highaltitude.log.20120122

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[08:53] <Upu> morning all
[08:54] <Darkside> \o
[08:56] <number10> moning
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[09:02] <natrium42> yo
[09:02] <daveake_> Current prediction for my flight next Sunday. It'll need to change considerably between now and then! http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=a79dca92247c48a2a2c93ebc308f2e249cc23818
[09:03] Nick change: daveake_ -> daveake
[09:07] <number10> well we hope so
[09:07] <number10> have you told Julie she will have to wake up before 0900
[09:08] <daveake> Yeah, she knows that :)
[09:08] <daveake> Actually, someone else (NigeyS ISTR) is planning to launch the same day, so I might end up delaying till the afternoon
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[10:39] <cuddykid> hi all
[10:39] <cuddykid> is a 1/4 ground plane the best way to go for a receiving antenna?
[10:40] <daveake_> Not my area really, but a collinear or yagi will give more gain (latter is directional of course)
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[10:51] <zyp> the more gain an antenna has, the more directional it will be
[10:52] <zyp> after all, focusing the energy in some directions is how an antenna increases gain
[10:53] <Darkside> cuddykid: if you're planning on following the payload, use a 1/4 wave, or a cross-dipole
[10:54] <Darkside> if you are following the payload and have too much gain on your receive antenna, the radiation pattern will be focussed more towards the horizon
[10:54] <Darkside> and if your balloon is above you, it won't work very well
[11:12] <cuddykid> thanks :)
[11:13] <Darkside> if you are looking for something to go on your car, maplins has some cheapish magbase antennas with whips on them
[11:13] <Darkside> you can get one of those and cut it to the correct length
[11:14] <costyn> don't get it... I now need 37k ohm difference between my mark and space to get a shift of 425... seems like a lot
[11:17] <Darkside> use whatever works
[11:17] <Darkside> i usually use 2 pins on the AVR, with a 37K and 49K resistor
[11:18] <costyn> ok
[11:18] <Darkside> GPIO1 ---47k--- TXD ---39k--- GPIO2
[11:18] <costyn> so its not a sign that I've wired something wrong or have a short?
[11:18] <Darkside> i wouldn't know without seeing the circuit
[11:18] <costyn> Darkside: I'm using Upu's: http://ava.upuaut.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/ntx2_diagram.jpg
[11:19] <costyn> Darkside: my R2 is now 37k instead of 4.7k
[11:19] <Darkside> dunno
[11:19] <costyn> k
[11:19] <costyn> well it works, so gonna keep that
[11:20] <Upu> Darkside that works for 3.3V
[11:20] <daveake_> Could be that Upu's values are for a 3V3 micro and yors is running at 5V
[11:20] <Upu> Arduino is 5
[11:20] <Upu> so example is for 5V
[11:20] <costyn> hmm yea I also have arduino at 5v
[11:21] <daveake_> I use a single pin so my values (and circuit) are different anyway
[11:21] <Darkside> Upu: yeah of course
[11:21] <Upu> I never found a 2 res solution for 5v
[11:21] <Darkside> Upu: yeah, you won't get the right bias point
[11:21] <Upu> always needed a bias, would love to model it mathematically but sadly I'm thick
[11:21] <daveake_> :)
[11:22] <daveake_> I made up 2 circuits last week, and got different offsets even though the value were the same. Only different was the two NTX's (one .650 and one .075)
[11:22] <Darkside> don't forget you can tweak the shift with the pots on the NTX2
[11:22] <Upu> you can tune the NTX2 a little if you peel the sticker off
[11:22] <Upu> afk alittle
[11:22] <costyn> daveake_: well I got 2 diferent offsets with different code; explain that.. :P
[11:23] <Darkside> one of the pots adjusts the modulation, one adjusts the centre frequency
[11:23] <daveake_> Good point. It was easy enough to try different R's till one worked, then solder that in
[11:23] <daveake_> costyn - 'cos the code's wrong :p
[11:24] <costyn> daveake_: prolly :)
[11:24] <costyn> daveake_: i have something that works now, not gonna fiddle with it any more
[11:24] <daveake_> :)
[11:24] <Upu> shift shouldn't be affected by code
[11:25] <daveake_> The R's and supply voltage and NTX2 set the gap; the code can't unless you're using the wrong outputs or not set them to be outputs
[11:25] <Darkside> daveake_: iy would be if both math and space pins go high at the same time
[11:25] <Darkside> mark*
[11:25] <cuddykid> does anyone know where I can get an sma (or alternative) breadboard or surface mount connector?
[11:25] <daveake_> Which would be faulty code, like I said :D
[11:25] <Upu> what Darkside said
[11:25] <Darkside> cuddykid: you wont get a SMA breadboard connector
[11:25] <daveake_> Yes, that sounds the most likely
[11:25] <costyn> ok good to know thx for the explanation guys
[11:26] <Darkside> if you really need a SMA socket then get a bit of coax with a sma connector on and put bits of wire on teh end
[11:26] <Darkside> single-core wire i mean, so it can poke into the breadboard
[11:26] <cuddykid> Darkside: :(
[11:26] <cuddykid> Darkside: ahh ok
[11:27] <Darkside> you can get a SMA connector onto veroboard if you drill out the holes a bit
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[11:41] <jonititan> Anyone online?
[11:42] <Jessica_Lily> rawr
[11:43] <costyn> can you do this in C? b_temperature = b_temperature / 10 ;
[11:44] <jonititan> I'm moving to cranfield soon to start a PhD. I was wondering if I might be able to get involved in launching if anyone needs any help?
[11:44] <cuddykid> costyn: yup
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[11:46] <number10> not sure if anyone is doing a team prject jonititan
[11:46] <costyn> cuddykid: thx
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[11:47] <jonititan> well perhaps i'll just concentrate on finishing my downlink.
[11:50] <fsphil> costyn, if you want to be fancy: b_temperature /= 10; also works
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[12:06] <costyn> fsphil: yes thx, using that now... found the compound math functions in the arduino docs
[12:07] <fsphil-laptop> aah so that's what that is called
[12:07] <costyn> 50 baud is acceptable rate for a first flight right? strings are completing about once every 20 seconds
[12:07] <fsphil-laptop> more than fine
[12:07] <costyn> fsphil: http://arduino.cc/en/Reference/IncrementCompound yes I didn't know either until I found this page hehe
[12:07] <fsphil-laptop> I wouldn't suggest using more unless you had a particular reason
[12:07] <daveake_> Yep. I can't decode 300 that reliably here let alone remotely!
[12:07] <costyn> fsphil: ok cool
[12:08] <fsphil-laptop> daveake_, possibly timing if you;re using sleep() instead of an interrupt
[12:08] <daveake_> No, it's interrupts, and yes I have connected a logic analyser to it to check the timing :)
[12:08] <costyn> well I think my payload electronics are done :) the string is outputting all that I want it to ; now I need to test it to see if it still works below 0
[12:08] <fsphil-laptop> strange
[12:09] <daveake_> I can't remember the error rate but I don'tlike to see more than the occassional bad sentence
[12:09] <fsphil-laptop> I'd also suggest a range test if you have the geography that allows it
[12:09] <Upu> costyn 50 baud is best baud
[12:09] <Darkside> boo
[12:09] <fsphil-laptop> 9600 is the best baud :p
[12:09] <Darkside> 300 baud is best baud
[12:09] <fsphil-laptop> we just need better antennas ;)
[12:09] <Upu> lol
[12:09] <costyn> hehehe
[12:09] <Upu> getting it soon... :)
[12:09] <Upu> afk dog walk
[12:09] <costyn> MOAR POWER!
[12:10] <fsphil-laptop> 300 baud is a bit more resistant against fading - the string is less likely to be interrupted by one
[12:10] <daveake_> True
[12:10] <daveake_> Has anyone bothered with baudot to reduce the sentence time a bit?
[12:10] <fsphil-laptop> Tim did
[12:10] <costyn> Upu: remember that buffer overflow I had? well I found it, my barometer pressure is 6 digits long, which needs a 'long' instead of 'int' :)
[12:10] <fsphil-laptop> although we had to make a small hack for him as baudot doesn't have the * symbol
[12:11] <daveake_> :)
[12:11] <fsphil-laptop> baudot has the problem that if the shift character is not received the rest of the string is garbage
[12:11] <daveake_> Yes, I know
[12:11] <fsphil-laptop> it would be best if we used something like psk uses
[12:11] <daveake_> I was thinking of trying till I realised that bit
[12:12] <fsphil-laptop> a kind of huffman tree
[12:13] <fsphil-laptop> though that would totally break any existing decoder
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[12:24] <cuddykid> hmm - arduino compiler giving me some weird error with switch statement
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[12:25] <cuddykid> oh - no it's not, just that my defines included a ;
[12:25] <cuddykid> silly error :P
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[12:30] <costyn> is this is a 1/4 wave antenna? Its one I got with a 2M handheld, not sure what it is, seems to receive fine but not sure if it'll work for tracking purposes on the car? http://imgur.com/2siXw
[12:30] <eroomde> it isn't, but it'll probably work ok despite that
[12:31] <eroomde> the loops are there to add inductance so it appears to be 50 ohn (or thereabouts)
[12:31] <Darkside> you could cut off most of it to make a 1/4 wave :P
[12:31] <Darkside> i'd be more concerned about the magnet not holding up to the wind
[12:31] <costyn> hehe ok
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[12:32] <costyn> the springs/loops are pretty springy I think it'll be ok but just wondering if I'm better off getting a different antenna for on top of the car?
[12:33] <eroomde> 1/4 wave specifically for 434mhz might work a bit better
[12:34] <eroomde> i would guess that that antenna has a radioation pattern that is flatter and more towards the horizon
[12:34] <eroomde> which might not be so good if the payload is at 45 degrees elevation to you, say
[12:34] <Darkside> yeah, that antenna would certainly have some gain on 70cm
[12:34] <eroomde> but equally it's much closer to you physically at those elevation angles
[12:34] <eroomde> i would just try it
[12:34] <eroomde> see how it goes one flight
[12:34] <Darkside> eroomde: doesn't help when the nulls match up
[12:35] <eroomde> no indeed, but that rarely happens
[12:35] <Darkside> >_>
[12:35] <Darkside> happens a LOT for us
[12:35] <eroomde> yeah but you just have desert
[12:35] <Darkside> yeah, we keep pace, or out-pace the payload
[12:35] <eroomde> 'struth! we gotta go that way brucie!' and you head off in a straight line underneath
[12:35] <Darkside> last launch we got to th elanding site 30 min before the payload did
[12:35] <costyn> a 70cm mobile antenna isn't expnsive http://www.jacobsbredaelectronics.nl/nl/webwinkel/Comm/Radio_Amateur_Sets/Antennes_Mobile_UHF-70cm
[12:36] <eroomde> we have to wiggle around our silly old roads that were rgihts of way in the 11th centure and have no logic anymore
[12:36] <Darkside> costyn: but you don't want gain
[12:37] <costyn> Darkside: so that one isn't any better?
[12:37] <Darkside> no, you'll have the same problem when the payload is above you
[12:37] <Darkside> you just want a 1/4 wave whip
[12:37] <Darkside> 16.2cm long
[12:38] <Darkside> you coudl make one by getting a longer whip and cutting it down
[12:38] <Darkside> eroomde: what was the hax you did with the RSSI values from a CC1111
[12:38] <Darkside> i'm thinking of doing something similar for an uplink, using a RFM22B
[12:39] <eroomde> i wouldn't :)
[12:39] <Darkside> why?
[12:39] <eroomde> just poll it v fast
[12:39] <eroomde> it's about the worst energy per symbol for a given bit error rate of any modulation scheme possible
[12:39] <Darkside> eh?
[12:39] <Darkside> aren't you just doing very low baud rate OOK?
[12:39] <costyn> Darkside: ok thx
[12:40] <Darkside> ideally i wanted to make it possible to trigger the cutdown by using a certain sequence of key clicks from a handheld radio
[12:40] <eroomde> i think dtmf would be a good way of attacking the problem
[12:40] <Darkside> yes, but it makes it more expensive
[12:40] <Darkside> these RFM22B modules are $10 each
[12:41] <Darkside> to do DTMF we'd need a receive module which gives the discriminator output, and then a DTMF decoder IC (or do it with a micro)
[12:41] <Darkside> i reckon i could do something with n RFM22B and a attiny
[12:41] <eroomde> dtmf decoder ic's cost about 18p
[12:41] <Darkside> really?
[12:41] <Darkside> but still theres the radio problem
[12:42] <Darkside> i was thinking of either doing the dodgy RSSI reading way
[12:42] <Darkside> or actually sending up OOK signals generated by another RFM22B
[12:42] <Darkside> i.e record and replay them through some more powerful radio
[12:43] <Darkside> anyway, i plan on getting a few of these RFM22B modules and experimenting - i like that i can change the frequency of them up to the higher end of the ham band (>440MHz)
[12:45] <Upu> got 2 here Darkside not done anything with them yet look promising
[12:46] <Darkside> sparkfun is out of stock :(
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[13:01] <cuddykid> am I correct in think that for a pot divider - large resistor values should be used?
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[13:06] <daveake_> Ideally much higher than impedance of what you're measuring, and also a lot smaller than the impedance of the measuring device you're feeding.
[13:06] <daveake_> Also you don't want to go too high otherwise you can pick up noise more easily.
[13:08] <daveake_> Is this for your solar cell thing?
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[13:12] <cuddykid> daveake_: yeah
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[13:29] <number10> have you cutdown on cloud 3 daveake_
[13:29] <daveake_> Probably not
[13:29] <daveake_> I have code and can make one but I'll probably not use it
[13:29] <eroomde> cutdown schmutdown
[13:30] <daveake_> Still bothered about cutdowns vs inline chute
[13:30] <eroomde> throw it up like a man and accept whatever the gods have in mind for its fate
[13:30] <Darkside> lol
[13:30] <daveake_> lol :)
[13:30] <Darkside> oh yeah eroomde
[13:30] <Darkside> we flew 2 of the red 100g balloons at linuxconf
[13:30] <Darkside> both burst at 21-22km altitude
[13:31] <Darkside> this is with 0.7m^3 of helium in each
[13:31] <Darkside> burst predictor said 10km burst
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[13:32] <daveake_> Your very own space program ... http://kerbalspaceprogram.com/
[13:32] <Darkside> ok i should sleep
[13:32] <eroomde> Darkside: nice
[13:32] <Darkside> night all
[13:32] <daveake_> nn
[13:33] <eroomde> sounds like the burst predictor doesn't know about your balloon material or specs
[13:33] <Darkside> well we entered the specs from the hwoyee website
[13:33] <Darkside> 1.8m burst diameter
[13:34] <daveake_> specs smecks
[13:34] <daveake_> hwoyees don't like to burst - you know that :)
[13:34] <Darkside> hehe
[13:34] <Darkside> well the first launch we lost in water
[13:34] <eroomde> but to go twice the altitude
[13:34] <eroomde> that's impressive
[13:34] <daveake_> yep
[13:34] <Darkside> second launch we watched the landing
[13:34] <eroomde> well, more it suggests the burst model is broken
[13:35] <Darkside> anyway
[13:35] <Darkside> i need to be up at some reasonable time tomorrow
[13:35] <Darkside> so gnight
[13:36] <number10> are you using one of the hwoyees daveake_
[13:36] <daveake_> Yeah, 1000g
[13:36] <number10> nn Darkside
[13:36] <number10> are the others more reliable at bursting
[13:36] <eroomde> daveake_: when is launch planned for?
[13:37] <daveake_> Well cloud3 used a 100g hwoyee, and that went to 36.5km (prediction was 33-34km ISTR)
[13:37] <daveake_> s/3/2
[13:37] <daveake_> cloud3 is the same payload weight, give or take, and same balloon size
[13:37] <daveake_> eroomde In theory next Sunday (29yh).
[13:37] <number10> so ideall you dont want much wind with one of those
[13:37] <eroomde> cool
[13:38] <daveake_> Prediction not looking so hot though
[13:38] <daveake_> more wet really
[13:38] <eroomde> still a bit far out
[13:38] <number10> looks like its not comming my way
[13:38] <daveake_> indeed
[13:38] <daveake_> Things can change
[13:39] <daveake_> Current - http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=a8ee33c5e94b099665d1a83b0d4cd64468f56d19
[13:39] <cuddykid> I'm also deciding how to best implement cutdown.. - currently best option I think is to let the chute hang below the payload as it ascends
[13:39] <eroomde> oh
[13:40] <eroomde> it's not crazy-talk to run lines to a cutdown at the apex of the chute
[13:40] <daveake_> I'll try each day during the week to see how it develops.
[13:40] <cuddykid> daveake_: get the boat ready :P :D
[13:41] <cuddykid> eroomde: just concerned about tangling - last thing I want is it to completely fail and come hurtling down on top of someone! lol
[13:42] <cuddykid> other option is a cheapo radio link - avoid all wires then
[13:42] <cuddykid> but would it work at ~ - 50C ? hmm
[13:42] <eroomde> wires are safer in that situation
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[13:42] <eroomde> they don't need to be big
[13:43] <eroomde> you can have a cap at the top which provides most of the current
[13:43] <eroomde> to compensate for losses in thin wires running 10-20m
[13:43] <daveake_> For a pyro cutdown, not a nichrome one though?
[13:43] <eroomde> and a fet to discharge the cap across whatever your cutdown mechanism is
[13:43] <eroomde> should work with nichrome too i'd have thought
[13:44] <daveake_> Big cap
[13:44] <eroomde> just depends on the energy requirements i guess
[13:44] <cuddykid> eroomde: mine will have it's own 2AA power supply
[13:44] <cuddykid> via fet
[13:44] <eroomde> ok
[13:45] <cuddykid> it will have to stay attached to payload/chute - don't want that coming lose
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[13:46] <cuddykid> almost built my "ground station"
[13:46] <eroomde> what does it look like?
[13:46] <cuddykid> various buttons for different uplink commands
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[13:47] <cuddykid> just a row of buttons, an atmega328 and radio :P
[13:47] Action: daveake_ has a thought .... http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=d48487bf98b4c68ddfe0307caf8e9527be214012
[13:47] <daveake_> Well that's an interesting prediction :D
[13:48] <cuddykid> nice!
[13:48] <eroomde> huh?
[13:48] <daveake_> Beats me
[13:49] <eroomde> it seems to be coming down ballistically
[13:49] <cuddykid> yeah
[13:49] <daveake_> I just changed launch site and re-ran the prediction
[13:49] <cuddykid> burst - bam - crater
[13:50] <daveake_> I think it's confused.
[13:50] <daveake_> OK this is what it should have done - http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=d48487bf98b4c68ddfe0307caf8e9527be214012
[13:52] <number10> prop not good ging iver london thogh
[13:52] <number10> over
[13:53] <eroomde> certainly not
[13:54] <eroomde> we always have steered well clear of cities
[13:54] <eroomde> hah
[13:54] <eroomde> i'm from pulborough
[13:54] <eroomde> you could land on our back garden with a small tweak
[13:57] <number10> we should do a competition - nearest to land on a target with a pico
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[14:03] <number10> I suggest Aldeburgh as target
[14:04] <Upu> seconded
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[14:08] <daveake_> lol
[14:10] <number10> I was there yesterday - had a walk on the beach - I did keep an eye out for any polystyrene jetsam
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[14:11] <daveake_> It's probably on a Norwegian island or something
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[14:37] Action: fsphil-laptop is still hopeful of a recovery
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[14:39] <number10> I think a laminated identity sheet would be good
[14:39] <fsphil-laptop> yea
[15:00] <daveake_> With international stule phone number :)
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[15:12] <number10> maybe also written in russian saying MB> =5 -6, ?>445;L=K5 <8=8-09A15@30 70 H?8>=06 - :0: B>B :0<5=L, <K ?>A048;8 2 ?0@:5
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[15:55] <daveake_> I'll tak eyour word for that number10 :D
[15:58] <number10> i thought you were inquisitive
[15:58] <daveake_> Not in every subject
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[16:00] <number10> yes - I have realised I type/talk a load of rubbish
[16:00] <number10> http://translate.google.com/#ru|en|%D1%8D%D1%82%D0%BE%20%D0%BD%D0%B5%20%D0%9C%D0%98-6%2C%20%D0%BF%D0%BE%D0%B4%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B5%20%D0%BC%D0%B8%D0%BD%D0%B8-%D0%B0%D0%B9%D1%81%D0%B1%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B3%D0%B0%20%D0%B7%D0%B0%20%D1%88%D0%BF%D0%B8%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%B0%D0%B6%20-%20%D0%BA%D0%B0%D0%BA%20%D1%82%D0%BE%D1%82%20%D0%BA%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%B5%D0%BD%D1%8C%2C%20%D0%BC%D1%8B%20%D0%BF%D0%BE%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%B4%D0%B8%
[16:00] <number10> lol and that didnt work either
[16:00] <daveake_> lol
[16:01] <daveake_> "fake mini-iceberg" :D
[16:01] <number10> yes
[16:01] <number10> my baloon will end up like my webchat typing - a massive failure
[16:02] <daveake_> Speaking of which .... when?
[16:02] <BrainDamage> http://translate.google.com/#de|de|pv%20zk%20pv%20pv%20zk%20pv%20zk%20kz%20zk%20pv%20pv%20pv%20zk%20pv%20zk%20zk%20pzk%20pzk%20pvzkpkzvpvzk%20kkkkkk%20bsch
[16:02] <BrainDamage> click on "listen"
[16:02] <BrainDamage> ( the loudspeaker icon )
[16:03] <number10> well now that I have done the ham suff I am cracking on - have a PIC controller and is sending telemetry data - just need to add temperature stuff and error handling
[16:03] <daveake_> BrainDamage lol
[16:04] <number10> as I am using PIC, I dont get to use all the AVR library stuff that everyone else is
[16:04] <daveake_> Yeah. CCS?
[16:04] <number10> CCS yes
[16:04] <daveake_> And what board?
[16:05] <number10> just using a pic proto board - has the basic cct for the pic, xtal and regulator
[16:06] <number10> and a small area for prototyping
[16:08] <number10> very good BrainDamage
[16:18] <daveake_> So I've printed and laminated a tag with contact details ...
[16:18] <daveake_> ... and now I shall do it again with the correct phone number :p
[16:18] <number10> lol
[16:18] <number10> put one inside the paload aswell
[16:18] <daveake_> Yep
[16:19] <NigelMoby> "this payload will self destruct" ? :p
[16:20] <daveake_> "This payload is perfectly safe so long as it's not beeping"
[16:21] <daveake_> (mine do)
[16:25] <NigelMoby> lol
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[16:37] <SpeedEvil> It would be nice if you could do online postage for longer periods.
[16:37] <SpeedEvil> So you could print some postage that'd be valid for - say - 6 months, and attach it.
[16:37] <SpeedEvil> And all they'd need to do would be to cut the string, and hand it in at the post office.
[16:42] <daveake_> In my case I'd have to account for the extra weight of some sea-water :p
[16:43] <daveake_> and possibly international postage ..
[16:44] <SpeedEvil> :)
[16:44] <BrainDamage> attach a folded catapult on the side
[16:45] <Randomskk> SpeedEvil: isn't that a stamp?
[16:46] <SpeedEvil> Randomskk: It's a stamp people can't use for other things after peeling off your payload.
[16:46] <Randomskk> I guess
[16:46] <SpeedEvil> Also you can reclaim the cash if it doesn't get used
[16:46] <SpeedEvil> or found
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[18:32] <NigelMoby> FYI
[18:32] <NigelMoby> Brian Cox RT @VirtualAstro: ALERT! There is very heavy geomagnetic activity and it may get stronger as the night goes on - Look out for Auroras
[18:33] <NigelMoby> u might see something speedy
[18:34] <fsphil> oooh
[18:35] <NigelMoby> got clear skies Phil?
[18:39] <SpeedEvil> oooh - maybe
[18:39] Action: SpeedEvil ponders getting out of bed.
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[19:00] <navrac> nothing out the window here
[19:03] <fsphil> cloudy here
[19:04] <Laurenceb_> http://www.go-gddq.com/upload/2011-07/11072617361523.pdf
[19:04] <Laurenceb_> wow
[19:16] <Randomskk> wow indeed
[19:16] <Randomskk> what even is it? such a complex schematic
[19:16] <Laurenceb_> toshiba netbook
[19:16] <Randomskk> well that explains the insane complicatedness
[19:17] <Laurenceb_> heh
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[20:09] <SpeedEvil> NigelMoby: nope
[20:09] <NigelMoby> Bah :(
[20:10] <fsphil> *looks again*
[20:10] <SpeedEvil> http://aurorawatch.lancs.ac.uk/
[20:10] <fsphil> moar cloud
[20:10] <SpeedEvil> It's ~90% clear here
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[20:11] <SpeedEvil> M31 was quite pretty.
[20:11] <SpeedEvil> 45, even
[20:11] <NigelMoby> oo
[20:41] <Laurenceb_> anyone see anything?
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[20:43] <fsphil> still clouded out
[20:46] Action: Laurenceb_ goes out to look
[20:52] <Laurenceb_> partially clear sky, cant see anything
[20:52] <NigelMoby> nowt ere :(
[21:04] <russss> http://www.swpc.noaa.gov/pmap/pmapN.html
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[21:14] <NigelMoby> Oo pretty strong, just not by us lol
[21:16] <Laurenceb_> http://scanlime.org/2010/10/sewing-machine-update-lcd/
[21:16] <Laurenceb_> epic
[21:24] <SpeedEvil> funky
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[21:54] <Laurenceb_> ive got a singer 720 thats got really bad speed control
[21:54] <Laurenceb_> tryng to modify it
[21:55] <Laurenceb_> http://uk.farnell.com/on-semiconductor/tda1085cg/ic-motor-speed-controller-smd/dp/1468784?Ntt=tda1085
[21:55] <Laurenceb_> wonder if thatd work
[21:55] <Laurenceb_> lol farnell have eagle footprints for everything
[22:00] <Laurenceb_> i dont understand how they are powering it
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[22:03] <SpeedEvil> It looks to be powered through the motor - indirectly
[22:03] <SpeedEvil> I've been lifting and moving too much stuff today to read it closely though
[22:04] <Laurenceb_> look at the diode
[22:05] <daveake__> Well that's good to know ... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Weather-Balloons-Make-Rotten-Sex-Toys-Annabelle-Du-Foue-/110810842007?pt=Fiction&hash=item19ccd74397#ht_499wt_1153
[22:05] <Laurenceb_> what the hell
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[22:06] <daveake__> I've no idea ... all I did was search for "weather balloon" <innocent smiley>
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[23:28] <Laurenceb_> whats the best provider for £G pay as you go sims for data only?
[23:29] <Laurenceb_> if i want pay as you go data only and for it to last for _ages_ ?
[23:30] <SpeedEvil> how much data?
[23:30] <Laurenceb_> not a low
[23:30] <Laurenceb_> *lot
[23:30] <Laurenceb_> <1GB
[23:33] <Laurenceb_> all the deals seem to have a time limit :(
[23:34] <SpeedEvil> http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/shop/mobile-phones/price-plans/pay-as-you-go/boosters/
[23:34] <SpeedEvil> 6 month internet booster for 20 quid
[23:34] <SpeedEvil> on PAYG - sim is free
[23:35] <SpeedEvil> 500M/mo
[23:42] <Laurenceb_> interesting
[23:43] <SpeedEvil> If you want slightly more - three - rolling contract ipad data-plan - 7.50 for 1G/mo
[23:43] <Laurenceb_> i see
[23:43] <Laurenceb_> t-mobile looks ok, thanks
[23:44] <SpeedEvil> :)
[23:44] <SpeedEvil> The other nice bit is that the data cost is capped at a pound a day
[23:44] <SpeedEvil> which can be very economic if you only use it a few - random - days a yer
[23:45] <Laurenceb_> i see
[23:46] <Laurenceb_> wait so its capped at £365/year?
[23:46] <SpeedEvil> no.
[23:46] <SpeedEvil> If you use it 3 days over 365, it costs you 3 pounds
[23:47] <SpeedEvil> actually - I suppose so
[23:47] <SpeedEvil> IIRC a fair use of 60M
[23:47] <SpeedEvil> It's been a while since I looked at the full T&Cs
[23:47] <Laurenceb_> ok
[23:47] <Laurenceb_> nvm
[23:47] <SpeedEvil> Seen any nice design documents on magnetic bearings?
[23:50] <Laurenceb_> nope
[23:50] <SpeedEvil> Idly wondering what's required for energy storage.
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[23:52] Nick change: daveake_ -> daveake
[23:53] Action: Laurenceb_ zzz
[23:54] <s-taylo> Laurenceb_: There's also giffgaff (O2 virtual network) who do a pay as you go 5GBP/month for 500mb, or if you just need low data rates over long periods Lebara (Vodafone virtual network) do 10mb/day free as long as you've got some credit on your sim
[23:54] <Laurenceb_> oh - university of sheffield had a nice thing using brushless motors at either end
[23:54] <Laurenceb_> and doing the levitation using them
[23:54] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: I was wondering about something similar to that
[23:55] <Laurenceb_> havent got a link handy, maybe search papers
[23:55] <SpeedEvil> http://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jsdd/5/5/829/_pdf
[23:55] <Laurenceb_> ok im really going to bed now, cya
[23:55] <SpeedEvil> Just look at the first couple of pics
[23:55] <SpeedEvil> basically brushless motors
[23:55] <SpeedEvil> night
[23:55] <SpeedEvil> I was hoping for a 'for dummies' book :)
[00:00] --- Mon Jan 23 2012