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[04:41] <shenki> eroomde: what kind of cortex-m3 chip were you thinking?
[04:41] <shenki> ive been telling Darkside we should do a board using a STM32F
[04:42] <shenki> as i've experience with them
[04:48] <Darkside> heh
[04:48] <Darkside> hey shenki
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[06:31] <Darkside> ok, SD card logging works on all 3 boards i've built so far
[06:36] <griffonbot> Received email: James Coxon "[UKHAS] Fwd: [Balloon_Sked] KF4ZTI balloon launch this Saturday
[06:40] <eroomde> shenki: sorry, time zone fail
[06:40] <eroomde> erm, not looked into it properly
[06:40] <eroomde> probably one of the ST parts
[06:40] <Darkside> http://rfhead.net/gallery/2011-06-16_Assembled_MiniNut/
[06:40] <eroomde> infact i need soemthing with an external memory bus soon
[06:40] <Darkside> http://rfhead.net/gallery/2011-06-16_Assembled_MiniNut/DSC_4087.jpg
[06:41] <eroomde> Darkside: great job
[06:41] <eroomde> must be satisfying
[06:41] <Darkside> oh yeah
[06:41] <Darkside> esp now i'm sure the SD card stuff works
[06:41] <eroomde> a nice family photo :)
[06:42] <Darkside> MiniNut #1, 2 and 3
[06:42] <Darkside> :-)
[06:42] <eroomde> the next job will be to get a pelican case with custon foam slots to keep them all
[06:42] <Darkside> #1 = 151.3MHz, #2 = 434.650MHz, #3 = 144.39MHz, when the modules arrive
[06:42] <Darkside> now i need to make a payload box with interchangable antennas
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[06:56] <fsphil> SMA :)
[06:57] <Darkside> mm
[06:58] <Darkside> i was thinking some kind of sturdy box base with bolts protruding
[06:58] <Darkside> and you screw on the radials
[06:58] <eroomde> yep
[06:58] <Darkside> i did a similar thing for a payload a while back, but the bolts weren't well secured, and broke on landing
[06:58] <eroomde> or you could just have 150mhz radials the whole time
[06:58] <Darkside> i think i'll be flying either 144.39MHz or 434.65MHz actually
[06:59] <eroomde> by which i mean, radials of sufficient length for 150 will only improve the ground for 434
[06:59] <Darkside> these boards may replace the existing horus payload
[06:59] <Darkside> eroomde: true
[06:59] <Darkside> and just have a SMA connector for the driven eement
[06:59] <Darkside> element*
[06:59] <eroomde> and then maybe just a bayonet active element
[06:59] <Darkside> or some other kind of connector
[06:59] <eroomde> or sam, yup
[06:59] <eroomde> sma*
[07:00] <eroomde> i don't know if a -40 celcius sma gets tighter or looser
[07:00] <Darkside> maybe just a bolt then
[07:00] <Darkside> i really want to make a payload with a cross-dipole antenna
[07:03] <fsphil> what advantage would they have?
[07:04] <Darkside> circular polarisation
[07:05] <Darkside> and it wouldn't have a null beneath the payload
[07:05] <Darkside> we already have a cross-dipole antenna on the DF truck
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[08:18] <eroomde> anyone else into bread baking?
[08:19] <SamSilver> I am in a big way eroomde
[08:20] <SamSilver> I am in my ciabatta phase at the moment
[08:20] <eroomde> ah grand!
[08:20] <eroomde> awesome
[08:20] <eroomde> what kind of stuff do you like to do?
[08:21] <eroomde> it's sort of taken over from hopbby for me (my hobby has just become my job, so I need a new hobby)
[08:21] <SamSilver> went through a foccacia stage as well
[08:21] <SamSilver> lol
[08:22] <SamSilver> what you baking ?
[08:22] <eroomde> bit of a sourdough guy
[08:22] <SamSilver> I am using brewers yeast a lot at the mo
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[08:22] <eroomde> a love a thin crispy blistered dark crust and big holey soft crumb. lots of oven spring
[08:23] <SamSilver> I spent a nearly a year getting the right type of bread to make the perfect slice of toast
[08:23] <eroomde> what did you settle on?
[08:24] <eroomde> see my sourdough quest is for the perfect cheese sandwhich. good sourdough with a bit of good local ham, good gruyere cheese gratings and some dijon mustard
[08:24] <eroomde> totally obscenely the stuff of life
[08:24] <SamSilver> brewers yeast, 20 hr first rise, 80% water to flour ratio,
[08:25] <eroomde> ah wow, totally after my own heart :)
[08:25] <SamSilver> 3 hr 2nd rise and straight into a hot casserole dish with lid @ 180
[08:25] <eroomde> long proofs and high hydration
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[08:25] <eroomde> WW flour or white? I'd have guessed WW as i'm not sure i have enough ninja skills to shape an 80% hydration white dough
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[08:26] <SamSilver> eroomde: the wife is over my shoulder and drooling at the sound of your sandwich
[08:26] <eroomde> it's perfection
[08:26] <eroomde> with a glass of wine
[08:26] <SamSilver> wow slow down eroomde now she wants your addy
[08:26] <SamSilver> lol
[08:27] <SamSilver> i have yet to find a good gruyere here in SA
[08:28] <eroomde> i'm half french and dad is always over there with work so it's a bit easier
[08:28] <eroomde> though a good cheddar (montgomery i'm a big fan of) comes a close 2nd
[08:28] <eroomde> SamSilver: here's my 'turn-to' sourdough http://i.imgur.com/vLBPM.jpg
[08:29] <eroomde> always makes good sandwiches, and lasts a good few days in the bread bin
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[08:29] <eroomde> ignore the packets of bakers yeast in the bg - i promise it's sourdough!
[08:30] <SamSilver> I was thinking the lack of air pressure at altitude might make up for yeast, so yeast-free bread at 95k ft might be a possibility!!
[08:30] <eroomde> now that's not a bad idea
[08:30] <eroomde> space-bread
[08:31] <SamSilver> well trying to keep with this room theme ;-)
[08:31] <SamSilver> wife says that your loaf looks like mine
[08:32] <eroomde> you're a slasher too?
[08:32] <SamSilver> lol
[08:32] <SamSilver> yes
[08:32] <eroomde> nothing like a good ear
[08:32] <SamSilver> my nick name is Zorro!!
[08:32] <SamSilver> double slash
[08:33] <eroomde> http://imgur.com/77MWC.jpg
[08:33] <eroomde> spiral slashing!
[08:33] <SamSilver> dust with rye makes for a great finish
[08:34] <SamSilver> show off!
[08:34] <eroomde> :p
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[08:34] <eroomde> yeah rye breads are fun. i've not yet made one I've been really happy with
[08:34] <eroomde> working on it
[08:35] <eroomde> i have been playing with using guiness as the liquid
[08:35] <SamSilver> I have never gone further than 50% rye
[08:35] <eroomde> i'm after really rye-ish loafs to slice thinly to have with smoked salmon
[08:36] <eroomde> normally 100% rye is too rye-ish for me but in that context it works i think
[08:36] <SamSilver> guiness is a great idea - think I will give i a bash one day
[08:37] <eroomde> the fat helps :)
[08:37] <eroomde> croissants are the other thing i've been trying, but they're so much effort and so time consuming that i don't really have the time or patience to try them often
[08:38] <eroomde> they keep friends happy though
[08:38] <eroomde> http://i.imgur.com/1UqeF.jpg
[08:39] <SamSilver> the son in law is a bit of a croissant baker but they come out different ever time
[08:39] <eroomde> yep, i've been finding that. so temperature sensitive
[08:39] <SamSilver> nothing wrong with those
[08:40] <eroomde> and my starter is a bit schitzophrenic
[08:40] <eroomde> i think i don't give her enough of a routine to develop good habits
[08:40] <SamSilver> do you have a bitch?
[08:40] <eroomde> i'm single at the moment
[08:40] <eroomde> or do you mean the starter?
[08:40] <SamSilver> starter
[08:40] <SamSilver> lol
[08:40] <eroomde> oh yes
[08:40] <eroomde> felicity
[08:41] <eroomde> felicitiy fungus
[08:41] <SamSilver> smellie shellie
[08:41] <SamSilver> is mine
[08:41] <eroomde> i'm not sure you can get male starters
[08:42] <eroomde> well, if you can I imagine they're 200 years old and living in a pizzeria in naples
[08:42] <SamSilver> I am at work and no pics on PC will share with you at a later date
[08:42] <eroomde> and they're called claudio
[08:42] <eroomde> or maybe frederico fermento
[08:43] <eroomde> SamSilver: have you seen the tartine bread promo video?
[08:43] <SamSilver> nope I am in South Africa
[08:44] <eroomde> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5kKeKSfyOE
[08:44] <eroomde> if ever i'm waning on bread baking, i watch that
[08:44] <eroomde> it's like baking propaganda
[08:44] <eroomde> the book is very good too
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[08:45] <eroomde> it's another high hydration, long slow proof afficionado
[08:46] Nick change: kdag -> alejoo
[08:46] <SamSilver> I am waiting for youtube to load fully
[08:47] <eroomde> it's worth the wait :)
[08:47] <SamSilver> we saw the slice of toast and the wife and I went "hmmmmm" at the same time!
[08:49] <eroomde> SamSilver's wife: this book makes a v good bday/christmas present :)
[08:49] <SamSilver> nudge nudge
[08:54] <eroomde> gosh, i want to go baking right now
[08:55] <eroomde> watching that video is like listening to 'the final countdown' - completely stuck in your head
[08:55] <SamSilver> :-)
[08:56] <SamSilver> birthday coming soon youtube buffering again
[08:59] <eroomde> sounds a wee bit slow!
[09:00] <SamSilver> done
[09:00] <SamSilver> that was great
[09:02] <eroomde> seems like he's got that lifestyle nailed. surfing in the morning, bread in the afternoon. they bake for 5pm - fresh bread for dinner, day-old for toast in following breakfast. quite a nice way of doing things and means you don't need to live crazy hours
[09:03] <Elwell> meh, walk to the local boulangerie still beats making my own :-)
[09:03] <SamSilver> bbl got to dash boss on the way over
[09:03] <SamSilver> bbl
[09:03] <eroomde> see you
[09:03] <SamSilver> byeeeeeeeeeeeee
[09:03] <eroomde> Elwell: where do you live?
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[09:18] <Elwell> french/swiss border near geneva
[09:18] <alejoo> Elwell: on the french or the swiss side?
[09:18] <Elwell> both :-)
[09:18] <alejoo> at the airport then
[09:18] <Elwell> well, live on french, work on swiss (and french)
[09:19] <alejoo> :)
[09:19] <alejoo> i lived in genf, now im closer to zurich
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[09:21] <alejoo> Elwell: have you done some balloon launch in this (CH) country?
[09:22] <alejoo> I wonder about regulations..
[09:30] <Elwell> no, and not likely to (suspect regs will be a PITA) -- more likely to launch from middle of france as 1) fewer pointy bits of rock 2) empty...
[09:31] <alejoo> i will go to la drome the last week of july
[09:32] <alejoo> but you have lots of 1) there
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[10:16] <Laurenceb> hmf stupid kalman filters
[10:17] <Laurenceb> so for some reason my ekf is accelerating down at 1G, disagreeing with gps and causing attitude to become unstable
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[10:32] <SpeedEvil> Indeed - it's hard to debug a fucking huge ball of equations
[10:32] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: Earlier you had a mm/m issue with the GPS - possibly related?
[10:33] <Laurenceb> i dont think so
[10:33] <Laurenceb> i dont really understand whats going on.. but G is hardcoded into openpilot
[10:34] <Laurenceb> so it should be able to take out G
[10:34] <Laurenceb> its certainly initialising to the correct attitude, and mostly ataging there
[10:35] <Laurenceb> on start up it accelerates down and stabilises a few hundered meters down, as the gps catches it
[10:35] <Laurenceb> then the attitude starts flipping upside down intermittently
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[11:05] Action: SpeedEvil rages against the dying of the light.
[11:05] <SpeedEvil> In this case the sync light.
[11:06] <SpeedEvil> Plusnet ceased my line accidentally, and now require 5-7 days to unbork it
[11:06] <russss> plusnet were good, once.
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[11:41] <fsphil> I nearly signed up with plusnet
[11:41] <fsphil> they seemed a good bunch
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[11:48] <Elwell> SpeedEvil: meh, try orange france ....
[11:48] <Elwell> consider them the freeserve (oh wait...) of the ISP world, with all the customer service of a vogon
[11:57] <SpeedEvil> To be fair - it was a wierd situation - I'd previously had two accounts, a and b, on line A and line B. I requested they move a to B and cease b.
[11:57] <SpeedEvil> This caused confusiion.
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[12:01] <Elwell> (you folks may know the answer to this -- how easy is it to use a (unlocked huawei E220) usb gsm dongle with arduino? want to send some udp telemetry data
[12:02] <Elwell> ... at ground level :-)
[12:03] <Laurenceb> http://uk.farnell.com/stmicroelectronics/lsm303dlh/sensor-geomagnetic-module-28lga/dp/1838545?Ntt=lsm303
[12:03] <Laurenceb> finally in stock
[12:04] <Laurenceb> http://uk.farnell.com/stmicroelectronics/l3g4200d/gyro-mems-3axis-16llga-16lga/dp/1872924
[12:04] <Laurenceb> that too
[12:04] <Elwell> the STI container arrived at the docl
[12:04] <Laurenceb> sti?
[12:05] <Elwell> st micro sorry. /me cleans creen
[12:19] <SpeedEvil> Elwell: you basically can't.
[12:19] <SpeedEvil> Elwell: (unlockae...
[12:19] <SpeedEvil> you need to talk to it as a USB host, implementing the USB serial protocol, and over that protocol, talk ppp to it.
[12:23] <Elwell> ah no worries. I stick with plan A of using a guruplug then
[12:23] <Elwell> ie, 'real' linux
[12:24] <SpeedEvil> Unless you can open it, and get to the modem after the USB->serial covnerter
[12:24] <SpeedEvil> which would mean you only need to do ppp
[12:25] <Elwell> sounds too much hassle - theres also the wierd mode seitch from CD-> modem to worry about otherwise
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[12:40] <Laurenceb> http://armadilloaerospace.com/n.x/Armadillo/Home/News?news_id=375
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[13:09] <fsphil> Welcome citizen m1x10
[13:12] <m1x10> :)
[13:12] <m1x10> last moments: http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/259809_1803841140618_1377549819_1671203_4833568_n.jpg
[13:13] <m1x10> they destroyed my army suit as its a custom here :)
[13:14] <m1x10> and my big radar antenna: http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/249498_1774806734776_1377549819_1632382_1485081_n.jpg
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[13:32] <SamSilver> eroomde:
[13:32] <Dan-K2VOL> Good day all
[13:32] <Dan-K2VOL> Does anyone know the guy doing the Norduino?
[13:32] <SamSilver> Dan the Man - good day to you
[13:33] <Dan-K2VOL> Hi Dave
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[13:37] <Dan-K2VOL> Looks like he might be Paolo Di Prodi at the university of Glasgow
[13:43] <griffonbot> Received email: Solar Balloonman "[UKHAS] 'Solar Pillow'"
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[13:47] <griffonbot> Received email: Oliver de Peyer Astrobiologist "[UKHAS] Could this take peroxide? Re: 'Solar Pillow'"
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[13:59] <SamSilver> m1x10: are you a free man ?
[13:59] <SamSilver> now
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[14:19] <eroomde> SamSilver: back
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[14:20] <SamSilver> back
[14:20] <eroomde> cool
[14:21] <SamSilver> eroomde: how do i post pics
[14:21] <eroomde> just gave a talk on our recent hab stuff
[14:21] <eroomde> i use imgur.com
[14:21] <m1x10> SamSilver: yes
[14:21] <SamSilver> what was the site you used t
[14:21] <Dan-K2VOL> Say "picus postum"
[14:21] <SamSilver> thanx
[14:21] <eroomde> Dan-K2VOL: if only
[14:21] <Dan-K2VOL> lol
[14:21] <Dan-K2VOL> eroomde, where did you speak?
[14:22] <eroomde> the engineering department
[14:22] <eroomde> home turf
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[14:23] <eroomde> this'n: http://www.eng.cam.ac.uk/news/stories/2011/CU_Spaceflight/
[14:23] <eroomde> but back to the issue at hand - bread!
[14:24] <SamSilver> I am trying 2 post on imgur
[14:25] <Dan-K2VOL> Cool eroomde
[14:25] <jonsowman> eroomde: how'd the talk go? sorry i couldn't make it, busy with other things...
[14:26] <eroomde> fine
[14:26] <eroomde> not a hugr crowd but of course all the students have gone home :)
[14:26] <eroomde> well, if not home then boozing
[14:26] <jonsowman> yeah indeed
[14:26] <jonsowman> good stuff
[14:27] <Darkside> jesus fucking christ
[14:27] <Darkside> my supervisor has now suggested i make a DRM demodulator on a microcontroller
[14:27] <Darkside> >_>
[14:27] <Darkside> SCARY.
[14:27] <shenki> Darkside: boards look good
[14:27] <eroomde> drm demodulator?
[14:27] <Darkside> eroomde: OFDM on HF
[14:27] <shenki> Darkside: are you putting the arduino bootloader on them?
[14:27] <Darkside> shenki: already have
[14:28] <shenki> im keen to write some bare metal code for em
[14:28] <Darkside> and i've modified the mobsendat code to work on them
[14:28] <shenki> cool
[14:28] <jonsowman> eroomde: http://www.flickr.com/photos/cuspaceflight/5841871071/in/photostream
[14:28] <Darkside> so as it stands, they work.
[14:28] <Darkside> i.e. they transmit, log to SD, etc
[14:28] <Darkside> all working fine
[14:28] <shenki> cool
[14:28] <SamSilver> http://imgur.com/2rjDl
[14:28] <Dan-K2VOL> Digital Radio Mondiale?
[14:28] <SamSilver> does that work?
[14:28] <eroomde> nice jonsowman
[14:28] <Darkside> shenki: if chris is serious about this DRM demodulator on a micro, i'm immediately switching to an ARM
[14:28] <shenki> Darkside: do you have an accerometer?
[14:29] <Darkside> Dan-K2VOL: yes
[14:29] <Darkside> shenki: no
[14:29] <eroomde> what's thee the business around it?
[14:29] <SamSilver> my first time :-p
[14:29] <jonsowman> eroomde: that's how they supply it
[14:29] <jonsowman> http://www.flickr.com/photos/cuspaceflight/5842417442/in/photostream/
[14:29] <shenki> Darkside: that's what we forgot :)
[14:29] <Darkside> shenki: i didn't bother
[14:29] <eroomde> gosh
[14:29] <eroomde> that's annoying
[14:29] <Darkside> if you can find a onewire accelerometer we could still do it >_>
[14:29] <shenki> Darkside: we could put one on the temp pins
[14:30] <jonsowman> eroomde: yeah, but it's free 48 hour service
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[14:30] <jonsowman> free as in completely actually free
[14:30] <shenki> Darkside: what do the ISP pins go to, when they're not being used for ISP?
[14:30] <Darkside> the SD card
[14:30] <jonsowman> so I don't mind dremelling it :)
[14:30] <Darkside> SPI
[14:31] <SamSilver> eroomde: can you see this http://imgur.com/2rjDl
[14:31] <eroomde> yup
[14:31] <eroomde> nice
[14:31] <SamSilver> first time using imgur
[14:31] <eroomde> it's giving me a pavlovian smell
[14:32] <Dan-K2VOL> Mmm does look good
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[14:34] <eroomde> SamSilver: is that with brewers yeast?
[14:35] <SamSilver> yip
[14:35] <eroomde> cool
[14:35] <eroomde> might try that
[14:35] <eroomde> i have used ales to make a barm before. same idea i guess
[14:36] <SamSilver> I like brewers yeast and then use course sea salt with 50/50 honey and sucrose
[14:37] <SamSilver> the sea salt seems to make more interisting aroma
[14:37] <eroomde> i don't usually add any honey or sucrose, unless it's for a speciality bread
[14:37] <eroomde> i'm a bit of a salt, water, flour and noet else person :)
[14:38] <eroomde> yeah i've heard that about sea salt
[14:38] <eroomde> will give it a try
[14:38] <eroomde> soft water seems to be a good thing too
[14:40] <SamSilver> there are soooo many things to vary : time, temp at different stages ........
[14:41] <eroomde> kneading too
[14:41] <eroomde> kind of need to write each attempt down on a piece of paper as you loose track of everything otherwise
[14:42] <Randomskk> eroomde: or use git, a la https://github.com/scoates/owty/commit/f6519da85f6cfac00db8e58a9c71dd61233c97f6#owty.jpg :P
[14:42] <SamSilver> I like to make two identical loves that vary only in one way then compare
[14:44] <eroomde> tho often giving them the same conditions in the oven (or with sequential cooking) can affect things too
[14:45] <SamSilver> my perfect bread for toast http://imgur.com/69fOt
[14:46] <eroomde> that looks perfect
[14:46] <eroomde> nice and holey
[14:46] <eroomde> but it takes butter really well
[14:46] <eroomde> bet*
[14:50] <SamSilver> two the same but different - http://imgur.com/189MO
[14:50] <eroomde> pretty crazy oven spring on those
[14:50] <SamSilver> soooo any idea on a high altitude oven?
[14:50] <eroomde> well, i'm working on a wood fired oven
[14:50] <eroomde> but it's a bit heavy for ballooning
[14:51] <SamSilver> I would give up a body part for a wood oven
[14:52] <eroomde> well, trying to get one at the french house
[14:52] <eroomde> at 'home' could be a bit of a push
[14:52] <eroomde> i am looking for a house with one when i move to oxford but i also want to be in the city itself, i think the two are incompatible
[14:52] <SpeedEvil> I'm working on a tiny oven for reheating single petit-pain.
[14:52] <eroomde> but yes, wood oven and grand piano are my two life ambitions
[14:52] <SpeedEvil> And similar objects.
[14:53] <SamSilver> I use the barbecue for small loves but it has no heat retention as the lid is stainless steel
[14:53] <eroomde> yep
[14:53] <eroomde> i often do loaves in a big cast iron pot
[14:54] <eroomde> it's about the nearest i can get to a proper wood oven in a home kitchen
[14:54] <eroomde> gives you a big radiative thermal store, traps the steam for a nice crust
[14:55] Action: Laurenceb read that as radioactive thermal store
[14:55] <SamSilver> I have used cast iron pots as well, putting embers on top of lid
[14:55] <eroomde> ah neat
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[14:57] <eroomde> SamSilver: if this works for you in SA, http://www.channel4.com/programmes/river-cottage/4od#3140237 is worth a watch at some point
[14:57] <russss> some interesting failures http://armadilloaerospace.com/n.x/Armadillo/Home/News?news_id=375
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[14:58] <eroomde> a good tv show extolling home bread making. you won't get much from it if you already know how to bake but it'll fill you with lots of warm glow, tartine style
[14:58] <eroomde> and they do a quickie bread/pizza oven
[14:58] <eroomde> russss: wrong forum
[14:58] <eroomde> this is a bread forum
[14:58] <russss> lol, sorry
[14:58] <eroomde> not space stuff
[14:58] <eroomde> :p
[14:59] <Laurenceb> russss: the second recovery is epic tho
[15:00] <Laurenceb> just when it looks like its going to explode... out comes the chute
[15:00] <Laurenceb> hey at least it wnet better than copenhagen suborbitals
[15:00] <eroomde> 'general lessons' is interesting
[15:00] <eroomde> lots of parachute stuff
[15:01] <SpeedEvil> Argh - silly internets.
[15:01] <eroomde> drives home that parachutes are some of the toughest things to do in any flying system
[15:01] <SpeedEvil> I'm making a little oven - well - two of them. One will be for reflow, with a fast ramp rate, and good stirring of the air, the other will be for reheating sausage rolls and toast.
[15:02] <SpeedEvil> Ramp rates of mini ovens are crap, meaning I have to wait longer for food.
[15:02] <SpeedEvil> And they use lots of energy
[15:02] <eroomde> SamSilver: i used to have a decent electric fan oven at home
[15:02] <eroomde> in this new house we have a little gas thing
[15:02] <eroomde> it really sucks for bread
[15:03] <eroomde> nasty thermal gradients front to back and top to bottom
[15:03] <eroomde> and they don't like being saturated with steam either
[15:03] <SamSilver> mine has a slight left to right diff
[15:04] <SamSilver> I have tried many methods for steam
[15:04] <eroomde> i have a large (~ 10kg) granite slab that i pre-heat to 240C which helps a lot, if i'm doing something bigger than the cast iron pot can handle
[15:04] <eroomde> and i do like big loaves
[15:04] <eroomde> but i need a decent cover to trap the steam
[15:05] <SamSilver> 10kg granite on top or below?
[15:05] <eroomde> below
[15:05] <eroomde> dough goes directly on it
[15:05] <eroomde> gives lovely oven spring
[15:05] <SamSilver> get another 46 of them granite stones and buile an outdoor oven
[15:06] <SamSilver> build
[15:06] <eroomde> working on it!
[15:06] <eroomde> my gran's old house is by the seaside here in england
[15:06] <eroomde> we're doing it up
[15:06] <SpeedEvil> 240c?
[15:06] <eroomde> really pushing for a bread oven in the bag garden, nice brickwork with a shell mosaic on the outside
[15:06] <eroomde> celcius
[15:06] <SpeedEvil> Doesn't that burn the dough when you put it on?
[15:06] <eroomde> nope
[15:07] <eroomde> there's so much water in these doughs
[15:07] <SpeedEvil> I suppose granite has a fairly poor thermal conductivity
[15:07] <eroomde> it does however have a nice big thermal mass to keep duming heat into the base and middle of the bread
[15:07] <eroomde> dumping*
[15:07] <eroomde> i do often get a fairly crispy base, but still never black
[15:07] <SamSilver> http://imgur.com/ottrJ red wine,macadamia nut and fig loaf
[15:07] <eroomde> but i like nice bold colourfull bakes :)
[15:07] <SpeedEvil> Neat.
[15:08] <eroomde> just like SamSilver's link above
[15:08] <eroomde> just a lovely free-form rustic loaf
[15:08] <SpeedEvil> My breadmaking is somewhat handicapped by tesco value flour.
[15:08] <eroomde> SpeedEvil: http://bewitchingkitchen.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/tartine1.jpg
[15:08] <eroomde> that kind of thing
[15:08] <eroomde> long slow proof so lots of the starches get broken down into simpler sugars
[15:09] <eroomde> so when you bake you get these wonderful shades from the caramelisation
[15:09] <SamSilver> a new organic mill has started up about an hour from me great strong white and tasty ww
[15:09] <eroomde> and loads of steam to give a thin, blistered, really crispy crust
[15:09] <eroomde> i consider that perfect bread
[15:09] <eroomde> SpeedEvil: tesco's unbleached organic stuff is really not bad, infact
[15:09] <eroomde> i've been nicely surprised by the flavour
[15:09] <SpeedEvil> Neat.
[15:10] <SpeedEvil> Yeah - I mean more the actual value white
[15:10] <SpeedEvil> It's not bad with a little sourdough flavour.
[15:11] <SpeedEvil> But it's nothing exceptional.
[15:11] <eroomde> sourdough can do wonders :)
[15:11] <eroomde> i'm going to experiment with spelt flour SamSilver
[15:11] <eroomde> half spelt and strong white sourdough
[15:11] <eroomde> the flavour is really interesting
[15:12] <SpeedEvil> Spelt is.
[15:12] <SamSilver> I have never managed to my hands on any
[15:12] <eroomde> tesco have it
[15:12] <SpeedEvil> I'm wondering about ordering some gluten, to play with.
[15:12] <eroomde> tho of course that's no help to you :)
[15:12] <eroomde> it's apparently a lot less bloating that wheat too
[15:12] <eroomde> but the gluten in it is all funky
[15:12] <eroomde> will need some research
[15:13] <SamSilver> no Tesco here
[15:13] <SpeedEvil> I can in principle afford it at the moment, but I'm trying to _really_ hammer down on the budget at the moment to pay for energy saving and other long-term-cost saving measures.
[15:13] <SpeedEvil> And stupid accidents involving glass. :/
[15:13] <eroomde> why do you need capital for energy saving - eg installing solar heating?
[15:14] <SpeedEvil> Insulation is unfortunately moderately expensive, for example.
[15:14] <eroomde> http://blogs.sfweekly.com/foodie/tartinebread1.jpg
[15:14] <SpeedEvil> At least on the budget I'm on.
[15:14] <eroomde> that's just so bloody perfect
[15:14] <eroomde> it's bread with an old soul.
[15:15] <SpeedEvil> That looks lovely.
[15:15] <Upu> anyone any good with the Wiki ?
[15:15] <Upu> I've made a page here : http://ukhas.org.uk/frontpage:guides:linkingarduinotontx2
[15:15] <eroomde> SpeedEvil: and being a sourdough, it'll keep for days
[15:15] <Upu> when it should have been here http://ukhas.org.uk/fguides:linkingarduinotontx2
[15:15] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:linkingarduinotontx2
[15:15] <Upu> even
[15:16] <Upu> anyway to fix that ?
[15:16] <Dan-K2VOL> From my experience with wikis in general, copy the wikicode and delete the old page and make a new one
[15:16] <eroomde> SamSilver: the nice thing about the tartine book is that the rear 1/3rd are recipes for day-old bread
[15:16] <eroomde> and they're wonderful
[15:17] <Upu> ok thx Dan
[15:17] <Dan-K2VOL> Np upu
[15:17] <SamSilver> wife says fathers day is soon and Bday is in august and online is an option aswell looks like I will be getting it soon
[15:18] <eroomde> worth it just for the recipe section, let alone the ode to that sourdough loaf in the first section
[15:18] <SamSilver> thanx for the hooking me up eroomde
[15:18] <eroomde> np
[15:18] <eroomde> it's a goodie
[15:18] <eroomde> must spread the word :)
[15:19] <SpeedEvil> :)
[15:19] <Upu> yeah that worked chees
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[15:19] <Upu> cheers
[15:19] <SamSilver> I have some video of a very smoooth loaf just out the oven starting to crack
[15:19] <eroomde> breadsong!
[15:19] <SamSilver> can hear and see it
[15:19] <eroomde> breadsong is a close second to chopin for me
[15:19] <SamSilver> never heard it called that "breadsong" luv it!
[15:19] <eroomde> hmm, that's the wankiest thing i've said so far this year
[15:20] <eroomde> i must keep this in check
[15:20] <Randomskk> haha
[15:20] <Dan-K2VOL> Lol
[15:20] <eroomde> but yeah, nothing like breadsong when you pull it out of the oven
[15:20] <eroomde> you know it'll be a goodie
[15:20] <Upu> I'm unsure how to delete pages so if anyone knows how or has permission this can be killed : http://ukhas.org.uk/frontpage:guides:linkingarduinotontx2
[15:21] <jonsowman> Upu: just delete everything on the page
[15:21] <eroomde> SamSilver: right, i'm definitely baking this evening
[15:21] <eroomde> will have a go at a rye-and-wholemeal sourdough
[15:22] <Upu> bingo thx
[15:22] <SamSilver> I will be starting a 20hr sourdough loaf aswell
[15:22] <SamSilver> with a touch of rye 20% maybe
[15:23] <eroomde> i usually get the rye note from just 5%
[15:23] <eroomde> and maybe 20% WW
[15:23] <eroomde> the rest a medium strength white
[15:23] <eroomde> i find strong white can make it a bit chewy and tough
[15:23] <SamSilver> rye for final dusting
[15:23] <eroomde> i quite like a softer, more pillowy crumb
[15:23] <eroomde> so cutting strong with plain flour tends to work out
[15:24] <SpeedEvil> Hence why I'm wondering about gluten - it's quite inexpensive - 2.50/Kg
[15:25] <SamSilver> i have been adding chickpeas ground up to my thin foccia
[15:25] <eroomde> how is that turning out?
[15:26] <eroomde> i've sort of wanted to make a humous-ey dough
[15:27] <Laurenceb> hmm i seem to be in #bread
[15:27] <SamSilver> it seems to make them puff up pitta style
[15:27] <SamSilver> adds nice nutty flavour
[15:27] <SamSilver> maybe we can swop a recipe or two soon
[15:28] <eroomde> for sure
[15:28] <SamSilver> but for now I am off home finished work over an hour ago
[15:28] <Laurenceb> adding a nutty flavour... surely thats my job
[15:28] <SamSilver> wife on phone
[15:28] <eroomde> :)
[15:28] <eroomde> better get to it
[15:29] <SamSilver> home is just 71 steps away from office so will be there chopchop
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[15:31] <SamSilver> stone ground or OO ???
[15:31] <eroomde> stone for me
[15:31] <eroomde> 00 can be a bit weird!
[15:31] <eroomde> i use it for pizza dough tho
[15:31] <SamSilver> I am getting my thoughts together
[15:32] <SamSilver> I will be back online when I get into bed about 4hrs from now
[15:32] <SamSilver> see you later
[15:32] <SamSilver> byee
[15:32] <Dan-K2VOL> tTyl
[15:32] <eroomde> see you
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[15:36] <Upu> any launches this weekend ?
[15:38] <fsphil> there's a US launch tomorrow
[15:38] <fsphil> nothing this side of the pond afaik
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[15:46] <Dan-K2VOL> Have you guys seen the BugLogic2? Fabulous looking USB logic analyzer that emulates 2 or 3 different commercial analyzers, which means you can use the downloadable software from those commercial analyzers!
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[15:49] <Upu> So the phones were busy so I decided to grab a support call from the queue. Someone was complaining every time they clicked a link in IE the machine did DJ Westwood "its friday chant" :/
[15:49] <Upu> Seems his coworkers were bored and changed all the windows sounds
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[15:57] <SpeedEvil> :)
[15:57] gartt_ (~gart@ip68-0-205-209.ri.ri.cox.net) joined #highaltitude.
[15:58] <SpeedEvil> 'I'm sorry sir - but the sound is correct - it is Friday. Please contact us Monday, if the incorrect sound is then being played"
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[15:59] <Dan-K2VOL> Hahah
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[16:16] <jonsowman> eroomde: meeting?
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[16:44] <cuddykid> Hi all
[16:48] <cuddykid> has there been any work done recently on an autonomous return vehicle? Been looking through wiki and the projects seem to be on hold or dead
[16:49] <Upu> probably legatliy
[16:49] <Upu> its a UAV
[16:49] <Upu> and you can't do those I understand
[16:50] <russss> IIRC someone did a flight with a steerable rogallo parachute, but it didn't work too well.
[16:50] <cuddykid> Upu, that's a shame if correct :( however, I'm sure they were planning one
[16:52] <cuddykid> been looking at the diydrones IMU autopilot.. can follow 3D waypoints and all of that fancy stuff... If I could shrink the payload size down to putting it in the body of a big glider then it could possibly work
[16:52] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb did the rollago
[16:52] <SpeedEvil> It failed for boring reasons - mechanical issues
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[16:53] <SpeedEvil> It seemed in principle to be likely to work if it was retried, but never was.
[16:53] <cuddykid> I just like the idea of sitting back and waiting for the payload to come back! Also.. avoids the tree issues that seem to be occurring a lot recently!
[16:54] <SpeedEvil> It only avoids the tree issues if it picks a return route without trees.
[16:54] <cuddykid> yeah lol, that would be unlucky if it flew straight into a tree!
[16:54] <Dan-K2VOL> I'd ike to see someone do a quadcopter return payload :-P
[16:55] Action: SpeedEvil wishes he had his UAV done.
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[16:55] <SpeedEvil> http://www.mauve.plus.com/test.png is as far as I've got - and a box of bits though.
[16:56] <Dan-K2VOL> Actually UAVs are legal above controlled airspace, perhaps you just need to have some massive inflated wings above 60kft to steer to a point that has a predicted drift landing somewhere nice
[16:56] <cuddykid> Dan-K2VOL been looking at the quadcopters, they are soo awesome!
[16:57] <cuddykid> nice SpeedEvil
[16:58] <cuddykid> problem is the cost.. it looks around £500 at least to get a quadcopter up and running
[16:58] <SpeedEvil> The nice bit about this is that you can clip a pair of wings to it, and it's a 'conventional' UAV
[16:59] <Dan-K2VOL> oh hey, you know what might really help if you could detect imminent tree impact? cutting off the support ropw at about 10 meters above the trees, so you have a little speed to bash through all the branches and get to the ground.
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[17:01] <russss> parachutes, as we have determined, are a bit of a pain
[17:01] <russss> if you want to try and do anything fancy
[17:01] <russss> like deploy them. Or steer them.
[17:02] <eroomde> a nasa engineer desicribed parachute deployment, in a recent conference talk, as a 'bounded random event'
[17:02] <eroomde> which sums it up nicely
[17:02] <eroomde> jonsowman: yo
[17:02] <cuddykid> haha eroomde
[17:03] <eroomde> i was unfortunely commited to helping churchill casino do some moving. is meeting still going?
[17:03] <eroomde> hi cuddykid
[17:03] <cuddykid> yeah, I think a big glider or quadcopter would be way forward that activates when below controlled airspace
[17:03] <cuddykid> hi eroomde
[17:04] <Dan-K2VOL> or heck, go the route of the MSL lander Curiosity, retro rockets to steer around and a winch!
[17:04] <eroomde> utterly binkers
[17:04] <Dan-K2VOL> Hehe
[17:04] <eroomde> bonkers*
[17:05] <BrainDamage> or, add few co2 capsules, and add inflatable bumpers?
[17:05] <eroomde> it's just so they can land at higher altitudes
[17:05] <eroomde> airbags also very difficult!
[17:05] <eroomde> but much easier for a 3kg payload
[17:05] <BrainDamage> not for full height fall, you still keep the chute, but at fixed height you inflate the airbag & detach the chute
[17:06] <jonsowman> eroomde: we're all still here if you're free now
[17:06] <russss> eroomde: well, the interesting thing is that there's only ever been one parachute failure in a manned spacecraft re-entry, so I guess it's possible to do right
[17:06] <BrainDamage> so you ensure the kinetic energy is limited, and you have sufficient to bounce off a tree
[17:06] <eroomde> people here have been drinking too much jpl cool-aid
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[17:06] <russss> yeah, the reason people use parachutes is they're a lot lighter than rockets...
[17:06] <russss> and I suppose probably more reliable.
[17:07] <russss> certainly less things to go wrong
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[17:08] <eroomde> tho speaking of jpl koolaid and airbags, the guy on the left is tom rivellini, who came up with airbags as an idea and developed them for pathfinder and mer, and is now doing MSL EDL
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[17:08] <eroomde> http://i.imgur.com/919kM.jpg
[17:08] <cuddykid> also, some may know on here.. I was looking at the JP aerospace peoples website and it looks incredible. But, how do they plan on maintaining a certain position and altitude for their "dark space station"?!! Only thing I can think of was a tether or fans.. was going to email but thought i'd ask here 1st :)
[17:08] <eroomde> and me to his right!
[17:08] <Dan-K2VOL> Haha nice eroomde!
[17:09] <cuddykid> eroomde, great!
[17:09] <eroomde> a was a bit foggy by that point in the morning
[17:09] <eroomde> but the jpl guys were still going strong.
[17:12] <russss> JP Aerospace are certifiably insane
[17:12] <eroomde> the right sort of insane though, I think
[17:13] <russss> yeah
[17:13] <cuddykid> yeah, incredible plan.. need people to take over now nasa's funding has been cut
[17:13] <eroomde> that might be pushing it alittle
[17:13] <cuddykid> lol
[17:13] <eroomde> but it's a sort of bold plan in the way that reaction engines is bold
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[17:13] <cuddykid> the high altitude balloon replacing the space shuttle
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[17:24] <SpeedEvil> Space station is so the wrong way.
[17:24] <SpeedEvil> Launch for millions, not billions, try lots of stuff.
[17:24] <SpeedEvil> Let tiny firms try silly ideas.
[17:25] <Dan-K2VOL> Well I think that the space station would be a fine way to test long duration long range systems and human flight abilities, but we're not really
[17:25] <Dan-K2VOL> We're limiting the human time in orbit to 6 mo periods
[17:27] Nick change: Upu2 -> Upu
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[18:00] <cuddykid> gyros and accelerometers are so expensive!
[18:00] <Dan-K2VOL> They're hard to make
[18:01] <Dan-K2VOL> if you haven't seen what's inside mems accelerometers and gyros , you should google it sometime, it's fascinating
[18:01] <cuddykid> its amazing how their functionality are fitted into something so small
[18:01] <cuddykid> yeah!
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[18:08] <mattltm> Hi all :)
[18:11] <cuddykid> Hi mattltm
[18:14] <mattltm> Hi cuddykid :)
[18:14] <mattltm> Hows it going?
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[18:23] <cuddykid> alright thanks, in middle of exams atm, so not best of times!
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[18:52] <SpeedEvil> cuddykid: err - what?
[18:52] <SpeedEvil> cuddykid: $10 or so for a 3 axis accel/magno?
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[18:52] <SpeedEvil> that is - 6 axis total
[18:52] <SpeedEvil> http://www.sparkfun.com/products/9757
[18:52] <cuddykid> oh right, the ones I was looking at were about $40!
[18:52] <cuddykid> thanks
[18:53] <SpeedEvil> The new generation are _lots_ cheaper
[18:53] <cuddykid> SpeedEvil, how would I go about connecting them up though? Seems like some pro soldering would be needed!
[18:54] <SpeedEvil> http://invensense.com/mems/gyro/itg3200.html
[18:54] <SpeedEvil> You need to make a board.
[18:54] <SpeedEvil> Then soldering them onto it isn't too hard
[18:55] <kristianpaul> where i can find an update gps tle file for gpredict?
[18:56] <cuddykid> ahh cool, thanks
[18:56] <SpeedEvil> make a board = design a board, and get someone else to make it - there are fairly inexpensive services. Or buy a 'breakout' board with a pre-soldered one.
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[18:58] <kristianpaul> ah, 12 channel limit, that may explain the missing satellites
[18:59] <SpeedEvil> There aren;t rarely >12 satellites in usable positions are there?
[18:59] <SpeedEvil> aren't usually
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[19:16] Action: Laurenceb_ is having kalman 'fun'
[19:16] <Laurenceb_> looks like verything going into the filter is sane... as i suspected
[19:17] <Laurenceb_> something has borked inside the openpilot ekf behemoth :S
[19:20] Action: BrainDamage is disappointed that his system model identification & prediction course didn't cover kalman filters
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[19:26] <Laurenceb_> attitude seems to be sane, just the z velocity is mental
[19:26] <Laurenceb_> ~50m/s
[19:27] <Laurenceb_> causing the position to drop a few hundered meters before stabilising
[19:27] <cuddykid> at least I would be putting my FP3 vector knowledge (albeit limited knowledge!) to use if I tried to create autopilot type thing for glider
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[19:52] <Laurenceb_> is that related to NEON ?
[19:53] <Laurenceb_> stm32 doesnt have any of this - its pretty snappy at floating point tho
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[19:53] <Laurenceb_> atm 13 component state vector ekf using all floating point running at 125Hz
[19:54] <Laurenceb_> s/running/iterating but failing miserably
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[20:03] <SpeedEvil> Does it behave sensibly if you vary g?
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[20:04] <Laurenceb_> it might do
[20:04] <Laurenceb_> but surely that cant be the issue
[20:07] <Laurenceb_> we know what G is :P
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[20:09] <Dan-K2VOL> Ha
[20:09] <SpeedEvil> You know what G is, but does it work with g=9.8mm/s^2
[20:10] <Laurenceb_> also the accel going into the ekf is spot on =9.81
[20:10] <Laurenceb_> yes its in the code - hardcoded into the ekf :S
[20:10] <Laurenceb_> which seems a poor choice... what happens when wwe terraform mars?
[20:11] <SpeedEvil> Also - .81 varies a little with position and altitude in the atmosphere
[20:11] <Laurenceb_> yes, more inportantly
[20:11] <SpeedEvil> 1% out at 30km IIRC
[20:11] <Laurenceb_> *importantly
[20:11] <SpeedEvil> though I'm not very awake
[20:11] <SpeedEvil> and then tehre is centripetal.
[20:12] <Laurenceb_> but yeah this is perplexing... accel insot the ekf is correct, as is the initial attitude
[20:12] <Laurenceb_> unless im applying the quaternion in the wrong direction
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[21:15] <griffonbot> Received email: Steve Randall "[UKHAS] Hollowing Styrofoam (Polystyrene) blocks."
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[22:27] <RocketBoy> he he
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[22:38] <NigeyS> ping
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[00:00] --- Sat Jun 18 2011