highaltitude.log.20110708

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[02:21] <javi_> hi
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[02:24] <javi_> ?
[02:28] <hibby> hey
[02:29] <hibby> sorry, it's gmt night time, and most members, what with this being UKHAS, are asleep
[02:33] <gb73d> im not
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[02:39] <javi_> you're right
[02:39] <hibby> haha
[02:40] <hibby> javi_: what's up?
[02:40] <hibby> gb73d: what's got you up?
[02:40] <javi_> i'm on gmt+2 :)
[02:40] <hibby> aha
[02:40] <javi_> i expected people from US too
[02:40] <hibby> I'm on gmt+5, so all's good here
[02:40] <javi_> but anyway
[02:40] <hibby> we've got some from the us
[02:41] <hibby> but this is, more or less, home of the UK High Altitude Society
[02:41] <javi_> i have a question...
[02:41] <hibby> feel free to ask it
[02:42] <javi_> i'm planning a launch later this month
[02:42] <javi_> and there's something i can't figure out
[02:42] <hibby> what country you launching in?
[02:42] Action: stilldavid guesses Spain
[02:42] <javi_> i need to figure out what the ascent rate will be based on the free lift
[02:43] <javi_> yep, spain
[02:43] <hibby> javi_: surely that's just balancing of forces
[02:43] <javi_> i know how to calculate the free lift from the helium volume and vice versa
[02:43] <hibby> (says the guy with a degree in engineering)
[02:43] <javi_> sure it is :)
[02:43] <hibby> I've not been involved in the balloon section, so I can't be of much use
[02:44] <hibby> but it'll be related to the pressure difference, volume of gas, and weight of the payload
[02:44] <hibby> Dan-K2VOL: may be able to shed some light
[02:44] <javi_> but the equations seem overly complex, and i wondered if there is any rule of thumb, such as "x grams of free lift will make it go y m/s faster"
[02:44] <hibby> doubt it
[02:45] <hibby> the lift changes as air pressure changes, really.
[02:45] <hibby> and there's, from what I remember, a nonlinear change in the pressure
[02:45] <stilldavid> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:balloon_data
[02:46] <stilldavid> check out the ascent calculator?
[02:46] <javi_> in fact, i read somplace something like "1 pound of free lift will give 300 feet/min"
[02:47] <kristianpaul> http://wiki.ukhas.org.uk/guides:balloon_data?
[02:47] <javi_> i'm looking at the spreadsheet right now
[02:49] <javi_> wow
[02:49] <javi_> thanks
[02:49] <javi_> looks exactly what i'm looking for
[02:49] <javi_> it's for totex balloons
[02:49] <javi_> and mine is one of those 30 year old military surplus
[02:51] <javi_> but i just need a rough estimate, and i think it will work
[02:51] <javi_> i don't want the balloon to end up in morocco, that's why i'd like to know the vertical rates in advance
[02:54] <kristianpaul> damn, i need to managed the balloon some how, i just cant consider to the mountatis (1t 2500Km hihg) and rescue the thing...
[02:54] <kristianpaul> s/managed/drive
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[05:07] <Darkside> ok WTF
[05:07] <Darkside> TV Licenses?
[05:07] <Darkside> really?
[05:09] <Darkside> am i going to get pinged for bringing in a usb DVB tuner?
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[07:07] <fsphil> Darkside, they'll eventually come after you even if you don't bring one
[07:08] <jcoxon> urgh horrible weather
[07:10] <fsphil> yea I think our bad weather from yesterday was heading that direction
[07:11] <jcoxon> not the greatest weather to be testing solar panels in :-p
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[07:12] <fsphil> hehe, ironically: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-14073447
[07:13] <fsphil> actually it's a perfect day to test, since this is fairly typical weather :)
[07:18] <jcoxon> i think i'm slightly mad trying to get this payload to work of off a 85mAh battery
[07:19] <fsphil> possibly, though the size is amazing
[07:19] <fsphil> 850mah battery is still very light
[07:20] <eroomde> Darkside: you won;t be bothered i don't think
[07:20] <eroomde> you're only there for a couple of months anyway
[07:21] <eroomde> and you have an amateur radio license so when they ask what the yagiu is for...
[07:22] <eroomde> jcoxon: quote of the day at the schools outreach thing yesterday, by a teacher:
[07:22] <fsphil> sneaky
[07:23] <eroomde> "NO!, Bradley! The antenna is *not* a lightsabre"
[07:23] <jcoxon> awesome
[07:24] <fsphil> "That's Darth Bradley to you sir"
[07:26] <eroomde> if you put me in detention now, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine
[07:37] <jcoxon> eroomde, so was outreach fun?
[07:39] <eroomde> yeah great
[07:39] <eroomde> some really sharp kids
[07:40] <eroomde> you might have caught this yesterday but one of the things we got them to do was program the chdk script
[07:40] <eroomde> that taught them about infinite loops with goto, and for loops with counters and so on
[07:41] <eroomde> when we tried to work out how long it would take for the 4gig card to fill up by seeing how big the pictures were, one of the 12 year olds started asking why jpegs were different file sizes even though they were the same physical size in pixels
[07:41] <eroomde> i took a deep breath and tried to explain information content and compressibility as simply as possible, not expecting them to get it
[07:41] <eroomde> but she got it completely
[07:41] <jcoxon> :-D
[07:42] <eroomde> and then started saying 'so if i take a picture of this blank sheet of paper it will take less space than if i drew dots and lines and things on it?'
[07:42] <eroomde> yes!!! jump for joy
[07:42] <eroomde> and then another one 'so is that why you get the strange bits on sharp edges in jpeg images?' (referring to jpeg artifacts). yes!!!
[07:43] <jcoxon> haha
[07:43] <eroomde> and then the third one said 'so if you have lots of different shades of red and green, could you just say 'that's 'red' ' and 'that's 'green' ' so save more space?'
[07:43] <eroomde> so they intuitively grasped quantisation
[07:43] <eroomde> really, i was pretty blown away
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[07:44] <jcoxon> its a good age for that
[07:47] <jcoxon> right work time
[07:47] <jcoxon> cya all
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[07:56] <fsphil> I wish our teachers knew that sort of stuff
[07:56] <fsphil> though to be fair, jpeg was fairly new then
[07:56] <fsphil> but even the idea of data compression was never discussed
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[08:33] <griffonbot> @LVL1WhiteStar: @hibbie Welcome to White Star country Hibby! #UKHAS [http://twitter.com/LVL1WhiteStar/status/89250643079999488]
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[09:24] <cuddykid> morning all
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[09:26] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[09:26] <cuddykid> g'day Lunar_Lander
[09:28] <Lunar_Lander> how's life?
[09:29] <cuddykid> good thanks, apart from damn eagle cad! How about you?
[09:30] <Lunar_Lander> quite OK
[09:30] <Lunar_Lander> I hope the lady selling the FT-790R writes back soon and then I hope that the thing is still on sale
[09:30] <Lunar_Lander> also, I hope that m1x10/mixio appears here soon
[09:32] <cuddykid> haha, from what I hear the FT-790s are great radios. I have an ft-817 myself - it's superb
[09:32] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[09:57] <Lunar_Lander> so cuddykid
[09:57] <Lunar_Lander> did you find what went wrong with your camera?
[09:59] <cuddykid> yeah
[09:59] <cuddykid> basically a last min change to the chdk script
[09:59] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[09:59] <cuddykid> meant that I was 1 millisecond out it working
[09:59] <cuddykid> I put sleep 1000000
[09:59] <Lunar_Lander> yeah :(
[09:59] <cuddykid> when max int allowed was 999999!
[09:59] <Lunar_Lander> ohhh
[10:00] <cuddykid> full run down - http://habexperiments.wordpress.com/
[10:01] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
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[10:08] <fsphil> still hitting a wall with eagle then?
[10:08] <fsphil> I'm going to be starting on that tonight hopefully
[10:11] <Lunar_Lander> hi fsphil
[10:15] <Lunar_Lander> cuddykid crap
[10:15] <Lunar_Lander> the thing is sold
[10:16] <cuddykid> fsphil: yep :(
[10:16] <cuddykid> oh no Lunar_Lander :(
[10:16] <cuddykid> was it ebay?
[10:16] <Lunar_Lander> no, on the DARC site
[10:16] <Lunar_Lander> the german ham radio union
[10:17] <cuddykid> oh right
[10:22] <Lunar_Lander> OK
[10:23] <Lunar_Lander> now I found a dealer
[10:23] <Lunar_Lander> 150 euro
[10:23] <Lunar_Lander> he'll call back in a few minutes
[10:23] <fsphil> that's not bad
[10:23] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[10:23] <Lunar_Lander> they write: "Only shop sale, no shipping"
[10:23] <Lunar_Lander> I asked him if they could ship it anyway
[10:23] <Lunar_Lander> as the shop is 150 km from here
[10:23] <fsphil> I can predict the answer :)
[10:24] <Lunar_Lander> yes?
[10:24] <fsphil> "no shipping"
[10:24] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[10:25] <fsphil> they used to pop up on ebay all the time in the UK, not so much anymore
[10:25] <fsphil> I think the ukhas bunch bought them all :)
[10:25] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[10:25] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[10:31] <Lunar_Lander> well
[10:31] <Lunar_Lander> I also could go by train
[10:45] <Lunar_Lander> I'll have to see
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[10:51] <daveake> Have now collected the helium for the launch this weekend :-). Next job - figure out how to connect the siller little filler thing to the balloon
[10:58] <Randomskk> duct tape
[11:00] <fsphil> and hose pipe
[11:00] <fsphil> and cable ties
[11:00] <Randomskk> pfft. hose pipe can be made out of duct tape :P
[11:00] <fsphil> lol
[11:01] <fsphil> or jubilee clip instead of cable ties
[11:01] <Randomskk> that's the spirit
[11:04] <daveake> Isee you guys have read my mind already :)
[11:05] <daveake> Is there anything that duct tape *cannot* do? ;-)
[11:05] <fsphil> I used cable ties but I hate cutting them afterwards, incase I nip the balloon
[11:06] <daveake> also need to go get a 3G dongle so I can run the tracker online from wherever I am (probably on top of the nearest hill).
[11:07] <daveake> My laptop has 3G built-in, by dl-fldigi isn't seeing the sound from the line-in, despite me spending half an hour messing with sound card settings.
[11:07] <fsphil> ooh, reminds me, I've been meaning to ask if getting an external gsm antenna for the car would be worthwhile?
[11:07] <daveake> So I'll use my netbook instead, but that has no 3G
[11:07] <daveake> Yes, if the dongle has an antenna socket then that can help.
[11:08] <fsphil> daveake, odd -- should be simple to switch it, though the cirrus guys had trouble doing it in windows vista
[11:08] <fsphil> (the line-in that is_
[11:08] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil btw the guy in the radio shop asked me to call back tomorrow when the boss is in
[11:09] <fsphil> aah sweet
[11:09] <fsphil> maybe you can make a deal
[11:09] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[11:09] <daveake> It was set to "ext mic" or something, but I set Line In and that didn't work. It was in a docking station which may have confused it (it has a headphone o/p in the station). I'll try undocked this evening
[11:09] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil or I pay the extra 26 euros for a train voyage
[11:09] <fsphil> that's pretty cheap for a train ticket
[11:10] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[11:10] <Lunar_Lander> I can get to Muenster for free
[11:10] <fsphil> the trains in england are scary expensive
[11:10] <daveake> Re the FT-790R, I bought one on ebay then the seller said the Tx didn't work properly. I explained I didn't need that so we did a deal. After that he spent 2 weeks with excuses so I got a refund. Bought an AR8000 in the end.
[11:10] <Lunar_Lander> and from then on, I can use the northrhine-westphalia ticket
[11:11] <daveake> I got the AR8000 cheap because "the battery compartment is broken". Which turned out to be a missing battery spring which I easily fixed with a spare :-)
[11:11] <fsphil> excellent
[11:11] <fsphil> I love it when that happens
[11:12] <Lunar_Lander> which allows you to travel in NRW with all trains of the short range class
[11:12] <Lunar_Lander> OK
[11:12] <Lunar_Lander> it means that I'll have 40 minutes to muenster
[11:12] <Lunar_Lander> and about an hour to the shop
[11:12] <fsphil> got a wrt54gl cheap because the owner bricked it -- simple to recover
[11:12] <Lunar_Lander> but that is OK
[11:12] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[11:12] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[11:12] <daveake> Just had to bend a spring from a cheap battery holder into the right shape (the spring bends down to plug directly into a PCB socket).
[11:13] <fsphil> they seem to be a popular receiver
[11:14] <daveake> Yep. They often come up on ebay but sometimes the bidders get a bit excited and the price goes too high.
[11:16] <daveake> Bought a twin-beam 'scope back when I was a student. Only one trace worked so I got it very cheap. Seller didn't know that on that particular model there's one beam with a blade/magnet splitter at the back of the tube. 10 seconds with a Bic cap and you move the magnet so both beams have the same brightness :-)
[11:16] <fsphil> I seen an ft790 go for about £200 a while back
[11:16] <daveake> Wow
[11:16] <daveake> Mine was going to be £40 till the excuses flowed
[11:17] <fsphil> I got mine for just over £60
[11:17] <daveake> Good price :)
[11:17] <fsphil> yea was well chuffed
[11:17] <fsphil> lovely little radio - just wish there was more 70cm activity around here
[11:17] <fsphil> well, it's not that little
[11:18] <fsphil> needa get that back, next flight will have two payloads
[11:19] <daveake> I only wanted the receiver for the balloon. It has been useful though for my job - I had a project using comms over radio modems. Dead handy to just hear the packets flying back and forth. Useful tool for debugging!
[11:19] <fsphil> definitely
[11:20] <daveake> The radio stuff used timing to control who transmitted when. I could heard by the pattern of blips when it went wrong!
[11:21] <fsphil> good to figure out if a radio module is dead too
[11:21] <daveake> Yep
[11:21] <daveake> That happened too.
[11:21] <fsphil> I had one I could never get working -- didn't know if it was just me using it wrong, or it wasn't tx'ing
[11:21] <fsphil> turned out it was tx'ing but really badly
[11:22] <daveake> The project was a timing system for the WRC (rally cars). I got asked to go help test it at the Acropolis rally in Greece. So there I was, in the shade of a tree by the side of a stage, pressing a button as each car went by and listening to theresulting radio traffic on the AR800. One of my better work trips :-)
[11:22] <fsphil> I'm not envious at all
[11:22] <daveake> LOL
[11:22] <fsphil> *mumbles*
[11:22] <Darkside> ok, flights are booked
[11:23] <Darkside> i arrive on the 18th
[11:23] <daveake> The timings went live on TV. I *thought* we were just testing - no-one told me the TV guys were connected to the data feed and had decided to go live as it all seemed to be working!
[11:23] <fsphil> ooh that's not long Darkside
[11:23] <fsphil> lucky there was no special debug messages daveake
[11:24] <daveake> LOL
[11:24] <fsphil> my systems often send little test messages that I wouldn't want my boss to see :)
[11:24] <daveake> :D:D:D
[11:24] <Darkside> fsphil: yeah i know
[11:24] <Darkside> pretty scary
[11:25] <fsphil> between you and hibby, it's like musical-continents here atm :)
[11:26] <daveake> fsphil these are the pics - https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150214464127654.312644.695937653&l=273e2b40e4 - first one is me testing the device during an earlier stage that day.
[11:29] <fsphil> very nice
[11:30] <daveake> Right, time to go BBQ for jhose and jubilee clips etc :-)
[11:32] <daveake> Payload is working ... helium here... NOTAM here ... just need the weather to follow the forecast. For a change!
[11:32] <fsphil> big ask :)
[11:34] <daveake> True!
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[11:43] <griffonbot> Received email: daveake "[UKHAS] CLOUD1 Launch on Sunday"
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[11:47] <Darkside> oh coooooooool i have the UKube design docs!
[11:47] <Darkside> this is awesome
[11:48] <Darkside> hmm, its 600km altitude
[11:48] <Darkside> thate not LEO
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[11:52] <Darkside> wait, yes it is
[11:52] <Darkside> LEO is up to 2000km
[11:53] <fsphil> still very high up
[11:53] <SpeedEvil> IIRC 300-20000 or so is a bad place energetic particle wise
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[11:56] <cuddykid> darkside: how did you get involved in cube sat?
[11:56] <Darkside> The Total Ionising Dose (TID) expected during the mission lifetime is not expected to exceed 15 krad.
[11:56] <Darkside> cuddykid: via my supervisor, who works at the university of bath
[11:57] <cuddykid> oh nice! lucky!
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[12:06] <Lunar_Lander> hi Upu Darkside
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[12:13] <cuddykid> oh I hate hate hate hate........ eagle
[12:14] <cuddykid> why has eagle decided to add in a wire on the board layout when it's not on the schematic layout?!?!?
[12:16] <BrainDamage> cuddykid: software 2.0, it guesses your intentions and acts accordingly to what you REALLY wanted
[12:16] <cuddykid> lol
[12:23] <fsphil> don't let it see fear
[12:23] <fsphil> it can sense it
[12:24] <Darkside> These powerports are not currently available in our World Traveller / Economy cabins on British Airways.
[12:24] <Darkside> AWWWWWWWWWW
[12:24] <Darkside> no power for me :<
[12:24] <Randomskk> haha yea world traveller is cheap and not great
[12:24] <Randomskk> british airways first class is superb, otoh
[12:24] <Darkside> urgh
[12:24] <fsphil> sneak on spare batteries?
[12:25] <BrainDamage> if TSA complains, say it's a C4 brick
[12:25] <Darkside> >_>
[12:25] <Darkside> fsphil: can't easily do that with a macbook pro >_>
[12:25] <Darkside> oh well, i'll have my kindle
[12:25] <Darkside> that'll provide me with entertainment for the flight
[12:26] <BrainDamage> there are actually battery packs with builtin inverter
[12:26] <BrainDamage> you plug them directly into the laptop's power socket
[12:26] <BrainDamage> it's kinda sucky as solution tough
[12:26] <fsphil> aah macs
[12:27] <fsphil> I had a home-made battery pack for my gameboy, took it onto a flight to england when I was a kid. it had four D batteries in a cardboard box, wires hanging out of it
[12:27] <fsphil> they didn't ask a thing
[12:28] <fsphil> doubt I could do that now :)
[12:31] <Darkside> oh guys
[12:31] <Darkside> will me bringign in a USB tv tuner cause problems?
[12:31] <Darkside> as a tourist, do i need to pay a tv license?
[12:31] <fsphil> nah you'll be fine
[12:32] <Darkside> will they care about it when i enter the country?
[12:32] <Darkside> i guess its a small USB device, so thy shouldn't notice
[12:32] <eroomde> no
[12:32] <eroomde> i think you're somewhat over-worrying (by about 4 orders of magnitude)
[12:33] <eroomde> it's not like coming to australia with an ant farm
[12:33] <eroomde> or a cane toad
[12:33] <Darkside> lol
[12:33] <Darkside> ok
[12:35] <Darkside> hrm, i wonder what Economy (N) means
[12:36] <Elwell> no loo
[12:36] <Elwell> you have to stand for the duration
[12:36] <Elwell> and they transfer you onto ryanair
[12:36] <eroomde> you have to hang on ryanair
[12:36] <eroomde> from meet hooks
[12:36] <eroomde> meat*
[12:36] <BrainDamage> I've seen a crazy proposal about seatless economic class for airplanes
[12:37] <BrainDamage> I had to read it 3 times to make sure they weren't joking
[12:37] <Darkside> lool
[12:37] <Elwell> Darkside: more seriously, flyerforums? have the ticket class info
[12:38] Action: Elwell looks forwards to his etihad business lie-flat trip at xmas :-)
[12:38] <Laurenceb> shuttle cameras are awesome
[12:39] <Elwell> flip -forgot that was soon - what are we up to?
[12:39] <Darkside> oh jeez
[12:39] <Darkside> iw onder if i'll be able to watch it over this 3g connection
[12:40] <Laurenceb> love the 2 and 3 guys
[12:41] <Darkside> woo, the stream is working perfectly :D
[12:41] <Darkside> even on 3G :D
[12:42] <Darkside> cool, pulling 127Kb/s over it :P
[12:42] <Darkside> anyone know the T-?
[12:43] Action: Elwell flips to somafm for audio
[12:44] <Laurenceb> lol whos that guy in the middle
[12:44] <Laurenceb> jackass
[12:44] <Darkside> hahaha
[12:45] <Laurenceb> their video overlay thingy seems to be glitchy
[12:45] <Laurenceb> giving a black '@' symbol now
[12:48] <fsphil> last I heard they where launching at 4:30-ish pm BST - has that changed?
[12:49] <Darkside> aww shit, so launch is still like 2 hours away?
[12:50] <Darkside> its already 10pm here, and i need to be up at7am tomorrow..
[12:50] <cuddykid> Darkside:when you coming over here?
[12:50] <Darkside> next weekend>_>
[12:50] <cuddykid> cool, nice long flight awaits then!
[12:51] <Darkside> oh yes
[12:51] <cuddykid> hopefully it will brighten up abit here
[12:51] <Darkside> my kindle had better last
[12:51] <cuddykid> been raining most of morning and freeeeezing
[12:51] <cuddykid> haha
[12:51] <Darkside> i think i'll bring multiple mp3 players too >_>
[12:51] <cuddykid> can bring charger on board and charge in HK or sing. (where ever you stop)
[12:51] <Darkside> would be nice if the seats has usb ports, but i doubt i'll have that
[12:52] <Darkside> yeah, i'll be doing that
[12:52] <cuddykid> nah, the equip on board is poor
[12:52] <Darkside> theres a layover in bangkok, not sure how long for
[12:52] <Darkside> you've flown british airwaysinternationally?
[12:53] <Laurenceb> ooh 5,6, and 7 have turned up
[12:55] <griffonbot> Received email: John Graham-Cumming "Re: [UKHAS] CLOUD1 Launch on Sunday"
[12:56] <cuddykid> Darkside: yeah, haven't flown BA to aus though, flew with Virgin Atlantic
[12:56] <cuddykid> usually fly virgin
[12:57] <Elwell> air NZ were ok when I did lhr to auckland
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[13:08] <Laurenceb> "cover your ears"
[13:08] <Darkside> T-1:22 min
[13:08] <Darkside> but there'll be a hold
[13:09] <Laurenceb> the HD feed is pretty cool
[13:09] <Dan-K2VOL> the NASA TV ipad app has amazing hd video
[13:10] <griffonbot> Received email: John Underwood "Re: [UKHAS] CLOUD1 Launch on Sunday"
[13:14] <Laurenceb> i didnt know usa stood for united space alliance
[13:14] <Laurenceb> :P
[13:14] <Darkside> mmm, they could make some good standing waves in that cord
[13:15] <Laurenceb> loool
[13:15] <Darkside> hmm launch at 15:26
[13:15] <Dan-K2VOL> haha Laurenceb we sold the acronymn naming rights of the country to raise money to pay our national debt :-P
[13:15] <Laurenceb> steriotypical nasa worker is sterotypical
[13:15] <Darkside> loooool
[13:15] <Darkside> awesome
[13:15] <Laurenceb> travis tompson XD
[13:15] <Darkside> OH MAN
[13:15] <Darkside> HE IS - NUMBER 6
[13:16] <russss> heh
[13:16] <Laurenceb> this need the team ameria music
[13:16] <Darkside> did he say "this is our ass"
[13:16] <Laurenceb> *needs
[13:17] <Laurenceb> i think he did
[13:17] <Darkside> lol
[13:17] <Darkside> lol diving board
[13:17] <Darkside> oh so thats what the yellow thing is
[13:17] <Darkside> vooling air
[13:17] <Darkside> cooling*
[13:18] <Laurenceb> i like the no step on the seal thing
[13:18] <Laurenceb> if you tread on that youll probably fall through :P
[13:18] <Darkside> a single hair? really?
[13:20] <Darkside> aww ustream doesn't show the number of viewers anymore
[13:20] <Dan-K2VOL> it's out of control!
[13:20] <Dan-K2VOL> (ustream views :-P)
[13:20] <Laurenceb> "hello you seem to be planning a space shuttle launch"
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[13:21] <Darkside> lol
[13:21] <Laurenceb> "please hold to speak to an advisor"
[13:21] <Darkside> i remember last time
[13:21] <Darkside> was like 130000 viewers
[13:21] <Darkside> which was somthing like 30Gbit/s
[13:21] <Laurenceb> *or press 1 to go to launch
[13:21] <Darkside> press number 2, if you need some cool air
[13:22] <Darkside> he seems to have that handled
[13:22] <cuddykid> woo, I think I've finally created a board file :)
[13:23] <eroomde> screencap
[13:23] <Laurenceb> ah poor randy
[13:23] <eroomde> or it didn;t happen
[13:23] <Darkside> randy has to hold the hose
[13:23] <Darkside> he was too randy
[13:23] <Laurenceb> XD
[13:23] <Laurenceb> randy is so randy hes holding his hose
[13:24] <Darkside> >_<
[13:24] <Dan-K2VOL> cool cuddykid
[13:24] <cuddykid> :) nightmare to check though!
[13:25] <Randomskk> about an hour until launch?
[13:25] <Randomskk> uh, two hours, even
[13:25] <eroomde> i just read an article which quite validly points out the correlation between populatairy of a programming language and the beard-length of its inventor(s)
[13:26] <eroomde> popularity*
[13:26] <Dan-K2VOL> haha eroomde
[13:26] <Randomskk> does it foretell doom for ruby, then?
[13:26] <eroomde> no
[13:26] <eroomde> ruby man has a beard
[13:26] <eroomde> so it'll be fine
[13:26] <Randomskk> he does? oh
[13:26] <Randomskk> how about python?
[13:26] <eroomde> GvR has a beard
[13:27] <cuddykid> where does everyone get their pcbs made?
[13:27] <eroomde> http://www.python.org/~guido/
[13:27] <eroomde> cuddykid: how soon do you want it back?
[13:27] <cuddykid> eroomde: about 3 weeks or so
[13:27] <cuddykid> month max really
[13:28] <eroomde> ok. pcbtrain are good if you want faster, if slower try olimex or seeed studio
[13:28] <cuddykid> thanks :)
[13:29] <cuddykid> as my board has 2 layers does that mean I need double sided board?
[13:29] <eroomde> yes
[13:29] <cuddykid> cheers
[13:29] <eroomde> sparkfun have an exellent tutorial on preparing eagle files for sending off to a manufacturer
[13:30] <cuddykid> will have a look
[13:30] <eroomde> make your tracks as thick as practically possible
[13:30] <eroomde> is my other tip
[13:30] <Dan-K2VOL> I'll second eroomde
[13:30] <cuddykid> cool
[13:31] <Dan-K2VOL> and silkscreen label all the functions of any pin on any connector!
[13:31] <eroomde> people seem to like 6 mil tracks surrounded by acres of space
[13:31] <eroomde> just makes it more likely to fail
[13:31] <cuddykid> my tracks are currently 0.1inch
[13:31] <Dan-K2VOL> and pour a ground polygon filling the board on both sides, with lots of vias in the open areas
[13:31] <cuddykid> I'll widen all that I can
[13:32] <eroomde> especially when you go from 30 celcius to -40 celcius on a balloon flight - there's a lot of relative contraction/expansion between the fibreglass substrate and the copper. thinner tracks are at higher risk of delaminating
[13:32] <eroomde> or splitting
[13:32] <Laurenceb> seeedstudio copper seems particularly brittle
[13:34] Action: Laurenceb uses 8mil/8mil for seedstudio boards
[13:34] <Randomskk> surely by and large copper is copper
[13:35] <Elwell> +impurities?
[13:35] <Randomskk> I'd be surprised if seeedstudio copper was somehow more brittle than gold phoenix copper or something
[13:35] <Dan-K2VOL> Randomskk metals are refined from ore, which can be done well, or not
[13:35] <Randomskk> the copper is being electroplated
[13:35] <eroomde> could just be who their buy their raw board from. it's not all created equal
[13:35] <Randomskk> atom by atom
[13:36] <Randomskk> and how much laminating glue they use and all the rest of it
[13:36] <Randomskk> there are a fair few variables
[13:36] <Randomskk> just I'd be surprised if seeedstudio were particularly worse
[13:36] <Randomskk> considering as they use several different factories anyway
[13:37] <Dan-K2VOL> I'm irritated to find that for commercial PCB assembly Goldphoenix they will source parts for you only from Digi-key in the USA
[13:37] <Randomskk> if you post them parts they'll use them, though
[13:40] <kristianpaul> mon
[13:40] <Laurenceb> its not that simple
[13:41] <Laurenceb> the copper is electroplated
[13:41] <kristianpaul> UWi
[13:41] <Laurenceb> you need various reagents adding to get good quality plate
[13:41] <kristianpaul> arg
[13:41] <kristianpaul> sorry
[13:41] <Laurenceb> lol
[13:41] <Laurenceb> it could be seeedstudio are saving money
[13:42] <kristianpaul> About balloons, how posible and accurate could be to have remotely piloted baloon flight?
[13:42] <kristianpaul> I guess some body already tried this in the past..
[13:43] <Laurenceb> Randy will be looking for a new job soon :(
[13:44] <Elwell> chief hose-holder never was a long term career plan I guess
[13:45] <Laurenceb> i like how theres an air flow label
[13:45] <Dan-K2VOL> kristianpaul all you can do that's significant while the balloon is going up is either let helium out, cut the balloon off, or drop weight
[13:45] <Elwell> lost audio?
[13:45] <Darkside> yup
[13:45] <Laurenceb> my headphones keep breaking
[13:46] <Darkside> no audio here
[13:47] <Darkside> there we go
[13:47] <griffonbot> Received email: David Akerman "Re: [UKHAS] CLOUD1 Launch on Sunday"
[13:52] <Elwell> 'oh bugger, I've cross-threaded it'
[13:53] <Zuph> Morning #highaltitude, what's up?
[13:55] <Laurenceb> if he graffitying the wall?
[13:58] <Laurenceb> heh they are signing the wall
[13:59] <kristianpaul> Dan-K2VOL: i understand about Z axis maneuverability, but what about what to try for X and Y ?
[13:59] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[13:59] <Lunar_Lander> kristianpaul you'd need motors
[13:59] <Lunar_Lander> you need to get faster than the wind
[13:59] <Lunar_Lander> then you can steer anywhere you want
[14:00] <Lunar_Lander> there is also a way when you are slower than the wind
[14:00] <Lunar_Lander> but that way failed in 1897
[14:01] <kristianpaul> what about wings using? is this already talked
[14:01] <kristianpaul> (faster than the wind) ahem ;)
[14:01] <kristianpaul> s/talked/talked?
[14:02] <Lunar_Lander> wings?
[14:03] <kristianpaul> http://www.ukhas.org.uk/_detail/projects:mihab:p4130055.jpg?id=projects%3Amihab%3Aglider
[14:03] <kristianpaul> well, more o less like that
[14:04] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[14:04] <Lunar_Lander> I thought you meant steering a balloon around
[14:05] <cuddykid> eroomde: What width do you recommend? 2mm is quite big on mine
[14:05] <eroomde> context?
[14:05] <eroomde> oh track width
[14:05] <cuddykid> eagle board
[14:05] <eroomde> sorry, goldfishs memory
[14:05] <cuddykid> yeah
[14:05] <cuddykid> lol
[14:05] <eroomde> 2mm is big
[14:05] <eroomde> what i mean is, if you can clearly make things bigger without bumping into each other, do
[14:06] <kristianpaul> Lunar_Lander: yeah, a balloon
[14:06] <griffonbot> Received email: Fergus Noble "[UKHAS] Re: CLOUD1 Launch on Sunday -- Fwd: [CGC-News] Red Arrow
[14:06] <kristianpaul> any way i need read more.
[14:06] <Darkside> aww
[14:06] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[14:06] <Darkside> nice photo
[14:06] <cuddykid> eroomde: got it :)
[14:06] <Lunar_Lander> what is that number 5 backpack?
[14:06] <Lunar_Lander> and number 7 has one too
[14:07] <Elwell> breathing app looking at the mask
[14:08] <Darkside> hmm
[14:08] <Darkside> for launch?
[14:08] <Elwell> for evac in case of fire?
[14:08] <Elwell> they all have one I think
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[14:09] <Elwell> love the bounce between the shuttle n white room
[14:10] <Laurenceb> 2mm track width?!
[14:11] <Lunar_Lander> Hold 1
[14:12] <Lunar_Lander> I got a dl-fldigi question
[14:12] <Lunar_Lander> sorry if I asked already
[14:12] <Lunar_Lander> could you rig dl-fldigi to plot the data on Google Earth?
[14:13] <DanielRichman> probably not; atleast I don't think so without some codingn work. You might have better luck having some sort of KML export from spacenear or rjh/listen.
[14:13] <Randomskk> you, well
[14:13] <Randomskk> it would take some programming, yea.
[14:13] <eroomde> Lunar_Lander:just incase, you know that feature is currently available
[14:14] <Randomskk> but you probably wouldn't have to change fldigi itself
[14:14] <eroomde> a live-updating kml for 3d google earth plotting
[14:14] <Randomskk> eroomde: only with internet connectivity
[14:14] <Randomskk> though how well google earth works without it I don't know
[14:14] <Randomskk> "not very" :P
[14:15] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[14:15] <Darkside> papyrus!
[14:15] <Darkside> ffs
[14:15] <Darkside> looooool
[14:15] <Darkside> they know they're on camera
[14:15] <Darkside> haha
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[14:15] <Laurenceb> lmao
[14:16] <Laurenceb> this gets more and more silly
[14:16] <Darkside> hahaha
[14:16] <Darkside> this is pretty awesome
[14:16] <Elwell> 'so long and thanks for all the fish?
[14:16] <Elwell> ah boring
[14:16] <Darkside> hahahaha
[14:16] <Darkside> oh fuck offffff
[14:16] <Laurenceb> lool Randy
[14:18] <Laurenceb> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhnUgAaea4M
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[14:19] Action: Laurenceb plays the audio over the nasa tv feed
[14:19] <NigeyS> any1 got the hd link for vlc ?
[14:19] <Darkside> im just using ustream
[14:19] <Darkside> working well
[14:19] <Elwell> NigeyS: there's a yahoo aggregator I think
[14:19] <griffonbot> Received email: David Akerman "Re: [UKHAS] Re: CLOUD1 Launch on Sunday -- Fwd: [CGC-News] Red Arrow
[14:21] <NigeyS> ahh oki
[14:21] <eroomde> 20 minutes
[14:21] <griffonbot> Received email: Ed Moore "Re: [UKHAS] Re: CLOUD1 Launch on Sunday -- Fwd: [CGC-News] Red Arrow
[14:21] <Darkside> isnt there another hold?
[14:21] <Elwell> +40? for the hold at 9
[14:22] <Darkside> fffffffuuuuuuuuuuuu a 40 min hold?
[14:22] <Darkside> i want to sleep :<
[14:22] <NigeyS> lol
[14:24] <eroomde> seems to still be at -17:20
[14:24] <eroomde> on the current shot of the countdown
[14:24] <Darkside> yeah but theres a hold at T-9 min
[14:25] <eroomde> oh
[14:25] <eroomde> where is this info?
[14:25] <russss> there is a ~40min built-in hold at T-9min
[14:25] <Darkside> wut
[14:25] <russss> http://science.ksc.nasa.gov/shuttle/countdown/count.html
[14:25] <Darkside> video feed stopped
[14:25] <eroomde> same for me
[14:25] <russss> yeah ours too
[14:25] <russss> back
[14:25] <Darkside> mm
[14:25] <eroomde> bollocks i have things that need doing
[14:27] <WillDuckworth> we've just had the same countdown discussion at work - typical american way of doing stuff - they'll drop in an advert break soon with all the sponsors
[14:29] <eroomde> the us taxpayer?
[14:30] <Darkside> no adverts on nasa tv :P
[14:30] <SpeedEvil> yet
[14:30] <Laurenceb> well they switched to flash player
[14:30] <SpeedEvil> Darkside: Well - there are Boeing/Mcdonnald Douglass/...
[14:32] <Laurenceb> theres a boat
[14:32] <eroomde> 35 minutes!
[14:32] <eroomde> the countdown unit shouldn't be minutes
[14:32] <fsphil> they've an interesting definition of 9 minutes
[14:32] <eroomde> it's clearly nonsense
[14:32] <Lunar_Lander> T-9 and holding for 41 mins 10 seconds
[14:33] <eroomde> the countdown is just a monitonically decreasing number of wildly variable derivative
[14:33] <eroomde> paul gambachini does nasa too
[14:33] <eroomde> who knew
[14:34] <Darkside> ok fuck it, i need to go to bed
[14:34] <Darkside> got too much stuff on tomorrow morning
[14:34] <Darkside> night all...
[14:34] <eroomde> you're missing history here
[14:34] <fsphil> night!
[14:34] Action: SpeedEvil wonders if they do abort, would they fly again?
[14:34] <WillDuckworth> http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/shuttle/launch/countdown101.html
[14:35] <eroomde> it might not launch successfully
[14:35] <Darkside> eroomde: i know
[14:35] <Darkside> but its midnight
[14:35] <SpeedEvil> Oooh!
[14:35] <Darkside> also my net connection has gone to shit
[14:35] Action: SpeedEvil hopes for a failure, so I can go to spain and see it.
[14:35] <Darkside> i can't get the stream working anymore
[14:35] <fsphil> "throttle up to 104% of capability" hmm
[14:35] <Darkside> nn all
[14:36] <SpeedEvil> nn
[14:36] <griffonbot> Received email: David Akerman "Re: [UKHAS] Re: CLOUD1 Launch on Sunday -- Fwd: [CGC-News] Red Arrow
[14:38] <fsphil> 40 minutes to go
[14:38] <hibby> party
[14:38] <fsphil> interesting they use UTC
[14:39] <hibby> all the TV channels here use local, but I think you mean NASA?
[14:39] <fsphil> watching nasa tv
[14:39] <eroomde> otherwise the upper stage manufacturers would use EST and the lower stage PCT and the explosive bolts would go off at the wrong time
[14:39] <fsphil> all the times they called out where UTC
[14:40] <eroomde> they learned their lesson from mars global surveyor
[14:42] <Lunar_Lander> no
[14:42] <Lunar_Lander> Mars Climate Orbite
[14:42] <Lunar_Lander> +r
[14:42] <fsphil> yea, MGS worked :)
[14:45] <SamSilver> I think it was Rady's idea
[14:45] <SamSilver> randy's
[14:45] <hibby> fox news or cnn for the coverage?
[14:45] <hibby> hmmm
[14:46] <juxta> fsphil, the 104% is in relation to rated power
[14:46] <Dan-K2VOL> ugh either one will give very poor coverage hibby, try to find CSPAN or CSPAN-II
[14:46] <hibby> lol
[14:46] <Dan-K2VOL> or just do the NASA TV stream or spaceflightnow.com
[14:47] <hibby> Sajuuk: my TC1100 ++ internet speed here won't handle that sadly
[14:47] <hibby> cupid stunt :/
[14:47] <hibby> jost shocked myself by putting the connection of my (recently used) headphones in my mouth
[14:49] <fsphil> odd
[14:49] <hibby> most likely static discharge
[14:50] <hibby> what i get for being a tool
[14:50] <Dan-K2VOL> I'm facing the same problem at work, the boss said put it on the TV, but the cable network here is crap, no NASA TV and I can't find CSPAN
[14:50] <fsphil> why do I keep hearing a windows bell sound
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[14:53] <eroomde> not me
[14:53] <fsphil> there it is again
[14:53] <fsphil> coming from the nasa stream
[14:53] Action: SpeedEvil wonders if they'd considered filling the payload bay with helium for a few kilos extra payload.
[14:54] <hibby> SpeedEvil: I think nasa have the resources to throw a cubesat or two in instead
[14:54] <hibby> :p
[14:55] <SpeedEvil> It's filled with atmospheric pressure atmosphere at the moment
[14:55] <eroomde> SpeedEvil: in 30km the helium would weight more
[14:55] <eroomde> and that's only a small part of the total KE
[14:55] <SpeedEvil> I know.
[14:55] <eroomde> ... that you'd get the saving
[14:56] <SpeedEvil> It only shaves gravity losses off over the first several kilometers
[14:56] <hibby> there could be venting occurring too
[14:56] <staylo> There's a low bandwidth stream at http://www.ustream.tv/channel/nasa-mobile :)
[14:56] <hibby> so by the time it becomes a burden, it's no longer there
[14:57] <SpeedEvil> There is venting occurring, yes.
[14:57] <eroomde> true
[14:57] <hibby> yay!
[14:57] <hibby> google plus!
[14:58] <Zuph> hibby: I like G+ a lot.
[15:02] <Dan-K2VOL> ah CSPAN-2 has it hibby
[15:02] <Dan-K2VOL> a direct NASA-TV feed
[15:02] <Zuph> The stream is rock solid for me, which is a first for my crummy netbook
[15:03] <hibby> Dan-K2VOL: sadly not an option :/
[15:03] <Dan-K2VOL> oh no
[15:04] <fsphil> lack of bandwidth hibby?
[15:04] <hibby> nasa mobile works
[15:05] <hibby> fsphil: bandwidth and computing power
[15:05] <fsphil> ah
[15:05] <mattltm> Im a bit late to the party but has anyone got a good link for the STS-135 launch?
[15:05] <fsphil> I'm using this: http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/ustream.html
[15:05] <Dan-K2VOL> well hibby CNN says they're doing special coverage
[15:05] <hibby> 1GHz celeron D is struggling a bit
[15:05] <hibby> Dan-K2VOL: indeed - a greying obama is talking at the moment
[15:06] <mattltm> ta fsphil :)
[15:06] <NigeyS> http://playlist.yahoo.com/makeplaylist.dll?id=1368163
[15:06] <NigeyS> 1200kbps
[15:06] <eroomde> how do you return to launch site within 25 mins?
[15:06] <eroomde> surely you'd have to do a whole orbit?
[15:06] <Dan-K2VOL> eroomde, the RTLS is a scary procedure
[15:06] <hibby> thre must be a termination altitude
[15:06] <Dan-K2VOL> you wait until the boosters finish firing
[15:06] <hibby> eject all the things, run away!
[15:07] <mattltm> NigeyS: what do you play that with? VLC?
[15:07] <NigeyS> yup
[15:07] <Zuph> eroomde: You wait until the booster finish, then turn the thing arond and fly into oyour exhaust plume
[15:07] <eroomde> do you not have too much cross-range momentum?
[15:07] <Dan-K2VOL> then use the shuttle main engine gymbals to rotate 180 degrees immediately and continue firing the main engines to remove all the forward velocity
[15:07] <eroomde> christ
[15:07] <Zuph> eroomde: if you do it right, you can *just* make it back to kennedy
[15:07] <Dan-K2VOL> and fire back to florida, drop the tank in the ocean and land
[15:08] <SamSilver> lowband width option > http://www.ustream.tv/channel/nasa-mobile
[15:08] <Dan-K2VOL> the shuttle pilots have pretty much agreed that they never want to do it
[15:08] <hibby> the lowbandwidth option is good.
[15:08] <Zuph> It's like a 4 or 5 G manuever, pushes the shuttle to its design maximums.
[15:08] <NigeyS> :o
[15:08] <hibby> g+ feels faster than Facebook
[15:09] <Dan-K2VOL> there's a fantastic MIT OpenCourseware audio course on Aircraft Systems Engineering that covered all the systems the Space Shuttle for the entire course, by bringing in the actual engineers who managed the systems development to teach each section!
[15:10] <Dan-K2VOL> (the engineers who actually designed the shuttle)
[15:12] <fsphil> sad day for them
[15:12] <Laurenceb> otc
[15:12] <Laurenceb> lol lmao 1337
[15:13] <Randomskk> how long've we got now?
[15:14] <fsphil> someone give her a dodgy microphone
[15:15] <hibby> queue the inspirational words
[15:15] <Laurenceb> lol
[15:15] Action: Laurenceb facepalms
[15:15] <fsphil> yea
[15:15] <Laurenceb> wake up
[15:16] <hibby> hmm
[15:16] <hibby> time for some sugar on my cheerios
[15:17] <hibby> not nearly sweet enough
[15:17] <fsphil> nooo
[15:17] <fsphil> there's that ding again
[15:17] <Zuph> Heh, that sounded like a "We've never done RTLS before, we're not doing it this time, just fly it damnit" excuse :-p
[15:18] <Lunar_Lander> weather is acceptable
[15:18] <Lunar_Lander> T-9 and counting
[15:19] <fsphil> the shuttle looks like it will be within radio range as it flies overhead -- will get the funcube dongle ready
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[15:19] <hibby> fsphil: love it
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[15:20] <fsphil> aarg -- the funcube dongle is too small, it's gone missing!
[15:22] <Randomskk> nearly at 5 minutes...
[15:22] <fsphil> ah, found it
[15:22] <fsphil> 5 minutes in nasa terms could be 2 hours :p
[15:23] <Randomskk> I think my VLC stream is quite delayed from realtime
[15:23] <Randomskk> oh well
[15:23] <Randomskk> I'll just pretend it's not and ignore IRC for a few seconds at launch :P
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[15:24] <fsphil> lol
[15:25] <Lunar_Lander> T-2
[15:25] <fsphil> I've lost the sma <> bnc adaptor now
[15:25] <Randomskk> my internet is so slow atm! D:
[15:25] <Lunar_Lander> Randomskk
[15:25] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/ustream.html
[15:25] <Randomskk> and keeps lagging
[15:25] <Lunar_Lander> the lag is much better there
[15:25] <Lunar_Lander> on ustream
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[15:25] <Lunar_Lander> hi mattltm
[15:25] <gb73d> tuned in recording TV
[15:26] <Lunar_Lander> Good Luck Atlantis!
[15:26] <Randomskk> T-2
[15:26] <eroomde> 40s
[15:26] <eroomde> big delay Randomskk
[15:26] <eroomde> 35
[15:26] <mattltm> Hi Lunar_Lander :)
[15:26] <Lunar_Lander> malfunction
[15:26] <fsphil> arg
[15:26] <Randomskk> haha the flash stream is super laggy
[15:26] <eroomde> 30s hold
[15:26] <Randomskk> oh fail
[15:26] <Elwell> held at 31?
[15:26] <Randomskk> that's a pretty close to go failure
[15:26] <hibby> failure
[15:27] <juxta> how long is the launch window? 4 mins I think I heard before?
[15:27] <eroomde> they're not sure something has fully retracted Randomskk
[15:27] <Randomskk> flash one keeps pausing D:
[15:27] <eroomde> ok it's fine
[15:28] <Lunar_Lander> go to proceed
[15:28] <Randomskk> eroomde: clearly this is how our hab launches should be
[15:28] <Lunar_Lander> Randomskk did you try ustream?
[15:28] <Randomskk> yea this is the ustream
[15:28] <Randomskk> I think my sister is torretning films or something D:
[15:28] <Elwell> Randomskk: what, reallty really expensive?
[15:28] <eroomde> Randomskk: quite
[15:28] <BrainDamage> and failing at -31
[15:28] <eroomde> 30 different roles and huge amounts of radio comming
[15:28] <hibby> go!
[15:28] <Lunar_Lander> goes on!
[15:28] <eroomde> resume
[15:29] <SamSilver> 15
[15:29] <SamSilver> 10
[15:29] <Randomskk> stop freeezing D:
[15:29] <Randomskk> noooo this is terrible
[15:29] <Lunar_Lander> LIFTOFF
[15:29] <Lunar_Lander> AMERICA WILL CONTINUE THE DREAM
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[15:30] <hibby> hmm
[15:30] <hibby> dream being the operative word there
[15:30] <hibby> s/the/to
[15:30] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[15:30] <Lunar_Lander> if Richard Feynman could see that now...
[15:31] <eroomde> Randomskk: I have always quite wanted to do the loop-launch thing via pyro
[15:31] <eroomde> with a countdown
[15:31] <Lunar_Lander> SRB sep
[15:32] <Zuph> Goddamn, can she move
[15:32] <Lunar_Lander> OMS on
[15:32] <Lunar_Lander> two engine TAL
[15:32] <Elwell> just a bit
[15:32] <fsphil> my stream has died
[15:32] <eroomde> still good
[15:32] <Zuph> mine too
[15:32] <eroomde> oh no
[15:32] <eroomde> dead
[15:32] <fsphil> still streaming, but the video is paused
[15:32] <eroomde> yup
[15:32] <Elwell> logo still animated but no video
[15:32] <Lunar_Lander> really?
[15:32] <Lunar_Lander> I see the shuttle pitching down slowly
[15:32] <BrainDamage> same here
[15:33] <eroomde> they're just finding the next vhs tape
[15:33] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[15:33] <eroomde> it's all staged, you see
[15:33] <Randomskk> haha
[15:33] <fsphil> lol
[15:33] <juxta> I was just wondering about that too
[15:33] <BrainDamage> audio dead
[15:33] <sbasuita> but is the logo in the flash clienit
[15:33] <fsphil> it's part of the stream
[15:33] <fsphil> back
[15:33] <eroomde> yup
[15:33] <eroomde> gone again
[15:33] <Elwell> right outtahere
[15:33] <BrainDamage> here too
[15:33] <eroomde> nope back
[15:34] <hibby> fsphil: i heard the bell this time
[15:34] <fsphil> ah not just me lol
[15:34] <Lunar_Lander> and a D in the picture
[15:34] <hibby> oh yeah
[15:36] <Lunar_Lander> press to MECO
[15:36] <SamSilver> did somthing fall off there?
[15:36] <Lunar_Lander> 12000 mph
[15:37] <juxta> the speed looks awesome, the earth appears to be rotating so quickly
[15:37] <Lunar_Lander> SamSilver someone else spotted it also
[15:37] <Lunar_Lander> seemed to be normal
[15:37] <Lunar_Lander> standby for MECO
[15:37] <Lunar_Lander> MECO
[15:38] <SamSilver> ice maybe
[15:38] <eroomde> Randomskk: do you recall the project status webpage for displaying on big screens that i showed you some months ago?
[15:38] <Lunar_Lander> OMS-1 not req'd
[15:38] <Zuph> Beautiful
[15:39] <SamSilver> what happens to the legs that were holding the ext tank?
[15:39] <SpeedEvil> Burn up along with the tank
[15:39] <SpeedEvil> The bit that flew away was the shuttle
[15:39] <juxta> SpeedEvil, the external tank is re-used, isnt it?
[15:39] <SpeedEvil> no
[15:40] <fsphil> bbc coverage is rubbish as usual
[15:40] <SpeedEvil> Only the SRBs
[15:40] <eroomde> it collapses to pieces under q then burns up, i beleive
[15:40] <juxta> oh, right
[15:40] <Zuph> http://robert.accettura.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/20090524_shuttle_mounting_point.jpg
[15:41] <Randomskk> eroomde: maybe?
[15:41] <Randomskk> I've seen a lot of project status webpages recently
[15:41] <eroomde> wondering if you had the link
[15:41] <Dan-K2VOL> Onward humans, stumble onward.
[15:41] <Randomskk> for displaying on big screens
[15:41] <Randomskk> I can't remember it but it may be in my IRC logs if you said it on IRC
[15:41] <eroomde> cba
[15:42] <eroomde> found it
[15:42] <eroomde> http://www.panic.com/blog/2010/03/the-panic-status-board/
[15:43] <Randomskk> my current place of work has one
[15:43] <hibby> cnn are getting quite proud
[15:43] <Randomskk> with website hits, servers uptime, recent tweets, some other metrics
[15:43] <hibby> "When they were chanting usa, usa, it made me really just want to cry"
[15:43] <Randomskk> it doesn't (yet) hook into the CI server though :P
[15:45] <fsphil> anyone know how far around the planet the shuttle is atm?
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[15:46] <eroomde> Randomskk: where are you working?
[15:46] <hibby> fsphil: n2yo might tell you
[15:47] <Randomskk> eroomde: startup in guildford. http://mydrivesolutions.com/
[15:47] <eroomde> similar to the previous now defunct company?
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[15:47] <Randomskk> surprisingly so
[15:48] <fsphil> does too hibby
[15:48] <fsphil> ta
[15:48] <fsphil> already over europe
[15:48] <fsphil> didn't receive any signal that time
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[15:52] <fsphil> worth a try
[15:53] <SamSilver> bbl
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[16:02] <griffonbot> Received email: David Akerman "Re: [UKHAS] CLOUD1 Launch on Sunday"
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[17:40] <cuddykid> wow, just watched the vid of atlantis blast off - incredible
[17:46] <Lunar_Lander> cool
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[17:57] <fsphil> was a neat launch
[17:57] <jcoxon> evening all
[17:57] <fsphil> g'day jc
[17:57] <gb73d> hi balloonistas
[17:57] <jcoxon> my current setup of picoatlasIII just doesn't work well enough
[17:58] <fsphil> battery?
[17:58] <jcoxon> well i basically had the ublox in a power down mode
[17:58] <fsphil> I've discovered a little flaw with my lipo charger -- it lets the battery drain even if their is an external voltage
[17:59] <jcoxon> but that still means 20mA
[17:59] <jcoxon> fsphil, max1555 based?
[17:59] <fsphil> it's something else...
[17:59] <cuddykid> ouch £31 for a pcb :O
[18:00] <fsphil> MCP73831
[18:00] <jcoxon> oh right
[18:00] <fsphil> Been watching it for a few days, and it goes through a charge/discharge cycle
[18:00] <jcoxon> basically i think i'm going to have to add a transistor to completely turn off the gps
[18:00] <fsphil> rather than using the solar/mains power when available
[18:00] <fsphil> yea that's my plan
[18:00] <fsphil> or a regular that has an EN pin
[18:01] <jcoxon> the gpsbee doesn't have a backup battery
[18:01] <jcoxon> guess i could add one
[18:01] <jcoxon> or even tag it to the main lipo
[18:04] <fsphil> the little cell batteries are very light
[18:04] <fsphil> though the mounting hardware might not be
[18:05] <fsphil> ooor.. how long would a capacitor last?
[18:07] <Lunar_Lander> depends on the capacitance
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[18:14] <cuddykid> fsphil: time constant -> RC
[18:16] <fsphil> aah
[18:16] <fsphil> probably end up being heavier
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[18:35] Action: hibby gets back from the shops sweating
[18:35] <Dan-K2VOL> heh hibby, it is damp out these days
[18:35] Action: Upu suspects hibby isn't in the UK
[18:36] <Upu> evening
[18:37] <hibby> afternoon
[18:37] <fsphil> morning
[18:37] <fsphil> (somewhere)
[18:37] <Upu> indeed
[18:37] <fsphil> oook there's that windows ding again .. and I'm *not* watching the nasa stream
[18:37] <Dan-K2VOL> and slightly post aphelion, if you're hangin out in solar orbit
[18:41] <jcoxon> fsphil, i've disconnected the gps and now my setup is slowly recovering
[18:41] <jcoxon> charging from solar near to a light
[18:42] <fsphil> how can you tell?
[18:42] <jcoxon> cause its txing
[18:42] <fsphil> aah -- it had stopped?
[18:42] <jcoxon> and i've rigged it to measure the voltage of the battery
[18:42] <jcoxon> oh yes
[18:42] <jcoxon> it had run the battery right down
[18:44] <fsphil> what's the voltage of the solar cells during charging?
[18:44] <jcoxon> about 6v
[18:44] <fsphil> better than I expected
[18:44] <jcoxon> but its currently under artifical light
[18:44] <jcoxon> quite near
[18:45] <jcoxon> whether that represents actual light is a differnet matter
[18:46] <jcoxon> 85mAh might just be too little
[18:48] <jcoxon> i've basically got a low power mode
[18:48] <jcoxon> which acts as a beacon
[18:49] <jcoxon> no postion but does send sensor data
[18:49] <jcoxon> and that only draws a tiny amount of current so the cell is able to charge up
[18:50] <Dan-K2VOL> cool jcoxon
[18:51] <Lunar_Lander> hi Dan-K2VOL jcoxon
[18:52] <jcoxon> the difficulty is getting the balance
[18:52] <jcoxon> i think its vital i add a backup battery to the gps
[18:53] Action: SpeedEvil still awaits his 600W of solar cells.
[18:53] <Lunar_Lander> cuddykid how did you get radiometrix to send you a ntx2?
[18:53] <Lunar_Lander> I emailed them in the same matter
[18:53] <Lunar_Lander> and never even got an answer
[18:54] <cuddykid> SpeedEvil: I'm still awaiting mine too!
[18:54] <cuddykid> Lunar_lander: emailed them about a year ago
[18:55] <Lunar_Lander> ah
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[18:55] <cuddykid> it was the fact that i was a student that did it i think
[18:55] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[18:55] <Lunar_Lander> I am one as well
[18:55] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[18:55] <cuddykid> they wanted to go through a school, but in the end they gave it without going through school
[18:55] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[18:56] <cuddykid> cool, they'll hopefully send you one :)
[18:56] <Lunar_Lander> well
[18:56] <Lunar_Lander> now I already bought one with the help of mattltm
[18:56] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[18:56] <cuddykid> :)
[18:56] <Lunar_Lander> and the other people?
[18:56] <Lunar_Lander> like solarbotics
[18:56] <cuddykid> yeah, just by emailing
[18:56] <Lunar_Lander> was it easy to get in touch with them?
[18:56] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[18:56] <cuddykid> urm, fairly easy
[18:57] <cuddykid> some take a couple of days to respond
[18:57] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[18:57] <mattltm> Hello :)
[18:57] <Lunar_Lander> hi mattltm :)
[18:57] <cuddykid> some have been instant! - dpie we're very very good, thoroughly recommend getting lassen iQ from them
[18:57] <cuddykid> their CEO - John Vaines is a top guy
[18:58] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[18:58] <Lunar_Lander> does seedstudio send stuff?
[18:59] <fsphil-eee> nah, they keep it all to themselves :)
[19:00] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[19:00] <Lunar_Lander> I once asked at SFE
[19:00] <Lunar_Lander> they said that their boss once made a HAB and lost it
[19:00] <Lunar_Lander> and they think my idea is cool
[19:00] <Lunar_Lander> but they get so many proposals that they don't sponsor
[19:03] <cuddykid> yeah, the positive response rate for all the companies I've emailed is about 1 in 5/ 1 in 6
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[19:05] <jcoxon> bbl
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[19:05] <Lunar_Lander> yea cuddykid
[19:05] <cuddykid> currently trying to get big sponsorship for the project, tried Virgin Galactic but no luck
[19:07] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[19:12] <Lunar_Lander> it's sad that the response is so poor
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[19:16] <fsphil-eee> for sponsorship?
[19:16] <cuddykid> fsphil-eee: yeah
[19:16] <cuddykid> why the eee on your name fsphil-eee?!?
[19:16] <Lunar_Lander> yeah fsphil
[19:16] <fsphil-eee> I can sort of understand that - it's not a huge benefit to a company
[19:16] Action: fsphil-eee is on an eeepc
[19:17] <cuddykid> ooooh, got ya
[19:17] <hibby> never would have guessed
[19:17] <cuddykid> yeah, must be quite a drain on the company - especially in these times
[19:18] Action: fsphil-eee has a small radio station setup in the corner of the room -- ft817 + eeepc
[19:19] <hibby> fsphil-eee: lovely :)
[19:21] <Lunar_Lander> we had eees in the physics lab
[19:21] <Lunar_Lander> strange machines
[19:21] <fsphil-eee> not actually managed a contact yet...
[19:21] <Lunar_Lander> only two front USB
[19:21] <Lunar_Lander> and a SD slot
[19:21] <Lunar_Lander> no optical drive
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[19:31] <mixio> Lunar_Lander
[19:31] <Lunar_Lander> hey mixio
[19:31] <mixio> http://slaros.blogspot.com/
[19:31] <mixio> :)
[19:32] <Lunar_Lander> yeah :)
[19:32] <Lunar_Lander> did you get my E-Mail?
[19:32] <Lunar_Lander> on your live.com account
[19:32] <mixio> email?
[19:32] <mixio> eee
[19:32] <mixio> no?
[19:32] <mixio> m1x10xf@gmail.com
[19:33] <Lunar_Lander> one sec
[19:35] <Lunar_Lander> xf?
[19:35] <mixio> y
[19:35] <Lunar_Lander> OK
[19:35] <Lunar_Lander> you have mail
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[19:36] <mixio> i will change it right away
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[19:38] <Lunar_Lander> :) thx
[19:45] <Lunar_Lander> but
[19:45] <Lunar_Lander> cool that you got the letter ;)
[19:45] <Lunar_Lander> and that you like the patch
[19:45] <Lunar_Lander> mixio
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[20:09] <jcoxon> is spacenear.us down?
[20:09] <fsphil-eee> looks like
[20:10] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/spacenear.us
[20:10] <jcoxon> might be worth getting cloud1 onto habitat
[20:10] <hibby> I had a bot that did that
[20:10] <hibby> it was a case of !down spacenear.us and it would say
[20:10] <hibby> very useful
[20:16] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[20:39] <jcoxon> fsphil-eee, trying out the transistor control of gps power
[20:41] <hibby> ooh, exciting
[20:41] <hibby> how's that wired together?
[20:42] <jcoxon> just put a p2n2222 on the ground line of the GPS
[20:43] <jcoxon> haven't fitted a backup battery yet to the gps so its not going to be particularly efficient
[20:43] <fsphil-eee> brilliant
[20:43] <mixio> ping Lunar_Lander
[20:43] <hibby> cool. uC controlled power on/off? Is it staying hot so you don't need total relocation?
[20:43] <jcoxon> hibby, in its current state it'll be a cold start
[20:43] <Lunar_Lander> pong mixio
[20:43] <jcoxon> but i intend to add a backup battery
[20:43] <jcoxon> to keep it warm
[20:44] <hibby> cool
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[20:57] <Upu> Considered using a Inventek chip jcoxon ?
[20:57] <Laurenceb_> http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/videogallery/index.html?media_id=100262181
[20:58] <Laurenceb_> heh its Randy Thompson XD
[20:58] <Laurenceb_> - last
[20:58] <jcoxon> Upu, certainly have
[20:58] <jcoxon> however picoatlas is built from spare parts
[20:58] <Upu> ok
[20:59] <Upu> its really small and has a battery option and I don't have the details but it pulls very very low current in "standby"
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[21:00] <Upu> Current (tracking) 25 mA (avg.)
[21:00] <Upu> VBAT current (GPS engine
[21:00] <Upu> turned off)
[21:00] <Upu> 10 ¼A
[21:01] <Laurenceb_> nice, what gps?
[21:01] <Upu> A hot start will be fully functional up to 2 hours from the last fix. It uses ephemeris, almanac, position, time
[21:01] <Upu> RTC data stored in the SRAM. If the last fix was less than 2 hours after powering down the engine, the TTFF
[21:01] <Upu> be one second or less when the GPS engine is turned back on in an open sky environment. An application
[21:01] <Upu> requiring location information every minute will save 98% on power by turning off the GPS engine between
[21:01] <Upu> acquisitions at an update rate of 1 Hz.
[21:01] <jcoxon> its a sirfIII
[21:01] <daveake> Even 25mA is 100mA less than my old found-in-a-box Jupiter 11 !
[21:01] <jcoxon> but with a high alt firmware
[21:01] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:inventek-ism300
[21:02] <Upu> the surface mount is a bit of a bitch but they are cheap
[21:02] <Upu> unless customs catch up with you
[21:03] <Upu> £23 each I think
[21:03] <Laurenceb_> aha sirf3
[21:03] <Upu> is that bad ?
[21:03] <Laurenceb_> altitude limit
[21:03] <Laurenceb_> and poor dynamic performance
[21:04] <Upu> no these are fixed
[21:04] <Upu> ceiling 135,000 fee
[21:04] <Upu> t
[21:04] <Upu> firmware is set to max alt of ceiling 135,000 feet
[21:04] <Upu> is the dynamic performane an issue for balloon apps ?
[21:05] <Upu> performance
[21:06] <Upu> I'm interested to know as I'm using one in my payload :)
[21:07] <jcoxon> it'll be fine
[21:07] <jcoxon> wb8elk uses them very often
[21:07] <Upu> I'm not exactly UAVing
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[21:22] <WillDuckworth> jcoxon - 2 things, is that a custom firmware? also, gumstix - pain in the proverbial, what's your successful build environment?
[21:48] <Lunar_Lander> gn8
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[23:02] <jcoxon> time for a bit of late night hab hacking
[23:03] <fsphil-eee> the best kind surly :)
[23:03] <jcoxon> oh yes
[23:03] <jcoxon> lipo fully charged...
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[23:06] <griffonbot> Received email: =?utf-8?B?Q2hyaXMgSGVtYnJvdw==?= "Re: [UKHAS] Re: CLOUD1 Launch on Sunday -- Fwd: [CGC-News] Red Arrow
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[23:11] <Upu> you launching jcoxon ?
[23:12] <griffonbot> Received email: David Akerman "Re: [UKHAS] Re: CLOUD1 Launch on Sunday -- Fwd: [CGC-News] Red Arrow
[23:12] <jcoxon> Upu, not this weekend
[23:12] <jcoxon> this project needs more work
[23:13] <Upu> oh ok
[23:13] <Upu> sorry misread
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[23:13] <Upu> hacking != tracking
[23:13] <jcoxon> am working on picoatlas3 right now
[23:13] <jcoxon> watching the GPS munch through the battery
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[00:00] --- Sat Jul 9 2011