highaltitude.log.20120210

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[00:20] <MLow-werk> so quiet
[00:22] <jakr> how fast can we expect our spaceships to travel in 50 years?
[00:22] <jakr> MLow-werk, "speeds of around 25,000 miles an hour were acheived on Apollo."
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[00:32] <MLow-werk> jakr: ?
[00:32] <MLow-werk> thats all relative
[00:32] <MLow-werk> 25,000mph in comparison to what, earth?
[00:32] <heathkid> jakr: starting today with an ion drive and 50 years it'd be going pretty fast! ;)
[00:33] <heathkid> true MLow-werk... speed is relative
[00:33] <jakr> MLow heathkid, ok WHAT fraction of the speed of light relative to earth can be approach becaure
[00:34] <MLow-werk> up to light speed according to Einstein
[00:34] <heathkid> why relative to Earth?
[00:34] <jakr> now were are 3.72791233 × 10^-5 times the speed of light
[00:34] <MLow-werk> relative to earth, probably +- a good couple million mph
[00:35] <jakr> heathkid, because the distances between earth and other planets have been measured
[00:36] <heathkid> no comment
[00:36] <heathkid> backing out of this conversation now... time for dinnner
[00:39] <jakr> heathkid, sorry, come back if you have time
[00:43] <MLow-werk> so
[00:43] <MLow-werk> relative to say, the center of the universe is absolute speed, of which any object can only got the speed of light
[00:43] <MLow-werk> got=go
[00:43] <MLow-werk> laptop
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[01:09] <MLow-werk> surprised the internet has allowed me to stay connected so long
[01:10] <MLow-werk> unusual considering we have some 100+ guests here
[01:10] <MLow-werk> our public network has remained solid
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[01:44] <natrium42> ???
[01:46] <MLow-werk> ?
[01:54] <natrium42> i was trying to understand < MLow-werk> surprised the internet has allowed me to stay connected so long
[01:54] <natrium42> :P
[02:11] <MLow-werk> well, our wifi
[02:11] <MLow-werk> we use a buffalo router so it's better than what we had before but still
[02:11] <MLow-werk> enough people brings any router to it's knees
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[04:07] <Chat5608> Hello
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[04:10] <MLow> hi
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[05:35] <SpeedEvil> Oooh!
[05:36] <SpeedEvil> http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Vega/SEMEMCWWVUG_0.html - fun with reteroreflectors!
[06:11] <Darkside> very cool
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[07:37] <jcoxon> morning all
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[07:41] <jcoxon> hey SamSilver_
[07:41] <SamSilver_> Hi jcoxon
[07:41] <SamSilver_> I have a novelty gift for you > pm me your delivery addy
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[07:41] <SamSilver_> thanx
[07:42] <jcoxon> i'm worried what it might be
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[08:08] <MLow> is there any way to make video with the intervalometer script for CHDK
[08:10] <daveake> I've not done it, but you'd have to edit the script to do it. Can be done.
[08:10] <MLow> is there a command to make a video then?
[08:10] <daveake> Yes. Don't ask me what it is though :-)
[08:10] <MLow> what is....
[08:10] <MLow> nvm
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[08:11] <daveake> I use a separate camcorder which, sometimes, I even remember to start recording on.
[08:11] <MLow> yeah i read your blog :P
[08:11] <daveake> <embarassed smiley>
[08:11] <MLow> it does help to hit record, helps even more for it to not land in water
[08:12] <UpuWork> water landings make good video
[08:12] <daveake> Landing in water is good if you have it recording. Ask Upu.
[08:12] <daveake> Speak of the devil
[08:12] <MLow> whoa
[08:12] <MLow> his ears must have been burning
[08:12] <UpuWork> sec
[08:12] <UpuWork> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcbykWjsQrI&list=UUGkq3Q2JQhN_ChjcPPwAW3A&index=17&feature=plcp
[08:13] <daveake> Actually I did hit record, and I have video of me fumbling around putting the camera in after. Then the video stops ... :p
[08:14] <MLow> ah so hit record twice?
[08:14] <daveake> most likely yes
[08:15] <MLow> hm
[08:15] <MLow> i cant find video commands on CHDK website
[08:15] <daveake> Ask cuddykid when he wakes up
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[08:16] <MLow> cuddykid I SUMMON THE
[08:16] <MLow> watch.
[08:16] <MLow> wait for it...
[08:17] <MLow> damn
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[08:19] <daveake> MLow might be some cameras only - http://www.zenoshrdlu.com/kapstuff/zchdk.html
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[08:20] <MLow> AHA The currently supported cameras are the Ixus70/SD1000 (see note below), A560, A570, A720 and G9.
[08:20] <MLow> a560 woot
[08:20] <fsphil> ooh
[08:21] Action: fsphil haz a560
[08:21] Action: daveake hazn't
[08:22] <fsphil> u can haz too
[08:22] <daveake> meez on ebayz innit
[08:23] <UpuWork> A570 here but its quite heavy
[08:23] <UpuWork> relatively
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[08:24] <daveake> Yeah, that's why I had an A495 (now sadly deceased) and A490. 125grams
[08:25] <UpuWork> you flying this weekend daveake ?
[08:25] <daveake> Nope
[08:25] <daveake> No notam or gas or in fact payload
[08:25] <UpuWork> unusual for you :)
[08:25] <UpuWork> ah
[08:26] <UpuWork> I need to make a new payload but is far too cold in the garage
[08:26] <UpuWork> doubt the hot wire cutter would work
[08:26] <daveake> :)
[08:26] <fsphil> it might warm you up
[08:26] <UpuWork> yeah right :)
[08:26] <UpuWork> nasty here today
[08:26] <daveake> Yeah those extra 5 watts will really help
[08:27] <fsphil> we've got the fog, but it's not freezing
[08:27] <daveake> Actually I was working on a 3rd payload prior to my last launch, so I can get that together quickly
[08:28] <daveake> Camera + the old Buzz1/2 tracker in a ball
[08:28] <daveake> Also, waiting for an rfm22b to replace the partially damaged one, then I can resurrect that little tracker.
[08:28] <daveake> My Buzz Lightyear balloon arrived this week :-). So a pico flight sometime soon
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[08:32] <MLow> how would i figure out if a number is a multiple of a number in basic
[08:33] <daveake> I imagine it's something like IF A/B = INT (A/B ) THEN
[08:34] <MLow> im just trying to figure out how i would shoot video every n shots
[08:35] <daveake> Do a loop for n shots then take a video, and put that sequence in a loop
[08:35] <fsphil> does chdk have the modulus operator?
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[08:35] <MLow> it's basic
[08:35] <MLow> literally, it's BASIC
[08:35] <fsphil> haha
[08:36] <fsphil> crude might be a better word
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[08:37] <MLow> i like daves idea
[08:37] <MLow> just a dumb loop for x shots then at the end do a video
[08:38] <gonzo_> real basic, with line nymbers?
[08:38] <gonzo_> u
[08:38] <MLow> well notepad++ has line numbers
[08:38] <MLow> but no putting 10 print hello 20 goto 10 does not work
[08:39] <fsphil> I risk starting one of those old timers threads again, but I was doing some assembly coding on the c64 last night. just cause
[08:39] <fsphil> trying to do an effect in 40 bytes
[08:40] <daveake> Ah, that reminds me ......... <no carrier>
[08:40] <fsphil> lol
[08:40] <daveake> Actually it does but I'll save that one :D
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[09:01] <MLow> almost done with my movie script
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[09:01] Nick change: bcw106 -> bcw
[09:02] <SamSilver_> music sorted MLow ?
[09:02] <daveake> Jaws 4 - Escape Of The Floating HAB?
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[09:02] <MLow> music?
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[09:06] <SamSilver_> daveake: do you have the link for the family tree video about breeding dumb-ass peeps I can't remember the title
[09:06] <SamSilver_> was from yesterday
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[09:06] <SamSilver_> idiots .....
[09:06] <daveake> justamo
[09:07] <daveake> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXRjmyJFzrU
[09:07] <SamSilver_> daveake: thanx
[09:07] <SamSilver_> thats the one lol
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[09:13] <MLow> hm camera died
[09:13] <fsphil> eeep
[09:13] <cuddykid> sleep 1 000 000 ?!
[09:13] <MLow> no i messed up the timing and it was taking a pic every second
[09:13] <cuddykid> ahh
[09:14] <cuddykid> make sure to put quite a lot of sleeps in - it's quite a slow thing
[09:19] <MLow> oh hey cuddykid
[09:19] <cuddykid> hi MLow :)
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[09:19] <cuddykid> any more progress with the hx1?
[09:20] <MLow> dont say that word in here
[09:20] <MLow> damn timing still off on the script
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[09:21] <MLow> getting distracted watching scrubs
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[09:22] <MLow> i hate how it dies in here
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[09:23] Nick change: mazzanet_ -> mazzanet
[09:23] <gonzo_> tv rots the mind
[09:24] <cuddykid> lol MLow
[09:24] <MLow> so does tobacco and beer but you dont see me not doing all 3 at once
[09:25] <gonzo_> how are people interfacing to cameras, to control the shutter ?
[09:25] <cuddykid> MLow - there are quite a few HAB scripts out on the internet, I would recommend them as the aperture etc settings really make a difference
[09:25] <cuddykid> gonzo_: I used USB
[09:25] <cuddykid> well - USB to start the camera going when I wanted it to start
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[09:25] <gonzo_> I'll just do the beer bit, but I'll make up for the other two by drinking three times as much
[09:25] <cuddykid> then chdk just controls the shutter automatically
[09:26] <gonzo_> never heard fo a cam that woudl allow usb control, only downloading
[09:26] <MLow> you can just change the aperature settings manually and the script uses those settings
[09:26] <daveake> gonzo_ http://chdk.wikia.com/wiki/USB_Remote_Cable
[09:27] <gonzo_> ta will gen up
[09:27] <cuddykid> gonzo_: I used an uplink with the usb control to start the camera taking photos just before I let the payload go - it was quite a tense moment to see if the damn thing turned on! Fortunately it did
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[09:28] <cuddykid> bbl
[09:28] <MLow> sounds a bit complicated
[09:29] <MLow> i mean i dont see the practicality, why not just use a fat SD card and take tons of pics
[09:29] <MLow> seeing as most are bound to be blurry or messed up somehow
[09:29] <daveake> I was about to say "just use a large SD card" but then I remembered my little mistake ... :p
[09:29] <cuddykid> yeah, you can do, I only had a 4gb one though
[09:29] <cuddykid> lol daveake
[09:29] <daveake> So: Use a large card AND clear it out first :p
[09:29] <MLow> my script works as intended right now
[09:30] <MLow> just need to get some camera settings good for space
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[09:30] <cuddykid> if I hadn't of implemented it, the payload was sitting around for over an hr due to problems at launch - it would've filled up mid flight
[09:30] <MLow> 2.6mb per pic
[09:30] <MLow> that isn't going to fill a 16gb any time soon
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[09:30] Nick change: bfirsh_ -> bfirsh
[09:30] <daveake> Leave it on automatic. Maybe set infinite focus if you don't care about photos taken before launch
[09:31] <gonzo_> I've been cutting into cheap ebay cams to bring the shutter button out on wires
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[09:31] <MLow> ew
[09:32] <MLow> easy way to break it
[09:32] Nick change: M0JSN -> jonsowman
[09:32] <gonzo_> prob is, it looke like the button is muxed in with the rest of the controls and I really wanted to avoid having to use a relay
[09:32] <gonzo_> so cheap, breaking is just inconvenient
[09:32] <MLow> my fear is that with auto it will use flash
[09:32] <MLow> which will drain it
[09:33] <MLow> btw this a560 was 30$ shipped off ebay
[09:33] <MLow> cheap is relative
[09:33] <gonzo_> yep, I was thinking same on mine, so would cut the flash cct out
[09:33] <daveake> You can switch the flash off, of course, even in auto.
[09:33] <gonzo_> I'm buying for a few pounds
[09:34] <MLow> dont see that option
[09:34] <daveake> On the 4-way control pad. Right button I think
[09:34] <gonzo_> cutting out stops finger trouble an flight day
[09:34] <gonzo_> though it risks it waiting for the flash to charge that won't!
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[09:36] <MLow> easily turned it off
[09:36] <MLow> couldnt while script was running
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[09:37] <MLow> taken the battery down to almost nothing testing though
[09:37] <MLow> it takes AA so i will use the ultimate lithium :D
[09:37] <daveake> alkaline?
[09:37] <MLow> litium iron disulphide i believe
[09:38] <daveake> Yes. Alkalines don't last long.
[09:39] <MLow> LiFePO4
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[09:40] <MLow> http://74.63.229.166/blog/ my blog
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[09:42] <balloon> test
[09:42] <daveake> burst
[09:42] <balloon> hi
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[09:43] <daveake> morning
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[09:44] <balloon> i found thatr chat via hubhub server
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[09:48] <daveake> Do yuo have a balloon project, balloon, or just thinking about?
[09:48] <balloon> i search for a real time prediction software for balloon hunting
[09:48] <Darkside> we do something like that
[09:48] <balloon> Yes i have made a ballon project
[09:49] <Darkside> but we don't release our code
[09:49] <balloon> last year
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[09:49] <MLow> Stupid internets
[09:49] <Darkside> the prediction software is available online balloon
[09:49] <balloon> in this year we will start another ballonin summer
[09:49] <Darkside> you can probably script up something to run predictions and plot them on some mapping software
[09:51] <balloon> why you dont relase the code ?
[09:52] <MLow> mapping software?
[09:53] <balloon> yes mapping an real time prediction, based on the data from the tracking system in the ballon unit
[09:53] <balloon> and
[09:55] <MLow> wonder if you can get the wind data download dump
[09:56] <Darkside> balloon: the software only works with a mapping program we use, called OziExplorer
[09:56] <natrium42> balloon: it's on github
[09:57] <Darkside> that too
[09:57] <Darkside> all the software to do the predictions is online
[09:57] <balloon> ah i know ozi explorer
[09:57] <Darkside> but you'll need to work out how to make your own live update system
[09:57] <cuddykid> yay, got a 1st in all modules :D
[09:57] <eroomde> can you call yourself something other than balloon
[09:57] <eroomde> names should be keywords
[09:57] <eroomde> namespace fail
[09:57] <eroomde> my head can't cope with it
[09:58] <balloon> yes how can i cahnge my name here ?
[09:58] <natrium42> /nick name
[09:59] Nick change: balloon -> db2tk
[10:00] <natrium42> are you a programmer, db2tk?
[10:00] <db2tk> and with the software online i can predict realtime , mobile in a car , by example
[10:01] <db2tk> my not a so good programmer
[10:01] <db2tk> ups i am
[10:01] <Darkside> 20:31 < db2tk> my not a so good programmer
[10:01] <Darkside> 20:31 < db2tk> ups i am
[10:01] <Darkside> ack
[10:01] <Darkside> goddamnit putty
[10:01] <Darkside> stupid excuse for a terminal emulator
[10:01] <natrium42> ah, well there is no ready made offline system yet for predictions
[10:01] <natrium42> you need to know how to put it together
[10:02] <Upu> using Putty as an excude for cut and paste fail ? :)
[10:02] <Upu> excuse even
[10:02] <Darkside> yes Upu
[10:02] <eroomde> using putty is an excuse for operating system fail
[10:02] <eroomde> hah!
[10:02] <eroomde> you suck!
[10:02] <natrium42> :7
[10:02] <Upu> lol
[10:02] <Darkside> eroomde: my laptop got stolen
[10:02] <eroomde> and your operating system sucks!
[10:02] <Darkside> i'm stuck with my windows pc
[10:02] <eroomde> apologies, i went all slashdot circa 1999 then
[10:02] <natrium42> eroomde: were you like :7 ?
[10:02] <Darkside> bahahaha
[10:03] <eroomde> 12
[10:03] <fsphil> lol
[10:03] <Upu> be sure to call it winblows
[10:03] <natrium42> :7 is trollface
[10:03] <eroomde> i had no idea what slashdot was like back then
[10:03] <eroomde> using my imagination
[10:03] <Darkside> windwoes
[10:03] <Upu> about what you put eroomde
[10:03] <natrium42> eroomde: did you use gentoo?
[10:03] <eroomde> suckdows ninety-suck
[10:03] <fsphil> micro$oft winblows ME
[10:03] <Darkside> ricers
[10:03] <Upu> basically if you put "Bill Gates is actually a really nice guy" 27,000 lynched you
[10:03] <Upu> 27,000 nerds
[10:04] <db2tk> ok the predition system that is aviable on github is for online prediction, its possible to turn it into an offline system
[10:04] <Upu> finger issues today I blame Windows 7
[10:04] <eroomde> it's not easy being green
[10:04] <fsphil> it's all bill gates fault Upu
[10:04] <eroomde> db2tk: yes that's correct
[10:04] <natrium42> db2tk: yes, but you need to code
[10:04] <natrium42> here it is, just in case: https://github.com/rjw57/cusf-landing-prediction
[10:04] <Upu> db2tk I think some people are working on solutions but nothing real at the moment
[10:05] <db2tk> ok i will look at that software, when i can doo an goog online predition , at first its very goog for me
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[10:06] <Upu> http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/215700.html
[10:06] <Upu> wrong window
[10:06] <eroomde> indeed
[10:06] <eroomde> but i got the message
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[10:06] Action: griffonbot is GriffonBot [http://github.com/ssb/griffonbot]
[10:06] Action: griffonbot is following: #ukhas #cusf #atlasballoon #projecthorus #HABE2
[10:06] Action: griffonbot is tracking emails sent to ukhas@googlegroups.com
[10:10] <db2tk> Vids of the last two flights you could found here: http://www.youtube.com/user/DL0PTB/feed
[10:12] <natrium42> db2tk: nice vids
[10:12] <natrium42> there's another german who hangs around here going by the name Lunar_Lander
[10:12] <natrium42> probably sleeping still :D
[10:13] <db2tk> natrium42: thanks
[10:20] Nick change: ms7821_ -> ms7821
[10:22] <db2tk> in the wiki i found Landing Prediction and Ver 2.0 predictor (and UI) what the difference
[10:24] <eroomde> db2tk: the wiki can be a bit random
[10:24] <eroomde> can you link to each?
[10:24] <Darkside> with one of them you can end up with a binary called 'pred'
[10:24] <Darkside> which you can pass data and get a predicted path from
[10:25] <eroomde> the current landing predictor is built around a small nuggest of c that is the actual predictor, which is quite simple. it's wrapped up in lots of python and php to make the webpage
[10:29] <MLow> it eats the wind data online?
[10:29] <eroomde> it's very hungry
[10:29] <daveake> Wonder if it gets windy after all that eating
[10:30] <eroomde> MLow: yes, it gets it online
[10:30] <eroomde> from the NOAA computers which do the global forecasts
[10:30] <MLow> yeah figured
[10:31] <MLow> i dont think you can download that stuff
[10:31] <Darkside> you sure can]
[10:31] <eroomde> download the actual forecast prediction?
[10:31] <Darkside> oh
[10:31] <Darkside> well you can get the wind models
[10:31] <eroomde> you can download the results of the forecast runs
[10:31] <eroomde> just not the forcast software itself
[10:31] <db2tk> https://github.com/jonsowman/cusf-standalone-predictor
[10:31] <eroomde> well you might be able to, but it's unlikely that you have a powerful enough supercomputer to run it
[10:32] <db2tk> https://github.com/rjw57/cusf-landing-prediction
[10:32] <eroomde> db2tk: yes, that's the one that is used currently
[10:32] <eroomde> for habhub.org/predict
[10:32] <eroomde> you'll see there is a c program which does the actual flight path generation
[10:32] <eroomde> and a python wrapper for it which takes the input conditions, gets the weather data, and runs the prediction
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[10:33] <db2tk> ah yes i see that
[10:34] <db2tk> and that is the right predictor fpr me ?
[10:36] <MLow> thats a matter of opinion
[10:36] <MLow> but either way you go, you will need internet
[10:36] <MLow> which for me, isnt an option
[10:36] <MLow> east texas = black hole of internet
[10:37] <Darkside> n
[10:37] <Darkside> no
[10:37] <natrium42> you can download the gfs data in advance
[10:37] <Darkside> you can download the gfs files beforehand
[10:37] <Darkside> and work with them
[10:37] <db2tk> yes at home is ok theere internet, mobile not
[10:37] <natrium42> XD
[10:37] <Darkside> natrium42: snap
[10:37] <Darkside> we download the gfs data just before we launch
[10:38] <db2tk> mlow: what your option ?
[10:38] <Darkside> and if our flight time crosses over a data relase period, we re-downloaded the wind data while chasing the balloon
[10:38] <MLow> well evidently i can dl the gfs data
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[10:39] <MLow> not incredibly concerned about predictions tho
[10:39] <MLow> i cant find my lighter
[10:39] <MLow> im having a mini freakout
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[10:40] <MLow> wait
[10:40] <MLow> theres a lighter in the car
[10:40] <MLow> BRB
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[10:42] <Darkside> addicts
[10:43] <MLow> that was the longest 40 foot sprint ever
[10:43] <SpeedEvil> http://fatpita.net/?i=3773 (sorta) on-topic
[10:43] <db2tk> does the sofware run under cygwin or ists besser to run under linux like suse or ubuntu
[10:43] <MLow> you know, i never though what to use for mobile os, im a windows guy
[10:44] <MLow> but thats where i make my moneys, so yeah not much money in mac of linuxBSD
[10:44] <MLow> of=or
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[10:46] <MLow> SpeedEvil: that is one wicked ....air...shield looking thing
[10:46] <SpeedEvil> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bow_shock_%28aerodynamics%29
[10:47] <MLow> damn your science ruining my moment
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[10:56] <daveake> cuddykid I see your article is online - http://www.worcesternews.co.uk/news/local/9522813.Up__up_and_away_____Adam_hits_heights_with_balloon/
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[10:57] Nick change: soafee-chan -> spacekitteh
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[11:36] <eroomde> nice work cuddykid
[11:38] <eroomde> Darkside: ping
[11:39] <Darkside> eroomde: pong
[11:39] <eroomde> did you both with a LNA or micronut?
[11:39] <eroomde> bother*
[11:39] <Darkside> wha?
[11:39] <eroomde> on*
[11:39] <eroomde> let me totally start again
[11:39] <Darkside> LNA? what for?
[11:39] <eroomde> did you incorporate a low noise amplifier for the gps antenna on micronut?
[11:39] <Darkside> no
[11:40] <Darkside> it doesnt need it
[11:40] <eroomde> cool
[11:40] <eroomde> thanks
[11:40] <eroomde> that will be all :)
[11:40] <Darkside> it might take longer to get lock, but unless it embeds itself in dirt, it maintains lock even when landed
[11:40] <Darkside> http://i.imgur.com/QicGF.jpg
[11:40] <Darkside> also
[11:40] <Darkside> i am not looking forward to assembling this thing
[11:40] <Darkside> PSU board for the next gen payloads
[11:40] <eroomde> what am i looking at?
[11:41] <eroomde> what size are the passives?
[11:41] <Darkside> well you can see the SOT23 on there
[11:41] <Darkside> i'm sure you can extrapolate from that
[11:41] <Darkside> R2 is a 0603
[11:41] <Darkside> as is R1, C4, C5
[11:41] <Darkside> wtc
[11:41] <eroomde> ah ok
[11:41] <eroomde> that's still cope-with-able
[11:42] <eroomde> 0402 is a bit masochistic
[11:42] <eroomde> for switch-mode stuff i just use the little TI all-in-one units
[11:43] <eroomde> saves a lot of agro
[11:50] <Darkside> mm
[11:50] <Darkside> that board has a TPS61202 and a NCP1402 onboard
[11:56] <eroomde> oh i just spotted that this atmega has differential ADCS with programmable gain
[11:56] <eroomde> that's a win
[11:57] <eroomde> current consumption sensing for free
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[12:04] <Laurenceb> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jth4yATniS4
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[12:06] <Laurenceb> looks like they used some of the more crazy conspiracy theories for inspiration
[12:15] <SpeedEvil> Either awesome, or crap, or more likely, mostly bland apart from the clips they've shown in the trailers where they spent all their CGI budget.
[12:15] <Laurenceb> http://s1.b3ta.com/host/creative/30035/1241035778/icke.jpg
[12:15] <Laurenceb> come to mind
[12:20] <zyp> eroomde, 0402 is not that bad if you're reflowing
[12:21] <eroomde> indeed - one of our flight computers was 0402
[12:21] <zyp> except that they're prone to tombstone
[12:21] <eroomde> but when you have to touch up, that's when you get annoyed
[12:21] <zyp> sounds like you don't have a good iron to touch up with :p
[12:22] <zyp> but yeah, I'm also going 0603 on my next board, to save time by not having any tombstones
[12:25] <eroomde> tombstoning is annoying too, yes
[12:25] <eroomde> it's not so much the iron, it's my eyes
[12:25] <eroomde> having a microscope helped hugely once we got it
[12:26] <UpuWork> I got a microscope from T'bay fro £40
[12:26] <UpuWork> great for checking
[12:26] <UpuWork> hard to use to solder under
[12:28] <SpeedEvil> Webcams can be of use
[12:28] <UpuWork> ping cuddykid
[12:28] <UpuWork> http://www.acudworth.co.uk/
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[12:29] <daveake> Registered on: 09-Feb-2012
[12:30] <daveake> Give him time :)
[12:31] <SpeedEvil> http://www.xflowcfd.com/ - cfdporn
[12:33] <Darkside> http://i.imgur.com/1I19z.jpg
[12:36] Action: SpeedEvil wishes he had a spare 40000 quid or so.
[12:36] Nick change: hibby_ -> Hibby
[12:36] <SpeedEvil> xflow looks shiny
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[12:39] <zyp> I hate using any kind of magnifier when I'm soldering, it's disturbing my depth vision, and my eyesight is good enough that I can do without it
[12:42] <eroomde> ah now wait a sec
[12:42] <eroomde> i agree with you about those iluminated magnifiers
[12:42] <eroomde> i find it very dizzying too
[12:42] <eroomde> but actual bino microscopes are great, i've found
[12:42] <eroomde> really very good and no depth problem
[12:43] <zyp> maybe
[12:43] <Darkside> i get confused when trying to bring in the solder
[12:43] <zyp> the only bino microscope I've tried had pretty high magnification
[12:43] <Darkside> or components
[12:44] <zyp> too shallow depth of field that depth vision even is an issue :p
[12:44] <Darkside> i have to place the component in teh field of view before looking in the microscope
[12:44] <zyp> good for inspection, unusable for soldering
[12:46] <gonzo_> those magnifiers are less nausiating if you close one eye
[12:46] <gonzo_> (even more so if you shut both!)
[12:47] <zyp> :p
[12:47] Nick change: grummund_ -> grummund
[12:47] <zyp> nah, just give me enough light, and my eyesight will be good enough
[12:47] <fsphil> wouldn't it be easier to use a camera with a good lens
[12:47] <fsphil> watch it on a screen
[12:48] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: that raises latency issues
[12:48] <SpeedEvil> But it can be
[12:50] <fsphil> certainly be easier on the eyes
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[12:50] <gonzo_> sonetimes I use a jewlers lupe, but have a tendency of burning the end of my nose
[12:50] <SpeedEvil> :)
[12:52] <daveake> :-). Being vert short-sighted I just remove my specs and get in close. Nose has survived so far ...
[12:52] <daveake> *very
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[13:06] <cuddykid> hi UpuWork :)
[13:07] <cuddykid> UpuWork: I'm going to have to dash - got to get a train - could you either email me, or leave me a message on here and I'll log on on my iPhone in a bit
[13:07] <cuddykid> cheers :)
[13:07] <UpuWork> no rush it can wait
[13:08] <UpuWork> o7
[13:08] <cuddykid> I've got a couple of mins
[13:08] <cuddykid> I changed the name servers yesterday
[13:08] <UpuWork> just saying name servers are active
[13:08] <cuddykid> oh good :)
[13:08] <UpuWork> site is up
[13:08] <cuddykid> brilliant :D
[13:08] <cuddykid> thanks
[13:08] <UpuWork> nps go get your train
[13:09] <cuddykid> UpuWork: cpanel isn't loading?
[13:09] <Darkside> http://i.imgur.com/vUEjN.jpg
[13:09] <Darkside> urghhh
[13:09] <Darkside> gonna have to reflow that chip on the left
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[13:11] <Hibby> too much labview
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[13:43] <SpeedEvil> I'm wondering about the point-spread function of multiple reteroreflectors.
[13:43] <SpeedEvil> The italian reteroreflector sat to be launched into a 1400km orbit looks quite plausible to hit with _really_ modest equipment.
[13:43] <SpeedEvil> A 1W laser pointer and a 2.5cm lens will make it glow as bright as a 4th magnitude star.
[13:44] <SpeedEvil> (of course, pointing is challenging)
[13:44] <SpeedEvil> Though this is in some ways annoying - as you can use it to communicate only within a radius of a few dozen meters at most.
[13:45] <MLow> Fuuuuuuuuck
[13:45] <gonzo_> good fun to rtry though
[13:46] <SpeedEvil> Indeed.
[13:46] <SpeedEvil> It's orbiting at a 70 degree inclination, so no problem about it being low in the sky
[13:47] <MLow> okay so I ordered an HX1-144.390-3
[13:47] <MLow> which tech support at radiometrix says aprs requires the HX1-144.390-10
[13:47] <MLow> :S
[13:47] <MLow> lemos int does not carry that model
[13:50] <MLow> Hello Marcel, HX1-144.390-3 is a 3kbps (1.5kHz) bandwidth restricted module. Its Low Pass Filter on TXD input will attenuate the higher 2200Hz tone compared to 1200Hz tone resulting in difference in Peak FM Deviation between tones.
[13:51] <SpeedEvil> What order is the LPF?
[13:51] <SpeedEvil> And what's the corner?
[13:51] <SpeedEvil> You might do preemphasis
[13:52] <MLow> i feel i have no options at this point, what with argent data out of the 144.390 radio, and no radiometrix distributor carrying the module i need
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[13:54] <Darkside> MLow: damn
[13:54] <Darkside> so that was the problem all along
[13:54] <MLow> maddening
[13:54] <Darkside> hang on thats wierd
[13:54] <Darkside> i have a HX1-145.175-3
[13:54] <Darkside> and that works
[13:54] <MLow> dont look at me that's what their email says
[13:55] <MLow> to the best of my knowledge(when ordering) there was no hx1-144.390-10
[13:55] <MLow> Please order the 10kbps (5kHz) bandwidth variant (as used on Trackuino) to produce +/-3kHz Peak FM Deviation for both tones when TXD input level is 0V-5V range. HX1-144.390-10 Best regards
[13:56] <Darkside> lol
[13:56] <Darkside> well thats interesting
[13:56] <Darkside> as ours works perfectly
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[13:57] <MLow> http://www.lemosint.com/product_Details.php?itemID=209
[13:57] <MLow> is my module
[14:01] <MLow> it must be something US online
[14:01] <MLow> only*
[14:01] <MLow> sucks
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[14:07] <MLow> hey cuddykid
[14:07] <cuddykid> Hi MLow :)
[14:07] <MLow> radiometrix basically told me i bought the wrong module
[14:07] <cuddykid> UpuWork: all working :D
[14:07] <cuddykid> MLow: oh :(
[14:07] <cuddykid> can they swap it out?
[14:08] <MLow> ha
[14:08] <MLow> well i bought it thought lemos international
[14:08] <MLow> so i guess i would have to ask them
[14:08] <MLow> but it seems i cant find anywhere that sells the module they suggested
[14:08] <MLow> HX1-144.390-3 is a 3kbps (1.5kHz) bandwidth restricted module. Its Low Pass Filter on TXD input will attenuate the higher 2200Hz tone compared to 1200Hz tone resulting in difference in Peak FM Deviation between tones. Please order the 10kbps (5kHz) bandwidth variant (as used on Trackuino) to produce +/-3kHz Peak FM Deviation for both tones when TXD input level is 0V-5V range. HX1-144.390-10
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[14:09] <SpeedEvil> I'd want to actually measure it
[14:09] <cuddykid> ahh ok
[14:09] <SpeedEvil> What's the deviation in each case
[14:10] <MLow> i wouldn't have any idea
[14:10] <MLow> how would i check
[14:11] <SpeedEvil> Do you have a reciever?
[14:11] <SpeedEvil> measure the output voltage with a constant input voltage
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[14:16] Action: griffonbot is GriffonBot [http://github.com/ssb/griffonbot]
[14:16] Action: griffonbot is following: #ukhas #cusf #atlasballoon #projecthorus #HABE2
[14:16] Action: griffonbot is tracking emails sent to ukhas@googlegroups.com
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[14:23] <MLow> ok
[14:23] <MLow> back
[14:24] <MLow> just installed irssi
[14:24] <MLow> :P
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[14:33] <eroomde> MLow: welcome to the club
[14:33] <eroomde> just put it on a remote server in a screen session
[14:33] <eroomde> and you can be omnipresent
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[14:36] Action: fsphil uses xchat and vnc ;)
[14:37] <fsphil> about 50 times the bandwidth necessary
[14:38] <eroomde> i was gonna say
[14:38] <eroomde> not so phone friendly
[14:39] <eroomde> infact i should get the private key for fraken onto my ipgone so i can use ssh on the phone
[14:39] <eroomde> that would be nerd points
[14:39] <fsphil> not a big fan of console irc clients, never got the hang of them
[14:41] <eroomde> i just use it in a completely vanilla way
[14:41] <eroomde> i think jonsowman and Randomskk have quite pimped configurations
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[14:42] <jonsowman> <3 irssi
[14:43] <eroomde> now that eagle6 is xml based in libraries, it might actually be easy to create new parts with a text editor rather than in eagle
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[14:47] <Randomskk> eroomde: I still find that vageuly unlikely. automated tools though...
[14:47] <Randomskk> a python generator where you specify pad size and pitch and separation, say
[14:48] <Randomskk> then again kicad has had that for years
[14:48] <eroomde> it was a tongue in cheek comment on the annoyingness of creating parts in eagle
[14:48] <Upu> eroomde missing the main great thing you can use version control properly now!
[14:48] <Randomskk> eroomde: should have said "easier", I totally agree :P
[14:48] <Randomskk> Upu: "properly"
[14:48] <eroomde> yes that's useful too
[14:48] <Randomskk> the diffs are still near meaningless and you can't really merge or work in branches except on separate files
[14:49] <Randomskk> https://github.com/adamgreig/AMPly/commit/97a37b1c528334e1374362b45fc4fcd1eb471c3c
[14:49] <eroomde> at least it might be possible to grok a change with an decent diff program
[14:49] <Randomskk> I think you'd need a diff program that visualised both PCBs
[14:49] <Randomskk> and frankly that's as well done with PNG renderings and github's image diff feature
[14:49] <Randomskk> (which, fwiw, works really well)
[14:51] <Randomskk> don't get me wrong, text based formats are still excellent and it should use them
[14:51] <Randomskk> but I disagree that it really makes version control any better
[14:51] <Randomskk> the text is still essentially unintelligable for almost any change and you still can't usefully branch/merge
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[15:03] <eroomde> i mean for libraries
[15:03] <eroomde> that's all i really care about
[15:03] <eroomde> v control paradigm for pcbs is sort of nonsensical i agree
[15:03] <BrainDam-> visual diff might make sense
[15:03] <eroomde> but eagle would be immesly improved if the parts management paradigm wasn't so borked and retarded as it has historically been
[15:04] <BrainDam-> but that requires netlist rendering for vcs :/
[15:05] Nick change: BrainDam- -> BrainDamage
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[15:28] <UpuWork> thx Randomskk sorry my spelling isn't great at the best of times
[15:33] <eroomde> i don't think it was a comment on spelling
[15:33] <eroomde> more than 'proper' version control still isn't possible
[15:33] <eroomde> you spelt it right anyway :)
[15:38] <Randomskk> sorry, yea, I wasn't correcting spelling!
[15:38] <UpuWork> just dug out my old photo studio to get some product shots : http://imagebin.org/198230
[15:38] <UpuWork> http://imagebin.org/198229
[15:38] <Randomskk> ooh nice :D
[15:39] <UpuWork> been years since I used it all
[15:39] <UpuWork> I bought it to take pictures of pretty ladies and now I'm taking pictures of Sarantel Antennas
[15:39] <UpuWork> how my life has changed
[15:43] <NigeyS> lol
[15:43] <daveake> "make love to the camera, baby" doesn't really work on a Sarantel ...
[15:44] <NigeyS> :p
[15:46] <gonzo_> Oh those filars!
[15:49] <UpuWork> thats your Sarantel fsphil
[15:54] <NigeyS> charge him double now as it's going to be famous :)
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[16:04] <fsphil> lol
[16:04] <fsphil> we need pretty ladies holding sarantel antennas
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[16:18] <UpuWork> fsphil that is an epic plan
[16:31] <eroomde> 'what will I be doing'?
[16:31] <eroomde> 'holding a helix antenna'
[16:31] <eroomde> 'excuse me, i'm not that kind of model. if you want him to lick me you need to phone a differtent agency'
[16:35] <daveake> lol
[16:39] <SpeedEvil> Hah. Currently on benefits, and the credit card I'm with has just upped my limit to 1750.
[16:39] <BrainDamage> you succeded in the trials? if so, congrats
[16:40] <SpeedEvil> err - if you mean the tribunal - yes, incidentally, but different benefit, and they haven't actually given me that money yet.
[16:40] <SpeedEvil> Thanks.
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[17:47] <daveake> How to repair an SSD ... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Indilinx-SSD-OCZ-Martini-SLC-repair-PCB-64G- 128G-256G-/230586704956
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[17:56] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[17:56] <Lunar_Lander> I need help
[17:57] <SpeedEvil> daveake: 404
[17:57] <SamSilver_> 911
[17:57] <Lunar_Lander> on my Ubuntu PC, that BIOS screen "with the Intel Logo and press DEL to setup" takes quite long. Then I cut the power to the PC, switched the power back on and then the LEDs on my Keyboard lit up and stayed on. Then it didn't recognize the USB WLAN receiver and when I then put in the Knoppix LIVE DVD, it almost hang at "Hardware Abstraction Layer"
[17:57] <Lunar_Lander> hardware error?
[17:57] <BrainDamage> SpeedEvil: drop the space between - and 128
[17:57] <BrainDamage> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Indilinx-SSD-OCZ-Martini-SLC-repair-PCB-64G-128G-256G-/230586704956
[17:57] <daveake> Cut 'n' pasted from a post with a NL in it
[17:58] <daveake> Though Chrome worked anyway
[17:58] <SpeedEvil> ah
[17:59] <SpeedEvil> The PCB does not seem a likely failure part
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[17:59] <daveake> Indeed. Don't see it making the memory 20% faster either!
[17:59] <SpeedEvil> I think it would perhaps be more accurately described 'I got this huuuge bag of PCBs that failed e-test'.
[17:59] <daveake> lol
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[18:09] <cuddykid> so frustrated with this internet! Going from 100+mbps to 2mbps where upload kills the internet
[18:09] <cuddykid> upload of 0.3mbps
[18:09] <cuddykid> at good times :(
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[18:10] <daveake> Possible camera if anyone is after one - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Canon-PowerShot-A470-7-1-MP-Digital-Camera-Blue-/250992194009?pt=UK_CamerasPhoto_DigitalCameras_DigitalCameras_JN&hash=item3a704cf1d9#ht_500wt_1413
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[18:34] <Laurenceb_> sup
[18:38] <Lunar_Lander> dinnertime bbl
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[19:16] <jcoxon> evening all
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[19:25] <Upu> evening
[19:25] <jcoxon> launch is on sunday
[19:25] <Upu> ok cool what time ?
[19:25] <jcoxon> morning
[19:26] <Upu> I'm about until about 1
[19:26] <jcoxon> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=c33a68b84d92d68bdf4db39969f3170883b0c870
[19:26] <Upu> going floating :)
[19:26] <jcoxon> thats the plan
[19:30] <Upu> "monkey" has posted me the PCB's
[19:30] <Upu> so hang fire on Pico flights I will have something for you to test
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[19:35] <jcoxon> will do
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[19:55] <nigelvh> Anyone got insights as to how well the habhub predictor thingy might work in the US? I assume it should work fine, but I don't know what the data sources are.
[19:56] <Laurenceb_> GFA
[19:56] <Laurenceb_> *GFS even
[19:56] <Laurenceb_> us weather agency
[19:56] <Lunar_Lander> yea NOAA
[19:56] <Laurenceb_> thats the one
[19:57] <nigelvh> So it should be fine
[19:57] Action: Laurenceb_ memory fail
[19:57] <nigelvh> Thanks
[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> it also works for Australia, so
[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> :P
[19:57] <nigelvh> I was just curious because I had only seen predictions for europe.
[19:57] <Upu> USA is same planet I think so should be good
[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> yay Ubuntu update time!
[19:57] <nigelvh> The way our gov. is acting these days, I'm not so sure.
[19:57] <daveake_> hmmmm
[19:58] <nigelvh> I'm increasingly convinced they're hostile aliens.
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[19:59] <nigelvh> None the less, the predictor will be handy. Thanks for the info.
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[20:10] <Laurenceb_> http://search.digikey.com/us/en/products/SE4110L-R/863-1351-1-ND/2745470
[20:10] <Laurenceb_> hawt
[20:10] <Lunar_Lander> hi fsphil-laptop
[20:11] <Lunar_Lander> Laurenceb_ what does it do?
[20:12] <Laurenceb_> gps front end
[20:12] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[20:13] <Upu> can't make it easy for yourself can you Laurenceb ? :)
[20:14] <Laurenceb_> i want to make a receiver with a front end and stm32f4
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[20:16] <Upu> there is lots of clever signal processing that goes on once you've received the signal though isn't there ?
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[20:20] <Laurenceb_> yes
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[20:25] <Lunar_Lander> hi GW8RAK
[20:25] <GW8RAK> Evening Lunar.
[20:29] <Lunar_Lander> how are you?
[20:35] <GW8RAK> Fine. Having a night tidying the radio room
[20:35] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[20:35] <Lunar_Lander> sounds good
[20:36] <GW8RAK> There's unfinished projects and faulty radios everywhere. Need to make some space
[20:36] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[20:58] <Laurenceb_> actually its still not very feasible :(
[20:58] <Laurenceb_> theres no countones in thumb2
[20:58] <Laurenceb_> and the best code takes about 6 clks
[20:58] <Laurenceb_> that eats all the cycles so you can only do ~8channel gps on stm32f4
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[21:10] <eroomde> Laurenceb_: cool project
[21:11] <eroomde> but yeah i gues you would probably want some hardware assistance for the very front end at least
[21:11] <Laurenceb_> yeah i just thought id take another look at the idea
[21:11] <oh7lzb> Is this old news? http://www.southgatearc.org/news/february2012/aimed_for_china.htm
[21:11] <Laurenceb_> http://www.sciencezero.org/index.php?title=ARM:_Count_ones_%28bit_count%29
[21:12] <Laurenceb_> ouch
[21:12] <eroomde> not that old!
[21:12] <eroomde> but very exciting and ambitious
[21:12] <Laurenceb_> hmm... GPIO->resistor ladder -> adc
[21:12] <Laurenceb_> :P
[21:12] <eroomde> also i don't know if the chinese would like it much
[21:12] <Laurenceb_> i dont think eroomde would approve
[21:12] <eroomde> but they probably couldn't shoot it down so
[21:12] <eroomde> meh
[21:13] <eroomde> huh?
[21:13] <Laurenceb_> GPIO->resistor ladder -> adc
[21:13] <eroomde> of what would i not approve?
[21:13] <Laurenceb_> for countones
[21:13] <eroomde> adv with resistor ladder?
[21:13] <Laurenceb_> shove the 32bit word to gpio
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> then just filter with a cap
[21:14] <eroomde> that's fine i think
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> to do the loop filter XD
[21:14] <eroomde> if it's a 1bit dac anyway, just have 32bit ints as your data arrays
[21:14] <eroomde> oh hang on i see
[21:14] <eroomde> gosh
[21:14] <eroomde> ouch
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> i know
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> im working it out for using 32bit words
[21:15] <Laurenceb_> it ends up with 8 channel being just feasible
[21:15] <Laurenceb_> but countones takes all the cycles
[21:15] <Laurenceb_> that thumb2 code is 10 clkc
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[21:16] <Laurenceb_> bbl
[21:16] <Laurenceb_> the only other code is a few XORs
[21:16] <Laurenceb_> with lookup tables
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[21:25] <radicalbiscuit> Greetings all. Any known launches upcoming?
[21:29] <Upu> hey radicalbiscuit
[21:29] <Upu> jcoxon is probably launching on Sunday I believe check mailing list for confirmation
[21:29] <Upu> Evening CovBalloon
[21:30] <Lunar_Lander> hi CovBalloon radicalbiscuit
[21:32] <radicalbiscuit> Many thanks
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[21:39] <oh7lzb> http://aprs.fi/telemetry/KT5TK-11 - cool, they're transmitting telemetry tomorrow
[21:39] <oh7lzb> from the texas floater
[21:39] <Upu> APRS I believe will be on aprs.fi
[21:39] <CovBalloon> hi all
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[21:40] <Upu> Going to be a bit south for us Euro peoples oh7lzb if it does float this way
[21:40] <oh7lzb> yup, http://www.southgatearc.org/news/february2012/aimed_for_china.htm
[21:40] <oh7lzb> we'll see
[21:41] <oh7lzb> i guess most likely it will become a sea floater in the atlantic
[21:43] <Upu> well the last one made it to the med from California
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[21:43] <Upu> oh
[21:43] <Upu> duh
[21:43] <Upu> you run aprs.fi :)
[21:44] <Upu> didn't recognise the callsign nick
[21:45] <Lunar_Lander> Upu: maybe we will see that circumnavigation earlier than expected
[21:46] <Upu> well
[21:46] <Upu> thats quite a step further
[21:51] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[22:00] <Laurenceb_> eroomde: http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=software%20gps%20correlator&source=web&cd=4&ved=0CDkQFjAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Fkom.aau.dk%2F~pdma02%2F2923_ref9.pdf&ei=KIU1T-aMEs3q8QODw8XAAg&usg=AFQjCNGEjjIg6TTOiE_JamhPSWhTS75U0g&cad=rja
[22:01] <Laurenceb_> on x86 that works out at 33MHz/channel
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[22:03] <danielsaul> had a reply from costello about boc and the free helium yet?
[22:03] <danielsaul> urgh
[22:05] <fsphil-laptop> this is not the window you where looking for huh
[22:05] <jonsowman> lol
[22:05] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[23:34] #highaltitude: mode change '+o jcoxon' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
[23:35] Topic changed on #highaltitude by jcoxon!jcoxon@host86-181-59-201.range86-181.btcentralplus.com: Welcome to #highaltitude - discuss anything to do with high altitude projects (balloons, gliders etc) www.ukhas.org.uk XABEN Sun 12/2/12 1000 UTC Suffolk, UK
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[00:00] --- Sat Feb 11 2012