highaltitude.log.20111218

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[08:20] <SamSilver_> if you type <let it snow> into the google search block, you eventually have to us the defrost button
[08:20] <SamSilver_> afk
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[09:15] <jcoxon> morning all
[09:15] <mattltm> Ello :)
[09:16] <jcoxon> hows tricks?
[09:16] <mattltm> Good thanks Mr. J. Hows you?
[09:16] <jcoxon> good
[09:16] <jcoxon> free day ahead of me
[09:16] <mattltm> Very nice :)
[09:17] <Upu> morning
[09:19] <mattltm> Hi Upu
[09:21] <jcoxon> the project for today i'm thinking is making a simple aprs receiver that'll go outside and connect wirelessly with my 'puter
[09:21] <jcoxon> as i can't get any reception indoors
[09:22] <Upu> I've been messing with APRS
[09:22] <Upu> not sure how to transmit yet but I'm on the map
[09:22] <Upu> recieving
[09:22] <jcoxon> oh nice
[09:22] <jcoxon> xastir?
[09:22] <Upu> AGWTracker
[09:22] <jcoxon> cool
[09:22] <Upu> quite alot of stations round here
[09:23] <jcoxon> what i'm thinking is a cheap HT in a box with something like an arduino + xbee
[09:23] <jcoxon> the arduino acts as a tnc and decodes the data
[09:23] <jcoxon> sends it over xbee as serial
[09:23] <jcoxon> and then decode the serial indoors
[09:23] <Upu> fair enough
[09:24] <jcoxon> you need quite good signal to decode the packet i find
[09:24] <Upu> Yup
[09:24] <Upu> I was getting a station 66km away last night
[09:25] <jcoxon> Upu, you antenna is excellent :-)
[09:25] <Upu> the hill is excellent :)
[09:25] <daveake> :)
[09:25] <Upu> I'm sorting out a pair of stacked Yagis on a rotator for next year
[09:25] <daveake> I guess there's a 7th stage of HAB expenditure .... buy a house on a hill
[09:25] <Upu> just saving atm :/
[09:26] <Upu> lol
[09:26] <Upu> entirely unintentional that one :)
[09:26] <daveake> :)
[09:31] <Upu> right shopping time
[09:36] <mattltm> I detect a christmas theme on SSTV this morning... http://www.mattltm.co.uk/sstv-images/
[09:37] <jcoxon> hehe
[09:37] <jcoxon> mattltm, any thoughts on local helium suppliers?
[09:37] <SpeedEvil> The sun is a large local source.
[09:37] <SpeedEvil> Jupiter may be more convenient though.
[09:38] <mattltm> http://www.kentballoons.com/helium-gas.html
[09:38] <mattltm> MAybe?
[09:38] <mattltm> £45 for a T size
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[09:39] <mattltm> monthly rental of £6 for the cilinder
[09:39] <jcoxon> not too bad really
[09:39] <SpeedEvil> Those look quite reasonable indeed.
[09:39] <mattltm> and £14 pick up charge
[09:39] <SpeedEvil> 0 if you pick it up from the warehouse
[09:39] <jcoxon> or free if you go to their warehouse
[09:39] <jcoxon> does the hackspace need He?
[09:39] <mattltm> They are jusr down the road from me
[09:40] <mattltm> about a 20min drive
[09:40] <daveake> Good price. Extra £14 for collection elsewhere
[09:41] <daveake> I see you already said that :p
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[09:43] <mattltm> jcoxon: http://www.bertos.org/use/examples-projects/arduino-aprs/
[09:44] <jcoxon> mattltm, already have that working
[09:44] <jcoxon> :)
[09:44] <mattltm> Cool :)
[09:44] <jcoxon> but as i said you need good signal
[09:44] <jcoxon> not this faraday cage of a flat...
[09:44] <mattltm> I was going to have a play with that and a chinese handy :)
[09:45] <jcoxon> thats exactly what my project idea was
[09:45] <jcoxon> :-)
[09:45] <mattltm> Did you see the APRS beacon i made with a radiometrix hx1?
[09:45] <jcoxon> yes
[09:46] <mattltm> needs more POWER!
[09:46] <jcoxon> or altitude
[09:46] Nick change: soafee-chan -> spacekitteh
[09:47] <jcoxon> i might get a cylinder after christmas
[09:47] <jcoxon> weather isn't going to be good next week
[09:47] <jcoxon> so no chance of a launch
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[09:58] <jcoxon> hey Hiena
[10:13] <Hiena> Hello!
[10:13] <Hiena> How things goes up?
[10:15] <Hiena> Seems, my family not happy with xmass tree made from the Mi-24 pitot tube. So i have to buy a real one...
[10:16] <jcoxon> hehe
[10:16] <Darkside> mattltm: you don't need more power
[10:16] <Darkside> 300mW is fine
[10:16] <jcoxon> Hiena, there is a guy called Raul__ on here how has been trying to contact you
[10:17] <jcoxon> he is from .hu
[10:17] <jcoxon> wants to do ballooning
[10:18] <Hiena> Ah, nice. Double chance to make a dent on some airliner.
[10:18] <jcoxon> is there a way he can contact you if you aren't on here?
[10:18] <Hiena> Is there some notify/message bot in this channel?
[10:18] <jcoxon> yup
[10:19] <Hiena> Thanks.
[10:19] <jcoxon> whether it works is a different matter :-p
[10:21] <Hiena> Message sent.
[10:22] <jcoxon> cool
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[11:11] <cuddykid> I guess the CAA will be 'deliberating' for a long while yet :(
[11:21] <jcoxon> thats what they do best
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[11:32] <cuddykid> indeed jcoxon!
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[12:35] <AndChat-> Lalala
[12:37] <SpeedEvil> Dipsy
[12:43] <Laurenceb__> Tinky-Winky
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[12:53] <Laurenceb__> oh dear
[12:53] <Laurenceb__> openpilot are working on unscented kalman for cortex M4
[12:54] <Laurenceb__> mental
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[13:55] <Raul_> hi hiena
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[13:55] <Hiena> Hiya! Got my message?
[13:56] <Raul_> No, do you have skype?
[13:57] <Hiena> Nope. At the moment, i'm in the middle some chainsaw action. No time to skype.
[13:57] <Raul_> I plan on launching from Hungary, wondering if we can have a little talk
[13:58] Action: SpeedEvil imagines Hiena up a tree, sitting on a branch, chainsaw in one hand, phone in other.
[14:00] Action: daveake wonders what could possibly go wrong?
[14:01] <daveake> Must say, that's impressive forethought - practising chainsaw skills prior to a launch :p
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[14:02] <x-f> good afternoon
[14:07] <x-f> daveake, will there be part 3 to 5 of Cloud 1 movie? i liked part 1 and 2
[14:08] <daveake> This weekend I think. Andrew's internet connection is a bit slow
[14:08] <x-f> cool
[14:09] <daveake> Remember that was my first launch so a few things left something to be desired :p
[14:11] <x-f> as i'm a HAB virgin, it's great as video lessons :)
[14:11] Nick change: AndChat- -> NigeyMoby
[14:11] <daveake> As how not to do it :)
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[14:14] <x-f> it's not that bad :)
[14:17] <daveake> well I had a long list of things to change for the next time, mainly in the payload (making it easier to put together before launch). Now after 4 it's much easier. Also that time I had a cast of thousands :p and I was trying to keep everyone informed and/or busy
[14:20] <Raul_> Anyone launched a HAB from the UK before?
[14:20] <RocketBoy> errr
[14:20] <jcoxon> Raul_, you''re in the right place
[14:20] <daveake> I think so ..... :p
[14:20] <jcoxon> i think we are at 88 launches currently
[14:21] <Raul_> How long dose it take to get a flight clearance?
[14:21] <Raul_> there...
[14:21] <daveake> 28 days, maybe more in the summer
[14:21] <jcoxon> Raul_, did you get Hiena's message?
[14:22] <Raul_> yes, we talked a little...90 F^^^^G days + a 1.5kg transponder
[14:22] <jcoxon> eek
[14:22] <Raul_> Is there any way I might be able to launch soon after new year's eve from the UK? ( I live in Romania )
[14:23] <Hiena> Welcome in the Hungarian Airspace, aftre the message please beep, or you will be soot down...
[14:24] <SpeedEvil> Launching from a site with an existing approval is easy
[14:24] <Raul_> I am willing to come all the way to the UK just to launch ASAP
[14:24] <SpeedEvil> I don't think any of the UK sites are going to run out soon, you'd just need to convince someone here to come along - or can authorisation be delegated?
[14:26] <RocketBoy> SpeedEvil: don't think so - the permits are named individuals
[14:26] <Raul_> Meybe someone is willing to assist me who has a permit
[14:26] <RocketBoy> nominated the "balloon operator"
[14:26] <Raul_> I'm sending a LEGO space shuttle into space! :)
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[14:35] <Raul_> can some of the UK based people give me their skype for further details?
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[14:38] <Raul_> So, given that I am in the presence of a licensed high alt balloonist I am allowed to launch?
[14:39] <SpeedEvil> If the person who has the permission is in control of the launch - yes.
[14:40] <jcoxon> Raul_, it doesn't really work like that
[14:40] <SpeedEvil> As I understand it
[14:40] <SpeedEvil> Listen to jcoxon though
[14:40] <Raul_> Can you describe how this could be done in some detail? Thank you
[14:41] <jcoxon> so there are 2 sites in the UK we some people have permission to launch from
[14:41] <jcoxon> often people borrow the site and hte people with the permission should be there
[14:41] <jcoxon> it means that you can't jump a launch on them
[14:42] <jcoxon> might be worth emailing the ukhas mailing list
[14:42] <Raul_> Ok
[14:42] <jcoxon> its a long way to come for a launch though
[14:42] <jcoxon> there are closer places with potential for launching surely
[14:43] <jcoxon> there are launches in Germany for example
[14:44] <Raul_> yes, but I would like to get it done in the beginning of Jannuary if I manage to do so I will get further funding for other of my projects (gas turbines, rockets etc)
[14:44] <navrac> Hi Jcoxon - coincidence - just emailed youhalf an hour ago
[14:44] <jcoxon> navrac, i've replied then
[14:44] <jcoxon> :-)
[14:44] <navrac> oh right - I'll check my inbox
[14:44] <Raul_> and in Germany there is the same system of launch sites and people with permits?
[14:45] <jcoxon> have a chat with lunar_lander about that
[14:45] <jcoxon> he is on here quite often
[14:45] <jcoxon> he is based in germany
[14:45] <Raul_> how can I email the mailing list you mentioned?
[14:46] <jcoxon> http://groups.google.com/group/ukhas
[14:46] <Raul_> Thanks, I really appreciate your time guys!
[14:47] <jcoxon> np
[14:47] <navrac> http://www.mouser.com/antenovaradionova/
[14:48] <navrac> thats the supplier james - $29 a pop
[14:48] <jcoxon> http://uk.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Antenova/M10382-A1/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMsjLMBIknjmkq1yAhCbuwXT8DiRQFKefBo%3d
[14:50] <navrac> yep thats the one - pretty neat
[14:50] <jcoxon> 21GBP
[14:50] <jcoxon> nice
[14:50] <jcoxon> shame about hte 12 delivery charge
[14:50] <jcoxon> navrac, have you already got one?
[14:51] <navrac> havent tried it yet though - sadly this afternoon is my only free time till january - no time to play!
[14:51] <jcoxon> eek
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[14:52] <navrac> I know - i was tempted to try soldering straight on the pads on the back just to see if it works, but decided to wait until i've got time to get a decent pcb laid out
[14:53] <jcoxon> navrac, did you get yours from mouser?
[14:53] <navrac> from mouser in the states - had someone coming over who picked one up for me
[14:54] <jcoxon> i see
[14:54] <jcoxon> annoying there isn't a uk supplier considering its made in UK
[14:54] <jcoxon> well thats where the company is based
[14:55] <navrac> mouser are pretty quick though - but as you say the delivery is a killer.
[14:57] <navrac> take your point on the lithium thionyl - I end up only getting 50-60% of the rated Ah when run at higher currents at low temperatures - I'm not sure how much the enegisers etc loose but from a weight point of view its a saving
[14:57] <navrac> and for the first couple of flights i dont think they are going to last long before i hit the burst altitude
[14:58] <SpeedEvil> Did you test it at -40, or in the freezer at -20?
[14:58] <navrac> -20
[14:58] <jcoxon> i'd be more concerned about the current they can supply
[14:58] <SpeedEvil> And you did have a large enough capacitor?
[14:58] <SpeedEvil> Also - if you turn your freezer onto 'boost' - and leave it for a couple of days, it may get a fair bit colder.
[14:59] <navrac> I reckon the insulation should get me through the -40 region. I had to get one particular supplier whose battery can give a decent ma output
[14:59] <jcoxon> navrac, fair enough
[14:59] <SpeedEvil> Well - insulation is only useful if you have a sizeable amount of power.
[14:59] <SpeedEvil> if you're dissipating milliwatts, it doesn't help - unless you cheat.
[15:00] <jcoxon> i've been playing with AAA energizer lithiums + stepup regulators
[15:00] <navrac> i only want to last 5 hours on the first flight
[15:00] <navrac> ah thats a good idea - 1.5V to 3.3V
[15:01] <navrac> having said that - last time i tried doing my own stepup designs to get to 50-60mA ended up quite big
[15:02] <navrac> i did a design a few years back to drive white leds off 1.5v batteries - i wonder if i still have the designs
[15:02] <jcoxon> i'm using this: http://www.sparkfun.com/products/9216
[15:02] <jcoxon> but that only really works with 2xAAAs
[15:02] <navrac> - got to go, thats my free time for the day gone - will try to get back later - and thanks for your advice
[15:02] <jcoxon> couldn't source the current for a single AAA
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[15:04] <navrac> how much does an aaa weigh?
[15:04] <daveake> Shame ... it says it works from 1V upwards (which for a Lithium Energizer is pretty much flat)
[15:04] <daveake> 8g
[15:04] <jcoxon> daveake, the problem was startup of gps
[15:04] <jcoxon> that draws loads
[15:04] <daveake> Yep
[15:05] <jcoxon> but it works with 2xAAA
[15:05] <daveake> The Lassen is pretty good in that regard but the UBlox5 takes loads
[15:05] <jcoxon> the lipower module however should be able to do it
[15:05] <jcoxon> so we'll see
[15:05] <navrac> 16g isnt too bad - my current one is 10g and doesnt give me much life - i think i can spare 6g
[15:06] <daveake> navrac is this for a pico flight?
[15:06] <navrac> I think the ubloc 6 is lower power
[15:06] <jcoxon> navrac, it is
[15:06] <jcoxon> but not initially
[15:06] <jcoxon> :-p
[15:06] <navrac> lol
[15:07] <jcoxon> i'll report back once i know about hte lipower
[15:07] <jcoxon> my current payload is 34g
[15:07] <jcoxon> lasts for 14hrs
[15:07] <navrac> im just aiming for straight up on a 1600g and see when it bursts, repeat and get a dp value
[15:07] <navrac> 34g - pretty good there
[15:08] <navrac> i'm at 68g including a tiny parachute and not much insulation
[15:09] <navrac> excluding two tie wraps to hold the balloon to the payload
[15:09] <jcoxon> navrac, i've been working on this for a while :-)
[15:09] <jcoxon> navrac, i don't see why you need such a light weight payload
[15:09] <jcoxon> for your aim
[15:09] <SpeedEvil> Differential pressure measurement should be very valuable
[15:10] <daveake> Indeed. I got caught up trying to save every last gram for Buzz1, but there's really no need as the balloon weighed nearly 20 times more than the payload!
[15:10] <navrac> I'm designing it light for when i need the weight saving for when im dumping ballast
[15:12] <jcoxon> :-)
[15:12] <navrac> -i have to go - will try to be back later - and thanks for your advice everyone - ive seen all your flight info and i was very impressed which is what encouraged me to take this up as a hobby
[15:12] <jcoxon> thanks
[15:12] <jcoxon> cy
[15:12] <jcoxon> a
[15:12] <daveake> bye
[15:24] <SpeedEvil> http://9gag.com/fast#1111387
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[15:32] <daveake> Try Lunar_Lander
[15:39] <Raul_> thx
[15:41] <Raul_> I consulted an airplane ticket website and a back and forth ticked Romania-London is 126 eur ( lower price than a car trip to Hungary for example )
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[15:47] <daveake> one problem would be that you'd probably need to book that early to get a good price, but you won't know if the weather is OK for a launch till say 3 days before the launch
[15:47] <daveake> Especially if you want to get the payload back. The 2 UK launch sites with permanent permission are both near the east coast, and the prevailing winds generally take flights east towards the sea.
[15:48] <daveake> If you can launch from mainland Europe you've got a far larger land mass to aim for!
[15:50] <Raul_> Oh, I did not know they are near the east coast, I will check with Germany then hoping they have simmilar regulations
[15:51] <russss> yeah, there are lots of weather-related reasons why you'd need to defer launch
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[15:51] <daveake> http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Cambridge&hl=en&ll=52.207607,0.12085&spn=3.036338,7.064209&sll=52.205337,0.121817&sspn=0.09489,0.220757&vpsrc=6&hnear=Cambridge,+United+Kingdom&t=m&z=7
[15:52] <Raul_> dave, do you use Skype?
[15:52] <daveake> Not really ... have an account but don't have it installed
[15:52] <Raul_> ah ok, thanks for the info
[15:53] <Raul_> where is the other launch site located?
[15:54] <daveake> Not many miles west of Cambridge
[15:54] <russss> they are both within ~15miles of each other
[15:55] <daveake> So far I've launched from near my home. Downside is having to apply and wait for permission. Upside is more land to aim at :-) (though I still managed to miss once :p )
[15:55] <Raul_> How long it it take you to obtain it?
[15:56] <daveake> Officially it's 28 days minimum
[15:56] <Raul_> haha landing prediction puts my balloon in N-W France
[15:56] <daveake> In the summer it can take longer
[15:56] <Raul_> so it took you more than 28?
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[15:57] <daveake> No, but I did have to plead a little once :p
[15:58] <Raul_> I wonder if that would work for me, being we're in the christmas spirit and I would come all the way from Romania for this
[15:59] <Raul_> In Romania it's 45days minimum but during this time of year the only acceptable launch location (S-E) will put the balloon in the Black Sea
[15:59] <daveake> Possibly, though Xmas holidays might extend it. But I think your big problem is not knowing till 1-3 days before if the weather is likely OK for launch. Sometimes they get cancelled on the morning.
[16:00] <daveake> I nearly scrubbed my last launch on the morning because of strong gusts
[16:01] <Raul_> I will stay there for a week or so hopefully a good day will arrive
[16:01] <daveake> Only continued because there were quiet periods, and because I'd booked the channel tunnel crossing for the recovery :)
[16:01] <Raul_> How about helim prices? here a 9.1 m^3 bottle of He gas is 26 Eur/ m^3
[16:02] <daveake> If you have a few days to choose, that does help
[16:02] <Raul_> Smaller 1.5 cu M bottle is 42.5 eur/ cu M
[16:02] <Raul_> In what area do you live Dave?
[16:03] <daveake> Here the 9.1 (L size) is around 120 Euro, so your price is expensive
[16:03] <Raul_> 120 for the whole bottle?
[16:03] <Raul_> Damn, it's X2 here!
[16:04] <Raul_> lucky I didn't buy it yet
[16:04] <daveake> About 80km west of London
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[16:04] <daveake> Beware that the 9.1 is big and HEAVY. 2-man job to shift
[16:04] <Raul_> This is will be a really international project, sponsored by an australian, built by a romanian and launched with a englishman
[16:06] <Raul_> is the balloon prediction website really accurate?
[16:07] <daveake> It's pretty good, yes, if the figures you give it are accurate
[16:07] <Raul_> Dave can I link you to my blog? meybe you can get a better feel for my activities
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[16:09] <daveake> sure
[16:09] <Raul_> How much would it cost to stay at a cheap motel for a week?
[16:10] <Raul_> http://microblade.blogspot.com/ here you go :)
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[16:15] <Raul_> How much would sleeping at a cheap hotel/motel in the UK for a week be?
[16:22] <Raul_> dave how much is a back and forth ticket on the eurotunnel?
[16:23] <RocketBoy> The problem I foresee with your idea of coming to the uk to launch is that there is no real garentee of the jeststream being calm within a 1 week period - especially this time of year.
[16:23] <RocketBoy> thats if you want it to land in the UK again
[16:24] <Raul_> I just did some predictions, some landed in France, that's why I am asking for the EuroTunnel ticket cost
[16:24] <RocketBoy> BTW the gut in the blue coat in the video on our site is me launching the robot from the EARS site
[16:25] <RocketBoy> I think its like 70GBP
[16:25] <RocketBoy> are - you thinking of driving here from romainia?
[16:25] <Raul_> it's a honor to meet you sir! :)
[16:26] <Raul_> no, flying is quite cheap
[16:26] <Raul_> I found flights for less than 180 euros with return journey included
[16:27] <RocketBoy> so how were you thinking of recovering the payload?
[16:28] <Raul_> My cousin is a regular flyer to Coventry University, he books flights months ahead for 50 Eur
[16:28] <RocketBoy> hire a car?
[16:28] <Raul_> Well...since I am 18 I don't have a driver's license yet. I was thinking of paying a fellow HAB to help me with that
[16:30] <Raul_> The second option is a bit impractical, a long chain of buses + a long walk
[16:30] Action: SpeedEvil lols at the thought of recovery by public transport.
[16:30] <SpeedEvil> That would be challenging!
[16:31] <Raul_> Imagine getting on the wrong bus! haha
[16:31] <SpeedEvil> More the problem that in rural areas, busses will not let you off between stops.
[16:31] <daveake> Raul_ Eurotunnel runs from £44 upwards for a day return (with which you can go one day return the next). For longer periods it can get quite expensive.
[16:32] <Raul_> thanks Dave
[16:32] <daveake> "Mr Bus Driver sir, can I put this aerial up on your roof?"
[16:32] <Raul_> I only have 2 GPS trackets, a SPOT and a TK102 as a backup
[16:33] <Raul_> no anntenas needed, altough I would love to have telemetry on it
[16:33] <daveake> "only"?
[16:34] <Raul_> yes, is that one to many?
[16:34] <daveake> It's never too many :D
[16:35] <Raul_> Hopefully I will find a high alt balloonist kind (and crazy enough) to help me with the launch and recovery
[16:35] <RocketBoy> why not mail someone your payload - they wait until the winds blowing to romainia - launch it - and you go get it?
[16:36] <daveake> That sounds like a better plan :)
[16:36] <Raul_> haha, if only it would get here! I am considering that possibility but I would like to gain the experience of launching & recoverying by participating
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[16:41] <RocketBoy> Raul_: nice lathe by the way I have an ML7
[16:42] <RocketBoy> british circa 1950
[16:42] <Raul_> nice, I hardly got to use mine...still waiting for accesories which are 50% of it's value
[16:43] <Raul_> it's a romanian made SN320 from the 70's or 80's
[16:43] <Raul_> what do you machine with it?
[16:43] <Raul_> turn I should say
[16:43] <RocketBoy> yeah - its all the chucks, facepaltes etc that really eat up the money
[16:44] <RocketBoy> all sorts of stuff - rocket bits
[16:44] <RocketBoy> couplers nosecones etc
[16:44] <Raul_> hmm rocketry will do soon ;)
[16:45] <RocketBoy> not as much fun as HABing IMO
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[16:46] <Raul_> This is why I want to get his balloon project done asap, if succesfull I will get a large amount of money for rocket and rocket engine development.
[16:46] <NigeyS> that ures steve? http://www.lathes.co.uk/myford-ml7/
[16:47] <RocketBoy> yeah - although its not as good as the one in the picture
[16:47] <RocketBoy> thats more like a classic car
[16:47] <RocketBoy> restored to its former glory
[16:47] <NigeyS> heh yup, looks like its had a dam good restoration
[16:47] <Raul_> so you sir rocketboy have a permit to launch anytime from thouse specific HAB launch sites?
[16:48] <RocketBoy> mines just a workhorse - covered in swarf ATM
[16:48] <NigeyS> heh, havent used a lathe since my schooldays
[16:48] <RocketBoy> I have a permit to launch at weekends from a site east of cambridge
[16:49] <daveake> west
[16:49] <daveake> I thought :)
[16:49] <RocketBoy> NigeyS: well I was similar to use - but then I got that one a few years ago
[16:49] <RocketBoy> I seem to have kept all my fingers so far
[16:50] <NigeyS> hah yeah, they can munch through fingers quite easily, scarey things
[16:50] <RocketBoy> doh - yeah west
[16:50] <RocketBoy> chuck keys flying about
[16:50] <daveake> Thought I was going nuts for a moment :p
[16:50] <RocketBoy> now thats dangerious
[16:51] <NigeyS> :o
[16:51] <Raul_> would you atleast in principle agree to assist me during a weekend when the winds are favorable? Can I pay or offer something else?
[16:51] <daveake> I once removed a nail and part of a finger in an orbital sander
[16:51] <daveake> So best I keep clear of lathes :)
[16:52] <RocketBoy> I drilled into my thumb once - through the nail
[16:52] <NigeyS> lol dave, i had a few near misses with a belt sander in school!
[16:52] <daveake> s/orbital/belt
[16:52] <RocketBoy> - when a drill bit broke
[16:52] <daveake> Oops
[16:52] <RocketBoy> one of the most painfull experiances I have had
[16:52] <daveake> Daft thing was, I just bought the sander without remembering I already had one! The existing one was a much safer design.
[16:53] <NigeyS> lol woops!
[16:53] <Raul_> I myself, broke the parting tool on the last cut ruining the whole part as it came flying accros the room
[16:53] Action: RocketBoy worries less about his occasionally failing memory
[16:53] <daveake> I sold the "new" one at a car boot sale, complete with a line of ex-finger on the belt ...
[16:54] <RocketBoy> walways wear goggles
[16:54] <RocketBoy> when playing with lathes IMO
[16:54] <NigeyS> goggles, crash helmet, hockey mask ...
[16:56] <daveake> At school we did some brazing. Just after a friend was about to pick up a brick that was still very hot. I stopped him, then proceeded to pick it up myself ....
[16:56] <daveake> That hurt. He just laughed!
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[17:03] <staylo> daveake: It's when people no longer laugh that you have to worry, because at that point they've decided you just can't help being that dumb :)
[17:04] <NigeyS> :o a human on 2m
[17:08] <daveake> staylo True :)
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[17:24] <fsphil> unpossible NigeyS
[17:25] <NigeyS> it was definately a human !
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[17:38] <Raul_> Dave are you still here?
[17:42] <Raul_> Any germans here?
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[17:44] <joph> Raul_, of course
[17:45] <Raul_> Hey joph
[17:45] <Raul_> I was wondering what are the ATC laws concearning HAB launches from Germany
[17:46] <joph> why?
[17:48] <Raul_> I live in Romania and getting a permission here for a launch will take months, since I will have everything in place next weekend I would come all the way to Germany if it means I can do it faster.
[17:55] <joph> i have no experience with launching a balloon in germay
[17:55] <joph> *germany
[17:55] <joph> may you ask Lunar_Lander, he's also out of germany and he already launched a balloon
[17:56] <Raul_> wish he was here
[17:57] <x-f> he's a regular visitor, don't worry
[17:58] <Raul_> thank you all for being so supportive!
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[18:15] <fsphil> lunar launched a balloon?
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[18:38] <raul_> Hi, searching for a german who knows his country legislation when it comes to HAB flights
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[19:37] Nick change: Laurenceb__ -> Laurenceb_
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[19:53] <natrium42> raul_: did you have a chat with Hiena
[19:53] <natrium42> ?
[19:55] <raul_> Yes
[19:55] <raul_> natrium from where are you?
[19:55] <natrium42> so there's a long wait to get permission in .hu too?
[19:55] <natrium42> canada
[19:55] <raul_> 90 days! :(
[19:56] <raul_> I am now considering either Germany or the UK
[19:56] <natrium42> what about NL?
[19:57] <raul_> What are the laws there?
[19:57] <natrium42> timzaman has been launching there
[19:57] <natrium42> http://www.timzaman.nl/
[19:57] <natrium42> eek
[19:58] <natrium42> pfft
[19:58] <raul_> ah, anyone else from Holland or Germany?
[19:58] <natrium42> he's a pretty cool guy
[19:59] <natrium42> you should watch the TEDx talk he has given, was pretty funny
[19:59] <raul_> If I can lanch within 3 weeks I will be super-happy
[19:59] <natrium42> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kShT_Z3GJSU
[19:59] <raul_> I might have seen his tedx
[19:59] <raul_> Yes, seen it
[19:59] <natrium42> :)
[19:59] <natrium42> if you launched with somebody that already had a permission
[20:00] <natrium42> you could do it sooner
[20:00] <raul_> from what I see, I think the laws are very permissive
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[20:13] <fsphil> mmmm
[20:13] Action: Laurenceb_ has watsed about 5 hours cooking
[20:13] Action: daveake informs fsphil that both casserole and soup contain onion
[20:13] <fsphil> mmmm for the ice cream
[20:14] <daveake> :)
[20:14] <Laurenceb_> on the + side i have enough food for 8 days now
[20:14] Action: nosebleedKT informs daveake that his soups contain some ice cream
[20:14] <daveake> different
[20:14] <nosebleedKT> natrium42!
[20:15] <nosebleedKT> CaliPornia !
[20:16] <nosebleedKT> natrium42: what means 42? the people you have killed inside the russian mafia? :p
[20:18] Action: nosebleedKT just retched the icecream
[20:36] <raul_> I emaild Tim Zaman
[20:36] Action: nosebleedKT goes to sleep
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[21:17] <fsphil> brian cox trying to explain quantum theory to famous people on bbc 2
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[21:43] <Laurenceb_> quantum superposition of success and being a total loser and moron
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[22:01] <daveake> And he still didn't get to leave with that diamond
[22:02] <fsphil> lol
[22:02] <fsphil> who knows, it may suddenly appear on my desk
[22:02] <daveake> Damn Planck
[22:03] <fsphil> I may have to wait a while though
[22:03] <daveake> Need to invent a local Planck's constant adjustment field generator
[22:04] <fsphil> an improbability drive!
[22:04] <daveake> Set the dial to one then walk off with the diamond
[22:04] <daveake> That's gonna take one big cup of tea
[22:07] <daveake> Wonder if James May is thinking about the amount of hydrogen in that balloon ... :)
[22:12] <fsphil> H2 bubbles... I sense a project for next weekend :)
[22:12] <russss> they're fun
[22:21] <raul_> Anyone from NL here? :-)
[22:21] <raul_> turns out you can launch anytime as long as it's under 4 kg and 8km away from an airport!
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[22:25] <fsphil> what's the rush raul_ ? :)
[22:26] <raul_> I'm just really excited to do this project:) somuch so I find it hard to sleep at night
[22:26] <fsphil> lol
[22:26] <fsphil> I get that the night before launch
[22:26] <fsphil> trying to think if I've remembered everything
[22:26] <fsphil> which I usually haven't
[22:27] <raul_> where are you from Phil?
[22:28] <fsphil> uk, no help :p
[22:28] <fsphil> my last notam took about 3 months
[22:29] <daveake> That was for the permission to land in Yorkshire :)
[22:30] <daveake> or enter their airspace ;)
[22:32] <daveake> btw I've ordered another 1600g NeverBurst, so I'll have a choice of that or a 1000g next flight
[22:35] <raul_> Holland is the best, legal prostitution, legal drugs and legal HAB flights!
[22:36] <navrac> why do manufacturers datasheets always miss out a small but vital bit of information
[22:37] <Randomskk> to tease you
[22:37] <navrac> I think they are in league with pcb manufacturers so you have to do an extra run to get the pins correct
[22:37] <Randomskk> hehe
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[23:22] <raul_> I'm searching for ballonist in Holland (NL)
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[00:00] --- Mon Dec 19 2011