highaltitude.log.20120116

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[00:36] <Lunar_Lander> Dan-K2VOL: do you think you'll fly speedball this year?
[00:36] <Dan-K2VOL> Yes kevin
[00:36] <Lunar_Lander> cool!
[00:45] <Lunar_Lander> it will be awesome
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[07:26] <jcoxon> himmm it seems ukas is down
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[07:34] <jcoxon> habhub is down too
[07:34] <jcoxon> though zeusbot is sitll here which means it must be the http side of things
[07:36] <cuddykid> yeah, ukhas down here too :(
[07:46] <cuddykid> spark fun package still sitting in San Francisco
[07:46] <NigelMoby> bloody Gremlins again
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[10:02] <fsphil> yay, monday
[10:04] <daveake> Satuday-5 :(
[10:04] <daveake> r
[10:05] <fsphil> beware though, it's Monday the 16th!
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[10:07] <daveake> What happens on the 16th? Does the internet break? ;)
[10:08] <fsphil> looks like it lol
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[10:09] <daveake> Payload box for cloud3 is nearly done - http://www.flickr.com/photos/daveake/sets/72157628868749177/
[10:09] <SpeedEvil> :)
[10:09] <fsphil> spiffy
[10:10] <fsphil> you did a neater job of soldering the fsa03 than I
[10:11] <daveake> :)
[10:11] <SpeedEvil> So your payload is duct tape?
[10:11] <daveake> lol. Basically yes.
[10:12] <daveake> I'll upload some more pix later. The cameras go into little "pods" that just slide in, to make it easy to add them shortly before launch.
[10:12] <SpeedEvil> neat!
[10:13] <daveake> On my first launch the insides were a mess, and the cameras had to go in first. Since the batteries for the cameras will run out first, that put time pressure on getting the thing launched.
[10:14] <daveake> fsphil You'll be pleased to see that there's a little loom - http://www.flickr.com/photos/daveake/6696159835/in/set-72157628868749177 for connecting the Arduino to everything else
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[10:15] <daveake> Commander Data Mk II ;)
[10:16] <daveake> Suppose one day I should learn Eagle or similar and make my own PCBs. Used to do that stuff by hand with tape years ago!
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[10:20] <fsphil> tape?
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[10:22] <daveake> <Old FartMode> When I were a lad, you made PCBs by drawing the pads using transfers, and tracks using transfers or thin flexible tape</Old FartMode>
[10:22] <fsphil> ooh I bet that was fun
[10:22] <daveake> Then dip the board in FeCL3 for half an hour
[10:22] <daveake> Yep
[10:22] Action: SpeedEvil used a fine-tipped quill-pen to draw tracks on the board.
[10:22] <daveake> Dalo pen wasn't it?
[10:23] <SpeedEvil> naah - just a random black permenant marker
[10:23] <daveake> :)
[10:23] <daveake> http://www.maplin.co.uk/dalo-etch-resistant-marker-pen-2105
[10:24] <fsphil> I did a pcb with a pen once, but it turned out as bad as my handwriting
[10:24] <daveake> Yeah I didn't get on with the pens
[10:25] <number10> payload is looking good daveake
[10:25] <daveake> tvm
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[10:33] <russss> some of those old hand-drawn PCBs are works of art though
[10:34] <Randomskk> some modern CAD PCBs are also
[10:37] <russss> true
[10:44] <SpeedEvil> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55z_0BYb5is&feature=plcp&context=C3c06232UDOEgsToPDskIBOhnbZAVBzhr-hchJK5xM
[10:44] <SpeedEvil> On the context of works of art
[10:44] <SpeedEvil> pcbs
[10:48] <daveake> Camera modules in my payload - http://www.flickr.com/photos/daveake/6707279027/in/set-72157628868749177. The slot on the right is for the cpu battery pack; the slots bottom left and right are for the camcorder.
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[10:50] <Upu> yikes daveake soldering directly to the FSA03 :/
[10:50] <daveake> Yep. Problem? :)
[10:50] <Upu> also daveake my Dads garage is still stained with that stuff you used to etch PCB's
[10:50] <daveake> I'm going to glue the wires to the back for a bit of strength
[10:51] <Upu> they'll break :)
[10:51] <Upu> I need to do an Eagle tutorial
[10:51] <daveake> I need to find some time to learn it :)
[10:51] <Upu> its really not that hard once you learn its funnies
[10:53] <daveake> Upu Ferric Chloride. Evil stuff, especially if you use hot water to speed things up :)
[10:53] <number10> does the antenna section fit like a bottom lid daveake http://www.flickr.com/photos/daveake/6696473215/in/set-72157628868749177/
[10:53] <UpuWork> yeah thats the stuff, I spilt it down the old coal bunker/bench in my Dad's garage
[10:53] <UpuWork> stained all the bricks
[10:53] <daveake> :)
[10:54] <daveake> I wrote off plenty of clothing with that stuff
[10:54] <UpuWork> when I was 6
[10:55] <UpuWork> I tried to give my Dad a hand and pick up the battery out of a Ford Cortina
[10:55] <UpuWork> tipped it back and spilt battery acid all down me
[10:55] <UpuWork> saved by a very quick thinking Dad (hosed me down)
[10:55] <daveake> !!!!
[10:55] <UpuWork> and my grandmas extremely thick wooly jumper (destroyed)
[10:56] <SpeedEvil> battery acid isn't _that_ nasty
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[10:56] <SpeedEvil> as long as you wash it off promptly
[10:56] <SpeedEvil> well
[10:56] <UpuWork> there was a massive hole portal style in my jumper
[10:56] <SpeedEvil> actually - for yo...
[10:57] <SpeedEvil> 6yo
[10:57] <daveake> A friend and I used to do chemical experiments in his garden shed. Walked in one day and he was diluting some sulphuric acid, by pouring the acid into a bottle of water. I had just about got the words out that this really wasn';t a very good idea and he should get some distance between it and him, when the glass shattered. The contents missed him and landed on my jeans.
[10:57] <SpeedEvil> he just wanted to see you naked.
[10:57] <daveake> lol
[10:58] <daveake> number10 - yes, fits into the bottom. You can't see on that photo but it has a piece of foam on the top to locate it. I'll make two - one for .650 and one for .075
[10:58] <daveake> (it has the NTX2 connected. Or will have soon)
[10:59] <fsphil> Upu, I soldered direct to the fsa03 three times, all good :)
[10:59] <number10> sounds like its comming together pretty quickly since you only started friday (saturday is any of your customers are here)
[10:59] <UpuWork> I destroyed an Inventek doing that
[11:00] <daveake> number10 lol
[11:00] <UpuWork> ah ha found it
[11:00] <fsphil> which reminds me, if anyone from my office is on here. I'm not here
[11:01] <UpuWork> http://imagebin.org/193900
[11:01] <UpuWork> check the stains!
[11:01] <daveake> :D
[11:01] <gonzo_> then also, THEY are not here phil!
[11:02] <number10> I notice you have a beer fridge in the garage UpuWork
[11:02] <UpuWork> absolutely
[11:03] <UpuWork> I used to run a server in that
[11:03] <UpuWork> the coal bunker that never was
[11:03] <UpuWork> my Dad built it for coal then a month later central heating was installed
[11:04] <UpuWork> so it never got used, made a great work bench / server storage
[11:04] <number10> thats one thing my house is lacking is a garage
[11:06] <daveake> UpuWork has it all ... garage with beer fridge, perched on top of a hilll ....
[11:08] <UpuWork> no thats my Dads house
[11:08] <UpuWork> though I do have a garage with a beer fridge in it
[11:08] <UpuWork> :)
[11:08] <daveake> Ah sorry. Too early :)
[11:08] <UpuWork> not that its on at the moment, not really needed given its -2 out there
[11:09] <daveake> Used to keep the elise in the garage, but now that I work from home and need more space I chcuked that outside and put shelving, workbenches and the servers in the garage.
[11:10] <daveake> No beer fridge yet though!
[11:15] <fsphil> I've the server in the attic, but spiders keep setting up home inside it
[11:15] <UpuWork> my Exchange server is in the garage
[11:15] <gonzo_> we built somethjing similar at a friends house as a wine cellar
[11:16] <gonzo_> a friend had a family of mice living in his garagge server
[11:16] <gonzo_> found them when they chewed through the mains cable
[11:17] <gonzo_> a server outage and a nasty smell
[11:18] <daveake> We had some living in the back of the dishwasher. They made a nest from the noise-deadending foam. They flooded themselves out by chewing through the water hose. The smell, oh the smell ....
[11:19] <SpeedEvil> uSpiders?
[11:19] <UpuWork> people say you want a cat for this situation but trust me a dog is better, cats get bored
[11:19] <UpuWork> Terrier
[11:20] <daveake> We have 4 cats ...
[11:21] <number10> I had a 1/2 sack of grass seed in the shed once - went in and saw it moving, so was ready to flatten a rat - turned out to be a hedgehog - was the fattest hedgehog Ive seen
[11:21] <daveake> ... as you say, they get bored. They only ever bring mice *into* the house. Sometimes alive, sometimes not.
[11:21] <daveake> And birds, voles, small rats, rabbits ...
[11:23] <SparxEtch> My cat brings mice through the house. D:
[11:26] <SpeedEvil> http://www.mauve.plus.com/rattus.jpg I do it myself.
[11:29] <daveake> At one of my customer's factories they had a leak under a chemical mixing machine. A rat tried to walk across the puddle, but only got halfway when either it ran out of steam or found the stuff was just too sticky. Long slow death followed.
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[11:36] <SparxEtch> Youch
[11:38] <gonzo_> nosebleedkt_, is the username a jok on boltzmanns eqn?
[11:42] <cuddykid> 1st exam finished - time to crack on with designing this pcb :P
[11:43] <nosebleedkt_> gonzo_: what?
[11:43] <nosebleedkt_> my nose is bleeding. thats all dude
[11:44] <gonzo_> Noise=BkT
[11:44] <gonzo_> oh well, been meaning to ask for ages
[11:44] <nosebleedkt_> still dont get you
[11:44] <nosebleedkt_> :P
[11:45] <gonzo_> there was a story I was told a while ago. A locan eng works had just spent a fortune of having the pidgeon crap cleaned off the building. To stop them roosting on the window sills and making another mess the works forman suggested getting someone in to put an anti bird gel on the sills. This irritates they feet and they get the message to not land there.
[11:46] <nosebleedkt_> damn
[11:46] <nosebleedkt_> must be an illusion
[11:46] <nosebleedkt_> sorry im working. i dont get you :)
[11:47] <gonzo_> apptly the owner was a tight arse and decided he could make something himself cheaper. so went into the chem locker and mixed stuff and pasted it outside the windows
[11:47] <gonzo_> The story goes that the next morning he was called in early, before anyone else got there, because there were 100's of birds glued to the sills
[11:47] <SparxEtch> lmao
[11:47] <gonzo_> nosebleedkt_, it;s a thread that was running just before you joined
[11:47] <fsphil> haha
[11:47] <gonzo_> it gets worse, but will tell you after tea break!
[11:47] <nosebleedkt_> still wtf
[11:47] <nosebleedkt_> i dont get the english
[11:48] <nosebleedkt_> i dont get your meaning
[11:48] <nosebleedkt_> brb
[11:48] <fsphil> sparrowhawks... that'll keep the pigeons away
[11:50] <SparxEtch> I worked for an eletronics firm once. Someone shot a pigeon down with an air rifle and it landed on the counter.
[11:50] <UpuWork> err
[11:50] <UpuWork> http://imagebin.org/193902
[11:50] <SparxEtch> The poor woman on the otherside of the counter fainted
[11:56] <daveake> My first launch landed about a metre away from a garden seat. Fortunately not occupied. That would have been a brown-trouser moment.
[11:57] <gonzo_> hehe, we used to shoot magpies off the telegraph pole across the raod. That was in the midle of a used car lot
[11:58] <gonzo_> shot one and it landed on the bonnet of a car, unfortunatly the dealer and prospective customer were standing over it haggling
[11:58] <BrainDamage> add an impact sensibile detonator
[12:01] <gonzo_> anyway, the story (not HAB realted at all)
[12:01] <gonzo_> They can't release the birds and it's getting close to the time when all the office girls would statrt arriving. So they go around and wring their necks
[12:01] <gonzo_> Now have 100dead pigeons glued to the sills, hanging down over the sides
[12:03] <gonzo_> so they then get a pair of wire cutters and snip off all the feet.
[12:03] <gonzo_> But after a few days the girls started to ask what all the little stalks were on the sills. Were told that they were to frighten off the birds. And suppise... No more landed there.
[12:03] <gonzo_> </story>
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[12:04] <SparxEtch> Woah D:
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[13:06] <cuddykid> UpuWork: with the saratel antenna do both ground pins need to be connected up? Just looking at your pcb for swift and only one is, thanks!
[13:08] <Upu> hey cuddykid
[13:08] <Upu> no both are
[13:08] <Upu> center pin is the RX two outside are GND
[13:08] <cuddykid> cheers Upu :D
[13:09] <cuddykid> on the swift v1-2 board the pin on the right isn't connected to anything (by the looks of it)
[13:09] <Upu> sec
[13:11] <Upu> 1-2 ?
[13:11] <cuddykid> yeah, I grabbed it off the project swift github
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[13:11] <Upu> Think that was a test board
[13:11] <Upu> go to www.github.org/upuaut
[13:11] <cuddykid> that explains it
[13:11] <cuddykid> will do, thanks
[13:11] <Upu> https://github.com/Upuaut/Eagle-Libraries/tree/f13067d71880178edb956a052e7015eb2c3725f9/Project%20Swift
[13:12] <Upu> get SwiftV1.sch
[13:12] <Upu> and .rd
[13:12] <Upu> .brd
[13:12] <UpuWork> http://imagebin.org/193909
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[13:14] <UpuWork> they are connected but all on the GND copper pour
[13:14] <cuddykid> I see, thanks
[13:15] <UpuWork> just hit rats nest to see the copper pour
[13:15] <cuddykid> Upu / UpuWork: do you know why your ava2 eagle stuff won't open? running latest mac version of eagle
[13:15] <Upu> Eagle 6.1 ?
[13:15] <cuddykid> just says "invalid data in ____ file"
[13:15] <cuddykid> yeah
[13:16] <Upu> yeah I had that 1 sec just got to get phone
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[13:18] <cuddykid> Upu: problem solved - for some reason when I installed eagle 6.1 instead of installing over the old copy it created a new version and I wasn't using it - doh. All working with 6.1 :)
[13:19] <UpuWork> jolly good!
[13:19] <UpuWork> if you're using the uBlox/Sarantel get the latest library
[13:22] <Upu> so are you making a custom PCB ?
[13:23] <Upu> hmm where did the library go
[13:25] <Upu> oh there it is
[13:26] <cuddykid> Upu: yeah, attempting to - want to slim everything down and pop it all on one smallish board - radio, atmega328 and ublox
[13:26] <cuddykid> currently my flight board is a complete mess - wires everywhere!
[13:26] <fsphil> I love that homebrew stuff is getting really professional like :)
[13:26] <Upu> surface mount ATMega ?
[13:27] <cuddykid> Upu: no, it's a dip (I think that's the term) one with pins, I'm going to use a holder for it though so I can take it out if need be
[13:27] <Upu> meh chicken :)
[13:27] <cuddykid> lol
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[13:27] <Upu> surface mount is great , prefer it to the thruogh hole stuff now
[13:27] <cuddykid> I'll be using the uBlox 6 though, If I can figure out all the wirings
[13:27] <Upu> its pretty easy to wire
[13:27] <Upu> check out picoAva FC board
[13:28] <cuddykid> there are a huge amount of ground pins!
[13:28] <Upu> thats a ublox6 , atmega, radio and pressure on one 28mmx45mm board
[13:28] <cuddykid> ahh yeah - that's easier :P thanks
[13:28] <Upu> only 6
[13:28] <Upu> GND's
[13:28] <NickB1> hey upu, why is it that you tie both ground planes together with an array of vias at the GPS ?
[13:29] <cuddykid> do you just connect them all up then link into GND on atmega?
[13:29] <Upu> recommended in the hardware integration manual for the GPS NickB1 also recommended by Darkside
[13:30] <Upu> cuddykid all GND link anyway as once you're done you make a "copper pour" fills in all the unlinked surface with copper ground plane
[13:30] <cuddykid> oh I see :D
[13:30] <Upu> any labeled as GND is linked to the same "net"
[13:31] Nick change: number10_ -> number10
[13:31] <Upu> you can pick a random wire, right click it -> Name and call it GND and its then GND
[13:31] <Upu> that helps when linking parts together, call the GPS TX GPS_TX
[13:31] <Upu> then the pin you link it to on the ATMega the same and boom they are linked even though there is no direct line on the schematic
[13:32] <zyp> NickB1, because you don't want huge ground loops
[13:32] <UpuWork> makes schematics much tider
[13:32] <UpuWork> NickB1 what zyp said
[13:33] <UpuWork> stops nasty inductive things going
[13:34] <NickB1> hmm
[13:34] <fsphil> induction is the enemy
[13:34] <zyp> the huger a ground loop is, the more it will work as an antenna, picking up noise into your ground
[13:34] <Darkside> hey all
[13:34] <Darkside> UpuWork: is there a new version of the chase car android app?
[13:34] <cuddykid> Upu / UpuWork: ahh, never knew you could do that, that's neat. Asks "do you want to connect ___ and GND?" <- that's the "net" right?
[13:34] <NickB1> arent you creating loops by doing so ?
[13:34] <NickB1> theres only one path zhen you use a solig round plane on the bottom
[13:34] <UpuWork> Darkside that was Willduckworth who made that
[13:34] <Darkside> oh ok
[13:34] <NickB1> *groundplane
[13:34] <zyp> NickB1, wrong
[13:35] <UpuWork> cuddykid yeah note the schematics I've done the nets come out of the ATmega but appear to be just floating, they're not I've labelled them up, means the schematics are much tidier
[13:35] <zyp> NickB1, remember that a complete circuit consists of a signal and the return path through gnd
[13:35] <Darkside> we're giving our talk on project horus tomorro
[13:36] <Darkside> but its at about 4UTC
[13:36] <zyp> and that circuit also is a loop
[13:36] <Darkside> so you guys will all be asleep
[13:36] <UpuWork> recording it ?
[13:36] <Darkside> but its being recorded, and will be put online
[13:36] <zyp> so you want to minimize the area of that
[13:37] <Laurenceb> wtf is that?!
[13:37] <Laurenceb> bouncing balloon?
[13:37] <UpuWork> what where Laurenceb ?
[13:37] <Laurenceb> on spacenear
[13:38] <NickB1> but doesnt a solid groundplane on the bottom make the loop the smallest?
[13:38] <NickB1> it can choose the shortest path
[13:39] <NickB1> its a bit fuzzy for me :)
[13:39] <fsphil> there's nothing on spacenear
[13:42] <UpuWork> nothing on spacenear you smoking something Laurenceb ?
[13:42] <Laurenceb> i see horus
[13:42] <Laurenceb> oh it gone
[13:42] <Laurenceb> weird
[13:43] <UpuWork> only thing on Spacenear.us is Darkside stealing my Globaltuners login
[13:44] <Darkside> lol
[13:45] <Darkside> heh
[13:45] <Darkside> i took the data off
[13:45] <Darkside> i was testing stuff in preparation for the launch
[13:45] <Darkside> since we haven't got a properly kitted out chase car, we have to do this chase the dodgy way
[13:45] <Darkside> which makes me quite nervois
[13:45] <Darkside> nervous*
[13:46] <gonzo_> is that a french nervous?
[13:50] <zyp> NickB1, the purpose of the abundance of vias is to make the two ground planes act as a single ground plane
[13:50] <Darkside> it also removes stray capacitance
[13:51] <Darkside> ok i need to sleep
[13:51] <Darkside> night
[13:51] <Darkside> 73s all
[13:51] <zyp> NickB1, think about fabric, the tighter it's woven, the more it appears as a solid surface
[13:52] <NickB1> zyp, ok I understand
[13:54] <NickB1> I've always thought of building a two layer board which simulates a 4 layer board by incorporating a solid ground plane on the bottom
[13:55] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: http://sales.hamamatsu.com/assets/applications/SSD/Characteristics_and_use_of_infrared_detectors.pdf - lots of fun graphs of transmission qualities of common materials and stuff
[13:55] <Laurenceb> cool
[13:56] <Laurenceb> lol@ altitude grahps
[13:56] <Laurenceb> no wonder balloons dont last
[13:56] <Laurenceb> ooh salt works
[13:59] <daveake> Any HABhub types here can upload a payload document for me?
[14:02] <daveake> blimey it's gone quiet ;)
[14:03] <fsphil> ooooh
[14:03] <fsphil> I can't from here
[14:04] <UpuWork> I don't know how to do that
[14:04] <fsphil> actually maybe
[14:04] <fsphil> is the doc handy?
[14:04] <SpeedEvil> Page 40 - graph with axis 'human movement speed (dB) and Frequency spectrum (Hz) with 'tiptoe' on one of the lines. :)
[14:04] <daveake> http://pastebin.com/CnZBCMfW
[14:04] <fsphil> it may explode though, so be warned :)
[14:04] <daveake> Later is fine :-)
[14:04] <daveake> In that case I won't suggest you delete my old one "CLOUD2" which isn't needed now ;)
[14:05] <zyp> NickB1, I've built a four layer board with ground on outer layers and signals on inner
[14:05] <daveake> The payload won't be running till this evening anyway, at the earliest
[14:05] <SpeedEvil> Also - i wonder if they made up 'steam laser'
[14:05] <zyp> http://bin.jvnv.net/f/yuaYu.png
[14:05] <NickB1> zyp, that way it is shielded ?
[14:06] <zyp> yes, kind of like a faraday cage
[14:06] <zyp> the red and blue layers are the outer layers
[14:07] <NickB1> i see
[14:07] <NickB1> never seen it done like that
[14:07] <NickB1> always a solid inner ground
[14:07] <fsphil> daveake, it might be saved. not sure
[14:07] <zyp> RF lecturer on uni advised me to do it this way
[14:08] <zyp> and he's a guy that knows his stuff
[14:08] <daveake> OK, hopefully this evening when I'm not working I'll get the payload connected up enough to transmit
[14:08] <NickB1> yeah, the things I see are not up to those frequencies
[14:09] <zyp> the thing in the top left corner is a 2.4 GHz antenna
[14:10] <NickB1> oh ok
[14:10] <NickB1> So the ground planes protect the circuit from the 2.4?
[14:10] <zyp> yes
[14:11] <NickB1> nice
[14:11] <NickB1> what do you use for design software?
[14:12] <zyp> I made that in eagle
[14:13] Action: cuddykid wonders if his package will ever make it out of SF
[14:13] <fsphil> it may already have, and just not updated?
[14:13] <fsphil> I've never seen one sit so long in one place
[14:13] <fsphil> or they've lost it
[14:14] <cuddykid> fsphil, I'm not sure - seems to be a fairly automatic update system - once it's scanned through, then it updates
[14:14] <cuddykid> hasn't moved since friday
[14:14] <cuddykid> so it may just be weekend
[14:14] <cuddykid> I'll check with parcel force as they're the ones who take over control when it gets here
[14:15] <cuddykid> nope - last update "Forwarded for export in San Francisco"
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[14:31] <number10> is that the first time you have used the fas03 daveake
[14:33] <daveake> yep
[14:33] <number10> taking it for a drive at the weeken over the meridian or have you tested that?
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[14:34] <daveake> Might do :-). Or I have some test NMEA anyway.
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[15:40] <Dan-K2VOL> morning
[15:40] <UpuWork> afternoon Dan
[15:40] <Dan-K2VOL> heh
[15:41] <Dan-K2VOL> how's your monday UpuWork
[15:41] <UpuWork> quiet actually and cold
[15:41] <UpuWork> the Gas utlility co decided this weekend would be a good one to do some gas works outside
[15:41] <UpuWork> its -2'C
[15:41] <UpuWork> and they managed not to complete the work on time so no heat
[15:42] <UpuWork> but otherwise good, hows you ?
[15:42] <Dan-K2VOL> ugh that would be unpleassant
[15:42] <UpuWork> could be worse the kettle still works
[15:42] <Dan-K2VOL> pretty good, haven't been to work for long, but it's quiet so far. Been looking at kiCad on OSX, it's a mess, but seems mostly functional
[15:42] <UpuWork> so we can still have our cups of tea
[15:42] <Dan-K2VOL> :-)
[15:43] <UpuWork> Yeah I need to check out Kicad
[15:43] <UpuWork> though I'm getting on ok with Eagle
[15:45] <Dan-K2VOL> yeah I'm rather partial to programs that work already
[15:46] <Dan-K2VOL> though I'd also usually say I don't prefer open source because of the poor UI choices they feature, but Eagle is not going to win any UI contest either
[15:46] <UpuWork> its better now in version 6
[15:46] <UpuWork> but yeah could do better
[15:46] <Dan-K2VOL> hmm, I haven't updated eagle in about a year, I'll ahve to check it out
[15:46] <UpuWork> well main reason is they've moved the file format to XML
[15:47] <UpuWork> so you can use version control
[15:47] <Dan-K2VOL> finally!
[15:47] <fsphil> not a good time to mention that it's too hot here? the heating system is stuck on full
[15:47] <UpuWork> and get this
[15:47] <UpuWork> to "copy" something you press "copy" and not "cut"
[15:47] <UpuWork> blown away by that new feature it'll catch on I'm sure
[15:48] <daveake> lol
[15:49] <fsphil> is the layout bit any easier in 6?
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[15:53] <zyp> eagle kind of grows on you after a while
[15:53] <Upu> yeah I don't mind it at all
[15:53] <zyp> I like the command interface
[15:53] <UpuWork> sort of use it
[15:54] <UpuWork> name, pin etc
[15:54] <fsphil> I think I missed that
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[16:00] <fsphil> how easy is it to add parts?
[16:00] <fsphil> to eagle
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[16:01] Nick change: Elwell_ -> Elwell
[16:02] <SpeedEvil> Hard. I tried adding a trunk, and for some reason it wouldn't fly.
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[16:08] <fsphil> trunk?
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[16:12] <Laurenceb> lol
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[16:13] <UpuWork> pretty easy but time consuming
[16:14] <UpuWork> that Antenova part took me about an hour
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[16:16] <eroomde> how long are people waiting on fusion pcb from payment to delivery usually?
[16:16] <UpuWork> 2 weeks ?
[16:16] <UpuWork> was pretty quick over XMAS
[16:17] <Laurenceb> http://www.northdownfarm.co.uk/rory/tim/
[16:17] <fsphil> that the relay computer?
[16:17] <UpuWork> Yeah about 2 weeks for the last 2 I ordered eroomde
[16:17] <fsphil> 1000 points for the first person to fly that
[16:18] <eroomde> thank UpuWork
[16:18] <UpuWork> We once transferred data using mechanical relays when I worked in the robotics research dept at ICI Wilton
[16:18] <UpuWork> it was very noisy
[16:18] <UpuWork> but that's very impresive
[16:19] <UpuWork> eroomde "monkey" sends you a mail telling you how its going when yuo order
[16:20] <eroomde> ok
[16:20] <eroomde> it's the variance i'm more interested in really
[16:21] <eroomde> don't want to get caught shaort by a 6 week wait
[16:25] <UpuWork> well its been 2 weeks for me twice now
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[16:50] <cuddykid> what's the easiest way of implementing a timer for 1min using arduino, but during that 1min I want the loop() to keep running?
[16:51] <fsphil> arduino has the millis() thing, counting the amount of time since startup
[16:52] <fsphil> you could store that, and keep checking util it's >= 60 seconds difference
[16:52] <daveake> fsphil Cheers, payload now appearing on spacenear :)
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[16:53] <daveake> These ublox 6's only seem to need a sniff of the sky to get a lock.
[16:53] <fsphil> yea they're pretty amazing
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[16:54] <daveake> The UBlox I used beforee was a '5', and that needed telling to Tx the RMC sentence. This one sends it right off the bat.
[16:55] <daveake> So probably I just need to set it to Flight mode
[16:55] <fsphil> wonder if that's still needed on ublox
[16:55] <fsphil> 6
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[16:55] <daveake> Well I'm not going to risk it unless someone tells me categorically it doesn't need it :)
[16:56] <fsphil> hehe yea, don't expect a rush of people to try it
[16:56] <fsphil> unless Darkside gets a hold of the gps simulator again this year :)
[16:56] <daveake> :)
[17:00] <cuddykid> thanks fsphil - not sure why I didn't think of that, I was looking at interrupts silly me
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[17:05] <fsphil> if you need something to happen precisely each minute then interrupts may still be better
[17:06] <cuddykid> nah, it's just a one off - needed to turn on cutdown then wait a min then turn it off :)
[17:06] <daveake> a minute?
[17:06] <daveake> melty melt melt
[17:07] <daveake> If you're using separate batteries and the wire isn't going to do any damage, then OK, but that's quite a long time.
[17:07] <cuddykid> daveake: going for 45secs - thing is, currently it takes ~10secs to melt through - however with the temps up there, I want to make sure it deffo does cutdown
[17:08] <cuddykid> yeah, separate batteries :)
[17:09] <daveake> I'd got for hotter then rather than a longer time
[17:09] <cuddykid> daveake: another batt?
[17:09] <daveake> Shorter nichrome
[17:09] <cuddykid> already as short as poss
[17:10] <fsphil> thinner nichrome?
[17:10] <daveake> thicker
[17:10] <fsphil> thinner should get hotter
[17:10] <daveake> think again :)
[17:11] <cuddykid> lol
[17:11] <cuddykid> thinner, thicker! & thinner! &.. thicker!
[17:11] <fsphil> thicker wire will need more current
[17:11] <daveake> So it'll take more current --> more power --> hotter
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[17:12] <fsphil> hmm
[17:12] <fsphil> pesky thermodynamic laws
[17:12] <daveake> ohms innit
[17:12] <fsphil> it's futile trying to break them
[17:12] Nick change: SamSilver -> SamSilver_
[17:13] <daveake> There's a catch phrase there ....
[17:13] <fsphil> possibly, although I'm a programmer, not a writer Jim
[17:14] <fsphil> that would've worked better of jcoxon had done it
[17:14] <daveake> :)
[17:15] <daveake> It's the Lithium batteries, Jim, they canna take any more
[17:15] <number10> they are di - ing
[17:15] <fsphil> try reversing the polarity!
[17:16] <daveake> Kaaaaaaaahn .... t
[17:16] <daveake> Apparently Benedict Cumberbatch will the the baddy in the next movie
[17:17] <fsphil> Indubitably
[17:17] <fsphil> also two bad guys in the Hobbit movies
[17:17] <fsphil> he does evil well it seems
[17:18] <fsphil> woo, escape time
[17:19] <daveake> :-). So now I can work on the flight computer .... ahem.
[17:19] <number10> I 'll be timing you - to get home logon by 18:10
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[17:48] <cuddykid> quite excited to see if the raspberry pi becomes the new HAB flight computer of choice
[17:49] <costyn> cuddykid: are they shipping yet?
[17:49] <cuddykid> costyn: don't think so - they're currently making 1st batch ~1000 units I think
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[17:55] <Randomskk> I doubt it -- they'll likely be more of a pain to interface sensors and radios to
[17:55] <Randomskk> plus it's not like anyone's really required any usefully powerful computer up there anyway
[17:55] <Randomskk> there might be fun applications for them as payloads, maybe
[17:56] <cuddykid> Randomskk: I agree with you, not sure of the power consumption but I'm guessing it's far higher than arduino - wouldn't be ideal
[17:59] <fsphil> if it can be underclocked then maybe it will be competitive, power wise
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[18:00] <fsphil> having a USB port does mean I can use much cheaper cameras
[18:00] <fsphil> the uart cameras are about £55 each
[18:00] <Randomskk> yea, it'd work well for cameras
[18:01] <cuddykid> yeah
[18:02] <cuddykid> plus it will be good to mess around with low level assembler stuff :P
[18:02] <Randomskk> the AVR is lower level, though... you can program arduinos in assembler
[18:02] <cuddykid> yeah - I wanted to put my ARM stuff into practice with a real chip :P
[18:03] <Randomskk> what ARM stuff?
[18:03] <Randomskk> bear in mind that rp is a cortex-a8 iirc which means thumb2 I think
[18:03] <Randomskk> rather than the ARM instruction set itself
[18:04] <Randomskk> oh
[18:04] <Randomskk> it's an ARM11
[18:04] <Randomskk> fair enough then
[18:04] <cuddykid> Randomskk: just done a semester in comp systems architecture based on arm assembler - but nothing too indepth
[18:04] <Randomskk> most assemblers are similar -- maybe try out the AVR one
[18:06] <Randomskk> I'd want the RP so I can run python, not write assembler :P
[18:07] <cuddykid> lol
[18:08] <cuddykid> just read about the ICT curriculum changes - very glad to see that ICT has been assigned to the bin and replaced with comp sci - far too late though
[18:09] <SpeedEvil> Indeed.
[18:09] <SpeedEvil> ~decade
[18:09] <SpeedEvil> Of course - that raises the thorny issue.
[18:10] <cuddykid> however, I very much doubt that the IT teachers at my old school would know a single thing about comp sci
[18:10] <SpeedEvil> WTF do you ...
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[18:43] <fsphil> I was looking at ARM chips for something avr-like but it looks like there is no such beastie yet
[18:44] <fsphil> what I really need is an AVR with 2mb of ram
[18:44] <nick_> fsphil: arduino due?
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[18:44] <NigelMoby> friendly ARM
[18:45] <fsphil> can it be programmed as easily nick_? (ie. not using the arduino ide)
[18:45] <fsphil> at the moment I use avr-gcc and avrdude
[18:45] <nick_> Well, other than it doesn't currently exist, yes.
[18:45] <fsphil> ah
[18:45] <nick_> You can program the arduino from command line.
[18:45] <nick_> So I assume the new ARM version will be similar.
[18:45] <NigelMoby> Phil
[18:45] <NigelMoby> http://www.friendlyarm.net/products/mini2440
[18:46] <fsphil> ooh
[18:46] <fsphil> 64Mb ram :)
[18:47] <NigelMoby> Yup 34pin gpio to
[18:47] <nick_> http://arduino.cc/blog/2011/09/17/arduino-launches-new-products-in-maker-faire/
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[18:48] <nick_> Oh, it doesn't have a whole lot of ram.
[18:48] <fsphil> 64 is overkill, for my project I'd only need 2
[18:48] <fsphil> was looking at external ram for avr's but it isn't easy at all
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[18:49] <NigelMoby> but 64 is so nice...lol
[18:49] <Upu> Arduino Due ?
[18:49] <Upu> the Arduino "Oh shit Raspberry PI's actually coming out"
[18:50] <fsphil> lol
[18:50] <fsphil> which one will be on sale first
[18:50] <nick_> PI
[18:50] <Upu> well the chinese are making the PI so I roll with PI
[18:50] <nick_> They should start shipping in a few weeks.
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[18:50] <nick_> I plan to buy one to use as a media centre (along with my projector)
[18:51] <Upu> be interested to see if it works
[18:51] <Upu> I use a Asus Revo at the moment
[18:51] <NigelMoby> it'll work
[18:51] <nick_> It's a shame they couldn't make them in the UK, but like he said, they're a charity, they cannot afford to lose money on the first batch.
[18:51] <fsphil> I'd like to fly one, and use it as a recorder -- see what kind of radio signals I can hear at 30km
[18:51] <Upu> with a funcube in it ?
[18:52] <fsphil> tempted yea
[18:52] <fsphil> or I might go for a cheaper radio
[18:52] <Upu> be good at compressing images
[18:52] <fsphil> one of the chinese handhelds
[18:52] <fsphil> that too
[18:52] <SpeedEvil> I plan on replacing my router with a USB wifi dongle, or three, a raspberry pi.
[18:52] <NigelMoby> send the uvr up?
[18:52] <Upu> interesting times
[18:52] <SpeedEvil> Drop perhaps 3W on baseline power, and do a lot more.
[18:53] <fsphil> that's a good idea too
[18:53] <NigelMoby> mm sounds good speedy
[18:53] <cuddykid> I think the raspberry pi will open up a whole new realm of possibilities being that cheap
[18:53] <SpeedEvil> And I need to sort out a 12V rail for stuff, so I can lose the inefficient PSUs on some stuff.
[18:54] <SpeedEvil> Also 5V, to recharge
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[19:03] <nick_> I really hope the first batch of pis sell out quickly.
[19:04] <SpeedEvil> Indeed.
[19:08] <NigelMoby> they limiting it to 1 per person?
[19:08] <fsphil> I bet half of the first batch end up on ebay
[19:09] <NigelMoby> Yup wouldn't surprise me.
[19:09] <nick_> NigelMoby: yes
[19:09] <NigelMoby> good
[19:10] <nick_> (Or 2 if they do a buy one, give one thing)
[19:10] <NigelMoby> might get a chance of getting 1 then lol
[19:18] <fsphil> been trying to play the same 4 minute tune all the way through for the last 30 minutes, but keep getting interrupted
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[19:42] <fsphil> that relay computer is brilliant. it can be overclocked to 10 hz :)
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[19:45] <jcoxon> evening
[19:51] <Upu> evening
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[19:53] <Laurenceb_> Randomskk: ping
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[20:28] <costyn> how come when I try one piece of code (Upu's test code), i get 2 clear lines of shift, but when I try jcoxon's code I don't have a clear 425hz shift
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[20:29] <fsphil-laptop> they may be switching different pins?
[20:29] <fsphil-laptop> if you're using the two-pin method and you only switch one of the pins, the shift will change. sometimes dramatically
[20:30] <costyn> i am using the 2 pin method... is there another pin method?
[20:30] <fsphil-laptop> you can use one pin and a few resistors
[20:31] <fsphil-laptop> but if you've it working with two pins I'd stick with that for now
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[20:31] <fsphil-laptop> you'll need to make sure jcoxon's code is toggling the same pins as upu's
[20:32] <costyn> I think it is... they both have pins 4 and 5
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[20:34] <fsphil-laptop> are both pins being configured as outputs?
[20:34] <costyn> yes
[20:34] <fsphil-laptop> arduino may be doing that for you
[20:34] <costyn> hmph... weird... jcoxon's code is using a shift of 85
[20:35] <costyn> i thought the shift was defined by the resistors
[20:35] <costyn> cause it's working now
[20:35] <Hiena> Anybody has an idea to chemical decompose a paper?
[20:35] <Lando-Uni> Hiena: Cellulase
[20:35] <Hiena> I got the sulfuric-acid in mind but has no time to cook it.
[20:36] <fsphil-laptop> it is costyn, but again the way the pins are toggled can change it
[20:36] <Lando-Uni> Hiena: Cellulase
[20:36] <costyn> fsphil-laptop: I see
[20:36] <Lando-Uni> Hiena: Cellulase
[20:36] <costyn> fsphil-laptop: so this probably means I'm not using the right pins
[20:37] <fsphil-laptop> that's my guess. are the two examples online somewhere?
[20:37] <Hiena> Lando-Uni: Any much more over the counter product?
[20:37] <costyn> fsphil-laptop: https://github.com/jamescoxon/Atlas-Flight-Computer/blob/master/Atlas3/Atlas3_3.pde <-- he's switching 3 pins here? 4 5 and 13?
[20:37] <costyn> fsphil-laptop: Upu's code: http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=125
[20:39] <fsphil-laptop> yea, 4 + 5
[20:39] <fsphil-laptop> both setup as outputs
[20:39] <fsphil-laptop> weird
[20:40] <jcoxon> costyn, the 13 is for the LED
[20:40] <Lando-Uni> Hiena: Cellulase
[20:40] <costyn> jcoxon: aargh.. duh :)
[20:40] <costyn> jcoxon: it does blink nicely when sending :)
[20:40] <fsphil-laptop> the two examples are essentially identical
[20:40] <jcoxon> the resistors define shift
[20:41] <jcoxon> yay stargazing live
[20:41] <costyn> fsphil-laptop: that's what I thought; and yet, in jcoxon's code I get it to work with a shift of 85 and 50baud and 8/n/1
[20:42] <jcoxon> same pins?
[20:42] <costyn> fsphil-laptop: and Upu's code 425 shift 7/n/1
[20:42] <Hiena> Lando-Uni: Yeah, it's kind of common here. I'll just go in to the Baumax and buy a gallon or two...
[20:42] <costyn> jcoxon: yep same pins, only differnce is the code I'm uploading
[20:42] <jcoxon> thats wird
[20:42] <jcoxon> weird*
[20:42] <fsphil-laptop> yea the 8-bit 7-bit difference is in the code
[20:43] <costyn> jcoxon: ok good, then it's not me hehe :)
[20:43] <fsphil-laptop> timing looks different
[20:43] <fsphil-laptop> similar enough that it should work though
[20:43] <costyn> fsphil-laptop: I've copied Upu's 50 baud timing to jcoxon's code, coudln't get his original timing to work
[20:44] <costyn> so delay is same too
[20:44] <fsphil-laptop> weirder and weirder
[20:44] <costyn> should I record a bit of 85 shift :)
[20:45] <jcoxon> costyn, go with what works
[20:46] <costyn> jcoxon: does it matter if the shift is so close?
[20:46] <cuddykid> my shift is ~800 lol
[20:46] <jcoxon> costyn, yeah
[20:46] <jcoxon> 425 is a good shift
[20:46] <jcoxon> 350 is fine as well
[20:47] <fsphil-laptop> as long as the shift is > the baud rate
[20:47] <jcoxon> too close a shift can cause issues with overlapping filters
[20:47] <costyn> jcoxon: that's what I thought, so I'd like to have that as well but not sure how now :)
[20:47] <jcoxon> costyn, change the resistors
[20:47] <costyn> ok
[20:47] <cuddykid> yeah, the magic happens with the resistor values
[20:47] <costyn> cuddykid: well... apparently not in my case but I'll fiddle with those tommorow
[20:48] <cuddykid> costyn: really? Strange! Yeah, have a fiddle :P
[20:48] <costyn> cuddykid: yea I can change the shift with only code, don't ask me how
[20:49] <cuddykid> wow - are you sure the shift? Not baud?
[20:49] <fsphil-laptop> costyn, upu's one gives the right shift yea?
[20:49] <costyn> cuddykid: yup, with one piece of code it's 85 and with another it's 425
[20:49] <costyn> fsphil-laptop: yes, that gives me 425
[20:49] <fsphil-laptop> try changing the code so that only one pin is toggled
[20:49] <fsphil-laptop> have 4 always on or off
[20:49] <cuddykid> that's odd
[20:49] <fsphil-laptop> see if it gives 85 shift
[20:50] <costyn> fsphil-laptop: ok
[20:50] <fsphil-laptop> that will at least narrow it down
[20:50] <costyn> one sec
[20:50] <fsphil-laptop> it could be 5 on or off too
[20:51] <costyn> getting a one-beep signal so no shift
[20:51] <costyn> which is expected I guess
[20:52] <jcoxon> fsphil-laptop, picoatlas6 MK3 is working well
[20:53] <jcoxon> just need to finalise the power source and then finish the radio antenna and its ready to roll
[20:53] <fsphil-laptop> nice-- you think it's tree-proof?
[20:53] <jcoxon> yeah
[20:54] <jcoxon> the last one was :-)
[20:54] <fsphil-laptop> will this be the first with the new gps module?
[20:54] <jcoxon> yes
[20:54] <jcoxon> its stupidly light
[20:55] <jcoxon> i've lost so much mass i can switch to a AA battery for the same weight
[20:57] <fsphil-laptop> any sensors?
[20:58] <jcoxon> bmp085
[20:58] <jcoxon> i was just thinking
[20:58] <jcoxon> so my battery will give out between 0 and 1.7V
[20:59] <jcoxon> so in theory i don't need a resistor divider to measure its voltage
[20:59] <jcoxon> just a resistor between it and the adc
[20:59] <daveake_> yep
[20:59] <fsphil-laptop> yea it'll always be lower than the output
[21:00] <daveake_> So long as the ADC ref is high enough
[21:00] <jcoxon> i assume the bigger the resistor the better
[21:00] <jcoxon> to keep the current low
[21:01] <costyn> ok well good news is my controller is now sending gps coordinates (still wildly varying), and temp ; tommorow I'll play with resistors and see if I can up the shift
[21:01] <daveake_> ADC i/p impedance should be high anyway
[21:02] <costyn> how long does it take for a neo 6m to stabilize and find it's place in the world? it's sitting on the window sill
[21:03] <jcoxon> costyn, it'll always drift a bit
[21:03] <jcoxon> and window sill gives it about 180deg view
[21:03] <costyn> at the moment it thinks I'm off the coast of greenland
[21:03] <jcoxon> hmmm
[21:03] <jcoxon> no it'll report correct within 100m
[21:03] <jcoxon> or nothing at all
[21:03] <jcoxon> your conversion is probably wrong
[21:04] <daveake_> good to find out now not later!
[21:04] <costyn> jcoxon: this is straight from your atlas code; are the coordinates coming out of that copy/pastable to google maps?
[21:04] <jcoxon> using tinygps?
[21:04] <jcoxon> can you paste the coords you have
[21:05] <costyn> 73.3190,-10.3071 is one popular one
[21:05] <costyn> and then I also get in the range of 28.4034,-13,9240
[21:05] <Upu> evening
[21:05] <jcoxon> costyn, thats mad
[21:06] <costyn> ah... and another set of coordinates at the top of the Kamchatka peninsula
[21:06] <jcoxon> the drift is quite small
[21:06] <costyn> maybe I hsould put it outside underneath clear sky
[21:06] <Upu> still struggling with the drift costyn ?
[21:06] <jcoxon> ublox gps?
[21:06] <costyn> jcoxon: yes, gps bee
[21:07] <daveake_> That's not GPS drift
[21:07] <jcoxon> polling the GPS with PUBX?
[21:07] <costyn> Upu: no, it's the GPS that's being weird now
[21:07] <Upu> oh ok
[21:07] <costyn> jcoxon: yes, as per your code (mostly unchanged) :)
[21:07] <jcoxon> which tinygps do you have?
[21:07] <jcoxon> the one from the wiki?
[21:07] <costyn> no, I think the main one when you google it?
[21:09] <jcoxon> http://wiki.ukhas.org.uk/guides:falcom_fsa03#modified_tinygps
[21:10] <costyn> jcoxon: thx lemme try that
[21:10] <costyn> i've just placed it outside with a clear view of the sky
[21:10] <costyn> starting to drift quite quickly now with the codl
[21:10] <jcoxon> costyn, also remember to turn off all the sentences
[21:10] <costyn> jcoxon: well that fixed it... it's reporting it's position perfectly now
[21:10] <jcoxon> the new lib?
[21:10] <costyn> jcoxon: gues the double glazing was messing it up somehow
[21:11] <costyn> jcoxon: putting it outside
[21:11] <jcoxon> oh right
[21:11] <costyn> well everything checks out now
[21:11] <jcoxon> okay
[21:11] <jcoxon> keep testing before launch
[21:11] <jcoxon> :-)
[21:11] <costyn> sorry for all the mind-boggles :)
[21:11] <costyn> hehe
[21:12] <costyn> I certainly will... I want to incorporate the bmp085 code next
[21:12] <costyn> jcoxon: although I might steal that from you too if you commit it to github ;) :P
[21:12] <jcoxon> i use a library :-)
[21:13] <Lando-Uni> SOUNDING ROCKET!
[21:13] <costyn> yea i had it workig in Tim's crazy code
[21:14] <costyn> jcoxon: I just realized numsats was 0 when it was reporting all those crazy coordinates
[21:14] <costyn> will look for that first next time
[21:14] <Upu> jsut assume sats < 4 = no lock
[21:15] <costyn> well happy with tonight's progress anyways
[21:15] <daveake_> yep
[21:15] <costyn> thanks a lot guys for your help :)
[21:19] Action: costyn signing off
[21:19] <Upu> o7
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[21:23] <Upu> did you get chance to print that part off jcoxon ?
[21:23] <jcoxon> not yet
[21:24] <Upu> no probs, do you run windows ?
[21:24] <jcoxon> let me finish what i'm doing and i'll have a go
[21:24] <jcoxon> Upu, no
[21:24] <Upu> sure no rush
[21:24] <Upu> Guess Eagle works on whatever you're running ?
[21:24] <jcoxon> i haven't tried new eagle
[21:24] <Upu> ok
[21:29] <jcoxon> http://www.bigspaceballoon.co.uk/about.php
[21:32] <jcoxon> anyone seen that before?
[21:32] <Upu> nope
[21:32] <cuddykid> nope
[21:32] <Upu> £500,000 ?
[21:32] <Upu> get him to 40k for £500 :/
[21:33] <Upu> mind you he'll need £500k to fill that balloon
[21:34] <cuddykid> bloody hell - don't think David Miller will be happy to dish out permission for that monster!
[21:35] Action: daveake_ checks to see if smallspaceballoon.co.uk is available :)
[21:35] <cuddykid> lol
[21:35] <fsphil> it has a telescope!
[21:36] <Upu> yeah this guy will get £500k make it all work and then not get a NOTAM from David Miller
[21:36] <Upu> lol
[21:36] <cuddykid> yup
[21:36] <cuddykid> David will be he biggest hurdle lol
[21:36] Action: Upu registers piconowherenearspaceballoon.co.uk for jcoxon
[21:36] <fsphil> !space
[21:36] <daveake_> :D
[21:37] <SpeedEvil> Also - wow.
[21:37] <SpeedEvil> I have a 'only' 50mW laser pointer.
[21:37] Action: daveake_ registers 41kmbutstillnotspace.com
[21:37] <Upu> smallspaceballoon.co.uk do a site "'ere at by 'eck balloons we's going to space and like, we need to raise 50 bob to pay for the gas"
[21:37] <cuddykid> 100kWh of power from solar cells :O
[21:37] <Upu> in my head that accent went from Yorkshire to Geordie
[21:37] <SpeedEvil> I was trying to do some measurements of stuff outside based on it.
[21:38] <SpeedEvil> _bar_of_light_
[21:38] <cuddykid> lol upu
[21:38] <daveake_> If he's doing it in 2013 he might need to increase his He budget
[21:38] <SpeedEvil> - it's slightly freezing/foggy
[21:38] <Upu> and lower his expections ? Good luck to him to be honest but I doubt that is going up in the UK
[21:39] <cuddykid> agree Upu
[21:39] <cuddykid> he's thinking of "interplanetary" missions - err what lol
[21:40] <cuddykid> lol - love the top right of the page - "the big twitter feed" then there is nothing below it
[21:40] <SparxEtch> 50 bob of He?
[21:40] <fsphil> lots of twitter stuff on it here
[21:40] <SparxEtch> That's not really a lot. I wish it was.
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[21:41] <SpeedEvil> H1, it's the only way.
[21:41] <fsphil> where do you get H1?
[21:41] <Upu> BoC
[21:41] <SpeedEvil> I have an ioniser - just stick it inside the balloon, should be fine.
[21:42] <fsphil> doesn't it form H2 straight away?
[21:42] <Upu> oh H1
[21:42] <jcoxon> i think it'll be awesome :-)
[21:42] <Upu> largespaceballoon ?
[21:42] <SpeedEvil> If metastable H could be made, it'd be awesome for rocketry.
[21:42] <cuddykid> I wonder if he gets to use something different than ntx2s :/
[21:43] <Upu> If that gets off the ground (both the project and the actual balloon) it will be more than epic,just seems a little too out there
[21:43] <Upu> still no harm in aiming high
[21:43] <cuddykid> yeah - he's rivalling JP aerospace
[21:43] <jcoxon> indeed
[21:43] <Lando-Uni> FOOOOOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAM!
[21:44] <fsphil> it would be visible from here
[21:44] <Upu> just under "sky crane" and "Kate beckinsdale in a full leather suit"
[21:44] <cuddykid> but, in the UK? hmmmmmm
[21:44] <jcoxon> cuddykid, well it would travel far
[21:44] <cuddykid> unless he launched on the outer Hebrides or something
[21:45] <jcoxon> i think launch permission wouldn't be an issue
[21:45] <jcoxon> as in it'll be a one off
[21:45] <SparxEtch> I've always wondered how far a normal He balloon goes.
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[21:46] <cuddykid> hopefully - but the CAA are a mysterious organisation - they're still "deliberating" over my glider which is made out of foam and will mostly be in free fall in controlled airspace
[21:46] <cuddykid> dread to think how long they will "deliberate" over this one
[21:46] <jcoxon> nah thats different
[21:46] <Upu> super pressure thing is interesting that would be something different, high altitude one anyway
[21:47] <SparxEtch> I'm wondering about the CAA thing. Do they consider anything or do they have a criteria?
[21:47] <Upu> so you looking to launch this weekend jcoxon ?
[21:47] <jcoxon> Upu, no
[21:47] <jcoxon> on call
[21:47] <Upu> ah ok just noticed MKIII in progress :)
[21:48] <Upu> measure that Antenova module before you throw it in the sea/Belgium :)
[21:48] <jcoxon> i've re learnt a lesson
[21:48] <jcoxon> wait for weather
[21:48] <jcoxon> so will have the payload ready
[21:48] <cuddykid> SparxEtch: I think they would consider anything - but& it takes them a very long time to if it's slightly out of the ordinary
[21:48] <Upu> will be great to start getting payloads actually landing in the UK again
[21:48] <daveake_> :)
[21:48] <cuddykid> lol
[21:48] <SparxEtch> cuddykid: Brilliant, thanks.
[21:49] <daveake_> Even launching from NI still misses the UK ...
[21:50] <SpeedEvil> Well - the one from Australia nearly hit the UK :)
[21:51] <jcoxon> Upu, my plan is to launch from kent northwards
[21:52] <cuddykid> does anyone have any "geofence" software for arduino?
[21:52] <Upu> I approve of that plan
[21:52] <Upu> north is good
[21:52] <jcoxon> will wait for the weather
[21:52] <Upu> should have the tracking Yagi up by then
[21:52] <Upu> ordered the house brackets today
[21:53] <Upu> going to be March before I get it up there as weather is crap at the moment
[21:57] <Darkside> daveake_: is it ok to wipe your data?
[21:58] <Darkside> we're doing a launch at 5UTC
[21:58] <Darkside> but we're not announcing it until about 10 min before
[21:58] <Darkside> :P
[21:58] <daveake_> Oh, sure. I'll switch it off.
[21:58] <SpeedEvil> Err - one from california, I mean
[21:59] <daveake_> Done
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[22:03] <cuddykid> yay - package is in UK :D
[22:03] <SpeedEvil> :)
[22:03] <cuddykid> probably get held up in customs though
[22:03] <cuddykid> if not - should be delivered tomorrow :)
[22:04] <jcoxon> daveake_, got those gps modules finally
[22:04] <daveake_> :). That was slow.
[22:05] <jcoxon> i couldn't get 4
[22:05] <jcoxon> they only had 3
[22:05] <jcoxon> but waited till i contacted me to tell me
[22:05] Action: daveake_ feels guilty
[22:05] <jcoxon> me -> them
[22:05] <jcoxon> its okay
[22:05] <jcoxon> i suspect they are the last fsa03 ever
[22:06] <daveake_> Probably. I ordered 2 a few days after you ordered your 4, so I half expected them to tell me they'd sold out
[22:06] <daveake_> I wired the first one up today to an Arduino Mini Pro. Working nicely.
[22:07] <jcoxon> i have some breakout boards lying around if you want
[22:07] <daveake_> I just soldered thinnish wires them hot-melted them to the back for a bit of physical protection
[22:08] <daveake_> But if you have 1 or 2 spares that would be nice :D
[22:08] <jcoxon> email me your address
[22:08] <jcoxon> i'll pop them in the post
[22:08] <daveake_> Will do
[22:08] <daveake_> TVM
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[00:00] --- Tue Jan 17 2012