highaltitude.log.20120201

[00:00] <Darkside> heh
[00:00] <Darkside> i dunno what costs are to get up to cairns
[00:00] <Darkside> i know accomodation willbe scarce
[00:00] <fsphil> it already is from what I've heard
[00:00] <Darkside> i bet...
[00:00] <fsphil> I think that's why they're trying to hurry me up
[00:01] <Darkside> heh
[00:01] <Darkside> no chance for a side-trip to adelaide? :P
[00:01] <Darkside> its a bit far away from QLD :P
[00:01] <fsphil> just down the road....
[00:01] <Darkside> hah
[00:01] <Darkside> about 5 hours away by plane i think
[00:01] <fsphil> (I'm sure there is a road)
[00:01] <fsphil> lol
[00:01] <Darkside> oh yeah, you could drive
[00:01] <Darkside> it'd take you 2 days
[00:02] <fsphil> that's mad. this island really is so tiny
[00:02] <Darkside> hehe
[00:02] <MLow> MY IDEA
[00:02] <MLow> you took it
[00:02] <Darkside> man, it would be great to have UK people along for a launch :P
[00:02] <Darkside> i've been to the UK for a launch, now UK people come to australia for a launch :D
[00:03] <fsphil> if only the eclipse track was further south. stupid moon
[00:03] <Darkside> hehe
[00:03] <Darkside> it is in a really annoying location
[00:03] <fsphil> yea
[00:04] <Darkside> i don't think i'll be going
[00:04] <fsphil> I think the sheet I got mentioned Sydney
[00:04] <Darkside> uhm
[00:04] <Darkside> sydney is WAY south of where you'll be going
[00:05] <Darkside> http://g.co/maps/wxjmk
[00:05] <Darkside> thats where cairns is
[00:06] <fsphil> 18th November 2012 you will be transferred to Cairns airport by coach
[00:06] <fsphil> 18th November 2012 Cairns - Brisbane 1000 1210
[00:06] <fsphil> 18th November 2012 Brisbane  Sydney 1325 1600
[00:06] <fsphil> 18th November 2012 Sydney  London Heathrow 1730 0620 +1
[00:06] <Darkside> yeah you'd leave the country via sydney
[00:06] <fsphil> ^^ doesn't make sense to me, unless that's the only way international flights can leave .au?
[00:06] <fsphil> ah
[00:06] <Darkside> uh oh
[00:06] <Darkside> 1.5 hours in sydney
[00:06] <Darkside> bad idea
[00:06] <Darkside> very very bad idea
[00:06] <fsphil> zombies?
[00:06] <Darkside> no, you won't get through all the bullshit in time
[00:07] <Darkside> you want at LEAST 2 hours in sydney
[00:07] <MLow> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12996303/hab%20pics/IMG_20120131_180440.jpg cutdown box
[00:07] <Darkside> MLow: did you just make that...
[00:07] <fsphil> lol
[00:07] <MLow> yeas....
[00:07] <Darkside> awesome
[00:08] <MLow> its just buttons on a box you caught me
[00:08] <fsphil> it's like a more advanced version of the Holly Hop Drive
[00:08] <Darkside> hahaha
[00:08] <Darkside> oh yes, the holly hop drive
[00:09] <Darkside> fsphil: aaaaaanyway, you may want to mention to the organisers, that a local has mentioned that you're gonna want a bit more time than 1.5 hours in sydney
[00:09] <fsphil> I'll email them about that in the morning
[00:09] <Darkside> i've had similar problems when booking flights through UK travel agents
[00:09] <Darkside> its australia, we are laid back
[00:09] <Darkside> things take time
[00:10] <fsphil> this is the hotel, http://www.tropicalqueenslander.com.au/
[00:10] <Darkside> you're going to have to collect your bags from the brisbane flight (15 min), go check them into international (20-30min), then be fully checked in 1.5 hours BEFORE your flight leaves
[00:10] <fsphil> ah screw it, I'll go
[00:10] <Darkside> you can't do it with that much time
[00:11] <Darkside> same going the other way
[00:12] <Darkside> anyway, see if you can tack on a few extra days and fly down here :P
[00:12] <fsphil> they've set aside 5 hours
[00:12] <Darkside> fly sydney to adelaide
[00:12] <Darkside> :P
[00:13] <fsphil> I'd be up there 7 days, I'd be bored silly every day except the eclipse :)
[00:13] <Darkside> bring a SSDV payload
[00:13] <Darkside> jeez
[00:13] <fsphil> yea
[00:13] <fsphil> the swift boards will be ready by then
[00:14] <Darkside> where is the eclipse positioned in the trip?
[00:14] <Darkside> right in the middle?
[00:14] <fsphil> 9th - 18th, eclipse is the 14th
[00:14] <fsphil> sorta
[00:14] <Darkside> mm
[00:14] <Darkside> you're going to be hot and bored
[00:15] <Darkside> lol
[00:15] <fsphil> they mention Parkes, is that far from there?
[00:15] <Darkside> yes
[00:15] <Darkside> lol
[00:15] <Darkside> well, its nearer sydney
[00:16] <Darkside> fsphil: remember, nothing is 'near' anywhere in australia
[00:16] <fsphil> yea
[00:16] <fsphil> however far away it looks, it's further
[00:16] <Darkside> http://g.co/maps/64j5n <-- Prkes
[00:16] <Darkside> Parkes*
[00:16] <fsphil> oh nowhere near it
[00:17] <Darkside> yep lol
[00:17] <Darkside> ok i'd better head to uni
[00:17] <Darkside> back later
[00:17] <fsphil> laters!
[00:17] <fsphil> I better sleep
[00:29] <SpeedEvil> http://www.b3ta.com/links/627895 (this is not related to anything)
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[00:51] <Darkside> woo i have my RFM22Bs
[00:51] <SpeedEvil> Congrats!
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[02:15] <MLow> Darkside: you hanging around?
[02:18] <Darkside> yep
[02:18] <Darkside> just reading datasheets
[02:19] <MLow> check out these guys antenna design
[02:19] <MLow> http://www.w5acm.net/B27_Disk_Art.jpg
[02:20] <Darkside> hah
[02:20] <Darkside> its a 1/4 wave monopole, just positioned away from the payload
[02:21] <MLow> yeah
[02:21] <MLow> ground plane is more common term for it over here
[02:21] <Darkside> well yes
[02:22] <Darkside> its a 1/4 wave monopole with ground radials
[02:22] <MLow> now that just sounds silly
[02:24] <MLow> these guys have 10+ years and dozens of launches behind their belt
[02:24] <MLow> latest launches have flown HSMM nodes with streaming broadband connections to earth
[02:24] <Darkside> jaysus
[02:24] <Darkside> thats interesting
[02:25] <MLow> basically a modified wrt54g cisco router, with mesh network firmware and 500mw amp
[02:25] <Darkside> oh
[02:25] <Darkside> is that all
[02:26] <MLow> 54mbps connection to the same hardware planet-side
[02:26] <Darkside> we've been considering doing wifi off a balloon, but then we'd have to sort out tracking dishes and stuff on the ground
[02:27] <MLow> it needs 12v, and it's pretty lightweight
[02:27] <MLow> a 3s rc battery can do that
[02:27] <Darkside> don't use lipos on a balloon
[02:27] <MLow> they've used it all
[02:27] <Darkside> well, if they are undergoing enough current draw to keep them warm its ok
[02:27] <Darkside> but once lipos freeze they don't work
[02:28] <Darkside> its why we usually stick to lithium primary cells - they operate happily right down to -50 degrees C
[02:30] <MLow> lithium iron disulfide is what most hab guys swear by
[02:30] <Darkside> that sounds about right
[02:30] <MLow> its the energizer 'ultimate' lithium brand
[02:30] <Darkside> yep
[02:31] <Darkside> this is exactly what we use
[02:31] <MLow> but you can obviously order them from different sources same battery
[02:31] <Darkside> http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/l91.pdf
[02:31] <MLow> energizer IMO too overpriced
[02:31] <Darkside> we get them off ebay
[02:31] <Darkside> ends up costing <$1 each
[02:31] <Darkside> but yeah, thats the chemistry we use, and we've never had problems
[02:32] <MLow> right
[02:32] <MLow> luckily i have access to a meat freezer
[02:32] <MLow> mounds of data at my fingertips :P
[02:32] <SpeedEvil> I'm amused that my freezer will exceed -45C if I leave it.
[02:32] <SpeedEvil> On 'boost'
[02:32] <Darkside> haha
[02:32] <Darkside> wow
[02:32] <SpeedEvil> Ordinary domestic superinsulated one.
[02:32] <Darkside> anyway, back in a bit, i need to get lunch
[02:33] <MLow> cool man dont starve on account of battery talk
[02:33] <SpeedEvil> It rises in temp (full) by about 2C/day
[02:33] <MLow> luckily i work at a restaurant so yeah..both access to freezer AND cold food
[02:34] <MLow> the freezer has 3 'zones'
[02:34] <SpeedEvil> In principle, a really rather modest little thingy could sit in a normal freezer with a teeny peltier.
[02:34] <MLow> first door is for beer/wine/etc/ 30f, second is for food that isnt meat, -15f, and the last...i cant stand in there for very long without turning purple
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[02:36] <MLow> like in series doors, you have to go deeper
[02:36] <SpeedEvil> It's shocking how much colder -40C is than -18C
[02:36] <MLow> 0c is 32f right?
[02:37] <SpeedEvil> -18 is sort-of bearable without gloves.
[02:37] <SpeedEvil> yes
[02:37] <SpeedEvil> -18 is the normal setting for freezers.
[02:37] <SpeedEvil> C
[02:37] <MLow> and its something like f = c x 2 + 32?
[02:37] <SpeedEvil> 0F = -18
[02:38] <MLow> i flunked math
[02:38] <SpeedEvil> -50F=-45C
[02:40] <MLow> lets just say, the back of that freezer is so cold
[02:40] <MLow> if you leave 100 proof vodka back there it freezes solid in like an hour
[02:40] <MLow> and i didn't even know you could do that
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[02:41] <MLow> hi dan
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[03:16] <MLow> wow these BLT guys could certainly have a better website
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[03:20] <Darkside> this is a problem with many ham radio projects
[03:20] <Darkside> inadequate documentation
[03:52] <MLow> wtf argen data ships from hawaii
[03:52] <MLow> argent*
[03:53] <MLow> they have like 1 video
[03:53] <MLow> out of 30 some launches
[03:54] <MLow> and its an atv stream, of the flight highlights...lol it lands on the median between a highway
[03:57] <Darkside> heh
[03:57] <Darkside> we've done... 22 launches now
[03:57] <Darkside> and have video from most of them
[03:57] <Darkside> we at least have pictures from each launch
[04:04] <MLow> Well documentation i think is part of the fun
[04:04] <MLow> at some point I'm going to get a blog and document me penny pinching my way to near-space
[04:06] <MLow> each flight these guy strap a 9v alkaline and buzzer to the size, exposed fully
[04:06] <MLow> and you can still hear it in near-space, color me confused
[04:09] <SpeedEvil> Sound will drop off a bit less than as the pressure
[04:09] <SpeedEvil> So at 1%, you're going to get a bit more than 1% volume
[04:09] <SpeedEvil> as the buzzer will vibrate more
[04:09] <SpeedEvil> maybe a lot more
[04:12] <MLow> i need to figure out hot to cut down on tabs...
[04:15] <MLow> hey how do you make a blog
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[04:30] <SpeedEvil> Find some hosting.
[04:31] <SpeedEvil> Type it in
[04:37] <MLow> well...
[04:37] <MLow> was hoping for some specifics...
[04:38] <MLow> in other odd news...ups seems to have shipped my package in the opposite direction of me
[04:38] <SpeedEvil> If you want, you could even stick it on the ukhas wiki
[04:39] <MLow> sounds like you would prefer i dont
[04:42] <SpeedEvil> I have no influence. :) It was a random source.
[04:42] <SpeedEvil> thought
[04:42] <SpeedEvil> There are _many_ blog sites out there.
[04:42] <SpeedEvil> What one would be easiest for you depends on your skills.
[04:43] <SpeedEvil> You might want to get your own server, ...
[04:44] <MLow> i have one of those
[04:44] <SpeedEvil> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blog_software
[04:45] <MLow> a VPS
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[05:16] <oh7lzb> MLow: Easiest is using blogger.com (google) or wordpress.com, just register/login and type your articles in
[05:16] <oh7lzb> those are very customizable too, allow all sorts of widgets and customisations
[05:17] <oh7lzb> and they allow you to export your content so that you can import them in some other platform later if you change your mind
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[07:48] Action: jcoxon has worked out why his arduino keeps resetting
[07:49] <jcoxon> on transmission the SPoT must draw a load of currrent
[07:49] <jcoxon> dropping the voltage
[07:49] <SamSilver> which is a good and a bag thing
[07:50] <SamSilver> good in that it has more chance of reaching a sat and a bad in that the batt suffers
[07:50] <jcoxon> yeah
[07:51] <jcoxon> its annoying from the arduino point of view
[07:51] <UpuWork> morning jcoxon
[07:51] <number10> whats the duration of the high current draw
[07:52] <UpuWork> big capacitor ?
[07:53] <jcoxon> would need to measure it
[07:53] <jcoxon> its not too long
[07:53] <jcoxon> this is only a theory
[07:53] <UpuWork> sounds viable
[07:54] <zyp> sounds like a lack of proper decoupling
[07:54] <fsphil> seems to be a common problem with satellite modems
[07:54] <jcoxon> the other issue is that its running of 2AAs
[07:55] <jcoxon> so with the arduinos reg it doesn't take long till it'll be quite near the limit of its low voltage
[07:55] <Upu> replace Arduino reg with a step up ?
[07:55] <jcoxon> another option would be to instead borrow the SPoTs regulator as well as that has a DC -DC converter/step up
[07:56] <Upu> you need a proper pico board with a step up on it
[08:07] <jcoxon> i think it'll improve also when i power the GPS on and off before tx'ing
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[08:16] <daveake_> I mentioned my flight on an electronics forum, and all of a sudden I have some extra radio hams volunteering to track this weekend :-)
[08:16] Nick change: daveake_ -> daveake
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[08:27] <Darkside> daveake: hey
[08:27] <Darkside> i need a favour from your
[08:27] <Darkside> you
[08:27] <daveake> ok ...
[08:27] <Darkside> could you please make your payload measure RSSI between sentences
[08:27] <Darkside> and send that data down in the transmitted sentence
[08:28] <Darkside> this is to determine how overloaded the radio gets at altitude
[08:28] <daveake> <slightly confused> .... RSSI is for Rx and who's sending to it? Or you're worried about spill from the main Tx in the other payload?
[08:28] <Darkside> both
[08:29] <Darkside> i'm concerned that the input filter on the radio may be too wide, and may get overloaed when it can suddenly see everything in the area
[08:29] <daveake> OK gottit
[08:29] <Darkside> pretty much, if you can switch it into the narrowest OOK mode you can
[08:29] <Upu> damn are we doing like SCIENCE ?
[08:29] <Darkside> like, low baud rate OOK
[08:29] <daveake> I'll see what I can do
[08:29] <Darkside> then take an average of a number of RSSI measurements
[08:29] <daveake> scarily close to doing that
[08:29] <Darkside> then ttransmit that as a parameter in your sentence
[08:29] <Darkside> yes, this is science
[08:30] <Darkside> because i'm not close enough to being able to launch a RFM22B yet
[08:30] <Darkside> and i need some data on how selective it is
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[08:32] <daveake> At the mo it never stops Txing, so I'd need to stop it, set this OOK thing, wait a while for it to settle, take a few measurements, average them, then add them to the next sentence and start tTxing again?
[08:32] <Darkside> that could all happe within a second
[08:33] <Darkside> or less
[08:33] <Darkside> also i've found that teh RFM22B does have a direct FSK mode
[08:33] <daveake> Needs to be a short time - the rfm22 will drift otherwise
[08:33] <Darkside> so i think we may be able to just set it up right and spam bits at it
[08:34] <daveake> Not sure I'll have time to do it for this weekend tho - way behind on work as it is
[08:34] <Darkside> ahh
[08:34] <Darkside> i thought there was stuff already in the libraries for measuring rssi
[08:34] <Darkside> but yeah, if you could get it working that'd be greatly appreciated
[08:34] <daveake> (on account of building this thing instead of real work)
[08:34] <Darkside> basically i need to know if i need to put a filter in front of the radio on my cudown
[08:34] <daveake> Prolly. I'll take a look :)
[08:34] <Darkside> cutdown*
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[09:55] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[09:55] <Lunar_Lander> Upu: are you here?
[09:55] <UpuWork> no leave a message after the beep
[09:55] <UpuWork> beep
[09:55] <Lunar_Lander> BBC TV is the greatest in Europe
[09:55] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[09:56] <Lunar_Lander> *hangs up receiver*
[09:56] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[09:57] <costyn> Lunar_Lander: yes, BBC makes amazing TV
[09:57] <Lunar_Lander> yeah!
[09:58] <Lunar_Lander> btw
[09:58] <Lunar_Lander> I read that ASTRA 2D carries BBC and the like Free To Air but the spotbeam is centered on the UK
[09:58] <Lunar_Lander> the BBC would like to have it not spreading to the continent but as that is not possible, continental people can receive 2D
[09:58] <Lunar_Lander> :P
[09:58] <costyn> interesting
[09:59] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[09:59] <Lunar_Lander> also, everyone else in Europe encodes his program
[09:59] <Lunar_Lander> the netherlands, austria, switzerland
[09:59] <Lunar_Lander> only we germans broadcast ARD and ZDF FTA
[10:00] <Lunar_Lander> thus the whole of europe can watch it for free
[10:00] <Lunar_Lander> and we have to pay GEZ
[10:00] <oh7lzb> But the voice is encrypted still 8)
[10:00] <costyn> BBC voice is encrypted?
[10:00] <oh7lzb> ARD/ZDF
[10:00] <Lunar_Lander> he means because it is in german
[10:01] <costyn> bwahaa
[10:01] <oh7lzb> Even foreign movies have been encrypted afterwards
[10:02] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[10:03] <costyn> not very good encryption though, with word frequency analysis it can be decoded
[10:03] <costyn> hard to automate though
[10:03] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[10:18] <fsphil> so learning to speak german can be considered cracking now? :)
[10:19] <fsphil> Lunar_Lander, the spot beam isn't perfect. all you need is a big dish
[10:19] <gonzo_> you can probably still get UK spotbeam from EU using a bigger dish
[10:20] <gonzo_> snaP!
[10:22] <Lunar_Lander> that is what I meant
[10:22] <Lunar_Lander> :)
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[10:40] <daveake> ping Darkside
[10:41] <Darkside> daveake: pong
[10:41] <Lunar_Lander> hi daveake
[10:41] <Lunar_Lander> I got a question for you
[10:41] <daveake> I had a look, and getting the latest RSSI is trivially easy
[10:42] <Lunar_Lander> what people lecture in british universities?
[10:42] <Darkside> daveake: yeah
[10:42] <Darkside> you just need to not be transmitting
[10:42] <Lunar_Lander> are those only professors or also readers and lecturers?
[10:42] <daveake> You mentioned setting baud rate and a mode ... surely I don't need that? I just need to be not Txing?
[10:42] <Darkside> the other stuff i mentioned is also relvant, as in setting it into a baud rate sets certain filters
[10:42] <daveake> ok
[10:42] <Darkside> and i'm interested in seeing how the filters perform
[10:43] <daveake> Do you have any code for the settings you intend to use?
[10:43] <Darkside> nope lol
[10:43] <Darkside> havent got it working yet
[10:43] <daveake> damn lol
[10:43] <Darkside> but its basically setting it into OOK mode, and the lowest baud rate
[10:43] <daveake> ok
[10:43] <Darkside> another cool trick we could do with this, is have someone on the ground TX when we know its going to measure
[10:44] <Darkside> and see if theres a noticable difference in RSSI
[10:44] <Lunar_Lander> calling daveake Delta Alpha Victor Echo
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[10:47] <daveake> brb
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[11:03] <daveake> back
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[11:03] <Lunar_Lander> wb
[11:03] <Lunar_Lander> daveake: do you have time for a question?
[11:03] <daveake> yes. was that it?
[11:04] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[11:04] <Lunar_Lander> let me rephrase
[11:04] <Lunar_Lander> do you have time for two questions?
[11:04] <daveake> :)
[11:04] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[11:04] <Lunar_Lander> the thing is: I read that in the UK, there are Lecturers and Readers besides professors doing the teaching at universities
[11:05] <Lunar_Lander> and that those two groups are actually bigger than the group of professors
[11:05] <Lunar_Lander> is that true?
[11:05] <daveake> hold on, that's a third question ...
[11:05] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[11:05] <daveake> No idea, sorry ... it's 30 years since I left uni and I don't remember any of it :)
[11:05] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[11:05] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[11:06] <Lunar_Lander> because I read an article of how postdocs in germany often get temporal contracts and are often forced to move from uni to uni
[11:06] <Lunar_Lander> in France, Austria, Switzerland, england and the Czech republic there are those intermediate levels of like the Reader which take up a much larger group
[11:07] <Lunar_Lander> limited contracts are much more seldom
[11:07] <Lunar_Lander> thus I asked myself if my future maybe is in England
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[11:13] <Lunar_Lander> in ENGLAND
[11:13] <Lunar_Lander> and if I live there, I can spend my weekends going to level crossings and watch trains go by
[11:14] <number10> feel free to get a close look
[11:15] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[11:22] <number10> try not to have too much Zwiebelkuchen and Neuer Wein before your visit
[11:24] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[11:24] <Lunar_Lander> actually, before you joined I explained the situations of postdocs in germany
[11:24] <number10> we dont usually get much in the way of horse and carts anymore
[11:24] <Lunar_Lander> and that I thought if my future (read post-2018) could be in the UK
[11:30] <Lunar_Lander> opinions?
[11:31] <eroomde> Lunar_Lander: post docs often move around in the UK too
[11:31] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[11:31] <costyn> is there a cheaper way of getting this functionality? http://www.sparkfun.com/products/10711
[11:31] <eroomde> but yes, there are the two intermediate stages (sometimes more) before professor
[11:31] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[11:31] <Lunar_Lander> the Lecturer and Sen. Lecturer right?
[11:32] <Lunar_Lander> and the latter one is sometimes called reader
[11:32] <eroomde> yes
[11:32] <eroomde> cambride has other wierdnesses too
[11:32] <eroomde> college lecturer, university lecturer, senior university lecturer
[11:35] <eroomde> but it's not a one dimensional space
[11:35] <eroomde> so some titles reflect more on contributions to teaching rather than research
[11:35] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[11:36] <Lunar_Lander> both is important
[11:36] <Lunar_Lander> as Feynman noted, the Institute for Advanced Study in Princeton soon lacked ideas as the people in there were put free of teaching
[11:37] <Lunar_Lander> they thought that having the most bright people in the world having all their time for thinking would produce the best ideas
[11:37] <Lunar_Lander> but lack of contact to students is bad
[11:37] <eroomde> agreed
[11:38] <eroomde> but the correlation is not always strong
[11:38] <eroomde> you do get some brilliant professors who should definitely not be given a first year undergrad introductory course
[11:38] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[11:39] <eroomde> we had such a thing for first year (first term) mathematics
[11:39] <Lunar_Lander> oh you too
[11:39] <eroomde> taking us for transforms
[11:40] <eroomde> so when you're 18 and you've just done school maths, you want to be told that a fourier transform is a thing that lets you make up any arbirary signal with a series of sines and cosines of different frequencies and magnitudes right?
[11:40] <eroomde> and our first lecture on the subject was actually him arriving 5 mins late, sweeping onto the stage and saying
[11:40] <eroomde> Hello, I'm Fitzgerald. Now, consider some orthogoanl set phi...'
[11:41] <eroomde> and launching off onto the blackboard
[11:41] <WillDuckworth> awesome stuff eh?
[11:41] <eroomde> at the end of the lecture we were all a bit shellshocked
[11:42] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[11:42] <Lunar_Lander> I can understand that well
[11:42] Action: costyn had those kinds of courses in uni too; at the end you're like "I'm never going to get this..."
[11:42] <eroomde> uhuh
[11:44] <eroomde> i had him for my masters though, for bayesian inference and machine learning
[11:44] <eroomde> and he was fantastic
[11:44] <eroomde> my best lecturer
[11:44] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[11:44] <eroomde> you just have to know your audience though, and realise the the art of communication is making sure you match your audiences input impedance
[11:45] <eroomde> and there was a pretty big mismatch when he took us in first year
[11:45] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[11:46] <Darkside> eroomde: I kv
[11:46] <Darkside> ack
[11:46] <eroomde> ?
[11:47] <Darkside> I love the impedance mismatch analogy
[11:47] <eroomde> SWR too high
[11:47] <eroomde> oh right
[11:47] <Darkside> it works so well
[11:47] <Darkside> also on phone
[11:47] <Darkside> ok
[11:47] <Darkside> rssi data comm code
[11:47] <Darkside> how, and how reliable
[11:47] <eroomde> poll it fast
[11:48] <Darkside> and how did yiu tx on gnd
[11:48] <Darkside> cw?
[11:48] <eroomde> yes
[11:48] <Darkside> ao yo uh keyed a radio?
[11:48] <eroomde> into the serial port on the radio
[11:48] <eroomde> .names
[11:48] <Darkside> or genefated audio
[11:48] <Darkside> ffff this kbd
[11:48] <eroomde> cw
[11:48] <Darkside> ok
[11:48] <Darkside> what rate
[11:49] <eroomde> and the choice of thresholding on the chip is probably quite important
[11:49] <eroomde> i think 10 or 20 baud
[11:49] <eroomde> can't recall
[11:49] <Darkside> heh ok
[11:49] <Lunar_Lander> btw eroomde Darkside I got an idea
[11:49] <Lunar_Lander> before I have to leave now
[11:49] <Darkside> yeah I was wondering how you did threahildi ng
[11:49] <Darkside> thresholding
[11:49] <Lunar_Lander> what if making an UKHAS book one day?
[11:49] <Lunar_Lander> *about
[11:49] <Lunar_Lander> not if
[11:50] <Darkside> was it a dynamic threshold
[11:50] <Darkside> wondering if rx gets overloaded in air
[11:50] <Lunar_Lander> and the book has to contain this sentence: "The Communications are done at 50 baud. You can actually talk faster than that!"
[11:50] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[11:51] <eroomde> :)
[11:51] <eroomde> i'd quite like to do a book
[11:51] <Darkside> we do 300
[11:51] <eroomde> the elements of high altitude ballooning
[11:51] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[11:51] <Lunar_Lander> Darkside: is that also comparable to talking speed?
[11:52] <Darkside> 50bd is for uk ppl
[11:52] <Darkside> lol
[11:52] <eroomde> more of a treatment of a few interesting topics. comms, parachutes, floating etc
[11:52] <Darkside> eroomde: thatd be good
[11:52] <Darkside> I started some work on somethinf similar
[11:52] <Darkside> as a seriea of blog posts
[11:52] <eroomde> yeah
[11:53] <eroomde> they would all make good blog posts really
[11:53] <eroomde> is there a LaTeX plugin on the ukhas wiki?
[11:53] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[11:53] <Darkside> basically it was to be a justification for our methods
[11:54] <eroomde> indeed
[11:54] <eroomde> good to have it all in writing somewhere
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[11:55] <Darkside> yup
[11:55] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[11:55] <Lunar_Lander> but still we need to keep the learning curve
[11:55] <Lunar_Lander> like for the GPS software integration
[11:55] <Lunar_Lander> which makes me think of head+wall=bash
[11:56] <eroomde> keep at it
[11:56] <eroomde> might be an advantage to prototype it in python actually
[11:56] <eroomde> as that is so good for string manipulation
[11:57] <eroomde> and then work on translating it into c step by step
[11:57] <eroomde> oh except duck typing probably hides all the float to string conversions from you and so on
[11:57] <eroomde> hrm maybe ignore that advice
[11:58] <Lunar_Lander> ok
[12:00] <Darkside> ok home...
[12:00] <Darkside> eroomde: so how did you do the thresholding?
[12:00] <Darkside> because i'm considering doing somethign similar witha RFM22B
[12:00] <Lunar_Lander> one day I'll get it I think
[12:00] <Lunar_Lander> eroomde :)
[12:01] <LazyLeopard> You want a learning curve? Make 'em learn Morse (at 30wpm)!
[12:03] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[12:08] <eroomde> Darkside: i think it could be done better than how it was done
[12:08] <eroomde> which was a sort of just sampling of background and threshold a few db's above
[12:08] <eroomde> cos your SNR value is going to drop a lot as it floats away
[12:09] <eroomde> also it was very possible to saturate it with too much power when it was close
[12:09] <Darkside> eroomde: yeah i was going to do the same thing
[12:09] <Darkside> but i think i might end up using the modules OOK mode
[12:09] <Darkside> at the lowest possible baud rate
[12:09] <eroomde> so some kind of (topically) adaptive decision threshold algorithm might be good
[12:09] <Darkside> have it send a heartbeat packet so i can monitor the drift
[12:10] <eroomde> yes you def want to do that
[12:10] <Darkside> use the heartbeat to tune a radio, then playback a pre-recorded packet
[12:10] <Darkside> or maybe use the CW key port if i can key it fast enough
[12:10] <eroomde> we used an arduino to do it all
[12:10] <eroomde> on the ground
[12:10] <eroomde> plugged into the back of the radio
[12:10] <Darkside> heh
[12:10] <Darkside> yeah but that was art 20 baud
[12:11] <Darkside> the minimum this thing goes to is 150 baud
[12:11] <Darkside> anyway, i've got a LOT of testing to do :P
[12:11] <Lunar_Lander> time to go home :)
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[12:20] <cuddykid> g'day all
[12:25] <cuddykid> arduino atmega328 running at 3V3 should be able to run at 8mhz ok?
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[12:25] <daveake> yes
[12:25] <Darkside> yes
[12:25] <cuddykid> :)
[12:25] <cuddykid> brill
[12:25] <Darkside> its when you run at 16MHz with 3.3v when things get a bit hairy
[12:25] <cuddykid> time to complete my pcb
[12:26] <daveake> The arduino mini pro 3V3 runs at 8MHz. I've got 4 payloads here with them so don't worry about it :)
[12:26] <cuddykid> cool :D
[12:27] <cuddykid> it's just going to be far easier to run everything at 3V3 than having 2 different voltages
[12:27] <daveake> I think I may have said that once or twice :p
[12:27] <cuddykid> yeah, you've persuaded me :P
[12:28] <daveake> praise be to the god of hab :)
[12:28] <cuddykid> lol
[12:29] <cuddykid> I'll then burn the arduino pro / pro mini 8mhz bootloader onto the chip - hopefully that will be a smooth process
[12:29] <cuddykid> but knowing my luck probably not :P
[12:30] <Darkside> cuddykid: so you have an ISP programmer?
[12:30] <daveake> :-). I've never done that but yes it should be easy with a suitable ISP
[12:30] <cuddykid> Darkside: I'll use another arduino to do it
[12:30] <Darkside> just program the board using ISP
[12:30] <Darkside> oh
[12:30] <Darkside> maybe not then :P
[12:30] <Darkside> thats painful
[12:30] <cuddykid> ohh :(
[12:30] <Darkside> using an arduino as an ISP is annoying
[12:30] <daveake> I expect nothing less from ck
[12:30] <Darkside> you have to do reset line hacks
[12:30] <cuddykid> oh no :S
[12:31] <Darkside> if you have the money, order an AVRISPMKII from farnell
[12:31] <cuddykid> http://arduino.cc/en/Tutorial/ArduinoISP
[12:31] <Darkside> they're about 30 pounds i think
[12:32] <cuddykid> I'll try it using my 2 arduinos first
[12:33] <cuddykid> brb - just going to check the post box to see if any HAB stuff is here
[12:35] <cuddykid> nothing :(
[12:36] <cuddykid> time to pester them :P
[12:39] <daveake> My postie has brought me some hab stuff :-). So nananana!
[12:39] <cuddykid> every day daveake!
[12:39] <daveake> seems like it
[12:42] <Darkside> mmm that was a good bottle of rekorderlig
[12:46] <cuddykid> time to burn
[12:49] <eroomde> if you have a dragon or some other thing bizarrely not supported by the arduino ide to burn the arduin bootloader, I have a suitable avrdude incantation, fuses etc
[12:55] <cuddykid> hmm, doesn't want to burn - "not in sync"
[12:56] <eroomde> cuddykid: what operating system do you use?
[12:56] <cuddykid> mac
[12:56] <cuddykid> lion
[12:56] <eroomde> and what programmer are you using?
[12:56] <cuddykid> and using a duemilove to burn atmega328 sitting in an Uno
[12:57] <cuddykid> want to pop the 8mhz boot loader on it
[12:57] <cuddykid> using arduino IDE
[12:57] <eroomde> can you burn to the deumelinivoaweveynoviawelio that you are using as a programmer normally?
[12:58] <Laurenceb> lol
[12:58] <cuddykid> so, Uno to dueme?
[12:58] <cuddykid> yeah - I don't know how to spell it either lol
[12:58] <eroomde> forget the uno for a moment
[12:58] <daveake> Not Uno
[12:58] <eroomde> pretend you just want to put examples > blink onto the deumo
[12:58] <cuddykid> yeah, that works
[12:58] <eroomde> can you do that - i.e., is the deumo working normally?
[12:58] <eroomde> ok cool
[12:58] <cuddykid> yep
[12:59] <cuddykid> and the IDE is loaded onto it, just won't burn the boot loader onto the other atmega
[12:59] <daveake> According to that link you gave " Currently, you cannot use an Arduino Uno as an ISP programmer because the optiboot bootloader does not support this sketch. "
[12:59] <eroomde> he's not
[12:59] <cuddykid> but, I'm using the dueme as the ISP programmer right?
[12:59] <eroomde> he's using the deumo as the isp
[12:59] <cuddykid> yeah
[12:59] <daveake> That's good then :)
[12:59] <daveake> ok
[12:59] <eroomde> and the uno as the target
[13:00] <cuddykid> yup
[13:00] <daveake> Fine
[13:00] <daveake> Back to my corner then :)
[13:00] <cuddykid> lol daveake
[13:00] <eroomde> cuddykid: after 'not in sync' it should give you a response
[13:00] <eroomde> a hex number
[13:00] <cuddykid> avrdude: stk500_getsync(): not in sync: resp=0x15
[13:00] <cuddykid> 15 hex
[13:00] <eroomde> can you tell me what that is?
[13:01] <eroomde> 0x15?
[13:01] <cuddykid> yep
[13:01] <eroomde> ok
[13:01] <eroomde> right, avrdude says that's something to do with autoreset
[13:01] <eroomde> so
[13:01] <eroomde> let's try something
[13:01] <eroomde> do you have a resisor
[13:01] <Darkside> this is the reset line thing
[13:01] <cuddykid> yup
[13:01] <eroomde> say about 100 ohms?
[13:02] <cuddykid> yeah 100ohms right here
[13:02] <eroomde> if so, connect it between +V and the reset pin
[13:02] <eroomde> and try again
[13:02] <eroomde> oh wait up
[13:02] <eroomde> i'm just reading more
[13:03] <eroomde> it wants to be 110 < x > 124
[13:03] <eroomde> ohms
[13:03] <cuddykid> ahh ok, one sec
[13:03] <eroomde> so the resistors wants to lie in that range
[13:03] <eroomde> i dunno if that's a stnadard value
[13:03] <cuddykid> I've got thousands :P
[13:03] <eroomde> i think 120 ohms is a standard value
[13:03] <cuddykid> 120
[13:03] <eroomde> yep use that
[13:04] <eroomde> and try reflashing the bootloader
[13:04] <cuddykid> same error
[13:05] <cuddykid> just to confirm - once the ISP has been loaded onto due me - I'm then selecting Board > arduino pro 8mhz (atmega328)
[13:05] <eroomde> oh hang on
[13:05] <eroomde> don't give up just yet
[13:05] <eroomde> cuddykid: correct
[13:06] <cuddykid> good
[13:06] <eroomde> the uno schematic is all different to what i remember of arduinos
[13:06] <eroomde> so
[13:06] <eroomde> do you have any caps around cuddykid?
[13:06] <eroomde> eg 10uF
[13:06] <cuddykid> a few
[13:06] <cuddykid> yep, 2 of those
[13:06] <eroomde> ok, loose the resistor
[13:06] <eroomde> and put a 10uF cap between reset and gnd
[13:06] <cuddykid> ok
[13:06] <eroomde> and try loading the bootloader again
[13:07] <cuddykid> long leg +ve?
[13:08] <eroomde> yes
[13:08] <eroomde> so long leg to rst
[13:09] <cuddykid> no luck
[13:09] <eroomde> try a much bigger one
[13:09] <eroomde> 100uF
[13:09] <eroomde> if that doesn't work then we'll think of something else
[13:09] <cuddykid> don't think I have one, one sec
[13:09] <eroomde> 200uF then
[13:09] <eroomde> something muh bigger
[13:10] <cuddykid> 220uF @ 63V ?
[13:10] <eroomde> fine
[13:10] <cuddykid> nope, same error
[13:11] <eroomde> you've def got power to both boards?
[13:11] <cuddykid> yar
[13:11] <cuddykid> both are on and appear in sync - "L" led flashes the same on both
[13:14] <cuddykid> I do have other stuff hooked up to the dueme because it's on my flight board atm - would that be a problem?
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[13:16] <eroomde> not sure
[13:17] <eroomde> i'm a bit stumped if it's not the autoreset issue
[13:17] <eroomde> do you have access to a windows machine?
[13:17] <cuddykid> no :(
[13:17] <cuddykid> well - I have bootcamp
[13:18] <eroomde> if you could try the process again but when booted into windows, it might work
[13:18] <eroomde> i've just read it's a mac and linux problem
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[13:18] <cuddykid> I'll have to do that later, as I've got to pop out now - I'll report back :) thanks for your help
[13:18] <Lunar_Lander> hello again
[13:18] <eroomde> hello
[13:20] <Lunar_Lander> it is so damn cold here
[13:20] <Lunar_Lander> :(
[13:24] <UpuWork> ping fsphil
[13:24] <UpuWork> http://imagebin.org/196706
[13:24] <Lunar_Lander> hi UpuWork
[13:24] <daveake> Erm, nice work :p
[13:24] <UpuWork> lol
[13:25] <UpuWork> this is a very prototype :)
[13:25] <daveake> :)
[13:25] <eroomde> nice macro lens
[13:25] <UpuWork> advise don't pick the DS18B21 part assuming the pin outs are the same as DS18B20's
[13:26] <daveake> :)
[13:26] <daveake> Next job - increase the depth of field using stacking, so we can examine the whole board :)
[13:26] <UpuWork> you don't want to examine it :)
[13:27] <daveake> :)
[13:27] <UpuWork> going to be alot of boards to do soldering practice on at the next conference...
[13:33] <fsphil> we could make it an olympic event
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[13:44] <daveake> Guess it'd be a track event
[13:44] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[13:44] <Lunar_Lander> and then I want to drive a DeLorean
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[13:57] <UpuWork> they aren't very good aparently
[13:57] <Laurenceb> tbh thats not the point
[13:58] <UpuWork> what you want is a time machine
[13:58] <UpuWork> what you get is a badly made slow mid 80's car with gull wing doors
[14:00] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[14:00] <Lunar_Lander> the reliability is the thing
[14:02] <daveake> Yeah, you never quite know what time you will end up in
[14:02] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[14:11] <Lunar_Lander> but is it slow?
[14:12] <fsphil> it was made in Belfast, it'll either blow up or sink :)
[14:12] <daveake> lol
[14:13] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[14:13] <UpuWork> well it allegedly does 8.8 to 60
[14:13] <daveake> slow then
[14:13] <UpuWork> but apparenly it is actually about 11
[14:13] <daveake> wow very slow
[14:13] <UpuWork> which is a bit like my wifes Jazz when I tow it
[14:13] <daveake> :D
[14:14] <Lunar_Lander> 11 mph?
[14:14] <daveake> Even my pug will do less than 8 to 60
[14:14] <daveake> seconds LL
[14:15] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[14:16] <daveake> 60mph
[14:17] <daveake> Average car around 10 seconds, sporty around 7, fast around 5, "oh shit" around 3
[14:17] <Lunar_Lander> XD!
[14:21] <zyp> I've tried the rollercoaster with the world's highest launch acceleration, it does 0-107 mph in 1.8 seconds
[14:21] <zyp> :D
[14:22] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[14:22] <number10> not the sort of thing you want to do after a curry
[14:23] <daveake> Erm no!
[14:24] <daveake> At Disney we started with the "Rock 'n' Roller" coaster, which is a mere 2.8 seconds to 60mph. At which point you're inverted too. That set Mrs Dave up for the whole day :p
[14:25] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[14:25] <daveake> She's used to my driving so I thought she be OK ...
[14:25] <daveake> she'd
[14:25] <Lunar_Lander> XD
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[14:27] <daveake> I regard my Elise as a "three shit" car. On a "demo" drive with a new passenger, going towards a corner at "high" speed, the first "Shit!" comes from the passenger when they think I really need to brake and we're going to crash.
[14:27] <daveake> On average the braking starts at the third "Shit!" :)
[14:28] <zyp> the one I'm talking about is launching along a linear track
[14:28] <zyp> except for the speed, it's not really wild :p
[14:28] <zyp> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dodonpa
[14:29] <fsphil> tip: If daveake offers you a lift to the next conference, decline :)
[14:29] <zyp> but they also have the rollercoaster with the most inversions in the world in the same park: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eejanaika_%28roller_coaster%29
[14:29] <zyp> I chickened out on that one.
[14:29] <daveake> lol
[14:31] <number10> Eejanaika has several meanings... one of them being projectile vomit
[14:31] <daveake> lol
[14:31] <number10> unfortunately I wont be able to edit the wiki
[14:32] Nick change: SAIDias -> W0OTM
[14:39] <number10> anyone know anything about optical systems?
[14:41] <cuddykid> ping WillDuckworth
[14:44] <cuddykid> daveake: is it looking like a london landing for sat?
[14:44] <daveake> No
[14:44] <cuddykid> goodo
[14:44] <daveake> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=4e19f09eda17ce9cfe22dcc9b1396b02f7e363f3
[14:45] <daveake> (as an example ... I can mess with ascent rate etc)
[14:45] <cuddykid> awesome :D
[14:45] <cuddykid> daveake: are you sat or sun?
[14:45] <daveake> Sat
[14:46] <cuddykid> ok
[14:46] <daveake> Also I ordered another parachute from rocketboy - should get that today or tomorrow - to give me more options for shifting the landing point
[14:48] <number10> with sime minor variations in wind and lift you could get it to buzz heathrow and gatwick :(
[14:48] <number10> some
[14:48] <daveake> :)
[14:49] <number10> take the elise for chase - you may need a quick getaway
[14:50] <cuddykid> oh wow, for my location there is quite a difference between 11am and 3pm prediction
[14:51] <daveake> Yeah. Same here. I'll keep an eye on that as we get closer.
[14:51] <daveake> number10 nowhere for the mag mount on the elise!
[14:52] <daveake> And this is a lot closer (though not served by such good roads) as my Cambs landing.
[14:54] <number10> you need one of these http://struts.co.uk/party-fancy-dress-shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=6912&ref=1
[14:54] <number10> a few modifications to the antenna
[14:54] <daveake> lol
[15:00] <cuddykid> daveake: would you mind if I did a launch probably midday/afternoon on saturday on 434.075 - weather dependant of course. I wouldn't require any one to divert their attention away from tracking yours
[15:00] <daveake> No, of course not
[15:00] <cuddykid> just phoned up David Miller and he was surprisingly nice about arranging permission for this sat
[15:01] <cuddykid> daveake: brill, just didn't want to interfere with the important testing of rfm22
[15:01] <cuddykid> and the predictions look very good
[15:01] <daveake> You're on a different frequency so no problem
[15:02] <cuddykid> awesome :D
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[15:02] <cuddykid> knowing my luck with bugs I will probably find a killer that will prevent me lol
[15:03] <number10> where are you launching from cuddykid ?
[15:03] <cuddykid> number10: just north of worcester
[15:04] <cuddykid> this is all very much in fast planning stage atm
[15:04] <daveake> Last minute planning ... that always works :: :p
[15:04] <WillDuckworth> hey cuddykid - was afk - keep me posted on notam fun
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[15:05] <number10> just like last minute code changes like add a few measurements
[15:05] <daveake> Indeed. Not happening - do that for the next one.
[15:06] <daveake> Had a quick play then decided against it :)
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[15:08] <cuddykid> WillDuckworth: will do, would you be able to come along and help on sat?
[15:08] <cuddykid> you could launch yours too if you want?
[15:08] <cuddykid> provided not on 434.650
[15:09] <WillDuckworth> unless it's first thing then unlikely unfortunately - got the outlaws visiting and rugby in the afternoon
[15:09] <cuddykid> ahh ok, no probs, I'll let you know closer to the time :)
[15:11] <daveake> If I launch on time (stranger things have happened - actually I managed it last time) then the flight should be down by 12:30. Once it's down then /650 is free again of course.
[15:12] <cuddykid> still have solar panel code to integrate - eek lol
[15:25] <cuddykid> I have a 2hr train journey this evening to plan and write a checklist
[15:26] <cuddykid> I'm going to have to drive back up on friday to pick up all my HAB stuff :P
[15:33] <cuddykid> nooo - the radio is giving me gobaldy gooch again??!?
[15:33] <cuddykid> and I haven't even touched the settings!
[15:33] <daveake> This Saturday, you say ....?
[15:33] <cuddykid> daveake: lol
[15:33] <cuddykid> cuddykid, saturday - No chance!
[15:36] <number10> is that why you dont need any trackers?
[15:36] <cuddykid> number10: yeah lol
[15:36] <number10> :)
[15:37] <cuddykid> seriously though - what is up?! - I haven't changed any of the settings - I wonder if it's a dodgy sound card
[15:37] <number10> why the rush cuddykid ?
[15:37] <cuddykid> number10: good prediction - never normally good for me
[15:37] <number10> looks like landing near watford
[15:38] <daveake> My prediction is that it's too late to be having (lots of) problems
[15:39] <daveake> My first flight my payload had been running for a while but a last minute change messed it up
[15:39] <cuddykid> oops - guess what I was doing....
[15:39] <cuddykid> I had 8mhz arduino pro selected - stupid me
[15:39] <cuddykid> that's better :D
[15:39] <daveake> :)
[15:39] <cuddykid> I know there's not a problem with the flight hardware as it's all be proven to work great
[15:40] <cuddykid> yep - all working :)
[15:43] <daveake> cool
[15:51] <griffonbot> Received email: Adam Cudworth "[UKHAS] HABE2 Flight Announcement"
[15:51] <cuddykid> daveake: I dropped a special thanks to you in my announcement for you enduring all my silly bugs :P
[15:52] <daveake> lol :)
[15:52] <cuddykid> hopefully it will be nice and crisp on sat so we can get some stunning photos - if I don't make a last min change!
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[15:54] <daveake> If the timing works out I'll switch to help track on our way back home
[15:54] <cuddykid> cool :D
[15:55] <cuddykid> I'll be flying the sms backup tracker which is always great
[15:55] <cuddykid> and is likely to save me if something goes wrong!
[15:55] <daveake> Ditto
[15:55] <daveake> Yours is a completely separate device?
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[15:56] <UpuWork> typical all these launches and I'm not about
[15:57] <daveake> :(
[16:00] <cuddykid> daveake: yep
[16:00] <cuddykid> battery on it lasts a long time
[16:00] <Lunar_Lander> finally back
[16:01] <cuddykid> the more I think about it - it's actually quite a good weekend for me, as my lecture tomorrow is cancelled allowing me to go back and prepare this evening. Got no work on atm because it's the start of term, so hopefully the prediction will be good
[16:02] <daveake> Always good to have a clear day before the launch - get the chase car set up, make sure the SIM cards have got credit, soak test the payload, etc etc.
[16:02] <cuddykid> yep
[16:02] <daveake> Charge batteries, clear down SD cards ... endless list :)
[16:02] <cuddykid> takes a lot of time to carefully pack car
[16:03] <cuddykid> indeed, I'll be making a list on the journey back tonight :)
[16:03] <Lunar_Lander> daveake: when do you fly?
[16:03] <cuddykid> Lunar_Lander: I'm going to attempt a Sat launch too :D
[16:03] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[16:03] <daveake> All my launches have been just down the road, so if I forget something (enough cable ties is a good one) I can go back.
[16:03] <daveake> Saturday 10am
[16:03] <daveake> All looks fine but it'll be COLD :(
[16:03] <Lunar_Lander> daveake: gonna send the letter tomorrow, maybe it reaches you in time
[16:03] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[16:03] <Lunar_Lander> I was so stupid not to send it today
[16:04] <daveake> From?
[16:04] <cuddykid> yeah - mine is about 100m away!
[16:04] <daveake> From Germany?
[16:04] <daveake> Prolly won't make it
[16:04] <cuddykid> that reminds me - need to clear it with the farmer :P but I'm sure he'll be ok
[16:04] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[16:04] <Lunar_Lander> me = idiot
[16:04] <cuddykid> he loved watching the last launch
[16:05] <cuddykid> daveake: -7 ish with wind chill - plenty of warm layers and replacing those latex gloves with proper gloves!
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[16:26] <daveake> Well that's a well insulated little payload ... 41 degrees inside :)
[16:27] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[16:27] <daveake> Now I just need to paint it pink ......
[16:28] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[16:31] <daveake> http://www.flickr.com/photos/daveake/sets/72157629102120711/
[16:33] <Lunar_Lander> SPACE EXPLORATION RULER
[16:33] <Lunar_Lander> COOL!
[16:33] <daveake> :)
[16:34] <Upu> you going for altitude tomorrow daveake ?
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[16:35] <daveake> Nah the main payload is 700-odd grams, plus this at around 60, plus chute so around 850-900g total.
[16:35] <daveake> Using a 1000g Hwoyee for a regular flight
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[16:36] <Upu> ok
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[16:37] <daveake> My only thought otherwise was that if the flight path doesn't work out too well, I could use a 1600 and swap the main payload for that very pink one I mentioned - just camera + tracker in a ball. That could get to around 39km, maybe a bit more, and would (with cirrent predictions) land SE of London
[16:40] <cuddykid> all systems go here! :D
[16:42] <cuddykid> lol - on the tracker - temperature 200C
[16:43] <cuddykid> daveake: do you think the place where you get helium from will be able to sort me out for Sat?
[16:44] <daveake> Should do
[16:44] <daveake> Got mine the next day; could have been quicker
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[16:52] <cuddykid> goodo
[16:58] <cuddykid> bbl
[17:04] <Laurenceb> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/ba/B-17F_Destroyed_by_Me-262.jpg
[17:04] <Laurenceb> crazy
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[17:10] <daveake> It'll t-cut out
[17:10] <daveake> Amazing photo. Hope they all got out
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[17:12] <Laurenceb> somehow i doubt that
[17:13] <daveake> yep
[17:15] <Laurenceb> http://forums.bit-tech.net/showthread.php?t=163306&page=9
[17:15] <Laurenceb> overbuilt pc++
[17:16] <Laurenceb> http://www.students.tut.fi/~huotari2/Seawolf/272.jpg
[17:16] <Laurenceb> ...seriously
[17:18] <daveake> Gotta be a wind-up ... he says "Then my girlfriend...". Penny to a pound he has no girlfriend.
[17:19] <number10> I am suprised anyone here has
[17:19] <daveake> lol
[17:19] <cuddykid> lol
[17:19] <cuddykid> it's the gf or HAB, not both, one or the other :P
[17:19] <number10> my mrs said send a cardboard cutout of me for her
[17:20] <number10> to her
[17:22] <cuddykid> probably not a brilliant idea to go for a run - now I've got 10mins to have a shower and get ready! pronto
[17:27] <Laurenceb> its a bit cold out there
[17:30] <Lunar_Lander> cu later
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[17:32] Nick change: AndChat- -> NigeyMoby
[17:38] <number10> amazing photo of B17. they used to fly from the village here
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[17:44] <cuddykid> brilliant - I've managed to pack a lot of my HAB stuff :D
[17:49] <number10> remember to leave the bugs at home
[17:50] <cuddykid> lol yeah, right, I'm off - cya later
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[18:52] <jcoxon> hey guys
[18:52] <jcoxon> need some help
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[18:53] <Upu> ask away
[18:53] <jcoxon> http://pastebin.com/nbgZZDuc
[18:54] <jcoxon> it keeps resetting the arduino at the end of loop();
[18:54] <danielsaul> Any chance of getting the tracking station setup in time for launches on Sat? Hopefully Costello will have done the coax after school today
[18:55] <danielsaul> Argh, ignore that
[18:55] <jcoxon> its most lilkley hardware but i was wondering if it could be software
[18:56] <Upu> does it execute the delay ? What line does it reboot on exactly ?
[18:56] <jcoxon> yeah it excutes the delay
[18:56] <Upu> then reboots ?
[18:56] <jcoxon> yeah
[18:56] <Upu> thats wierd
[18:56] <Upu> what happens if you use lower delays like just 1 min etc ?
[18:57] <daveake> Do the serial strings get sent OK?
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[18:57] <jcoxon> yup
[18:59] <daveake> Hrum. So far othing stands out as being iffy.
[18:59] <Upu> no
[18:59] <Upu> just checking datatypes for overflow etc
[18:59] <Upu> delay is an unsigned long so should be fine
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[19:00] <Upu> can you make another Arduino be the spot and just do 2 arduinos back to back for simulation ?
[19:00] <jcoxon> could do
[19:00] <Upu> just to rule out something odd the spot is doing like dragging voltage down etc
[19:04] <Upu> back in a bit
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[19:07] <daveake> Not a bug, but just a comment that sometimes you're using "pin", which is 13, and sometimes you use "13".
[19:07] <daveake> Both look to be for the same thing.
[19:08] <daveake> Might cause trouble if you change that to be another pin sometime :)
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[19:15] Nick change: bcw -> bcw-AFK
[19:15] Nick change: bcw-AFK -> bcw
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[19:28] <Lunar_Lander> hallo again daveake
[19:28] <Lunar_Lander> I wanted to ask whether Part 5 is online already?
[19:28] <daveake> No, not yet :(
[19:29] <Lunar_Lander> oh ok
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[19:38] <danielsaul> http://gallery.apexhab.org/index.php/Apex-III/Core/Soldered-PCB/
[19:38] <danielsaul> Urgh
[19:38] <danielsaul> irssi keeps switching back to this channel for some reason
[19:39] <Lunar_Lander> it looks good
[19:39] <Lunar_Lander> is the sqare module the GPS?
[19:40] Nick change: bcw -> bcw-AFK
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[19:43] <Lunar_Lander> hello jcoxon
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[19:55] <cuddykid> is there something up with the predictor? Doesn't seem to get past 0% downloaded here..
[19:58] <daveake> You broke it? ;)
[19:58] <daveake> Stuck at 10% here. Try again later.
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[20:02] <cuddykid> yep - 10% now :P
[20:02] <cuddykid> will do :D
[20:02] <cuddykid> half expecting to re run it and it to land in france!
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[20:13] <cuddykid> is anyone around to give the cache a flush? That's if it would help
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[20:22] <eroomde> Randomskk jonsowman ping
[20:22] <jonsowman> hi eroomde
[20:22] <eroomde> can frequencies for this weekend be negotiated
[20:22] <jonsowman> probably, what are you planning?
[20:22] <eroomde> well, daveake is launching on 650
[20:22] <jonsowman> ah okay
[20:22] <eroomde> cuddy is launching on 075
[20:23] <jonsowman> days/times?
[20:23] <eroomde> sat both
[20:23] <Upu> also one on 434.200 I think
[20:23] <jonsowman> wow, busy
[20:23] <eroomde> yeah
[20:23] <jcoxon> like buses
[20:23] <jonsowman> where are they being launched from?
[20:23] <jonsowman> jcoxon: yeah indeed
[20:23] <eroomde> so i saw a situation developing if cusf want to launch but don't tell anyone on the ukhas lidst
[20:24] <jonsowman> we were planning to tell people but waiting till tomorrow's predictions
[20:24] <eroomde> daveake is from near newbury
[20:24] <Upu> using NTX2 or something else ?
[20:24] <eroomde> cuddykid is a bit further north
[20:24] <jcoxon> jonsowman, i still have the regulator eek
[20:24] <jonsowman> Upu: yeah but i've no idea which
[20:24] <jonsowman> jcoxon: don't worry, as long as it's safe
[20:24] <jonsowman> we've got the other one
[20:24] <jcoxon> okay
[20:24] <jcoxon> will be up cambridge way in a weeks time
[20:25] <Upu> damn only bloody day I'm not here and we potentially have 4 payloads up :/
[20:25] <jcoxon> might be launching from suffolk
[20:25] <daveake> I'm intending use .650 with an NTX2. I also have a 0.075 so I can switch. The 434.2 is a test payload and could be skipped.
[20:25] <jonsowman> jcoxon: ah nice one, give me a shout when you're here and i'll meet you to grab the reg
[20:25] <Upu> I don't think the .200 is a problem :)
[20:25] <daveake> :)
[20:25] <jonsowman> daveake: i'll let you know asap, what time are you launching?
[20:25] <Upu> I hope these new RF chips work
[20:25] <daveake> 10am
[20:25] <Upu> I have a dream, a sky fillled with balloons*
[20:25] <jonsowman> daveake: alright ta
[20:25] <Upu> *on different frequencies
[20:26] <daveake> Flight should be done by 12:30
[20:26] <jonsowman> i'd happily move it to sunday but predictions aren't good
[20:27] <eroomde> well, as long as people don;t wonder into each other's telemetry
[20:27] <jonsowman> indeed
[20:27] <eroomde> that'd be poor form but thankfully i don;t think it's ever happened yet
[20:27] <eroomde> except jcoxon's own becaon crashing into his payload telem
[20:27] <jcoxon> done it on the same flight before
[20:27] <jcoxon> :-p
[20:27] <daveake> :D
[20:27] <jcoxon> it kept on going
[20:27] <jonsowman> haha
[20:27] <jcoxon> it was only brief
[20:28] <jonsowman> smooth
[20:28] <eroomde> it was brief because it was drifting at like 1khz a min
[20:29] <eroomde> and then it came back for another round from the other direction :)
[20:29] <daveake> :D
[20:32] <daveake> I potentially could just fly the 434.2, but I'd need to think about what to fly in that case as performance of that transmitter is a partial unknown
[20:32] <jcoxon> daveake, stick to your plan
[20:32] <jcoxon> we'll cope
[20:32] <daveake> Ta :)
[20:32] <jcoxon> right
[20:32] <jcoxon> i've taken a risk - increased the batteries to 3
[20:32] <jcoxon> hope the SPoT can cope
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[20:37] <daveake> jcoxon I put the rfm22 tracker into this - https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s320x320/429142_10150525745107654_695937653_8784509_1045776688_n.jpg - 60g total
[20:37] <daveake> I now own Upu a royalty payment for the colour scheme
[20:37] <daveake> owe
[20:37] <Upu> I GPL'd pink
[20:38] <daveake> of course :)
[20:38] <jcoxon> Upu, its not voltage drops
[20:38] <Upu> ok very odd
[20:38] <jcoxon> yeah its actually a bit random
[20:38] <Upu> did you do back to back Arduinos ?
[20:39] <jcoxon> no
[20:39] <Laurenceb_> how many monitors?!
[20:39] <Upu> Laurenceb thats DASA launch control
[20:39] <daveake> How many can you count?
[20:39] <Laurenceb_> 4
[20:39] <daveake> A. More than you can see
[20:39] <Laurenceb_> oh dear
[20:39] <daveake> :)
[20:40] <navrac2> I'm down to 3 monitors now :-(
[20:40] <daveake> 4 on the main PC. Others are connected to laptops and don't get used much
[20:40] <navrac2> but the one in a middle is 36" :-)
[20:41] <daveake> :)
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> it's the studio of Radio Dave
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[20:42] <navrac2> luckily the rfm doesnt do wbfm then
[20:43] <Upu> well buffer overflows possibly jcoxon but not sure how in that code
[20:43] <navrac2> how big is the receive buffer in newsoftserial - in the arduino1 softwareserial its only 6bytes
[20:43] <navrac2> 6/64
[20:45] <jcoxon> hmmm could be
[20:45] <Upu> flush before reading ?
[20:46] <navrac2> 256 in newsoftserial
[20:46] <jcoxon> 128 in mine
[20:49] <eroomde> daveake: I'll be catching a lift to you with dave robertson
[20:52] <daveake> cool
[20:52] <daveake> planning on tracking/chasing? Or just for the launch?
[20:53] <navrac2> what time are you thinking of launching daveake?
[20:53] <daveake> 10am
[20:53] <daveake> I have permission for 8:45-1pm, but I've told everyone 10am :)
[20:54] <navrac2> should be able to track for a bit before daughter turns up for me to take her car shopping
[20:54] <daveake> take a magmount to stick on for the test drives :p
[20:54] <navrac2> just got my work schedule sorted - next day off march 4th :-(
[20:55] <navrac2> ill have to find my laptop inverter too
[20:56] <eroomde> daveake: up to him i guess
[20:57] <daveake> Sure
[21:03] <daveake> We'll have an equipped chase car but another one wouldn't go amiss :)
[21:10] <number10> well if you could send it my way ;)
[21:12] <daveake> :D
[21:14] <daveake> Mission badge sorted :) http://imgur.com/HNc97
[21:15] <Upu> :)
[21:16] <number10> dave akerman's space agency i presume
[21:16] <daveake> Not allowed to say "space" here ;)
[21:16] <Upu> nearish space
[21:16] <daveake> But yes, a friend did that for me for my first launch
[21:16] <daveake> DANSA
[21:17] <eroomde> NASA
[21:17] <eroomde> Nearly-Almost_space Agency
[21:17] <daveake> NBNQAA
[21:17] <daveake> er
[21:17] <daveake> NBNQSA
[21:17] <daveake> (nearly but not quite)
[21:18] <Lunar_Lander> XD
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[21:23] <cuddykid> daveake: any more luck with the predictor? No luck here
[21:24] <daveake> not tried. hold on ...
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[21:33] <daveake> yeah seems stuck
[21:38] <eroomde> no luck here
[21:39] <Upu> jsut jamming ?
[21:40] <Upu> its not running any predictions
[21:52] <Upu> right off to take my dog for a walk with the tracker in my pocket
[21:55] <fsphil> it's freeeezing out there
[21:55] <fsphil> my dog didn't want to go out
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[22:00] <fsphil> (actually a lie, I didn't want to go out -- the dog would still want a walk even if it was a blizzard)
[22:03] <cuddykid> lol fsphil
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[22:06] <cuddykid> is the balloon ok to be stored at minus temps? Currently sitting in the freezing garage& lol
[22:06] <SpeedEvil> Should be fine
[22:06] <SpeedEvil> There isn't any signfiicant water.
[22:06] <Lunar_Lander> cuddykid: in the antarctic they have the balloons also
[22:06] <Lunar_Lander> they immerse them in boiling water before inflation
[22:06] <Lunar_Lander> that was actually better than storing them in diesel
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[22:08] <Upu> lol thats ace
[22:08] <cuddykid> nice :)
[22:09] <Upu> you can see to within 2 meters where my dog just had a poo
[22:09] <daveake> lol
[22:09] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[22:09] <Lunar_Lander> snow?
[22:09] <fsphil> dog walks near us
[22:10] <Lunar_Lander> Upu
[22:10] <daveake> You need a DoggyActivity field ... 1=sniffing someone, 2=sniffing another dog's arse, 3=humping someone's leg ...
[22:10] <Lunar_Lander> "And James was rubbish with the shotgun"
[22:10] <Lunar_Lander> *looks into barrel*
[22:10] <Lunar_Lander> WOOO!
[22:11] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[22:12] <Upu> lol
[22:12] <Lunar_Lander> but the best thing was the austrian training
[22:12] <Lunar_Lander> with the powerpoint presentation
[22:12] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[22:12] <Upu> that GPS is epic you can even tell which side of the road I'm on
[22:14] <fsphil> yea I did a dog walk with hadie last year, it could see amazing detail
[22:15] <daveake> I see our need to upgrade one of our cats to a dog
[22:15] <daveake> I
[22:15] <fsphil> indeed
[22:15] <fsphil> guy walking around with a bag and antenna sticking out looks weird. if said guy is walking a dog, it's fine :)
[22:16] <daveake> :)
[22:16] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[22:16] <fsphil> you could attach that pico module to one of your cats
[22:16] <Upu> lol
[22:16] <daveake> True :)
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[22:46] <daveake> Well that's the first temperature drift test done ... I went for a walk (sans dog) and the frequency fell off the waterfall by the time I got to the end of the road!
[22:47] <daveake> Mrs Dave called thinking I'd collapsed or something :D
[22:47] <Lunar_Lander> ohh
[22:47] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[22:47] <daveake> I did actually walk round the block despite what the map thinks
[22:47] <daveake> F-ing cold :(
[22:48] <daveake> I'm so looking forward to tying the balloon off on Saturday ...
[22:49] <Laurenceb_> tracks the road well
[22:49] <daveake> yeah not bad
[22:50] <Laurenceb_> hehe now i know where everyone lives
[22:50] <Laurenceb_> cuddykid lives in a field
[22:50] <daveake> UNDER a field
[22:51] <Laurenceb_> its hot down there
[22:51] <Laurenceb_> hot as hell
[22:51] <daveake> Yep
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[00:00] --- Thu Feb 2 2012