highaltitude.log.20110526

[00:00] <KF5KWE> what about for 50$ their choice of item under 100g to send up to space, then mailed to them upon landing
[00:00] <natrium42> sound good
[00:00] <KF5KWE> for lack of creativity lol
[00:02] <natrium42> oooh
[00:02] <KF5KWE> ?
[00:02] <natrium42> KF5KWE: can you get a bunch of surplus keyboards from anywhere?
[00:02] <KF5KWE> uhhh
[00:02] <KF5KWE> maybe
[00:02] <natrium42> space key that has been in space
[00:03] <natrium42> could add a necklace
[00:03] <SpeedEvil> spacecakes that have been in space.
[00:04] <natrium42> behave, SpeedEvil! :D
[00:05] <KF5KWE> does sound cool
[00:07] <Darkside> SPAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACE
[00:08] <natrium42> space candy has special healing powers
[00:08] <natrium42> heals aids, cancer, etc
[00:09] <natrium42> you could be a snakeoil salesman, KF5KWE
[00:09] <KF5KWE> could put snakeoil on it
[00:09] <natrium42> lol...
[00:10] <KF5KWE> project total with overhead for rewards is like 600usd
[00:10] <Darkside> lol rewards
[00:13] <KF5KWE> does that seem reasonable?
[00:13] <KF5KWE> my excel spreadsheet says it is, but the number seems high to me
[00:17] <W0OTM> natrium42: you around?
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[00:38] <natrium42> sup W0OTM
[00:47] <natrium42> bbl, moving home
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[01:18] <natrium42> back
[01:18] <natrium42> W0OTM: there?
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[07:46] <SamSilver> bbl
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[09:24] <Chingy> Hi :)
[09:27] <Chingy> cuddykid: you mentionned last time that you own a lassen iQ, didn't you ?
[09:28] <cuddykid> yuhuh :)
[09:28] <Chingy> i just got mine yesterday
[09:29] <Chingy> 'was eager to start playing with it and with my arduino
[09:29] <cuddykid> nice! I was amazed how small it was!
[09:29] <cuddykid> haha
[09:29] <cuddykid> have you got the connector lead from samtec?
[09:29] <Chingy> yeah, it's really impressive !
[09:29] <Chingy> yeap, got the connector :)
[09:30] <Chingy> i'm just wondering how to connect my arduino and the lassen since the arduino is 5V and the lassen 3.3V...
[09:30] <cuddykid> good good
[09:30] <cuddykid> I've got mine hooked up to the 3.3V out of arduino
[09:30] <cuddykid> near the 5v out
[09:30] <cuddykid> not a digital i/o pin
[09:30] <cuddykid> near the GND pins
[09:31] <Chingy> yeah for the power thing
[09:31] <Chingy> but for the serial connection
[09:31] <cuddykid> hmm, I'll try and remember...
[09:31] <Chingy> i mean there are at least 4 things you got to connect, right ? +Vcc, Ground, and 2 cables for the serial connection
[09:32] <Chingy> +Vcc yeah i intend to use the arduino's 3.3V, ground is easy ^^
[09:32] <cuddykid> yeah, I think so, hold on a sec..
[09:32] <Laurenceb> http://vimeo.com/24258192
[09:34] <Chingy> impressive Laurenceb , did you build it ?
[09:34] <Laurenceb> no way :P
[09:34] <cuddykid> Chingy, I'll have a look in a bit and get back to you!
[09:35] <Chingy> thanks cuddykid ! Much appreciated :)
[09:36] <Chingy> Laurenceb: doesn't seem to be very wind-proof though ;)
[09:47] <Laurenceb> #electronics just goes to overflow :(
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[10:09] <cuddykid> right, Chingy..
[10:10] <cuddykid> I've had a look and mine is a quite a mess!
[10:10] <Chingy> ?
[10:10] <Chingy> haha
[10:10] <cuddykid> from what I gather...
[10:10] <cuddykid> I have 3 leads into the gps with 3.3V
[10:10] <cuddykid> 1 lead to the ground
[10:11] <cuddykid> and 1 lead to the TX pin on arduino
[10:11] <cuddykid> correction, * to the RX pin on arduino!
[10:11] <Chingy> ok
[10:11] <Chingy> so the arduino receives only
[10:11] <Randomskk> the arduino will receive 3v3 serial without needing level conversion
[10:11] <cuddykid> yeah
[10:12] <cuddykid> theres no transmitting to lassen
[10:12] <cuddykid> make sure you just get the NMEA strings though
[10:12] <Chingy> ok, it's the only thing i need
[10:13] <Chingy> Randomskk: do you know what the lower limit of the arduino is for a logic 1 ?
[10:14] <Chingy> i've read 2.4 V somewhere, just wanna be sure
[10:14] <Chingy> ok cuddykid, thanks for the help :)
[10:14] <Chingy> i'll try this out, see how that goes !
[10:14] <cuddykid> no problem chingy, sorry I couldn't have been of more help!
[10:15] <Randomskk> Chingy: not off the top of my head. it's in the datasheet though
[10:15] <Chingy> it's ok, if i didn't have anything to figure out by myself, things wouldn't be as fun ;-)
[10:17] <fsphil> 5v avr can accept 3.3v logic - I assume the arduino board will be the same
[10:18] <fsphil> just be careful about the other way around :)
[10:19] <Chingy> well, i might not need the other way around actually, so that would make things easier :)
[10:19] <fsphil> true, lassen is happy without having to send commands
[10:22] <Chingy> ok, i have what's probably gonna be a very stupid question
[10:23] <Chingy> in the datasheet of the lassen, the label the leads from 1 to 8 with their function, but how do i know from what end to start ?
[10:30] <fsphil> pin 1 should be indicated somehow
[10:31] <Chingy> ok
[10:32] <Chingy> well, there's one lead in red
[10:32] <fsphil> is there a mark on the board?
[10:32] <Chingy> no
[10:35] <Chingy> the only thing i have is a picture in the datasheet that show which way to plug in the connector with the 8 leads, and one of the leads is in red
[10:40] <fsphil> strange, normally they are marke
[10:40] <fsphil> d
[10:41] <fsphil> does the red lead match pin 1 in the diagram?
[10:41] <cuddykid> Chingy, have you got a multimeter?
[10:42] <Chingy> yeah i got a multimeter
[10:42] <cuddykid> I just measured resistance across and then identified which lead went where
[10:42] <Chingy> the thing is i don't have a diagram : just a table with the pin numbers and their functions
[10:43] <Chingy> wait, can you tell me which pins you connected to the 3.3V cuddykid ?
[10:43] <cuddykid> not off the top of my head as I haven't got the lassen with me, only the samtec lead is connected, and I've got no idea wich hole goes to which pin!
[10:44] <Chingy> ^^
[10:44] <Chingy> ok ok
[10:47] <cuddykid> Chingy... your in luck!... see page 230 of this....
[10:47] <cuddykid> http://www.sparkfun.com/datasheets/GPS/Lassen%20iQ_Reference%20Manual.pdf
[10:48] <cuddykid> then use multimeter on resistance to figure which samtec lead goes to which pin
[10:48] <Chingy> oh great
[10:49] <Chingy> forgot to check the appendixes
[10:49] <Chingy> sorry, 'should have found this by my own :s
[10:52] <Chingy> thanks a lot
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[11:57] <Laurenceb> oh awesome
[11:58] <Laurenceb> just took 21KB of the code size by using custom printf
[11:59] <Laurenceb> looks like ill fit fatfs with rtc and the full ekf filter on there
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[12:01] <nelly11> Hi, silly question maybe. Is the cutdown mechanism autonomous or ground controlled? How do you implement it on the balloon
[12:01] <Randomskk> whatever you want
[12:01] <Randomskk> both have been used
[12:01] <nelly11> Also what size batteries do u normally use for it? 850mAH
[12:06] <Upu> whatever melts your wire :)
[12:07] <griffonbot> @adamcudworth: Coding in the temperature sensors for #HABE1 #UKHAS [http://twitter.com/adamcudworth/status/73721863485927424]
[12:08] <Hibby> cuddykid: getting there?
[12:09] <cuddykid> just about! given up with the dallas temp library and just coding in the unique device id's
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[12:09] <cuddykid> trying to integrate it now into the sentence that gets transmitted by ntx2
[12:10] <Hibby> is that not what you have to do anyway?
[12:10] <cuddykid> have a feeling something will go horribly wrong when the temp goes neg
[12:10] <cuddykid> apparently not with the dallas temp library, it's meant to do it automatically
[12:10] <Hibby> oh, well it didn't do that for me
[12:11] <cuddykid> oh right :S not sure
[12:11] <cuddykid> anyway, at least this way is working
[12:11] <Hibby> ah!
[12:11] <Hibby> DeviceAddress var = {}
[12:11] <Hibby> I had DeviceAddress outside ={0x28, 0x36, 0x52, 0xEE, 0x02, 0x00, 0x00, 0x44};
[12:12] <Hibby> and some others
[12:12] <cuddykid> oooo!
[12:12] <cuddykid> thats it!
[12:12] <Laurenceb> ok printf stuff is on github
[12:12] <cuddykid> is that with dallas library?
[12:12] <Laurenceb> pretty small and all the useful functionality
[12:12] <Hibby> cuddykid: aye
[12:12] <cuddykid> hibby, could you paste the code?
[12:12] <Hibby> cuddykid: see https://github.com/Hibby/Strathclyde-HAB-Project/blob/master/fusen_computer/fusen_computer.pde
[12:12] <cuddykid> thanks
[12:13] <Hibby> I battled with it but once I got it working life was much easier.
[12:13] <Hibby> as it packaged all the functions away nicely.
[12:13] <Hibby> anything that is sensors. or related to inside or outside is the dallas stuff
[12:13] <Hibby> had to run a function to discover my addresses
[12:15] <cuddykid> got it.. right, i'll try it now, should neaten up the code
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[12:24] <cuddykid> Hibby, where's the floattostring library?
[12:25] <Hibby> http://www.arduino.cc/playground/Main/FloatToString
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[12:26] <cuddykid> thanks
[12:28] <cuddykid> arghh, just printing out -85.00.. on the serial
[12:29] <cuddykid> here's the code http://pastebin.com/EJmTNLde
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[12:37] <fsphil> fldigi is broken on Fedora 15
[12:42] <LazyLeopard> Ho hum.
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[12:46] <Laurenceb> http://svn.openpilot.org/browse/OpenPilot/flight/AHRS/insgps16state.c?r=314a2fcf0037e38ac62ff22a8e09543a470f29bc
[12:47] <Laurenceb> 16 component state vector now O_o madness just madness
[12:48] <Randomskk> that's insane
[12:49] <Laurenceb> apparently they added accel bias drift
[12:49] <Randomskk> lol line 409-544
[12:50] <russss> omg so many silly array operations
[12:50] <russss> what is all this
[12:50] <Randomskk> 16 element state prediction via an ekf filter
[12:50] <Randomskk> :|
[12:50] <Randomskk> uh, via an ekf.
[12:51] <russss> surely you can somehow abstract that into some slightly nicer looking matrix maths?
[12:51] <Randomskk> the first version of that function does it with loops
[12:51] <Randomskk> but that's apparently slower
[12:51] <Randomskk> I'd have thought -funroll-loops or something
[12:52] <Randomskk> I don't think they use a matrix library exactly
[12:52] <Laurenceb> aiui its about twice as fast like that
[12:52] <Randomskk> crazy
[12:53] <Laurenceb> i have a very low drift accel, so hopefully not an issue
[12:54] <Laurenceb> i think they had problems with the adxl345, but that has poor drift
[12:54] <fsphil> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=c27ddcaad7950ccbce2b45ca40d6c6a32d674d93
[12:55] <Randomskk> haha Pnew = (I+F*T)*P*(I+F*T)' + T^2*G*Q*G'
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[12:59] <cuddykid> can someone tell me what the %d, %s and %ld mean in the sprintf
[12:59] <Randomskk> Laurenceb: how do they even have 16 states
[12:59] <Randomskk> it includes gps position too I see
[12:59] <Randomskk> but still
[12:59] <Laurenceb> accel bias 3, gyro bias 3, pos 3, vel3
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[13:00] <Laurenceb> quaternion 4
[13:00] <Randomskk> ah, fair enough
[13:00] <Laurenceb> im presently compiling 13 state
[13:00] <Dan-K2VOL> Cuddykid
[13:01] <Dan-K2VOL> They are standard printf formatters
[13:01] <SpeedEvil> %d = integer
[13:01] <SpeedEvil> %s = string
[13:01] <Dan-K2VOL> you can find more of them by googling for 'printf format'
[13:02] <cuddykid> thanks :)
[13:10] <TangoAlphaWork> cuddykid: can also use dtostrf to convert float to string
[13:13] <Laurenceb> oh wow
[13:14] <Laurenceb> guess how big the prject with 13 state ekf, mag model and reduced printf is?
[13:14] <Laurenceb> 70KB O_o
[13:14] <SpeedEvil> How large is your ROM?
[13:14] <Laurenceb> pwnage
[13:14] <Laurenceb> 128KB
[13:14] <SpeedEvil> :)
[13:14] <Laurenceb> tons of space
[13:15] <Laurenceb> easily fit in fat32 with rtc
[13:15] <Laurenceb> so it could log flights as kml files for e.g.
[13:16] <SpeedEvil> Surely you need states to model the solar wind environment, and its influence on the magnetic field, and GPS ionospheric disturbance?
[13:16] <Laurenceb> lmao
[13:16] <Laurenceb> id like to add wind
[13:16] <Laurenceb> if i have space im going to experiment with wind modelling using the pitot sensor
[13:17] <SpeedEvil> Though I have proposed a shared iono-model in the past.
[13:17] <SpeedEvil> But that went nowhere as the device never took off.
[13:20] <Laurenceb> hmf now i need come code to convert gps time to something the mag model function understands :(
[13:20] <Laurenceb> tedious
[13:21] <SpeedEvil> What time is the mag model expecting?
[13:22] Action: Laurenceb forgets
[13:22] <SpeedEvil> epoch fail.
[13:22] <Randomskk> :(
[13:23] <Randomskk> Laurenceb: don't forget to correct between GPST and UTC
[13:23] <Laurenceb> uint16_t Month, uint16_t Day, uint16_t Year
[13:23] <Laurenceb> annoyance
[13:23] <Laurenceb> need to add extra data to my ubx parser
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[13:25] <Laurenceb> at least the ekf is dead easy to use
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[13:27] <Laurenceb> im just going to take the quaternion output then put it in DCM form and take projection of x body axis onto world z
[13:27] <Laurenceb> and body y onto world z
[13:27] <fsphil> *woosh* :)
[13:27] <Laurenceb> then use a bounded copy of those as the elevator and aileron P term, and raw gyro as the D term
[13:28] <Randomskk> raw gyro, rather than from the ekf?
[13:28] <Laurenceb> there is no rate in the ekf
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[13:28] <Laurenceb> so yes
[13:28] <Laurenceb> or rather raw gyro - ekf bias
[13:28] <Randomskk> meh, so differentiate over two iterations
[13:29] <Randomskk> I guess yea, at least take the bias out of the ekf
[13:29] <Laurenceb> altitude hold and roll offset during turns is a headache
[13:29] <Laurenceb> i tried reading the diydrones code but its written by n00bs
[13:30] <Randomskk> a lot of these kind of projects seem to be done by enthusiastic hobbyists rather than professionals, which sometimes doesn't matter and I guess sometimes does
[13:30] <Randomskk> I've heard similar complaints about makerbot
[13:30] <Laurenceb> i guess you point the plane up and try and maintain enough lift
[13:30] <SpeedEvil> Many people don't really get the maths.
[13:30] <Randomskk> it is kinda hard
[13:30] <SpeedEvil> It's the same issue with encryption.
[13:31] <SpeedEvil> It tends towards import of code without understanding.
[13:31] <SpeedEvil> And very few people trying to hack the core models.
[13:31] <SpeedEvil> Or verify.
[13:31] <SpeedEvil> See the sshd problems with keys a couple of years ago
[13:31] <DanielRichman> that was hilarious
[13:32] <Randomskk> haha yea
[13:32] <Laurenceb> i guess you need to way the lift vector is at some angle off the airframe z axis
[13:32] <Laurenceb> and scales with airspeed ^2
[13:32] <Laurenceb> then you can do some tig to work out how to do truns and pitch up without stalling
[13:33] <Laurenceb> or spiral diving... or generally ending badly :P
[13:33] <Laurenceb> the hard bit is making some sort of control loop which handles things by itself, without loads of tuning for the specific airframe
[13:34] <SpeedEvil> Is this for a powered device?
[13:34] <Laurenceb> i dont mean the roll/pitch loop, i mean the altitude/turn code
[13:34] <Laurenceb> yes, im going to use a flyingwings v-trainer
[13:35] <Laurenceb> guess i need to understand more about flight
[13:35] <Laurenceb> e.g. if you dont pitch up, and just increase the airspeed a lot, what happens?
[13:36] <SpeedEvil> you mean flying straight?
[13:36] <SpeedEvil> straight and level?
[13:36] <Laurenceb> yes
[13:36] <SpeedEvil> If you don't change pitch, then you generally go up.
[13:36] <Laurenceb> presumably you have excess lift, so you start going up
[13:36] <SpeedEvil> yeah
[13:36] <Laurenceb> but that alters the effective angle of attack
[13:36] <Laurenceb> so you lose lift
[13:37] <SpeedEvil> True - but it's a second order effect
[13:37] <Laurenceb> i guess thats why it works better to pitch up and throttle up
[13:37] <SpeedEvil> If you just increase in speed - most of your engine power goes in drag.
[13:37] <Laurenceb> its not second order
[13:37] <Laurenceb> if it wasnt there youd go up like a rocket :P
[13:38] <SpeedEvil> I mean the decrease in effective AOA due to the vertical lift from increasing speed at a constant AOA.
[13:38] <Laurenceb> yeah me too
[13:38] <SpeedEvil> due to vertical speed - ratehr
[13:39] <Laurenceb> thats why you dont take off like a rocket
[13:39] <Laurenceb> but it also limits what you can do vertical speed wise
[13:39] <Laurenceb> so you want to pitch up as well
[13:40] <Laurenceb> but i guess for a trivial demo you could even just run motor at 100% below target altitude, and turn off above
[13:40] <SpeedEvil> Well - yes. If you have no gravity - then effective AOA doesn't change with speed
[13:40] <SpeedEvil> Stalling would be bad.
[13:40] <Laurenceb> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E21byPXR1ek
[13:41] <Laurenceb> when you turn you also lose lift ^
[13:41] <SpeedEvil> When you turn, in a coordinated turn - G goes up.
[13:41] <SpeedEvil> This means wing loading goes up.
[13:42] <SpeedEvil> Drag increases, and the AOA you need to keep a constant speed increses.
[13:42] <SpeedEvil> Hence more power if you want to keep speed.
[13:42] <SpeedEvil> Or trade altitude.
[13:43] <Mrdini> simple rule of thumb. low & fast. high & slow
[13:48] <Mrdini> anyway heya all - I'm hoping to work with the radiometrix ntx2.... I'm just wondering however as to how I can receive from it if space's an issue? can I use a nrx2 or is the range of that rubbish? (I haven't seen very much online of people using the nrx2)
[13:50] <fsphil> I haven't tried, but from what I've heard the sensitivity is not very good compared to a 'proper' receiver
[13:50] <fsphil> although you could probably overcome some of that with a good antenna and maybe a pre-amp
[13:51] <fsphil> but at that point you may as well get a cheap radio :)
[13:51] <Mrdini> yeah... hm. so let say space's an issue, what would be my best option to receive from one of those ntx2 chips? (I'm very much not a radio person :-s )
[13:52] <Darkside> Mrdini: a proper scanner
[13:53] <Laurenceb> ah i see
[13:53] Action: Mrdini doesn't need exact details or anything at this point, just trying to gather info/starting points for google searches :)
[13:53] <Darkside> i'm fond of the Icom R10s as a nice little handheld scanner
[13:53] <Darkside> but R10s aren't made anymore
[13:53] <fsphil> how much of an issue is space? there are some nice handhelds
[13:53] <Laurenceb> the entire openpilot ahrs code is ~70KB
[13:53] <Darkside> or if you wan tto go all out, you could get a funcube dongle
[13:53] Action: fsphil is very slow today
[13:53] <Laurenceb> but im missing the cal code
[13:53] <Darkside> funcube dongle is very small :-)
[13:53] <Laurenceb> and load of other stuff, and just compiling the ekf
[13:53] <Laurenceb> and i already have the math functions
[13:53] <fsphil> the smallest receiver I think
[13:53] <Mrdini> fsphil, well, I'm thinking of 2x arduinos+radiometrix ntx2 + LCDs to talk to each other
[13:54] <Darkside> fsphil: heh, yeah its funy
[13:54] <Darkside> Mrdini: for HAB?
[13:54] <fsphil> is the nrx2 going on the payload?
[13:54] <Mrdini> DarkCow, no - for radio communications over erm several hundred metres (in the air)
[13:54] <Darkside> i wouldn't trust the NRX2 over a long distance
[13:55] Nick change: DarkCow -> ZarkCow
[13:55] <Darkside> though if its LoS it may work, at a low baud rate
[13:55] <Darkside> ZarkCow: bahaha
[13:55] <Mrdini> it's not for HAB, no. but definitely LoS in air
[13:55] <fsphil> lol
[13:55] <ZarkCow> >.>
[13:55] <fsphil> aah non-HAB it might do, what sort of distance?
[13:55] <Mrdini> Darside! sorry :P
[13:55] <ZarkCow> no worries
[13:55] <fsphil> Mrdini, I pestered darkcow yesterday too :)
[13:56] <fsphil> well, not yesterday but not long ago
[13:56] Action: Mrdini points up - several hundred feets. more the better but can deal with 1000 feet max
[13:56] <fsphil> what's that in metres?
[13:56] <Darkside> 300m
[13:56] <Darkside> Mrdini: whats this for? what is the overall applicatoin?
[13:56] <Darkside> application*
[13:56] <Darkside> I like to get a big picture view before making reccommendations
[13:57] <SpeedEvil> I'd randomly guess that the ntx2 is likely to be at least 10dB less sensitive, with another 20dB due to wider in-band noise, and maybe 5-10dB due to FM lock-in.
[13:57] <Mrdini> Darkside, here I go again :P (I've been talking to several people across channels like #arduino :P). but for starters...
[13:57] <fsphil> The datasheet specifies 500m, so you may be OK
[13:57] <SpeedEvil> So that's ~35dB
[13:57] <Mrdini> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fs666zqMw0s <----
[13:57] <SpeedEvil> Maybe 8km or so optimal line of sight?
[13:58] <Darkside> hld on
[13:58] <Darkside> Mrdini: you're making a FLARM replacement?
[13:58] <Mrdini> what I'm looking to make is a way to text communicate between other gliders or ground
[13:58] <fsphil> cool
[13:58] <Darkside> Mrdini: you shouldn't be texting while in a glider
[13:58] <Mrdini> AFAICT, no devices on market for text comms
[13:58] <Darkside> you should be FLYING
[13:58] <Darkside> voice comms is much safer
[13:58] <W0OTM> Howdy
[13:58] <SpeedEvil> Mrdini: Persistance of vision displays on the wings.
[13:58] <Mrdini> Darkside, profoundly deaf :P
[13:59] <Darkside> Mrdini: but you'll screw up your lookout
[13:59] <Darkside> if you have to use a keyboard
[13:59] <SpeedEvil> Darkside: Only if you look at the keyboard.
[13:59] <Mrdini> Dan-K2VOL, *nods* indeed - that's a point I'm keeping in mind.. this is pretty just prototyping at the moment
[13:59] Action: Mrdini gnghs at tab completion
[13:59] <Darkside> bahaha
[13:59] <Dan-K2VOL> Eh?
[14:00] <Darkside> a NTX2/NRX2 combo may work, at a low baud rate
[14:00] <Darkside> theres also the radiometrix combined modules
[14:00] <Darkside> i.e. the BiM2
[14:00] <Dan-K2VOL> Ah I see, wrong nick
[14:00] <Darkside> transceivers
[14:00] <Dan-K2VOL> Np
[14:00] <Darkside> Mrdini: i'd say try some range tests
[14:00] <Mrdini> *nods* the idea is so that it'd be possible to request permission to fly in controlled airspace or similar
[14:00] <Darkside> Mrdini: eh?
[14:00] <Darkside> isn't it a requirement to talk to ATC?
[14:01] <Darkside> i.e. actually contact them via voice comms
[14:01] <Mrdini> <Mrdini> Darkside, profoundly deaf :P <---
[14:01] <SpeedEvil> Darkside: no.
[14:01] <Darkside> Mrdini: wha
[14:01] <SpeedEvil> Darkside: At least - not for some classes of aircraft.
[14:01] <Darkside> mm true
[14:01] <SpeedEvil> Yes, if you've got an airliner.
[14:01] <Darkside> i never got far enough into gliding training to learn the radio procedures
[14:02] <Darkside> Mrdini: ever thought about using a phone? :P GPRS would work in the air
[14:02] <Darkside> 3g maybe not
[14:02] <SpeedEvil> GPRS doesn't
[14:02] <Mrdini> *nods* really, at this moment, I'm just trying to aim to make a prototype without concern for size - to see how well it'd work & then look at the space issue carefully if others think the idea's worth purusing
[14:03] <Darkside> SpeedEvil: i've had my phone work fine in the air
[14:03] <SpeedEvil> Or rather - it may up to a couple of hundred meters sometimes
[14:03] <SpeedEvil> It depends on how the towers are setup.
[14:03] <Darkside> yah
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[14:03] <SpeedEvil> They are setup to point the beam at the ground - any overspill is very patchy.
[14:03] <Mrdini> phones would actually be more "dangerous" than a dedicated device... phonebooks, keypads not suited for quick typing, etc
[14:03] <SpeedEvil> Probably varies by company.
[14:03] <Darkside> Mrdini: true
[14:03] <Darkside> Mrdini: well, give the BiM2 modules a go
[14:04] <Darkside> the transceiver modules
[14:04] <Darkside> i'd just use a low baud rate for reliability
[14:04] <Mrdini> that looks like a different frequency from the NTX2 - any licences required?
[14:04] <Darkside> Mrdini: what country are you in
[14:04] <Mrdini> UK
[14:05] <Darkside> hmm it hought there was a BiM2 that operated on 434.650
[14:05] <Darkside> or somethign similar anyway
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[14:05] <Darkside> NTR2
[14:06] <Darkside> NTR2-434.65-5
[14:07] <Darkside> Mrdini: i had this wonderful idea of implementing AX.25 on an ISM band
[14:07] <Darkside> and using it for glider to glider position reporting
[14:08] <Darkside> so youd have ground stations at the glider clubs, and glider positions would be digipeated from glider to glider, until hopefully it reaches a ground station, where it gets plotted on a map
[14:08] <Darkside> i'd just use APRS, but a gliding club can't really do that
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[14:08] <Darkside> licensing issues i'm sure
[14:08] <fsphil> not in the UK anyway :)
[14:08] <Hibby> it's just a protocol
[14:09] <Mrdini> yeah, need a licence for APRS
[14:09] <Hibby> an extension of ax.25
[14:09] <Darkside> Hibby: i mean using the existing APRS network
[14:09] <Darkside> i mean, you can't do that in the UK anyway
[14:09] <Darkside> it would be fine in australia though
[14:09] <Hibby> Darkside: no reason you can't upload to something based on libfap
[14:09] <Darkside> lib...fap?
[14:09] <Hibby> libfap
[14:09] <Hibby> finnish aprs parser
[14:09] <Darkside> ok
[14:09] <polycarbonate1> lol Darkside
[14:10] <Hibby> or fantastic, depending on how you look at it.
[14:10] Action: Mrdini can't find the ntr2 for sale or its price - but in any case, does seem like what I want... will read tonight
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[14:10] Action: Mrdini goes back to work :P
[14:10] <Hibby> there is a fantastic function called fap_cleanup()
[14:10] <Darkside> bahahahahaah
[14:10] <Darkside> brilliant
[14:10] <fsphil> good luck Mrdini!
[14:10] <Mrdini> ta!
[14:10] <Hibby> we're using libfap as the backbone for aprsmap
[14:10] <Darkside> Hibby: APRS between gliders woudl be cool i think
[14:11] <Hibby> i guess weight and range are your only worries.
[14:11] <Darkside> coudl just use an existing radiometrix based digipeater system, just with a different frequency module
[14:11] <Darkside> yeah, i'd think half a watt would be enough to get between gliders through
[14:11] <Darkside> problem is gliders don't always fly at particularly high altitudes
[14:11] <Hibby> depends on the country, but 10mW should be fine too
[14:11] <Darkside> say if its at 1000ft, 10km away from the airfield
[14:12] <Darkside> thats the kind of situation where it would be nice to get a position report through :P
[14:12] <Darkside> because if youre 10km from the airfield at 1000ft you're probably about to do an outlanding
[14:12] <fsphil> aprs on the 869mhz module would possibly work well
[14:12] <Upu> fap_cleanup() lol let me guess #include tissues.c ?
[14:12] <fsphil> get 500mw
[14:12] <Darkside> fsphil: in australia i'd do 5W >_>
[14:12] Action: Upu gets his coat
[14:12] <Hibby> Upu: lol.
[14:12] <fsphil> yea yea
[14:13] <Darkside> fsphil: :P
[14:13] <Upu> .h even
[14:13] <Darkside> <3 austalian radio laws
[14:13] <Darkside> australian*
[14:13] <Hibby> very progressive sounding
[14:13] <fsphil> that's just wasting photons Darkside :p
[14:13] <Upu> fsphil I'm going to radio club tonight see if I can borrow some TNC's
[14:13] <Darkside> still need to do a 5W HF telemetry payload
[14:13] <Darkside> my Class E amp can probably be pushed to 5W
[14:14] <fsphil> TNC's look fun
[14:16] <fsphil> I've been playing with aprs this past week - it's quite complicated for a newbie
[14:17] <Hibby> fsphil: as is anything in radio, really.
[14:18] <Dan-K2VOL> Fsphil it is, I don't like it, it seems overly complicated and confusingly documented
[14:19] <Hibby> again, something of a radio theme
[14:19] <Dan-K2VOL> Ha yeah
[14:19] <fsphil> it's been nice to play with it - have received two stations so far
[14:19] <Dan-K2VOL> Cool
[14:19] <Dan-K2VOL> What freq do they use there
[14:19] <fsphil> 144.800
[14:20] <Hibby> there's one for 70cm too, iirc, but no one uses that.
[14:20] <fsphil> 433.800 isn't it?
[14:20] <Hibby> possibly
[14:21] <fsphil> I've never listened there -- I bet everyone here is using that
[14:22] <Hibby> it's all about the microwaves :). 60MHz up at 1240MHz. what more can a nerd want to experiment with
[14:22] Action: Elwell _still_ needs to get up the shack mast and get the rotors fitted for tracking
[14:27] <mattltm-alt> Oh, Microwaves! I love a bit of 5.8Ghz :)
[14:30] <Hibby> mattltm-alt: aircraft scatter?
[14:30] <fsphil> bah, 58ghz is where it's at
[14:30] <SpeedEvil> Hibby: I have offers for free samples of 2.4GHz power transistors. I really want to try to make a SS microwave.
[14:31] <SpeedEvil> Hibby: But I have basically enough knowledge to know I have no hope.
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[14:31] <Hibby> SpeedEvil: might as well give it a bash
[14:31] <Hibby> could always make a transverter and use a 144mhz radio as your IF
[14:32] <SpeedEvil> Matching a dozen 100W or so transmitters so they don't explode each other seems challenging. :)
[14:32] <Hibby> nah, sounds exciting instead of challenging
[14:32] <mattltm-alt> One of my clients has a tray full of intel 3.5Ghz wimax modules.
[14:33] <Hibby> sweet.
[14:33] <Hibby> 3.5ghz must be crap for propegation, surely?
[14:33] <mattltm-alt> Yep, mostly for point to point links.
[14:35] <mattltm-alt> We have another guy who does 5.8Ghz point to point data links.
[14:36] <Hibby> nice. What kind of bandwidth you using for them?
[14:36] <mattltm-alt> One of his links was running at 180Mbp/s and over the first few months of the year the speed has dropped to around 10Mbp/s
[14:37] <mattltm-alt> Signal strength went from -69db to -87db.
[14:37] <mattltm-alt> Turns out a tree grew in the way!
[14:37] <Hibby> nice.
[14:37] <mattltm-alt> 40Mhz channels I think.
[14:37] <mattltm-alt> Maybe 20Mhz.
[14:38] <mattltm-alt> Its that guy who provides 100Mb to my house :)
[14:38] <SpeedEvil> mattltm-alt: Chainsaw time - or bigger tower?
[14:38] <Hibby> loads of space, then. tasty.
[14:38] <mattltm-alt> lol. Industrial weedkiller?
[14:39] <mattltm-alt> I suggested turning the power up and burning his way through.
[14:39] <mattltm-alt> :p
[14:40] <mattltm-alt> Right. Hometime :)
[14:53] <Mrdini> Darkside, a thought regarding mobile phones (from earlier) - using a custom device would mean I could program it with predefined phrases prior to takeoff & allocate these phrases to hotkeys
[14:53] <Mrdini> can't do that with phones
[14:54] <Mrdini> such as "requesting permission to", etc
[14:55] <Laurenceb> ok github updated
[14:55] <Laurenceb> ive integrated the time thingy - swapped it to use week numbers
[14:55] <Laurenceb> way simpler
[14:56] <Laurenceb> whole thing is 71KB XD
[14:56] <Laurenceb> fat fs is the only big thing thats missing
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[15:06] <Laurenceb> decimal_date=1980+(Gps_Week+1)*0.0191653649;
[15:06] <Laurenceb> simple XD
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[15:13] Action: SpeedEvil loves random unexplained constants.
[15:15] <Randomskk> clearly that's 1/52 :P
[15:16] <Randomskk> amusingly it's not quite 1/52, actually
[15:16] <Laurenceb> leap years
[15:16] <Randomskk> yea, I guessed
[15:16] <Randomskk> so how does this mag field stuff work?
[15:17] <Randomskk> my earlier naive assumption was that you just take the magnetic field vector and hey presto, 'north'
[15:17] <Laurenceb> i dunno lol
[15:17] <Randomskk> later I realised you kinda need an accelerometer to get attitude for that to make much sense
[15:17] <Laurenceb> aiui its using some sort of spherical harmonics
[15:17] <Randomskk> but for what purpose? to determine where north is?
[15:17] <Laurenceb> "evaluates all of the Schmidt-semi normalized associated Legendre
[15:17] <Laurenceb> functions up to degree nMax"
[15:18] <Laurenceb> as you do
[15:18] <Laurenceb> to find the earths field vector in local space
[15:19] <Randomskk> but for what purpose?
[15:20] <Randomskk> a better estimation of bearing?
[15:20] <Laurenceb> e.g. Iceland in may of 2012 = WMM_GetMagVector(65.0, -20.0, 0.0, 5, 5, 2012, B);
[15:20] <Laurenceb> * Alt is above the WGS-84 Ellipsoid
[15:20] <Laurenceb> * B is the NED (XYZ) magnetic vector in nTesla
[15:20] <Laurenceb> it goes into the ekf
[15:20] <Laurenceb> you measure the B vector from the magno, then compare
[15:20] <Laurenceb> the error - or residual goes through the kalman update step
[15:21] <Laurenceb> effectively it slews the quaternion around a bit and recalibrates the gyro bias a bit
[15:22] <Randomskk> so the value the function gives you is the earth's magnetic field vector relative to true north or something?
[15:22] <Randomskk> and you measure a magnetic field vector from your magno, and can compare the two to work out your bearing?
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[15:23] <Laurenceb> not really
[15:23] <Laurenceb> its much more than just bearing
[15:24] <Laurenceb> you could say the B vector was tilted off the z axis in the northerly direction
[15:24] <Laurenceb> simple right
[15:24] <Randomskk> okay, yea
[15:24] <Laurenceb> but if you do it like this you have the vector in the same co-orbinate space the navigation takes place in, and the gps operates
[15:24] <Randomskk> where the z axis is what, radial?
[15:25] <Laurenceb> remember in a kalman everything is related
[15:25] <Randomskk> yea
[15:25] <Laurenceb> on the earths surface, yes
[15:25] <Laurenceb> so vertical
[15:25] <Laurenceb> this means the magno actually corrects everything
[15:25] <Laurenceb> and gps + magno is effectively your measurement
[15:25] <Laurenceb> as gyro and accel are in the update step
[15:26] <Randomskk> ah, okay
[15:26] <Laurenceb> by observing how the integrated state from the gyro and accel differs from the observed state from gps and magno it can correct both the 'state' and the gyro bias
[15:27] <Laurenceb> and also it seems accel bias from the latest code
[15:28] <Randomskk> I see
[15:28] <Randomskk> these things. very clever.
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[15:28] <Laurenceb> ned frame says the earth is locally flat
[15:29] <Randomskk> a fair enough approximation
[15:29] <Laurenceb> a good approximation.. but its easy to get ECEF from the ublox5
[15:29] <Laurenceb> im wondering if you have to say that its flat
[15:29] <Laurenceb> itd probably be slower, as the g vector changes
[15:30] Nick change: CountX__ -> KF5KWE
[15:31] <Laurenceb> but gps runs in ecef, so if you had sw gps as well...
[15:34] <Laurenceb> flat earth: good enough for a kalman filter :P
[15:35] <SpeedEvil> Unless you're going fast.
[15:35] <SpeedEvil> Fails for when you need to compute hyperbolic orbits.
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[15:44] <Laurenceb> anyone here used the fsa03 with battery backup?
[15:44] <Laurenceb> im wondering if the config is in bbram
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[15:58] <SpeedEvil> New google feature.
[15:58] <SpeedEvil> http://correlate.googlelabs.com/search?e=kittens&t=weekly#
[15:58] <SpeedEvil> :)
[16:03] <Randomskk> http://correlate.googlelabs.com/comic
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[16:04] mattltm-alt (~mattltm-a@mail.icm2.org.uk) left irc:
[16:06] <Randomskk> http://correlate.googlelabs.com/draw
[16:26] <Laurenceb> right i really need the gps populating
[16:26] <Laurenceb> but mag estimation should now work, also with gps setup
[16:27] <Laurenceb> cant beleive ive got it down to 72KB
[16:28] <Laurenceb> elm-chan fatfs is what? 20KB or so
[16:29] <Laurenceb> oh im missing bmp085 code - Randomskk: have you had it working on stm32?
[16:30] <Randomskk> uhm I don't think so
[16:30] <Randomskk> nearly got around to doing it then didn't :/
[16:30] <Laurenceb> ah - datasheets are rather lacking
[16:30] <Laurenceb> guess theres the sparkfun code
[16:31] <Laurenceb> ever come across a better fat lib than elm-chan?
[16:32] <Randomskk> nah, never needed to write fat
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[16:34] <MNSP> Hello All :)
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[16:34] <Laurenceb> im goign to use it for log files
[16:34] <Laurenceb> also kml hopefully
[16:36] <Randomskk> sounds good
[16:37] <Randomskk> you seem to be getting things together really quickly
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[16:38] <Laurenceb> what the...
[16:38] <Laurenceb> fatfs is 6KB O_o
[16:38] <Laurenceb> ok im going to need something to fill my flash with XD
[16:38] <Randomskk> /dev/urandom :P
[16:39] <Laurenceb> this is crazy, i should fit into 90KB
[16:39] <Randomskk> excellent
[16:39] <Laurenceb> im only getting it together quickly as its ~75% other peoples work
[16:39] <Laurenceb> and work from dactyl
[16:40] <Laurenceb> theres a _lot_ of effort gone into the ekf and mag model
[16:40] <Randomskk> yea I can imagine
[16:42] <cuddykid> can someone tell me what the fields (not sure whether they're called fields! :S) in this mean... > (char * outstr, double val, byte precision, byte widthp) ? I'm trying to convert a temperature float reading to a string to add to the sentence to get transmitted!
[16:43] <DanielRichman> are those arguments to a function?
[16:43] <DanielRichman> and/or what's the name of the function
[16:43] <cuddykid> yeah, to the floatToString function
[16:43] <DanielRichman> ok so you'd do something like this
[16:43] <DanielRichman> char my_buffer[20]; // some space on the stack
[16:44] <DanielRichman> floatToString(my_buffer, the_value_you_just_read_from_the_thermometer, 3, 3); // somethign like that
[16:45] <DanielRichman> but if you're using printf/sprintf to build your telemetry strings then that can do the conversion
[16:45] <DanielRichman> no need to use floatToString
[16:45] <cuddykid> ahh, ok, thanks :) .. what are the 2 "3"s on the end?
[16:46] <DanielRichman> hard to tell. I'm assuming that it's decimal places, and minimum width
[16:46] <DanielRichman> based on a google for that function name
[16:47] <DanielRichman> however if you're using sprintf;
[16:47] <DanielRichman> sprintf(whatever, "$$WHATEVER,blah,blah,blah,%f", blah, blah, blah, temperature); works
[16:47] <jonsowman> is this an arduino
[16:47] <jonsowman> ?
[16:48] <MNSP> I was just firing mine up for that same reason jonsowman
[16:48] <Laurenceb> im off, cya all
[16:48] <jonsowman> sprintf + floats on arduino = fail
[16:49] <Laurenceb> https://github.com/Laurenceb/Dactyl/blob/master/Util/rprintf.c
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[16:49] <Laurenceb> thats small
[16:49] <cuddykid> ok, yeah it is an arduino, and I am using sprintf
[16:49] <SamSilver> bbl
[16:49] <DanielRichman> jonsowman: really?
[16:50] <MNSP2> I did something similar cuddykid...
[16:50] <MNSP2> gps.f_get_position(&flat, &flon);
[16:50] <MNSP2> char f_lat[20];
[16:50] <MNSP2> char f_lon[20];
[16:50] <MNSP2> floatToString(f_lat, flat , 5);
[16:50] <MNSP2> floatToString(f_lon, flon , 5);
[16:50] <DanielRichman> oh. I didn't know. I never bothered with it and just sent temperature in hex
[16:50] <MNSP2> and then...
[16:50] <cuddykid> yeah, got that for gps MNSP2 and works a treat
[16:50] <jonsowman> DanielRichman: the version of sprintf it uses doesn't have float support compiled in to keep memory usage down
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[16:50] <MNSP2> int n = sprintf(buffer, "$$%s,%u,%s,%s,%s,%u", callsign, counter, timestr, f_lat, f_lon, alt);
[16:50] <jonsowman> hence everyone uses custom floatToString etc functions
[16:50] <DanielRichman> that seems fair enough. but looking at the source to floatToString I imagine the implementation that libc would have used would have been better
[16:51] <jonsowman> I'd agree, but there you go
[16:51] <MNSP2> but my temp sensors haven't arrived yet so can't help with that bit just yet
[16:51] <cuddykid> yeah, its just this temperature which I'm having a hard time converting! It prints out like 72.13... blah blah
[16:51] <DanielRichman> If the full functionality including the floating point conversions is required, the following options should be used:
[16:51] <DanielRichman> -Wl,-u,vfprintf -lprintf_flt -lm
[16:51] <Randomskk> to be honest
[16:51] <Randomskk> multiply by a hundred
[16:51] <jonsowman> yeah
[16:51] <Randomskk> it's a temperature
[16:51] <jonsowman> or send in hex, as DanielRichman said
[16:52] <Randomskk> hex requires annoying floating point processing on the other side
[16:52] <Randomskk> multiply by a hundred and it's immediately readable
[16:52] <Randomskk> you know exactly how much precision you need and have
[16:52] <Randomskk> there's no need for floating point
[16:52] <Randomskk> heck you could even put the decimal point in for cosmetics if you want
[16:52] <cuddykid> randomskk, then do I convert that into int?
[16:52] <cuddykid> lol
[16:52] <MNSP2> am inclined to agree with randomskk
[16:52] <Randomskk> cuddykid: yea. multiply your float by 100 and convert to int
[16:52] <DanielRichman> alien is a float-free flight computer. the temperature read in binary and sent in hex. But the bin->dec conversion would be easy. the temperature sensors send an integer, (temperature/2) to allow for .5 temperatures
[16:52] <DanielRichman> so if you multiply that int by 5, job done. small code.
[16:53] <cuddykid> right, thanks guys, I think I'll go with the convert to int
[16:53] <cuddykid> will the sprintf work correctly with integers?
[16:54] <jonsowman> yeah
[16:54] <MNSP2> mine seems to work fine :)
[16:54] <DanielRichman> I wonder how much larger -lprintf_flt makes your code.
[16:54] <cuddykid> great, cheers :) I'll plug away and get back to you!
[16:55] <DanielRichman> seems to add about 2K
[16:57] <MNSP2> good luck cuddykid
[16:57] <cuddykid> thanks MNSP2 think I'll need it!
[16:58] <cuddykid> Come across my first hurdle... for use with the sprintf... would the int be a %b ?
[16:59] <Randomskk> %d
[16:59] <cuddykid> thanks
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[17:06] <MNSP2> How does everyone fund their HABing?... http://www.joshingtalk.com/
[17:06] <MNSP2> just wondering if anyone else tried crowd sourcing?
[17:11] Josh__ (5689c3ac@gateway/web/freenode/ip.86.137.195.172) joined #highaltitude.
[17:11] <Josh__> hi guys
[17:11] <MNSP2> Hello Josh
[17:12] <Josh__> if you took a normal party balloon filled with helium, how high would it go before it burst? and would reducing the helium, so that it's partially inflated, make it go up further due to having more room to expand?
[17:13] <SpeedEvil> At 10km, it's at double the diameter it is at sea level
[17:13] <SpeedEvil> and yes, partially inflating may make it go up more
[17:13] <W0OTM> MNSP2: I just pay for it out of my pocket
[17:14] <MNSP2> Same as w0otm
[17:14] <W0OTM> Josh__: I jyst did a launch with party balloons
[17:14] <Josh__> ok, so potentially inflating it half full could make it go up to 20km?
[17:14] <MNSP2> I know a couple of the others got sponsorship too
[17:14] <Josh__> W0OTM: cool, how did it go?
[17:14] <SpeedEvil> half full is a volume measure
[17:14] <W0OTM> http://www.ihabproject.com/iHAB-5/Media/230816_10150248784220943_746325942_9168810_828679_n.jpg
[17:15] <W0OTM> Used 5 36" balloons, (filled 75%) and it got to 18,000ft
[17:15] <MNSP2> nom time, ttfn
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[17:15] <Josh__> interesting
[17:16] <W0OTM> Josh__: here is full details. http://www.ihabproject.com/iHAB-5/
[17:16] <W0OTM> Josh__: Im launching again on Sunday, doing the same thing
[17:16] <Josh__> W0OTM: sweet! i'll have a browse
[17:17] <SpeedEvil> W0OTM: So it was cutdown?
[17:17] <W0OTM> SpeedEvil: I cutdown once I began to see a descent
[17:18] <W0OTM> SpeedEvil: 3 of the 5 balloons burst
[17:18] <SpeedEvil> ah
[17:18] <SpeedEvil> you recovered the balloons?
[17:18] <SpeedEvil> Or from the data
[17:18] <W0OTM> SpeedEvil: both
[17:22] <SpeedEvil> How did you recover the baloons, if you cutdown?
[17:22] <SpeedEvil> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=aB9A0Zv07xM#t=87s - beautiful sky view
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[17:26] <cuddykid> arghh... the temp is not being printed correctly when in sprintf
[17:26] <cuddykid> it just prints it as 123
[17:27] <cuddykid> n=sprintf (superbuffer, "$$HABE1,%d,%d:%d:%d,%s,%s,%ld,%d", count, hour, minute, second, latbuf, lonbuf, ialt, temp_inc);
[17:28] <cuddykid> temp_inc is the integer for internal temp and it is correct (serial print correct if I do Serial.println(temp_inc)).... however if I Serial.println(superbuffer) it just comes out as 123!
[17:28] <DanielRichman> cuddykid: can you pastebin the whole function/lump of relevant code?
[17:29] <cuddykid> will do
[17:29] <cuddykid> http://pastebin.com/UC7uJL8i
[17:30] <cuddykid> I added a Serial.println(temp_inc) before the while and it printed out the correct temperatur
[17:31] <cuddykid> think I might have spotted problem..
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[17:32] <cuddykid> when no gps lock I was using %s rather than %d
[17:34] <cuddykid> working!
[17:34] <DanielRichman> yeah that might have that effect
[17:34] <DanielRichman> using %s instead of %d should produce a compiler warning
[17:34] <DanielRichman> ideally you want no warnings at all when you compile
[17:34] <cuddykid> it looks like it was the ialt producing the 123
[17:34] <cuddykid> no compiler warning
[17:35] <cuddykid> the 123 is still there.. but now the temp follows it
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[17:38] <DanielRichman> where is ialt declared?
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[18:08] <cuddykid> DanielRichman, ialt is declared at the top as long int = 123... that will be why the 123 is printed then!
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[18:20] <DanielRichman> cuddykid: haha
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[18:22] <Laurenceb_> hi
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[19:31] <Laurenceb_> how does the time of fat work?
[19:31] <Laurenceb_> *on
[19:31] <Laurenceb_> annoyingly the Fatfs stm32 example seems to be missing the rtc file :(
[19:44] <Laurenceb_> seems to me some sort of 32bit .. thing
[19:44] Action: Laurenceb_ facepalms @ #electronics
[19:44] <Randomskk> just use like a counter
[19:44] <Randomskk> no one will know
[19:45] <Laurenceb_> heh
[19:45] <Laurenceb_> "<DanFrederiksen> you can feel loved, worthy. have enough self worth that external difficulty can't really traumatize you"
[19:46] <Laurenceb_> i really dont know what to make of that
[19:46] <Randomskk> he's selling viagra and/or penis enlargement drugs
[19:46] <Randomskk> clearly
[19:47] <Laurenceb_> i think hes extolling the virtues of jesus
[19:47] <Laurenceb_> he should get back to trolling spacefellowship
[19:47] <Randomskk> same thing
[19:48] <Laurenceb_> im going to try and get the rtc working - its setup to run off the backup coin cell along with the ublox
[19:48] <Laurenceb_> then set the rtc off the gps and use it for the fat
[19:49] <BrainDamage> Laurenceb_: danfred is notorious for doing religious trolling
[19:49] <BrainDamage> he also does tesla magic energy, and various other things he has no understanding of
[19:49] <Laurenceb_> -religious
[19:49] <Laurenceb_> hes a troll on every topic
[19:50] <Laurenceb_> as long as we keep him out of here
[19:50] Blackover (d5950a1a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.213.149.10.26) joined #highaltitude.
[19:50] <Blackover> Hi!
[19:50] <Randomskk> meh we'd just kick him
[19:50] <Randomskk> hi
[19:51] <Blackover> I need help in arduino programming
[19:51] <Laurenceb_> hmm maybe i should spend more time on actually relevant stuff :P
[19:51] <Laurenceb_> like guidance and things rather than fat rtcXD
[19:52] <Blackover> How to convert string to uint8_t array?
[19:52] <Randomskk> the string is already an array of chars which are basically uint8
[19:52] <Randomskk> so just pretend it already is
[19:52] <Laurenceb_> does arduino even have that datatype?
[19:53] <Randomskk> you can define it. nothing has it "natively", it's not part of C
[19:53] <Blackover> yeah\
[19:53] <Blackover> it does
[19:53] <BrainDamage> all you need is a typecast
[19:54] <Laurenceb_> yeah i meant as part of the 'environment'
[19:55] <Blackover> all you need is a typecast
[19:55] <Blackover> what typecast?
[19:56] <Laurenceb_> im 12 years old and whats a typecast
[19:56] <Randomskk> Blackover: let's say you have a string
[19:57] <Randomskk> char* mystring = "hello, world";
[19:57] <Randomskk> uint8_t myint = (uint8_t)(mystring[2]);
[19:57] <BrainDamage> basically appending a leading (datatype) forces your variable to be read like it'd be that type of data
[19:58] <BrainDamage> in some cases, the data is converted, like when you cast ( convert ) fixed point into floating
[19:58] <BrainDamage> in your case, the 2 data formats are bitwise identical, so no conversion will be made
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[19:59] <Blackover> why in mystring[2] there is "2'?
[19:59] <BrainDamage> it means accessing the 3rd element
[20:00] <BrainDamage> a string in c is a char array
[20:00] <BrainDamage> the [] operator, accesses an element in the array
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[20:01] <Blackover> in my case, there is the next code:
[20:01] <Blackover> ...
[20:01] <Blackover> String CommonMessageToSend;
[20:02] <Blackover> ...
[20:02] <Blackover> CommonMessageToSend = String("Hello World!; ");
[20:02] <Blackover> uint8_t *dataToSend[RF22_MAX_MESSAGE_LEN] = CommonMessageToSend;
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[20:04] <Blackover> it won't work\
[20:04] <BrainDamage> no, that doesn't look right
[20:04] <BrainDamage> try instead
[20:05] <BrainDamage> uint8_t * dataToSend = (uint8_t *)CommonMessageToSend;
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[20:07] <Blackover> invalid cast from type 'String' to type 'uint8_t*'
[20:07] <BrainDamage> what type is string? is that a c++ string?
[20:08] <BrainDamage> or char* ?
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[20:08] <Blackover> String is Object from http://arduino.cc/en/Reference/StringObject\
[20:09] <Laurenceb_> n00b question - how do i pull a github repo?
[20:09] <russss> Laurenceb_: git clone <url>
[20:09] <Laurenceb_> so copy a new repo from github to my machine
[20:09] <griffonbot> @adamcudworth: Both temp sensors working.. now to integrate into telemetry string #HABE1 #UKHAS [http://twitter.com/adamcudworth/status/73843255023898624]
[20:09] <Laurenceb_> and it creates it inside a new directory?
[20:09] <BrainDamage> if you already have a repo for the same thing
[20:09] <russss> Laurenceb_: yeah
[20:09] <Laurenceb_> ok
[20:09] <BrainDamage> git remote add alias repourl
[20:09] <BrainDamage> git fetch aliasname
[20:10] <BrainDamage> so you don't need 2 folders
[20:10] <BrainDamage> Blackover: you want this function http://arduino.cc/en/Reference/StringToCharArray
[20:10] <Laurenceb_> Permission denied (publickey).
[20:10] <Laurenceb_> fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly
[20:11] <Laurenceb_> grr not that error
[20:12] <BrainDamage> Laurenceb_: what are you trying to do? add another repo of the same project? or is it another sep project?
[20:13] <russss> Laurenceb_: that means you're using the git+ssh:// url and not the http:// one. If you want to commit, you need to add your SSH public key to github. If you don't, just use the HTTP URL instead
[20:13] <Laurenceb_> i see
[20:14] <Blackover> BrainDamage one line is uint8_t dataToSend [RF22_MAX_MESSAGE_LEN];
[20:14] <Blackover> BrainDamage next CommonMessageToSend.toCharArray(dataToSend, RF22_MAX_MESSAGE_LEN);
[20:15] <BrainDamage> should work, but it might dislike the implicit cast
[20:16] <Blackover> invalid conversion from 'uint8_t*' to 'char*'
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[20:18] <Laurenceb_> ah score - ive found rtc.c
[20:18] <BrainDamage> CommonMessageToSend.toCharArray((uint8_t*)dataToSend, RF22_MAX_MESSAGE_LEN);
[20:18] <Laurenceb_> its in the wrong directory for some reason
[20:18] <Laurenceb_> ok i can get fat with gps based rtc working easily now XD
[20:20] <Blackover> same error
[20:21] <DanielRichman> CommonMessageToSend.toCharArray( (int8_t *) dataToSend, RF22_MAX_MESSAGE_LEN);
[20:22] <DanielRichman> drop the u
[20:22] <BrainDamage> unsigned and signed is the same thing
[20:22] <DanielRichman> or ( (char *) dataToSend, )
[20:22] <DanielRichman> clearly not
[20:22] <BrainDamage> clearly yes, if you know how the data is stored
[20:22] <DanielRichman> << invalid conversion from 'uint8_t*' to 'char*'
[20:22] <DanielRichman> normally you get "pointer targets differ in signedness"
[20:22] <BrainDamage> and char* is actually the right cast btw
[20:22] <DanielRichman> so it's a bit strange.
[20:23] <BrainDamage> gcc does automatic implicit typecast between signed & unsigned ...
[20:23] <Blackover> again the same err
[20:23] <DanielRichman> are you sure that error is coming from that line?
[20:24] <Blackover> yes it's highlighted
[20:24] <Blackover> )
[20:25] <BrainDamage> Blackover: try
[20:26] <BrainDamage> char temparray[RF22_MAX_MESSAGE_LEN];
[20:26] <BrainDamage> CommonMessageToSend.toCharArray(temparray, RF22_MAX_MESSAGE_LEN );
[20:27] <BrainDamage> uint8_t* newpointer = (uint8_t*)temparray;
[20:29] <Blackover> no compiling errors, GREAT!! Thank you, BrainDamage!
[20:29] <DanielRichman> Blackover: out of curiosity, do you have #include <stdint.h> anywhere in your code?
[20:30] <Blackover> no
[20:30] <Blackover> should I?
[20:30] <DanielRichman> yet you received no errors when you used uint8_t ?
[20:31] <Blackover> yes without errors
[20:31] <DanielRichman> interesting.
[20:31] <BrainDamage> I guess he's using a function which needs uint8_t
[20:32] <Blackover> rfm22 library, server and client code examples
[20:32] <BrainDamage> and while including the header for the function which needs it, he automagically dragged in stdint
[20:32] <DanielRichman> indeed. I didn't see it the ardino headers so I suppose a library dragging it in makes sense
[20:34] <Laurenceb_> anyone here run eagle 5.11 on ubuntu?
[20:34] <Laurenceb_> it not appeared on the menu ?
[20:34] <DanielRichman> I've got eagle 5.10 on ubuntu. I have a strange memory of adding the shortcut manually but I cant' remember if it's true
[20:43] <Laurenceb_> yeah i think ill have to do that
[20:43] <cuddykid> ping jonsowman
[20:43] <jonsowman> alright cuddykid
[20:44] <jonsowman> what's up :)
[20:44] <cuddykid> hi Jon :)
[20:44] <cuddykid> just wondering if I could change my xml?
[20:44] <jonsowman> yep
[20:44] <jonsowman> what needs changing?
[20:45] <cuddykid> I've added 2 temp sensors
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[20:45] <cuddykid> one internal and one external
[20:45] <jonsowman> payload name?
[20:45] <cuddykid> HABE1
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[20:45] <cuddykid> however, the temp comes out as 3 digits eg. 230 meaning 23.0 C
[20:46] <jonsowman> so always integer, but could go -ve?
[20:46] <cuddykid> yep
[20:46] <jonsowman> righto
[20:46] <cuddykid> is it possible to pop the decimal point in after the 2nd digit also?
[20:46] <jonsowman> no
[20:46] <jonsowman> not via the DL
[20:46] <cuddykid> ok, no problem!
[20:46] Action: Randomskk mumbles something about habitat
[20:46] <jonsowman> sorry Randomskk, didn't quite hear that :P
[20:46] <Randomskk> cuddykid: you could probably make your code put the decimal point in pretty easily
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[20:47] <cuddykid> randomskk, could you shed some light?! lol... currently it just prints a 3 digit int
[20:47] <Randomskk> well say you have a float 21.5
[20:48] <Randomskk> you could cast to an int, getting 21, and print that
[20:48] <Randomskk> then subtract that int from the float, leaving 0.5
[20:48] <cuddykid> nice!
[20:48] <Randomskk> multiply by 10 to get 5 and cast that to an int, and print it
[20:48] <Randomskk> print a '.' between the two
[20:48] <cuddykid> I like it!
[20:48] <cuddykid> right.. will get coding
[20:49] <cuddykid> jonsowman, will the above be ok with DL (will still have comma in correct place)?
[20:49] <jonsowman> get the telem working then let me have a couple of strings
[20:49] <DanielRichman> jonsowman: tomorrow marks the end of the week with >50% of my exams. free time will increase dramatically
[20:49] <jonsowman> then i can make sure it works
[20:49] <DanielRichman> wasted time will also increase dramatically
[20:49] <jonsowman> DanielRichman: :D
[20:49] <DanielRichman> but still
[20:49] <jonsowman> haha
[20:49] <jonsowman> how're exams going btw?
[20:49] <cuddykid> ok , thanks jonsowman !
[20:49] <cuddykid> DanielRichman, are you doing as's?
[20:49] <DanielRichman> going pretty great
[20:49] <DanielRichman> cuddykid: yes
[20:49] <jonsowman> DanielRichman: glad to hear it
[20:50] <DanielRichman> D1 today was ... a unique gem produced by the kind people at OCR
[20:50] <jonsowman> I heard
[20:50] <Randomskk> I saw sbasuita's tweet
[20:50] <Randomskk> what happened?
[20:50] <DanielRichman> lemme go find a link to the pdf
[20:50] <cuddykid> ahh, did a huge amount of the construction of payload during my as's lol
[20:50] <Randomskk> DanielRichman: our exams start 10th june, so still got just over a week of revision, then finish a week later
[20:50] <cuddykid> a's start in about 2 weeks
[20:50] <Randomskk> after which time spent drinking and collapsing unconcious may increase dramatically
[20:50] <cuddykid> with FP3 1st ... ekkk..
[20:50] <Randomskk> fp3 was fine
[20:50] <Randomskk> fp2 is the annoying one
[20:50] <DanielRichman> http://www.pdf-archive.com/2011/05/26/ocr-decision-maths-1-26th-may-2011/ocr-decision-maths-1-26th-may-2011.pdf
[20:50] <cuddykid> yeah, its going ok atm
[20:50] <Randomskk> well. I did the proper maths crap, none of this new syllabus :P
[20:50] <DanielRichman> bawww
[20:50] <cuddykid> lol
[20:51] <Randomskk> DanielRichman: wow, they put the papers online quickly
[20:51] <DanielRichman> *they(
[20:51] <DanielRichman> aiui teachers can just take them out and upload them. I think they end up online on the same day but I heard something about a 24hr grace period
[20:51] <DanielRichman> doesn't seem to have been respected in the above case if it does exist
[20:52] <DanielRichman> the pdf I linked is scanned; the actual thing certainly won't be on the ocr website for ~7 months or something
[20:52] <cuddykid> I always seem to be way more productive during exam time.. however, not on exam stuff!!
[20:52] <DanielRichman> anyway questions 1-4 are boring. 6 is the fun stuff.
[20:52] <Randomskk> omg simplex tableaus, lol d1
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[20:52] <cuddykid> good old simplex lol
[20:52] <DanielRichman> 4 consumed time; that was its only purpose
[20:53] <MNSP> evening all :)
[20:53] <jonsowman> wow I remember that
[20:53] <jonsowman> kind of
[20:53] <Randomskk> hang on, lol what
[20:53] <DanielRichman> if you're bored enough you might want to try 6ii
[20:53] <cuddykid> did d2 last jan, was a bitch of a paper.. our teacher sets the d2 too... she chuckled to herself... grrr!
[20:54] <DanielRichman> the desire to do d2 in our class was quite low at the beginning of today and by now I'd imagine it's rock bottom
[20:54] <cuddykid> haha
[20:54] <DanielRichman> I think it's gonna be m3 or s2.
[20:54] <cuddykid> s2
[20:54] <Randomskk> I'd do all the m you can
[20:54] <Randomskk> so what was weird about q6 then?
[20:54] <jonsowman> that really depends on what you're planning to do later
[20:55] <jonsowman> S2 is pretty useful
[20:55] <jonsowman> much more so than S1
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[20:55] <jonsowman> otoh, for engineering, I agree M > S
[20:55] <cuddykid> yeah, s2 is also quite abit easier than s1
[20:55] <DanielRichman> I'd prefer not to comment on question 6 before the markscheme is released at risk of embarassing myself
[20:55] <Randomskk> much more importantly m3 is way more interesting
[20:56] <Randomskk> sbasuita said the show-that was wrong
[20:56] <Randomskk> you called it a "unique gem"
[20:56] <Randomskk> if I could remember my graph theory I'd have a go, but
[20:56] <DanielRichman> well yeah I'm not going to rush to say that it was wrong given that these guys are meant to be good at this sort of thing
[20:56] <Randomskk> I did D1, briefly, after self-learning it in 3 days, over two years ago
[20:56] <Randomskk> and got a crap mark in it to boot
[20:57] <DanielRichman> however there was decided difficulty in getting the values they said you should get
[20:57] <DanielRichman> :-(
[20:57] <Randomskk> it's 6.ii that's weird?
[20:57] <DanielRichman> yeah
[20:58] <Randomskk> lol I remember all these words
[20:58] <Randomskk> d1 was really kinda fun, at least in theory
[20:58] <Randomskk> doing data structures and algorithms next year, maybe I'll get to do some of this again
[20:58] <Laurenceb_> ok hardware added https://github.com/Laurenceb/Dactyl/tree/master/Hardware
[20:59] <Laurenceb_> bom.xls needs a few changes
[21:00] <cuddykid> DanielRichman, what other subjects do you do?
[21:00] <DanielRichman> double maths chemistry physics german
[21:01] <cuddykid> replace german with econ and thats what I did
[21:01] <cuddykid> dropped chem this year... didn't get on well at all with it!
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[21:02] <DanielRichman> well out of the 4 I'm going to get my worst marks in Ger so that would go, if anything. Don't get to decide until september
[21:02] <Randomskk> chem a level sounds dull
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[21:03] <cuddykid> cool
[21:03] <Laurenceb_> chem a level is _hard_
[21:03] <DanielRichman> dull?
[21:03] <Randomskk> well mostly hard
[21:03] <DanielRichman> but what about the topics titled "CO2 VILLIAN TO SAVIOUR"
[21:03] <DanielRichman> that stuff is thrilling
[21:03] <Randomskk> and involves remembering like a billion colour changes as I hear it
[21:04] <Randomskk> tbh I didn't do chemistry AS even, so you're way ahead of me there
[21:04] <Randomskk> though I have now done two years of materials so
[21:04] <Randomskk> I could tell you all about steel :/
[21:10] <DanielRichman> anyway the 6ii argument is that their answers are 1.9 out. That's the sum of the weights of AB and FG
[21:10] <Randomskk> as though they'd forgotton those two paths and just worked it out for the inner square?
[21:11] <DanielRichman> it has been suggested that what they did was: it's a route inspection problem; so arcs will need to be repeated to make the graph Eularian. AB and FG obviously will be repeated, so ignore than and consider the route inspection problem with odd nodes BCEF
[21:11] <Randomskk> good use of the passive voice there
[21:11] <DanielRichman> repeating arcs BC and EF is gives the lowest total; if x<1.8 add (x+1.4) + (1.8+2.5) and if x>1.8 add 3.2 + (1.8+2.5)
[21:12] <DanielRichman> since if x<1.8 BDC is better than BC
[21:12] <DanielRichman> so add that to the total wt of the graph; 26.7+x+(x+1.4)+(1.8)+(2.5) = 32.4+2x which should look familiar
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[21:13] <DanielRichman> however you have not added the weight that must be added from repeating AB and FG; the real answer is 34.4+2x
[21:13] <DanielRichman> um. supposed real answer
[21:13] <jonsowman> What do you call a tooth in a litre of water? A one molar solution.
[21:13] <Randomskk> get out
[21:13] <DanielRichman> >.>
[21:13] <Randomskk> DanielRichman: I see
[21:13] <DanielRichman> similar for x>1.8
[21:14] <Randomskk> so you think either there is something very subtle going on that you didn't spot
[21:14] <Randomskk> or the examiners made a mistake, the checkers made a mistake, their checkers didn't notice and the paper got published? along with a presumably incorrect mark scheme?
[21:14] <DanielRichman> exactly- and that's why I'm reluctant to state flat out that its wrong
[21:14] <DanielRichman> yeah exactly
[21:14] <DanielRichman> that's completely rediculous
[21:14] <Randomskk> the good news is that they will likely just accept both workings/answers and award all the marks
[21:14] <Randomskk> if they made a mistake
[21:15] <DanielRichman> and the wasted time on the question would drag down the grade boundaries
[21:15] <Randomskk> and if they didn't, the paper was likely too hard and they'll mark it up accordingly
[21:15] <Randomskk> the main issue is the wasted time, yea
[21:15] <Randomskk> but yes, the grade boundaries get dragged down. hope you didn't waste too long on that Q
[21:15] <Randomskk> :P
[21:15] <Randomskk> tbh my totally uneducated opinion (especially as I haven't even tried the question) is that they made a mistake
[21:16] <DanielRichman> well I mean, after the 2 iteration simplex on question 4 I was thinking, well I'm kinda running short on time here. But it's ok there are two questions left
[21:16] <DanielRichman> then when 6ii happened.
[21:16] <Randomskk> D:
[21:16] <Randomskk> still, q6 is the last one right
[21:16] <DanielRichman> yup
[21:16] <DanielRichman> bit of a contrast to c1c2s1
[21:16] <Randomskk> did they go swimmingly?
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[21:17] <DanielRichman> they did indeed
[21:17] <Randomskk> that's good news
[21:17] <Snomi> DanielRichman told me where this is where all the chemistry jokes are at
[21:17] <Snomi> Is this the correct channel?
[21:17] <DanielRichman> who?
[21:17] <Randomskk> I have some excellent chemistry pick-up lines, if you'd like
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[21:17] <Snomi> yeah much appreciated Randomskk
[21:18] <DanielRichman> oh god.
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[21:18] <Snomi> could help with my preparation for tomorrow
[21:18] <Snomi> so I can woo the marker
[21:18] <Randomskk> my favourite ones are all biology but, well, "you're so attractive I cannot help but form hydrogen bonds with you".
[21:18] <Randomskk> these are crap, what
[21:18] <BrainDamage> bleh, all you need as pickup line, is a powerful anesthetic
[21:18] <Randomskk> "you must be a good benzene ring, because you are pleasantly aromatic"
[21:18] <Randomskk> this is why chemistry a level was shit
[21:19] <Randomskk> my DT was like "right boys, time to lube it up"
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[21:19] <Randomskk> is that an open valency in your pants or are you just happy to see me?
[21:20] <Randomskk> etc
[21:20] <Snomi> ok cool might write them in my exam if I have time
[21:20] <DanielRichman> along with the haikus
[21:20] <Snomi> haikus are standard
[21:20] <Snomi> they go in there anyway
[21:20] <Randomskk> can't hurt, right
[21:21] <Snomi> if anything the examiner will appreciate the flow of your writing
[21:21] <Snomi> and so be prepared to read it all
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[21:22] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[21:22] <Snomi> Randomskk: you said you had some biology ones to?
[21:22] <Snomi> too
[21:22] <Randomskk> my favourite one there is "if I could be any enzyme I wanted I'd be helicase so I could unzip your genes" though it works better spoken
[21:23] <Randomskk> but "you're so hot you denature my proteins" is also acceptable and would probably get me into bed
[21:23] <Snomi> ok cool
[21:23] <Randomskk> (both of those statements is a lie)
[21:23] <Snomi> D:
[21:23] <Randomskk> for crudeness, "if you were a concentration gradient I'd go down on you" also wins points
[21:23] <Snomi> hmm
[21:23] <Snomi> too obvious
[21:24] <Snomi> the subtle ones are better
[21:24] <Snomi> or the ones that don't really make sense
[21:24] <Randomskk> if we can stray into maths, "I wish I were your derivative" is quite subtle until you realise it is best followed with "... so I could lie tangent to your curves"
[21:24] <Snomi> ah
[21:25] <Lunar_Lander> Snomi what biology "ones"?
[21:25] <Snomi> Lunar_Lander: as opposed to chemistry ones
[21:25] <Snomi> or maths ones
[21:25] <Snomi> but maths is fine
[21:25] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[21:25] <Lunar_Lander> citations?
[21:25] <Lunar_Lander> jokes?
[21:25] <Lunar_Lander> experiments?
[21:25] <Snomi> yes
[21:25] <Lunar_Lander> ah
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[21:26] <Snomi> DanielRichman: ^
[21:26] <DanielRichman> Snomi: I'm seriously regretting that now.
[21:26] <Snomi> DanielRichman: so am I
[21:26] <amar|nanda> sup biatch
[21:26] <DanielRichman> k cya I'm going back to F322
[21:27] <Snomi> Thanks for your help Randomskk
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[21:27] <Lunar_Lander> so how is balloning going DanielRichman Randomskk?
[21:28] <amar|nanda> how is landing on the moon going Lunar_Lander
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> better don't ask
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> my father is quite angry about me
[21:29] <Randomskk> is that a high altitude balloon in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?
[21:30] <Lunar_Lander> lol
[21:30] <Randomskk> I guess that works even better as a canister of helium, actually
[21:31] <Lunar_Lander> ah Justin Bieber again ran into a glass door
[21:31] <DanielRichman> interesting. Snomi and i were trying to persuade swappingn from Skype -> IRC, what with skype4linux being terrible and everything. Didn't work. It seems that the way to encourage people to use irc is chemistry pick up lines
[21:31] <Lunar_Lander> that is good news
[21:31] <Randomskk> why wouldn't you want chemistry pick up lines
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[21:31] <Lunar_Lander> hi nelly11
[21:31] <SpeedEvil> np: If I said you had a beautiful burrette would you hold it against me.
[21:32] <Randomskk> it's funny how superior IRC is for group chat compared to almost anything since
[21:32] <nelly11> hey! lunar_lander
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> how's life?
[21:32] <nelly11> pretty good at the moment! :)
[21:32] <nelly11> how about yours?
[21:34] <Laurenceb_> ib/CMSIS_CM3/stm32f10x.h:346: error: two or more data types in declaration specifiers
[21:34] <Laurenceb_> ^huh?
[21:34] <Lunar_Lander> nelly11
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[21:34] <Lunar_Lander> my father is quite angry about me
[21:34] <Randomskk> paste the line in question?
[21:34] <Lunar_Lander> but
[21:34] <Lunar_Lander> Justin Bieber again ran into a glass door
[21:34] <Lunar_Lander> that is good
[21:34] <nelly11_> hahaha
[21:34] <fsphil> that would make anyone's day
[21:35] <Laurenceb_> typedef enum {FALSE = 0, TRUE = !FALSE} bool;
[21:35] <Randomskk> ...no idea
[21:35] <Laurenceb_> i tried added #ifndef TRUE
[21:35] <Laurenceb_> but that doesnt help
[21:35] <Randomskk> maybe some new library code you added defines TRUE and FALSE or bool
[21:35] <Lunar_Lander> but now I go to bed :)
[21:35] <Lunar_Lander> good night :)
[21:35] <nelly11_> good night!
[21:35] <Laurenceb_> it does
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[21:36] <Laurenceb_> but i added ifndef TRUE
[21:36] <Laurenceb_> hmm maybe bool is defined somewhere
[21:36] <Laurenceb_> oh wait if it doesnt define it there things will break
[21:36] <Laurenceb_> grr ill have to change things in rprintf
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[21:37] <Snomi> [21:32] <Randomskk> it's funny how superior IRC is for group chat compared to almost anything
[21:37] <Snomi> I agree
[21:37] <Laurenceb_> ./Util/Fatfs/rtc.c:#include <stdbool.h>
[21:37] <Laurenceb_> wait what
[21:38] <Laurenceb_> stdbool.h never knew that existed
[21:38] <Laurenceb_> thats probably the issue
[21:38] <Laurenceb_> part of fatfs
[21:38] <Randomskk> Laurenceb_: indeed
[21:38] <Randomskk> Snomi: for me it beats out using msn or skype group chat by miles
[21:38] <Snomi> yup
[21:38] <Randomskk> though the lack of webcam/audio support means skype still has a place for some kinds of conversations
[21:38] <Snomi> skype sucks
[21:38] <Snomi> msn group chats are a joke
[21:38] <Randomskk> but yea, irc is where it's at
[21:39] <Laurenceb_> you can do other stuff whilst using irc
[21:39] <jonsowman> skype is good for video calls
[21:39] <jonsowman> but apart from that, <3 IRC
[21:39] <Laurenceb_> skype you have to give ~100% attention
[21:39] <Snomi> some people argue that skype is best for calls
[21:39] <Snomi> Laurenceb_: ya
[21:39] <Snomi> Laurenceb_: although they tried to implement hilighting
[21:39] <Randomskk> I do enjoy skype's ability to edit previous chat messages, that said
[21:40] <Snomi> yeah
[21:40] <Snomi> but it's not a good function
[21:41] <Laurenceb_> im always learning new c features
[21:41] <fsphil> C is great
[21:41] <Randomskk> bloody C
[21:41] <DanielRichman> burn the heretic
[21:41] <Laurenceb_> today i discovered stdbool, variable number of arguments and pointers ot functions
[21:41] <Randomskk> my kingdom for python running on my stm32 as fast as C would :(
[21:41] <Laurenceb_> and i thought i knew it :P
[21:41] <Randomskk> varargs and pointers to functions are both pretty great
[21:41] <Randomskk> though tbh pointers to functions? that always seemed pretty standard
[21:42] <Laurenceb_> heh yeah i need to read a c book
[21:42] <Randomskk> I didn't know about stdbool and apparently the cmsis people either didn't or didn't care to include it :P
[21:42] <fsphil> didn't know that one either
[21:42] <DanielRichman> stdbool.h just has #define true 1, #define false 0 in it?
[21:42] <Randomskk> DanielRichman: I played with couchdb some more recently, it's really super great. I'm getting better at this views lark
[21:43] <Randomskk> I used it to fetch and analyse social network data from facebook! very web twopointohy
[21:43] <DanielRichman> :o cool
[21:43] <Laurenceb_> ewww facewhat
[21:43] <Randomskk> in time I really should have been spending doing revision :P
[21:43] <BrainDamage> try #define true false
[21:44] <Randomskk> BrainDamage: hah you think that's bad, try python
[21:44] <BrainDamage> and watch programs going nuts
[21:44] <Laurenceb_> ill put #ifndef bool
[21:44] <BrainDamage> I use python for numerical computation
[21:44] <Laurenceb_> no wait thats not a define
[21:44] <Laurenceb_> grrrr
[21:44] Action: fsphil is python impaired
[21:44] <Randomskk> BrainDamage: http://pastie.org/1978211
[21:45] <BrainDamage> hah, nice
[21:46] <Laurenceb_> commenting out stdbool fixed it
[21:46] <Laurenceb_> its just asking for a SD card config header file now
[21:46] <Laurenceb_> which im too tired to write now :P
[21:47] <Laurenceb_> can someone explain what droxygen does?
[21:47] <Randomskk> droxygen or doxygen?
[21:47] <BrainDamage> doxygen is a documentation generator
[21:47] <Laurenceb_> oh doxygen
[21:47] <Randomskk> doxygen looks for comments in your source file and extracts them to provide html/latex documentation
[21:48] <BrainDamage> it parses your source files
[21:48] <Laurenceb_> oh i see
[21:48] <Randomskk> comments follow a specific markup to indicate parameters, return values, etc
[21:48] <Randomskk> great for making sexy APIs
[21:48] <Laurenceb_> so is * @brief Configures the I2C1 interface
[21:48] <Laurenceb_> the @ is for doxygen?
[21:48] <Randomskk> https://randomskk.net/u/idp_docs/namespaceIDP.html is a sexy example jonsowman and I did for a project this year
[21:48] <BrainDamage> yes
[21:48] <Randomskk> the @brief is a doxygen command saying "the following line is the brief description for this class/function/whatever"
[21:48] <Laurenceb_> sweet
[21:48] <jonsowman> urgh IDP
[21:49] <Laurenceb_> i need to run this
[21:49] <jonsowman> get it away from me
[21:49] <Randomskk> Laurenceb_: try doxywizard to generate your doxyfile (config file) then touch up the doxyfile by hand
[21:49] <Laurenceb_> but is there a way to host documentation on github?
[21:49] <Randomskk> well yes and no
[21:49] <Randomskk> github will host static html pages for you
[21:49] <Randomskk> so yes, you can
[21:49] <Randomskk> but I've never done it
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> ok
[21:50] <Randomskk> github also features a wiki which a lot of people use, per repo, which you can just write stuff in
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> interesting
[21:50] <Randomskk> a lot of projects use the wiki for documentation etc
[21:50] <Randomskk> though if you did use doxygen, you could host those html files on github.
[21:51] <DanielRichman> the procedure for creating the branch used to make github host static files is black magic but after that it's fairly straight forward
[21:51] <DanielRichman> used it on one repo; works great
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[22:00] <jonsowman> that's unusual
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[22:09] <Laurenceb_> ok 84KB with rtc, and fat added
[22:09] <Randomskk> nice
[22:10] <Laurenceb_> i havent setup the spi properly and stuff, but that shouldnt change things much
[22:10] <Laurenceb_> only major things to add are pid loops and si4432 comms
[22:10] <Laurenceb_> as lots of tidy up
[22:11] <Laurenceb_> *and
[22:12] <Laurenceb_> slightly worrying http://elm-chan.org/docs/mmc/mmc_e.html
[22:13] <Laurenceb_> http://elm-chan.org/docs/mmc/do_diag.png
[22:13] <SpeedEvil> :)
[22:13] <SpeedEvil> So this is the completed board?
[22:13] <Laurenceb_> very lucky i put a resistor between the si4432 and usd
[22:13] <SpeedEvil> Or are you just doing the sw
[22:13] <Laurenceb_> the thing on github? yes
[22:13] <Laurenceb_> board was finished a couple of weeks ago
[22:13] <Laurenceb_> oh i have ~10 pcbs spare if anyone wants some :P
[22:14] <SpeedEvil> :)
[22:14] <Randomskk> everything soldered up?
[22:14] <Laurenceb_> apart from gps
[22:14] <Laurenceb_> im waiting for kapton tape - also xtal nees swapping
[22:14] <Laurenceb_> kapton under the fsa03 - theres some solder clinging to vias
[22:14] <Laurenceb_> im worried it may work its way through the solder stop
[22:15] <Laurenceb_> on the fsa03 and do bad stuff
[22:15] <Randomskk> solder stop is quite good at stopping solder
[22:15] <Randomskk> but yes, some tape can't hurt
[22:15] <Laurenceb_> yeah but i may as well do a proper job
[22:15] <Randomskk> indeed
[22:15] <Randomskk> and besides
[22:15] <Randomskk> the more kapton tape the better
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[22:17] <Laurenceb_> https://github.com/Laurenceb/Dactyl/tree/master/Hardware/Schematics
[22:18] <Randomskk> might be an idea to upload the eagle sch and brd files
[22:18] <Randomskk> if you want
[22:18] <Laurenceb_> a few things can be simplified with the new version of the lsm303dlh
[22:18] <Laurenceb_> oops yeah i missed them
[22:18] <Randomskk> also you should totally fill the polygons before exporting pngs :P
[22:19] <Laurenceb_> theres a ton of libraries for eagle
[22:19] <Laurenceb_> heh it looks more pretty like that
[22:19] <BrainDamage> you really need a README in the repo with a project description
[22:19] <BrainDamage> what's it for? I'm guessing a flight computer
[22:19] <Laurenceb_> lol ok ok one thing at a time
[22:19] <Laurenceb_> :P
[22:21] <natrium42> echo README > README
[22:26] <Laurenceb_> lol
[22:28] <Laurenceb_> turns out openpilot is larger as it includes cal code
[22:28] <Laurenceb_> have i already said this?
[22:29] Action: Laurenceb_ has kind of lost the plot
[22:30] <Laurenceb_> - their ahrs code
[22:33] <Laurenceb_> right i need to get some shut eye, cya all
[22:33] <Randomskk> seeya
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[00:00] --- Fri May 27 2011