsowman I have like ten metres of EL wire in various colours
[19:26] <futurity> jonsowman: no problem. Just wanted to help out after missing today's earlier launch
[19:26] <Randomskk> could dangle it down from the payload
[19:26] <NigeyS> moving blocks around a flow diagram .. very odd
[19:26] <nigelvh> Well my logs say otherwise. On port 22, I got lots of attempts on my box, and moved away from there and the only accesses are me.
[19:26] <Laurenceb_> ah i see
[19:27] <Randomskk> nigelvh: sure, but I don't think any of those attempts will succeed
[19:27] <Laurenceb_> NigeyS: so im guessing itd just be a matter of "custructing" something
[19:27] <futurity> Do you know what time roughly Wednesday? I hope to be around
[19:27] <Randomskk> meh, it doesn't make much odds
[19:27] <futurity> for tracking
[19:27] <Laurenceb_> for fl0digi interfacre
[19:27] <Randomskk> futurity: all the details are in the ukhas email, but
[19:27] <NigeyS> pretty much yeah
[19:27] <Randomskk> around 11 and 2
[19:27] <Laurenceb_> awesome
[19:27] <Randomskk> or 12 and 3
[19:27] <Randomskk> or something. ISH.
[19:27] <Laurenceb_> now i just need a dongle :S
[19:27] <nigelvh> Yes, they are unlikely, Another step in front of them is good, and moving to a different port is trivial, both in configuration, and connection.
[19:27] <Randomskk> I guess
[19:27] <NigeyS> theres alot of work going on on that sdr list to to get some proper software done, so its looking hopeful
[19:28] <Laurenceb_> ill ring post office tomorrow to see if they have it and didnt drop off a "you were out" notice
[19:28] <Laurenceb_> it should have turned up by now :(
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[19:28] <NigeyS> also a sch of a lna for it .. although he recommends not using it yet, refining component values
[19:28] <futurity> Randomskk: thanks i'll go check out the email ;)
[19:28] <Laurenceb_> oh
[19:28] <nigelvh> Generally I don't limit by IP, but I do only have a limited number of boxes in the DC available via SSH and work through there.
[19:28] <Laurenceb_> i have a roll of RFMD lnas
[19:28] <Laurenceb_> crazy low noise figure
[19:28] <NigeyS> ooo
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[19:28] <Laurenceb_> i need to do a pcb
[19:29] <Laurenceb_> they are a pita to dead bug and tent to oscillate at ~3GHz
[19:29] <NigeyS> https://github.com/loxodes/rtl-sdr-lna
[19:30] <Laurenceb_> theres no bias down the coax then
[19:30] <Laurenceb_> it seems...
[19:31] <pjm> i measured it today, looks like input is cap coupled
[19:31] <Laurenceb_> ok
[19:31] <Laurenceb_> on the pcb?
[19:31] <pjm> but a L + C + 100ohm R would fix that
[19:31] <pjm> yeah
[19:32] <Laurenceb_> yeah thats what i did on cc1020
[19:32] <Laurenceb_> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:chipcon_cc1020_software_define_radio if you havent already seen it
[19:32] Action: pjm looks
[19:32] <NigeyS> Laurenceb: im using this 1 thats on the list .. http://www.nigey.co.uk/rtl2832-fm.grc.png
[19:32] <NigeyS> in gnuradio
[19:32] <Laurenceb_> sweet
[19:33] <Laurenceb_> i like that
[19:33] <NigeyS> radio1 still sounds crap mind lol
[19:33] <Laurenceb_> so that goes to your speakers?
[19:33] <NigeyS> itll gen a wav file
[19:33] <Laurenceb_> ah
[19:34] <Laurenceb_> ok, just make the file a named pipe
[19:34] <Laurenceb_> and open with fldigi
[19:34] <NigeyS> ive not sussed out real time playback, if thats at all possible ?
[19:34] <Laurenceb_> it should be possible with a named pipe
[19:34] <Laurenceb_> on the output.. not sure about the input
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[19:35] <Laurenceb_> also named pipes tend to break with fldigi unless you use the modified version on my github
[19:35] <pjm> very interesting!
[19:35] <NigeyS> yeah its the input thats a pain, and id definately recommend the out file being a ramdisk as they note
[19:35] <Laurenceb_> but it shouldnt be an issue as gnuradio supports JACK
[19:35] <NigeyS> true
[19:35] <Laurenceb_> and fldigi can connect to a JACK server
[19:35] <SpeedEvil> NigeyS: you mean FM?
[19:35] <NigeyS> yeah SpeedEvil
[19:36] Action: SpeedEvil keeps meaning to read up on if the OFDM decoder is supoprted - for DAB
[19:36] <NigeyS> ofdm ?
[19:36] <Laurenceb_> i think its in the kernel sources
[19:36] <Laurenceb_> or whatever
[19:36] <Laurenceb_> the linux driver source stuff :P
[19:36] <SpeedEvil> Orthogonal Frequency Division Multiplexing
[19:36] <SpeedEvil> hmm
[19:36] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[19:36] <SpeedEvil> As used by DAB
[19:36] <NigeyS> ohh
[19:37] <Laurenceb_> it will do OFDM QAM decoding in hardware
[19:37] <SpeedEvil> It's a cunning method of seperating a plurality of carriers without them interfering at all
[19:37] <Laurenceb_> on the relatec thingy
[19:37] <Laurenceb_> and you can set the QAM constellation iirc
[19:38] <NigeyS> ah yes, i remember from doing some work with mumudvb
[19:38] <Laurenceb_> i dont know if that always has to be followed by the bit edge tracker and header sync stuff...
[19:38] <SpeedEvil> hmm
[19:38] <Laurenceb_> or if you can make a custom hardware accelerated OFDM QAM receiver
[19:38] <SpeedEvil> I was more meaning using it for actual DAB.
[19:38] Action: SpeedEvil goes to google.
[19:38] <Laurenceb_> oh lol
[19:38] <NigeyS> well seems like this cheap as chips thingie has potential anyhow :D
[19:38] <Laurenceb_> plug it in and it works :P
[19:39] <SpeedEvil> I want to reterofit my radio with a Pi
[19:39] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: UInder linux?
[19:39] <Laurenceb_> just grap vlc or whatever
[19:39] <Laurenceb_> iirc yes
[19:39] <SpeedEvil> Oh - right - awesome.
[19:39] <Laurenceb_> theres a driver for it
[19:39] <Laurenceb_> most of the heavy lifting is handled on the realtec thingy
[19:39] <Laurenceb_> it does bit syncronisation and stuff
[19:39] <Laurenceb_> more or less an MPEG stream out iirc
[19:40] <Laurenceb_> and it PLLs onto the carrier(s)
[19:41] <Laurenceb_> also, raspberry pi.. whats that
[19:41] <NigeyS> hehe "Delayed" :p
[19:41] <Laurenceb_> does anyone actually have one
[19:41] <NigeyS> dont think so
[19:42] <NigeyS> only the 1's they kept from the initial batch to send out to the os developer people n stuff
[19:42] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[19:43] <NigeyS> was looking at a vid of qt5 running on it, pretty bloody impressive
[19:43] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: yeah.
[19:44] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: Most of the itneresting stuff - to me - is just as a linux box with a reasonable community
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[19:45] <Laurenceb_> lol - to exceed the distance record PBH will have to fly to Iran
[19:46] <NigeyS> hah sod that, icbm at 12oclock :p
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[19:47] <Laurenceb_> its very slow
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[19:47] <NigeyS> not got the tracker up, whats its current speed does aprs give it ?
[19:48] <Upu> 133km/h
[19:48] <NigeyS> hrm thats is a bit slow for the jetstream ?
[19:48] <jcoxon> its not in the JS
[19:48] <jcoxon> JS is lower
[19:48] <Laurenceb_> its above
[19:49] <NigeyS> ah oki
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[19:54] <Laurenceb_> wheres the aprs?
[19:55] <jcoxon> azores
[19:59] <Laurenceb_> i mean the aprs page with tracker id
[20:03] <gonzo_> did the SHARP crew make a recovery?
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[20:07] <Upu> member of the public found it
[20:07] <Upu> http://aprs.fi/#!mt=roadmap&z=5&call=a%2FKD2AUC-1&timerange=172800
[20:07] <fsphil> wonder if they'll try again
[20:07] <fsphil> third time lucky
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[20:07] <Upu> they want to launch on Sat
[20:07] <Upu> but we will just launch oo before 2pm and we shouldn't clash
[20:08] <fsphil-laptop> hah
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[20:29] Nick change: daveake -> grumpy_dave_no_a
[20:29] <grumpy_dave_no_a> fail
[20:29] Nick change: grumpy_dave_no_a -> daveake
[20:29] <andrew_apex> Back in Southampton with the payload :)
[20:29] Action: daveake has no adsl
[20:29] <daveake> :)
[20:29] <daveake> How was the telephone line
[20:29] <daveake> ?
[20:30] <andrew_apex> No problem - the parachute just needed nudging off with a pole
[20:30] <fsphil> whoops
[20:30] <daveake> :)
[20:30] <daveake> So you didn't break my ADSL then? :p
[20:30] <andrew_apex> Nope :D
[20:31] <daveake> I've had a happy time proving it's a BT fault
[20:31] <daveake> Anyhoo, what's the story on the cutdown?
[20:31] <fsphil> it's never BTs fault
[20:32] <daveake> It is when I've tried 2 routers and 2 line filters with same result
[20:33] <andrew_apex> There was a software error that caused it to fire at 10k
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[20:33] <andrew_apex> So I did exactly what it was programmed to do
[20:33] <Randomskk> oops :P
[20:33] <daveake> I hate calling for "support". Best one was Dell: "What operating system are you using?" Me: "What does it matter when there's smoke pouring out the back?!"
[20:33] <Randomskk> at least you tested the cutdown
[20:33] Action: kristianpaul wonders if there are programable LNA's
[20:33] <andrew_apex> We got it back, got good photos, and tested the cutdown
[20:33] <daveake> And unlike the test, it missed the ground :p
[20:34] <andrew_apex> Do not too bad a flight :)
[20:34] <craag> daveake: LOL
[20:35] <andrew_apex> Although the radio seemed slightly less good than yesterday - anyone agree?
[20:35] <jonsowman> andrew_apex: what was the bug?
[20:35] <daveake> I grabbed some screen images from fldigi showing some really wierd things
[20:36] <andrew_apex> Jonsowman: it fires the cutdown when falling to cut away the burst balloon - it thought it was falling...
[20:36] <jonsowman> what was the "i'm falling" criteria?
[20:37] <andrew_apex> Falling over 500m per minute for three minutes in a row
[20:37] <andrew_apex> However that obviously wasn't the case
[20:38] <daveake> andrew_apex rtty frequency wierdness - http://i.imgur.com/ov4lM.png and http://i.imgur.com/4TvW7.png
[20:39] <jonsowman> andrew_apex: so what happened?
[20:39] <andrew_apex> Jonsowman: haven't looked at the log or code yet
[20:39] <jonsowman> okay
[20:39] <jonsowman> )
[20:39] <jonsowman> :)
[20:39] <jcoxon> PBH starting to descend
[20:40] <andrew_apex> Daveake: I think that was due to the 3v3 rail changing voltage
[20:40] <andrew_apex> But no ideas why
[20:40] <andrew_apex> Possibly something drawing loads of current and loading down the reg
[20:41] <daveake> That's what we were discussing at the time
[20:41] <andrew_apex> This payload is seriously power hungry! 0.6A at 5v...
[20:42] <andrew_apex> (Max)
[20:42] <jonsowman> :o
[20:42] <jonsowman> wow
[20:43] <andrew_apex> Yeah... I'm wondering if there's a problem somewhere - it was built by non electronics people :P
[20:43] <andrew_apex> I only helped with the transceiver module wiring - and that's 50ma max or so
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[20:50] <LazyLeopard> Hmmm... Wonder not whether there's a problem; wonder, rather, where the problem is... ;)
[20:50] <daveake> Actually ... if the 3V3 comes down then the signal to the NTX2 goes down so the frequency goes down.
[20:50] <daveake> However those glitches in my shots were the other way
[20:50] <r2x0t> power it on the ground, hook it up to scope and watch 3.3V
[20:50] <mfa298> some of the cabling was a bit suspect when I saw it a couple of weeks ago.
[20:51] <LazyLeopard> There were some seriously weird bits of frequency wobble yesterday in the later stages of descent too.
[20:51] <mfa298> along the lines of 2cm of insulation removed to connect some of the wires
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[20:52] <Randomskk> I wonder if that was it trying to fire the cutdown multiple times
[20:53] <andrew_apex> Yeah, it seems spikes on the 3v3 rail
[20:53] <andrew_apex> So something big turning off
[20:53] <r2x0t> maybe cutdown wires got shorted?
[20:53] <r2x0t> so it tried to power it from time to time
[20:53] <andrew_apex> It was doing that while the Citroen was connected
[20:53] <daveake> But the cutdown was absent on the previous launch and that had glitches too
[20:53] <andrew_apex> *cutdown
[20:53] <Matt_soton> is sharp launching next weekend?
[20:54] <andrew_apex> Did the previous? I didn't see that
[20:54] <andrew_apex> Matt: hopefully
[20:54] <daveake> I saw one funny; others said they saw some too
[20:54] <daveake> Today I was watching more
[20:55] <andrew_apex> Very odd
[20:55] <daveake> Suggest someone gets nominated to record the rtty audio next time
[20:55] <mfa298> I saw one big jump yesterday. Which I think was the other way and more distinct they the ones daveake captured
[20:56] <mfa298> didn't get a screenshot though.
[20:56] <andrew_apex> I saw lots today...
[20:56] <andrew_apex> Maybe just some big caps on the tc module...
[20:56] <andrew_apex> *tx
[20:57] <mfa298> I think it was a couple of hndred hz shift down yesterday and i think for a bit longer. probably around 1/3 of the total tx
[20:57] <daveake> NTX2?
[20:57] <mfa298> I can imagine a big cap on the tx module and maybe something similar for the cutdown (if it doesn't already)
[20:58] <andrew_apex> NiM2
[20:58] <daveake> OK. Well I'd want a scope on the power and signal lines to that
[20:58] <LazyLeopard> Two different effects yesterday: 1) A single jump in frequency, and 2) back-and-forth changes in frequency, but not as clean as the jump.
[20:58] <andrew_apex> Daveake - yup
[20:59] <daveake> Yeah my first pic had a shift (for longer than I managed to get in the screenshot)
[21:00] <LazyLeopard> Three different effects today: 1) and 2) as above, and 3) a random series of short-duration jumps in frequency.
[21:02] Action: mfa298 wonders if a good test might be to hang the payload off a tall building and set it swinging and see if the signal stays stable.
[21:02] <mfa298> at least that might show if it's a movement thing.
[21:02] <r2x0t> any test is better then no testing at all
[21:04] <LazyLeopard> There were also the usual swinging/spinning-payload effects, but they were at most a tenth as severe.
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[21:11] <r2x0t> PBH is started dive early... yesterday it was still stable at high altitude at this time
[21:12] <fsphil> sunset is sooner the further east it is
[21:12] <r2x0t> ah yes
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[21:13] <fsphil> I must have a listen for it when I get home, it should be detectable now
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[21:30] <Randomskk> :D wombat is sitting in the fridge
[21:30] <Randomskk> chilling out :P
[21:36] Nick change: xfire|afk -> xfireguru
[21:37] <Morseman> Randomskk how long does Wombat meat save in the freezer? ;-)
[21:37] <Randomskk> Morseman: it should last ages ;D
[21:37] <Randomskk> I actually want to learn taxidermy and then make the best ever case for wombat
[21:38] <jonsowman> grim
[21:38] <NigeyS> lol
[21:38] <Randomskk> especially when it lands after being at -40C in someone's garden
[21:38] <Randomskk> or in like
[21:38] <Randomskk> a play park
[21:38] <Randomskk> oh god
[21:38] <Morseman> When I was little one of my favourite stories was "The Muddle Headed Wombat"
[21:38] <jonsowman> joey is outside on my car roof
[21:38] <Randomskk> the fridge is boring, brb relocating to freezer
[21:38] <jonsowman> seems to have stabilised
[21:39] <NigeyS> you have a kangaroo on ure car roof, thats gonna get some odd looks ;)
[21:39] <jonsowman> lol
[21:39] <jonsowman> has drifted by 2kHz from being inside
[21:39] <jonsowman> also this is with no insulation whatsoever
[21:39] <Morseman> In Aus arn't the bumpers called "Roo Bars"?
[21:39] <NigeyS> thats not to bad then
[21:39] <Randomskk> this is more like it
[21:40] <Randomskk> getting properly cold now
[21:40] <NigeyS> Morseman: something along those lines
[21:41] <Morseman> Anyone considered GPSDO locking from the GPS that gives the location of the payload?
[21:41] <Laurenceb_> 16mph
[21:41] <Laurenceb_> its going to have to go faster than that
[21:42] <Morseman> What's 16mph Laurenceb_ ?
[21:42] <Laurenceb_> pbh speed
[21:42] <Morseman> AH - OK I'll reload the tracker
[21:42] <Laurenceb_> Randomskk: does the pll lock?
[21:43] <Randomskk> Laurenceb_: wombat?
[21:43] <Randomskk> yes
[21:43] <Laurenceb_> Morseman:http://aprs.fi/#!mt=roadmap&z=7&call=a%2FKD2AUC-1&timerange=432000
[21:43] <Randomskk> it's being much much much better behaved
[21:43] <Laurenceb_> what was the issue?
[21:43] <Randomskk> I think it was that I was using a 22nH inductor where 19nH would be preferable
[21:43] <Laurenceb_> ah
[21:43] <Randomskk> and I was using one of the bulk ones instead of a wirewound
[21:43] <Randomskk> so lower Q
[21:43] <Laurenceb_> something else to consider: inductor tolerance is quite bad
[21:43] <Randomskk> yea, especially with those bulk ones
[21:43] <Laurenceb_> unless you get the expensive ones
[21:43] <Randomskk> wombat's down to 1 degree C
[21:43] <Laurenceb_> the murata ones are nice
[21:44] <Randomskk> about 400Hz drift from 25C
[21:44] <Laurenceb_> but there are issues with supplies after japan quake
[21:44] <Randomskk> indeed
[21:44] <Randomskk> murata one in there now
[21:44] <jonsowman> Randomskk: that's significantly better than joey
[21:44] <Randomskk> 0.00C
[21:44] <Randomskk> yay -
[21:44] <Randomskk> 0.06 :P
[21:45] <Randomskk> I wonder how cold my freezer is
[21:45] <Randomskk> I guess down a few degrees
[21:45] <Randomskk> not sure I can get any colder at home
[21:46] <Randomskk> -2C
[21:46] <Randomskk> it's being really quite surprisingly good
[21:46] <jonsowman> i'm impressed
[21:46] <daveake> Does it have a "Quick Freeze" switch? That can help
[21:46] <Randomskk> maybe the radio has a higher thermal mass than the temp sensor
[21:46] <BrainDamage> how long does it have to be sustained? because spray cans can give you quite some cooling
[21:46] <Morseman> I'll close my eyes and try to forget that I used to care about APRS and digipeating and how people used to cock it up!
[21:46] <NigeyS> mine was -18 when i had picochu in there last week
[21:46] <Randomskk> NigeyS: blimey
[21:46] <Randomskk> hmm
[21:47] <Randomskk> atm it's in the freezer part of the fridge/freezer
[21:47] <Randomskk> but there is the outdoors freezer
[21:47] <Randomskk> which is bigger and so perhaps colder
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[21:47] <daveake> yep
[21:47] <NigeyS> ahh they always run about -5 max i think
[21:47] <Randomskk> down to -3
[21:47] <Randomskk> I'll let it stabalise and then move to big freezer
[21:47] <NigeyS> a chest freezer with turbo freeze would be fun
[21:48] <Morseman> I plan to fly APRS someday with NO digis in the path at all...
[21:48] <BrainDamage> like SpeedEvil's body storage device with -40°C turbo mode?
[21:48] <NigeyS> haha yes!
[21:48] <BrainDamage> btw, something to consider: spray a can of compressed air, tilted, directly on the part
[21:49] <BrainDamage> the fluorine compounds have a boiling point between -30 and -50°C
[21:49] <NigeyS> with my soldering? it'd probably blow the part off lol
[21:49] <Morseman> Is PBH on 300 or 1200 baud?
[21:49] <BrainDamage> this way you can do strong localized cooling
[21:49] <Morseman> I'd guess 1200 from the fequency in use
[21:49] <BrainDamage> alternatively, build an hilsh vortex tube
[21:49] <NigeyS> i think 1200 Morseman
[21:49] <Morseman> That's what I guessed NigeyS
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> i got to -25C with a peltier and an pc power supply
[21:50] <NigeyS> BrainDamage: or a shed load of co2 blocks !
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> but pc supplies at 12v, and the big peltiers are 16v
[21:50] <Randomskk> Laurenceb_: how did you heatsink?
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> at least the one i had was
[21:50] <BrainDamage> unfortunately, dry ice is not easily available here
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> Randomskk: some big alu extrusion
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> and 16 cpu fans
[21:51] <NigeyS> 16...ffs lol
[21:51] <Randomskk> haha
[21:51] <Laurenceb_> about 30cm square heatsink
[21:51] <Laurenceb_> then blue foam on the other side
[21:51] <Laurenceb_> but yeah with 16v supply i should have hit ~ -50C
[21:51] <Laurenceb_> room was ~20C
[21:51] <Randomskk> nice
[21:52] <Randomskk> wombat is down to -5 now
[21:52] <Laurenceb_> i cant find any easily available 16V, high current supplies
[21:52] <Morseman> What sort of altitude would that be Randomskk ?
[21:53] <Randomskk> depends
[21:53] <Randomskk> and, dunno
[21:53] <Morseman> Give, or take a bit...
[21:53] <BrainDamage> most of cheap peltiers I've seen are rated for 60K deltaT max
[21:53] <BrainDamage> did you stack multiple, or was the peltier simply a better one?
[21:53] <Randomskk> dunno, 10k? 20k? the temperature is a bit weird
[21:54] <Laurenceb_> must have been a little better
[21:54] <Randomskk> 750Hz shift over 30C change
[21:54] <NigeyS> lemme check what temps were on picochu-2 think -5 is around 3.5 4k
[21:54] <Laurenceb_> but i only got 45C delta
[21:55] <Morseman> Trying to decide what sensors would be useful on a one-man type payload where weight and reliability is all
[21:55] <Laurenceb_> im expropolating as i was seeing better than expected to 60C max delta
[21:55] <Randomskk> temperature sensor doesn't weigh much
[21:56] <Morseman> There's no point in releating what everyone already knows, I guess?
[21:56] <Morseman> repeating
[21:57] <Morseman> But what does a temperature sensor tell you Randomskk unless there's an inversion?
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[21:57] <Randomskk> well in my case I can use it to temperature compensate the radio
[21:58] <Randomskk> curious. decodability is dropping now it's -5C
[21:58] <Randomskk> significantly in fact
[21:58] <Randomskk> signal level is still very strong though
[21:58] <Morseman> True, I guess...
[21:58] <Randomskk> probably still be ok on 50 baud
[21:58] <Randomskk> but this is now basically undecodable. interesting.
[21:59] <Morseman> As long at the sensor feeds a feedback loop I guess?
[21:59] <jonsowman> i need an antenna for joey
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[22:00] <NigeyS> whats the drift been like Randomskk ?
[22:00] <Randomskk> NigeyS: 750Hz from 25C to -5C
[22:00] <Morseman> Randomskk Could it be that the junctions of the FET/transistors are breaking down at that temp?
[22:00] <Randomskk> Morseman: I very much doubt it
[22:00] <Randomskk> all the parts are rated to -40C
[22:00] <Morseman> OK
[22:01] <Randomskk> I wonder if the battery is being sad.
[22:01] <Randomskk> NigeyS: however by -5C decodability has become really bad
[22:01] <Morseman> So what is temp dependent to -5 then?
[22:01] <Randomskk> the lipo is certainly one candidate
[22:01] <Morseman> AH.. Batteries!
[22:02] <NigeyS> ouch, well i can go by experience lipos HATE the cold, 7k -15 .. froze :|
[22:02] <Randomskk> yea
[22:02] <Morseman> Maybe the next thing is warming for batteries as wella
[22:02] <Randomskk> I wonder if a lipo is not such a great idea. then again with insulation it'l be okay
[22:02] <Randomskk> well it might be okay.
[22:02] <Randomskk> it's at -6C now and struggling to decode 300 baud
[22:02] <Morseman> as or instead of crystals?
[22:03] <Randomskk> Morseman: or just use batteries that cope better with the cold, like lithiums
[22:03] <Morseman> True
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[22:03] <Morseman> Don't they fall off a voltage cliff when discharged like Nicads though?
[22:05] <Morseman> Always a problem for 11kV substation switching when trying to get a system that would last a while without mains power...
[22:06] <Upu> interesting PBH has an "abort" mechanism
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[22:07] <Morseman> OOK, has it been invoked then?
[22:07] <Upu> https://twitter.com/#!/PBHVI/status/183839024455221250/photo/1
[22:07] <fsphil-laptop> they aborted last time
[22:07] <Upu> seem pretty serious about it as they have redundant ones
[22:08] <Upu> put money they pull the plug if it goes near Russian airspace
[22:08] <nigelvh> I suppose I haven't thoroughly tested it, but I've used lipos on my flights and they seem to do fine.
[22:09] <Morseman> 3 x abort options from that diagram
[22:09] <Laurenceb_> lol @ PBH takeoff location
[22:09] <Laurenceb_> sat photo looks suspiciously blurred
[22:10] <Upu> yeah
[22:11] <Randomskk> wombat seems to be doing a little bit better now that it's stabilised at -5
[22:11] <Randomskk> mostly gettin decodes
[22:12] <Randomskk> time to move it into the colder freezer :P
[22:12] <Morseman> given up on the HF and APRS signals - I don't think they will be strong here through the SSB and 30M stuff let alone any APRS FM on non-standard EU APRS frequencies
[22:13] <Randomskk> hehe letting it warm up first
[22:14] <navrac> im not keen on lipos, the loss of capacity at low temps is always glossed over in the datasheets and try to charge them at below 5 degrees and its goodnighy
[22:14] <Randomskk> but they are so convenient :3
[22:14] <Morseman> That's just mean Randomskk It'll get a bit of warm and then back into the freezer...
[22:14] <Randomskk> I am thinking hard about swapping to a battery pack of lithiums though
[22:14] <jonsowman> me too in that case
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[22:15] <navrac> I know - ive looked at heated blankets etc but whatever I do they just dont stack up
[22:15] <Randomskk> how many battery packs of lithiums do we have?
[22:15] <jonsowman> no 3XAA(A) packs
[22:15] <Randomskk> none?
[22:15] <jonsowman> *holders
[22:15] <jonsowman> i couldn't find any
[22:15] <Randomskk> how about 4? 4 would work
[22:15] <Randomskk> we should maybe get some
[22:15] <jonsowman> we've got 4s
[22:15] <jonsowman> and ed bought a load of new lithiums a while back
[22:16] <Randomskk> yea
[22:16] <Randomskk> we have 4s?
[22:16] <Randomskk> like, several?
[22:16] <jonsowman> yes
[22:16] <Randomskk> ok
[22:16] <Randomskk> maybe use those
[22:17] <jonsowman> yeah
[22:17] <nigelvh> Perhaps my payloads run warmer. Generally don't get below -10C.
[22:17] <navrac> Ive walked in half way thru this conversation - are you discussing battery packs at low temps
[22:17] <jonsowman> yes
[22:17] <nigelvh> Yes.
[22:17] <Morseman> What's the issue with Lithium batteries
[22:18] <Morseman> ?
[22:18] <navrac> I spent hours looking at this as I really wanted something rechargeable to work with solar
[22:18] <nigelvh> Also I use large batteries (2000mAh, so a good bit of spare capacity and a good bit of thermal mass).
[22:18] <navrac> to be honest as much as it irritated me energiser lithiums offered the best bang per gram by a long chalk
[22:19] <Morseman> I think I had some lithium batteries for my FT817
[22:19] <nigelvh> Yeah, we're a bit less concerned about weight with our payloads. I generally aim for under a pound for mine.
[22:20] <navrac> At lower (-10 to -15) the capacity of standardf lipos falls to at best 60% of rated capacity
[22:20] <navrac> even if you use them as primary cells ( ie dont recharge) the enegisers still beat them
[22:21] <Morseman> navrac rechargeable seems to need long "off" times from what I can make out
[22:21] <nigelvh> No, we've used real primary cells
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[22:21] <nigelvh> Though those aren't light either
[22:22] <nigelvh> But 10Ah in a D size battery is nice.
[22:23] <navrac> well there are various lithium - but some only like to provide trickle power <20mA to give the rated capacity
[22:23] <Morseman> recharging or voltage uplift is always going to be a problem though? Especially if the temperature of the system is going lower...
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[22:24] <daveake> It's a bit retro, but I've added a little LCD to my car PC to put important HAB information in clear view - http://i42.tinypic.com/ct43p.jpg
[22:24] <navrac> I was working on using solar to heat lithium cells t obeing them to >5 degrees to allow them to charge
[22:24] <Randomskk> daveake: sweet :D
[22:24] <Randomskk> what's running it / where's the info from?
[22:24] <fsphil-laptop> daveake, 10 hab points
[22:25] <daveake> :)
[22:25] <navrac> retro - but #well cool'
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[22:25] <navrac> is this getting output from fldigi?
[22:26] <daveake> It's a 128x64 LCD with a serial controller. I've built circuits with these before and done the coding the hard way, but this was bought complete (well I had to solder the display to the controller, but that's all)
[22:26] <daveake> So that connects to a USB serial converter with 3V3 levels
[22:27] <navrac> +20 hab points if you canbuild it into the car dash so it looks like a factory fitted option
[22:27] <daveake> So from the PC I can send commands in a VT100-stylee command set
[22:27] <daveake> navrac that IS the plan :)
[22:27] <daveake> It fits in one of the dash vents
[22:27] <Randomskk> daveake: you need to put bearing-to-payload on ;)
[22:27] <navrac> dont need this heating/aircon stuff in the car - more important to have a hab display
[22:28] <Randomskk> so that you can just navigate right to it
[22:28] <daveake> The commands come from a program wot I rote, that listens to the telemetry via a port that dl-fldigi opens
[22:28] <Randomskk> unless that's one of the dials...
[22:28] <daveake> Randomskk that's the dial at top-left
[22:28] <daveake> lol
[22:28] <Randomskk> nice :D
[22:28] <Randomskk> hah too cool
[22:28] <daveake> The lower dial is where the payload is headed
[22:28] <navrac> fldigi opens a port? tell me more dave
[22:28] <daveake> It opens several. I ran netstat to find out which ones.
[22:29] <daveake> Then I just opened the first one and there was the decoded telemetry :)
[22:29] <daveake> Who needs documentation? :p
[22:29] <Randomskk> :P
[22:29] <navrac> really? that is well cool
[22:29] <navrac> guess what I'm going to be doing tomorrow then
[22:29] <daveake> Well I did ask around at the time but no-one seemed to know so I just tried it
[22:30] <navrac> and it just spits out the data?
[22:30] <daveake> yep
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[22:31] <navrac> someone launch a balloon please so i can check the outputs from fldigi please
[22:31] <daveake> port 7322
[22:31] <daveake> Just connect with telnet or putty or something
[22:31] <navrac> excellent - thanks - I was wondering about how to do that
[22:31] <daveake> You then have to do the parsing, checksum checks etc
[22:32] <daveake> Maybe there's a better way but this is what I found
[22:32] <navrac> yeah but thats just regular stuff
[22:32] <daveake> Sure
[22:32] <jonsowman> guys, what nav mode do you set your ubloxes to?
[22:32] <jonsowman> 1g/2g/4g?
[22:32] <navrac> having something to parse is the biggy
[22:32] <daveake> yep
[22:33] <Randomskk> navrac: get a second computer/laptop
[22:33] <Randomskk> load fldigi
[22:33] <Randomskk> transmit rtty out speakers
[22:33] <Randomskk> listen on first computer's microphone
[22:33] <Randomskk> :3
[22:33] <daveake> If the code is for your payload then of course you know what to expect. Otherwise you need some config to handle different formats, as of course dl-fldigi does to some extent and the habitat system does fully
[22:33] <Morseman> Anyone tell me what multiple tracking helps with? Other than 1st, during and last tracking? Thanks
[22:34] <gonzo_> jonsowman, the setups that number10 sent me the other day is <1g
[22:34] <jonsowman> gonzo_: right, thanks
[22:34] <Randomskk> Morseman: ?
[22:34] <Morseman> and if during is multiple, what help is that?
[22:35] <navrac> I'll just fire ozzie2 up - does it put out the whole string dave or the bit that fldigi understands and decodes - lat/long/dist/bearing/alt
[22:35] <daveake> navrac btw do this on the PC dl-fldigi is running on. IIRC it doesn't allow connections from other machines on the network
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[22:35] <daveake> Everything
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[22:35] <Morseman> Randomskk thinking that multiple tracking isn't going to be a lot of use if flight is in range of a few people anyway
[22:36] <Randomskk> what do you mean by multiple tracking?
[22:36] <Randomskk> as in, more than one transmitter?
[22:37] <Morseman> Well, what I've seen so far, apart from 1 ballon where I was "lucky" enough to post one or two final posts most times my reports are just duplicates
[22:38] <Randomskk> oh, you mean as in multiple people listening to the thing?
[22:38] <Randomskk> well it's just to ensure that as many packets as possible are correctly received
[22:38] <Morseman> Yes, and all reporting same reception reports
[22:38] <Randomskk> they can't report different things
[22:38] <fsphil-laptop> I'm normally the only person tracking my payload when it's near the ground
[22:39] <Morseman> And what does that add iff all report the same thing?
[22:39] <Randomskk> it's because any one person could stop receiving -- local interference, out of their radio reception, local issues like a power cut, whatever
[22:39] <Randomskk> Morseman: they all have to be reporting the same thing, it's not like the payload can transmit different information to each of them
[22:39] <Randomskk> it adds redundancy to the system
[22:39] <Randomskk> so that it's more likely we receive more packets
[22:39] <Morseman> Randomskk There's people who are better placed than me though
[22:39] <fsphil-laptop> particularly important for images
[22:39] <Randomskk> and also because why not? each person can listen if they want, or not
[22:40] <Randomskk> we're hardly going to say "only one listener allowed"
[22:40] <Morseman> fsphil-laptop not seen any images here yet
[22:40] <r2x0t> also it's nice to be able to say: currently 20 people are receiving my baloon... yay!
[22:41] <fsphil-laptop> yea there hasn't been an ssdv flight in a while
[22:41] <fsphil-laptop> must fix that
[22:41] <r2x0t> images will come with higher rate modems
[22:41] <craag> And means someone launching doesn't nessesarily have to own a receiver..
[22:41] <Morseman> r2x0t that might be nice, but I can leave Upu to do it all for me as he is much better placed than I am
[22:42] <fsphil-laptop> craag, well they always should :)
[22:42] <r2x0t> Morseman: good for you
[22:42] <Randomskk> but it does help if you want to get in the car and get chasing for someone else to be reliably receiving :P
[22:42] <Randomskk> r2x0t: images already happen :P
[22:42] <fsphil-laptop> images over 300 baud ftw :)
[22:43] <Morseman> And I bet Upu would get images as well, so I guess the
[22:43] <Morseman> question is "why do you need me?"
[22:43] <gonzo_> though the maths says it should work, it's stiull a thrill to listen directly to a flee-power signal from 1900's of miles away
[22:43] <gonzo_> (and a fed miled up)
[22:43] <Randomskk> for the times when you are the nearest person to the balloon's descent and so get the vital last few packets :P
[22:43] <Randomskk> also because it's hopefully fun for you
[22:44] <Morseman> r2x0t OK so I'll go and do something else instead then. TA
[22:45] <r2x0t> It will be interesting to see some high rate tests, maybe as secondary payload
[22:45] <r2x0t> like 128kbit
[22:45] <fsphil-laptop> I hope that works
[22:46] <r2x0t> will need SDR and good antenna tho
[22:46] <gonzo_> at 10mw erp!
[22:46] <fsphil-laptop> heck I'd be happy with 1200 baud
[22:46] <fsphil-laptop> (which has been done)
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[22:46] <fsphil-laptop> (just)
[22:46] <r2x0t> up to 9600Bd viterbi coded will be here soon... that's my first planned modulation standard
[22:47] <Morseman> r2x0t AH, now we are getting near high speed data and, yes, I do have a couple of SDR and do know how to put up antennas, thanks for asking...
[22:47] <r2x0t> 300-19200 GMSK, raw data rate 50-9600 depending on coding
[22:47] <r2x0t> all wide SSB compatible with possible FM radio fallback decoding
[22:48] <fsphil-laptop> convolution coding you mean?
[22:48] <r2x0t> yes
[22:49] <fsphil-laptop> yea been reading about that
[22:49] <r2x0t> will use viterbi k=5 1/2 code for first version
[22:49] <Morseman> Would be possible if the code was available and could be incorporated into well known systems
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[22:50] <r2x0t> I will provide code for microcontroller (probably arduino)
[22:50] <r2x0t> and user friendly windows application for decoding
[22:50] <Morseman> Ah well, I'm never going to be the one who can do it so good night from me
[22:50] <r2x0t> and full documentation for mode
[22:51] <gonzo_> what would you use for the TX?
[22:51] <gonzo_> and modulation
[22:51] <r2x0t> designing it to be usable with RFM22B
[22:51] <r2x0t> tha's the one of the requirements
[22:51] <gonzo_> rgr
[22:51] <r2x0t> GMSK modulation
[22:51] <Morseman> I guess that means I should get an arduino then?
[22:52] <Morseman> And an RFM22B as well
[22:52] <r2x0t> I'm deciding on dev platform, probably arduino nano 3.3v + rfm22b
[22:53] <r2x0t> but code should be easily portable
[22:54] <craag> r2x0t: How well would GMSK cope with frequency drift out of interest?
[22:55] <r2x0t> demodulator can track it
[22:55] <fsphil-laptop> "PBH-18 has been descending for a couple of hours now, altitude as of 2225 UTC is 72k feet"
[22:55] <r2x0t> if it jumps too much, FFT can be used to auto tune it again
[22:56] <craag> One of the advantages with RTTY is you can see it easily on the waterfall, what does GMSK look like?
[22:56] <Randomskk> quite a lot like rtty
[22:56] <r2x0t> that's worse... GMSK is just blob
[22:57] <Randomskk> but yes
[22:57] <r2x0t> with good SNR, it's very distinct
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[22:57] <r2x0t> with low SNR, it's like a blob of noise
[22:58] <craag> Ok, i'm just wondering cos I've played around with MT63, and that can be a pain to tune right when it's deep in the noise I found, especially with a drifting rx!
[22:58] <r2x0t> I want decoder to be able to tune signal automatically
[22:59] <r2x0t> if it appears anywhere in soundcard channel
[22:59] <r2x0t> also considering adding some longer SYNC sequence
[22:59] <r2x0t> that will produce tone on top of GMSK every packet
[23:00] <r2x0t> so it can be easily tuned by finding FFT peak
[23:00] <craag> That sounds good.
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[23:01] <navrac> you'll need a decent filter on the front of the rfm22 to get any sort of usable sensitivity
[23:02] <craag> If you could get GMSK rx into fldigi, then everybody would be happy!
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[23:03] <r2x0t> navrac: sensitivity? I don't want to use it for RXing
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[23:03] <r2x0t> SSB radio or SDR will be used for rxing it
[23:03] <navrac> gotcha
[23:04] <navrac> well fldigi is open source so anything can be added
[23:04] <Morseman> r2x0t some of us have both available
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[23:05] <r2x0t> well, I already have very good GMSK demod, but can't add it to fldigi, because I use it in commercial software
[23:05] <r2x0t> that's why there will be new application for decoding, freeware but not open source
[23:05] <fsphil-laptop> I'm sure someone here could reimplement it
[23:05] <Morseman> Just need to know what antennas and what RX program to decode the I/Q channels
[23:06] <navrac> can you put the decoder in a dll and call it from fldigi
[23:06] <r2x0t> yes, that would be possible
[23:07] <Morseman> r2x0t if you don't tell us, we can't know how to decode it...
[23:07] <r2x0t> as I said, there will be complete specification available
[23:07] <r2x0t> just not code for decoder/demodulator
[23:08] <fsphil-laptop> night all! midnight has passed, and my laptop is turning into an apple.
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[23:08] <Randomskk> I hate it when that happens
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[23:09] <Morseman> r2x0t Code would mean nothing to me, but if I can't make anything of the signals they might as well not exist to be honest...
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[23:10] <r2x0t> I don't worry about that, signal coding will not be secret
[23:12] <craag> I think if you could get some POC setup, and trial it against the RTTY system, people would be easier persuaded.
[23:13] <r2x0t> I already did some tests with great results
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[23:13] <r2x0t> ie. 2400Bd GMSK with convolutional coding needs same SNR as 300Bd FSK
[23:14] <Randomskk> I think open source code in dl-fldigi's C++ would be more convincing, given as otherwise it's not going to work on linux or OS X and will at any rate require your custom DLL
[23:14] <Randomskk> but still
[23:15] <craag> It sounds great to me! If you could get some TX code running on an arduino to demonstrate, people would be more inclined to help out with an open-source rx implementation.
[23:15] <Randomskk> 2400 baud would be very neat. same SNR you say, but what about bandwidth?
[23:15] <navrac> yes but as an initial approach to get it in until an open source version coul.d be sourced
[23:15] <r2x0t> sample: http://www.r00t.cz//gmsk600.wav
[23:15] <Randomskk> (and incidentally what's the radio receiver in that case?)
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[23:16] <r2x0t> just so you know how it sounds/look on spectrum
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[23:17] <r2x0t> this is 64byte packet size, convolutional 1/2 code
[23:17] <r2x0t> packet size will be variable, adjustable as needed depending on how much data you want to send
[23:18] <craag> What baudrate is this sample?
[23:18] <r2x0t> 600Bd GMSK -> 300Bd after convolutional
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[23:23] <Randomskk> haha I have the temperature vs frequency graph
[23:24] <Randomskk> https://github.com/adamgreig/wombat/raw/master/misc/temperature_compensation/freq_vs_temp.png
[23:24] <Randomskk> it's weird.
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[23:26] <craag> r2x0t: If you could get arduino tx + proprietary rx working, then you might be able to persuade someone to hitch it on a payload. If it performs well enough to be worth the trouble, we can work on open-source RX for fldigi and look at replacing rtty?
[23:26] <r2x0t> yes, that's my plan
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[23:31] <craag> People are going to be hesitant to track their payloads without the distributed rx system of dl-fldigi that exists with rtty. I don't know if you were planning on getting your 'freeware' rx to use that.
[23:32] <r2x0t> I can always add uploader for spacenear.us to my decoder application
[23:32] <r2x0t> or make it DLL called from fldigi
[23:33] <craag> As a linux-user I would like an open-source implementation in the end.. but for the POC part it may be worth going the DLL route if it isn't too much trouble.
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[23:34] <craag> Did you mention being able to decode it with an FM rx btw?
[23:34] <r2x0t> I only wrote decoders for win32, but all of them worked just fine under wine
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[23:35] <r2x0t> yes, you can always use FM radio for receiving it, as long as it have discriminator output
[23:36] <r2x0t> because GMSK is FSK, so FM
[23:36] <Darkside> erm
[23:36] <r2x0t> but not good for low rates, because filter in FM radio is too wide to be usable for <1200Bd or so
[23:36] <Darkside> was about to say
[23:36] <Darkside> all you hear with 300 baud payloads is a clicking
[23:36] <Darkside> well, a kind of buzz, not decodable
[23:37] <r2x0t> it's all about SNR
[23:37] <r2x0t> if you get strong signal, it would still work
[23:37] <r2x0t> not different from decoding 512Bd POCSAG pagers
[23:37] <craag> Ah ok, would the 9600 baud output from my rx work?
[23:37] <r2x0t> yes
[23:37] <Randomskk> we get 10mW ERP, whatever antenna you can put on both end and background noise on an ISM band
[23:37] <Randomskk> you're not going to do a great job changing the baseline SNR
[23:38] <r2x0t> FM option isn't really good when you want to get every possible frame
[23:38] <Randomskk> on the other hand, plenty of people do have 70cm FM receivers, so an FM mode could be neat
[23:38] <Randomskk> but yes
[23:38] <r2x0t> but enough for someone trying to decode "something"
[23:38] <r2x0t> or quick testing
[23:47] <NigeyS> wow this antenna on the ezcap is mightily crap lol
[23:47] <NigeyS> struggles to get a dab radio station lol
[00:00] --- Tue Mar 27 2012