highaltitude.log.20110222

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[00:38] <Lunar_Lander> wb Dan
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[00:39] <kylehotchkiss> Hey so how do you get speed from the recommended free lift on http://www.ukhas.org.uk/guides:balloon_data ?
[00:39] <kylehotchkiss> I mean is there a calculation for that?
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[00:41] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[00:41] <Lunar_Lander> you can download the "burst3" spreadsheet just under the table
[00:42] <Lunar_Lander> it will calculate all you need to know if you enter the balloon and payload weight
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[00:44] <kylehotchkiss> Trying to write my own calculator in PHP
[00:44] <kylehotchkiss> What's the CD?
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[00:45] <Lunar_Lander> the coefficient of drag
[00:46] <Lunar_Lander> that is given in that spreadsheet
[00:46] <Lunar_Lander> there is a little chart for that
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[00:47] <SpeedEvil> Cd varies depending on if you're using a round, or cubic balloon.
[00:50] <Lunar_Lander> yes that is true
[00:51] <Lunar_Lander> and so does Reynold's Number
[00:53] <kylehotchkiss> Seems like it could be .25 for a 24 inch round balloon
[01:03] <NigeyS> wibble wobble
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[01:56] <NigeyS> damn its quiet in here
[02:02] <LazyLeopard> Hmmm... 2am here, so not entirely surprised if UK folks are asleep, I guess. States-side might be expected to be awake, though...
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[02:06] <NigeyS> yeah, theyre all hiding from us thinking we're asleep! lol
[02:07] <NigeyS> howcomes your up late LazyLeopard ?
[02:08] <LazyLeopard> Something microbial is dancing a dance in my sinuses, and it's making sleeping difficult...
[02:09] <NigeyS> ach dam that sux :(
[02:11] <LazyLeopard> Somewhat irritating. Leaves brain feeling like it's full of wool, too...
[02:11] <NigeyS> yeah its not nice, no sinex or anything ?
[02:12] <LazyLeopard> Applied, but taking its time...
[02:12] <NigeyS> meh :( hope it kicks in soon for you dude
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[02:13] <LazyLeopard> Cheers.
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[02:51] <NigeyS> meh ffs wish gps chip makers would state which cocom limits theyve applied to their chips !!!!!
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[07:30] <juxta_> looks like Tim's payload was recovered (hohoho III)
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[07:40] <Elwell> http://www.trci.org.au/Loki.html <-- hadn't seen that one before
[07:41] <Darkside> they're new
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[09:30] <eroomde> morning all
[09:32] <fsphil> morning ed
[09:32] <eroomde> hi
[09:32] <eroomde> how are things?
[09:34] <GW8RAK> Morning. Stuck to my work literally. Been gluing since 7.
[09:35] <eroomde> you have been gluing?
[09:35] <eroomde> are you set yet?
[09:35] <GW8RAK> Hopefully they will ready later. Have to go out today.
[09:36] <GW8RAK> First time we've tried this and gluing velcro to £500 boots is worrying.
[09:36] Action: fsphil is having a slow morning.. installing software
[09:37] <juxta_> hi eroomde
[09:37] <Darkside> juxta_: i have a mega protoshield
[09:37] <eroomde> hi juxta_ how are tricks?
[09:37] <juxta_> hey Darkside - excellent
[09:37] <Darkside> also it looks like adrian is coming, so hopefully i'll be in his car working HF
[09:37] <juxta_> not bad thanks eroomde
[09:38] <juxta_> mind if I pm you?
[09:38] <eroomde> do
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[10:13] <NigeyS> good morning people
[10:14] <eroomde> mornign NigeyS
[10:14] <NigeyS> hey eroomde
[10:15] Action: NigeyS thinks locosys support staff are generally...stupid
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[10:25] <NigeyS> ello speedy
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[10:56] <SpeedEvil> Hello
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[11:05] <GroupO> Hibby: hey man, are u in the office?
[11:15] <GroupO> .
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[11:35] <jgrahamc> Morning (or almost lunchtime) all
[11:37] <fsphil> howdy howdy
[11:37] <GroupO> morning
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[11:37] <Dooberry> London City Airport is amazing - no queues or anything.
[11:38] <fsphil> mmm still 2 hours until lunchtime here :)
[11:40] <jgrahamc> Yes, LCY is amazing.
[11:41] <jgrahamc> Where are you fsphil ?
[11:50] Action: fsphil is in n.ireland
[11:51] <eroomde> i have had too much coffee and not enough food and have the sweats
[11:51] <eroomde> i need lunchtime in a big way
[11:51] <eroomde> tis last night's boeuf bourgignon
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[12:06] <Lunar_Lander> hello everybody
[12:08] <Lunar_Lander> hello Upu
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[12:12] <Lunar_Lander> brb lunch
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[12:36] <Upu> Hi Lunar
[12:39] <Lunar_Lander> back
[12:39] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[12:39] <Lunar_Lander> how are you today?
[12:43] <Lunar_Lander> I read the breadboard tutorial you gave me
[12:43] <Lunar_Lander> so if I get this, the Uno has a CPU socket
[12:43] <Lunar_Lander> and the ATMega is removed from there and onto the breadboard
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[12:44] <NigeyS> Lunar_Lander,
[12:44] <NigeyS> http://arduino.cc/en/Main/Standalone
[12:44] <NigeyS> handy tutorial aswell
[12:44] <Lunar_Lander> yeah that one I meant
[12:44] <Lunar_Lander> I read this
[12:45] <Josh__> Hi everyone. I'm planning a weather balloon launch this year during June/July. I heard that there is a place in Cambridge where you can launch them and it has a blanket permission so I don't have to go through insurance, airport contact etc etc. Is this true? Also, is there anywhere else I could launch closer to the South East? Thanks.
[12:46] <Lunar_Lander> ah now I see
[12:46] <Lunar_Lander> I need to mount the pins to the breakout boards?
[12:46] <Lunar_Lander> i.e. solder them on
[12:46] <NigeyS> most breakout boards come without the headers etc so yeah a bit of soldering
[12:47] <NigeyS> Josh__, you need to speak to the CUSF guys
[12:47] <Josh__> Thanks Nigey. Do they have a website/email you could point me towards? Will a Google search be beneficial enough?
[12:48] <NigeyS> have you looked at the ukhas wiki? it's also worth signign up to the ukhas mailing list aswell
[12:48] <NigeyS> signing*
[12:48] <Lunar_Lander> and if jcoxon is here, he can also answer questions
[12:48] <Lunar_Lander> I think
[12:48] <NigeyS> he's in vienna! lucky sod hehe
[12:48] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[12:49] <Lunar_Lander> to get to that tutorial
[12:49] <Josh__> Thanks NigeyS. Joined! :D
[12:50] <Lunar_Lander> when I get the chip out of the Uno, I don't need that bootloading showed there?
[12:50] <NigeyS> no probs Josh__ if he's about eroomde may be of some help, but i think he's at lunch at the moment
[12:50] <NigeyS> no Lunar_Lander it will already have a bootloader installed
[12:50] <Lunar_Lander> ok that is good
[12:50] <Lunar_Lander> and I saw that the breadboard won't work with the ArduinoMega, as that one has no removable CPU
[12:51] <Josh__> Not a problem. I have loads of newbie questions but I shan't bore you with them. Hehe.
[12:51] <NigeyS> nope, dont get a mega! lol i did and its been a right arseache
[12:51] <Lunar_Lander> oh ok
[12:51] <NigeyS> Josh__, it's ok, ask away :-)
[12:51] <Lunar_Lander> Josh__ don't worry I am also asking basic questions and I'm still alive xD
[12:52] <NigeyS> unless you plan for ALOT of sensors, the mega isnt really worth the extra effort or cost
[12:52] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[12:52] <Lunar_Lander> I had another idea
[12:52] <Darkside> aww xmega ia aaesome
[12:52] <Lunar_Lander> when the breadboard does the GPS and transmitting
[12:52] <NigeyS> hey Darkside !
[12:52] <Josh__> Hehe. Well the low down is me and a friend (both 20) are planning a budget weather ballon launch with a payload to capture images of space. we have plans for a very unique and un-tried launch so we're being careful with the planning preparations to give us the best chance of success
[12:52] <Lunar_Lander> is there some way to record the data inside of the system? I.E. have an SD card or so
[12:53] <Lunar_Lander> hello Darkside
[12:53] <NigeyS> yeah lunar, you might want to look at openlog
[12:53] <Upu> Yes lunar there are sd card break outs and code for Arduino
[12:53] <NigeyS> Josh__, what is this untried method? :D
[12:53] <NigeyS> afternoon Upu
[12:53] <Upu> I'm interested in that too josh
[12:53] <Upu> Hi NigeyS
[12:53] <Lunar_Lander> and then I would plug the SD breakout into the breadboard?
[12:54] <Upu> Not used one but yes I suspec
[12:54] <Lunar_Lander> oh ok
[12:54] <Josh__> haha well you'll see soon.....tbh, it's not un-tried.....it's just a new way of capturing the images with the use of 2 cameras
[12:54] <Lunar_Lander> btw I found that SHARP Dust Sensor
[12:54] <Darkside> done thaat
[12:54] <Lunar_Lander> http://sensorapp.net/?p=479
[12:54] <Lunar_Lander> and that code on the page
[12:55] <Josh__> eventually if after this first launch, all goes to plan, i can use that as my pilot test for a weather balloon to capture the journey to space in 3D
[12:55] <Lunar_Lander> that is required to make the sensor work?
[12:55] <Darkside> you wont see much depth
[12:55] <Darkside> esp at apex
[12:55] <Darkside> everything will be so far away heh
[12:56] <NigeyS> Lunar_Lander, yup, that should be fairly straight forward to hook up and get running by the looks of it
[12:56] <Josh__> true but we've thought of other ways to incorporate close/far scenery
[12:56] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[12:56] <NigeyS> wouldnt camera stability be an issue for 3d imaging ?
[12:56] <Lunar_Lander> only that I wouldn't have the Arduino 2009 but the ATM in the middle of the board
[12:57] <Darkside> problem would be syncing 2 video streams
[12:57] <Darkside> when the internal clocls will drift
[12:57] <Josh__> not too much. so long as it's a sturdy payload. GoPro cameras have just released their new 3D GoPro's......the underlying mechanisms are two ordinary GoPro's which clip into another case with one external lens on
[12:57] <NigeyS> could be a bit of a knightmare tbh
[12:57] <Josh__> instead of the normal 3D cameras which have one camera and 2 lenses
[12:58] <Darkside> Josh__: go pros work well
[12:58] <Josh__> yeah.....cost a fair bit though :/
[12:58] <Darkside> we've flown then 4 times now i think
[12:58] <NigeyS> heh theyre certainly not cheap, but the results have been brill
[12:58] <Josh__> i bet they produce some quality results
[12:58] <Darkside> ohhh yes
[12:58] <Josh__> yeah ^ worth it i guess
[12:59] <Darkside> projecthorus.org Josh__
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[12:59] <Darkside> go to blog and scroll down a bit
[12:59] <NigeyS> Lunar_Lander, are you getting a pcb for you atm ?
[13:00] <Josh__> wow!
[13:00] <Lunar_Lander> I think I'd try the breadboard thing
[13:01] <NigeyS> yeah do the breadboard for testing, but you dont want to send a breadboard up :P
[13:01] <Josh__> that's amazing
[13:01] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[13:01] <Josh__> the thing i'm worried about is launching the balloon and then it drifting to far and landing in the sea :/
[13:02] <Lunar_Lander> so the Uno gets sent up?
[13:02] <NigeyS> make use of the predictor, don't launch if it predicts a splashdown :D
[13:02] <Josh__> is the predictor fairly accurate?
[13:02] <NigeyS> yup Lunar
[13:02] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[13:03] <fsphil> it's pretty accurate for up to two days away, then things go a bit random
[13:03] <Lunar_Lander> and you could maybe have two unos and the second only takes sensor data and records them (if many sensors are used)
[13:03] <NigeyS> yeah more than 2 days and it gets a bit..murky
[13:03] <Lunar_Lander> and the first has the Xmitter
[13:03] <Josh__> ah ok cool
[13:04] <Josh__> that's the predictor at habhub.org?
[13:04] <NigeyS> yip
[13:04] Action: NigeyS throws a basketball at fsphil
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[13:04] <Lunar_Lander> hey btw
[13:04] <Lunar_Lander> that professor who donated me the helium is now also the Dean of Physics here
[13:04] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[13:04] <NigeyS> nicey! :D
[13:05] <Lunar_Lander> and he told me that if he could change the lab, he would include soldering exercises and so on
[13:05] Action: fsphil throws a surprised chicken at NigeyS
[13:05] <NigeyS> that'll be helpful
[13:05] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[13:06] <NigeyS> chicken? wth lmao .. thanks! *feeds it to the cat*
[13:06] <NigeyS> fsphil, it appears, with a special pmtk code, i can unlock the cocom limit of that locosys gps chip ;)
[13:07] <NigeyS> or at least the mode, from or to and .. vice versa
[13:07] <fsphil> oh cool, I wonder why that isn't the default
[13:07] <NigeyS> no idea, i have a lovely email dialgoue with a taiwanese lady called brenda going on .. lol
[13:08] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[13:08] <Lunar_Lander> hey btw
[13:08] <Lunar_Lander> there is a belgian comedy group, who did pull off some amazing actions on TV
[13:08] <Lunar_Lander> for instance they called people who sent spam emails
[13:08] <Lunar_Lander> like a guy from South Africa who sold IPods and IPads
[13:08] <Josh__> how far has anyone travelled to pick up a payload after descent?
[13:09] <Lunar_Lander> and then they acted as they were Merchants from Luxemburg
[13:09] <Lunar_Lander> the talk was like this
[13:09] <Lunar_Lander> "I need apples, I thought you sell apples" "Yeah man, I sell Ipod, Ipad" "But I need apples, you see? I need the real fruit"
[13:09] <NigeyS> lol
[13:10] <Lunar_Lander> "Oh wait, my monocle fell down"
[13:10] <NigeyS> Josh__, pretty far, especially if its a valueable payload
[13:10] <Josh__> 30km?
[13:11] <NigeyS> alot further in some cases
[13:11] <Josh__> hmmm ok thanks, i'll pick a day with 0kpm wind i thin
[13:11] <Josh__> hehe
[13:12] <fsphil> Mine is sitting 300km away now, I might be traveling to find it in the summer
[13:12] <NigeyS> and there was tim with his epic speedboat rescue....
[13:12] <Josh__> :O lol, i'm not talking a long term launch however
[13:12] <Josh__> haha!
[13:14] <Josh__> i've decided to make my payload from a polystyrene box and am currently trying to find a decent place that sells them
[13:14] <fsphil> that and juxta's swim through shark-infested waters ... though I may have exaggerated that
[13:14] <Josh__> i'm wondering how i go about attaching the balloon to the payload securely
[13:14] <GW8RAK> Try a fishmongers. Could be smelly though
[13:14] <Josh__> yeah good thinking!
[13:15] <NigeyS> oh and Darkside and juxta's trek throughh the sand....
[13:15] <Lunar_Lander> what about those people who sent the cheese?
[13:15] <Lunar_Lander> yeah and also into the sea NigeyS -> Horus 8
[13:15] <NigeyS> Josh__, there also a place on ebay that sells them
[13:16] <NigeyS> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Polystyrene-Shipping-Box-DGP-EPS7-similar-/280572574647?pt=UK_Packaging_Materials&hash=item41536dbbb7
[13:16] <Darkside> Josh__: http://www.projecthorus.org/horus7.html that was our longest flight i think
[13:16] <Lunar_Lander> btw lol there was a protest at my uni and they have a sign with "Rich Parents for everybody!"
[13:17] <Darkside> Josh__: where are you launching from?
[13:17] <Darkside> what country / area
[13:17] <Josh__> crikey! that's a bit of a trek
[13:17] <Darkside> crikey
[13:17] <Darkside> crikey? >_>
[13:17] <Darkside> australian?
[13:17] <Josh__> well i'm not sure :(....i live in surrey in uk but i think they have blanket permission up in cambridge
[13:17] <Darkside> oh, UK
[13:17] <Darkside> i'd hate to launch there
[13:17] <Josh__> yeah ^^
[13:18] <Darkside> shit radio laws, and crap country to launch from
[13:18] <Darkside> since you have villiages every few km
[13:18] <NigeyS> being on an island has its drawbacks lol
[13:18] <Darkside> NigeyS: hey, i'm on an islang
[13:18] <Darkside> island*
[13:18] <Darkside> its just bigger than yours
[13:18] <NigeyS> yours is bigger!
[13:18] <Josh__> lol
[13:18] <Lunar_Lander> well Glaisher thought the same
[13:18] <Lunar_Lander> and he launched at Wolverhampton frequently
[13:18] <GW8RAK> Everybody lives on an island. It's just the size that varies.
[13:18] <Lunar_Lander> LOL yeah
[13:18] <NigeyS> we're just puney :(
[13:19] <Darkside> haha
[13:19] <NigeyS> phils island is smaller though so ha! :p
[13:19] <Darkside> australia is an awesome place to launch from
[13:19] <Darkside> though it does pose some challenges with retrieval sometimes
[13:19] <Darkside> like, ocean, desert
[13:19] <Darkside> sheep
[13:19] <Josh__> lol
[13:19] <Darkside> cows
[13:19] <NigeyS> nah not a challenge, if you love sand, sharks, sea water, and snakes .. :p
[13:19] <Darkside> there weren't any sharks... we think
[13:19] <NigeyS> lol
[13:20] <NigeyS> anyway mr.. about these cows ..
[13:20] <NigeyS> when we going to see a dam kangaroo!
[13:20] <Darkside> haha
[13:20] <Darkside> good question
[13:20] <Darkside> Josh__: http://www.projecthorus.org/horus8.html
[13:20] <Darkside> check out the bottom left of that trace
[13:20] <Darkside> the landing area
[13:20] <NigeyS> seriously, the last thing i expected to see on a ustream from aus was a bloody cow! lmao!
[13:20] <Darkside> :P
[13:21] <Lunar_Lander> Darkside the saddest thing about Horus 8 is the loss of MAXTRAX and the glasses
[13:21] <Darkside> yeah
[13:21] <GW8RAK> That's lunch finished. No more excitement until tea time. :(
[13:22] <Lunar_Lander> I got an exiting thing
[13:22] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.flickr.com/photos/33053621@N02/3091179218/
[13:22] <Josh__> how do you guys attach the balloon to the payload securely?
[13:22] <Lunar_Lander> at the left you see the physics building of the University
[13:22] <Darkside> Josh__: we use brickies line
[13:22] <Lunar_Lander> and the building part to the right is the main building of the science campus
[13:22] <Lunar_Lander> where math and informatics are housed
[13:22] <Lunar_Lander> and do you see those "balconies"?
[13:23] <Josh__> brickies line
[13:23] <Josh__> ok thanks
[13:23] <NigeyS> hope no-one has jumped from them lunar!
[13:24] <Lunar_Lander> no fortunately not
[13:24] <Darkside> Josh__: we use cable ties to seal up the balloon, and tie the brickies line onto the cable ties
[13:24] <Lunar_Lander> but I got permission to set my payload up on that top balcony over the weekend
[13:24] <Josh__> wow. ok is that really secure enough to hold everything?
[13:24] <NigeyS> god aye, brickies line can take some weight
[13:25] <NigeyS> Lunar_Lander thats pretty cool!
[13:25] <Josh__> ok. and then i guess you pierce some holes into the payload and thread the line through them?
[13:25] <GW8RAK> Lunar_Lander are you planning to test your parachute?
[13:26] <Lunar_Lander> that too
[13:26] <Lunar_Lander> the building manager said that he could arrange that
[13:26] <NigeyS> just dont go tying any house bricks to it :)
[13:26] <Lunar_Lander> that we throw the chute, ballasted with a pack of sugar, out from that floor
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[13:26] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[13:27] <Lunar_Lander> I was asked "why sugar, and not flour"
[13:27] <GroupO_> hey guys
[13:27] <NigeyS> hey GroupO
[13:27] <Lunar_Lander> he was quickly reminded what happens if a flour bag hits the ground
[13:27] <NigeyS> lol splat!
[13:27] <Lunar_Lander> hi GroupO_
[13:27] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[13:27] <GroupO_> does anyone have any advice about using a phone for GSM?
[13:28] <GroupO_> i have heard T68i is a good way to go
[13:28] <NigeyS> yup t68i will do nicely
[13:28] <Josh__> ty±
[13:28] <GroupO_> cool - do you know of any tutorials/guides about using them on an arduino?
[13:29] <NigeyS> yeah let me find the link
[13:29] <NigeyS> http://alienproject.wordpress.com/page/2/
[13:29] <NigeyS> scroll down a bit
[13:30] <NigeyS> there's arduino code in dan's repo
[13:32] <GroupO_> NigeyS: thanks alot - mucho appreciado
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[13:32] <NigeyS> no probs, DanielRichman did a great job of documenting it
[13:33] <Lunar_Lander> oh yeah
[13:33] <Lunar_Lander> getting a SSB receiver will be another thing
[13:33] <GroupO_> yeh, its very clear - even for a noob like me
[13:33] <Lunar_Lander> but someone said that any Scanner works
[13:34] <GroupO_> ssb?
[13:34] <Lunar_Lander> yeah I heard that you need a SSB capable receiver
[13:35] <GW8RAK> If you use the RTTY nased system used my UK groups, then you need SSB reception
[13:35] <GroupO_> ok i will talk to Hibby and see what he has
[13:35] <Josh__> i've gtg guys
[13:35] <Josh__> thanks for the advice and help
[13:35] <GroupO_> i'm sure it will be fine, because we are using RTTY and the scanner he has is suitable for that
[13:35] <Josh__> i'll probs be back online tonight!
[13:35] <Josh__> have a good day!
[13:35] <NigeyS> you to josh :)
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[13:36] <Lunar_Lander> yeah RTTY is what you do with the NTX2 right?
[13:37] <GW8RAK> Yes, but it's not RTTY as used by radio amateurs. We use 8 bit ASCII code.
[13:37] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[13:38] <Lunar_Lander> RTTY is what is used in those machines which spew out messages on paper right?
[13:39] <GW8RAK> I don't think hard copy teletype machines have been used for some time.
[13:39] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[13:39] <GW8RAK> Most commercial datamodes now include some form of error correction.
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[13:39] <Lunar_Lander> by the way, look what I just found: http://www.heise.de/netze/artikel/Die-0-Euro-Antenne-223704.html
[13:39] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[13:40] <russss> haha, that's awesome
[13:40] <GW8RAK> Like it :)
[13:40] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[13:42] <fsphil> cool
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[13:47] <Upu> oh wow
[13:47] <Upu> HoHoHo III has been found
[13:47] <Upu> in Germany
[13:47] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
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[13:49] <fsphil> I wonder if we'll find out now what caused the huge rtty shift
[13:49] <Lunar_Lander> I hope
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[13:55] <Darkside> .names
[13:55] <Darkside> whoops
[13:57] <StrayVoltage> *Hides*
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[14:02] <m1x10> Good afternoon all
[14:03] <Lunar_Lander> kali mera
[14:04] <Lunar_Lander> cherete
[14:04] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[14:04] <m1x10> oh
[14:04] <m1x10> lola
[14:04] <m1x10> goode morgen :p
[14:04] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[14:05] <m1x10> u know some?
[14:07] <Lunar_Lander> I just looked up "Grrek words for your holiday"
[14:07] <Lunar_Lander> *greek
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[14:13] <m1x10> :p
[14:15] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[14:15] <Lunar_Lander> and I finally start to understand electronics
[14:15] <Lunar_Lander> thanks to NigeyS Darkside Upu and all others
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[14:16] <m1x10> lol
[14:16] <m1x10> I also raised my XP level recently
[14:16] <m1x10> :)
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[14:18] <Lunar_Lander> yay
[14:18] <Lunar_Lander> and all the missiles in good order?
[14:21] <m1x10> lol
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[14:22] <m1x10> yesterday i did my worst guarding
[14:22] <m1x10> cold wind rain much humidity
[14:23] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[14:23] <Lunar_Lander> but I got something to cheer you up
[14:23] <Lunar_Lander> I just saw a trailer for the show "Who Wants to marry my son?"
[14:24] <m1x10> wtf?
[14:24] <Lunar_Lander> and there was a mother going through the city and asking random women "Excuse me, I am looking for a girlfriend for my son?"
[14:24] <Lunar_Lander> "are you available?"
[14:24] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.eyeworks.tv/catalogue/catalogue_item/t/who_wants_to_marry_my_son
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[14:24] <NigeyS> lmao
[14:24] <NigeyS> its zuph!
[14:25] <Lunar_Lander> hello Zuph
[14:25] <Zuph> Morning :)
[14:26] <NigeyS> Zuph, you're kinder eggs are oficially on their travels! :D
[14:26] <Zuph> Cool. Be sure to let me know what you want and where you want it sent :)
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[14:27] <Lunar_Lander> lol
[14:27] <Lunar_Lander> oh m1x10
[14:27] <Lunar_Lander> GW8RAK helped too of course
[14:27] <NigeyS> will do dude, now you make sure you get all 4, if the postie eats any, kill him! :p
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[14:27] <Lunar_Lander> but you are not a ham operator m1x10 =
[14:27] <Lunar_Lander> ?
[14:28] <GW8RAK> No probs, Lunar_ Lander. I asked plenty of questions when I started. Don't know it all by any means, but getting there.
[14:28] <fsphil> hehe, I can picture four empty wrappers arriving
[14:28] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[14:28] <NigeyS> lol yeah, they just leave the toys to be put together!
[14:28] <Lunar_Lander> I am asking because Greek callsigns start with SV
[14:29] <m1x10> Lunar_Lander: I have a ham license but im not doing anything at the moment
[14:29] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[14:29] <m1x10> yes its SV and SW
[14:29] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[14:29] <m1x10> SV for those who know morse code
[14:29] <m1x10> I got SW
[14:29] <Lunar_Lander> I got a question from the german ham exam
[14:29] <m1x10> SW2HYX
[14:29] <Lunar_Lander> which countries use the callsigns DA to DZ?
[14:29] <m1x10> :p
[14:29] <Lunar_Lander> Sierra Whiskey Two Hotey Yankee X-Ray
[14:29] <m1x10> hehe
[14:29] <Lunar_Lander> *Hotel
[14:30] <Lunar_Lander> and it turns out
[14:30] <Lunar_Lander> DA to DR belong to Germany
[14:30] <Lunar_Lander> DS, DT are South Korea
[14:30] <Lunar_Lander> and DU to DZ are the Phillipines
[14:30] <m1x10> Lunar_Lander: my bro is doing fast german lang lessons
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[14:31] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[14:31] <m1x10> he is leaving greece
[14:31] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[14:31] <m1x10> going to be doctor there
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[14:31] <Lunar_Lander> where exactly?
[14:31] <m1x10> we still dont know
[14:31] <m1x10> we try to get in contact with other greek communities there
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[14:32] <m1x10> and its possible that if he makes it and find a job in german hospital
[14:32] <m1x10> i will come too
[14:32] <Lunar_Lander> yeah that would be cool
[14:32] <m1x10> sure
[14:32] <m1x10> we are too young and we want to work. Now greece is not offering oppurtunities.
[14:32] <Lunar_Lander> I'm here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osnabr%C3%BCck
[14:33] <m1x10> we will loose our years
[14:33] <m1x10> here
[14:34] <m1x10> we want to evolve. not try to survive.
[14:34] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[14:34] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.osnabrueck.de/webcam1.asp
[14:34] <m1x10> but there are some things i dont like with germany. its cold and your lang is strange
[14:35] <Lunar_Lander> yeah that is true
[14:35] <m1x10> oh yeah and I dont like those houses
[14:35] <Lunar_Lander> but we got ALDI
[14:35] <Lunar_Lander> is there ALDI in greece?
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[14:35] <m1x10> ALDI ?
[14:36] <m1x10> Im the guy that likes houses like this: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_6yf7zcawPhg/TBHFuBvo1sI/AAAAAAAAB8c/nXO6hoCGrRo/s1600/Fira,+Santorini,+Cyclades+Islands,+Greece.jpg
[14:36] <m1x10> not like yours :(
[14:36] <Lunar_Lander> cool!
[14:36] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[14:36] <m1x10> they look creepy to me
[14:36] <GW8RAK> Nice
[14:36] <GW8RAK> But a big Yagi would look out of place
[14:36] <fsphil> never!
[14:37] <m1x10> what is aLDI ?
[14:37] <fsphil> all building can be improved with an appropriately placed yagi :)
[14:37] <Lunar_Lander> aldi is like this http://www.aldi.co.uk/
[14:37] <fsphil> We've got lots of Lidl shops here, very few Aldi
[14:37] <m1x10> aa
[14:38] <m1x10> yeah my place is full of lidl too
[14:38] <fsphil> I got my small telescope there
[14:38] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gp09Sdrw2W4
[14:38] <m1x10> Lunar_Lander: you live in a house like that?
[14:39] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.bauplaneronline.de/images/doppelhaus.jpg
[14:39] <Lunar_Lander> something like this
[14:39] <Laurenceb> is that the lost city of atlantis place?
[14:39] <m1x10> Lunar_Lander: thats a nice house
[14:40] <m1x10> but no balconies?
[14:40] <Lunar_Lander> no
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[14:41] <m1x10> Lunar_Lander: http://www.saloniki.org/webcam/webcam_limani.htm
[14:41] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhaxEdzropo&feature=related LIDL Malta
[14:41] <Lunar_Lander> cool!
[14:42] <m1x10> you live in north germany
[14:42] <m1x10> that should be a very cold place
[14:42] <m1x10> do german people speak english ?
[14:42] <Lunar_Lander> most of them do
[14:44] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SXPu-FMnVk&feature=related
[14:44] <m1x10> here there is the common view that french and german ppl dont speak english
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[14:44] <Lunar_Lander> yeah french sometimes know no english
[14:45] <m1x10> I wish to do some Ms in germany.
[14:45] <Lunar_Lander> we once had exchange students from France who couldn't speak english
[14:45] <m1x10> and work at the same time
[14:45] <m1x10> my other choice is to go to London, but the weather is awful there.
[14:46] <m1x10> I will have psychological problems :p
[14:46] <GW8RAK> If you want awful weather, come to Wales
[14:46] <m1x10> where is that ?
[14:46] <m1x10> ah lol
[14:46] <GW8RAK> Small country stuck on the west side of England
[14:47] <m1x10> yeah
[14:47] <m1x10> Lunar_Lander: are german girls sluts or good persons? or mixed? :p
[14:47] <GW8RAK> LOL :)
[14:48] <Lunar_Lander> mixed
[14:48] <Lunar_Lander> here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEGbVJJRZSA
[14:49] <m1x10> lol ppl
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[14:49] <jgrahamc> I don't think the question "are german girls sluts or good persons? or mixed? :p" is appropriate here. Let's not bring the tone down.
[14:51] <m1x10> lol, ok
[14:51] <m1x10> my bro is here
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[14:54] <m1x10> my bro had a german girlfriend when he was 20, he met her in some greek resort place
[14:54] <m1x10> sandra
[14:54] <m1x10> :p
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[14:58] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[15:02] <m1x10> http://www.robot-electronics.co.uk/acatalog/Thermal_Array_Sensor.html
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[15:07] <NigeyS> hey Dan
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[15:07] <Dan-K2VOL> ey
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[15:09] <fsphil> that was brief lol
[15:09] <NigeyS> talk about a flying visit lol
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[15:17] <Laurenceb> http://www.stanford.edu/~siegman/ring_laser_gyros/Three%20axis%20laser%20gyro%20med.jpg
[15:18] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[15:18] <Lunar_Lander> the old Arianes had that IIRC
[15:19] <Laurenceb> hideously expensive
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[15:21] <Laurenceb> i saw some ideas for Mossbau or super-conductive gyros
[15:22] <Laurenceb> superconductive block with sheilding and SQUIDS would be ... interesting
[15:23] <Lunar_Lander> https://www.fbn-dd.de/der-verein/vereinsprojekte/messteam/bauanleitung-fuer-yagi-antenne/
[15:23] <Lunar_Lander> is that good? look at the pictures at the bottom
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[15:39] <GW8RAK> I've been trying to understand if these could be of benefit to HAB'ing http://www.rev-ed.co.uk/docs/AXE213.pdf
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[15:40] <GW8RAK> Cheap, but would they offer any benefits over what we do already?
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[15:45] <fsphil> probably wouldn't have the range using a proper receiver would give
[15:47] <GW8RAK> Sorry, what I meant was in terms of S/N ratio for encoding and decoding the signal. I'd use a proper RX with them
[15:48] <GW8RAK> What would Manchester encoding give us?
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[15:49] <fsphil> I doubt it would make much difference
[15:50] <GW8RAK> I suppose, we are not interested in any one data string and if received incorrectly, we rely on getting another one, or someone else getting it.
[15:52] <fsphil> best option would be some kind of error correction
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[15:55] <GW8RAK> True, but it would be interesting to test it.
[15:55] <GW8RAK> I feel a modification to the flight board coming on.
[15:57] <fsphil> haha
[15:58] <GW8RAK> Just about got mine drawn up and hope to do some etching this weekend. Most of it will be on veroboard though
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[15:58] <fsphil> dominoex + fec seems the best option, although complicated to implement and the fldigi modem can't handle frequency drift like it can with RTTY
[15:59] <SpeedEvil> I was pondering something rather simple.
[15:59] <SpeedEvil> Take existing rtty.
[15:59] <fsphil> rtty+fec
[15:59] <SpeedEvil> Add a short string of FEC to it
[15:59] <fsphil> yea, 7-bit RS codes would work well there
[15:59] <SpeedEvil> It needs a decoder that doesn't throw a wobbly when the framing bits getr errored though
[16:00] <fsphil> better to have convolution coding, can handle variable-length data
[16:00] <fsphil> but means existing decodes won't work
[16:01] <fsphil> decoders
[16:01] <GW8RAK> I don't know how other FEC systems work, but IIRC, AMTOR just repeated each character at original position plus 5 . This works well at HF although it does slow things down.
[16:02] <fsphil> they all do unfortunately :)
[16:02] <fsphil> still, quicker than having to repeat the entire string
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[16:04] <GW8RAK> If that simple AMTOR way improved reception, it would be easy to implement.
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[16:04] <Josh__> Hi guys! I'm back :D :S
[16:05] <Josh__> jjust looking at a weather ballon to buy for a project
[16:05] <Josh__> is this any good?
[16:05] <Josh__> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/New-Giant-2200-Gram-Weather-Balloon-Meteorological-NR-/170604618770?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27b8d3e412#ht_7029wt_1282
[16:05] <eroomde> might not have aged well
[16:05] <russss> "new"
[16:05] <SpeedEvil> Josh__: you're in the US?
[16:05] <russss> for certain values of the word new
[16:05] <eroomde> so might burst earlier than you expect
[16:05] <Josh__> ahhh i wondered why it was so cheap
[16:05] <Josh__> no i'm in the UK but it seems they are quite expensive over here
[16:06] <eroomde> the price is honest though - thats really how much they cost, i think
[16:06] <russss> new ones are more expensive, because they perish
[16:06] <russss> http://randomsolutions.co.uk/Random_Engineering/Balloons.html
[16:06] <Josh__> i guess so
[16:07] <Josh__> thanks russsss
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[16:07] <Josh__> how big a balloon should i get to get me around 30k?
[16:07] <Josh__> 30km*
[16:07] <russss> depends partially on how heavy your payload is
[16:07] <russss> http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~cuspaceflight/calc/
[16:08] <Josh__> our payload is going to be roughly 1kg
[16:08] <Josh__> ahh that's a great link
[16:08] <Josh__> thanks
[16:08] <eroomde> russss: it's integrated into cuspaceflight.co.uk/predict now
[16:09] <russss> ah
[16:09] <russss> I just hit the link on habhub.org
[16:09] <fsphil> GW8RAK, the trouble with repeating characters .. how do you know which one was right?
[16:09] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.sparkfun.com/products/163 this one is good?
[16:09] <eroomde> probs needs an update :)
[16:10] <fsphil> the stand-alone version is handy too
[16:10] <fsphil> for mobile connections
[16:10] <eroomde> Lunar_Lander: yes
[16:10] <eroomde> well, it works at altitude
[16:10] <eroomde> it's definitely not as sensitive as the uBlox units
[16:10] <eroomde> but it served us well on badger 1
[16:10] <eroomde> just use a decent patch antenna with a ground plane underneath it
[16:11] <Lunar_Lander> ah
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[16:11] <GW8RAK> AMTOR uses a 7 bit code with each character having 4 marks and 3 spaces. If the ratio is different, the character is ignored and the other one tested.
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[16:16] <Lunar_Lander> GW8RAK?
[16:16] <GW8RAK> Afternoon
[16:16] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[16:17] <Lunar_Lander> you said that you could send me resistors and so on
[16:17] <Lunar_Lander> that would be great :)
[16:17] <GW8RAK> Yes, just let me know what you want. Have you got a list ready?
[16:19] <Lunar_Lander> I think I need at least what it says here http://arduino.cc/en/Main/Standalone, so the resistors and capacitors given there
[16:19] <Lunar_Lander> and the LEDs
[16:19] <Lunar_Lander> do you have that Voltage Regulator as well?
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[16:21] <Lunar_Lander> I found the crystal on sparkfun
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[16:25] <GW8RAK> Okay Lunar_Lander, I will get those bits for you. I may have the crystal as well. I know I have plenty of 8MHz ones. Would the reduced speed affect things? Can you compensate by reducing delay times etc?
[16:26] <GW8RAK> Got some voltage regs spare as well.
[16:26] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[16:26] <Lunar_Lander> I don't know if it would work with 8 Mhz
[16:26] <GW8RAK> It should still work, but any time critical steps would be twice as long.
[16:26] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[16:27] <Lunar_Lander> so i would have to reprogram that?
[16:27] <Lunar_Lander> the CPU I mean
[16:27] <GW8RAK> I'll have a look tomorrow evening when I'm home for a 16MHz xtal.
[16:27] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[16:28] <Lunar_Lander> that last thing in the list, does he mean a button switch with that?
[16:28] <fsphil> I've a few spare here if all else fails
[16:28] <GW8RAK> Yes, but it may just be a case of changing serial port speeds etc. The Picaxe chips I am using can be used at many different speeds and all it takes is a correction to certain functions.
[16:28] <GW8RAK> Yes, just a push to make switch.
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[16:29] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[16:29] <Lunar_Lander> that would be nice if you have one of these too
[16:29] <Lunar_Lander> thanks :)
[16:29] <GW8RAK> I've printed the list off and I'll see what I can find. I may even have a go myself.
[16:30] <GW8RAK> Not played with Arduino and don't know if I want to learn another language.
[16:30] <GW8RAK> Struggling with Spanish at present!
[16:31] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[16:31] <Lunar_Lander> thanks again :)
[16:31] <Lunar_Lander> btw
[16:31] <Lunar_Lander> someone on sparkfun complained that they sell the crystal without the capacitors
[16:32] <Lunar_Lander> so I searched my tabs for the tutorial
[16:32] <Lunar_Lander> and I was like "Fortunately he has written them on the list"
[16:32] <fsphil> their crystal kit comes with capacitors, though not enough
[16:32] <Lunar_Lander> and next: "Well dumb, withought the caps it wouldn't work anyway"
[16:32] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[16:33] <Lunar_Lander> I heard that Radiometrix sometimes gives NTX2 away if someone does a balloon?
[16:33] <Lunar_Lander> so it is worth to write them?
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[16:33] <fsphil> there is enough capacitance in breadboard to use crystals directly :)
[16:33] <Lunar_Lander> cool :)
[16:35] <GW8RAK> Just out of interest, how is the Arduino programmed please? I can see references to USB Breakout boards, but can it be done straight from a normal serial port?
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[16:36] <Lunar_Lander> the language is derived from C++
[16:36] <GW8RAK> I was thinking of the physical programming hardware needed.
[16:36] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[16:37] <fsphil> It needs TTL level serial signals
[16:37] <Lunar_Lander> I think older arduino boards had been available with a serial connector
[16:37] <fsphil> The USB->header adapters are the handiest, as they usually output TTL signals directly
[16:38] <fsphil> or you could use a MAX232 or similar IC to convert serial level to TTL
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[16:40] <GW8RAK> I'm happy with the Picaxe chips at present, but keep wondering about going over to the Dark Side.
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[16:50] <fsphil> C is a pretty good language
[16:50] <fsphil> my favourite so far
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[16:55] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[16:55] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/avasim.jpg
[16:55] <Upu> bad mock up :)
[16:56] <Lunar_Lander> Upu, could you please have a look at a link I found?
[16:56] <Lunar_Lander> lol
[16:56] <Upu> I'll have a look as soon as I'm home
[16:56] <Lunar_Lander> ah ok
[16:56] <Upu> just setting off be 30 misn
[16:56] <Upu> mins
[16:56] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[16:57] <fsphil> hehe
[16:57] <fsphil> they'll probably be able to spot this thing from the ISS
[16:58] <fsphil> If it's a good day, I'll be really tempted to take the telescope out and have a look for it myself
[16:59] <Lunar_Lander> cool
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[17:05] <GW8RAK> Nice light evening here. First ride home in the daylight. Spring is on it's way!
[17:05] <Lunar_Lander> yay
[17:05] <fsphil> sweet
[17:06] <Lunar_Lander> IIRC, servos turn quite slow, right?
[17:07] <eroomde> it depends a lot but something like 0.1-0.3s/60 degrees is typical
[17:07] <eroomde> GW8RAK: cloud and rian in cambridge
[17:07] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[17:08] Action: m1x10 is tired
[17:08] <GW8RAK> Been looking at the rainfall radar. Clear all the way from here to Chester
[17:08] <fsphil> we don't have windows in this office, no idea what it's doing outsite atm
[17:09] <GW8RAK> http://www.raintoday.co.uk/
[17:09] <eroomde> GW8RAK: i use that quite a lot for launches
[17:09] <eroomde> it's great isn't it
[17:09] <eroomde> especially useful for storm hab, methinks
[17:09] <m1x10> I want to put a capacitor to my mini servo. What capacity should it be?
[17:09] <GW8RAK> I use it to make sure I don't get wet!
[17:09] <GW8RAK> Much more important
[17:09] <Lunar_Lander> I once heard someone working in the electronics industry that Lead-Free Solder is one of the worst things ever invented
[17:09] <eroomde> m1x10: first ask yourself why you want to do this?
[17:09] <eroomde> Lunar_Lander: I love it
[17:09] <fsphil> mm... wet :)
[17:10] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[17:10] <m1x10> eroomde: the mini servo will be powered by solar panel
[17:10] <m1x10> eroomde: I believe the servo every first time it is going to move
[17:10] <m1x10> eroomde: it will try to draw a fast charge
[17:11] <Dan-K2VOL> Lunar_Lander I would tend to agree
[17:11] <m1x10> so I want this fast charging to be in the cap
[17:11] <Dan-K2VOL> do you guys at least get to use leaded solder for hobby projects?
[17:11] <eroomde> Lunar_Lander: the only time I don't like lead solder is when my happy and lovely friend fergus left a solder stensil covered in solder paste face down on my coffee mug, and i took a big swig and then felt burning on my lips and down my throat
[17:11] <eroomde> Lunar_Lander: oh i misread!
[17:12] <eroomde> i love *leaded* solder too
[17:12] <eroomde> infact it's still legal for use on space equipment
[17:12] <eroomde> just because the outgassing on lead free hasn't been tested properly yet
[17:12] <fsphil> can still be bought yep
[17:12] <Dan-K2VOL> nice
[17:12] <fsphil> I've never used the lead-free solder yet
[17:12] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[17:12] <eroomde> i have - it really sucks
[17:13] <fsphil> yea I get that impression
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[17:13] <eroomde> it's tolerable (but definitely worse mind) when soldering, but a total pain when you want to do rework
[17:13] <eroomde> it just will not reflow for love nor money
[17:13] <Lunar_Lander> sparkfun has something called "Special Blend"
[17:13] <Lunar_Lander> they write it contains Antimony
[17:13] <eroomde> annihiliates on contact with money
[17:14] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[17:15] <Lunar_Lander> "Soldering 101
[17:15] <Lunar_Lander> First hint: don't poke yourself in the eye!"
[17:16] <fsphil> yea, it's not good for the tip
[17:16] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[17:16] <Lunar_Lander> Sample Question:
[17:16] <Lunar_Lander> Why would you want to use a breadboard?
[17:16] <Lunar_Lander> a. To solder components on
[17:16] <Lunar_Lander> b. To test your circuit
[17:16] <Lunar_Lander> c. To insert under your skin
[17:16] <Lunar_Lander> d. To cut your bread and cheese on for lunch
[17:16] <Lunar_Lander> The official answer is 'b' although depending on the breadboard you have 'd' might be useful as well.
[17:18] <Lunar_Lander> someone comments on the Pb solder sold by sparkfun
[17:19] <Lunar_Lander> "Eutectic is recommended for beginners? This should be the primary solder used on every project you do for the rest of your life. 60/40 is sloppy and takes twice as long to heat, plus it has a temperature range where its soft and 'bendy' before it melts. Eutectic (63/37) has no soft point, it goes from solid to liquid instantly, which means you don't have to wait an extra 4 seconds for it to heat up and cool down.
[17:19] <Lunar_Lander> Now 4 seconds is nothing, but when you are soldering SMT with an exact iron temperature, it makes all the difference whether or not you've just destroyed a component. Don't think this is best for SMT only, using it with PTH will not only insure a quicker connection, but less time that the solder stays heated and moveable, so no more disturbed joints."
[17:19] <SpeedEvil> I have used actual breadboard to make circuits on.
[17:19] <SpeedEvil> Well - proto-breadboard - AKA wood.
[17:19] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[17:19] <SpeedEvil> I used part of the same bit of wood to make a food breadboard.
[17:20] <Lunar_Lander> cool :)
[17:20] <eroomde> I always wondered why standard solder wasn't a eutectic mixture. obviously it exists so I guess I will try some
[17:21] <eroomde> 'always' means 'up until my last ever materia science exam' at which point my brain's gargage collector went to work
[17:21] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[17:21] <Lunar_Lander> "Sample Question:
[17:21] <Lunar_Lander> What is the purpose of soldering?
[17:21] <Lunar_Lander> a. Playing with fire
[17:21] <Lunar_Lander> b. Connecting two pieces of metal both physically and electrically
[17:21] <Lunar_Lander> c. Wiping your soldering iron on a wet sponge
[17:21] <Lunar_Lander> d. Making your circuit heat proof
[17:21] <Lunar_Lander> Officially the answer is 'b' but for some people it is 'a' as well, although if you are getting flames you might be doing something wrong."
[17:22] <Dan-K2VOL> the wet sponge will reduce the life of your tip, I do wish they'd just start sending brass coils with soldering irons
[17:23] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[17:23] <Lunar_Lander> I just read that on the site
[17:23] <Lunar_Lander> and it saved me
[17:23] <eroomde> they're staggerinly effective too
[17:23] <Lunar_Lander> because I had thought it exactly the wrong way, that solder is applied with the iron
[17:24] <Lunar_Lander> someone writes that he coats the tip of his iron with solder when he is done to preserve it for storage
[17:28] <Lunar_Lander> and a cold joint is when you have solder on the PCB but actually it is only a "ring" around the connect
[17:28] <Lunar_Lander> so that it doesn't really connect the part to the PCB?
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[17:34] <Lunar_Lander> is that definition correct?
[17:36] <SpeedEvil> yes
[17:36] <SpeedEvil> It can also refer to an improperly wetted joint, that makes contact at the moment, but mostly through prayer.
[17:38] <Lunar_Lander> ah
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[17:48] <Lunar_Lander> lol
[17:48] <Lunar_Lander> "Oh hey - the satellites are in the sky, 12,552 miles above you, so be sure and point the ceramic towards the sky, ok? "
[17:50] <Lunar_Lander> for the lassen iq they write "Requires external antenna and expensive interface cables"
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[17:55] <Lunar_Lander> what does that mean exactly?
[17:56] <Lunar_Lander> why do the wires need to be expensive?
[17:57] <spacefelix> Spaceflight. :P
[17:57] <spacefelix> RF check.
[17:57] <spacefelix> Quality check.
[17:57] <spacefelix> Fire check.
[17:57] <spacefelix> Ect. :P
[17:58] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[17:59] <Lunar_Lander> xD "Here's a SparkFun analogy: You want to build a big/cool/fire project, but a small part of your project uses an accelerometer."
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[18:03] <Lunar_Lander> and another thing
[18:03] <Lunar_Lander> a physics book of mine had an idea which is quite useful I think for HABing
[18:03] Nick change: SAIDias -> W0OTM
[18:03] <Lunar_Lander> take a fretsaw, replace the sawblade with a wire
[18:03] <Lunar_Lander> hook the wire to a battery
[18:03] <Lunar_Lander> result: A styrofoam hot-wire cutter
[18:05] <Upu> back what was this link ?
[18:06] <Lunar_Lander> one moment
[18:07] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.scribd.com/doc/27219332/ATMega-PWM-Servo-Control
[18:09] <Lunar_Lander> can the arduino do that also as it has a ATM?
[18:13] <Upu> Arduino can control servos
[18:14] <Upu> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AF0v31HhpDw
[18:15] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[18:15] <Lunar_Lander> how comes the servo "oscillates" and does not stand still?
[18:16] <Upu> needs some smoothing code in it the accelerometer gave jitter
[18:17] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[18:22] <Lunar_Lander> OK, I am off a short time to go to ALDI to get my bottle of chocolate and orange juice
[18:23] <Lunar_Lander> closing remark: it is interesting that a normal night of sleep lets you awake relaxed even though you had been awake for 38 hours before
[18:26] <Lunar_Lander> so ttly
[18:26] <Lunar_Lander> ttyl
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[19:12] Nick change: laurence_ -> Laurenceb_
[19:12] <Laurenceb_> hi
[19:13] <NigeyS> hey Laurenceb_
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[19:35] Action: Elwell scrolls up -- brass coil for tip cleaning? what?
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[19:41] <Lunar_Lander> hello again
[19:41] <NigeyS> works a treat Elwell
[19:41] <NigeyS> hey Lunar
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[19:47] <Lunar_Lander> ok question time again
[19:47] <Lunar_Lander> the µC "communicates" over the TX and RX pins?
[19:47] <fsphil> do we get a prize?
[19:47] <Lunar_Lander> maybe you get a prize if I get my balloon in the air
[19:48] <m1x10> the mcu got a UART
[19:48] <Lunar_Lander> all of you who helped :)
[19:48] <m1x10> SPI and I2C
[19:48] <fsphil> A "oh what's that thing that just landed on my car" surprise?
[19:49] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[19:49] <Lunar_Lander> we'll sse :)
[19:50] <Lunar_Lander> *see
[19:50] <fsphil> lol
[19:50] <fsphil> Oh 50MHz is tonight
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[19:53] <Elwell> dammit. tesseract has converted '...' into 'm'
[19:55] <Lunar_Lander> does the Arduino come with power and programming wires?
[19:55] <Upu> yes
[19:55] <Upu> sorry
[19:55] <Upu> no
[19:56] <Upu> you can program and power from a standard A-B USB
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[19:59] <Lunar_Lander> that is good
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[20:08] <Lunar_Lander> if my balloon reaches 8000 m, I think I will jump
[20:08] <Lunar_Lander> say 20 cm
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[20:08] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[20:10] <Lunar_Lander> lol Upu
[20:10] <Lunar_Lander> I just read something
[20:10] <Lunar_Lander> I don't know if it is sad or hilarious
[20:12] <Lunar_Lander> "Hello, since yesterday I own a new Arduino Uno and now it does not work anymore. The power LED (green) is on, but the three orange LEDs don't work anymore. Currently, the board is connected to 12 V and via USB to my computer."
[20:14] <Dan-K2VOL> ah, lucky he has a working computer
[20:14] <Lunar_Lander> why?
[20:14] <Lunar_Lander> can you kill a PC if you plug in an externally powered USB device?
[20:16] <Dan-K2VOL> you can kill a PC if you plug 12v into the regulated 5v of a device that's also connected to the computer. Not sure if he's doing that, but hey, anything is possible
[20:17] <Lunar_Lander> when I got him correctly, the Uno is connected via USB and then he connected the 12 V to the Uno as well
[20:17] <Lunar_Lander> someone says that the voltage can reach the PC only when it is off
[20:18] <dehuman> if he has it plugged into the power jack then its getting regulated to 5v
[20:20] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[20:20] <Lunar_Lander> is it a good idea to get a few Atmega328 to spare?
[20:20] <NigeyS> dan is it me or has that pivotal task list got bigger since last night? :|
[20:20] <dehuman> lunar: yes
[20:20] <dehuman> get 1 get 5
[20:20] <Lunar_Lander> good
[20:20] <NigeyS> get at least 2 you WILL break 1 at some point :P
[20:21] <Lunar_Lander> and I don't need the bootloader ones because I still have my Uno, right?
[20:21] <Lunar_Lander> and the Uno can install the bootloader
[20:21] <NigeyS> yup
[20:24] <Lunar_Lander> lol "During each one of these experiments, do a quick temperature test of your voltage regulator. In general, the regulator should be cool enough to touch. If it's red hot (be careful!) you should turn off your breadboard and check for shorts."
[20:24] <dehuman> eh
[20:24] <dehuman> can it?
[20:24] <dehuman> the avrisp sketch doesn't work on the uno does it?
[20:24] <dehuman> sorry arduinoisp or whatever
[20:25] <m1x10> http://www.ladyada.net/images/solarlipo/charging.jpg
[20:25] <dehuman> NOTE: Currently, you cannot use an Arduino Uno as an ISP programmer because the optiboot bootloader does not support this sketch. A revision for this is in progress.
[20:25] <dehuman> fwiw
[20:25] <Lunar_Lander> "Place your Atmega chip into the Arduino board with the divot of the chip facing outward. Set the jumper to an external power supply and connect a 12V power brick (your board needs to be externally powered when using the AVR ISP mkII but is not needed with the AVRtinyISP) . Then, attach the 6-pin female plug of your AVR programmer to the 6 male header ICSP pins with the plastic nub of the ribbon cable head facing inward."
[20:26] <Lunar_Lander> on the photo the board is connected to the 12V
[20:26] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[20:26] <dehuman> if you have an isp programmer it doesn't matter
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[20:26] <Laurenceb_> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Deutsch
[20:27] <Laurenceb_> "was a founder, along with Sarah Fitz-Claridge of the Taking Children Seriously movement"
[20:27] <Laurenceb_> i fear he has gone slightly nuts
[20:27] <dehuman> photo?
[20:28] <dehuman> thats for an older revision arduino with a power jumper or something
[20:28] <Lunar_Lander> http://arduino.cc/en/Main/Standalone
[20:28] <Lunar_Lander> you need to scroll down
[20:29] <Lunar_Lander> http://arduino.cc/en/uploads/Main/arduinobb_bootload1.jpg
[20:29] <Lunar_Lander> or rather look at that
[20:30] <dehuman> what do you need bootloader for anyway?
[20:30] <dehuman> i can see it being useful to keep an extra one handy in case you fry one but otherwise if you've got 'finished' code no need for a bootloader yah? just use isp
[20:31] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[20:31] <dehuman> prototype using avr with bootloader, once prototype is done, burn your finished .hex using isp
[20:31] <Lunar_Lander> and when it malfunctions without the code being ready?
[20:31] <dehuman> just reprogram it?
[20:32] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[20:33] <Lunar_Lander> so what is the bootloader doing in the first place?
[20:33] <dehuman> bootloader just lets you do self programming. so for example the type of bootloader arduino uses allows for self reprogramming over uart
[20:33] <dehuman> or you could have a bootloader that lets you do programming over spi or whatever i suppose
[20:34] <NigeyS> lunar
[20:34] <NigeyS> if you want some "free" parts ..
[20:35] <NigeyS> http://www.ladyada.net/resources/procure/samples.html
[20:35] <NigeyS> :)
[20:35] <dehuman> i mean i suppose a bootloader could do all kinds of stuff but generally it sits there and waits for you to power on, then if you arent in programming mode it boot loads your program
[20:36] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[20:36] <dehuman> if you've done something to trigger programming mode, like pull some pin low or hit a switch or something instead of exeucting your code it will execute code that might fake an avrisp programmer (ala arduino) allowing you to upload new code the bootloader cna self program on its flash
[20:37] <dehuman> but for practical purposes its useful to you in that you dont need an isp programmer handy (rs232, usb<->rs232 or something)
[20:37] <dehuman> does the atmega328 on an uno even have a bootloader?
[20:37] <dehuman> it shouldn't need one
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[20:38] <dehuman> the firmware on the usb avr on it should handle that i would think
[20:38] <dehuman> who knows, its an arduino
[20:39] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[20:39] <Lunar_Lander> thanks NigeyS
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[20:49] <Lunar_Lander> yay freescale has pressure sensors
[20:49] <Lunar_Lander> shit netsplit
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[20:50] <Laurenceb_> SpeedEvil1: were you looking at mouse sensors a while back?
[20:51] <Laurenceb_> you can only read off one pixel per frame on all of them?
[20:51] <Laurenceb_> or are there any better sensors?
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[20:59] Nick change: SpeedEvil1 -> SpeedEvil
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[21:00] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: There are lots better sensors, but you can't buy them.
[21:00] Action: SpeedEvil is annoyed at the whole 'shiny stuff you can't have theme.
[21:01] <Laurenceb_> plenty on digikey and RS
[21:01] <Laurenceb_> im looking for something for laser speckle imaging
[21:01] <SpeedEvil> I've not seen actual available high framerate sensors in stock.
[21:02] <Laurenceb_> i think i can use the SQAL for interesting stuff
[21:02] <Laurenceb_> http://uk.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=searchProducts&searchTerm=mouse+sensor
[21:03] <SpeedEvil> Ah
[21:03] <SpeedEvil> All the mouse sensors I've looked at can't read out the frame rapidly
[21:04] <SpeedEvil> however I've only looked at ~4
[21:04] <SpeedEvil> -10
[21:04] <SpeedEvil> www.framos.eu
[21:04] <Laurenceb_> i see
[21:05] <Laurenceb_> im not sure i have to dump a frame - its particularly cool if the job is handled for me by SQAL
[21:05] <SpeedEvil> I assume linear ccds are no use?
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[21:05] <Laurenceb_> no - i need 2D
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[21:07] <Laurenceb_> if i can treat SQAL as an analogue of speckle modulation depth thatd be good
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[21:30] <Lunar_Lander> NigeyS ?
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[21:40] <Lunar_Lander> NigeyS ?
[21:40] <NigeyS> yo
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> the pressure sensors are all labled "max. 10 kPa"
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> and I don't get why
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> the pressure here is, after all, 100 Kpa
[21:41] <SpeedEvil> differential pressure sensors?
[21:42] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[21:42] <Lunar_Lander> yeah I think they are differential
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[21:50] Nick change: laurence_ -> Laurenceb_
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&name=ADNS-9500-ND
[21:50] Action: Laurenceb_ drools
[21:50] <natrium42> moin Lunar_Lander
[21:50] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> >11kfps
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> mental
[21:51] <Laurenceb_> and full frame capture
[21:51] <natrium42> any upcoming launches?
[21:52] <NigeyS> by the sounds of it, 3 or 4 in march
[21:54] <Dan-K2VOL> oh, one little one from the midwest here in the next week or so
[21:55] <NigeyS> just a iccle balloon hey dan ? :P
[21:56] <natrium42> Dan-K2VOL: \o/
[21:56] <Dan-K2VOL> :-D
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[22:36] <mattltm> Hi all :)
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[22:38] <Lunar_Lander> hi mattltm
[22:38] <mattltm> Hey Lunar
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[22:51] <fsphil> hullo
[22:51] <mattltm> hi :)
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[22:53] <Lunar_Lander> whoa
[22:53] <Lunar_Lander> check this: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/47/Breadboard_complex.jpg
[22:53] <mattltm> Nice!
[22:54] <fsphil> oooh I wonder what it does
[22:55] <SpeedEvil> Incite swearing.
[22:55] <SpeedEvil> Don't see any real busses
[22:55] <Lunar_Lander> the description says
[22:55] <SpeedEvil> Oh
[22:55] <SpeedEvil> I see an 8088
[22:55] <Lunar_Lander> "An example of a complex circuit built on a breadboard. The circuit is an Intel 8088 single board computer."
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[22:56] <SpeedEvil> No it's not.
[22:56] <SpeedEvil> It's a 5 board computer.
[22:56] <mattltm> Why is it such a nightmate to find a Ublox or Lassen IQ suplier in the UK?
[22:56] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[22:57] <NigeyS> mattltm, lassens you can get from diamond point
[22:57] <mattltm> You have a link?
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[22:58] <NigeyS> http://www.dpieshop.com/trimble-lassen-iq-12-channel-gps-module-p-237.html
[22:59] <mattltm> Ta :)
[22:59] <NigeyS> np :)
[23:00] <Hibby> anyone got much experience with the FS03 and arduino kicking about?
[23:00] <Hibby> **FSA03, even.
[23:00] <Lunar_Lander> what is a good antenna for the Lassen?
[23:01] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.dpieshop.com/trimble-miniature-30v-unpackaged-gps-antenna-hfl-connector-5785900-replacement-p-234.html this?
[23:01] <NigeyS> thats the 1 i've got .. its crap tbh
[23:01] <fsphil> FSA03 is good but has a very fragile antenna
[23:02] <NigeyS> theyre also super teeny tiny
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> do you think that if I write a very kind e-mail to sparkfun that they give me a discount or so?
[23:05] <Hibby> Currently playing with one, but can't get a fix... Any suggestions? Playing with the code that's up on the UKHAS site along side the UBLOX-5 documentation
[23:05] <Hibby> What I do have, though, is UTC time...
[23:05] <Randomskk> give it a little longer or more view of the sky?
[23:06] <NigeyS> yeah take it outside for a few minutes that'll soon get it locked
[23:06] <Hibby> 45 minutes // view of the sky it has has been sufficient for two other non agps devices.
[23:06] <fsphil> yep, it gets the time even with a weak signal
[23:06] <Hibby> admittedly, there is a window in the way
[23:06] Action: Hibby checks weather
[23:07] <Hibby> it's also pissing down
[23:07] <NigeyS> umbrella?
[23:07] <NigeyS> :P
[23:07] <mattltm> On the subject of GPS, does anyone know what this is? - http://www.mattltm.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/IMAG0102.jpg
[23:08] <Lunar_Lander> maybe you can hook your GPS to the satellite dish and hope that the satellites pass by just right
[23:08] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[23:08] <fsphil> helical antenna
[23:08] <SpeedEvil> matt: It's a helical antenna
[23:08] <SpeedEvil> ceramic one
[23:08] <SpeedEvil> you also get wire ones
[23:08] <Hibby> Lol. Will leave it to the morning. Was hoping to get some reasonable work done on decoding pubx strings, but not to stress
[23:08] <SpeedEvil> which are bigger
[23:09] <Lunar_Lander> yeah the GPS antennas must be omni right?
[23:09] <Lunar_Lander> as directional would be quite unuseful
[23:09] <mattltm> The antenna is a Quadrifilar Helix Antenna :)
[23:09] <mattltm> Im trying to work out what the gps chip is.
[23:10] <rjharrison_> ping Upu
[23:10] GroupO (5adbe4ca@gateway/web/freenode/ip.90.219.228.202) joined #highaltitude.
[23:11] <Upu> pong
[23:11] <rjharrison_> all on for tomorrow
[23:11] <rjharrison_> do you need directions?
[23:11] <Upu> yup I'll be there
[23:11] <Upu> nah leeds uni
[23:11] <NigeyS> ahh rjharrison_ just the man, i couldnt find a way to pull from your svn ... :|
[23:11] <rjharrison_> Yep
[23:11] <Upu> I'm in Leeds all day for training
[23:11] <rjharrison_> hehe
[23:11] <Upu> so I'll grab a bite to eat and head up that way
[23:11] <rjharrison_> I'll give you a bell when I head over
[23:12] <Upu> sure I won't be too early , in park square
[23:12] <rjharrison_> np
[23:12] <Upu> training finishes @ 5.30
[23:12] <rjharrison_> cool coffe at 6:30
[23:12] <Upu> Just been speaking to Andrew Walker ?
[23:12] <rjharrison_> NigeyS cant you just right click
[23:12] <rjharrison_> Upu cool
[23:12] <Upu> North Wakefield Radio Amateurs
[23:12] <Upu> going to his on Sat for some training :)
[23:12] <NigeyS> nope, it tries saving the php file, id have to manually copy paste the files into notepad..lol
[23:13] <rjharrison_> hehe I gave them a talk a while back
[23:13] <Upu> yeah he mentioned you when I said what I was doing
[23:13] <rjharrison_> NigeyS give me a himt which file
[23:13] <rjharrison_> hint
[23:14] <NigeyS> the eagle dir of icarus II .. GTP, GTs files etc
[23:14] <rjharrison_> you only need the brd and the sch files
[23:14] <rjharrison_> just right click those
[23:15] <rjharrison_> should take about 4 seconds
[23:15] <NigeyS> oh.. lol .. *stupid*
[23:16] <Upu> anyway I'm off to bed, see you tommorrow Rob looking forward to it
[23:16] <rjharrison_> sur see yo
[23:16] <Upu> I'll bring you a new keyboard ;)
[23:20] <rjharrison_> heh
[23:20] <rjharrison_> nights
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[23:20] <eroomde> rjharrison_: I have a missed call from you (badminton match, sorry). Just got home and going to bed as am shagged but drop an email?
[23:20] <Hibby> GroupO: ping
[23:20] <eroomde> ah tits
[23:20] <GroupO> pong
[23:20] <GroupO> hows it going?
[23:20] <Hibby> will be in tomorrow
[23:20] <Hibby> not bad, playing with gps currently
[23:21] <GroupO> good stuff - sorry for the emails... getting a bit stressed :S
[23:21] <Hibby> noticed. Don't worry, ground comms are secondary for you, and it's not a big stress, according to Mal, if the code comes from "elsewhere"
[23:21] <GroupO> lol
[23:21] <GroupO> thats encouraging!
[23:22] <Lunar_Lander> will Robert launch tomorrow?
[23:23] <GroupO> Hibby: word of warning - never take any classes involving climate control
[23:23] <Hibby> I'm an electrical engineer, it's not really my style
[23:24] <SpeedEvil> GroupO: That sounds like a sensible plan.
[23:24] <GroupO> haha, yeh, well im a mechanical engineer and I don't care much about it, but got me extra credits
[23:24] Action: SpeedEvil is currently sort-of-trying to design a ghetto AC.
[23:25] <Randomskk> climate control gets boring fast
[23:25] <GroupO> anyway, point being you have to deal with pretensious people
[23:25] <GroupO> yeh
[23:25] <Hibby> My primary involvement with the Mech eng department is that they give me awesome toys to play with (see office)
[23:25] <Randomskk> you have to deal with rubbish maths more to the point
[23:25] <GroupO> it does - especially when they dont know why global warming happens, but are more than happy to make comments about what engineers should do to stop it
[23:26] <SpeedEvil> Oh - that sort of climate control.
[23:26] <SpeedEvil> I have the perfect way to fix that.
[23:26] <GroupO> do tell
[23:26] <Hibby> assume ($climate_change = true)
[23:26] <Randomskk> I bet it's not as good as the current plan here
[23:26] <SpeedEvil> It involves three large lenses, and a matrix of shutters.
[23:26] <Randomskk> the current plan here involves a very, very, very long tube
[23:26] <Randomskk> a massive pump
[23:26] <Randomskk> and some gigantic balloons to hold it up
[23:26] <Randomskk> then you pump up reflectants into the atmosphere
[23:26] <SpeedEvil> The lenses are placed near a lagrange point, and project an image of the sun onto the shutters, and then relay that image onto the earth.
[23:27] <eroomde> and a big boat
[23:27] <SpeedEvil> The bonus point is that you can selladvertising space on the sun.
[23:27] <Lunar_Lander> lol
[23:27] <NigeyS> hey eroomde
[23:27] <eroomde> hi
[23:27] <Randomskk> yo ed
[23:27] <GroupO> lol
[23:27] <Randomskk> IDP is almost over! just have to finish this report tonight and I'm suddenly free again
[23:27] <SpeedEvil> More seriously - the CO2 absorbtion plants from air seem to be not implausible.
[23:27] <GroupO> excessive i feel
[23:28] <GroupO> the best i have heard of so far is to induce volcanic eruptions...
[23:28] <GroupO> that was a serious suggestion
[23:28] <GroupO> I was not impressed
[23:28] <GroupO> :)
[23:29] <SpeedEvil> http://people.ucalgary.ca/~keith/papers/84.Stolaroff.AirCaptureGHGT-8.p.pdf
[23:29] <eroomde> the idea above is indeed artificial volcanic eruptions
[23:30] <SpeedEvil> I think is the one I was thinking of - massive CO2 collector - ernergetically quite cheap
[23:31] <GroupO> I dont think it is necessarily a bad idea to pump the atmosphere full of artificial particles - it was someone actally considering some way to excite volcanic eruptions
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[23:33] <eroomde> go mad,why not
[23:33] <eroomde> right, time to be off
[23:34] <eroomde> night all
[23:34] <NigeyS> nn Ed :)
[23:34] <SpeedEvil> Night!
[23:37] <GroupO> nite
[23:48] <mattltm> Right. See you all later :)
[23:48] <Lunar_Lander> cu mattltm
[23:50] mattltm (~mattltm@92.24.138.144) left irc:
[23:57] <Lunar_Lander> does anyone know if the people in the sparkfun chat are able to read what someone writes?
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[00:00] --- Wed Feb 23 2011