highaltitude.log.20110520

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[01:19] <W0OTM> iHAB-5 Recovery Video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zqvl1dpjaOs
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[02:07] Nick change: CountX_ -> KF5KWE
[02:33] <Gnea> W0OTM: nice
[02:33] <W0OTM> LOL
[02:33] <W0OTM> it was ALOT of fun!
[02:33] <Gnea> looks like it
[02:33] <Gnea> we did one yesterday, sent an egg up 77,297 feet and it survived, not a single crack
[02:34] <Gnea> it sure was cold, though!
[02:36] <Gnea> that also explains why the resistor didn't expend as much heat as you needed, perhaps with some better shielding you might be able to get that part to work
[03:14] <natrium> W0OTM: ^
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[03:17] <natrium> W0OTM: what did you use the ipad for?
[03:20] <natrium> lol, cool chase
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[03:21] <W0OTM> natrium: I have the tracker on it
[03:22] <W0OTM> I tether from my iphone when I chase
[03:22] <natrium> ah, neat
[03:22] <natrium> impressive 3g coverage
[03:22] <W0OTM> thanks to Verizon
[03:22] <W0OTM> :)
[03:23] <W0OTM> the tracker worked well
[03:23] <W0OTM> really the first time I have used it in action to display APRS data
[03:24] <natrium> good to hear!
[03:29] <natrium> should add that to spacenear.us too
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[07:01] <griffonbot> Received email: Allen Sklar "RE: [UKHAS] Re: A few questions about balloons"
[07:09] <SamSilver> bbl
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[09:38] <NigeyS> morning
[09:38] <SpeedEvil> Perhaps.
[09:38] <NigeyS> hey speedy
[09:39] <SpeedEvil> (I'm actuallydressed, and about to leave for the bus, so that's pretty good evidence.
[09:39] <NigeyS> lol im up, but coffee b4 i hit the shower!
[09:39] <NigeyS> how goes the solar kettle btw? :D
[09:40] <SpeedEvil> I'm still working out exactly how I'm going to get it on the roof.
[09:40] <SpeedEvil> At the moment, I have it connected to a barrel outside, with a hot water tap.
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[09:41] <NigeyS> cool, seems to be working nicely mind
[09:41] <SpeedEvil> Yeah - even on cloudy days, it will heat 40l from 11-40 or so.
[09:42] <NigeyS> :o blimey
[09:42] <SpeedEvil> Well - cloudy+ a bit warm days
[09:42] <SpeedEvil> It's not going to do that in winter.
[09:43] <SpeedEvil> But it should be useful for at least 8 months of the year.
[09:43] <SpeedEvil> With it providing all hot water needs for around 6
[09:43] <NigeyS> 8 months is pretty dam good
[09:43] <SpeedEvil> Without anything else.
[09:43] <SpeedEvil> For 300 quid.
[09:43] <SpeedEvil> Well - and a leetle pump.
[09:43] <NigeyS> that's my quarterly gas bill in the winter
[09:44] <SpeedEvil> And I'd need a 60 quid or so heat exchanger.
[09:44] <NigeyS> still, for say .. 400quid, it's going to save you 10 times that within a few years
[09:46] <SpeedEvil> It's a bit complicated by the fact that I'm likely to be using it more, rather than economising on hot for bills reasons.
[09:46] <SpeedEvil> So it's a comfort measure too.
[09:46] <SpeedEvil> But yes.
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[09:47] <NigeyS> either way, for a small investment, you get a saving that'll get better over time, win win
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[09:48] <NigeyS> todays task is ... design a cryoprobe .. oh the joys
[09:51] <Laurenceb> cant you connect directly to hot water tank?
[09:56] <NigeyS> god why is morning radio so crap nowadays :(
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[10:35] <eroomde> NigeyS: radio 4
[10:35] <NigeyS> already there :D everything else is just utter rubbish!!
[10:36] <eroomde> it automaticallt turns on at 7am in our house
[10:36] <eroomde> my alarm clock, the kitchen radio, and my housemate's iphone
[10:36] <eroomde> they all spring into acton
[10:37] <NigeyS> haha that's pretty neat!
[10:38] <fsphil> everything here springs into action in the mornings except me
[10:41] <NigeyS> i have no spring until at least 3 pm!
[10:45] <Elwell> anything better than fstream for R4 on the iphone?
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[10:46] <Laurenceb> and random opamp amplifier
[10:46] <Laurenceb> *any
[10:47] <Laurenceb> if you screw up youll get R4 longwave
[10:47] <Laurenceb> its that strong
[10:47] <Randomskk> my radio will pick it up without an antenna :P
[10:56] <fsphil> I received R4 on a bt878 capture card + wire
[10:56] <fsphil> the audio chip can do something like 400khz
[10:59] <jontyw> eroomde, hmm, hadn't though to have the kitchen radio come on
[10:59] Action: jontyw will implement that tonight
[10:59] <Elwell> soundbridge ftw
[11:00] <Elwell> cronnable wget from server to turn on :-)
[11:00] <eroomde> jontyw: yeah, it's good
[11:00] <eroomde> having noise from downstrairs wafting up the strais seems to make it easier to get up
[11:00] <Elwell> general music till nearly at the o-clock for news
[11:00] Action: LazyLeopard has radio 4 on a timer as a wake-up... This morning's wake-up was discussing the destruction of the remaining stocks of smallpox...
[11:01] <Laurenceb> http://cybertrench.com/vtail/cc-gps.jpg
[11:01] <Elwell> nice
[11:01] <Laurenceb> everything i think of gets done by someone else :(
[11:01] <Laurenceb> flywings vtrainer uav
[11:01] <Randomskk> I know that feeling
[11:01] <Laurenceb> also beta version of single board openpilot
[11:01] <Randomskk> just have to do it better
[11:02] <Laurenceb> its using mediatec gps
[11:03] <Laurenceb> http://cybertrench.com/vtail/cc-right.jpg
[11:03] <Laurenceb> hot
[11:04] <jontyw> Laurenceb, you just need to start building things instead of talking about them. Ideas are formed by filling in the blanks between current concepts - some people can see slightly further into the future than others, but at some point someone else will inevitably implement something similar to your vision.
[11:04] <Laurenceb> heh well said
[11:05] <jontyw> :P
[11:06] <jontyw> I've estimated my idea lead time at about 6 months, which gives me about three months to build anything and beat someone else to it.
[11:07] <Laurenceb> about 2 years ago i was thinking of making something like funcube dongle
[11:08] <Laurenceb> but decided it was impossible :/
[11:08] <Laurenceb> still dont get if/how they make it work
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[11:09] <fsphil> however it works, it's not good near strong transmitters - when I tested mine last week on the mountain, the tower there pretty much wiped it out even before I got close
[11:10] <fsphil> radio tower that is
[11:14] <LazyLeopard> Erf. Some hideous periodic HF interference here at present... something like 2 seconds on 3 seconds off, pushing S9 on 40, 30 and 20 metres...
[11:15] <Randomskk> power line networking? :D
[11:15] <Laurenceb> yeah this is what i thought
[11:15] <Laurenceb> the DVBT receiver ics have a ton of haronics on the LO
[11:15] <Laurenceb> thats why i didnt think itd work
[11:16] <Laurenceb> obviously it 'works' to an extent
[11:16] <Laurenceb> *harmonics
[11:16] <Laurenceb> each harmonic going into the mixer gives you another receiver 'sideband'
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[11:41] <Randomskk> Laurenceb: I've just updated my STM32_SkeletonProject git repo
[11:41] <Randomskk> it now has the latest stm32 std peripheral library and USB library and a new makefile with support for the value line and XL devices
[11:42] <Laurenceb> nice
[11:43] <Randomskk> doing a chibiOS skeleton project now
[11:45] <Laurenceb> nice
[11:45] <Laurenceb> i2c looks fiarly unchanged
[11:45] <Laurenceb> better comments
[11:53] <LazyLeopard> Hmmm... I can hear that interference all the way from 160 metres to 2 metres... Wonder if someone's doing a lot of arc welding somewhere nearby...
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[11:56] <fsphil> 2m affected too -- that's unusual
[12:05] <Randomskk> Laurenceb: https://github.com/adamgreig/STM32_ChibiOSProject
[12:07] <Laurenceb> interesting * Port D setup.
[12:07] <Laurenceb> * Everything input with pull-up except:
[12:07] <Laurenceb> * PD0 - Normal input (XTAL).
[12:07] <Laurenceb> * PD1 - Normal input (XTAL).
[12:07] <Randomskk> I wrote that
[12:07] <Randomskk> I'm not actually sure why though
[12:07] <Laurenceb> do you need to configure gpio at all to use xtal?
[12:07] <Randomskk> wait, did I?
[12:07] <Randomskk> I think that may have been from the example
[12:08] <Randomskk> not sure
[12:08] <Randomskk> I mean, it works
[12:08] <Randomskk> also I'd have thought it'd be alt function
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[12:08] <Laurenceb> hmm interesting - maybe thats the source of my xtal issues
[12:09] <Laurenceb> do you have any projects where you uses external xtal?
[12:09] <Laurenceb> - no rtos ones
[12:09] <Randomskk> I've used external xtals on everything
[12:09] <Randomskk> https://github.com/adamgreig/STM32_SkeletonProject
[12:10] <Randomskk> ^ is up to date, compiles, runs on this board with an external osc
[12:10] <Randomskk> or at least I assume it's using the external osc.. :P
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[12:10] <Laurenceb> heh
[12:11] <Randomskk> https://github.com/adamgreig/STM32_SkeletonProject/blob/master/lib/CMSIS_CM3/system_stm32f10x.c is where clock setting up magic happens
[12:12] <Randomskk> doesn't appear to touch the gpio
[12:12] <Randomskk> however
[12:12] <Randomskk> I think it's just that
[12:12] <Randomskk> normally the things are inputs
[12:12] <Randomskk> which is the '4' in that board.h
[12:12] <Randomskk> however everything else there is actually 8
[12:12] <Randomskk> input pulled high
[12:12] <Randomskk> well, input pulled, anyway
[12:13] <Randomskk> and so perhaps not configuring the gpio on xtal is fine, but configuring it to be pulled would be bad
[12:13] <Laurenceb> hmm so the xtal doesnt need gpio config
[12:13] <Laurenceb> yeah
[12:13] <Laurenceb> datasheet does say xtal must be <16mhz
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[12:15] <Randomskk> I guess that's the issue
[12:15] <Randomskk> hmm, could you have a quick look at this thing I've put together for boot0 for my motor controller? I'm not sure if I'm doing something very silly
[12:16] <Randomskk> trying to get it so that when DTR is asserted on the incoming serial, the device resets and boots into bootloader mode
[12:16] <Laurenceb> k
[12:16] <Randomskk> https://randomskk.net/u/minimoc.pdf in the centre of the page, bottom left of the ARM box
[12:17] <Laurenceb> ooh kicad
[12:17] <Laurenceb> i found the graphics too annoying
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[12:18] <Laurenceb> hmm
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[12:19] <Laurenceb> C16 needs to be larger?
[12:19] <Laurenceb> i think it wont work when it comes out of reset
[12:21] <Laurenceb> maybe a cap on boot0 to keep it high
[12:21] <Randomskk> I've used 100n before for that and it works
[12:21] <Laurenceb> interesting
[12:21] <Randomskk> though admittedly I didn't have the 100n C16 on it too, just one in series with dtr
[12:22] <Laurenceb> thatll act like a potential divider
[12:23] <Randomskk> yea, I was concerned about that
[12:23] <Laurenceb> so use say 470n
[12:23] <Randomskk> for which?
[12:23] <Laurenceb> for C16, and put a cap on BOOT0 as well
[12:24] <Randomskk> a cap between BOOT0 and ground?
[12:24] <Laurenceb> to keep it high after reset goes high again
[12:24] <Laurenceb> yes
[12:24] <Laurenceb> 1u or 470n or something
[12:24] <Randomskk> I don't want BOOT0 high after reset goes high necessarily
[12:25] <Randomskk> just before programming, DTR will go low and stay low until finished
[12:25] <Laurenceb> hmm
[12:25] <Randomskk> when DTR goes low, it brings NRST low briefly, but then NRST charges up through its internal pullup, bringing the device out of reset
[12:25] <Laurenceb> oh
[12:25] <Laurenceb> got it
[12:25] <Randomskk> but DTR is still low, so BOOT0 is still being held high by the PNP
[12:25] <Randomskk> well, by the p-channel mosfet
[12:25] <Laurenceb> i didnt realise DRT was held low
[12:26] <Randomskk> then if DTR is floating or high, the mosfet is off and R10 brings BOOT0 low for normal booting
[12:26] <Laurenceb> ok that should work then
[12:26] <Randomskk> though thinking about it I'll need some other way to reset the thing without bringing it into bootload mode, hmm
[12:26] <Laurenceb> power cycle XD
[12:26] <Randomskk> ooh actually
[12:26] <Randomskk> a quick hack on stm32loader.py
[12:27] <Randomskk> and it now starts running code as soon as bootloading's finished
[12:27] <Randomskk> neat
[12:27] <Laurenceb> oh
[12:27] <Randomskk> despite BOOT0 still being "wrong"
[12:27] <Laurenceb> is that on github?
[12:27] <Randomskk> it's about to be
[12:27] <Laurenceb> that annoyed me about loader :P
[12:28] <Randomskk> it is now
[12:29] <Laurenceb> does makefile need changing?
[12:29] <Randomskk> hmm it works for my skeleton project but not my chibios project
[12:29] <Randomskk> no
[12:29] <Randomskk> just stm32loader.py
[12:29] <Laurenceb> cool
[12:29] <Randomskk> it just sends the GO command at the end
[12:29] <Randomskk> so you reckon just change C16 for like a 470n?
[12:30] <Randomskk> tempted to just remove C20 instead
[12:30] <Randomskk> as I already have plenty of 100ns on the bom
[12:30] <Laurenceb> yeah
[12:30] <Laurenceb> http://pastebin.com/xN4LytZU
[12:30] <Laurenceb> i redid the i2c read code
[12:30] <Laurenceb> havent tested yet..
[12:31] Action: Laurenceb is currently getting very annoyed with voltage spikes on his Xscale board
[12:32] <Randomskk> Laurenceb: hmm, dunno whether making sure there's 100n to ground on NRST is a good idea
[12:32] <Randomskk> I mean, my other boards haven't bothered and they work
[12:32] <Randomskk> but it is in the datasheet
[12:32] <Laurenceb> ive used it
[12:32] <Randomskk> otoh if I do that and have 100n from DTR it does make a potential divider and potentially :(
[12:32] <LazyLeopard> fsphil: Erf. Brain-fade. Should have said 6 metres, not 2...
[12:32] <Randomskk> hang on though, it makes a weird divider
[12:32] <Randomskk> as dtr will be 0
[12:32] <Randomskk> and the other capacitor goes to 0
[12:33] <Randomskk> so it's just two capacitors in parallel to 0
[12:33] <Randomskk> when dtr is high it's going to be like a capacitor and the pullup in parallel to +, and the other cap to 0
[12:35] <Laurenceb> yeah but the C to gnd has previously been pulled up
[12:35] <Laurenceb> so where doe sthe charge go?
[12:35] <Laurenceb> other than into the cap to DTR
[12:35] <Laurenceb> so its a pot divider
[12:37] <Randomskk> ah, I see what you mean
[12:37] <Laurenceb> hmm thats quite nice - i have a drt on my cp2102
[12:37] <Randomskk> yea
[12:38] <Laurenceb> might do that on v2 of dactyl
[12:38] <Randomskk> the trick is what arduino uses to reset when you program it
[12:38] <Randomskk> their ftdi chip has dtr wired to reset through a capacitor
[12:38] <Randomskk> and their bootloader runs at every boot
[12:38] <Laurenceb> yeah
[12:38] <Laurenceb> i cant use ftdi
[12:38] <Randomskk> just for half a second or so, to see if anyone's trying to bootload, then loads user code
[12:38] <Randomskk> in this case there's the extra annoyance of boot0
[12:38] <Randomskk> but that transistor might just d it
[12:38] <Randomskk> do*
[12:42] <Laurenceb> ooh its working
[12:42] <Laurenceb> kind of
[12:42] <Laurenceb> one axis is corrupted and it keeps swapping the corrupted axis
[12:42] <Randomskk> that's a lot better than not talking, though, I guess?
[12:43] <Laurenceb> heh yes - probably something to do with pointers
[12:43] <Laurenceb> looks like i made polled i2c work XD
[12:43] <Laurenceb> ha +1 on openpilot
[12:46] <Laurenceb> oh doh - signed rather than unsigned ints
[12:47] <Randomskk> :) I'm glad it's not all a solved problem
[12:47] <Randomskk> would hate to think openpilot had solved everything
[12:48] <Laurenceb> it is a very cool project
[12:48] <Randomskk> yes
[12:48] <Randomskk> it certainly is
[12:48] <Laurenceb> shame about the hardware
[12:48] <Laurenceb> but they are simplifying it a bit now
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[12:55] <Randomskk> Laurenceb: you were totally right, with two capacitors on it wouldn't make a reset pulse at all
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[13:00] <Randomskk> Laurenceb: do you think putting 10n to ground and keeping the one to DTR 100n would do?
[13:00] <Laurenceb> probably
[13:00] <Randomskk> alternatively I could put a 1u to DTR and keep 100n to gnd
[13:00] <Randomskk> the 1u definitely works, just tested, but it takes like tens of ms to come out of reset
[13:01] <Laurenceb> interesting
[13:01] <Randomskk> well I say that
[13:01] <Randomskk> I'm just looking at a scope
[13:01] <Randomskk> and faking up its input pin with a ~10k pullup
[13:01] <Randomskk> but still
[13:01] <eroomde> Randomskk: you had a pic of your pc/desk up asomewhere iirc?
[13:02] <Randomskk> https://randomskk.net/u/anns_l11_3.JPG ?
[13:02] <eroomde> yup
[13:02] <Randomskk> or maybe https://randomskk.net/u/anns_l11_1.JPG
[13:04] <eroomde> lots of good desk space coming
[13:04] <Laurenceb> heh nice
[13:04] <eroomde> coming?
[13:04] <eroomde> lots of good desk space *
[13:04] <Laurenceb> moving in as a civil partner?
[13:05] <eroomde> thanks laurenceb
[13:05] <Laurenceb> sorry i could resist
[13:06] <Laurenceb> *couldnt
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[13:12] <eroomde> https://randomskk.net/u/anns_l11_3.JPG xkcd book on the coffee table Randomskk ?
[13:13] <Randomskk> indeed
[13:13] <Randomskk> also dinosaur comics, a softer world, several others
[13:13] <BrainDamage> dinosaur comics do not match with xkcd
[13:14] <Randomskk> it turns out it is possible to enjoy two things that are not the same
[13:14] <BrainDamage> no, I mean http://xkcd.com/135/ and http://xkcd.com/87/
[13:15] <Randomskk> haha well, fair enough
[13:23] <m1x10> ping fsphil
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[13:26] <griffonbot> @W0OTM: iHAB-5 Post Flight Analysis, Photos, and Video are now posted! http://www.ihabproject.com/iHAB-5/ #arhab #gpsl #hamradio [http://twitter.com/W0OTM/status/71567437887324161]
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[13:27] <griffonbot> @Hamradio_Ticker: RT @w0otm: iHAB-5 Post Flight Analysis, Photos, and Video are now posted! http://www.ihabproject.com/iHAB-5/ #arhab #gpsl #hamradio [http://twitter.com/Hamradio_Ticker/status/71567839886188546]
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[13:41] <LazyLeopard> Hmmm... I guess at least one of iHAB-5's balloons burst a little earlier than expected...
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[14:02] <W0OTM> LazyLeopard: I didn't really know what to expect
[14:02] <W0OTM> :)
[14:02] <W0OTM> \
[14:02] <W0OTM> I will say im not really impress with those party balloons. we had one pop as we were filling
[14:02] <natrium> eek
[14:03] <natrium> those were regular party baloons?
[14:03] <W0OTM> they just dont have alot of stretch
[14:03] <W0OTM> yeah, 36" heavy latex
[14:03] <natrium> ah
[14:03] <W0OTM> used for commercial advertising
[14:04] <W0OTM> have a real thick wall, but dont have alot of stretch
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[14:05] Action: Laurenceb doesnt get dinosaur comics
[14:05] <Laurenceb> its the same image macro
[14:06] <natrium> hehe
[14:06] <natrium> Laurenceb: so did rapture start in parts of the world?
[14:06] <NigeyS> naaaaatrium
[14:06] <natrium> NiiiiiiiGeyS
[14:06] <NigeyS> did you get deported? lol
[14:06] <Laurenceb> huh
[14:06] <natrium> lolwat
[14:06] <Laurenceb> its supposed to start already?
[14:07] <NigeyS> lol you had such a brief visit i thought you'd been deported or something :P
[14:07] <NigeyS> Laurenceb, ya, so if people start suddenly disapearing...
[14:07] <BrainDamage> http://i52.tinypic.com/24eauu0.jpg
[14:08] <natrium> NigeyS: i was travelling for 3 weeks, though!@
[14:08] <natrium> ukraine, russia, belarus and uk
[14:08] <NigeyS> oh aye
[14:08] Action: Laurenceb checks world cock
[14:08] <NigeyS> did you purposely chose all of the coldest places to visit? lol
[14:09] <Laurenceb> ah australia
[14:10] <Laurenceb> any missing australians?
[14:10] <NigeyS> not that i know of ...
[14:10] <Darkside> Laurenceb: the world cock eh?
[14:10] <Laurenceb> +l
[14:10] <NigeyS> ah there we go Ds is here, that proves rapture is a load of shite, or DS is unholy...lol
[14:10] <Darkside> what?
[14:11] <Darkside> nah it strts 6pm local time on the 21st
[14:11] <Darkside> still the 20th here
[14:11] <Darkside> :-)
[14:11] <NigeyS> damn lol
[14:11] <Darkside> and of course i'm unholy
[14:11] <Darkside> i'm a godless heathen
[14:11] <Darkside> i'm the secretary the atheist club at uni
[14:11] <Darkside> secretary of*
[14:11] <NigeyS> :o
[14:12] <natrium> NigeyS: i got roots in russia and ukraine :P
[14:12] <natrium> ping juxta
[14:12] <natrium> did juxta rapture?
[14:12] <Darkside> lol
[14:12] <Darkside> he's around
[14:12] <Darkside> natrium: your'e off by many hours
[14:12] <Darkside> accordint o harold camping, it starts at 6pm local time
[14:13] <natrium> aaah
[14:13] <natrium> how soon is that?
[14:13] Action: juxta is about
[14:13] <natrium> \o/
[14:13] <natrium> Darkside: when is 6pm?
[14:13] <NigeyS> yey he's still with us
[14:13] <Darkside> 8:30UTC i think
[14:13] <natrium> juxta: did you repent and accept jesus as your saviour yet?
[14:14] <natrium> it's not too late
[14:14] <juxta> thank goodness for that
[14:14] <eroomde> natrium: thanks for the photo
[14:15] <natrium> :)
[14:15] <SamSilver> bbl
[14:16] <Elwell> pair of wellies on pavement with some dry ice in :-)
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[14:16] <Darkside> hahaha
[14:16] <Darkside> good idea Elwell
[14:16] <Darkside> but i dn't think we have any of the loonies around our parts
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[14:17] <NigeyS> gonna be alot of p*ssed off people around on sunday when they realise it was all a load of trash!
[14:21] <natrium> :D
[14:21] <natrium> NigeyS: there was a proposal to leave old clothes on the street
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[14:21] <NigeyS> :O
[14:24] <Laurenceb> heh
[14:29] <KF5KWE> about how cold do people's payloads get internally?
[14:31] <jonsowman> http://www.hexoc.com/pages/apex/apex-ii/launch-2-data.php
[14:33] Nick change: jontyw -> press
[14:33] Nick change: press -> jontyw
[14:34] <KF5KWE> -30c?
[14:34] <KF5KWE> wow that chilly
[14:34] <NigeyS> it can get as low as -50
[14:34] <KF5KWE> I could only test at -6
[14:35] <Elwell> is the 100mb line a detector low limit in those graphs?
[14:35] <jonsowman> Elwell: it was a free sample from freescale that only goes down to ~100mb
[14:35] <jonsowman> so yes
[14:37] <NigeyS> rssi ?
[14:37] <jonsowman> received signal strength indicator
[14:37] <NigeyS> ah
[14:37] <jonsowman> you can see three peaks where we did uplink
[14:37] <jonsowman> :)
[14:38] <NigeyS> yups
[14:38] <jonsowman> interesting to note the higher noise floor in the air as well
[14:38] <KF5KWE> your batteries went down in voltage then back up?
[14:38] <jonsowman> the landing point is very obvious from that trace
[14:38] <KF5KWE> what type of batteries?
[14:38] <jonsowman> KF5KWE: yes that happens
[14:38] <jonsowman> terminal voltage will drop with temperature
[14:38] <jonsowman> energizer lithiums
[14:38] <KF5KWE> I couldn't get that result from my tests
[14:39] <KF5KWE> ofcourse as I said I could only get -6c
[14:39] <jonsowman> the maximum drop is <0.5V
[14:39] <jonsowman> so nothing to worry about really
[14:39] <KF5KWE> using li-ion cells here
[14:40] <jonsowman> li-ions lose capacity badly with temperature
[14:40] <jonsowman> did you test under load?
[14:40] <jonsowman> and what load current?
[14:40] <KF5KWE> pretty low power
[14:41] <KF5KWE> everything I read said li-ions are best at low temps
[14:41] <jonsowman> their internal resistance drops
[14:41] <Dan-K2VOL> KF5KWE in the daytime there's no reason to get below freezing, the solar input is large, particularly if you use a dark color and seal holes in the boxes
[14:41] <jonsowman> but the effect of losing capacity is significantly worse
[14:42] <Dan-K2VOL> KF5KWE energizer e2 ultimate lithium AA batts are the best, lightest, most affordable power source
[14:42] <Elwell> (browsing your gallery) -- I take it your PV converter is 'on grid' for sync?
[14:42] <KF5KWE> what type of cell are they?
[14:42] <Dan-K2VOL> best for cold anyway and power per gram
[14:42] <Elwell> and you don't have a DC battery bank?
[14:42] <KF5KWE> i prefer rechargable
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[14:42] <jonsowman> Elwell: correct
[14:42] <Dan-K2VOL> You'll then have poor cold performance if you like that preference KF5KWE
[14:43] <jonsowman> KF5KWE: nothing comes close to the energizer lithiums for HAB use
[14:43] <Elwell> jonsowman: so in a power cut, do you get anytyhing out of em?
[14:43] <jonsowman> i really don't recommend li-ion or li-poly
[14:43] <KF5KWE> i see
[14:43] <jonsowman> Elwell: yep, they continue to power the house but disconnect from the grid
[14:43] <jonsowman> so as to not electrocute the technicians fixing the fault
[14:44] <Elwell> ah ok needing some re-sync when its back on? or does it all just happen automagically?
[14:44] <Dan-K2VOL> White Star is going to use li-poly only for a multi-week very long duration floating flight, and we must plan to lose all power at night, and regain it when the sun warms them up in the daytime
[14:44] <jonsowman> Elwell: needs manually confirming, but will sync itself
[14:44] <Elwell> cool
[14:45] <Dan-K2VOL> our math showed that for flights less than about 3 days long that solar power was heavier per watt than energizer lithiums
[14:45] <jonsowman> hehe
[14:46] <KF5KWE> well i only spent 20$ or so on the li-ion solution, can pretty easily switch to the energizer ones
[14:46] <jonsowman> they are stunningly light
[14:46] <KF5KWE> grams per cell?
[14:46] <Dan-K2VOL> 14
[14:46] <jonsowman> 14
[14:46] <KF5KWE> fff
[14:46] <jonsowman> hehe
[14:46] <Dan-K2VOL> lol
[14:46] <jonsowman> Dan-K2VOL beat me to it
[14:47] <KF5KWE> i figured if I got 10C drain li-ions I would be good
[14:47] <KF5KWE> so long as I kept the payload insulated and such
[14:47] <KF5KWE> but the savings in grams ...may make it all worth switching
[14:47] <Dan-K2VOL> KF5KWE I have a link to the data sheets here: http://wiki.whitestarballoon.com/doku.php?id=compendium#batteries
[14:47] <Dan-K2VOL> The handbook is handy indeed
[14:48] <Elwell> do you bother with chucking a handwarmer pack in or just better insulation?
[14:48] <KF5KWE> you and your wikis...
[14:48] <jonsowman> Elwell: never bothered
[14:48] <Dan-K2VOL> He
[14:48] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[14:48] <jonsowman> just insulate well, the sun has a pretty big warming effect
[14:48] <jonsowman> mostly the electronics keep themselves warm
[14:48] <jonsowman> especially cameras
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[14:48] <jonsowman> ejcweb: hi
[14:49] <jkominar> do you guys find there's much concern about electronics actually overheating frequently in the reduced atmosphere at apex?
[14:49] <Dan-K2VOL> The energizer lithiums give a lot of current out too
[14:49] <ejcweb> hi jonsowman
[14:49] <Dan-K2VOL> jkominar not much concern on flights of a few hours
[14:49] <KF5KWE> lithium-iron disulfide
[14:49] <jonsowman> jkominar: not really, nothing uses that much current that it requires significant heatsinking
[14:49] <KF5KWE> mouthfull
[14:50] <jonsowman> ejcweb: how are things?
[14:50] <Dan-K2VOL> But on long duration multi day flights it is a concern as we try to absorb and store as much heat as possible from the sun for the night time cold soak
[14:50] <BrainDamage> you could reuse the stray heat to keep batteries warm
[14:51] <ejcweb> jonsowman: yeah, all okay. 7 days to go until the fun starts ;)
[14:51] <ejcweb> how about yourself?
[14:51] <jonsowman> yeah not too bad things, got a little longer
[14:51] <jonsowman> revising & trying not too let interesting stuff distract me too much
[14:52] <Dan-K2VOL> BrainDamage we actually rely on the 54 AA batteries to be the heat storage from the sun
[14:52] <jonsowman> *thanks
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[14:52] <KF5KWE> http://cgi.ebay.com/4AA-Energizer-Ultimate-Lithium-Battery-OEM-PACKING-New-/280658995991?pt=US_Batteries&hash=item4158946b17#ht_2559wt_1140
[14:52] <BrainDamage> 54 batteries? wow
[14:52] <Dan-K2VOL> that's for 72 hours days continuous operation
[14:53] <Dan-K2VOL> 3 days
[14:54] <BrainDamage> your equipment draws ~1W on average?
[14:54] <Dan-K2VOL> Mark Caviezel has made solar balloons from black plastic, and when they get up to altitude they get holes melted in them
[14:54] <Dan-K2VOL> sounds about right
[14:55] <Dan-K2VOL> We have a 5w satellite modem that pulses every 15 minutes
[14:55] <Dan-K2VOL> And everything else idles at about 200ma
[14:55] <Dan-K2VOL> With 70ma spikes for ballast valve, and 60ma for the night time strobe
[14:56] <Dan-K2VOL> four of the AAs are dedicated in reserve for the cutdown device
[14:57] <Dan-K2VOL> And there's the HF TX that's about 500ma on tx every half hour or so
[14:57] <Dan-K2VOL> Speedball is a power hog
[14:58] <KF5KWE> so the energizer batteries drain to about 1.3v ea then are pretty much depleted?
[14:58] <Dan-K2VOL> we're making the opposite for the vldb experiments, an ultra lightweight barebones payload, to reduce the size of envelope needed for the superpressure balloon
[14:58] <Dan-K2VOL> sounds about right I suppose, they start at 1.8
[14:59] <Dan-K2VOL> I'd just go by the graphs on the datasheet and battery handbook
[14:59] <Elwell> Dan-K2VOL: what did you end up with for the strobe?
[14:59] <Dan-K2VOL> 5 white LEDs that cycle around
[14:59] <Dan-K2VOL> Certainly not impressive, but possibly visible
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[15:00] <KF5KWE> does it look like a UFO?
[15:00] <Dan-K2VOL> Haha or a police car, it's definitely odd
[15:00] <Dan-K2VOL> We drove up to the launch site with it active in the middle of a mini-van, and got some odd looks on the highway
[15:01] <KF5KWE> looks like it starts at 1.6, then if you apply current it drops to 1.4
[15:01] <KF5KWE> then stays about that for a good while
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[15:01] <KF5KWE> until about <10% capacity where it drops to 1.2
[15:01] <Dan-K2VOL> it drops pretty fast at the very end
[15:02] <KF5KWE> yeah, looks like it goes from 10% and down very fast to 0.8v
[15:02] <KF5KWE> i need to supply around 6.5v+ at al times though
[15:03] <Dan-K2VOL> Just use a variable voltage regulator
[15:03] <Dan-K2VOL> To select your desired voltage and keep your batt pack always few volts above that
[15:04] <KF5KWE> using a linear regulator for heat
[15:04] <KF5KWE> heard some try that with success
[15:04] <KF5KWE> besides it's 77% effiency is not much lower than a switching supply i could build
[15:04] <Dan-K2VOL> Sounds good, just get one that can take up to 12 v input or something, and add cells accordingly
[15:04] <Dan-K2VOL> Not bad
[15:05] <KF5KWE> best figure I keep coming to is about 88% for a pretty complicated switching supply
[15:05] <KF5KWE> big ol' inductor needed, would add weight
[15:05] <KF5KWE> and then I would still want something making heat haha
[15:05] <KF5KWE> which would eat probably 10% of the power
[15:05] <Dan-K2VOL> Pololu robotics sells a nice line of switching supply boards pretty cheap, we're using two in our payload, a 5v and a 3.3v to step down from about 16v pack
[15:06] <Dan-K2VOL> They're tiny too and have good interface pins
[15:06] <KF5KWE> yeah I can build one for about 10$
[15:06] <Dan-K2VOL> Time is money, remember too
[15:06] <KF5KWE> the bigest part is the inductor
[15:06] <KF5KWE> it's about 1"x.5"
[15:06] <Dan-K2VOL> Wtf that's monstrous
[15:06] <KF5KWE> well...it's only a dollar
[15:07] <KF5KWE> if I sprung for a better one they make some pretty small ones
[15:07] <KF5KWE> ofcourse the switching supply i was going to build would be able to supply 1.5a continuous
[15:07] <KF5KWE> accept 5v-40v
[15:07] <KF5KWE> and output 3.3v and 5v
[15:08] <Dan-K2VOL> hehe
[15:08] <Dan-K2VOL> We are using the second one down on this page: http://www.pololu.com/catalog/category/84
[15:08] <KF5KWE> so many tabs
[15:08] <KF5KWE> so little time
[15:08] <Dan-K2VOL> If you like building things that's cool, I just like to get on to the more unusal building things like science experiments, rather than power supplies
[15:09] <KF5KWE> eh, it's all fun
[15:09] <KF5KWE> 14$ is a pretty good deal at any rate
[15:09] <KF5KWE> 15$ sorry
[15:10] <Dan-K2VOL> I have found that it does NOT like 5v in on the 3v output line
[15:10] <KF5KWE> oh did some 'testing' on that did ya?
[15:10] <Dan-K2VOL> not one bit. It didn't like it so much that the microchip exploded with a pretty nice bang
[15:11] <KF5KWE> another reason i build most of my stuff
[15:11] <KF5KWE> i don't do stuff like that, to something i spent 4 hours putting together
[15:11] <Dan-K2VOL> Yeah fortunately it was still on the bench and not inside the payload at that point!
[15:11] <Dan-K2VOL> Ha i had no intention of doing that
[15:12] <KF5KWE> well, i take extra precautions
[15:12] <KF5KWE> such as measuing everything with a multimeter before hooking things together
[15:12] <KF5KWE> especially before applying solder
[15:13] <Dan-K2VOL> yes, that wears down after 6 months of nightly disassembly and reassembly of the things till 3am while a team of people are building all the various systems
[15:13] <Dan-K2VOL> I'm really interested in their boost supplies, but I wish they were higher current
[15:13] <KF5KWE> thats about how long it took to research and build my flight computer
[15:14] <KF5KWE> before i completely redesigned
[15:14] <Dan-K2VOL> That's cool, a lot goes into those
[15:14] <KF5KWE> sad thing is the old design was probably better
[15:14] <KF5KWE> too bad it was just plan A, "buy arduino"
[15:15] <Dan-K2VOL> we used some arduino plug in module versions for several of our internal systems
[15:16] <Dan-K2VOL> The FIO arduino is nice, as it has an XBee socket for wireless sensor comms
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[15:16] <KF5KWE> would xbee even work at those distances
[15:16] <Dan-K2VOL> We're using it to go to the top of the balloon
[15:16] <Dan-K2VOL> But if you use 900 mhz xbees with whip antennas and a yagi antenna on the ground, yes, several groups do that
[15:17] <KF5KWE> nice
[15:17] <KF5KWE> id rather take advantage of my ham license
[15:17] <KF5KWE> go with vhf telemetry
[15:17] <KF5KWE> much like I am now, but im piggy backing on APRS
[15:18] <Dan-K2VOL> there are pros and cons, we'll probably add the 900mhz xbee to speedball due to the high data rate we want to collect transitioning from climb to float, the xbee is so easy to use, and much less power hungry than our long range transmitters
[15:18] <Dan-K2VOL> And light
[15:19] <Dan-K2VOL> right now we're measuring the voltage of a thermistor dangling inside the balloon, using only two lithium AAs, the xbee, a few resistors and the thermistor - the xbee has built-in A/D converter pins that it can poll
[15:20] <KF5KWE> pretty cool
[15:20] <Dan-K2VOL> It's a little overkill for a wirelss temp sensor, but it was fast and easy to integrate
[15:21] <KF5KWE> hm
[15:21] <KF5KWE> apparently the lm7805 needs 7v
[15:21] <eroomde> I used the long range 1W xbee for the blimp
[15:21] <eroomde> it was good
[15:22] <eroomde> very nice to just have a plug and play serial link
[15:22] <KF5KWE> need 6 AA cells for that
[15:22] <Darkside> KF5KWE: use a LDO reg instead
[15:22] <BrainDamage> you want the input always few V above the output for linear regulators
[15:22] <Dan-K2VOL> eroomde what freq
[15:22] <eroomde> i think it was the 900mhz freq-hopping spread spectrum
[15:23] <eroomde> well, i know it was that
[15:23] <Dan-K2VOL> Cool, yes, the series 2.5 can be a pain to get set up, and I could never get series 1 to pass hardware flow control properly, but once you have link, it's like there's a wire between the two thing
[15:23] <eroomde> it does do some occassional weirdness
[15:24] <eroomde> i think it's v sensitive to baud rates
[15:24] <Dan-K2VOL> that sort of makes sense, it packetizes the data
[15:24] <Dan-K2VOL> we're using the 2mw 2.4ghz ones to do 4800 baud to the satellite modem hanging up in trees
[15:24] <eroomde> yes, if you want to send single bytes with low latency, you'll want to use it in non-transparent mode
[15:24] <eroomde> to force it to send the single byte
[15:24] <eroomde> say
[15:25] <Dan-K2VOL> Ah
[15:25] <eroomde> rather than have it wait for a bit to see if there's anything else to put in the packet
[15:25] <Dan-K2VOL> Yeah
[15:25] <eroomde> we had this problem when trying to use it in closed loop control between ground laptop and blimp
[15:25] <Dan-K2VOL> Oh that's interesting, was it holding on to the data waiting for more before xmitting?
[15:26] <eroomde> yes, though not indefinitely
[15:26] <eroomde> but the delay was long enough to cause us some control hiccups and also seemed a bit variable
[15:30] <eroomde> truthfully i think it'd be fine for a balloon
[15:30] <eroomde> but not so hot for the 25Hz loops I was gunning for
[15:31] <Dan-K2VOL> yeah, I think i'll use it for simply getting helium temp, altitude, and time at as high a rate as I can get on ascent, then shut it off for the rest of the trip
[15:31] <eroomde> yeah
[15:31] <eroomde> worth knocking up a wee yagi for it i'd have thought
[15:31] <Dan-K2VOL> did you use one?
[15:31] <eroomde> there's a high noise floor on that ffreq nowadays
[15:32] <eroomde> no, but the blimp was always within like 1m
[15:32] <Dan-K2VOL> Someone brought in a biiig yagi for 900mhz, it's got like 20 elements, I think we could track the xbee to the moon with that
[15:32] <eroomde> otherwise you can barely see it, and that gets hairy
[15:32] <KF5KWE> ugh, my head hurts
[15:32] <KF5KWE> ok, would it be unreasonable to put an 8pack of AA's in the payload
[15:33] <eroomde> nope
[15:33] <Dan-K2VOL> That's pretty common
[15:33] <KF5KWE> 116grams
[15:33] <KF5KWE> hm
[15:34] <KF5KWE> im thinking that covers me pretty good on capacity and voltage, but 116grams
[15:34] <Dan-K2VOL> you've legally got 6lbs to play with, so no worries there
[15:34] <Dan-K2VOL> Should be around 2.4 kg I htink
[15:34] <KF5KWE> well, a 500g balloon would be nice to use
[15:35] <Dan-K2VOL> Yeah, cheap
[15:35] <KF5KWE> so i was shooting for 500g payload
[15:35] <KF5KWE> may not be entirely possible though
[15:35] <KF5KWE> unless i sacrifice something
[15:36] <KF5KWE> but i can still go up to 1000g without too much worry in the balloon
[15:36] <KF5KWE> 500g balloon should be able to do that
[15:36] <eroomde> a 500g balloon should get 1kg to 25km at 4m/s lift
[15:36] <Dan-K2VOL> yeah don't worry too much about it
[15:36] <eroomde> which isn't too bad
[15:37] <KF5KWE> for a first launch yeah
[15:37] <eroomde> you can save 40km for a rainy day
[15:38] <eroomde> except don't, of course, because rain is bad
[15:38] <Dan-K2VOL> And that's less driving
[15:38] <Dan-K2VOL> damn the weather, it's so rarely good for our constraints
[15:38] <KF5KWE> its all grey today
[15:38] <eroomde> yes, you've especially got a tough situation
[15:39] <eroomde> you want powerful jet streams but that often means energetic ground weather
[15:39] <Dan-K2VOL> I wish we could launch it from a rocket or an airplane or something
[15:40] <Dan-K2VOL> I think NASA did that above Venus actually
[15:40] <eroomde> we're doing the opposite
[15:40] <Dan-K2VOL> inflated two big balloons while on parachute
[15:40] <eroomde> launching the rocket from the balloon
[15:40] <Dan-K2VOL> nice!
[15:41] <Dan-K2VOL> That's tricky on top of tricky
[15:41] <eroomde> mmm
[15:42] <eroomde> building up mentally to another 20hr day for months on end thing
[15:42] <KF5KWE> http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&name=AP1186T550L-UDI-ND
[15:42] <KF5KWE> is that a good LDO regulator?
[15:42] <Dan-K2VOL> Hehe eroomde, that's what makes life fun isn't it?
[15:42] <eroomde> well quite
[15:43] <Randomskk> KF5KWE: looks complicated and discontinued
[15:43] <eroomde> but it wasn't so long ago i did that
[15:43] <eroomde> and i was going to have a phase of being parisian in paris
[15:43] <Dan-K2VOL> My girlfriend keeps trying to make me appreciate sitting around the house talking about people
[15:43] <eroomde> and going to underground jazz gigs and smoking galois and pondering on street cafes
[15:43] <KF5KWE> http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&name=576-1143-ND ?
[15:43] <eroomde> but actually it is a bit boring
[15:43] <KF5KWE> looks like you can supply 5.47v - 26v
[15:44] <eroomde> not having A Project
[15:44] <eroomde> nothing really gets done
[15:44] <eroomde> it's like a fill-in for religion
[15:44] <Dan-K2VOL> Ha true
[15:44] <Dan-K2VOL> you should join a hackerspace
[15:44] <eroomde> yes I will
[15:44] <Dan-K2VOL> There's always something to spark the imagination into making a project
[15:44] <eroomde> well, cambridge makespace should be happening soon
[15:44] <eroomde> it's being started by two freinds
[15:45] <eroomde> i've been doing what I can, though that's not much at the minute
[15:45] <Dan-K2VOL> For example I'm building a set of EL-wire ipod headphones that pulse to music tonight for a sort of mini burning man festival later this year. A super quick but fun diversion
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[15:46] <eroomde> yeah some bite-size projects would be good
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[15:53] <Laurenceb> i think i my have bricked an accelerometer :/
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[15:53] <Laurenceb> but overwriting the config flash
[15:53] <eroomde> accelerometers have flash :|
[15:54] <Laurenceb> apparently
[15:54] <Dan-K2VOL> Lol
[15:55] <Laurenceb> no actually - something is wrong with the i2c
[15:55] <Laurenceb> i cant read back registers correctly
[15:55] <KF5KWE> anyone try a different type of li-FeS2 battery other than the energizer ones?
[15:56] <Laurenceb> hmf ive got my itg3200 and lsm303 magno working nicely
[15:56] <Laurenceb> but no accel atm
[15:56] <Dan-K2VOL> KF5KWE i've not seen anything approaching the price point of the energizers, which has kept me from doing so
[15:57] <KF5KWE> well the same place i got my li-ion cells has li-FeS2
[15:58] <Laurenceb> 0: Z axis disabled; 1: Z axis enabled
[15:58] Action: Laurenceb facepalms
[15:58] <Laurenceb> why did i read that as 1:0
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[16:14] <W0OTM> Howdy
[16:15] <KF5KWE> Hey!
[16:15] <KF5KWE> Had fun last night?
[16:17] <W0OTM> oh my god yes! had a blast!
[16:17] <KF5KWE> Seemed like it
[16:17] <KF5KWE> Could barely see the balloon and then you caught it
[16:18] <W0OTM> I posted some phots, ect. http://www.ihabproject.com/iHAB-5/
[16:22] <KF5KWE> You going to try foil balloons next time?
[16:24] <KF5KWE> Thank god it didn't tangle in power lines
[16:26] <W0OTM> No, I have enough balloons to do another Party Balloon Launch. Will use those todo do another low altitude test for testing the cutdown module
[16:26] <KF5KWE> Do you know why the cutdown didn't work?
[16:26] <W0OTM> but then I am going to switch to 200g Totex balloons. They are MUCH easier to work with (IMO)
[16:27] <W0OTM> I have some "theories" but dont know for sure yet
[16:28] <KF5KWE> seems to me scientific sales prices out their balloons to be cheaper the bigger the balloon
[16:28] <KF5KWE> why 200g?
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[16:30] <KF5KWE> like 2x 200g + 1x 100g
[16:30] <KF5KWE> is 10$ more than a 500g
[16:37] <KF5KWE> ok so heres a generic kinda question
[16:37] <KF5KWE> im sure will be funny to some
[16:37] <KF5KWE> How do you guys go about finding a place to launch?
[16:38] <eroomde> i lived there
[16:40] <KF5KWE> so you launch from your land?
[16:42] <Laurenceb> score
[16:42] <Laurenceb> stm32+imu working
[16:42] <Laurenceb> oddly the accel is outputting 16bit data
[16:42] <Laurenceb> that wasnt in the datasheet
[16:43] <cuddykid> W0OTM, looks like a great mission!
[16:43] <Laurenceb> the itg is mental - ~1lsb noise
[16:43] <eroomde> KF5KWE: not mine, but my college's
[16:43] <KF5KWE> ah, well lucky
[16:43] <eroomde> they have playing fields - good open spaces
[16:43] <eroomde> and towards the edge of town, surrounded by countryside
[16:43] <Dan-K2VOL> KF5KWE open space for a long ways is important to look for
[16:44] <Dan-K2VOL> About a football field size piece of land is sufficient, but try to find one without light poles around it
[16:44] <eroomde> or pylons!
[16:44] <Dan-K2VOL> Small airports are usually where I like to launch from, they're quiet, and the airplanes are paying attention when they're there
[16:44] <Dan-K2VOL> Ha
[16:44] <KF5KWE> well that rules out anywhere in my city haha
[16:45] <Dan-K2VOL> yes, avoid high voltage power lines
[16:46] <KF5KWE> i want to wait for a day with north winds, lots of farmland out north, east is trees
[16:46] <Dan-K2VOL> Yeah, keep running the predictor
[16:47] <Dan-K2VOL> to tell you where you'll land
[16:47] <eroomde> we have the sea to worry about usually
[16:47] <KF5KWE> i bet you look for calm days haha
[16:47] <eroomde> http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~cuspaceflight/hourly-predictions/
[16:48] <Dan-K2VOL> Have you guys thought about making a globalspot one that can survive as a solar-powered bouy?
[16:48] <eroomde> you can see most of the landing points are in the north sea
[16:48] <eroomde> james and I had a buoy plan once upon a time
[16:48] <eroomde> with an HF vertical
[16:49] <KF5KWE> not to sound offensive
[16:49] <eroomde> or i guess spot would work too
[16:49] <KF5KWE> but most of the locations on that map sound like their from lord of the rings
[16:49] <eroomde> well, lord of the rings languages are based on a variety of old languages
[16:50] <eroomde> norse, old english, gaellic
[16:50] <Laurenceb> how can you cat from a serial port?
[16:50] <eroomde> so it's quite unsurprising that that place names (given lots of english places are thousands of years old) sound a bit LOTR
[16:51] <KF5KWE> no i know it makes perfect sense
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[16:51] <KF5KWE> but i didn't want to come off as typecasting your neck of the woods
[16:52] <KF5KWE> you know, im almost tempted to go and try foil party balloons my first launch
[16:52] <KF5KWE> but i wouldn't feel confident I can make a remote control cutdown
[16:53] <eroomde> no typcasting miscomprehension taken!
[16:53] <KF5KWE> a timer based cutdown may work
[16:53] <KF5KWE> if the hardware functions that is
[16:53] <eroomde> or radius
[16:53] <eroomde> distance from launch spot
[16:54] <KF5KWE> true
[16:55] <KF5KWE> has anyone proven you can get foil balloons to burst at altitude
[16:55] <eroomde> KF5KWE: the interesting thing is that you'll see that bit of england is the bit when marauding vikings or gauls are likely to land
[16:55] <eroomde> so they have really vikingy names
[16:55] <eroomde> like saxmundham
[16:57] <KF5KWE> that is interesting
[16:58] <Dan-K2VOL> KF5KWE foil balloons will certainly burst!
[16:58] <Dan-K2VOL> Jcoxon has done several attempts at getting them to NOT burst
[16:58] <Dan-K2VOL> Not succesfully
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[17:00] <NigeyS> lol dan
[17:00] <NigeyS> spot on ;)
[17:01] <NigeyS> i have my pico foil launch in a couple of weeks using foil balloons
[17:02] <Dan-K2VOL> Nice Nigey, measure that lift to the gram if you can and record it for future amateur scientists!
[17:02] <Dan-K2VOL> indoors
[17:02] <NigeyS> i will, aiming for 33grams per balloon
[17:05] <Dan-K2VOL> The difference between burst and superpressure is likely about 1psi on those, has anyone measured the differential burst pressure there?
[17:06] <NigeyS> think steves done some calculations on that.
[17:06] <cuddykid> NigeyS, what alt are you expecting?
[17:06] <NigeyS> hoping to float between 5 and 7 km
[17:06] <Dan-K2VOL> What??
[17:07] <cuddykid> nice
[17:07] <Dan-K2VOL> That seems high to me, but superpressure calculations are odd
[17:07] <Dan-K2VOL> how many balloons nigey
[17:07] <NigeyS> 5
[17:07] <Dan-K2VOL> Of the 36" size?
[17:07] <NigeyS> yip
[17:08] <Dan-K2VOL> How heavy is your payload?
[17:08] <Dan-K2VOL> a very slow climb or normal one?
[17:08] <NigeyS> well, with a bit more trimming i can get it to 112grams
[17:08] <Dan-K2VOL> Very nice
[17:09] <NigeyS> it'll be painfully slow
[17:09] <Dan-K2VOL> Good
[17:09] <NigeyS> 1m/s if that
[17:09] <Dan-K2VOL> well cool, what's left to do
[17:09] <NigeyS> which actually makes selecting a launch site very tricky
[17:09] <NigeyS> as most of the countryside within an hour of here seems littered with pylons
[17:10] <Dan-K2VOL> Ugh yeah
[17:10] <NigeyS> got to get the helium, and a cold temp test of the lipo .. that's about it
[17:10] <Dan-K2VOL> One thing that I'd like to try on the super pressure balloons is to use a tow balloon that drags it up quickly above the terrain then cuts off
[17:11] <NigeyS> someone else mentioned that not so long ago
[17:12] <m1x10> ping fsphil
[17:12] <NigeyS> think the hardest part of these foil ballons is the filling, they have a nasty 1 time use valve, you cant refill if you're a little short
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[17:19] <MNSP> hello all :)
[17:27] <eroomde> greetings
[17:27] <eroomde> NigeyS: yes - it's annoying
[17:27] <eroomde> i guess you'd need a drink straw that you could clamp shut or something
[17:28] <NigeyS> hey Ed, yeah i was thinking of some very thin tubing or something
[17:28] <MNSP> hi ed, nigey
[17:28] <NigeyS> hey MNSP
[17:28] <BrainDamage> can't you use bycicle tire valves?
[17:29] <BrainDamage> just glue it
[17:29] <BrainDamage> or even car tire valves, because iirc bycicle's are designed to hold thanks to internal pressure, while car's use a spring to hold
[17:29] <BrainDamage> iirc the names are presta and shrader, forgot which is which
[17:30] <NigeyS> hmm possibly
[17:31] <eroomde> i'd just locktite the straw :)
[17:33] Nick change: SpeedEvil1 -> SpeedEvil
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[17:42] <MNSP> ok while there is a lull in the convo...
[17:43] <MNSP> anyone know where I can source a pushbutton or similar with a cover, like in the movies the button for a big bomb?
[17:43] <SpeedEvil> Machine control
[17:43] <SpeedEvil> http://shop.ebay.co.uk/?_from=R40&_trksid=p3907.m38.l1313&_nkw=emergency%20stop%20button&=&_sacat=See-All-Categories
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[17:45] <MNSP> ah those are the emergency stop buttons, I was thinking more of smaller with like the clear plastic cover that you flip up... but not the toggle switches
[17:46] <SpeedEvil> http://business.shop.ebay.co.uk/i.html?_nkw=safety+toggle&_sacat=12576&_odkw=button+cover&_osacat=12576&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313
[17:47] <MNSP> yup, not that sort...
[17:47] <MNSP> ;)
[17:47] <Dan-K2VOL> I think sparkfun might have something
[17:47] <Dan-K2VOL> Like that
[17:47] <BrainDamage> I have one of those safety switches with caps, I used one for my railgun psu, feels soooo satisfactory :p
[17:47] <MNSP> yeah?
[17:48] <MNSP> like the one speedevil linked to rain-damage?b
[17:48] <BrainDamage> yes, like his last link
[17:49] <BrainDamage> I have 2, one to "arm" by starting the booster psu that charges the cap, and another that triggers the fire mechanism
[17:49] <SpeedEvil> For what?
[17:49] <MNSP> I know I've seen them somewhere
[17:49] <SpeedEvil> MNSP: I mwan - what are you wanting to uise it for
[17:49] <eroomde> oh, missile switches?
[17:49] <MNSP> yes ed
[17:49] <MNSP> but not the toggle switches
[17:49] <eroomde> push-to-make
[17:50] <BrainDamage> you want a momentary button with a plastic cover?
[17:50] <MNSP> SpeedEvil, nothing right now
[17:50] <MNSP> Yes BrainDamage
[17:50] <BrainDamage> possibly with a red light in the button itself, and transparent plastic ?
[17:50] <SpeedEvil> There are - to cheat slightly - waterproof switches implemented like that
[17:50] <MNSP> YES
[17:51] <MNSP> I might even use it as the on switch for my payload :D
[17:51] <SpeedEvil> What about with an integrated subwoofer, to play ominous music?
[17:51] <MNSP> I dunno about that, we're just getting silly now :P :D
[17:52] <MNSP> But what BrainDamage described
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[17:54] <m1x10> where is fsphil ? :( I had sad news.
[17:55] <eroomde> apologies for low SNR mnsp :)
[17:55] <eroomde> usually they're sold seperately
[17:55] <eroomde> the switches (with a washer and nut) and the guard
[17:56] <SpeedEvil> I'd look on RS and farnell
[17:56] <eroomde> lots of people (eg Farnell) carry guards
[17:56] <SpeedEvil> In the machinery section
[17:56] <eroomde> e.g. http://parts.digikey.com/uk/1/855565-switch-guard-square-round-a01fg2.html
[17:57] <MNSP> Perfect ed!
[17:57] <MNSP> thank you chaps
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[18:01] <MNSP> switch guard!! I've been looking for switch covers
[18:01] <MNSP> makes all the diff in a search
[18:01] <eroomde> online parts searches can be jolly annoying
[18:01] <eroomde> the prospect of making a farnell shopping list after designing a pcb can fill me with dread
[18:02] <Randomskk> seriously
[18:02] Action: Randomskk is about to undertake that
[18:02] <Randomskk> so many choices to make, and there will be like 0 to 1000 possible choices
[18:03] <MNSP> and if you don't know the exact right term they use, you're pretty much stuffed
[18:03] <MNSP> bring on the semantic web :)
[18:03] <SpeedEvil> MNSP: You can cheat.
[18:03] <SpeedEvil> Use the actual paper catalog and flick through till you see what you want.
[18:03] <MNSP> :o perish the thought..
[18:04] <MNSP> LOL
[18:04] <MNSP> I like to go to maplins and look at stuff but not buy anyhing
[18:06] <MNSP> I really had a problem with the manager of my local store
[18:09] <MNSP> http://uk.farnell.com/multicomp/50-011-01/cover-protection-18x18mm-for-d16/dp/1736763
[18:09] <MNSP> et voila
[18:09] <MNSP> nom time
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[18:29] <Laurenceb_> http://eatliver.com/img/2011/7280.jpg
[18:30] <griffonbot> @fsphil: No hadie:3 launch this Sunday. Predictions have it landing either in Belfast or the Irish Sea. Don't fancy either :) #ukhas [http://twitter.com/fsphil/status/71643999475208192]
[18:31] <fsphil> also the world may end ;-)
[18:33] <Upu> evening
[18:33] <fsphil> g'day Upu
[18:33] <Upu> just back from China
[18:33] <fsphil> OOooh that's right .. all go well?
[18:34] <Upu> yeah was a great two weeks
[18:34] <Upu> mad place
[18:34] <NigeyS> upu!
[18:34] <fsphil> I've heard, a few mates went there last year
[18:34] <Upu> health and safety was done by the same people who did it on the Death Star
[18:34] <fsphil> said when they arrived, the space beside the hotel was empty. and by the time they'd left a week later, half another hotel was there
[18:35] <fsphil> lol
[18:35] <fsphil> pointless drops with no safety rails then? :)
[18:35] <Upu> yeah its like the end scene in Inception they are throwing up high rises as far as the eye can see
[18:35] <Upu> no none
[18:35] <Upu> on the great wall anyway
[18:36] <Upu> and epic warning signs like this : https://picasaweb.google.com/upuaut/201105China?authkey=Gv1sRgCLzMhf7p5p20xAE#5608811409482200002
[18:37] <Upu> so any launches recently
[18:37] <Upu> in the last two weeks ?
[18:37] <fsphil> Engrish1
[18:37] <fsphil> 11!!
[18:37] <fsphil> er. no not 11 launches
[18:37] <Upu> was about to say :)
[18:38] <fsphil> James launched a balloon. it got introduced to a tree and they where happily together for a week or so. the breakup wasn't so good though, particularly for the tree
[18:38] <Upu> I think I saw that one before I went ? Farmer cut the tree down ?
[18:38] <fsphil> was for testing the spot altitude hack
[18:38] <fsphil> Not sure who cut it down actually
[18:39] <fsphil> my own launch is *still* any-time-now
[18:40] <fsphil> there was another one that rocketman was involved with
[18:40] <fsphil> sciency one I think
[18:41] <Upu> well I should start looking for somewhere to launch now
[18:41] <fsphil> indeed
[18:41] <Upu> just need to get these parachutes sorted out
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[18:52] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[18:53] <fsphil> yoyo
[18:53] <Lunar_Lander> Ariane later this evening
[18:53] <Lunar_Lander> and I watched Avril Lavinge singing "Knocking on Heaven's Door" in Korea
[18:53] <Lunar_Lander> and then I found, that Korean TV shows this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Girlfriend_is_a_Nine-Tailed_Fox
[19:01] <Lunar_Lander> well anyway
[19:01] <Lunar_Lander> hi fsphil mattltm Dan-K2VOL NigeyS
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[19:09] <Dan-K2VOL> Hi Kevin
[19:10] <Lunar_Lander> how's life?
[19:10] <Dan-K2VOL> Great, going to prepare for my oscilloscope workshop i'm giving tomorrow
[19:10] <Dan-K2VOL> http://twiddlescratch.eventbrite.com/
[19:10] <Dan-K2VOL> And put together a showy EL wire gizmo to wear at a festival,
[19:11] <Dan-K2VOL> It will look like ipod headphones (white) but they will glow like neon and pulse in time to ambient sound
[19:11] <Dan-K2VOL> And you can wear it
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[19:11] <Dan-K2VOL> How about you
[19:11] <KF5KWE> thats awesome
[19:11] <KF5KWE> can i copy that idea :D
[19:11] <BrainDamage> psh, replace the EL wire with nichrome wire and make them glow blackbody!
[19:12] <Lunar_Lander> cool Dan-K2VOL !
[19:12] <Lunar_Lander> I'm OK too
[19:12] <Lunar_Lander> just listening to this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIoKwMXjNb4
[19:12] <Lunar_Lander> BrainDamage do you know what sparkfun needs in its catalogue?
[19:12] <Dan-K2VOL> Ugh can't listen at work
[19:12] <BrainDamage> nuclear-grade trigatrons?
[19:12] <Lunar_Lander> solenoids
[19:13] <Lunar_Lander> np Dan-K2VOL :)
[19:13] <Dan-K2VOL> Rather, can't watch utube, I'm listening to di.fm DJ Mixes channel on my iPHone
[19:13] <BrainDamage> seeed studio should have one
[19:13] <BrainDamage> also search on fleabay
[19:13] <Lunar_Lander> ah wait
[19:13] <Dan-K2VOL> more linear actuation devices would be nice
[19:13] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.sparkfun.com/products/10391
[19:13] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.sparkfun.com/products/10456
[19:13] <Lunar_Lander> seem to be new
[19:14] <Dan-K2VOL> Was thinking last night on ways to make a snakey long blimp that used little air pumps and separate helium cells to cause it to undulate like an inchworm
[19:14] <KF5KWE> i doubt it would move that way
[19:14] <KF5KWE> but cool
[19:15] <Dan-K2VOL> it would be a mess outdoors, but it would be neat to try fiddling with automated gas transfer between cells indoors in a gymnasium to see what could be done
[19:16] <russss> tangental but high-altitude related http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewnews.html?id=1531
[19:18] <Dan-K2VOL> I wonder what neutral bouyancy bubble wrap would be like at parties
[19:19] <Randomskk> amazing?
[19:19] <eroomde> noisy?
[19:19] <KF5KWE> Dan-K2VOL, brave man wearing AC powered device on you
[19:19] <Dan-K2VOL> Hehe
[19:19] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[19:19] <Dan-K2VOL> Haha
[19:19] <Lunar_Lander> as amazing as
[19:19] <Lunar_Lander> Rusty Schweickart has seven kids!!
[19:20] <Dan-K2VOL> Good for him, astronauts and scientists should be the ones propagating profusely
[19:20] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[19:20] <Lunar_Lander> Leonard: "Our children will be both beautiful and smart."
[19:21] <jonsowman> <3 big bang theory
[19:21] <Lunar_Lander> Sheldon: "And, don't forget that, imaginary"
[19:21] <Lunar_Lander> :D
[19:21] <eroomde> Dan-K2VOL: you've a fluke portable scope!
[19:21] <Dan-K2VOL> well, not me, but the LVL1 Hackerspace does!
[19:21] <BrainDamage> or, it could have HER intelligence, and HIS beauty
[19:21] <Dan-K2VOL> People have donated tons of cool stuff
[19:21] <eroomde> The blimp project bought one. not sure i'll be abelt to take it with me though
[19:21] <eroomde> it's very, very pretty
[19:21] <Dan-K2VOL> lol roomde, this one is from about 1994
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[19:22] <Dan-K2VOL> But it works
[19:22] <eroomde> ah, this is a shiny color-display one
[19:22] <eroomde> 4channel
[19:22] <Dan-K2VOL> It comes with Windows 3.1 software
[19:22] <eroomde> and oblig yellow rubberyness
[19:22] <Dan-K2VOL> Oh the yellowberiness is fine on those isn't it
[19:22] <Lunar_Lander> jonsowman xD the scene in S1E1, where Leonard says "The sum of our IQs is 340, we ought to get in that building" and then the kids come up and get in simply by ringing all doors
[19:22] <Lunar_Lander> :D
[19:23] <eroomde> i don't think it'd help much ina fall
[19:23] <jonsowman> haha
[19:23] <jonsowman> yes
[19:23] <jonsowman> excellent sitcom that one
[19:23] <Lunar_Lander> "What a solution" "COMEON, hold that door open!"
[19:24] <BrainDamage> one of my classmates picked sheldon as his life model
[19:24] <Lunar_Lander> "Yeah." "We are Leonard and Sheldon" "From the intercom" "How did you get in here?"
[19:24] <Lunar_Lander> "We are scientists."
[19:25] <jonsowman> BrainDamage: a wise decision
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[19:25] <BrainDamage> the awful part is that he's trying to involve me in a rl renactment of bbt ...
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[19:25] <BrainDamage> I posed a condicio sine qua non that he needs to find an equally hot penny, and I get to make out with her
[19:25] <Lunar_Lander> do you have to go to the agressive ex-bfs of women in your neighbourhood?
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[19:27] <BrainDamage> oh, and I forgot to mention the awful coincidences, like his super religious mother ...
[19:28] <Lunar_Lander> ohh
[19:28] <BrainDamage> altho unlike sheldon, he dislike theoretical physics and makes fun of them saying they have no contact to reality
[19:28] <BrainDamage> and for that, I make fun of him telling he's a fake sheldon :p
[19:28] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[19:30] <Lunar_Lander> OH BTW did you read the end card of episode 1?
[19:30] <BrainDamage> I've just finished 4th season
[19:31] <Lunar_Lander> something about how Chuck Lorre never could read cards when he paused his VHS tapes
[19:31] <Lunar_Lander> and he visited some guy to propose making a digital recording method
[19:31] <Lunar_Lander> and that guy "asked him to leave his mother's basement"
[19:31] <Lunar_Lander> and then something that Chuck forgot about it and now we finally have DVDs
[19:33] <Lunar_Lander> "leonard" "WHAT?" "my mom bought me those trousers, you gonna have to call her"
[19:43] <nelly11> Hello! I am back again for help. I came up with a few concepts to test a deployment mechanism on a HAB and my tutor was not too happy with some. A concept he liked (which I don't really know how to make happen) is to try and deploy 4 antennas attached to the balloon. The antennas will contain springs that are compressed when they are held down on the payload box. They will be held down using pastic strings and a hot wire will
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[19:44] <nelly11> The whole thing will be carried on the balloon an upon receiving a command from the ground station, a small electrical circuit say, will produce current that will heat the wire and burn through the plastic strings to release the antenna
[19:45] <nelly11> now where Im stuck is how to practically make this happen at a very low mass penalty so that the entire payload box is as light as possible
[19:45] <SpeedEvil> WHAT HAPPEN??
[19:46] <SpeedEvil> 1W ceramic resistors good to 350C surface temperature rated are available, and cheap.
[19:46] <SpeedEvil> teeny '20C' li-ion cells are available.
[19:47] <nelly11> ok. I will look that up now
[19:47] <nelly11> so all you need are resistors and the battery?
[19:47] <SpeedEvil> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/5X-3-7V-Li-Po-Battery-Syma-RC-Helicopter-S107-150mah-20-/220743146149?pt=UK_ToysGames_RadioControlled_JN&hash=item3365511aa5
[19:47] <SpeedEvil> In principle, yes.
[19:47] <SpeedEvil> And a timer.
[19:49] <nelly11> ok thanks
[19:55] <NigeyS> SpeedEvil, you about in about an hour ?
[19:55] <SpeedEvil> Probably.
[19:55] <NigeyS> cool, i need to pick you're brains
[19:57] <SpeedEvil> My brains aare sorta-fried.
[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> hi NigeyS
[19:58] <SpeedEvil> Been spendin today waiting on imaginary busses.
[19:58] <NigeyS> hey kev
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[19:59] <Dan-K2VOL> SpeedEvil, they should have GPS tracking shouldn't they? I mean really
[19:59] <SpeedEvil> Indeed.
[19:59] <NigeyS> did 3 turn up at once?
[19:59] <SpeedEvil> No.
[19:59] <SpeedEvil> None turned up at once.
[20:00] <Lunar_Lander> SpeedEvil so nelly11 needs kind of a cutdown?
[20:00] <Dan-K2VOL> I get so irritated that we have money to track a balloon across the world but the transit department doesn't have the money to track 30 busses within radio range of their office
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[20:00] <SpeedEvil> The final service out to my house - well - near it - is once an hour from the local burbplex.
[20:01] <SpeedEvil> Apaert from 3 o-clock for some reason.
[20:01] <SpeedEvil> The 4 oclock service was missing, and the 5 oclock was 20 minutes late.
[20:01] <SpeedEvil> I'd just given up on the 20 mins one, and was walking home, when it arrived, and I had to run to catch.
[20:02] <Lunar_Lander> brb
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[20:02] <Dan-K2VOL> Nelly11 we use 30 gauge Nichrome wire that connects to 4 energizer lithium AA batteries for our cutdowns, works wonderfully. About 5cm of the wire is coiled around the nylon 3mm dia string
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[20:25] <nelly11> Dan-K2VOL: Im not sure I understood well what you meant
[20:26] <Dan-K2VOL> Nelly, go to http://youtube.com/steamfire and search that user's vids for cutdown
[20:26] <Dan-K2VOL> (that's my account, but I can't log in at work)
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[20:26] <Dan-K2VOL> You will see one in action on the bench
[20:27] <nelly11> ok thanks
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[20:30] <Lunar_Lander> schnell
[20:31] <Lunar_Lander> sorry
[20:31] <Lunar_Lander> www.videocorner.tv
[20:31] <Lunar_Lander> ariane!!
[20:31] <fsphil> ooooh
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[20:37] <Lunar_Lander> "minus 240 degrees, that's cold"
[20:38] <Upu> whats in it
[20:38] <Upu> ?
[20:38] <Lunar_Lander> LH2
[20:38] <Upu> sorry :) the payload
[20:38] <Lunar_Lander> and LOX
[20:38] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[20:38] <Lunar_Lander> sat for Japan and India
[20:38] <Upu> k
[20:39] <fsphil> hey how come the arianne website has the date the wrong way around
[20:39] <Upu> hopefully this one won't be an expensive firework
[20:55] <Laurenceb_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgTYZUrie1Q
[20:55] <Laurenceb_> the openpilot of vtrainer i posted aerlier
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[21:01] <Lunar_Lander> 3 minutes until upper stage burn end
[21:01] <Laurenceb_> of what?
[21:02] <Lunar_Lander> ariane
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[21:06] <Lunar_Lander> ST-2 seperation
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[21:10] <Lunar_Lander> MISSION SUCCESSFUL
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[21:11] <Lunar_Lander> xD "the champagne is on ice and the cigars are made ready"
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[21:23] <fsphil> no boom today
[21:26] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:26] <Lunar_Lander> but they showed some fireworks potential in one of the movies
[21:26] <Lunar_Lander> the ISRO rockets :D
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[21:39] <Lunar_Lander> hello mattltm
[21:40] <mattltm> Hey :)
[21:40] <Lunar_Lander> how's life?
[21:41] <mattltm> good thanks. Just got home
[21:42] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[21:42] <Lunar_Lander> I watched Ariane V202 go
[21:42] <Lunar_Lander> all successful
[21:43] <mattltm> cool.
[21:44] <Lunar_Lander> also, I watched Avril Lavinge singing "Knockin' on Heaven's Door" on South Korean TV
[21:45] <Lunar_Lander> with a shirt on that said "Go ahead, make my day"
[21:45] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[22:00] <fsphil> man if this weather doesn't improve soon, I'm liable to launch anyway and have this thing land somewhere unsensible
[22:02] <fsphil> again
[22:03] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[22:03] <BrainDamage> add a jack in box in that case please
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[22:25] Action: Laurenceb_ fails to understand why anyone would want to use vi
[22:25] <Laurenceb_> how do i write a line of text?
[22:26] <staylo> Press i to enter insert mode
[22:26] <Laurenceb_> oh my god
[22:26] <Laurenceb_> how do i delete a line?
[22:26] <SpeedEvil> dd
[22:27] <Laurenceb_> is there anything easier for using over ssh?
[22:27] <staylo> try nano
[22:28] <staylo> vim is awesome when you get usee to it, sheer pain until then though
[22:28] <SpeedEvil> emacs, ...
[22:29] <BrainDamage> vim and emacs are not text editors, they are operative systes
[22:29] <Laurenceb_> true *nix gurus are slightly crazy
[22:29] <BrainDamage> systems*
[22:29] <BrainDamage> actually scratch that, in-operative systems
[22:30] <staylo> emacs is an os lacking a good editor ;)
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[23:12] <NigeyS> lalala
[23:12] Action: NigeyS throws a sponge at fsphil
[23:15] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[23:19] <NigeyS> SpeedEvil, do you know of an extremely accurate pressure sensor that's atmega friendly ?
[23:20] <SpeedEvil> No.
[23:20] <NigeyS> :/
[23:20] <SpeedEvil> I assume you mean one that goes down to a couple of millibars?
[23:22] <Lunar_Lander> a friend of mine suggested a sponge in a plate capacitor
[23:23] <NigeyS> .5 kpa
[23:23] <Lunar_Lander> it will change shape with pressure and thus act like a changing dielectric
[23:23] <Lunar_Lander> but the bad thing is that this doesn't depend on pressure only
[23:23] <Lunar_Lander> so that idea is bad
[23:24] <NigeyS> eek yes that's a bad idea!
[23:24] <NigeyS> SpeedEvil, i need to know the exact pressure of when the balloon bursts
[23:25] <SpeedEvil> ah
[23:25] <BrainDamage> I wouldn't rely on pressure, instead I'd attach a strain gauge on the balloon
[23:25] <SpeedEvil> external - you mwan?
[23:25] <NigeyS> using the foil balloons fully inflated to get burst and burst pressure data for future attempts at SP
[23:25] <BrainDamage> and find tensile breakdown strenght
[23:26] <SpeedEvil> I'd hit it with a manometer.
[23:26] <NigeyS> ahh
[23:26] <NigeyS> now that i hadnt thought of
[23:27] <SpeedEvil> freescale has lots of suitable pressure sensors, if you want to do that.
[23:27] <NigeyS> looking at them now, i dont think a manometer would help due to the awkwardness of the valves on these foil balloons
[23:29] <eroomde> blah
[23:30] <NigeyS> hey Ed
[23:30] <eroomde> v pretty girl who referenced xkcd. how often does that happen?
[23:30] <eroomde> too drunk to be on irc
[23:30] <eroomde> bbl
[23:30] <NigeyS> lol cya!
[23:30] <natrium> eroomde: >:|
[23:30] <NigeyS> natrium !
[23:31] <natrium> eroomde: i permit you 2 beers per day max!
[23:31] <natrium> hi NigeySter
[23:31] <eroomde> natrium: fuck that for a bunch of bananas
[23:31] <natrium> XD
[23:31] <Lunar_Lander> Czech beer?
[23:32] <BrainDamage> wait, you said pretty girl, and you're now on irc? does.not.compute
[23:33] <eroomde> friend of friend's girlfriend
[23:33] <eroomde> came over for dinner
[23:33] <eroomde> they all got in a taxi back just now
[23:33] <eroomde> i did dinner
[23:33] <eroomde> good banter but not staying the night
[23:33] <eroomde> :(
[23:34] <natrium> :(
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[00:00] --- Sat May 21 2011