highaltitude.log.20110701

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[01:28] <natrium42> Darkside: sup?
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[01:46] <Darkside> natrium42: there is a veru good
[01:46] <Darkside> argh
[01:46] <Darkside> nvm
[01:46] <Darkside> will talk later
[01:46] <natrium42> :D
[01:46] Action: natrium42 is travelling
[01:47] <SpeedEvil> :)
[01:47] <SpeedEvil> How many balloons?
[01:47] <natrium42> 99 red balloons
[01:48] Action: SpeedEvil watches the jetfighters.
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[02:58] Action: SpeedEvil ponders a central dried air line over his house and gardens.
[03:10] <kristianpaul> food gardens?
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[04:54] <griffonbot> @LVL1WhiteStar: Worked hard to redesign sat message queuing code. Flowchart time! #UKHAS #arhab http://t.co/gMsG9RR http://t.co/qeaIPEN [http://twitter.com/LVL1WhiteStar/status/86658950602309632]
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[06:26] <fsphil> sweet Darkside!
[06:27] <Darkside> >_>
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[06:45] <fsphil> Darkside, are you still coming to do the DAB radio stuff?
[06:45] <Upu> morning
[06:45] <Upu> ISS must be over head :)
[06:46] <fsphil> morning Upu
[06:46] <Upu> I hear some modem noise
[06:46] <fsphil> oh I left the radio on the local APRS freq.
[06:46] <Darkside> fsphil: yeah
[06:46] <Upu> oh ok
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[06:47] <Upu> did you decode anything ?
[06:47] <Upu> you can have it back btw
[06:47] <fsphil> didn't try, was curious how much activity there was - quite a lot it turns out
[06:47] <Upu> yeah seems like it
[06:48] <RocketBoy> does anyone know if bill got his palyload back? did it land in a tree?
[06:49] <Upu> morning
[06:49] <Upu> I've not heard
[06:50] <fsphil> it looked pretty certain to be in that tree
[06:50] <fsphil> hopefully an old photo, the tree might not even be there anymore
[06:50] <Darkside> mm, i'll be in the UK for a few months probably
[06:50] <Darkside> need to come along to a launch :-)
[06:54] <SpeedEvil> kristianpaul: I'm pondering dried air lines, to make condensation inside glazed solar panels a non issue.
[06:54] <SpeedEvil> ~1l/day of bone dry air simplifies things lots.
[06:57] <RocketBoy> Darkside: Let me know when your hear your quite welcome to come along to any I do from the EARS site
[06:57] <fsphil> Darkside, will you be about at the start of October? The UKHAS conference is on then
[06:58] <Darkside> fsphil: likely
[06:58] <Darkside> that'd be fun to come to :-)
[06:58] <Darkside> australian rep at the UKHAS conference :-)
[06:58] <fsphil> I'm debating going too
[06:59] <fsphil> just a quick flight away
[06:59] <fsphil> (and a slow train journey, and a long walk) :)
[06:59] <Darkside> mm
[06:59] <Darkside> oh yeah, what phone networks are around in teh UK?
[06:59] <Darkside> and on what frequencies
[06:59] <Darkside> i'm probably goign to have to get a new phone...
[07:00] <Upu> you get a prepaid for £35 with £10 of credit
[07:00] <Darkside> i'm more concerned with data
[07:01] <Upu> you get can PAYG dongles
[07:01] <Darkside> well, i have a 3g dongle already
[07:01] <Darkside> does 900/2100MHz UMTS
[07:01] <Upu> probably work
[07:01] <Darkside> hopefully UK has widespread 2100MHz UMTs?
[07:01] <Upu> my wife got one of thse http://europe.nokia.com/find-products/devices/nokia-c1-01 £25 battery lasts 2 weeks
[07:02] <Darkside> what networks are there, and what frequencies to they have UMTS on?
[07:02] <Darkside> thats what i'm maily interested in
[07:02] <Darkside> and can i buy a sim card without being a UK citizen
[07:02] <Upu> http://www.prattfamily.demon.co.uk/mikep/frequency.htm
[07:02] <fsphil> SIM are easy to get
[07:02] <fsphil> +s
[07:02] <Darkside> yeah thats just GSM
[07:02] <Darkside> oh
[07:02] <Darkside> wait
[07:03] <SpeedEvil> Darkside: yes
[07:03] <Darkside> ok, its mostly 2100MHz UMTS
[07:03] <SpeedEvil> Darkside: Walk into any mobile phone shop.
[07:03] <Darkside> and some 1900MHz...
[07:03] <SpeedEvil> Darkside: Or supermarket
[07:03] <fsphil> 900 and 1800 are used
[07:03] <Darkside> hmm ok
[07:03] <SpeedEvil> How much data?
[07:03] <Upu> or in bradford any "unlock while U wait" cafe :)
[07:03] <fsphil> haha
[07:04] <SpeedEvil> For example t-mobile UK gives 500M/month for 6 months, for 6 pounds with PAYG
[07:04] <Darkside> hmm ok
[07:04] <Upu> three is probably best for data
[07:04] <SpeedEvil> three only uses 3G
[07:04] <SpeedEvil> So you can't fallback to 2g where there is dodgy signal.
[07:05] <fsphil> I think that's changed
[07:05] <SpeedEvil> Also - three requires a contract, and I object to the better rates they give to ipads.
[07:05] <Darkside> hmm
[07:06] <Darkside> i'm wondering - could i get someone to get me a sim card and mail it to me?
[07:06] <fsphil> eek, take that back: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/11/08/3uk_orange_roaming/
[07:06] <Darkside> so when i get into the country i can immediately switch SIM cards and get on the net
[07:06] <Darkside> or is free wifi prevalent?
[07:06] Action: SpeedEvil would - but getting to the postoffice is tricky.
[07:07] <SpeedEvil> Darkside: It's not reliable.
[07:07] <fsphil> II should have an O2 SIM somewhere, I'll see if I can dig it out
[07:09] <SpeedEvil> Check it's not timed out. It's annoying they do that. :/
[07:09] <fsphil> urg, the O2 pay and go sim only gives 500MB free data
[07:09] <fsphil> per month per £10 topup
[07:10] <fsphil> aaah I didn't know they had a best before date
[07:10] <SpeedEvil> There seem to be no economic PAYG with >500M/mo
[07:10] <fsphil> it's probably too old
[07:10] <Darkside> ho[pefully i'll be able to use uni internet at bath
[07:10] <Darkside> well, i shoul dbe able to, just not sure how much i'll get
[07:10] <Darkside> i've gottan far too used to >2GB 3G data per month, and heaps of ADSL net quota
[07:10] <SpeedEvil> How long're you here?
[07:11] <Darkside> possibly a few months
[07:11] <SpeedEvil> t-mobile has an advantage that the internet doesn't stop working, and you don't get charged more if you go over quota.
[07:11] <SpeedEvil> It just goes slower, and streaming and downloads stop working.
[07:11] <SpeedEvil> 3 and o2 have hideous overage rates.
[07:12] <fsphil> I've just ordered some free sims from O2
[07:12] <fsphil> who knows how long they'll take to get here mind :)
[07:12] <Darkside> hmm, and they all seem to have 2100MHz UMTS
[07:12] <SpeedEvil> They tend to be prompt.
[07:12] <Darkside> which'd work
[07:12] <fsphil> if they get here quickly enough I'll fire one down to you Darkside
[07:13] <Darkside> awesome
[07:13] <fsphil> it'll need topped up when you get here, £10 will give you some free sms and the 500mb data
[07:13] <Darkside> cool
[07:14] <fsphil> of to work I go.. meh
[07:31] <eroomde> morning all
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[08:56] <cuddykid> morning eroomde
[08:57] <cuddykid> oooo.. fsphil, that reminds me, need to get sim sorted urgently!
[09:00] <Upu> found a nice circuit simulator ltspice
[09:00] <Upu> http://www.linear.com/
[09:01] <Upu> no idea how to us it
[09:01] <cuddykid> time to check predictions - hope they're still good
[09:01] <griffonbot> Received email: Adam Cudworth "[UKHAS] Re: HABE1 Launch 02/07/11 @ 14:00 BST"
[09:03] <cuddykid> yep, 1.5km away :)
[09:06] <griffonbot> Received email: John Graham-Cumming "Re: [UKHAS] Re: HABE1 Launch 02/07/11 @ 14:00 BST"
[09:08] <griffonbot> Received email: Adam Cudworth "[UKHAS] Re: HABE1 Launch 02/07/11 @ 14:00 BST"
[09:11] <fsphil> almost there cuddykid :)
[09:12] <cuddykid> almost :) .. still a lot to do today though
[09:12] <cuddykid> need to try and plan for all eventualities!
[09:12] <cuddykid> also, keep remembering stuff I haven't done (like the sim card)
[09:12] <fsphil> make sure them batteries are secure
[09:13] <cuddykid> fortunately I have a few lying around from the days of testing different signal strengths
[09:13] <cuddykid> yeah, going to tape them down in their cut out little slot
[09:39] <SpeedEvil> Darkside: http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/368383/40gb-of-data-that-costs-the-same-as-a-house
[09:39] <SpeedEvil> Oh - he'll be in bed
[09:42] <fsphil> madness
[09:46] <cuddykid> just was reading that, then roaming charges came on the news!
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[09:55] <NigelMoby> Meep
[09:56] <fsphil> mmmm roadrunner
[10:00] <NigelMoby> Lol hey Phil
[10:01] <cuddykid> do I have to call the nearest aerodrome before launch? Doesn't say I have to on notam
[10:01] <Randomskk> are you sure?
[10:01] <Randomskk> the notams usually specify that you must give notice of launch
[10:02] <cuddykid> yep
[10:02] <cuddykid> got it in front of me, and no mention
[10:02] <cuddykid> just says mobile must be monitored in launch period and only 1 flight
[10:02] <cuddykid> and operator must have permission in possession at all times during flight
[10:04] <NigelMoby> It would be wise to call the atc b4 launch
[10:04] <cuddykid> btw, Randomskk, are you able to add internal & external temp readings to my payload reading on the spacenear tracker?
[10:04] <cuddykid> will call them :)
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[10:27] <fsphil> Mine always asks me to call ATC in Scotland
[10:27] <fsphil> 12 hours before launch
[10:28] <fsphil> I think it's mostly for trans-atlantic flights
[10:29] <Randomskk> I'd definitely give them a ring beforehand
[10:31] <cuddykid> Yeah, rang my local airport and they've given me the number of ATC, said it should be fine but just call to double check
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[10:32] <cuddykid> right, still got to get: latex gloves, sim and aluminium rings (connect chute to payload)
[10:33] <russss> fsphil: is that Shanwick?
[10:33] <russss> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Shanwick_Map.PNG
[10:37] <fsphil> Prestwick Centre
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[10:42] <cuddykid> just got the lithiums out - wow, they are light
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[10:51] <Upu> cuddykid
[10:52] <Upu> whas your payload called
[10:52] <cuddykid> habe 1
[10:52] <Upu> ofc
[10:52] <Upu> what frequency
[10:52] <cuddykid> 434.075
[10:52] <cuddykid> usually comes out more .071 though lol
[10:53] <Upu> ok noise blanker on then :) I'm away but fsphil has full remote access to my rig
[10:53] <fsphil> they're never exact :)
[10:53] <Upu> good luck
[10:53] <cuddykid> ahh, cool Upu, thanks! :)
[10:53] <cuddykid> starting the camera test now
[10:55] <cuddykid> anyone know where I can get some split rings (key rings)
[10:57] <fsphil> I think I seen them in Homebase
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[10:57] <fsphil> but probably cost 5x what they should
[10:57] <cuddykid> just had a look on their website but couldn't see any
[10:57] <cuddykid> indeed!
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[11:02] <Upu> cuddykid
[11:02] <Upu> you seriously transmitting at 600 baud ?
[11:02] <cuddykid> nooo, 50
[11:02] <Upu> uh
[11:02] <cuddykid> where did you get 600 from?!
[11:02] <Upu> sorry
[11:02] <Upu> 600 shift
[11:02] <Upu> I r stoopidz
[11:02] <cuddykid> probably more like 800hz shift lol
[11:03] <cuddykid> don't think the resistor values were spot on!
[11:04] <fsphil> I'm trying 1200 baud on a future flight :p
[11:04] <cuddykid> wow!
[11:04] <fsphil> though not as the primary beacon
[11:04] <cuddykid> I bet the baud could be increased as the range for most flights is 100s of km
[11:04] <cuddykid> could easily bring the range down to about 70km - but then I suppose fewer people will be able to listen in
[11:04] <fsphil> indeedy
[11:05] <fsphil> some of the packets on my last flight where only received by distant stations, so it's definitely helpful
[11:05] <cuddykid> yeah
[11:06] <fsphil> I'll be flying 1200 baud just to see how far it can work - I think M0DTS (~300km away) might receive it, but not much further than that
[11:07] <cuddykid> indeed
[11:07] <Upu> I couldn't get 600 baud out of it stable
[11:07] <cuddykid> hmm, called homebase and they don't have the rings
[11:07] <Upu> needs more error correction
[11:07] <cuddykid> got a few lying about the house but not sure whether they are alu or not
[11:08] <SpeedEvil> See if magnetic
[11:08] <cuddykid> ahh, clever!
[11:08] <cuddykid> cheers :)
[11:10] <fsphil> Upu, needs to be done with interrupts
[11:10] <Upu> ok
[11:10] <fsphil> timing in software at that baud rate is pretty dicey
[11:10] <Upu> out of my programming league
[11:10] <Upu> timing at 50 doesn't work right
[11:11] <Upu> you have to fudge it
[11:11] <fsphil> fldigi is pretty forgiving
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[11:11] <Upu> delayMicroseconds(20150);
[11:11] <Upu> doesn't work
[11:11] <Upu> do 10000 then another 10150 does
[11:12] <fsphil> aah it's a rounding thing .. "Currently, the largest value that will produce an accurate delay is 16383"
[11:13] <Upu> ah ok
[11:13] <Upu> I thought it couldn't add up properly
[11:16] <fsphil> I think the biggest limitation to 1200 baud is fldigi itself -- it's rtty modem doesn't like going fast
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[11:27] <cuddykid> right, the keyring is not magnetic, so that should mean it's aluminium ? (and therefore good for use?)
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[11:31] <eroomde> cuddykid: sorry for coming in late - what's this for?
[11:32] <SpeedEvil> cuddykid: you mean a split ring keychain thing?
[11:32] <SpeedEvil> cuddykid: they are invariably SS
[11:42] <cuddykid> eroomde / SpeedEvil : yeah
[11:43] <cuddykid> a key ring (split ring) - found one lying around and it's not magnetic so hopefully SS then
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[12:05] <SamSilver> bbl
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[12:16] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[12:16] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[12:16] <Lunar_Lander> xD there just was a hilarious story on BFBS
[12:17] <Lunar_Lander> the guy said that he bought walkie-talkies for his kids and he said to his daughter: "You push the button, say something and then you say "Over""
[12:17] <Lunar_Lander> and she pressed it and said: "OVER!"
[12:17] <Lunar_Lander> and he: "No no no, it doesn't work that way, you'd need to say something first and then say over"
[12:17] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[12:28] <Lunar_Lander> hi mixio mattltm NigeyS
[12:35] <futurity> Hi, is there a launch today?
[12:43] <fsphil> tomorrow hopefully futurity, cuddykid's habe1
[12:43] <cuddykid> just got off the phone with the local newspaper, they're really interested and coming to cover it :)
[12:44] <cuddykid> pressures on now! lol
[12:44] <fsphil> brave move :)
[12:44] <cuddykid> can't have any errors now! eeek
[12:44] <Lunar_Lander> hi cuddykid fsphil
[12:44] <cuddykid> Hi Lunar
[12:45] <Lunar_Lander> it'll go well
[12:45] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[12:46] <cuddykid> hopefully :)
[12:46] <griffonbot> @adamcudworth: Press are covering tomorrows #HABE1 launch - Preflight checks underway and last bits going to be bought! #UKHAS [http://twitter.com/adamcudworth/status/86777601175207936]
[12:46] <fsphil> remember to bring duct tape, cable ties and a pair of snippers :)
[12:46] <fsphil> I forgot the cable ties last time
[12:47] <cuddykid> yep, got a big bag of them! :)
[12:58] <eroomde> ah press!
[12:58] <eroomde> i hope the weather works out for you
[12:58] <eroomde> when external people like the press come for launches, you can often feel pressure to launch anyway, even if you would normally perhaps scrub, for whatever reason
[12:59] <eroomde> don't do this
[12:59] <eroomde> it's never worth it. they're not important compared to being happy that the flight will be successful
[12:59] <eroomde> and safe
[12:59] <eroomde> sermon over. but we've certainly been there before!
[13:00] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[13:00] <Lunar_Lander> hi eroomde
[13:01] <eroomde> yo
[13:01] <russss> eroomde: heh
[13:01] <russss> case in point, Apollo 12
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[13:02] <Lunar_Lander> and hi russss
[13:02] <russss> hey
[13:02] <eroomde> russss: interesting - what did they rush on apollo 12?
[13:03] <russss> they basically launched in a thunderstorm!
[13:03] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[13:03] <russss> and one of the main pressures was because Nixon was watching
[13:03] <russss> so they didn't want to scrub
[13:03] <eroomde> gosh
[13:03] <eroomde> that happened to us with nova 13
[13:04] <eroomde> we had a bunch of schools kids and others
[13:04] <russss> and it ended up with the whole lightning strike thing, which was a pretty lucky break.
[13:04] <eroomde> this was the result of nova 13
[13:04] <eroomde> http://www.flickr.com/photos/cuspaceflight/3863616068/in/set-72157622038400075/
[13:05] <Lunar_Lander> is that from lightning or the sea water?
[13:05] <eroomde> oh, sea water
[13:05] <eroomde> lighting would be cool
[13:05] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[13:05] <eroomde> i do very much want to launch a hab into a thunderstorm
[13:05] <fsphil> I'd love to see that too
[13:06] <eroomde> the only problem (well, i'm sure not the only one) is that thundersotrms are actually really small
[13:06] <fsphil> though wouldn't be fond of standing outside with a yagi to track it :)
[13:06] <eroomde> about say 500m across
[13:06] <eroomde> and trying to aim for one is difficult
[13:06] <fsphil> I wonder if the winds are such that the storm would 'capture' the balloon?
[13:07] <eroomde> yes i had an interesting chat with a storm dynamics bloke about that
[13:07] <eroomde> i think there's a lot of circulation in front of the storm
[13:07] <eroomde> the updrafts and so on
[13:07] <eroomde> but not that much side-to-side
[13:07] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[13:07] <eroomde> so i guess you'd have to plonk yourself in its path
[13:08] <eroomde> it'd be fascinating to log the ascent rates, including accelerations
[13:08] <eroomde> see what the circulations are like in the storm itself
[13:08] <eroomde> and the pictures of a big cumulonimbus (casting a ncie shadow) from above would be pretty sweet
[13:09] <eroomde> Dan has done some research on lightning-proofing too, which would be fun to work in
[13:09] <fsphil> planes that fly through a storm trigger lightning- would the payload be big enough to do the same?
[13:09] <eroomde> i wonder if you were to release a spool of 500m of thin copper wire, you could 'short' a storm cloud and cause lightning
[13:10] <eroomde> or maybe just a spark-plug just to provide an initial few ions?
[13:10] <fsphil> ooh
[13:10] <fsphil> fire it at regular times, see if the storm responds
[13:10] <eroomde> yeah!
[13:10] <Zuph> Heh, dual purpose: Strobe light.
[13:11] <eroomde> measure the potential field strength aswell
[13:11] <fsphil> more code lightning
[13:11] <eroomde> infact, can you do that?
[13:11] <fsphil> morse
[13:11] <eroomde> my electromagnetics was never too hot
[13:11] <eroomde> haha!
[13:11] <cuddykid> eroomde: good point, I won't!
[13:11] <eroomde> that would be one hell of an amateur radio amplifier
[13:11] <eroomde> i wonder if you'd need an NOV
[13:11] <Zuph> Using lightning as a spark-gap transmitter? :-p
[13:11] <eroomde> yes!
[13:11] <fsphil> lol
[13:12] <Zuph> Marconi would be proud.
[13:13] <fsphil> the stations that use rockets to trigger lightning have a way to measuring when lightning is most likely
[13:13] <Lunar_Lander> true
[13:13] <Lunar_Lander> they observe the electric field
[13:14] <fsphil> my vertical antenna had a pretty measurable voltage when storms approach
[13:14] <eroomde> fsphil: but they have a ground
[13:14] <fsphil> though it didn't seem to drop after a lightning flash
[13:14] <fsphil> true
[13:14] <eroomde> the can measure the diff tween air and ground
[13:14] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil eroomde there was a series of balloon measurements in thunderstorms in the UK
[13:14] <Lunar_Lander> by Sir Simpson
[13:14] <fsphil> you'd need something more like a dipole
[13:15] <Lunar_Lander> do you want the two reports of his?
[13:15] <eroomde> yes please!
[13:15] <Lunar_Lander> one moment
[13:15] <fsphil> but then the variation probably would be quite small
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[13:17] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil do you want the two reports too?
[13:18] <fsphil> also the measuring circuit would probably get fried after the first strike :)
[13:18] <fsphil> please do Lunar_Lander
[13:18] <Darkside> http://www.bath.ac.uk/elec-eng/invert/topcat.html
[13:18] <Darkside> AHA
[13:18] <Darkside> thats what i'll be workign on
[13:18] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil could you PM me your e-mail please?
[13:19] <Zuph> Darkside: Neat.
[13:23] <Lunar_Lander> eroomde just a moment
[13:23] <eroomde> thanks
[13:23] <Lunar_Lander> you're welcome
[13:23] <Lunar_Lander> 70%
[13:23] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[13:23] <Lunar_Lander> 80%
[13:23] <Lunar_Lander> 90%
[13:24] <Lunar_Lander> sent
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[13:27] <eroomde> QSL
[13:28] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[13:28] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[13:28] <NigeyS> hmm the register are doing another space plane thingy
[13:29] <NigeyS> LOHAN
[13:34] <Zuph> LOHAN? Is it powered by cocaine?
[13:34] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[13:34] <Lunar_Lander> hi NigeyS
[13:34] <NigeyS> lol brad
[13:34] <NigeyS> hey kev!
[13:34] <eroomde> roast bone marrow and parsely salad for dinner. OH YEAH
[13:34] <Lunar_Lander> NigeyS
[13:35] <Lunar_Lander> good appetite eroomde :)
[13:35] <Lunar_Lander> NigeyS I'll try Matt's way of wiring the NTX2 later
[13:35] <NigeyS> :)
[13:35] <Lunar_Lander> he wrote in his blog that you gave him the arduino code
[13:35] <NigeyS> ahh good stuff
[13:35] <Lunar_Lander> could you give me the code too, please?
[13:36] <NigeyS> https://github.com/nigeysuk/Picochu-1/
[13:36] <mattltm> Lunar_Lander: The code has evolved from Nigey's original. Do you want the code that go along with the version on my site?
[13:36] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[13:36] <Lunar_Lander> and thanks NigeyS
[13:37] <Zuph> eroomde: Sounds tasty.
[13:38] <eroomde> Zuph: legendarily nice
[13:38] <eroomde> and costs next to nothing
[13:40] <Zuph> Sounds very British :-p
[13:40] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[13:40] <Lunar_Lander> the guy on BFBS said that he had tea, chips and beans
[13:40] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[13:41] <eroomde> Zuph: i think marrow scares most british off
[13:41] <eroomde> but it's making a comeback
[13:41] <eroomde> it's certainly french country cooking
[13:41] <SpeedEvil> YMmmm. Gravy
[13:41] <Zuph> Ah ha
[13:42] <eroomde> with a sharply dressed parsely salad and salt, eaton on some sourdough toast, it's bliss
[13:42] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Jy3X6MgZ3I
[13:43] <Lunar_Lander> "Chaos in the anatomy lecture hall when the exam papers were handed out: everyone had to get his papers personally from the front desk. Begin of handout: 4:10 pm, planned beginning of exam: 4:15 pm, and 400 students"
[13:43] <eroomde> oh dear
[13:43] <eroomde> that wasn't thought through
[13:43] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[13:44] <Zuph> July 4th weekend in Kentucky means time for Southern food. I won't be eating anything this weekend that isn't fried, grilled, or suffixed with "Salad" involving lots of Mayonnaise.
[13:44] <eroomde> sounds like bliss
[13:45] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[13:46] <Zuph> There's probably a reason that almost everyone older than 50 in my family has either heart problems, diabetes, or both :-p
[13:46] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
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[13:51] <eroomde> right, time to visit the butchers to stock up
[13:51] <eroomde> see you later
[13:51] <eroomde> ha, 'stock' up
[13:51] <eroomde> lol
[13:52] <Dan-K2VOL> heh see ya ed
[13:52] <eroomde> i'll get me coat
[13:52] <Zuph> hah, enjoy dinner :-p
[13:52] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[13:52] <eroomde> willdo!
[13:52] <Lunar_Lander> ttyl eroomde
[13:52] <Lunar_Lander> hi Dan-K2VOL
[13:52] <eroomde> decided to nullify the cheapness of the marrowbones by serving them as a first course and beef wellington as main
[13:52] <Dan-K2VOL> hi Kevin
[13:53] <Zuph> eroomde: Fancy!
[13:53] <Lunar_Lander> mattltm NigeyS I think I got the rig put together
[13:54] <Zuph> Dan-K2VOL: How did the rest of the code stuff go last night?
[13:55] <Dan-K2VOL> great, distilled it all down to the pics in the tweet I posted to @LVL1WhiteStar
[13:57] <Dan-K2VOL> basically separated it into two main operations - managing a queue of all messages on the comm controller, and managing the external queue of one message in the sat modem
[13:58] <Zuph> Very nice!
[13:59] <Darkside> what is the UK WIA
[13:59] <Darkside> i.a. amateur license coordinator
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[14:00] <Darkside> nvm, ofcom
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[14:26] <griffonbot> Received email: Solar Balloonman "[UKHAS] Re: Could this take peroxide? Re: 'Solar Pillow'"
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[14:28] <Darkside> UK people: what providers have 900MHz UMTS in the UK
[14:28] <Darkside> and which should i go with
[14:32] <Randomskk> for cell phones?
[14:32] <Randomskk> well obviously, I guess
[14:32] <SpeedEvil> Darkside: Most of them except 3
[14:32] <SpeedEvil> Umm - actually
[14:33] <SpeedEvil> I vaguely remember it's one of orange or t-mobile
[14:34] <Randomskk> I think by and large all our operators run on the same frequencies, it's not quite as diverse a setup as the USA
[14:34] <Randomskk> also orange and t-mobile are the same company now SpeedEvil
[14:35] <Randomskk> can't your phone do 1800?
[14:35] <Darkside> nope
[14:35] <Randomskk> apparently O2 and Vodafone are both sure wins for 900
[14:35] <Darkside> in australia we mainly have 850, 900 and 2100MHZ UMTS
[14:35] <Darkside> 1800 and 1900 are only GSM
[14:35] <Randomskk> ah
[14:35] <Randomskk> what phone? may be easier to just get a cheap one here, they're like £20
[14:35] <Darkside> no, i'll get a phone i can use back here in australia
[14:35] <Darkside> hence the question about 900/2100UMTS
[14:36] <Darkside> because if i get a phone that can do that, and i can use it in the UK and in australia, that'd be best
[14:36] <Randomskk> pretty much any phone you buy here now will be tri band or more
[14:36] <Randomskk> apparently dual band should cover australia and UK anyway though
[14:37] <Darkside> pl
[14:37] <Darkside> ok
[14:37] <Darkside> now i need to find a prepaid data pack...
[14:37] <Randomskk> really any phone should work fine in both countries on any operator
[14:38] <Randomskk> that's also easy. you can literally buy them in the airport or high street shops
[14:38] <Randomskk> with cash
[14:39] <Darkside> ok
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[14:43] <SamSilver> afk
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[14:47] Nick change: ed____ -> eroomde
[14:47] <eroomde> change of plan, no marrowbones
[14:48] <eroomde> butcher let me down
[14:49] <Zuph> Damn
[14:50] <eroomde> roast chicken with 40 cloves of garlic instead
[14:50] <Randomskk> roast chicken is still pretty delicious
[14:50] <Randomskk> eroomde: so my new oven has a magical bread mode
[14:50] <Zuph> This is a fact.
[14:50] <eroomde> it's not fried (sorry Zuph) but it's just amazing - and very very easy.
[14:50] <Randomskk> it claims I can just put some dough in
[14:50] <Randomskk> and pres butan
[14:50] <eroomde> http://helengraves.co.uk/2010/02/chicken-with-40-cloves-of-garlic/
[14:50] <Randomskk> and time and temperature is entirely controlled by the oven
[14:50] <eroomde> Randomskk: hmm
[14:50] <Randomskk> and then bread comes out
[14:50] <eroomde> suspicious
[14:50] <Randomskk> I am super skeptical
[14:51] <Randomskk> it also has a magic automatic cake mode
[14:51] <Randomskk> same deal, but for cake
[14:51] <eroomde> dough is a living being
[14:51] <eroomde> you have to nurture it
[14:51] <eroomde> you can't just put a baby in a box, wait 18 years, and expect an adult to come out
[14:51] <eroomde> but that's exactly what they seem to be suggesting with this bread mode
[14:51] <Randomskk> indeed
[14:51] <Zuph> eroomde: In general, I think I'd prefer a good roast chicken to fried chicken, anyway.
[14:51] <eroomde> especially with 40 cloves of garlic
[14:51] <Zuph> eroomde: Dan-K2VOL actually has a plan for just such a baby box.
[14:51] <Randomskk> it's a nice oven in a lot of respects (though for some reason you have to click through setting the time of day to set the minute minder..)
[14:52] <Randomskk> but I am suspicious enough to try it
[14:52] <eroomde> is it a NEF?
[14:52] <Randomskk> so my "cooking for geeks" book has some bread related recipes
[14:52] <Randomskk> if NEF is a brand of oven, then no, it's a cannon
[14:52] <Darkside> oh wow, the bus service in bath looks good
[14:52] <Darkside> http://www.bathstudent.com/asset/news/6003/u18.pdf
[14:52] <Zuph> I suspect that it can make a passable loaf of generic white bread.
[14:52] <eroomde> Zuph: bread baking is one of my big hobbies
[14:53] <Randomskk> http://www.cannoncooking.co.uk/macro/product.d2w/report?catref=7&prref=4&picref=c60gpc&range=cpro&cpctry=uk in particular
[14:53] <eroomde> now that my main hobby has become my job, it may be that bread becomes my hobby
[14:53] <cuddykid> back from homebase - latex gloves and more duct tape bought
[14:53] <eroomde> see this kind of thing: sourdough + woodoven (my two favourite things after wine and women)
[14:53] <eroomde> http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/24123/don039s-woodfired-sourdough-bread
[14:54] <Zuph> eroomde: I've been working on it. Got a collection of books for Christmas last year, and have been baking my way through.
[14:54] <eroomde> this i consider perfect to the point of being dangerous
[14:54] <Zuph> eroomde: That is beautiful. Me and a couple of guys at the hackerspace are toying around with ideas for a wood-fired oven.
[14:55] <eroomde> a WFO is really the one thing i want
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[14:55] <eroomde> infact there are two
[14:55] <eroomde> this has been my life goal for the last few years. i will have 'made it' when a) I have a steinway grand piano and b) a WFO
[14:55] <Zuph> heh :)
[14:56] <eroomde> and a well made pizza is just...
[14:56] <eroomde> ok so there's this pizza place in chiswick
[14:56] <eroomde> which is south west london
[14:56] <eroomde> when i went there i nearly died
[14:56] <eroomde> so perfect was this pizza
[14:57] <eroomde> and got really excited and said 'the world must know about this!' but when i googled it turns out the world already knows
[14:57] <eroomde> it has a huge rep on foodie blogs
[14:57] <Zuph> A plethora of really good pizza places have popped up around town recently.
[14:57] <eroomde> http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/wordofmouth/video/2010/feb/17/how-to-make-perfect-pizza
[14:57] <eroomde> just check out that video
[14:57] <eroomde> 7 mins well spent
[14:58] <eroomde> Randomskk: the narrator/presenter is the chap who's just bought fitzbillies
[14:58] <Randomskk> :o
[14:58] <Zuph> One uses a standard commercial gas pizza oven, but makes all ingredients from scratch; Home-cured bacon, etc. Another has a coal fired oven, and has the best Neopolitan pizza this side of Italy, and the third is opening in a few weeks with a wood-fired oven.
[14:58] <eroomde> which gladdens my heart
[14:58] <eroomde> he's really passionate
[14:58] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[14:58] <eroomde> Zuph: check this video! you'll love it if you're into neopolitan style wood oven pizzas
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[14:59] <eroomde> infact if you come to the UKHAS conference in october, i'll take you here
[15:00] Action: Darkside is trying to find out how long i'll be in the UK for
[15:00] <Darkside> hopefully until october!
[15:00] <Zuph> Unfortunately, not quite able to swing the airfare. Next time I'm in the country, though, I'll give you a ring :)
[15:00] <eroomde> do!
[15:00] <eroomde> Darkside: you're going to bath, right?
[15:00] <Darkside> yup
[15:00] <eroomde> awesome
[15:00] <eroomde> it's a real jewel of a city
[15:00] <Darkside> where are you?
[15:01] <eroomde> cambridge
[15:01] <Darkside> oh yea :P
[15:01] <Darkside> i'll have to come visit
[15:01] <eroomde> t'other side of england, but that only means its 2hrs on the train :)
[15:01] <eroomde> actually i'll be in oxford from july
[15:01] <eroomde> which is much closer
[15:01] <cuddykid> ooo.. camera test complete :) amazing performance by the lithiums - only stopped as 4gb mem card was full.. all in all lasted almost 4 hours!!
[15:01] <Zuph> Stupid small European countries.
[15:01] <eroomde> :)
[15:02] <Darkside> oh man
[15:02] <Zuph> Nearest passenger train to here is 2hrs by car :-p
[15:02] <Darkside> bath was founded in like 900 BC
[15:02] <Darkside> WOW
[15:02] <eroomde> yep
[15:02] <eroomde> it has amazing roman architecture
[15:02] <Darkside> seriously, this is very very different to here
[15:02] <eroomde> infact it's named after the hot springs
[15:02] <cuddykid> bath is nice :)
[15:02] <Darkside> australia didn't EXIST until 1788
[15:02] <cuddykid> lol
[15:02] <Darkside> well, wasn't colonised anyway
[15:02] <eroomde> it was meant to be where you go to clean yourself metaphorically and literally
[15:02] <cuddykid> Oz is lovely though too!
[15:03] <Dan-K2VOL> Zuph what is the second pizza place you speak of
[15:03] <Lunar_Lander> eroomde I'm still trying to find out how to get to london from germany
[15:03] <Zuph> Dan-K2VOL: I forget the name. It's on Lexington Ave., next to the Vogue.
[15:03] <Darkside> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Baths_(Bath)#Water_safety
[15:03] <Darkside> In 1979 a girl swimming in the restored bath swallowed some of the source water, and died five days later from amoebic meningitis.
[15:03] <Darkside> whee
[15:04] <eroomde> Lunar_Lander: i did £30 (35 euro?) berlin shoenfeld to london gatwick with easyjet
[15:04] <Zuph> Dan-K2VOL: Evidently, their ovens get up to 1400 F.
[15:04] <Darkside> oh yeah
[15:04] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[15:04] <Darkside> thats something i want to see
[15:04] <Darkside> old tunnels and shiz
[15:04] <eroomde> basically the price of a nice meal out - not too bad
[15:05] <Darkside> i'm into urban exploration in australia
[15:05] <eroomde> and Lunar_Lander take advantage of the exchange rate while it lasts!
[15:05] <eroomde> Randomskk: I can give you some of my sourdough starter if you'd like
[15:06] <Lunar_Lander> eroomde is the GBP/EUR ratio good at the moment?
[15:06] <eroomde> very
[15:06] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[15:06] <eroomde> if you're in the euro
[15:06] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[15:06] <eroomde> crap for me
[15:06] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[15:07] <eroomde> it used to be 1.6 euros/ pound
[15:07] <eroomde> no it's about 1.1
[15:07] <eroomde> now*
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[15:08] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[15:09] <Dan-K2VOL> After 3 days in high humidity a water cutdown did trigger. Looks like you might not have to wait for rain showers to get your box back, but that means I'll need to ship them sealed with dessicant :-P
[15:10] <Lunar_Lander> xD yeah
[15:11] <Zuph> Dan-K2VOL: Most places aren't as humid as a Louisville summer :-p
[15:13] <Dan-K2VOL> Yes, it's a lot easier for me to test with natural humidity and artificial dryness than the other way around
[15:14] <Darkside> eroomde: lol, 1 hour from bath to oxford by train
[15:14] <Darkside> thats all...
[15:14] <Darkside> thats loony...
[15:14] <Darkside> (we don' thave many trains here)
[15:15] <Zuph> Darkside: Come to America; we're actively hostile towards public transit!
[15:16] <Darkside> lol
[15:16] <Darkside> i love it!
[15:16] <Darkside> i'm just amazed how close everything is by train in the UK!
[15:17] <Darkside> hell, i could go to another country for a weekend by train...
[15:17] <imrcly> just yesterday i kicked a bus and spit at a tram
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[15:17] <eroomde> Darkside: yep, and probably 2 hours to london from bath
[15:18] <eroomde> and yes, london to paris is about 3 hours by train
[15:18] <SpeedEvil> Or scotland
[15:18] <Darkside> eroomde: 1.5 hours actually
[15:18] <Darkside> bath to london i mean
[15:19] <eroomde> nice!
[15:19] <eroomde> well, there you go
[15:19] <Darkside> i'm sure i'll be doing that once or twice
[15:19] <eroomde> it's all wee
[15:19] <Darkside> i've got a friend that'll be over for a holiday, we're planning on having a beer in a pub somewhere in london
[15:19] <Darkside> just because we can
[15:20] <eroomde> you can do it often
[15:20] <eroomde> it's so easy to get there
[15:20] <eroomde> and there is world-class x, where x is whatever you like
[15:21] <Darkside> ?
[15:21] <Darkside> oh, you mean in london
[15:21] <Darkside> heh
[15:21] <Darkside> shiiiiiit, i need to get my advanced amateur license
[15:21] <Darkside> so i can do stuff over there
[15:24] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[15:25] <Darkside> also i totally want to see a balloon launch over there :-)
[15:25] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[15:37] <futurity> Hi, I should be able to track the launch tomorrow if its launched or still up after 11:30am
[15:39] <eroomde> ah cool
[15:39] <mixio> ebay: Your account is suspended. Users whose accounts are suspended must resolve any outstanding issues. Please resolve all outstanding complaints and try again.
[15:39] <eroomde> aquired a yagi?
[15:40] <Dan-K2VOL> mixio sounds like this is just not your week
[15:40] <mixio> :)
[15:40] <Dan-K2VOL> hope your paypal funds stay accessibly
[15:40] <Dan-K2VOL> e
[15:40] <mixio> i dont have anything to do with that. I dont get it.
[15:40] <mixio> hi Lunar_Lander
[15:41] <Dan-K2VOL> does anyone know regular expressions? I'm stuck here and will gladly trade you something for a simple regex
[15:41] <Lunar_Lander> hi mixio
[15:41] <Randomskk> Dan-K2VOL: what are you trying to regex?
[15:42] <Randomskk> sometimes when the planets align correctly and the moon is in the right phase I can do regexes
[15:42] <Dan-K2VOL> A sequence of hyphens, and em-dashes no more than 4 characters long
[15:42] <Zuph> 'Some people, when confronted with a problem, think "I know, I'll use regular expressions." Now they have two problems.'
[15:43] <Randomskk> Dan-K2VOL: as in, you want to match one to four hypens or em-dashes? or is it more specific?
[15:43] <mixio> Lunar_Lander: i just sew your message. thank you.
[15:43] <Laurenceb> hey anyone here used arduino on *nix?
[15:43] <Randomskk> Laurenceb: yea
[15:43] <Dan-K2VOL> and I simply want to replace the hyphens with a different character, and I want to replace the em-dashes with another different character
[15:43] <Laurenceb> how do i connect to /dev/ttyUSB0?
[15:43] <Randomskk> to do what? observe?
[15:43] <Laurenceb> i dont see it on the menu bar thingy
[15:43] <Randomskk> the arduino IDE has a serial monitor that works
[15:43] <Randomskk> ...it should be there
[15:44] <Laurenceb> i want to program
[15:44] <Lunar_Lander> mixio you are welcome
[15:44] <Randomskk> alternatively you can just "screen /dev/ttyUSB0 9600"
[15:44] <Laurenceb> should it autodetect?
[15:44] <eroomde> Dan-K2VOL: is this ascii?
[15:44] <Randomskk> Laurenceb: you'll probably need to select the port and baud
[15:44] <eroomde> i.e single dash and double dash?
[15:44] <Dan-K2VOL> Randomskk and I have the following fields to do it with: "Regex find string" and "Regex Replace string" in this program I"m using
[15:44] <Dan-K2VOL> eroomde, no it's UTF-16
[15:45] <Dan-K2VOL> the em-dash is triple width
[15:45] <Randomskk> Dan-K2VOL: ignoring the fact that you should be using vim, you want to find patterns that contain one to four hyphens or em dashes and replace all found hyphens with one character and all found em-dashes (both inside the one-to-four-long patterns) with a different character?
[15:45] <Dan-K2VOL> it's an Adobe Indesign plugin to process CSV data files into tables
[15:45] <Dan-K2VOL> that's correct randomskk
[15:45] <Randomskk> so like -- should go to aba?
[15:46] <Dan-K2VOL> yes
[15:46] <Darkside> ok, i'll have to get in contact with the bristol hackerspace
[15:46] <Randomskk> curiously my hyphen glpyh has a slightly different height
[15:46] <Randomskk> but what about --- ?
[15:46] <Randomskk> no action?
[15:46] <Randomskk> is the 4-long thing a constraint, or just that you don't have anything else in the data?
[15:46] <Dan-K2VOL> really, just find and replace all is fine
[15:46] <Randomskk> any reason you can't just run two replaces?
[15:47] <Randomskk> one for all hyphens to a, and all em dashes to b?
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[15:49] <Dan-K2VOL> Randomskk I'm trying to do this in the context of the system as it is, which uses a plugin to processes CSV data files, and the plugin gives you a chance to apply a "Regex find string" and a "Regex Replace String" to a particular field as it imports the data
[15:49] <Randomskk> ah, I see
[15:49] <Randomskk> so you want a single regex find/replace to swap all hyphens for one char and all em-dashes for another?
[15:50] <Dan-K2VOL> yeah. I've definitely tried to dive in and read up on regex, but if you know of an easy way before I spend all day trying& I'd be quite indebted
[15:51] <eroomde> i would just do it twice
[15:51] <eroomde> not use regex, as it's litterally a highly deterministic swap
[15:51] <Randomskk> eroomde: I think the issue is that the importer only allows one
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[15:51] <Randomskk> like "while you're importing this data, would you like to run a single regex search/replace"
[15:51] <eroomde> oh. that would imploy putting conditional branching into your regex
[15:51] <Dan-K2VOL> yes
[15:51] <Dan-K2VOL> yes randomskk
[15:52] <eroomde> ok, can't help you there!
[15:52] <Randomskk> I wonder how complicated/complete the regex parsing is
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[15:52] <Dan-K2VOL> it's Adobe InDesign, so I presume fairly complete, given the demanding industry it's used in
[15:53] <Randomskk> you say that
[15:53] <Dan-K2VOL> lol
[15:53] <Dan-K2VOL> I do only presume though
[15:53] <UpuMobile> yay for free hotel wifi
[15:53] <Dan-K2VOL> it seems like grouping with () would be part of the solution
[15:55] <Dan-K2VOL> Randomskk no worries if it's not something reasonable to solve off the top of your head, I can continue digging
[15:55] <Randomskk> I'm not sure it's even doable in standard regex
[15:55] <Dan-K2VOL> ok that's a good answer too
[15:56] <eroomde> yes i am unsure of that too
[15:56] <Randomskk> matching is easy
[15:56] <Randomskk> but conditional replacing...
[15:56] <Randomskk> really this is where one would normally run two search/replace operations
[15:56] <eroomde> i'm not sure you can say, in one statement, find x or y and then if x do foo and if y do bar
[15:56] <Darkside> nn
[15:57] <Randomskk> regexes are really more about matching than replacing
[15:57] <eroomde> exactly
[15:57] <Randomskk> replacing is just saying "if you did find a match, swap out the matched text for this" and often with support for grouping
[15:57] <Randomskk> so you might be able to do something a bit clever, like swap arguments inside a function call by grouping them and replacing with them in the other order
[15:58] <Dan-K2VOL> interesting, good to know the limitations of regex better
[15:58] <eroomde> it's basically what sed and awk were made for
[15:58] <Randomskk> yea
[15:59] <Randomskk> unless your regex thing has some special syntax, I really can't think of anything that would do this
[16:01] <Dan-K2VOL> ok, that's good to know, I'll see about other ways to deal with this! thank you Randomskk and eroomde for your enlightening thoughts on this hairy subject of regex :-P
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[16:02] <Randomskk> there are some regex syntaxes that would kind of do this
[16:02] <Randomskk> but whether your program supports them...
[16:02] <Randomskk> conditional insertions, to be particular
[16:02] <Dan-K2VOL> interesting
[16:02] <Randomskk> might be easy to test
[16:03] <Dan-K2VOL> oh?
[16:03] <Randomskk> find: (-)?()?
[16:03] <Randomskk> replace: (?1:a)(?2:b)
[16:04] <Dan-K2VOL> I'll try it
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[16:05] <Randomskk> there's an alternative syntax which is even less likely to work, heh, but I guess you can try it
[16:06] <Dan-K2VOL> hmm that didn't quite work lol, it found them nicely and inserted "(?1:a)(?2:b)" in their place
[16:06] <Randomskk> not too surprised
[16:06] <Randomskk> try this for search
[16:06] <Randomskk> (?(-)(a))(?()(b))
[16:07] <Randomskk> wait, hm
[16:07] <Randomskk> that's not..quite going to work
[16:08] <Dan-K2VOL> yeah throws an invalid find string error
[16:08] <Randomskk> oh, it's valid regex, just wouldn't quite do what you want. presumably means that syntax is also not supported
[16:08] <Randomskk> unsurprisingly
[16:08] <Randomskk> both are somewhat implementation-specific syntaxes
[16:09] <Randomskk> yea, I think you're probably going to have to look into somehow filtering the data with your own code
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[16:11] <griffonbot> @adamcudworth: Balloon filler complete, now need to fill some water bottles for filling balloon (lift required) #HABE1 #UKHAS [http://twitter.com/adamcudworth/status/86829173229883392]
[16:11] <Dan-K2VOL> go cuddykid!
[16:11] <cuddykid> any spacenear server people about?
[16:11] <cuddykid> haha thanks Dan-K2VOL!
[16:11] <Randomskk> probably not spacenear you need but robertharrison.org
[16:11] <Randomskk> sadly jonsowman is away or he'd be a good one to prod about it
[16:12] <cuddykid> ahh, I need someone to adjust the tracker details for my payload (if possible add int & ext temp)
[16:12] <cuddykid> yeah, jonsowman was the guy!
[16:12] <Dan-K2VOL> it'll store it even if it won't display it, won't it?
[16:12] <Laurenceb> Randomskk: im trying to burn avr bootloader onto an atmega
[16:12] <cuddykid> I think so Dan-K2VOL
[16:12] <Laurenceb> cant get it talking over serial, even tho the ic is responding over isp
[16:13] <cuddykid> so not a big issue, but would be nice
[16:13] <Laurenceb> any ideas on lockbit setting etc?
[16:13] <Dan-K2VOL> Randomskk check your pm
[16:13] <cuddykid> also, live landing predictor would be cool :)
[16:14] <Randomskk> Laurenceb: fuse bits?
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[16:14] <Randomskk> uhm, the default arduino makefile has the right ones in it. I think you can "make fuse"
[16:14] <Laurenceb> i used the hex file from the arduino folders
[16:14] <imrcly> Dan-K2VOL: i realized there was a new thing we forgot about last night, determining the communication(thing) type, should be able to do this on message size right?
[16:14] <Randomskk> that just gives the code but not the fuses
[16:14] <Laurenceb> then set up the fusebits for boot reset and 1kb bootloader
[16:15] <Laurenceb> i think
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[16:16] <Dan-K2VOL> imrcly yes I suppose so, the long messages are actually the shortest cause they're just two two-byte I2C EEPROM pointers, the ATC rpts are 12 bytes, and short messages will be 6 bytes
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[16:18] <cuddykid> natrium42, just the man
[16:18] <cuddykid> have you got a few mins spare?
[16:19] <imrcly> so quick sudo code is <=6 is short{ format using short} >6 & <=12 is atc{ format using atc} and >12 is long report {format long}
[16:20] <imrcly> can use same logic to help manage que
[16:27] <Dan-K2VOL> no, long is <6
[16:27] <Dan-K2VOL> see my previous comment if you can find it
[16:27] <kristianpaul> Laurenceb: helo :)
[16:28] <kristianpaul> Laurenceb: when have some time please upload you sampled data to wikisend.com
[16:28] <kristianpaul> thanks
[16:32] <Dan-K2VOL> imrcly but yes the idea is fine, just remember that long messages are pointers to the data stored in the I2C eeprom
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[16:35] <griffonbot> Received email: dev "[UKHAS] Equipment"
[16:35] <imrcly> long are read from eeprom direct to modem que?
[16:37] <Dan-K2VOL> yes
[16:37] <Dan-K2VOL> there's not enough ram to hold even a single one
[16:41] <griffonbot> Received email: Adam Cudworth "[UKHAS] Re: Equipment"
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[16:43] <cuddykid> guys - for the payload weight (when calculation required lift etc) does that include parachute?
[16:47] <Dan-K2VOL> yes
[16:47] <Dan-K2VOL> calculate everything that's not the balloon itself
[16:49] <griffonbot> Received email: Ed Moore "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Equipment"
[16:49] <eroomde> think about the physics - it's a load on the balloon that is counteracting the lift
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[16:50] <eroomde> so basically, the payload mass is whatever force the balloon neck is feeling divided by gravity
[16:50] <eroomde> assuming equilibrium, of course
[16:53] <Dan-K2VOL> the weight of the balloon is of course borne by the helium too, but it's already removed from the lift force number you read on your scale hooked to the neck
[16:54] <cuddykid> brilliant, thanks :)
[16:54] <cuddykid> weighs in at around 950grams
[16:56] <cuddykid> however, the lithiums rather than alkalines should bring that down a little
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[16:58] <cuddykid> launch predictions still good :)
[17:02] <UpuMobile> good luck
[17:02] <UpuMobile> what time is launch ?
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[17:23] <cuddykid> UpuMobile: thanks, around 2pm
[17:24] <cuddykid> that's if all goes to plan - which I doubt!
[17:25] <griffonbot> @adamcudworth: Payload weighs in at 950g - Water bottles filled - free lift required ~ 2.3Kg - Time to collate everything #HABE1 #UKHAS [http://twitter.com/adamcudworth/status/86847789430083584]
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[17:44] <cuddykid> where can I find the forecasts for the winds above the jet stream?
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[17:49] <Lunar_Lander> cuddykid you mean the predictor?
[17:49] <cuddykid> yeah, but was wondering where it gets the winds above the jet stream from - as it forecasts the balloon to drift west after a certain alt but all the jet stream forecasts are east! :S
[17:50] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[17:50] <Lunar_Lander> from NOAA normally
[17:51] <cuddykid> ahh right, just wanted to check that it will actually turn back on itself! otherwise it will be bad lol
[17:51] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
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[17:54] <Lunar_Lander> hi jcoxon
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[17:57] <jcoxon> afternoon
[17:59] <Randomskk> cuddykid: it really does do that :P
[17:59] <cuddykid> Randomskk: good to hear! :D
[17:59] <cuddykid> hi jcoxon
[17:59] <cuddykid> is it possible to clear tracker tomorrow morning for launch in afternoon?
[18:01] <jcoxon> yeah
[18:01] <jcoxon> will do
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[18:01] <cuddykid> cheers :)
[18:01] <cuddykid> going to power up the payload and do some final checks now
[18:07] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[18:09] <cuddykid> a quick q regarding which way gps antenna should go..
[18:09] <cuddykid> 2 photos.. should it be photo A or photo B..
[18:09] <cuddykid> i'll get link in a sec
[18:10] <cuddykid> http://imageshack.us/g/19/imageozs.jpg/
[18:10] <cuddykid> the 1st image or 2nd?
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[18:11] <jcoxon> 2nd
[18:11] <cuddykid> cheers :)
[18:11] <jcoxon> 1st image = bad
[18:11] <jcoxon> surely you didn't get a lock with the 1st image
[18:12] <jcoxon> bbl
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[18:13] <cuddykid> jcoxon, I don't think I did, I thought the 2nd was right way but just wanted to double check!
[18:13] <cuddykid> thanks
[18:14] <Lunar_Lander> Upu there?
[18:16] <cuddykid> he signed off about 15 mins ago I think
[18:16] <Lunar_Lander> oh ok
[18:16] <Lunar_Lander> I think I was wrong yesterday
[18:16] <Lunar_Lander> the resistors I got at the shop are indeed 22k
[18:16] <Lunar_Lander> or 22.1k
[18:18] <Lunar_Lander> OK quiz
[18:18] <Lunar_Lander> five-ring resistor
[18:18] <Lunar_Lander> brown-black-black-white-brown
[18:18] <Lunar_Lander> what's the value?
[18:24] <cuddykid> hmm not sure - would have to check online
[18:25] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[18:25] <Lunar_Lander> tip: it's big
[18:25] <Lunar_Lander> :P
[18:27] <cuddykid> 100 x10^9
[18:27] <cuddykid> lol, huge
[18:27] <cuddykid> payload - gps lock and telemetry uploading :D
[18:29] <Lunar_Lander> xD yeah
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[18:58] <hibby> http://www.instantelevatormusic.com/nyan-cat-progress-bar
[18:58] <hibby> win
[18:58] <hibby> (dows only)
[19:02] <eroomde> lose
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[19:27] <Lunar_Lander> hi mixio
[19:36] chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) joined #highaltitude.
[19:39] <mixio> hi Lunar_Lander
[19:40] <Lunar_Lander> how's life?
[19:40] <mixio> normal, i think :)
[19:41] <mixio> and u?
[19:41] <Lunar_Lander> here as well :)
[19:42] <mixio> shall we order the new boards?
[19:42] <Lunar_Lander> can you give me the price again?
[19:42] <mixio> it will take time to get the TX1 and test it... and about 3 more weeks for pcbto arrive here.
[19:43] <mixio> I think it was 14E each of us
[19:44] <mixio> superb: http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/twig-geiger-counter-p-867.html?cPath=144_194
[19:44] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[19:44] <Lunar_Lander> sounds good
[19:46] <mixio> Sub-Total:
[19:46] <mixio> $3.52
[19:46] <mixio> Registered Air Parcel (Weight: 0.07 KG.
[19:46] <mixio> Delivery Time: 10-30 Days):
[19:46] <mixio> $38.42
[19:46] <mixio> Total:
[19:46] <mixio> 39$
[19:47] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[19:47] <Lunar_Lander> 14¬ you said?
[19:47] <Lunar_Lander> good :)
[19:47] <mixio> 39.00 USD = 26.8501 EUR
[19:48] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[19:48] <mixio> 13.5
[19:48] <mixio> 14 is better :
[19:48] <mixio> )
[19:49] <Lunar_Lander> :) yea
[19:50] <mixio> NTX2 works at what voltage?
[19:51] <cuddykid> 3.3v
[19:52] <mixio> nice then
[19:52] <Lunar_Lander> or 5V
[19:52] <Lunar_Lander> it doesn't really matter
[19:52] <mixio> with new board only 3v3 is provides
[19:52] <mixio> provided
[19:52] <cuddykid> yeah
[19:52] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[19:52] <Lunar_Lander> mixio
[19:52] <Lunar_Lander> I hooked it to 3.3V today
[19:52] <Lunar_Lander> wporks
[19:52] <Lunar_Lander> *works
[19:53] <mixio> I hope Tx1 (10mw) is sufficient
[19:53] <Lunar_Lander> well
[19:53] <Lunar_Lander> it worked in the UK
[19:53] <Lunar_Lander> why shouldn't it work on the continent?
[19:55] <mixio> yes? that much?
[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil?
[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil can hear balloons over england
[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> that is 500 km away
[19:58] <mixio> Lunar_Lander
[19:58] <mixio> send me 14E
[19:58] <Lunar_Lander> OK one moment
[19:58] <Lunar_Lander> phone
[20:00] <mixio> girl?
[20:00] <mixio> :p
[20:00] <Lunar_Lander> xD no a good friend
[20:00] <Lunar_Lander> but I'm preparing paypal
[20:01] <mixio> :p
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[20:10] <cuddykid> finally got sim card sorted :)
[20:10] <cuddykid> time to test backup tracker
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[20:10] <SpeedEvil> :)
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[20:11] <cuddykid> I think I might be relying on the backup tracker tomorrow!!
[20:12] <SpeedEvil> Where are you again - I forgot.
[20:12] <SpeedEvil> A bit west of Cambridge?
[20:15] <cuddykid> about 75miles due west
[20:15] <cuddykid> worcester
[20:15] <cuddykid> :)
[20:15] <mixio> Lunar_Lander: this is what u r paying for
[20:15] <mixio> http://imagebin.org/160940
[20:16] <Lunar_Lander> Sent!
[20:16] <Lunar_Lander> cool!
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[20:16] <Lunar_Lander> you removed the gyro?
[20:16] <mixio> yes
[20:16] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[20:17] <Lunar_Lander> why?
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[20:17] <mixio> 1axis gyro didnt have any practical thing for me
[20:17] <mixio> :9
[20:17] <mixio> :(
[20:17] <Lunar_Lander> oh ok
[20:18] <Lunar_Lander> is that version 3.5 or 4?
[20:18] <Lunar_Lander> btw
[20:18] <mixio> i cant really think of how a guro would be of any help up there
[20:18] <mixio> 3.5 4?
[20:18] <mixio> which one?
[20:18] <Lunar_Lander> the new board
[20:18] <Lunar_Lander> when the last one was version 3
[20:19] <mixio> Rev. D01.07.11
[20:19] <mixio> Revision Delta 01.07.11
[20:19] <mixio> that how i name them
[20:20] <cuddykid> just WOW - backup tracker pinpointed location to less than 1m .. incredible
[20:20] <mixio> :)
[20:20] <mixio> u have a backup tracker?
[20:20] <cuddykid> yeah, a gprs tracker
[20:20] <mixio> I would like to see it. i can show you mine
[20:21] <mixio> ah, mine is based on sms :)
[20:21] <cuddykid> just text it and it texts back with location :) got if off ebay
[20:21] <cuddykid> yeah, sms it
[20:21] <mixio> ebay?
[20:21] <mixio> link?
[20:21] <cuddykid> ages ago, will try and find link though to website
[20:22] <cuddykid> v v similar to this - http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/GPS-Tracker-SOS-Calling-Feature-Quadband-/170468606475
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[20:22] <cuddykid> works a treat
[20:23] <mixio> omg thing!
[20:23] <mixio> Lunar_Lander
[20:23] <mixio> now if i make the order
[20:24] <mixio> how i can add your 14e to my bank debit card?
[20:24] <mixio> cause i have 14e in paypal and an other amount on debit card
[20:24] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[20:25] <mixio> i need to move the 14 from paypal to debit card
[20:25] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[20:25] <mixio> how did u use my money i sent for farnell
[20:25] <Lunar_Lander> I "downloaded" the money from PP to my bank account
[20:25] <mixio> yes
[20:25] <mixio> how?
[20:25] <mixio> show me
[20:25] <Lunar_Lander> that should be right next to "Send Money"
[20:26] <cuddykid> mixio go to "withdraw"
[20:26] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[20:27] <mixio> Account Type
[20:27] <mixio> Checking or Savings
[20:27] <mixio> ?
[20:29] <Lunar_Lander> do you have your bank account connected to the PP account?
[20:30] <griffonbot> @adamcudworth: Sim card sorted - backup tracker pin pointing down to accuracy of less than 1m (wow) #HABE1 #UKHAS [http://twitter.com/adamcudworth/status/86894340831576064]
[20:30] <mixio> i do that right now Lunar_Lander
[20:30] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:31] <Lunar_Lander> ah
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[20:31] <Lunar_Lander> that is your type of bank account
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[20:32] <Lunar_Lander> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transactional_account
[20:32] <Lunar_Lander> this is a checking account
[20:32] <Lunar_Lander> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savings_account
[20:32] <Lunar_Lander> checking is a normal account
[20:33] <mixio> my bank book is called savings
[20:33] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:33] <mixio> so i chose tht
[20:33] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[20:34] <mixio> now im ordering the pcb
[20:34] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:34] <mixio> and tomorrow i will send the designs
[20:35] <eroomde> Zuph, Dan-K2VOL2 just spotted your feature in make blog
[20:35] <eroomde> nice!
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[20:39] <Lunar_Lander> mixio eroomde http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TqhRNxDc7I8
[20:41] <eroomde> cool!
[20:41] <eroomde> flying time!
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> well
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> something is still wrong
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> why doesn't it do more RTTY
[20:42] <eroomde> memory leek?
[20:42] <eroomde> what happens when it stops - does everything stop?
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> in the program?
[20:42] <eroomde> leak*
[20:43] <Lunar_Lander> well
[20:43] <eroomde> although i'd quite like to see what a 'memory leek' would look like
[20:43] <Lunar_Lander> the led on pin 13 continues to flash
[20:43] <Lunar_Lander> but maybe because there is no GPS connected?
[20:44] <eroomde> i couldn't really say without looking at the code and everything
[20:44] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[20:44] <mixio> Lunar_Lander lol
[20:48] <mixio> brb
[20:48] <griffonbot> @fsphil: hadie:3 is out of the tree! third recovery attempt successful. pics soon #ukhas [http://twitter.com/fsphil/status/86899042814148609]
[20:49] <Lunar_Lander> yay
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[20:50] <natrium42> XD
[20:51] <UpuMobile> evening
[20:51] <Lunar_Lander> hi natrium42 UpuMobile
[20:51] <natrium42> hi nerdboys and nerdgirls
[20:52] <cuddykid> hi natrium42
[20:52] <UpuMobile> whos the girl ?
[20:52] <natrium42> haha & "the"
[20:52] <cuddykid> lol
[20:52] <cuddykid> natrium42, do you have a few mins spare now?
[20:52] <natrium42> Cleo == Cleopatra?
[20:53] <natrium42> uhm, sure, sup?
[20:53] Action: natrium42 is in a coffee shop
[20:53] <cuddykid> cool, would you be able to change my payload details on the spacenear tracker to show internal & external temp?
[20:53] <cuddykid> don't worry if it's will take a while!
[20:54] <cuddykid> launching tmrw
[20:54] <UpuMobile> no rush
[20:54] <cuddykid> lol yeah
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[20:58] <cuddykid> my payload is "habe1" and a sample string is > $$HABE1,56,18:37:13,52.2787,-2.2415,68,21.7,17.4*07 (where 21.7 is the internal temp & 17.4 is the external temp) .. I've g2g now.. don't worry if you can't do it. Big thanks if you are able to!
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[21:38] <Lunar_Lander> eroomde?
[21:38] <Lunar_Lander> hi UpuMobile fsphil-laptop
[21:38] <fsphil-laptop> hiya Lunar_Lander!
[21:39] <Lunar_Lander> OHHH!
[21:39] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.videocorner.tv/videocorner2/live_flv/index.php?langue=en
[21:39] <Lunar_Lander> ASTRA 1N launch imminent
[21:39] <UpuMobile> hello
[21:39] <SpeedEvil> Hello!
[21:42] <Lunar_Lander> LAUNCH HOLD
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[21:50] <Lunar_Lander> BILD is on that lauch btw
[21:50] <Lunar_Lander> launch#
[21:50] <Lunar_Lander> BILD is something like the SUN is in the UK
[22:20] <fsphil-laptop> the word that sums up the hadie:3 pics best is "cloud" ;-)
[22:26] <fsphil-laptop> cool, space invaders :) http://i.imgur.com/a96vh.jpg
[22:27] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[22:27] <Lunar_Lander> (00:26:26)<RisingFury>Also, is Arduino language *actual* C++ or is it just based on it?
[22:27] <Lunar_Lander> (00:26:40)<RisingFury>I need to know if the libs that come with C++ are available to it...
[22:27] <Lunar_Lander> can someone answer this question please?
[22:28] <fsphil-laptop> it's C++, arduino is really only a bootloader + library
[22:29] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[22:29] <Lunar_Lander> second question coming up
[22:29] <Lunar_Lander> (00:29:27)<RisingFury>Does Arduino comply with the 1998 ANSI/ISO C++ standard, or any later standards?
[22:32] <fsphil-laptop> it's not a language, so the question is invalid
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> ok
[22:32] <fsphil-laptop> the C++ compiler that the arduino IDE uses is GCC I think
[22:33] <Randomskk> he's asking all the wrong questions
[22:33] <Randomskk> but it's g++, it uses C++
[22:33] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[22:33] <Lunar_Lander> you see he is a friend of mine who wants to understand the software part
[22:34] <Randomskk> it's open source
[22:35] <Randomskk> I'd link your friend to http://arduino.cc/en/Hacking/BuildProcess perhaps
[22:35] <Lunar_Lander> OK
[22:36] <Randomskk> anyway it's essentially C++ with libraries, it uses avr-g++, the limitations come from the very liimited hardware so some functionality isn't available and there's no STL
[22:36] <Lunar_Lander> yeag
[22:37] <Lunar_Lander> he says
[22:37] <Lunar_Lander> Thank you!
[22:37] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[22:38] <Laurenceb_> stupid arduino
[22:38] <Laurenceb_> fried my 'arduino' board :(
[22:39] <SpeedEvil> That must have been 'ard.
[22:39] <Laurenceb_> http://www.currentcost.com/product-bridge.html
[22:39] <Laurenceb_> one of those
[22:40] <Laurenceb_> i didnt realise it was a four layer board and top layer was 3.3v not gnd
[22:40] <Laurenceb_> fried the avr usart
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[22:53] <SpeedEvil> Depressing that powermeter is going away.
[22:53] <SpeedEvil> What were you trying to use it for?
[22:55] <Laurenceb_> ive got some tqfp avrs guess ill get the hot air out
[22:55] <Laurenceb_> general automation stuff
[22:55] <SpeedEvil> What does it do?
[22:56] <SpeedEvil> Is it a tranparent serial -nic bridge?
[22:57] <Laurenceb_> yes
[22:57] <Laurenceb_> bbl
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[23:03] <Lunar_Lander> YES
[23:03] <Lunar_Lander> YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES
[23:46] <fsphil> hehe, got 278 pictures of trees
[23:47] <SpeedEvil> Woo!
[23:47] <SpeedEvil> Congrats!!!
[23:48] <SpeedEvil> Any wildlife in the trees?
[23:48] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[23:48] <fsphil> none lol
[23:48] <fsphil> trying to upload them now
[23:49] <fsphil> got a few really nice images of the big lake here, but mostly just cloud
[23:49] <SpeedEvil> :)
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[23:51] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil SpeedEvil I think my system works halfway
[23:57] <fsphil> you getting proper beeps? :)
[00:00] --- Sat Jul 2 2011