highaltitude.log.20120307

[00:02] <eroomde> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_BLggf-mqs
[00:06] <fsphil-laptop> that makes me feel better
[00:08] <Lunar_Lander> and this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlkqZtSl7ZM
[00:08] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[00:08] <SpeedEvil> :)
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[00:09] <Lunar_Lander> I now understood why they call themselves Big Red Tower
[00:09] <Lunar_Lander> they got a video with Apollo flight footage
[00:09] <Lunar_Lander> and the Saturn V launch tower was red
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[00:35] <Randomskk> anyone used the adf7012?
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[00:40] <Darkside> Randomskk: i wish
[00:40] <Darkside> do you have a board going?
[00:40] <Randomskk> a few
[00:41] <Randomskk> however in the current I can't get the PLL to lock
[00:41] <Randomskk> and I don't know if it's a software thing or what
[00:41] <Randomskk> not entirely sure what sequence one's meant to follow to start it up
[00:41] <Randomskk> datasheet isn't much use and I can't find any sample code anywhere...
[00:41] <Darkside> i thought ad usually provided apps to give you programming sequences
[00:42] <Darkside> i know they do for their DDSes
[00:42] <Randomskk> hmm
[00:42] <Randomskk> didn't see any
[00:42] <Randomskk> wasn't really looking for any either
[00:42] <Randomskk> I did try their clksim thing to do the loop filter
[00:42] <Randomskk> but it crashed X
[00:42] <Randomskk> :/
[00:42] <Darkside> lol
[00:42] <Randomskk> still my design is exactly as in their datasheet and voltages everywhere seem reasonable
[00:43] <Randomskk> plus I think I'm getting the right signals at both dividers, so
[00:43] <Randomskk> very confused
[00:43] <Darkside> sounds like a software problem then
[00:43] <Randomskk> the dev board I made locked apparently at random
[00:43] <Randomskk> some times it locked right on start, most times not
[00:43] <Randomskk> but this one hasn't locked once yet
[00:43] <Darkside> ouch
[00:44] <Randomskk> yea
[00:44] <Randomskk> same schematic
[00:44] <Randomskk> board layout should be able the same...
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[00:45] <Darkside> very weird
[00:45] <Randomskk> be about*
[00:45] <Randomskk> yea really annoying
[00:45] <Darkside> what are you planning on using the ADF7012 for?
[00:45] <Randomskk> https://randomskk.net/u/wombat.png
[00:46] <Randomskk> flight computer but I want to try doing somewhat higher data rates
[00:46] <Darkside> whaaaaaat the
[00:46] <Randomskk> however jonsowman is playing with a different radio that might allow like sub-hz shifts on the small end and maybe a megahertz or so on the high end
[00:46] <Darkside> heh
[00:46] <Darkside> how migh higher
[00:46] <Randomskk> so r2/r3 might swap out
[00:46] <Randomskk> not sure
[00:46] <Randomskk> depends how small shifts I can get away with but ideally mfsk by reprogramming N all the time
[00:46] <Randomskk> to fill up the audio bandwidth
[00:46] <Darkside> hey i see a TPS61200 there
[00:46] <Randomskk> yea
[00:47] <Randomskk> no end of pain from that shit
[00:47] <Darkside> hahaha
[00:47] <Darkside> yeah this is why i moved our power supply onto a separate pcb
[00:47] <Randomskk> and then perhaps go up to a few thousand bits per second ideally
[00:47] <Darkside> with a 'standard' connector
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[00:47] <Randomskk> the IC has enough RAM to store a 640x480 JPG in memory
[00:47] <jonsowman> :)
[00:47] <Randomskk> so I can do clever coding stuff
[00:47] <Randomskk> wanna try fountain coding
[00:47] <Darkside> heh
[00:47] <Darkside> Randomskk: we do 1200 baud from our payloads now :P
[00:47] <Randomskk> however, radio pll isn't locking, so...
[00:47] <Randomskk> Darkside: still 2fsk though huh :P
[00:48] <Darkside> APRS :P
[00:48] <Randomskk> ew
[00:48] <Randomskk> :P
[00:48] <Darkside> works like a charm
[00:48] <Randomskk> got the psu working okay now
[00:48] <Randomskk> but god it's a pain
[00:48] <Darkside> 3 of us in the team have aprs-capable handhelds
[00:48] <Randomskk> meanwhile a separate SMPS in an amplifier power supply I'm doingn is also being very sad
[00:48] <Darkside> Randomskk: i cloned the lipower design in mine
[00:48] <Randomskk> I have a whole new level of respect for SMPSs
[00:49] <Randomskk> and PLLs >_>
[00:49] <Darkside> http://i.imgur.com/Vj86w.png
[00:49] <Randomskk> chunky though :P
[00:50] <Darkside> its designed to go on th eback of a 2xAA holder
[00:50] <Randomskk> my whole flight computer is 49mm by 49mm inc the stm32f4 (168MHz, 196k RAM, 1M flash, DSP, FPU)
[00:50] <Randomskk> micro SD, coin cell, gps, radio, psu
[00:50] <Darkside> yeah i'm a bit tired of the 5x5cm limigts
[00:50] <Darkside> limits
[00:50] <Randomskk> I wasn't actually under them
[00:50] <Randomskk> amusingly
[00:50] <Randomskk> but figured I may as well fit into them if possible for later revisions
[00:50] <Randomskk> (got these boards done with ENIG in next-day, so nice)
[00:50] <Darkside> heh
[00:51] <Darkside> you have a preamp on the gps?
[00:51] <Randomskk> http://www.flickr.com/photos/randomskk/6954487281
[00:51] <Randomskk> yea
[00:51] <Randomskk> also a bit of a pain
[00:51] <Randomskk> it has a shunt to ground at RF IN
[00:51] <Darkside> why?
[00:51] <Randomskk> so I thought I'd shorted the antenna
[00:51] <Randomskk> and spent hours debugging what wasn't a problem
[00:51] <Randomskk> it's actually two fitlers and an LNA
[00:51] <Randomskk> a filter before and after the LNA
[00:51] <Randomskk> not quite SAW but similar aiui
[00:51] <Randomskk> maybe saw
[00:51] <Darkside> again, why?
[00:51] <Randomskk> anyway, to help reject any other noise mostly
[00:52] <Darkside> ah
[00:52] <Randomskk> it blocks the shit out of gsm and any harmonics from the adf
[00:52] <Darkside> we haven't had a problem, even with a 300mW 2m transmitter right next to it
[00:52] <Randomskk> yea I doubt it's "required"
[00:52] <Randomskk> but I have board space and it looked like a fun idea
[00:52] <Darkside> just means more pain when constructing
[00:52] <Darkside> i bet you're regretting it now :P
[00:52] <Randomskk> I was in the department until 4.30AM constructing this shit
[00:52] <Randomskk> yea
[00:52] <Darkside> yeah it looks a bit scary dude
[00:53] <Randomskk> it's all 0402
[00:53] <Darkside> oh fuck
[00:53] <Darkside> yeah no
[00:53] <Randomskk> except where they don't make those parts in 0402
[00:53] <Darkside> i value my sanity
[00:53] <Randomskk> meh I have a stereo microscope and reflowed the majority
[00:53] <Darkside> hehe
[00:53] <Randomskk> then spent >10hrs reworking with hot air and an iron
[00:53] <Darkside> yeah i bet...
[00:53] <Randomskk> got a stencil made too, though going with steel next time
[00:54] <Randomskk> but yea
[00:54] <Darkside> anyway, whike you guys work on experimental payloads, i'm trying to perfect a dual-band payload
[00:54] <Darkside> which we use as a standard payload for all our flights
[00:54] <Darkside> i want a 70cm RTTY + APRS payload in one box
[00:54] <Randomskk> that'd be cool too
[00:54] <Randomskk> I've finally got code working on the STM32F4, the GPS works, the power supply finally works (hours and hours and hours of debugging)
[00:54] <Randomskk> just gotta get the damn radio pll to lock
[00:55] <Darkside> what was the problem with the power supply?
[00:55] <Randomskk> well in the end I think it was that I specced an inductor too small (despite the datasheet...)
[00:55] <Randomskk> too small current that is
[00:55] <Darkside> oh
[00:55] <Darkside> yeah mine is 1.6A rated
[00:55] <Randomskk> however it was significantly exasperated by the power supply I was using
[00:55] <Randomskk> wait
[00:55] <Randomskk> not the word I'm looking for
[00:56] <Randomskk> but anyway the bench PSU was current limiting
[00:56] <jonsowman> exacerbated
[00:56] <Randomskk> and made the smps get stuck at startup a lot
[00:56] <Randomskk> thanks
[00:56] <Darkside> http://uk.farnell.com/panasonic/ellvgg2r2n/choke-power-3x3x1-5mm-2-2uh/dp/1717412
[00:56] <Randomskk> anwyay in the end once I'd swapped the inductor (and made test versions on spare PCBs, and tried powering resistors, and all sorts of shit)
[00:56] <Randomskk> finally I wired the two channels together to get 2A before limiting and then it was okay
[00:56] <Randomskk> just the inrush current was high
[00:56] <Randomskk> and if it limited the smps then locked up and went unstable
[00:56] <Randomskk> and basically uugh.
[00:57] <Darkside> heh
[00:57] <Randomskk> lessons learnt including putting nice big inductors (700mA in this case)
[00:57] <Darkside> only 700mA?
[00:57] <Darkside> >_>
[00:57] <Randomskk> and not having the current limit turned on on the bench psu
[00:57] <Randomskk> it's 0805
[00:57] <Randomskk> 700mA is the biggest I can get
[00:57] <Darkside> ohhhhhhhh
[00:57] <Darkside> ouch
[00:57] <Randomskk> anyway it's only delivering 300mA into 3v3
[00:57] <Darkside> well that limits your current draw
[00:57] <Darkside> whats your UVLO set to?
[00:57] <NigeyS> Darkside> i want a 70cm RTTY + APRS payload in one box <--- SWIFT !
[00:57] <Randomskk> originally 2v8
[00:57] <Darkside> NigeyS: i want one that works
[00:58] <Randomskk> but right now I think it's something else
[00:58] <NigeyS> swift works :p
[00:58] <Randomskk> as I spent a long time trying to make that work with different resistors
[00:58] <Darkside> Randomskk: mine is either going to be 0.8v or... 0v
[00:58] <Randomskk> heh
[00:58] <Randomskk> 0.25 surely
[00:58] <Darkside> i want to see if letting the batteries go completely flat kills the TPS chips
[00:58] <Darkside> yeah
[00:58] <Randomskk> but yea right now I'd let the lipo die
[00:58] <Randomskk> oh god though
[00:58] <Randomskk> that might just draw tons of current
[00:58] <Darkside> yep
[00:58] <Randomskk> meh I'll fix the resistors and test it before I fly it
[00:58] <Darkside> thats the scary part
[00:59] <Darkside> Randomskk: you'll blow your inductor
[00:59] <Randomskk> the lipo has cutoff builtin
[00:59] <Randomskk> it will stop itself when it gets too low voltage
[00:59] <Darkside> in our case we're using 2x lithium AAs
[00:59] <Randomskk> ah
[00:59] <Darkside> i want to drain them as much as possible
[00:59] <Randomskk> yea
[00:59] <Randomskk> well my priority is getting the radio working atm
[00:59] <Randomskk> but no luck :/
[00:59] <Darkside> everything on the payload is set up so that if the power does start cycling, we at the very least get some blips on one of the radios
[00:59] <Randomskk> heh
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[01:00] <Darkside> so we can DF the blips if necessary
[01:00] <NigeyS> Randomskk, have you seen Swift ?
[01:00] <Darkside> NigeyS: oh yeah, thats why i wouldnt use swift
[01:00] <Darkside> no switchmode supplies :P
[01:00] <NigeyS> meh you love ure switchmodes! lol
[01:00] <Darkside> also i'm trying to make my payload fit on the back of a 2xAA holder
[01:01] <Randomskk> NigeyS: don't think so
[01:01] <NigeyS> yikes, thats gonna be fun!
[01:01] <NigeyS> Randomskk, http://www.flickr.com/photos/nigeys/6843450381/in/photostream
[01:01] <Darkside> NigeyS: it'll extend a bit past the end
[01:01] <NigeyS> R1 .. been sent off for some "corrections"
[01:01] <Randomskk> looks neat
[01:01] <Randomskk> though yea :P
[01:01] <Darkside> note the rework wire
[01:01] <Randomskk> so far I've got no showstopping board issues or any board mods..
[01:01] <Randomskk> ...but a few little mistakes. had to remove the keying pip from the antenna
[01:02] <Darkside> Randomskk: whats the second terminal block?
[01:02] <NigeyS> we had a gps tx/rx mixup, and a incorrect temp sensor footprint, other than that its a little beauty
[01:02] <Randomskk> connected one of the radio pins to a gpio I didn't mean to, but it's no biggie
[01:02] <Randomskk> Darkside: pyro control
[01:02] <Darkside> why does the track go nowhere
[01:02] <Randomskk> it.. doesn't?
[01:02] <Randomskk> which track?
[01:02] <Randomskk> it goes to that big capacitor
[01:02] <Darkside> https://randomskk.net/u/wombat.png
[01:02] <Darkside> pin 2
[01:02] <Darkside> or is there a component there
[01:03] <Randomskk> there's a big capacitor in the middle
[01:03] <Randomskk> that's why there's no other parts
[01:03] <Randomskk> it charges the cap through 100R though to prevent loading the psu
[01:03] <Darkside> Randomskk: i see the cap
[01:03] <Darkside> on the terminal block
[01:03] <Darkside> pin 2
[01:03] <Randomskk> oh right
[01:03] <Darkside> or is that ground
[01:03] <Randomskk> that goes to a pad on a MOSFET
[01:04] <Randomskk> you can see the tiny pin number
[01:04] <Darkside> oh ok
[01:04] <Randomskk> sot-23
[01:04] <Darkside> said mosfet can handle 1A?
[01:04] <Randomskk> yea
[01:04] <Darkside> noice
[01:04] <Darkside> i'm using a SO8 thing
[01:04] <Darkside> dual mosfet
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[01:04] <Darkside> so you're charging a cap and using that to run the pyro... interesting
[01:04] <Darkside> i'm just going to be dropping battery voltage
[01:05] <Darkside> will need to do some tests to check the switchmode supplies still run
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[01:05] <Randomskk> yea
[01:05] <Randomskk> well I mean I can put a 0R on the 100R to stop that
[01:05] <Randomskk> e.g. for a melty-wire cutdown with higher resistance
[01:05] <Randomskk> this is designed for pyro cutdowns where there's a big current draw for not very long
[01:06] <Darkside> ahh ok
[01:06] <Darkside> yeah i'm using melty wire
[01:06] <Randomskk> we have an excess of very very nice pyros which I might play with. they are £20 a pop though...
[01:06] <Randomskk> (£50 a pop at unit qty, too)
[01:06] <Darkside> i dont know if we can get / are allowed to use pyros here
[01:06] <Randomskk> these aren't technically explosives
[01:06] <Randomskk> >_> but they kinda explode
[01:06] <Darkside> is this for cutting the wire?
[01:06] <Darkside> line*
[01:06] <Randomskk> not sure how to use it yet
[01:06] <Randomskk> might do that
[01:06] <Randomskk> might just use it to push away the thing holding the wire
[01:06] <Darkside> yeah we just want to cut the line
[01:07] <Randomskk> but mostly this wombat platform just has a lot of capability I don't plan to use for a while yet
[01:07] <Randomskk> micro sd card too
[01:07] <Darkside> hehe
[01:07] <Darkside> it looks pretty packed
[01:07] <Randomskk> got a serial camera for it so should be able to take+store photos, transmit them fast, all sorts of fun
[01:07] <Randomskk> yea >_>
[01:07] <Darkside> mm photos
[01:08] <Darkside> lol
[01:08] <Randomskk> I was up until 5 for about a week paining over the schematic
[01:08] <Darkside> we want to try images over APRS at some point
[01:08] <Randomskk> then had a solid weekend making footprints and routing
[01:08] <Randomskk> finished routing 5am monday morning, emailed the design files to the stencil maker and the pcb maker and placed the component orders
[01:08] <Randomskk> everything arrived tuesday, so was in the dept 4.30am tuesday soldering it up
[01:08] <Randomskk> what a week that was
[01:08] <Darkside> haha
[01:08] <NigeyS> soldering 0402's at 4:30am ? are you insane? :p
[01:09] <Darkside> i'm getting all my designs checked off by the teams professional electronic engineers
[01:09] <Randomskk> 0402s are really not that bad
[01:09] <Darkside> since i don't want to have to get a second run made
[01:09] <Randomskk> he says, with a stereo microscope
[01:09] <NigeyS> haha
[01:09] <Randomskk> so far I don't /need/ a second run. I hope -- so long as the radio works
[01:09] <Randomskk> but I've got a nice checklist of things that could be improved
[01:09] <Randomskk> and the plan is to make 10x of these anyway
[01:09] <Darkside> hehe
[01:09] <Randomskk> so this is the first prototype, but if it works I'll get more PCBs made either which way, might as well add the improvements
[01:09] <Darkside> i'm still thinking of using my original cutdown design
[01:10] <NigeyS> http://imagebin.org/202122 ATS Mk 2
[01:10] <Darkside> which is basically just RFM22B + FET
[01:10] <NigeyS> that uses pyro cutdown to
[01:10] <Randomskk> nice
[01:10] <Randomskk> we have a strip of 20 NEO6Qs
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[01:10] <NigeyS> ordered in yellow though lol!
[01:10] <Randomskk> so no MAX6s on my designs any time soon
[01:10] <Randomskk> shame as they're tiny
[01:10] <Randomskk> however the NEO has an onboard USB
[01:10] <Randomskk> which is really really really happy for testing
[01:10] <Randomskk> and as I have an eeprom to store config, I can program it in u-center
[01:10] <NigeyS> Randomskk, jon was saying earlier you had alot left lol
[01:11] <Darkside> Randomskk: http://i.imgur.com/yh1xw.jpg
[01:11] <Randomskk> neat
[01:11] <Darkside> simple cutdown
[01:11] <Darkside> no gps
[01:11] <Randomskk> rfm22b is cheating about as much as the ntx2
[01:11] <Randomskk> all this premade radio crap :P
[01:11] <Darkside> lol
[01:11] <Darkside> but i get an uplink with a RFM22B!
[01:11] <NigeyS> are these rfm's as reliable as the ntx2's do we know ?
[01:11] <Randomskk> I really hope jonsowman's experiment comes through
[01:11] <Randomskk> sub-hz shifts
[01:11] <Randomskk> programmable to any frequency you want in 433-434 or so
[01:11] <Darkside> Randomskk: i want to try the RSSI detection stuff you did
[01:12] <Randomskk> in theory
[01:12] <Randomskk> oh it's gross :P
[01:12] <Darkside> yeah but if it works
[01:12] <Darkside> i dont care
[01:12] <Randomskk> I plan to try a proper transceiver next time and uplink using wide fsk
[01:12] <jonsowman> me too Randomskk
[01:12] <Randomskk> the transceiver chips all have really really really good receiver circuits
[01:12] <Darkside> i'm worrying about shift
[01:12] <Darkside> i mean, temp drift
[01:12] <Randomskk> like, optimal decoders and all sorts of very clever things
[01:12] <Darkside> you'll need to correct for that
[01:12] <Randomskk> and 25kHz shifts on uplink FSK make decoding it accurately way easier
[01:12] <Randomskk> but yea
[01:12] <Randomskk> however that should be a case of transmitting on its downlink freq
[01:13] <Randomskk> for a matched transceiver
[01:13] <Darkside> ep
[01:13] <Darkside> yep
[01:13] <Darkside> i wanted to do the uplink using one of our existing radios
[01:13] <Randomskk> nice in theory
[01:13] <Darkside> like, we already use a IC-706 to tune to the downlink freq
[01:13] <Randomskk> but one day I plan to use one of the transceiver chips on both ends for uplink
[01:13] <Darkside> so why not just have that transmit
[01:13] <Randomskk> still rubbish for downlink
[01:13] <Randomskk> however that'd be like r3 or maybe r5
[01:13] <Darkside> Randomskk: how did you do your uplink?
[01:13] <Darkside> that was just a keyed IC-7000 wasnt it?
[01:13] <Randomskk> right now the plan is to get the ADF working or identify the problem in r1, make up a few r2s with all the r1 issues done, then r3 can be with a new radio
[01:14] <Randomskk> uhm yes
[01:14] <Randomskk> indeed
[01:14] <Randomskk> though that wasn't me
[01:14] <Randomskk> more eroomde aiui
[01:14] <Darkside> oh ed did that
[01:14] <Darkside> i need to take a look at the code at some point
[01:14] <Darkside> because i'm not sure how to do the floating comparator stuff
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[01:26] <Randomskk> hmmm
[01:26] <Randomskk> the R divider is almost exactly half the N divider frequency
[01:26] <Randomskk> that's not right
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[01:27] <Randomskk> R is at like 2.22MHz and that's a /2 output so 4.44MHz original is a bit weird too
[01:28] <Randomskk> wait
[01:28] <Randomskk> wtf is R=4
[01:29] <Randomskk> uhm
[01:29] <Randomskk> if this explains it I will be so so annoyed at myself
[01:31] <Randomskk> uhm
[01:31] <Randomskk> omg what
[01:35] <Lunar_Lander> good night
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[01:59] <schofieldau> hey all
[02:00] <Darkside> hey schofieldau
[02:00] <Darkside> IRCing at school eh?
[02:02] <schofieldau> yup
[02:03] <schofieldau> counts as work I'm fairly sure
[02:03] <schofieldau> although the firewall is so restrictive it's a hassle
[02:03] <Darkside> lol
[02:03] <schofieldau> 3G tethering
[02:03] <schofieldau> which is slow
[02:03] <schofieldau> due to vodafone
[02:03] <Darkside> yes we are primary sources
[02:03] <Darkside> :P
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[02:16] <schofieldau> damn it 3G
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[02:21] <schofieldau> yay fixed
[02:22] <schofieldau> ssh proxy over port 443
[02:22] <schofieldau> anyway
[02:22] <schofieldau> still haven't heard back from CASA. anybody here know how long it usually takes to get a reply from them?
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[02:27] <schofieldau_> I'm attempting to find the cheapest possible CHDK-compatible camera
[02:27] <Pavix> A560
[02:28] <Pavix> $50 on ebay
[02:28] <schofieldau_> thank you :)
[02:28] Nick change: schofieldau_ -> schofieldau
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[03:03] <Randomskk> oh wtf
[03:03] <Randomskk> Darkside: I have the ADF7012 locking every time and transmitting perfectly
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[03:03] <Randomskk> ......on 414MHz.
[03:03] <Randomskk> think I might need to redesign the loop filter...
[03:09] <Randomskk> I think the loop filter (or something) is right on the edge.
[03:09] <Randomskk> at N=88 (f=432.538) it locks on right away
[03:09] <Randomskk> at N=89 (f=437.4527) it never locks
[03:10] <Randomskk> time to start playing with the fractional parts
[03:10] <Randomskk> and being sad
[03:11] <Darkside> Randomskk: hahaha
[03:11] <Darkside> damn
[03:13] <Randomskk> I can get it in-band
[03:13] <Randomskk> 433.2816 is the highest it reliably locks at
[03:13] <Randomskk> (at room temperature)
[03:13] <Randomskk> anyone's bet what it'l do at -30C
[03:13] <Randomskk> but that is totally in-band :D
[03:13] <Randomskk> damn it AD, this is your own sodding loop filter design
[03:13] <Randomskk> on the bright side resoldering four or five 0402s is no problem
[03:13] <Darkside> yeh that is the other problem
[03:14] <Darkside> are any of the loop filter components temperature sensitive
[03:14] <Randomskk> just need to work out what the new values should be
[03:14] <Randomskk> haha they are resistors and capacitors
[03:14] <Randomskk> yes, very
[03:14] <Randomskk> mostly X7R capacitors
[03:14] <Randomskk> too big for better dielectrics
[03:14] <Darkside> heh
[03:14] <Randomskk> might try and spec the best ones I can get this time around
[03:14] <Randomskk> no idea how to design a better loop filter though
[03:15] <Darkside> use 0603s for that part then
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[03:15] <Randomskk> does that help?
[03:15] <Randomskk> anyway then I'd have to spin a new board
[03:15] <Darkside> well you can get better tolerance components
[03:15] <Randomskk> hmm
[03:15] <Darkside> C0B or whatever
[03:15] <Randomskk> I think you can get 0402 in good tolerance if you pay
[03:15] <Darkside> heh
[03:15] <Darkside> i forget the exact dielectric
[03:16] <Randomskk> C0G
[03:16] <Darkside> but theres a nice high Q one that you can get
[03:16] <Darkside> thats it
[03:16] <Randomskk> but you can't usually get that for such high capacitances
[03:16] <Randomskk> well they're not that high
[03:16] <Darkside> ahh
[03:16] <Randomskk> maybe.
[03:16] <Darkside> yeah all the stuff i've been using them for is ridiclously small capacitances
[03:16] <Darkside> like 2pf and the like
[03:16] <Randomskk> okay so it looks like at least some are
[03:16] <Darkside> which is kind of funny when a 0805 pad is 0.8pF by itself
[03:16] <Randomskk> let's see what package
[03:16] <Randomskk> hmmmm
[03:16] <Randomskk> 0402
[03:17] <Randomskk> I think I might have got these in C0G anyway then
[03:17] <Randomskk> let's check
[03:17] <Darkside> i'm using all C0G on a duplexer board i've had made up
[03:17] <Darkside> because i obviously don't want the cutoff frequencies to drift with temperatore
[03:17] <Randomskk> hmm 1 is, 2 are X7R
[03:17] <Randomskk> I mean X7R isn't awful
[03:17] <Randomskk> but it's a bit bad
[03:17] <Randomskk> oh well looks like they all need replaciang anyway
[03:18] <Randomskk> resistors were all 100ppm/K
[03:19] <Randomskk> which is like, not much
[03:19] <Randomskk> 16 ohms on my 3300 ohm resistor at -30C
[03:19] <Randomskk> talking <1% for the resistors. not concerned.
[03:19] <Randomskk> but the caps are a whole different story
[03:19] <Randomskk> plus evidently all wrong
[03:19] <Randomskk> sodding loop filters
[03:19] <Darkside> heh
[03:20] <Darkside> evidently the RFM22B doesnt have this problem
[03:20] <Randomskk> shush
[03:20] <Randomskk> wooo the RTTY is transmitting okay
[03:20] <Darkside> though it is way bigger
[03:21] <Randomskk> my guesses at time delays in my idle-busy loop were spot on
[03:21] <Randomskk> okay well it's transmitting valid RTTY in-band
[03:21] <Randomskk> that's pretty successful
[03:21] <Darkside> thats teh annoying thing with the RFM22B... it takes up heaps of board real-estate
[03:21] <Randomskk> yea
[03:22] <Randomskk> the one jon's working in ends up being 2 MSOP8 packages
[03:22] <Darkside> i'd consider just using the Si chip directly
[03:22] <Randomskk> and fuck all passives
[03:22] <Darkside> but meeeehhhhh
[03:22] <Randomskk> smaller than the ADF thing even
[03:22] <Randomskk> by a long shot
[03:22] <Randomskk> will be insanely good if it works
[03:22] <Darkside> oh it has a lot of passives
[03:22] <Darkside> oh jobs thing
[03:22] <Darkside> jons
[03:22] <Darkside> whats he doing?
[03:22] <Randomskk> it's a micrel radio chip which is just a x32 PLL multiplier and a PA
[03:22] <Randomskk> nothing else
[03:22] <Randomskk> a crystal source
[03:23] <Randomskk> and two varactors driven by a dual 16 bit DAC
[03:23] <Randomskk> with very different c/v curves
[03:23] <Darkside> aha
[03:23] <Randomskk> then pull them to set fine and coarse freq
[03:23] <Randomskk> the bit resolution works out to something insane
[03:23] <Darkside> won't we have the same problems with drift though?
[03:23] <Randomskk> plus it's pin compatible with the very much cheaper 12bit one if that turns out to be enough
[03:23] <Randomskk> yea but a temp sensor on the board means it can be calibrated and compensate
[03:23] <Randomskk> (which is the plan for this board too)
[03:23] <Darkside> thats cool
[03:23] <Randomskk> yea
[03:24] <Randomskk> this is working perfectly now
[03:24] <Randomskk> on 433.281
[03:24] <Darkside> hehe
[03:24] <Randomskk> can't believe it was the sodding loop filter
[03:24] <Randomskk> it's just a low pass filter!
[03:24] <Randomskk> damn it!
[03:24] <Randomskk> a first order low pass filter!
[03:24] <Randomskk> :|
[03:24] <Randomskk> how wrong can it be jeez
[03:24] <Randomskk> I didn't type "sodding" originally there
[03:25] <Darkside> haha
[03:25] <Darkside> well, its interesting
[03:25] <Darkside> i also want to look at the Si1000 chip
[03:25] <Darkside> since thats a SoC
[03:25] <Randomskk> overall I think I'm glad that so many people are starting to branch out from the NTX2
[03:25] <Darkside> would be totally possible to have that as the primary microcontroller in a telemetry payload
[03:25] <Darkside> well we want to get away from them because they're expensive
[03:25] <Randomskk> meeeh
[03:26] <Darkside> i can get the RFM22Bs for $8
[03:26] <Randomskk> yea and fixed frequency and can't do all that much fun stuff
[03:26] <Randomskk> my experience with integrated micros is meh
[03:26] <Darkside> yeah i know you dont like them
[03:26] <Randomskk> they're always more hassle than being able to do a nice micro
[03:26] <Randomskk> worth it for really tiny payloads maybe
[03:26] <Randomskk> really tiny
[03:26] <Darkside> but again, my aim is a reliable dual-band payload
[03:26] <Randomskk> yea
[03:26] <Darkside> not an experimental payload
[03:26] <Randomskk> frankly if all you're doing is position telem then it's entirely fair enough
[03:26] <Darkside> i want something that we can stick in a box and be our primary telemetry payload for all our flights
[03:27] <Randomskk> the only reason this has an insane processor is I want to do a lot of cool stuff with the DSP unit
[03:27] <Darkside> hehe
[03:27] <Darkside> yeah, i'll be doing all that experimental stuff in other payloads
[03:28] <Darkside> i've got another hf payload in the works that i should be able to do some fun stuff with
[03:28] <Randomskk> that's cool
[03:28] <Randomskk> too bad we can't fly on our amateur licenses here
[03:28] <Randomskk> though there is license-exempt HF band I think
[03:28] <Darkside> 13.56MHz
[03:28] <Darkside> i bet
[03:28] <Randomskk> I reckon 1KB/s might be obtainable from a balloon... maybe more.
[03:29] <Darkside> heh
[03:29] <Darkside> 1KiloByte/s?
[03:29] <Randomskk> yea
[03:29] <Darkside> yeah i reckon it would be
[03:29] <Darkside> i mean, we can probably get close to that now
[03:29] <Randomskk> if you can get 20dB SNR, shannon gives a max of like 20kbit/s, if you say 8kbit/s given realistic codes and transmission then 1KB/s
[03:30] <Darkside> we'd switch to 9600baud downlinks
[03:30] <Randomskk> if you can up the SNR then it goes up to a couple of KB/s
[03:30] <Darkside> and do 9600 baud AX25
[03:30] <Randomskk> that'd be cool
[03:30] <Darkside> i mean, we have the radios to do it already
[03:30] <Randomskk> at 1KB/s you can tx a 640x480 decent quality JPG in like under a minute
[03:30] <Darkside> i could, right now, connect a beaglebone to my kenwood TH-D72 handheld and have a 9600 baud downlink going
[03:30] <Darkside> it'd be bloody heavy though
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[03:31] <Darkside> but it would work
[03:31] <Darkside> 5W too :P
[03:31] <Darkside> i'm not too enthused about putting a $650 handheld into a balloon paylod though
[03:31] <Randomskk> hahaha
[03:31] <Randomskk> I forget
[03:31] <Randomskk> you can put silly SNRs
[03:31] <Randomskk> good lord
[03:31] <Randomskk> you could get friggin tons of data
[03:31] <Darkside> yeah
[03:31] <Darkside> i'd drop it to 1W though
[03:31] <Darkside> but yeah, i was thinking of getting a few of those 900MHz XTend modules
[03:31] <Darkside> and having a play
[03:31] <Randomskk> that's still 20dB more tx power than I get
[03:32] <Randomskk> would be cool
[03:32] <Randomskk> live images would be a lot of fun I reckon
[03:32] <Darkside> i wouldn't use it for images dude
[03:32] <Randomskk> plus in theory could allow for some epic non-recovered flights
[03:32] <Darkside> ATV
[03:32] <Randomskk> aurora, etc
[03:32] <Darkside> non-recovered flight? whats that?
[03:32] <Darkside> :P
[03:32] <Randomskk> you can't talk
[03:32] <Randomskk> :P
[03:32] <Darkside> oh shush
[03:32] <Darkside> all the ones we didn't get back, we didn't intend on getting back :P
[03:32] <Randomskk> same :P
[03:33] <Darkside> haha
[03:33] <Randomskk> ...mostly
[03:33] <Darkside> aaaaanyway
[03:33] <Randomskk> of the ones I've launched, we got back all the ones we planned :P
[03:33] <Darkside> haha
[03:33] <Randomskk> obviously when you count the 90+ launches from churchill it's a bit difference ;P
[03:33] <Darkside> yeah
[03:33] <Randomskk> different* even
[03:33] <Darkside> you guys and your prolific launching
[03:33] <Randomskk> haha
[03:33] <Randomskk> hopefully get back to that soonish if these experimental payloads start working
[03:33] <Darkside> we've got a few other people starting to look at launching balloons around here
[03:33] <Randomskk> though we are really ramping up rockets now
[03:34] <Darkside> tehres a hackerspace in sydney thats in the "OMG LETS LAUNCH A UAV GLIDER" stage
[03:34] <Darkside> they'll get over that soon
[03:34] <Randomskk> lol
[03:34] <Randomskk> yea
[03:34] <Randomskk> they usually do
[03:34] <Darkside> mainly because its not going to happen
[03:34] <Darkside> CASA will never allow it
[03:34] <Darkside> except maybe at the woomera rocket range
[03:36] <Darkside> haha
[03:36] <Darkside> at its peak, the woomera prohibited area was bigger than the UK
[03:36] <Darkside> its now half the size of the UK :P
[03:36] <Randomskk> haha
[03:36] <Randomskk> so unfair :P
[03:36] <Darkside> its hillarious
[03:36] <Randomskk> hehe check out the battery holder and micro sd socket :D http://www.flickr.com/photos/randomskk/6808385184
[03:36] <Randomskk> the back of wombat is so pretty
[03:37] <Darkside> i like the black overlay
[03:37] <Randomskk> turns out that's harder to manufacture
[03:37] <Randomskk> the fab house complained a little
[03:37] <Darkside> heh look at all the higgledypiggledy tracks
[03:37] <Darkside> haha
[03:37] <Randomskk> it's also ENIG gold
[03:37] <Darkside> oh man
[03:37] <Darkside> nice
[03:38] <Darkside> i can get that done via a place in shenzhen
[03:38] <Randomskk> http://www.flickr.com/photos/cuspaceflight/6793049100
[03:38] <Darkside> wooooow
[03:38] <Darkside> pretty
[03:39] <Darkside> that really is beautiful
[03:39] <Pavix> Just imagine placing the solder paste for that thing
[03:39] <Randomskk> Pavix: I don't have to imagine...
[03:39] <Randomskk> http://www.flickr.com/photos/cuspaceflight/6939162927
[03:40] <Pavix> That takes skill
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[03:40] <Randomskk> a skill I sadly lack, spent a further two hours reworking troublesome bits
[03:40] <Darkside> its what masks are for
[03:40] <Randomskk> steel stencil next time
[03:40] <Randomskk> the plastic one is okay, but not at that pitch
[03:40] <Darkside> yeah we used steel stencils for TOPCAT
[03:40] <Darkside> worked pretty well
[03:41] <Darkside> but the reflow oven we used fucked up and held the board too hot for too long
[03:41] <Randomskk> all populated and ready for reflow: http://www.flickr.com/photos/cuspaceflight/6793516470
[03:41] <Darkside> and we killed our power supply switchmode IC
[03:41] <Randomskk> haha I just put it in a toaster oven
[03:41] <Randomskk> :D
[03:41] <Randomskk> might be seeing if I can steal eroomde's design for the control loop on it though
[03:41] <Darkside> yeah we had a toaster overn with a control system
[03:42] <Randomskk> oh man I'm so glad the radio's working
[03:42] <schofieldau> is this talking about PCB fabrication?
[03:42] <Randomskk> and inband too
[03:42] <Randomskk> I'll just order parts for a new loop filter tomorrow
[03:42] <Randomskk> be here thursday
[03:42] <Darkside> schofieldau: somewhat
[03:42] <Randomskk> we might fly this sunday
[03:42] <Darkside> more pcb population
[03:42] <schofieldau> ah okay
[03:42] <Randomskk> in which case I have work cut out to write the flight computer code.....
[03:42] <Darkside> Randomskk: oh god
[03:42] <Darkside> thats what i have to do tonight
[03:42] <Darkside> start writing code for the RFM2@B
[03:43] <Darkside> 22B*
[03:43] <Randomskk> it's 3.40am here though and I'm about to go to bed :P
[03:43] <Randomskk> oh well
[03:43] <Darkside> i need to check jcoxons code will work at 300 baud
[03:43] <Randomskk> my sleep in the last two/three weeks has been so, so bad
[03:43] <Darkside> haha
[03:43] <Randomskk> :|
[03:43] <Darkside> same
[03:43] <schofieldau> I was thinking of just using a breadboard/prototyping board for my launch - do you think that'd work?
[03:43] <Darkside> schofieldau: not a breadboard
[03:43] <Darkside> but veroboard, sure
[03:43] <Darkside> other option is you can stack arduino shields
[03:43] <Randomskk> schofieldau: protoboard works (agree not a breadboard) but PCBs are fun and not that expensive
[03:43] <Darkside> we've done that before
[03:44] <schofieldau> hmm I was going to go for an arduino mini
[03:44] <schofieldau> the ones without the shield interface things
[03:44] <Darkside> lemme find old nut
[03:44] <Darkside> ok ok
[03:44] <Darkside> well that also works
[03:44] <Darkside> http://i.imgur.com/5KHUi.jpg
[03:44] <Darkside> that was the first project horus payload
[03:45] <Randomskk> schofieldau: that works too
[03:45] <Darkside> schofieldau: eyah, do something up on veroboard
[03:45] <Darkside> my first payload was like that
[03:46] <Randomskk> I did this once: http://www.cusf.co.uk/2011/12/raccoonkit/img_20111202_033343/
[03:46] <Randomskk> stripboard, openlog reprogrammed with new code, gps, xbee radio, accelerometer
[03:46] <Randomskk> worked pretty well
[03:46] <Darkside> Randomskk: nice
[03:46] <Randomskk> bottom is http://www.cusf.co.uk/2011/12/raccoonkit/img_20111202_033352/
[03:46] <Randomskk> didn't have time to make a pcb
[03:46] <Randomskk> this was for a rocket though hence the xbee
[03:46] <Darkside> ahh
[03:47] <Darkside> lemme find my first hf payload
[03:47] <Darkside> it was a mess
[03:47] <schofieldau> Randomskk: I think that's probably what I'll end up doing
[03:47] <Randomskk> schofieldau: it works perfectly well. do consider a pcb for maybe next time, they're cool
[03:48] <schofieldau> do you make them yourself or get them made from schematics?
[03:48] <Randomskk> so schematic is the symbolic circuit layout
[03:49] <Randomskk> but after that you do board design - placing copper, parts, routing traces, that sort of thing
[03:49] <schofieldau> ah okay
[03:49] <Randomskk> then generally I send the designed boards to a manufacturer
[03:49] <Randomskk> but on occasion I do make the whole thing myself
[03:49] <schofieldau> how much does that usually cost you
[03:49] <Randomskk> these day's it's less than $15 including shipping for 10 PCBs of size 5cm by 5cm or less
[03:50] <schofieldau> cool!
[03:50] <schofieldau> any suggestions for places to get them done?
[03:50] <Darkside> http://i.imgur.com/YtkiN.jpg
[03:50] <Darkside> i am ashabed by this payload
[03:50] <Darkside> absolutely ashamed
[03:51] <Randomskk> schofieldau: http://seeedstudio.com http://iteadstudio.com
[03:51] <Randomskk> Darkside: haha ew :P
[03:51] <Darkside> i mean, it worked
[03:51] <Darkside> but man, was it power inefficient
[03:51] <Darkside> horribly so
[03:51] <Darkside> and it only outputted 40mW!
[03:52] <Darkside> sooooooo bad
[03:52] <schofieldau> is that an amp on the right?
[03:52] <Darkside> yeah, a shitty one
[03:53] <schofieldau> do you suggest using one?
[03:53] <schofieldau> as in will I need one for a radiometrix transmitter?
[03:53] <Darkside> well in my case i needed it, as my signal generator outputted about 0.1mW
[03:53] <Darkside> but no, you won't need one for the radiometrix module
[03:53] <Darkside> schofieldau: i take it you're planning on using a NTX2?
[03:53] <schofieldau> yep
[03:53] <Darkside> ok
[03:54] <schofieldau> do you think that's a good ide?
[03:54] <schofieldau> idea*
[03:54] <Darkside> for a first payload, yep
[03:54] <Darkside> hell, all our current payloads still use them
[03:56] <schofieldau> okay then
[03:56] <Darkside> but yeah, make up a prototype on veroboard
[03:56] <Darkside> then if you want to, design and produce a pcb
[03:56] <schofieldau> is veroboard that stuff with evenly spaced holes in it all over?
[03:56] <schofieldau> like in Randomskk's board?
[03:56] <Darkside> hrmm maybe i'm using the wrong name
[03:56] <Darkside> stripboard
[03:57] <schofieldau> yep googled it that's what I was thinking
[03:57] <Darkside> yeah
[03:57] <Randomskk> veroboard is a trademark
[03:57] <Darkside> ahh :P
[03:57] <Randomskk> stripboard is more generic
[03:57] <Randomskk> okay now I must sleep :P
[03:57] <Randomskk> seeya
[03:57] <Darkside> haha yes, you do that
[03:58] <Darkside> schofieldau: if you're going to make the board with an arduino pro mini, use a 3.3v one
[03:58] <schofieldau> so as far as RTTY goes
[03:58] <schofieldau> I'm assuming I don't need to generate a tone or anything
[03:58] <schofieldau> night :)
[03:58] <schofieldau> ahh
[03:58] <Darkside> as your gps module will likely need 3.3v
[03:58] <schofieldau> the 8mhz one is 3.3 I think
[03:58] <Darkside> yep
[03:58] <Darkside> thats fine
[03:59] <schofieldau> so to send 1s and 0s
[03:59] <schofieldau> I don't need an oscillator to generate a sound/shift frequency of the sound
[03:59] <Darkside> this is the point where i usually need a whiteboard
[03:59] <schofieldau> I just need to change transmit freq on the board?
[03:59] <schofieldau> transmitter*
[03:59] <Darkside> to explain the theory behind how the transmitter works
[03:59] <Darkside> :P
[04:00] <Darkside> ok, so the radiometrix module can be thought of as a voltage controlled oscillator
[04:00] <schofieldau> okay
[04:01] <schofieldau> so it doesn't take in an audio signal, it takes in a frequency level in the form of a voltage?
[04:01] <Darkside> the transmit data pin (TXD) 'pulls' the resonant frequency of a crystal oscillator, which is multiplied to produce the output frequency
[04:01] <Darkside> if you feed in standard TTL data, i.e. 0V or 3.3v, you get an output frequency shift of about 6KHz
[04:02] <Darkside> i.e. at 0V the output frequency would be 434.650MHz, ad 3.3v 434.656MHz
[04:02] <Darkside> but the module can also accept voltages all throughout this range, producing different output frequencies
[04:02] <schofieldau> okay. for the purpose of RTTY we only need high and low, right?
[04:03] <Darkside> yes
[04:03] <Darkside> RTTY = FSK, Frequency shift keying
[04:03] <Darkside> one frequency represents a 0, another represents a 1
[04:03] <schofieldau> okay
[04:03] <Darkside> RTTY defines how data is sent: start bit, data byte, stop bit
[04:03] <schofieldau> does the reciever need to hop frequency?
[04:04] <schofieldau> or does it stay on one
[04:04] <Darkside> no
[04:04] <Darkside> the receivers we use have a 'passband' of about 3KHz
[04:04] <Darkside> so if you configure the transmitter to transmit FSK with a small frequency shift (we use 425Hz), then that fits within the passband of the receiver
[04:04] <schofieldau> okay
[04:04] <schofieldau> and then that program decodes it
[04:04] <Darkside> yes, dl-fldigi
[04:05] <schofieldau> from soundcard input
[04:05] <Darkside> yep
[04:05] <Darkside> the receiver shifts the 3KHz-wide passband down to audio frequencies
[04:06] <Darkside> so if the receiver was set to 434.650MHz, a carrier signal at 434.651MHz would be heard as a 1KHz tone on the audio output
[04:06] <schofieldau> ah okay
[04:06] <Darkside> schofieldau: https://docs.google.com/present/edit?id=0ASjjb1CUQvqPZGMzOXNicmRfMTZmdndnNzhkag
[04:07] <schofieldau> thanks
[04:07] <schofieldau> was that linux.conf.au?
[04:07] <Darkside> yup
[04:07] <Darkside> the talk is online somewhere too
[04:08] <Darkside> on the internode mirror
[04:11] <schofieldau> http://i.imgur.com/0vlQN.jpg haha oh wow
[04:11] <Darkside> hell yeah :d
[04:11] <Darkside> :D
[04:12] <Darkside> thts my seat
[04:12] <schofieldau> /r/battlestations
[04:12] <Darkside> hah
[04:12] <Darkside> the pc in there isnt that good actually, it needs an upgrade
[04:12] <Darkside> its a P4 :(
[04:12] <Darkside> but man is it fun to track in there
[04:13] <schofieldau> what OS do you run? is dl-fldigi crossplatform?
[04:13] <Darkside> yeah its cross-platform
[04:14] <Darkside> we mostly run windows in teh chase cars, as our offline tracking system requires the use of a windows mapping program
[04:16] <Darkside> dl-fldigi still uploads the data to spacenear.us/tracker/, but we sometimes go out of 3g range, hence why we have the offline tracking system
[04:17] <schofieldau> nice
[04:17] <schofieldau> ordering the arduino tonight. also the NTX2
[04:17] <schofieldau> going to do some more research on the GPS because the u-blox is fairly expensive
[04:18] <Darkside> i have some breakouts you can probably use
[04:18] <Darkside> i'd be happy to sell one at cost if you want
[04:18] <Darkside> (just need to check they work!)
[04:19] <Darkside> the cost of each board was around $30 i think
[04:19] <Darkside> http://rfhead.net/data/uBloxBreakout/breakout_top.JPG
[04:20] <schofieldau> cool
[04:21] <Darkside> there no LNA on that, but you won't need one for ballooning work
[04:22] <Darkside> it just means they'll be unlikely to gain lock inside
[04:22] <schofieldau> so I'm screwed if it lands indoors :P
[04:22] <Darkside> pff
[04:22] <Darkside> well once it lands you're not going to head the telemetry signal unless you're really close anyway
[04:23] <schofieldau> yep
[04:23] <Darkside> the key point there is to be within a few km when it lands, so you know the landing site to within a few hundred metrs
[04:23] <schofieldau> so predict it with that cambridge site
[04:23] <schofieldau> how accurate have you found that to be?
[04:24] <Darkside> they get more accurate the closer to the launch time
[04:24] <Darkside> we find the predictions on the morning of the launch are accurate to about 10km or so
[04:24] <Darkside> assuming the balloon bursts when it's meant toi
[04:25] <schofieldau> also, what is the difference between using a heavier/lighter balloon
[04:25] <schofieldau> burst height?
[04:25] <Darkside> the balloon 'weight' is the weight of the latex
[04:25] <Darkside> larger balloons can hold more gas, and give more lift
[04:25] <Darkside> burst height is based on the balloons burst diameter and how much gas is in the balloon at launch
[04:26] <Darkside> http://www.cusf.co.uk/calc/
[04:26] <Darkside> have a play with that
[04:27] <Darkside> back in a bit, grabbing a drink
[04:31] <Darkside> mmmm delicious caffeine
[04:31] <schofieldau> haha
[04:31] <schofieldau> speaking of which, think geek now ships via australian post
[04:31] <schofieldau> yay caffeine-based snacks
[04:31] <Darkside> yeah, cheaper shipping
[04:32] <Darkside> what arduino where you planning on getting?
[04:33] <schofieldau> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/ARDUINO-Pro-Mini-ATmega328P-3-3V-8Mhz-/120866454848?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c2433bd40
[04:33] <Darkside> you have a FTDI cable?
[04:34] <schofieldau> is that for programming?
[04:34] <Darkside> yes
[04:34] <schofieldau> can I DIY and program from a computer with a printer port?
[04:35] <Darkside> no
[04:35] <Darkside> well, maybe, but bad idea
[04:35] <Darkside> get a proper cable
[04:36] <schofieldau> alright
[04:36] <Darkside> well, not necessatily a cable
[04:36] <schofieldau> friend of mine is doing mechatronic at adelaide uni I'm sure he'd have one
[04:36] <Darkside> http://littlebirdelectronics.com/products/ftdi-basic-breakout-3-35v-arduino-compatible
[04:36] <Darkside> thats the kind of thing you want for programming an arduino pro mini
[04:37] <Darkside> but be aware that the serial port on the AVR that's used for programming, is the same one as you'll be using for the GPS
[04:37] <Darkside> so you need to disconnect the gps when programming
[04:39] <schofieldau> hmm okay then
[04:40] <Darkside> its not too hard to deal with
[04:41] <Darkside> just connect the gps to a pin header on the veroboard, and unplug it when you program
[04:41] <schofieldau> yep
[04:41] <schofieldau> also
[04:41] <schofieldau> not sure if this is at all possible
[04:41] <schofieldau> or perhaps too much hassle
[04:41] <schofieldau> I have
[04:41] <schofieldau> http://www.avrusb.com/images/pic2.png
[04:41] <schofieldau> one of those
[04:41] <schofieldau> got it to jailbreak a PS3 some time ago when the USB exploit was discovered
[04:42] <Darkside> it'd be a pain to use that
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[04:43] <schofieldau> hmm alright
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[04:48] <schofieldau> http://arduino.cc/en/Hacking/ParallelProgrammer what do you think of that?
[04:48] <Darkside> just get the proper cable
[04:48] <Darkside> it'll make your life easier
[04:48] <schofieldau> alright :P
[04:49] <Darkside> or use an arduino with a usb port
[04:49] <Darkside> all of those are 5V though
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[04:58] <Darkside> juxta: ping
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[04:59] <juxta> hey Darkside
[05:00] <Darkside> yo
[05:00] <Darkside> --> skype
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[06:37] <schofieldau> any suggestions for the best value on NTX2 modules?
[06:37] <schofieldau> or transmitters in general
[06:37] <Darkside> theres only really one option in australia
[06:37] <Darkside> and thats RFMA
[06:37] <Darkside> http://rfma.com.au/
[06:38] <Darkside> i think they charge about $25 per module
[06:38] <schofieldau> awesome
[06:39] <Darkside> (+ shipping)
[06:39] <Darkside> you'll need to call them for a quote
[06:39] <Darkside> or email
[06:40] <schofieldau> they said they have an NTX2-434.650-10 for $23.60
[06:40] <schofieldau> or an NTX2-434.650-10-HP for $26.90
[06:41] <Darkside> get the HP version
[06:41] <schofieldau> HighPower?
[06:41] <Darkside> thats the 25mW version
[06:41] <schofieldau> okay cool
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[06:49] <schofieldau> any suggestions on acquiring helium?
[06:50] <Darkside> uhmm
[06:50] <Darkside> BOC
[06:51] <schofieldau> hmmm, school gets welding and such through them
[06:51] <schofieldau> might already have a contact
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[07:04] <schofieldau> what size bottle would you recommend
[07:04] <Darkside> uhmm
[07:04] <Darkside> depends on the balloon size
[07:05] <Darkside> ok heading off to hackerspace
[07:05] <Darkside> will be back online when i get there
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[07:21] <upix> hello
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[07:24] <Upu> morning
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[07:24] Nick change: daveake_ -> daveake
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[07:44] <Hix> Play have a few memory deals on at the moment, for those that need any - http://view.email.play.com/?j=ff2b1176756d&m=fe9a1570706d067d71&ls=fe2e15737663067d711277&l=ff67167170&s=fe8911757d66077572&jb=ffcf14&ju=fec917767462077e&utm_source=ExactTarget&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=ADHOC_2012_MAR_07_VOL9_MEMORY&utm_content=&WT.tsrc=ExactTarget&WT.mc_id=ADHOC_2012_MAR_07_VOL9_MEMORY&WT.dscvid=16204270&_$ja=tsid:35626&r=0
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[08:11] <eroomde> morning all
[08:12] <daveake> morning
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[08:13] <Darkside> hey eroomde
[08:16] <eroomde> it's an exciting day today
[08:16] <eroomde> watson colinear arrives
[08:16] <eroomde> parts for hedgehog arrive
[08:16] <eroomde> ipad 3 to be bought
[08:16] <Darkside> coolo
[08:16] <Darkside> wha
[08:16] <eroomde> and an awesome project at work
[08:17] <number10> which one did you get 300?
[08:17] <Darkside> cool
[08:17] <Darkside> i'm getting altium installed on my macbook
[08:17] <Darkside> so i can finish my cutdown
[08:17] <eroomde> number10: which one of what?
[08:17] <number10> watson
[08:17] <eroomde> oh
[08:17] <eroomde> W-50
[08:17] <number10> ah same one as upu
[08:17] <eroomde> i know right
[08:18] <eroomde> gotta fight fire with fire
[08:18] <number10> lol, that was next day delivery - pretty good
[08:18] <eroomde> yep!
[08:18] <eroomde> radioworld gave me no choice
[08:18] <eroomde> which was kinda nice actually
[08:19] <eroomde> official sanctioned impatience and instant gratification
[08:19] Action: daveake stares at W-300 with its ample dimensions ...
[08:19] <daveake> .... no woowoo though
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[08:20] <eroomde> that's enormous
[08:20] <number10> I wonder how much difference the 2dB makes
[08:20] <eroomde> my fear is that if i got that it might be higher than the lightening conductor
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[08:23] <daveake> Probably the 2dB is less of a factor than the extra height!
[08:23] <daveake> But yeah, I was going to buy a WooWoo-50, but this one came up on ebay for £35
[08:24] <daveake> And in an attempt to limit the HAB spend slightly, I opted for that
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[08:25] <Darkside> eroomde: wheres your RSSI uplink code?
[08:25] <eroomde> Engelbert Humpadink is axctually Arnold Dorsey from London
[08:25] <Darkside> i want to have a look and see if i can get somethin gworking
[08:25] <eroomde> Darkside: lost in the annals of time
[08:25] <Darkside> bah
[08:25] <eroomde> not flown since 2009!
[08:25] <Darkside> yeah well
[08:25] <Darkside> if it works
[08:25] <eroomde> erm on the cusf svn somewhere
[08:25] <eroomde> which is no longer online
[08:26] <Darkside> heh
[08:26] <Darkside> i figure if it works
[08:27] <eroomde> it's basically the same as a software uart
[08:27] <eroomde> except with a function to do threholding
[08:27] <Darkside> you had a floating comparator, right?
[08:27] <Darkside> yeah
[08:27] <eroomde> rather than just 0/1
[08:27] <Darkside> thats what i'm not sure how to do
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[08:30] <eroomde> it is raining
[08:30] <eroomde> this is not good enough
[08:30] <eroomde> i want to be putting antennas up
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[08:35] <x-f> we have a saying here for such cases "are you made from sugar?" :)
[08:36] <Laurenceb_> Darkside: you seen the skyworks demodulators?
[08:36] <Laurenceb_> they have some interesting parts that might work for sdr
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[10:12] <cuddykid> sodding rain
[10:12] <fsphil> aye
[10:12] <cuddykid> oh dear - from the radar, looks like the worst should be here in a few mins
[10:15] <cuddykid> at least it's iPad day
[10:16] <x-f> hey, cuddykid
[10:16] <x-f> i read the backlog from last night
[10:16] <x-f> you can have a cutdown on your solar balloon
[10:17] <x-f> just do it like White Star did - zero pressure balloon and inversion rope
[10:17] <x-f> demo - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=om6wgdxToRI
[10:17] <cuddykid> ahh nice! Thanks x-f :D
[10:18] <x-f> cheers
[10:20] <LazyLeopard> Much wind. Little drizzle.
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[10:21] <fsphil> very windy here last night, but happily HF vertical is still vertical
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[10:36] <eroomde> rain and drizzle
[10:36] <eroomde> i want to put the antenna up too
[10:36] <eroomde> fluggering scrottocks
[10:36] <jonsowman> eroomde: http://hexoc.com/u/joey-m-brd.png
[10:36] <eroomde> piss taking:p
[10:36] <kokey> october rain, in march
[10:38] <kokey> last night my car's warning light came on, I slept wrong and my back is sore, I ironed a shirt with a missing button this morning and had to iron another one, I had to run back into the building to get an umbrella when I saw the rain, and had to sprint to catch my train on time
[10:39] <kokey> things can only get easier from here
[10:39] <cuddykid> lol
[10:40] <cuddykid> I've not got to brave the rain and cycle a couple of miles to a lecture :(
[10:40] <cuddykid> still better than catching the damn bus though
[10:41] <kokey> I'm looking at monitors so I can work from home more often
[10:42] <kokey> my macbook's vertical resolution is only 800px which is a bit of a pain if I bring up my virtual desktop from work
[10:43] <eroomde> jonsowman: http://db.tt/KC59bncC
[10:43] <jonsowman> hmm some resemblance!
[10:44] <jonsowman> sorry :P
[10:44] <eroomde> so coy and innocent :p
[10:44] <eroomde> :)
[10:44] <jonsowman> haha
[10:44] <jonsowman> you got one populated yet?
[10:44] <eroomde> no - big farnell bag arriving today hopefully
[10:45] <jonsowman> cool
[10:45] <eroomde> sent the order off yesterday at 6.30
[10:45] <eroomde> also my antenna should be arriving today
[10:45] <jonsowman> :D
[10:45] <jonsowman> nice weather for it
[10:45] <eroomde> unfort i am going to a formal tonight
[10:45] <eroomde> which means i can't stay at work late
[10:45] <jonsowman> oh nice, where?
[10:47] <eroomde> worcester college
[10:47] <eroomde> i've turned to the dark side
[10:47] <jonsowman> haha
[10:48] <eroomde> UpuWork: http://db.tt/KC59bncC
[10:48] <eroomde> thanks!
[10:48] <jonsowman> my sister's got an offer from oxford for next year
[10:48] <jonsowman> much to my disgust :P
[10:48] <eroomde> mmm
[10:48] <eroomde> win some loose some
[10:48] <jonsowman> yeah
[10:49] <eroomde> jonsowman: so we've got a temp controller on our toast oven which we bought on monday
[10:49] <eroomde> here at work
[10:49] <eroomde> and it's fanbulous
[10:49] <eroomde> fabulous*
[10:49] <jonsowman> oh cool, is it a temp probe and mains PWM type thing?
[10:50] <eroomde> i've been getting completely wonderful results with it, in combination with a stainless steel solder mask
[10:50] <jonsowman> or actually built into the oven?
[10:50] <eroomde> external box that switches the poven's mains
[10:50] <jonsowman> linky?
[10:51] <eroomde> http://www.reflow-kit.com/rkuk/order_product_details.html?p=242
[10:51] <jonsowman> merci
[10:51] <eroomde> money very well spent
[10:51] <jonsowman> hmm that looks neat
[10:51] <jonsowman> might buy one for CUSF
[10:51] <eroomde> you first plug it in and press 'learn'
[10:51] <eroomde> which characterises the oven's response
[10:52] <eroomde> you only have to do that once
[10:52] <jonsowman> oh that's clever
[10:52] <fsphil> that's not even that expensive
[10:52] <eroomde> then you just hit 'solder' and it'll do the correct profile
[10:52] Action: jonsowman puts on cusf to-buy list
[10:52] <fsphil> does it have the profile already or do you have to program it in?
[10:52] <eroomde> fsphil: no indeed
[10:53] <eroomde> in combination with a £20 toast oven you have something of the same cost (or cheaper really) than a decent soldering iron
[10:53] <eroomde> it has a profile ready
[10:53] <eroomde> tho it also has an rs232 interface if you want to poke
[10:53] <eroomde> but the default is fine
[10:53] <eroomde> i must emphasise though that the results i attirube also to a good stainless solder paste stencil
[10:53] <jonsowman> very nice
[10:54] <eroomde> as that has really brilliant neat results too
[10:54] <jonsowman> i think Randomskk wants a steel stencil for doing Wombat r2
[10:54] <eroomde> no overspill that might cause adjacent passives to come together
[10:54] <jonsowman> how did you lay up everything for stencilling?
[10:54] <eroomde> i made a jig
[10:55] <jonsowman> from?
[10:55] <eroomde> it was some bits of FR4 glued onto a offcut of metal sheet
[10:55] <jonsowman> ok cool
[10:55] <jonsowman> yeah i was thinking we should do that
[10:55] <eroomde> the bits of fr4 made a cage that you put the stencil into
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[10:55] <eroomde> sorry, not the stencil, the pcb
[10:55] <jonsowman> yeah
[10:55] <jonsowman> then lay stencil over the top and clamp it down?
[10:55] <eroomde> then the stencil is aligned and a hinge is made out of tape
[10:55] <eroomde> yep
[10:56] <jonsowman> sounds sensible
[10:56] <eroomde> then you just put a small line of paste down and drag it over the stencil with a towl
[10:56] <eroomde> trowl*
[10:56] <jonsowman> i think we ended up using a car ice scraper
[10:56] <eroomde> i'll take pictures of the p4rocess when i do it for hedgehog
[10:56] <jonsowman> that'd be good if you don't mind
[10:56] <eroomde> yeah. just something like that is fine
[10:56] <eroomde> ours was a wallpaper removal thing
[10:57] <zyp> I just hold the stencils with the left hand and apply paste with the right
[10:57] <jonsowman> right, just GND net left to route. this should be easy right.
[10:58] <zyp> I did two boards yesterday to test my reflow oven
[10:58] <eroomde> more prone to misalignment error tho zyp
[10:58] <eroomde> i would definitely make a jig if i had >2 boards to make up
[10:58] <fsphil> if it was misaligned, can the solder paste be removed cleanly from the board?
[10:58] <zyp> yes
[10:59] <zyp> http://bin.jvnv.net/f/FlKvz.JPG <- here's the boards I did yesterday
[10:59] <zyp> before and after soldering
[10:59] <zyp> I don't have pics of the stenciling
[10:59] <eroomde> it's wonderful isn't it!
[10:59] <eroomde> it's like making bread
[11:00] <eroomde> put in oven. wait. teeheehee really nice stuff comes out
[11:00] <fsphil> lol
[11:00] <zyp> http://bin.jvnv.net/f/lNfIS.JPG <- and my oven, some cheap china shit
[11:00] <zyp> seems to work nicely though
[11:00] <eroomde> heh, ours is cheap argos shit so you don't need to convince me
[11:01] <eroomde> it's as good as the feedback really
[11:01] <jonsowman> bbl
[11:01] <CovBalloon> Is Mondo launching today?
[11:01] <fsphil> I need to make space in my shed for all this stuff
[11:02] <eroomde> yep
[11:02] <eroomde> also a tower with an az/el
[11:02] <fsphil> totally
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[11:03] <fsphil> I'd like one on the mountain, remotely controlled
[11:03] <zyp> fsphil, I have all this stuff in the middle of my living room :p
[11:05] <eroomde> i think a volcano crater would be the ideal place to launch balloons
[11:05] <eroomde> a nice wind shield
[11:05] <gonzo_> I live in a hole in the ground
[11:06] <fsphil> do you have hairy feet?
[11:06] <gonzo_> you just get a vortex in there, so the wind is there, but often going the other was from on high ground
[11:06] <eroomde> that doesn't sound ideal
[11:07] <eroomde> bloody weather!
[11:07] <eroomde> yesterday was glorious
[11:07] <eroomde> birdsong and stillness and working outside
[11:07] <eroomde> i am angry
[11:07] <fsphil> we had hail a few minutes ago
[11:07] <gonzo_> (and didn't say a word for 18 yeas, and have a sore foot)
[11:07] <gonzo_> yucky mist rain here
[11:08] <gonzo_> but will prob still go out for a walk along the bay, it's still better than beiong in work, even if it is raining
[11:08] <fsphil> yea, I might head home for lunch. just cause
[11:09] <fsphil> ah no, road works
[11:09] <gonzo_> should be ok then if the road is working
[11:10] <eroomde> which bay gonzo_ ?
[11:10] <gonzo_> holes bay, poole
[11:10] <eroomde> ah nice
[11:10] <eroomde> though as a launch site probably dumps everything on central london
[11:10] <fsphil> the road is working, it's the other drivers when faced with temporary traffic lights
[11:10] <fsphil> they become idiots
[11:10] <fsphil> colourblind idiots
[11:11] <zyp> other drivers are always idiots by default
[11:11] <gonzo_> yep
[11:11] <griffonbot> Received email: NickB "[UKHAS] Re: AERIALS ..."
[11:11] <gonzo_> the bay here is too open, so it's breezy all the time
[11:12] <gonzo_> prob is, we are in a number of controled airspaces. An airport and a corridor. Not sure if that would bar us from a NOTAM
[11:13] <fsphil> possibly
[11:13] <fsphil> can buyt try though
[11:13] <fsphil> -y
[11:14] <gonzo_> I try a prediction every week or so just to see what happens. But usually ends up in the channel
[11:16] <eroomde> FARNELL HAS ARRIVED WEE
[11:16] <eroomde> ok see you soon with a finished board
[11:16] <fsphil> good luck. take lots of pics!
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[11:29] <UpuWork> welcome eroomde
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[12:27] <F5MVO> hELLO ALL
[12:27] <fsphil> hiya F5MVO
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[12:29] <F5MVO> M0ZOS for information your icon is near Mons Belgium ?
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[13:05] <cuddykid> back from todays activities :D
[13:06] <cuddykid> don't think my postage has come yet
[13:06] <cuddykid> seems to be very random here
[13:06] <cuddykid> varies from 9am to 3pm lol
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[13:07] <navrac> we have the same problem here with the post - any random time from 9 till 3
[13:08] <navrac> I'm just waiting for a few tiny bits for my payload which is all built and tested
[13:08] <cuddykid> nice :)
[13:09] <cuddykid> great to see Nasa's probes now mapping the moon :D
[13:09] <cuddykid> time to go and get my free dominos pizza and drop the money off at the bank in time for this evenings event :P
[13:09] <cuddykid> bbl
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[13:09] <navrac> just trying to shave off a bit of weight, currently 30g all in including aerial, housing etc
[13:10] <cuddykid> :O
[13:10] <cuddykid> wow - any photos?
[13:10] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[13:10] <cuddykid> navrac: are you planning pico or solar balloon?
[13:10] <navrac> I'll get my camera out in a minute - if i can find where i left it.
[13:11] <navrac> pico - gas and balloon arrived yesterday
[13:11] <cuddykid> good stuff - I'll be back in 30
[13:11] <cuddykid> ish
[13:11] <navrac> just finished building my 4 element upling 458mhz yagi
[13:11] <navrac> catch you later
[13:12] <griffonbot> @PD3EM: Received some nice toys to play with from @iPrototypeNL http://t.co/B0vvWKVP time to develop a #HAB payload ;-) #ukhas [http://twitter.com/PD3EM/status/177381111914172419]
[13:16] <Lunar_Lander> cuddykid: how are you today?
[13:16] <Lunar_Lander> PD3EM: cool!
[13:16] <PD3EM> Lunar_Lander: it sure is
[13:17] <PD3EM> time to start the experimenting soon
[13:18] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[13:18] <PD3EM> but I'm not in a hurry.... first hoping on a high learning curve ;-)
[13:19] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[13:20] <PD3EM> First learn the Arduino... then connect the GPS later when Upu finished it ;-)
[13:20] <Lunar_Lander> yeah :)
[13:20] <Lunar_Lander> I got the sarantel version yesterday
[13:21] <PD3EM> I ordered the same one build
[13:21] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[13:23] <fsphil> eroomde or jonsowman, do you guys use lead-free solder paste? is it as difficult to work with as regular lead-free solder?
[13:23] <zyp> lead-free solder is not difficult to work with
[13:24] <fsphil> I can't seem to get it to flow as well
[13:24] <zyp> unless you find turning up the temperature knob difficult
[13:24] <jonsowman> i've used both
[13:24] <fsphil> I don't have a temperature knob
[13:24] <zyp> there's your problem then
[13:24] <jonsowman> i didn't really find any difference
[13:24] <jonsowman> zyp: that's not the issue
[13:24] <zyp> lead-free has a higher melting point so you have to solder it at a higher temperature
[13:25] <jonsowman> as long as it's hot enough to melt the lead-free then that's not causing the problem
[13:25] <jonsowman> i assume it actually melts fsphil?
[13:25] <zyp> wrong
[13:25] <fsphil> oh yea, it melts
[13:25] <fsphil> it doesn't seem to flow over the part or the board as well
[13:25] <jonsowman> hmm
[13:25] <zyp> you'll get the same problem if you try soldering leaded solder with a too cold iron
[13:25] <jonsowman> i didn't have that issue at all
[13:25] <fsphil> it could just be my iron
[13:26] <fsphil> it's a cheap maplin special
[13:26] <zyp> melting of solder is not a binary process
[13:26] <jonsowman> it behaved a bit differently when reflowing
[13:26] <jonsowman> but apart from that
[13:27] <jonsowman> i've not noticed much difference
[13:27] <zyp> there is not much difference as long as you use a proper temperature :)
[13:27] <fsphil> with the paste I'll be using an oven, so hopefully it shouldn't matter
[13:28] <zyp> just use the right reflow profile
[13:28] <fsphil> yea
[13:28] <zyp> a leaded reflow profile won't work for leadless for the same reason
[13:28] <jonsowman> last few i've done i've just put it under a medium grill for a few minutes
[13:28] <fsphil> I was just going to get a dumb oven, but that controller eroomde linked to earlier seems ideal
[13:28] <jonsowman> worked for both leaded and lead-free
[13:28] <jonsowman> but obviously a controller would be better
[13:28] <Randomskk> fsphil: are you using flux
[13:28] <Randomskk> when hand soldering
[13:28] <fsphil> Randomskk, yea
[13:29] <Randomskk> use more flux
[13:29] <fsphil> I have a little flux pen
[13:29] <Randomskk> oh
[13:29] <Randomskk> get like, some jelly flux
[13:29] <Randomskk> flux is the secret sauce of hand soldering smt stuff >_>
[13:29] <Randomskk> incidentally though is your iron any good?
[13:29] <fsphil> I got some of that recently
[13:29] <Randomskk> like, the one in the cusf lab doesn't have temperature control
[13:29] <Randomskk> but that's because it's amazing and really doesn't need it, lead-free or not
[13:29] <zyp> I've never really had to use seperate flux
[13:29] <Randomskk> other irons lack temperature control because they are fire starters plugging a heating element into the mains
[13:29] <zyp> I'm using solder with lots of flux in it
[13:30] <Randomskk> zyp: my solder is too thin to contain lots of flux
[13:30] <Randomskk> and anyway more flux makes soldering more fun
[13:30] <fsphil> I suspect my iron is just too cheap and rubbish
[13:30] <Randomskk> I don't think that relationship has a limit
[13:30] <Randomskk> fsphil: a good iron's worthwhile I think
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[13:30] <zyp> well, then it's too thin to contain lots of solder too.
[13:30] <Randomskk> zyp: yes :P it is very thin
[13:30] <Randomskk> but I don't need much solder
[13:30] <fsphil> using the flux pen made my (lead) soldering much much better :)
[13:30] <zyp> it's the amount of flux to solder that matters
[13:31] <Randomskk> exactly, and I can massively increase that by adding more flux ;)
[13:31] <Randomskk> not saying you can't solder without extra flux and for a lot of things (passives mostly) I don't bother
[13:31] <Randomskk> but for like, really fine pitch ICs
[13:31] <Randomskk> the flux just makes it all a heap happier
[13:37] <gonzo_> there are a lot of no-clean flux solders about now. I hate them, because the flux all but evaporates off as soon as the iron hits it. Much prefer the old rosin cored solder
[13:38] <gonzo_> not sure what fluxes they use in soplder paste though
[13:40] <UpuWork> I use this stuff : http://www.google.co.uk/products/catalog?hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=BEI&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&q=quik+chip+flux&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&biw=1280&bih=868&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=14348379773309560159&sa=X&ei=XmVXT4nlJeib0QXFkb3QDQ&ved=0CFUQ8wIwBA
[13:41] <UpuWork> tried a reflow yesterday, didn't go well
[13:42] <Randomskk> I don't like the quik chip stuff
[13:43] <UpuWork> how come ?
[13:43] <UpuWork> smells a bit funny but seems to work
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[13:44] <Randomskk> I use http://uk.farnell.com/edsyn/cr-88/solder-paste-lead-free-5ml-10g/dp/1521898
[13:44] <Randomskk> it works nicely
[13:44] <Randomskk> bbl
[13:45] <UpuWork> I'll have to try that
[13:46] <Hix> £2200/Kg
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[13:48] <SpeedEvil> Hix: Cheap compared to printer ink.
[13:49] <Lunar_Lander> OK cu
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[13:51] <Hix> SpeedEvil, god point - I've got a laser though, pretty much for that reason
[13:51] <Hix> good
[13:52] <Hix> does make you wonder what margins these companies are working on though.
[13:52] <Hix> I'm in the wrong trade
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[14:04] <Hix> http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/soldering-consumables/0551693/ is this comparable solder paste? 75g even better value compared to RS
[14:04] <Hix> for RS read 25
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[14:07] <cuddykid> if the iPad has on screen textures that would be beyond awesome :P
[14:09] <SpeedEvil> cuddykid: I prefer 60 grit.
[14:09] <cuddykid> lol
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[14:15] <eroomde> hedgehog is currently in the solder oven
[14:15] <eroomde> just cooked the mainly-smd side
[14:15] <eroomde> UpuWork: what went wrong with yours?
[14:16] <cuddykid> eroomde: don't tell the hedgehog preservation society :P
[14:16] <eroomde> fsphil: leaded
[14:16] <eroomde> it's experimental aerospace so it's quite legal too
[14:16] <eroomde> to sell, that is
[14:17] <Hix> UpuWork, LEDs.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIGzpi9lCck&feature=player_detailpage
[14:17] <cuddykid> bb in an hour ish
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[14:51] <UpuWork> hey eroomde the ATmega didn't flow properly
[14:51] <UpuWork> ended up wonky
[14:51] <UpuWork> I've done another where I've soldered the leds, caps and resistors
[14:52] <UpuWork> I'll do the chips manually
[14:52] <UpuWork> btw
[14:52] <UpuWork> getting some NTX2's for the shop
[14:52] <UpuWork> cheap ones
[14:53] <UpuWork> they can do custom frequencies but minimum order 100
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[15:00] <fsphil> wonder what the quietest part of the 434 band is
[15:02] <UpuWork> I can't stress this enough
[15:02] <UpuWork> if you want to buy an NTX2
[15:02] <UpuWork> come see me
[15:02] <UpuWork> before you place the order
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[15:08] <Hix> hey UpuWork check out the non pink LEDs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIGzpi9lCck&feature=player_detailpage
[15:08] <gonzo_> time for a poll phil!
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[15:14] <UpuWork> hey hix will do when I get home
[15:14] <navrac> pictures of almost completed payload and uplink yagi www.photobucket.com/ozzie1pics
[15:15] <UpuWork> is that my module :)
[15:15] <UpuWork> well your module
[15:16] <navrac> yep - credited in the text with the picture
[15:16] <signaleleven> UpuWork where can I get some info about "your" module? ;)
[15:16] <signaleleven> I'm considering some designs for our next StratoSpera flight
[15:21] <UpuWork> signaleleven PM
[15:21] <UpuWork> thanks navrac :)
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[15:24] <navrac> no problem. It was much more pleasant to work with than the antenova which for some reason I struggle with.
[15:25] <UpuWork> Well feel free to link the site tell your friends/ buy more :)
[15:26] Action: SpeedEvil wants brown LEDs!
[15:26] <navrac> Well I have one in stock for another pico flight then I'll order a couple more for the summers big flights.
[15:26] <UpuWork> sure no problems
[15:26] <UpuWork> probably going to have to order more uBlox modules at this rate
[15:27] <SamSilver> Hix: there was a house that had the same thing as the Mercedes. the owner felt bad that he had taken the view of the sea away from the house behind him.
[15:27] <navrac> well they are dead easy to work with. A few lines of code and they're up and running
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[15:29] <Hix> SamSilver, :D
[15:29] <navrac> just need to loose another 1.5g from somewhere - I dont suppose you could narrow the pcb round the chip antenna could you? I might try it on this one.
[15:29] <UpuWork> thats not going to save 1.5g
[15:30] <Hix> UpuWork, I'll credit you with a link when I've got my site up properly.
[15:30] <UpuWork> the whole thing only weighs 1.5g :)
[15:30] <SamSilver> Hix: I am searching for it
[15:30] <navrac> no but its a start...
[15:30] <UpuWork> sure you could clip away some of it
[15:30] <UpuWork> but you could take the antenna with it :)
[15:30] <navrac> might remake the aerial with thinner wire - thats another 0.2g saved
[15:35] <NigelMoby> why u stressing over 1.5g?
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[15:38] <navrac> point of principle - the target was 28g and it annoys me that I've overshot
[15:39] <NigelMoby> well don't stress, 1.5g isn't much
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[15:40] <Laurenceb> photo?
[15:40] <UpuWork> www.photobucket.com/ozzie1pics
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[15:42] <Laurenceb> lithium cells will weigh less
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[15:44] <navrac> the alkaline is just an old testing cell, the lithium AAA's should arrive tomorrow
[15:45] <Laurenceb> then you will be fine
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[15:51] <navrac> I'd forgotten about that - alkalines are about 11g and the lithiums 8g - that would explain where the extra weight came from
[15:52] <fsphil> remove the label and save yourself another gram
[15:54] <navrac> nope - I aimed for 28g and thats fine if I can make that
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[16:00] <eroomde> TADA: http://i.imgur.com/YcrhK.jpg
[16:00] <eroomde> http://i.imgur.com/qkToS.jpg
[16:01] <navrac> very pretty board there
[16:01] <eroomde> UpuWork: ^
[16:01] <fsphil> the bear rug lives!
[16:01] <eroomde> TA NAVRAC
[16:01] <PD3EM> eroomde: WOW! Looking very nice!
[16:01] <eroomde> whoops
[16:02] <UpuWork> soldering is nice
[16:02] <UpuWork> relow ?
[16:02] <UpuWork> reflow ?
[16:02] <fsphil> so just apply power and go?
[16:04] <eroomde> top side is reflow
[16:04] <eroomde> the flatter side with the ICs
[16:04] <eroomde> the bottom more 3d side is by hand
[16:04] <eroomde> the sd card holder was a pig
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[16:05] <eroomde> also there's a connector missing on the bottom side
[16:05] <eroomde> which didn't turn up with the rest of farnell
[16:06] <navrac> found an old alkaline now 27.5g well chuffed , although I expect someone will undercut that shortly
[16:06] <navrac> sorry lithium
[16:09] <eroomde> fsphil: i would just apply power if farnell had included the power connector!
[16:09] <eroomde> it goes on the bottom left of the board here: http://i.imgur.com/qkToS.jpg
[16:09] <eroomde> next to its 6-pin brother
[16:10] <UpuWork> pico balde ?
[16:10] <UpuWork> blade ?
[16:10] <eroomde> yep
[16:10] <eroomde> bit the bullet and got the crimp tool
[16:11] <UpuWork> yikes
[16:11] <nigelvh> eroomde, could be wrong, but it looks like that D3Z bit on the top side has a solder bridge.
[16:11] <eroomde> it does
[16:11] <eroomde> delib
[16:11] <UpuWork> I got a japanese knock off one
[16:11] <UpuWork> was still £50
[16:11] <eroomde> ref
[16:11] <eroomde> vref and vdd
[16:11] <nigelvh> Ah, ok.
[16:11] <Laurenceb> whats the analogue devices ic?
[16:11] <eroomde> but, i will be going round it under the magnifier before applying power to double check everything
[16:11] <eroomde> AD5060
[16:11] <UpuWork> DAC
[16:11] <eroomde> 16bit dac
[16:12] <eroomde> spi interface
[16:12] <eroomde> diddy
[16:12] <UpuWork> They kindly sent me 2 samples
[16:12] <cuddykid> yay UpuWork - your bits and bobs just arrived :D - the swift board looks awesome - thanks for that :)
[16:12] <Laurenceb> what for? radiometrix?
[16:12] <eroomde> yes
[16:12] <UpuWork> cuddykid don't try make it, a number of errors on it but should be good for solder practice
[16:13] <cuddykid> UpuWork: yeah, I'm just going to use it as practice with a few components :)
[16:13] <Laurenceb> i just used pwm
[16:13] <Laurenceb> remeber that it drifts with temperature
[16:13] <Laurenceb> so mfsk is only just doable
[16:13] <Laurenceb> anything more than that and theres no chance
[16:14] <eroomde> more than mfsk?
[16:14] <eroomde> what is more than mfsk?
[16:14] <eroomde> really-mfsk?
[16:14] <Laurenceb> more than 16 levels
[16:14] <nigelvh> Also eroomde, wont the capacitor lead get in the way of the connector (i assume for power)?
[16:15] <eroomde> no that's just spare solder
[16:15] <eroomde> it flowed across to the connector pin pad
[16:15] <eroomde> Laurenceb: what makes you say that?
[16:15] <eroomde> and if i get 24 levels working does that mean i have broken some law of the universe?
[16:16] <eroomde> it has temperature compensation btw
[16:16] <cuddykid> still in awe at this tiny tiny board :P
[16:16] <eroomde> that's the idea of this system - it'll have a 2d lookup table in the flash once i've calibrated it with an environmental chamber and frequency counter
[16:16] <eroomde> so lookup a value for freq and temp
[16:18] <eroomde> that's also why i have a 1284 atmega
[16:18] <eroomde> for a nice beefy LUT
[16:18] <nigelvh> Also, I'm sure you're aware, but the solder joint on one of the capacitors on the power supply looks kinda weak.
[16:19] <nigelvh> Also, I forgot to mention, that's a damn fine looking board.
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[16:23] <eroomde> which solder joint?
[16:23] <eroomde> this is all good stuff keep it coming
[16:23] <eroomde> oh the little daugher pcb?
[16:24] <Laurenceb> seriously?!
[16:25] <Laurenceb> temperature compensated ntx2
[16:25] <Laurenceb> id just grab a cc1020/si4432
[16:25] <eroomde> yes seriously
[16:25] <Laurenceb> you crazy
[16:25] <eroomde> i don't see why the cc1020 would help?
[16:25] <nigelvh> Yes, on the daughter board.
[16:26] <eroomde> i just had to look at those things funnily for them to deviate by 10khz
[16:26] <nigelvh> On the closer side of the closer capacitor in the picture.
[16:26] <Laurenceb> use a decent tcxo
[16:26] <nigelvh> Maybe it's just the lighting, but it doesn't look totally wetted.
[16:26] <eroomde> nigelvh: i see the one
[16:26] <Laurenceb> at least the deviation doesnt shift
[16:26] <Laurenceb> thats the issue with ntx2
[16:26] <eroomde> yeah it's lighting i think - there is a complete fillet
[16:26] <Laurenceb> if you are going to those lengths then i guess 16bit dac isnt overkill at all
[16:27] <nigelvh> Ok, just good to check.
[16:27] <eroomde> tho it really doesn't look like it on the photo i agree!
[16:27] <eroomde> Laurenceb: yeah
[16:27] <eroomde> i want to be able to have about 10hz accuracy on this
[16:27] <Laurenceb> my mfsk-16 works ok in fridge and stuff
[16:27] <Laurenceb> but its borderline
[16:27] <eroomde> so you can fly, say, several payloads all doing something like dominoEX, all on 434.650
[16:28] <Laurenceb> it does work crazy well with fldigi tho
[16:28] <eroomde> all of them keeping to their 1khz of bandwidth
[16:28] <Laurenceb> can copy 100% when its not even visible on the waterfall
[16:28] <eroomde> yeah that's why i wanna give it a go
[16:28] <Laurenceb> well - some faint fuzzyness
[16:28] <eroomde> more robust and pleasantly faster (tho not massively so)
[16:28] <Laurenceb> theres code on the ukhas wiki
[16:29] <eroomde> i've still got dimonoex code from badger1
[16:29] <eroomde> but that was just lifted from fldigi too really
[16:29] <Laurenceb> yeah - i like mfsk-64 a lot
[16:29] <eroomde> it's all about the lookup table in this implementation i think
[16:29] <Laurenceb> but its a little tricky to tune
[16:29] <fsphil> does fldigi have a working AFC for any of the multi-fsk modes?
[16:30] <Laurenceb> mfsk-64 afc kind of works
[16:30] <Laurenceb> not very well
[16:30] <eroomde> dominoex yes
[16:30] <eroomde> i think
[16:30] <eroomde> the entire mode is designed to be tollerant to drift
[16:30] <Laurenceb> i havent used it for ages
[16:30] <eroomde> as the data is encoded in the freq jumps rather than the freqs themselves
[16:31] <fsphil> just checked, mfsk has the others don't
[16:31] <eroomde> ah tits
[16:31] <eroomde> well, not tits
[16:32] <eroomde> as you wont need afc on mine :D
[16:32] <eroomde> ah farnell delivery 2 just arrived!
[16:32] <Laurenceb> http://ukhas.org.uk/code:radio
[16:32] <eroomde> the final connector!
[16:32] <eroomde> bbiab
[16:32] <DanielRichman> I vageuly recall being able to decode dominoex with dlfldigi even if you completely miss with the red lines, like, half way through the signal
[16:36] <DanielRichman> http://imgur.com/MHVPK like that
[16:36] <Laurenceb> yeah aiui it doesnt need tuning at all
[16:39] <kokey> I bought some speakers last night
[16:39] <kokey> tonight I'm fetching an amp
[16:39] <kokey> so tonight the most complex thing I'll do is wire it up with some coat hangers
[16:40] <kokey> or flex cable
[16:40] <kokey> whichever comes first
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[16:54] <Upu> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Universal-Mini-Crimping-tool-Crimp-pliers-Molex-KK-ZH-XH-SL-JST-AMP-JAE-servos-9-/260968044160?pt=UK_Computing_NetworkingTools_Accessories_SM&hash=item3cc2e85680
[16:54] <Upu> for the picoblade stuff
[16:55] <eroomde> http://i.imgur.com/cjGtx.jpg
[16:55] <eroomde> farnell just delivered the power connector picoblade
[16:55] <eroomde> now it's on
[16:55] <eroomde> job jobbed
[16:57] <PD3EM> Nice!!! I'm jealous.....
[16:58] <UpuWork> when does it fly ?
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[16:59] <UpuWork> oo 5pm
[16:59] <UpuWork> bbl
[17:00] <fsphil> cue flintstones theme tune
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[17:05] <eroomde> UpuWork: not sure
[17:05] <eroomde> if the board works, coupla weeks?
[17:06] <eroomde> gonna fly a 30cm model of skylon for shiggles
[17:06] <eroomde> right, i gotta go too
[17:06] <eroomde> good day!
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[17:06] <fsphil> cya mr.eroom
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[17:27] Nick change: MLow -> MLow-werk
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[17:31] <navrac> who do i grovel to to put my payload data on the tracker?
[17:34] <PD3EM> navrac: you're going to launch soon?
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[17:34] <navrac> Sunday - weather permitting
[17:35] <navrac> but i'd like to test the uploading with fldigi etc before that
[17:35] <PD3EM> great!
[17:35] <PD3EM> looking forward to the flight! Whre you'll launch?
[17:35] <navrac> nr famlingham in Suffolk - but its only a pico launch
[17:36] <PD3EM> test de upload is allways good
[17:36] <navrac> well it should prove ah, interesting...
[17:36] <PD3EM> ok but who knows how far the beacon can reach..
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[17:51] <griffonbot> Received email: Cresswell family "[UKHAS] Payload document."
[17:51] <Upu> navrac link pastebin here
[17:52] <Hix> woo hoo Sunday launch
[17:52] <Upu> no need for a diary entry Hix :)
[17:53] <Hix> he he he
[17:53] <Upu> I was like wtf why am I getting work stuff to my home account
[17:53] <Hix> or shoule i say "Yeah"
[17:53] <Hix> :D
[17:54] <Hix> CTRL V is sometimes a bad thing
[17:56] <griffonbot> Received email: Daniel Richman "Re: [UKHAS] Payload document."
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[18:02] Nick change: nigelvh_ -> nigelvh
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[18:19] <navrac> upu: http://pastebin.com/f9Mvxb9T
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[18:19] <Upu> cheers
[18:19] <Upu> requested it be added
[18:21] <griffonbot> Received email: navrac "[UKHAS] Re: Payload document."
[18:21] <navrac> thanks - better do my flight announcement then.
[18:22] <navrac> feels a bit nerveracking, it was alright when I could quietly potter on in my study.
[18:25] <daveake_> First time is nerve-racking
[18:25] <daveake_> Subsequent flights are also nerve-racking :)
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[18:27] <DanielRichman> navrac: Hi - may I ask what "uplchan" and "uplinktxt" are, and if they should be displayed on spacenear.us?
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[18:32] <griffonbot> Received email: navrac "[UKHAS] Flight Announcement Sunday 11th March"
[18:33] <navrac> yes - the uplink channel is the channel number of the uplink receiver - the frequencies are in the flight announcement.
[18:34] <navrac> the uplinktxt is the last uplink message received which comprises an uplin message number:callsign:and message text.
[18:34] <navrac> should have said yes please!
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[18:43] <DanielRichman> navrac: all done, it should now work :-)
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[18:53] <LazyLeopard> I presume the uplink message text won't have anything in it which will confuse tracking, like commas, dollars, asterisks, newlines, etc...
[18:56] <navrac> thanks DanielRichamn - and LazyLeopard the uplink message only allows alpanumerics and the : sign
[18:56] <LazyLeopard> That sounds sane. ;)
[18:57] <navrac> and not the h by the looks of it!
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[19:08] <fsphil> heh, ipod3 has higher resolution screen than any of my desktop monitors
[19:08] <nigelvh> It's "retina"
[19:09] <nigelvh> We're going to throw a billion pixels in there. You can't see them, but trust us, they're there.
[19:10] <SpeedEvil> I've pondered using the screen for a pandaboard based netbook.
[19:10] <fsphil> I'd be tempted if they can be free from itunes
[19:10] <cuddykid> pre order today apparently :D - I have the card at the ready.. :P
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[19:16] <fsphil> did anyone ever manage to get a non-ios OS on there?
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[19:18] <nigelvh> I'm not sure there's been much of an effort in that regard. People generally like iOS, just want the freedom of having it jailbroken.
[19:18] <nigelvh> It's already essentially a *nix machine. Jailbreak it and get SSH on there, do whatever the hell you like.
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[19:19] <griffonbot> Received email: Francis "[UKHAS] Re: Flight Announcement Sunday 11th March"
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[19:21] <jcoxon> evening
[19:22] <PD3EM_shack> good evening
[19:23] <navrac> good evening
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[19:27] <jcoxon> navrac, i'll might be able to try upload code
[19:27] <jcoxon> not code
[19:27] <cuddykid> right - off to get fish & chips :P - the pre-ordering better not start whilst I'm out..
[19:28] <griffonbot> Received email: navrac "[UKHAS] Re: Flight Announcement Sunday 11th March"
[19:29] <navrac> jcoxon - I'll email you the code, just got to get a small bug out of it. I've simplified it rather a lot to make it really easy.
[19:29] <navrac> easy for me that is!
[19:32] <jcoxon> hehe
[19:32] <jcoxon> what sort of approach are you going for regarding pico balloons?
[19:32] <jcoxon> slow ascent rate?
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[19:33] <navrac> Well I'd apreciate any advice on this as its my first. My payload is 27g in total so I'm going to underinflate and go for a slow <0.5m/s ascent
[19:33] <navrac> hopefully that will allow it to get fairly high to test the uplink at range
[19:33] <cuddykid> navrac: are you using rfm22b for uplink?
[19:34] <navrac> yep
[19:34] <cuddykid> nice, do you have your code/setup documented anywhere - I'm really interested
[19:34] <navrac> with 500baud it seems pretty sensitive and on the freq im using im allowed 100mw erp
[19:35] <cuddykid> nice - got to dash, be back in 30
[19:35] <navrac> well when my son gives me the passwords for my webspace I'm putting up a wordpress blog
[19:35] <navrac> but i can pastebin the code
[19:35] <jcoxon> navrac, i think thats a good plan
[19:35] <jcoxon> 0.5m/s
[19:35] <jcoxon> fill indoors
[19:35] <jcoxon> recommend avoiding lauching into rain
[19:35] <jcoxon> navrac, use the wiki if you want to document
[19:35] <navrac> yes i'll postpone if it rains
[19:36] <navrac> will do - just need to clean up the code and put comments in - it is really pretty trivial to do an uplink with the rf22 library
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[19:41] <Morseman> Can someone point me towards a way to see just the tracks I received for any ballon flight please? I'd like to see what I sent to the Tracker whilst I was out. Thanks
[19:42] <Morseman> By received I mean decoded and sent to the system
[19:43] <number10> Morseman: http://www.robertharrison.org/listen/view.php
[19:44] <Morseman> Thanks number10 I guess I'll have to extract mine and then turn them into something like a kml file?
[19:44] <fsphil> no way of doing that on the tracker afaik
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[19:49] Nick change: number10_ -> number10
[19:49] <NigeyS> navrac, u using just 1 balloon ?
[19:50] <navrac> yes, gives 66g neck lift, but my payload is 27g so should be ok
[19:52] <NigeyS> ah a qualatex balloon, add an extra gram to that weight btw :)
[19:52] <navrac> for the string?
[19:53] <NigeyS> yups, and piece of gaffa tape, put it over the string where u tie it, ive had 2 rip the foil in the past
[19:55] <navrac> thanks for the advice - will dig round for my gaffa tape
[19:57] <griffonbot> Received email: Steve Randall "[UKHAS] XABEN Flight Announcement Saturday/Sunday 17/18th March"
[19:57] <PD3EM_shack> Morseman: looks like you'll need to extract your data and put it in a kml file like <coordinates>4.35748,50.79814,98</coordinates> see also https://developers.google.com/kml/documentation/kml_tut#geometrystyles
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[19:58] <Morseman> Thanks PD3EM_shack I've extracted just my data and saved it as a CSV file so now to learn how to make a kml :-)
[20:00] <PD3EM_shack> Looking forward to the result Morseman !
[20:01] <PD3EM_shack> Does anyone knows what the highest com-port number is that the Arduino software can use?
[20:01] <Morseman> Might take a while, programming and I don't get on very well, and I'm still full of cold...
[20:02] <PD3EM_shack> Morseman: take your time. Doesn't sound good that cold
[20:02] <cuddykid> Apple's website is taking an almighty hammering
[20:03] <fsphil-laptop> they selling the raspberry pi?
[20:03] <PD3EM_shack> lol
[20:03] <daveake_> PD3EM_shack I doubt there is a limit - it just lists the available ports for you to choose from
[20:03] <cuddykid> they've taking it down again - bloody hell!
[20:03] <cuddykid> they've got one of the biggest server farms around as well
[20:04] <PD3EM_shack> daveake_: I've already 26 com ports in use.... so if it won't work i'll have to install in on another machine
[20:05] <Morseman> PD3EM_shack my best work was making a christmas tree in text characters scroll up the page on a ZX81...
[20:06] <PD3EM_shack> Morseman: haha! that should have been a while ago ;-) I don't have time yet for scripting... mayube next week
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[20:07] <F5MVO> good evening all
[20:07] <PD3EM_shack> Hi F5MVO
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[20:08] <Morseman> PD3EM_shack Christmas 1982 probably :-)
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[20:31] <cuddykid> who's going to be the first person to fly an A5X chip? :P
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[20:34] <PD3EM_shack> cuddykid: i might when i buy one... but at 10km max altitude ;-)
[20:34] upix (4e3c1ef4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.60.30.244) joined #highaltitude.
[20:35] <cuddykid> :P
[20:35] <upix> hello
[20:35] <cuddykid> ergh - the site is still down
[20:35] <cuddykid> hi upix
[20:36] <upix> any new upcoming launches
[20:36] <upix> i missed one
[20:36] <fsphil-laptop> can't call it ihab, that's already taken :p
[20:37] <Upu> March is fully booked
[20:37] <NigeyS> speaking of ihab
[20:37] <daveake> I wanted ipaddy.com to sell iPads in Ireland :D
[20:37] <NigeyS> not seen marshal much lately
[20:37] <daveake> But it's an IP addy site
[20:38] Nick change: MLow-werk -> MLow
[20:38] Action: Laurenceb_ buys 2X ipad3 + fresnel lenses
[20:38] <Laurenceb_> thats my workstation sorted
[20:38] <NigeyS> lol
[20:43] <daveake> Upu Yep - busy month!
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[20:44] <daveake> I keep thinking that "upix" is Upu logged in from a Linux machine
[20:44] <Upu> yeah its annoying for me too :)
[20:44] <daveake> lol
[20:44] Nick change: fsphil-laptop -> upoo
[20:45] Nick change: daveake -> upuwuwu
[20:45] <Upu> not funny
[20:45] <Upu> :)
[20:45] <upoo> hah
[20:45] <upuwuwu> :)
[20:45] Nick change: upuwuwu -> daveake
[20:45] <upoo> lol
[20:46] Nick change: upoo -> fsphil-laptop
[20:47] Action: Upu just ignores the children
[20:48] <Upu> upoo :)
[20:48] <Upu> sigh
[20:48] <Upu> just messing with an A710
[20:49] <daveake> Is that one of the ones that can be switched into and out of video mode?
[20:49] <Upu> its got image stabilization on it
[20:50] <Upu> http://www.livingroom.org.au/photolog/canon-powershot-a710.JPG
[20:50] <Upu> script from Ava's A560 seems to work
[20:50] <PD3EM_shack> Upu what? is it still in original state?
[20:51] <Upu> yeah apart from CHDK script
[20:51] <Upu> takes 1 picture every 10 secs
[20:51] <PD3EM_shack> ok. nice!
[20:51] <Upu> £30 from Ebay
[20:52] <PD3EM_shack> need to start with the Arduino soon and get some stuff connected to it
[20:52] <daveake> good price
[20:53] <daveake> I bought another Zx1 camcorder earlier, for £24
[20:54] <daveake> Not sure image stabilisation makes much difference for a HAB flight - plenty of light up there and you'd normally be using a wide angle on the lens.
[20:55] <SpeedEvil> It does, in a couple od ways
[20:55] <SpeedEvil> Of course, the question is if the IS actually works in this case
[20:56] <SpeedEvil> It may - quite reasonably - not be designed to stabilise a constant 720 degree/s spin
[20:56] <daveake> But the shutter time will be 1/1000s or faster. You'd need a lot of movement to show up at that speed
[20:56] <SpeedEvil> 720 degrees/s = ~1 degree blur
[20:56] <SpeedEvil> You don't even need to be spinning very fast to get >>1 pixel
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[21:01] <fsphil-laptop> farnell's site must be offline more than it's on
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[21:02] <Upu> did get camera because of IS
[21:02] <Upu> just happens to have it
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[21:16] <Upu> ping navrac
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[21:17] <navrac> hi upu
[21:17] <Upu> me wife just called
[21:17] <Upu> can you mail me the code for RFm + Arduino
[21:17] <Upu> and quick circuit diagram
[21:17] <Upu> ta
[21:17] <Upu> bbs
[21:17] <navrac> no problem - got a bug in there at the moment i need to fix
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[21:20] <danielsaul> Anyone of know of somewhere that explains the legalities/regulations of airborne radio, the fact that 434 is license free etc.?
[21:20] <danielsaul> That didnt make sense, meh
[21:22] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/general:restrictions_legality
[21:23] <Upu> ok navrac if you get something to me I'll make up a circuit and plug it into a Yagi
[21:23] <Upu> I assume it transmits at full power ?
[21:23] <danielsaul> Really should have looked on there first... thanks Upu
[21:23] <Upu> dead link to OFCOM if you find correct link can you fix wiki ? :) ta
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[21:23] <jcoxon> navrac, are you using the mikem arduino lib?
[21:26] <navrac> the rf22 one, ill just check
[21:27] <navrac> yes i am - although i took the liberty of redefining one of the modulation settings in the lib as it didnt seem to work when i didit with setmodemregisters
[21:27] <jcoxon> its a big library
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[21:44] <NigeyS> evening ed
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[21:58] <NigeyS> WASHINGTON — A pair of scorching explosions on the Sun's surface is sparking the biggest radiation and geomagnetic storm the Earth has experienced in five years, space weather experts said Wednesday.
[21:59] <NigeyS> uhoh
[21:59] <NigeyS> wow it was an X class :|
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[22:07] <danielsaul> //saul.im/cghg
[22:08] <jonsowman> browsers like to be told which protocol to use
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[22:08] <danielsaul> jonsowman: :P
[22:08] <danielsaul> http://saul.im/cghg
[22:09] <Upu> nice
[22:12] <Laurenceb_> whats that for?
[22:12] <Laurenceb_> advert for icom?
[22:13] <danielsaul> haha, no
[22:13] <danielsaul> Competition we're in next week
[22:13] <danielsaul> Gotta make a load of posters that won't even be read
[22:13] <russss> NigeyS: http://iswa.gsfc.nasa.gov/downloads/20120307_014400_anim.tim-den.gif
[22:13] <Laurenceb_> looks like a ham mag advert by icom XD
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[22:15] <daveake> Upu Mrs Dave says "You've got an envelope with some really really tiny things in it" :)
[22:15] <Upu> lol
[22:16] <Upu> yeah don't sneeze
[22:16] <daveake> Cheers :)
[22:16] <LazyLeopard> Hope that doesn't mean they're all over the floor...
[22:17] <daveake> Well she did think there was only one item, not two ...! She did find the second when she looked closer
[22:17] <LazyLeopard> ;)
[22:17] <Laurenceb_> 0603?
[22:17] <Upu> 1206
[22:17] <Laurenceb_> thats huge
[22:18] <Laurenceb_> 0201 is where it at
[22:18] <Upu> just ordered some 0402
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[22:18] <Upu> right dog walk bbs
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[22:21] Nick change: soafee-chan -> spacekitteh
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[22:25] <NigeyS> oo thanks russss
[22:26] <russss> http://iswa.ccmc.gsfc.nasa.gov:8080/IswaSystemWebApp/ has more of these fancy charts than you can shake a stick at
[22:29] <NigeyS> thats cool !!
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[22:34] <danielsaul> http://saul.im/cgjc
[22:34] <danielsaul> no
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[22:41] <schofieldau> Darkside: I'm keen on buying that u-blox breakout of yours if it's still available
[22:42] <Darkside> ill have to check they work
[22:42] <Darkside> i have a small pile of them
[22:42] <schofieldau> awesome :)
[22:43] <richardf> Evening all
[22:44] <SpeedEvil> Evening.
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[22:44] Action: SpeedEvil wonders if richardf is OSM's RichardF.
[22:44] <richardf> I've got a ublox breakout from upu, im just ordering a Logic Level Converter, that will work with the arduino?
[22:44] <HighAltitudeFrid> hi
[22:45] <richardf> OSM?
[22:45] <Upu> hi Richard yes it should do
[22:46] <HighAltitudeFrid> someone knows about the software packet.c from pegasus project to do RTTY?
[22:46] <richardf> Oh hi Upu, fantastic. That should be with me for the weekend then
[22:46] <Upu> cool
[22:47] <Upu> just need to make sure you don't put 5v into the breakout
[22:47] <Upu> and don't try power the breakout from the Arduino 3.3v
[22:48] <Upu> as that can only do 50mA and the chip does take more than that
[22:49] <schofieldau> hmm where abouts can I get logic level converters (if that's the thing I'm thinking of to drop 5v down to 3.3v) locally in AUS
[22:49] <Darkside> schofieldau:
[22:49] <Darkside> you'll want a 3.3v LDO redulator to power the ublox module
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[22:49] <Upu> sparkfun
[22:49] <richardf> Do I connect the Logic Level Converter betweent the 5v and the breakout?
[22:50] <Darkside> as for level conversion, you don't need a special level converter
[22:50] <Upu> I have a breakout with the LL and regulation circuit on it
[22:50] <Upu> just waiting on the donkey from Seeed
[22:50] <Darkside> Upu: monkey
[22:50] <Upu> yeah him as well :)
[22:50] <Darkside> schofieldau: the arduino will accept 3.3v TTL logic levels directly
[22:50] <Upu> Went for UPS delivery
[22:50] <Darkside> but when communicating with the gps, you'll want to use a voltagte divider to drop the 5v TTL down
[22:52] <eroomde> evening
[22:52] <schofieldau> so for powering your payloads do you generally use double As or a specialised battery?
[22:52] <Upu> Energizer Lithiums
[22:52] <Darkside> yep
[22:53] <Darkside> Energizer lithium AAs
[22:53] <Upu> accept no substitute
[22:53] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/ideas:power_supply
[22:53] <Upu> Good article by Steve Randal
[22:54] <Darkside> http://iswa.gsfc.nasa.gov/downloads/20120307_014400_anim.tim-den.gif
[22:54] <Darkside> wheee
[22:54] <Upu> yeah
[22:55] <Upu> take that ionosphere
[22:55] <NigeyS> lol
[22:55] <Darkside> i'm just thinking how i can monitor it
[22:55] <Darkside> with the gear i have
[22:55] <Upu> the Amateur DSN receive Stereo A & B
[22:55] <Darkside> its meant to hit at 0625Z
[22:56] <NigeyS> yups
[22:56] <Darkside> about 5pm my time
[22:56] <Darkside> maybe if i set something up to watch the carrier from WWV
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[22:57] <NigeyS> Latest Alert: Mar 07 2145 UTC CONTINUED ALERT: Electron 2MeV Integral Flux exceeded 1000pfu
[22:57] <NigeyS> dunno what that means in english mind...
[22:58] <fsphil-laptop> where's La Forge when we need him
[22:59] <NigeyS> oh this is interesting
[22:59] <NigeyS> The geomagnetic field is expected to be active initially on day 1 (08 March) but is expected to increase to major storm levels with a likelihood for isolated severe storm levels after the arrival of the CME from today's X5/full halo event. The arrival time is estimated to be sometime between 0600-1000Z. Minor to major storm levels are expected
[23:00] <fsphil-laptop> "minor to major" isn't very specific
[23:00] <LazyLeopard> Hmmm... Goodbye HF for a day or three, quite likely...
[23:01] <NigeyS> heh it covers all eents phil
[23:01] <NigeyS> events*
[23:01] <LazyLeopard> Look for aurora perhaps?
[23:01] <NigeyS> certainly wouldnt want to be a satellite about now :/
[23:01] <LazyLeopard> ...even this far south?
[23:02] <NigeyS> AuroraWatch UK status:
[23:02] <NigeyS> No significant activity
[23:02] <NigeyS> meh :/
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[23:05] <SpeedEvil> Indeed. I second your meh.
[23:06] <fsphil-laptop> thirded
[23:06] <NigeyS> i wants auroras!
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[23:39] Nick change: MLow -> MLow-werk
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[00:00] --- Thu Mar 8 2012