highaltitude.log.20110120

[00:02] <Dan-K2VOL> All quiet in here?
[00:02] <fsphil> yar
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[00:24] <stilldavid> so aprs
[00:24] <stilldavid> is hard. for how prevalent it is, there doesn't seem to be much real-world documentation on how to build a transmitter
[00:25] <Dan-K2VOL> stilldavid
[00:25] <Dan-K2VOL> yeah, it is
[00:25] <stilldavid> yo Dan-K2VOL
[00:25] <stilldavid> I'm building a: http://trackuino.blogspot.com/
[00:25] <stilldavid> it's hard to debug, too.
[00:26] <stilldavid> mostly because I'm scared of spamming 144.39 with too much info
[00:26] <stilldavid> people don't like transmissions spaced closer than 10mins apart even :/ and the HX1 isn't tuneable :)
[00:26] <Dan-K2VOL> well, just put a dummy load using a couple 50-ohm resistors on it, and set up your own I-Gate
[00:27] <Dan-K2VOL> or just use a normal audio decoder from a 2m radio
[00:27] <nevyn> hrm
[00:27] <stilldavid> I'm trying to use fl-digi
[00:27] <Dan-K2VOL> Carl Lyster, WA4ADG is a whiz at balloon transmitter building
[00:27] <Dan-K2VOL> oh that'll work fine, if it does packet
[00:27] <nevyn> stilldavid: /me has a plan to put the trackduiono firmware on a modsendat.
[00:28] <stilldavid> I'm just getting at it, so no questions yet, but it's not working now :P
[00:28] <Dan-K2VOL> what is that modsendat
[00:28] <Dan-K2VOL> I like to use APRS as a tool, buy a ready-made module and slap it in the balloon
[00:28] <stilldavid> I thought it'd be fun to build a tinytrak of my own essentially
[00:29] <Dan-K2VOL> cool
[00:29] <stilldavid> also helps to have bare access to the gps data and such
[00:29] <stilldavid> tinytrak is basically an arduino on an HX1
[00:29] <Dan-K2VOL> oh yeah, I like the TinyPack
[00:29] <Dan-K2VOL> but I think it's long gone
[00:29] <nevyn> http://www.freetronics.com/products/mobsendat
[00:30] <Dan-K2VOL> lol thx, the misspell had my googling coming up with nothin
[00:30] <nevyn> the b/d inversion is really common
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[00:38] <Dan-K2VOL> stilldavid
[00:40] <nevyn> so the mobsendat is already all 3.3v
[00:40] <Dan-K2VOL> stilldavid there's several of these that are summaries of specific flight series, we don't really care about the science payload results, (X-ray telescopes, ozone observations, etc)
[00:53] <stilldavid> Dan-K2VOL, okay...
[00:54] <Elwell> re APRS, for those of you on fedora ... https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=669010
[00:59] <nevyn> so is xastir still the bomb..?
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[01:45] <Dan-K2VOL> The seeking of publicity is such a double-edged sword. this latest article about our hackerspace and White Star balloon program is about the worst for accuracy yet: http://leoweekly.com/news/hacktory
[01:46] <Dan-K2VOL> like "NASA papers are clear that the temperature of the helium is important, but they dont say why" which is utter baloney
[01:47] <Darkside> also publicity can incite other people to try doing ballooning themselves
[01:47] <Darkside> and they might do it badly, fucking it up for the rest of us
[01:53] <Dan-K2VOL> what's really funny is that I've been the one who warned LVL1 quite severely in the beginning that a trans-atlantic balloon attempt would suck their lives away for nearly a year, and they wouldn't see their families
[01:53] <Dan-K2VOL> yet after filtering through the reporter, it translated to "Bowen & has been continually surprised at the daunting intricacy of the project"
[01:55] <Dan-K2VOL> darkside the nice thing about this scale of project is that no one is likely to be able to succeed in doing it in a controlled fashion. Until we sell the kit version anyway
[01:55] <Dan-K2VOL> :-P
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[02:20] <Darkside> haha
[02:20] <Darkside> i wouldn't recommend that..
[02:24] Action: SpeedEvil imagines a horde of balloons setting off from Columbia every time the wind is favourable to the USA.
[02:25] <Darkside> hahaha
[02:28] <SpeedEvil> Filtering through reporters is like filtering through used underwear.
[02:28] <Darkside> lots of holes?
[02:29] <SpeedEvil> and you get shit falling off into the product.
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[02:34] <Dan-K2VOL> ah yeah
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[02:58] <stilldavid> Dan-K2VOL, thanks for the 'photographed' column :)
[02:58] <stilldavid> printing now, unless you say anything...
[02:58] <Dan-K2VOL> :-) stilldavid yw
[02:59] <Dan-K2VOL> just a few more min if you could
[02:59] <stilldavid> oh, yeah, that's why I ask :)
[02:59] <Dan-K2VOL> gracias
[02:59] <stilldavid> it's 17 out and I'm not too keen on leaving just yet
[02:59] <Dan-K2VOL> you usually stay this late?
[02:59] <stilldavid> eh, no.
[02:59] <stilldavid> but I was debugging some stuff with a co-worker
[03:00] <stilldavid> plus the roads are nasty right now (or were at rush hour...) and I'm in no rush
[03:00] <Dan-K2VOL> ahh gotcha
[03:01] <Dan-K2VOL> Here's a curious one: Correspondence relating to a request by an official of the U.S.S.R. for NCAR to provide four balloons and electronics packages for safety testing. The balloons and electronics were made available but the tests were never conducted.
[03:01] <stilldavid> company email: Yep took me hour and half to get home normally takes me 25minutes.
[03:01] <Dan-K2VOL> yipes
[03:01] <stilldavid> huh.
[03:01] <Dan-K2VOL> don't need that one photographed, but its interesting to think about
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[03:38] <Dan-K2VOL> stilldavid, have at it, reformat arrange as you see fit
[03:38] <stilldavid> I'll probably just sort by priority and take it from there
[03:38] <Dan-K2VOL> sounds good
[03:38] <stilldavid> which is already done :)
[03:39] <griffonbot> @nearsys: Received ten transmitters for my flight computer kits. Will have the first available with GPS and antenna shortly. #ARHAB [http://twitter.com/nearsys/status/27933300676894720]
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[04:01] <stilldavid> alright, I'm off, list in hand
[04:01] <stilldavid> will keep you posted upon my return tomorrow
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[06:36] <earthshine> morning
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[06:38] <Elwell> https://www.faasafety.gov/files/notices/2011/Jan/GPS_Flight_Advisory_CSFTL11-01_Rel.pdf <-- gps degredation, usa se coast
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[07:44] <eroomde> morning all
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[08:05] <juxta> morning eroomde
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[08:22] <SpeedEvil> Elwell: ... hmm. Broadcast from a UAV?
[08:23] <SpeedEvil> Or is that a spot beam actually.
[08:23] <SpeedEvil> I vaguel recall the spot-beams were about that radius.
[08:24] <SpeedEvil> And a spot beam with a meacon code pointed at a constant point - or several of them - would sorta fit the pattern
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[08:39] Action: griffonbot is GriffonBot [http://github.com/ssb/griffonbot]
[08:39] Action: griffonbot is following: #arhab #ukhas #cusf #atlasballoon
[08:39] Action: griffonbot is tracking emails sent to ukhas@googlegroups.com
[08:44] <eroomde> juxta: morning
[08:44] <juxta> (evening)
[08:44] <juxta> :)
[08:46] <eroomde> sorry yes
[08:46] <eroomde> so, did you see the articles a few days ago about how storms squirt antimatter into space?
[08:46] <SpeedEvil> Neat.
[08:46] <SpeedEvil> There was one ages back from that about high energy jets into space
[08:46] <juxta> yes! I saw that, seemed pretty intertesting
[08:47] <eroomde> it got me excited - antimatter annihilates with matter and produces gamma rays in the process
[08:47] <juxta> were you there for the picoatlas recovery eroomde?
[08:47] <eroomde> and we can detect gamma rays with a geiger counter
[08:47] <eroomde> and I've always wanted to launch a balloon into the belly of a storm
[08:47] <juxta> hey wow, that's a really neat idea
[08:47] <eroomde> a proper hairs-on-your-chest balloon launch
[08:48] <eroomde> if we built an armoured payload with some useful instrumentation, i think it'd make a pretty cool mission
[08:48] <juxta> yeah
[08:48] <eroomde> and the photos of cumulo-nimbus from above could be really something
[08:48] <eroomde> I wasn't at recovery nope, sorry, just launch
[08:49] <juxta> we've flown in some pretty high winds, but never a proper storm
[08:49] <eroomde> it would be an interesting launch for sure
[08:49] <eroomde> Might be easier to fill in a hangar
[08:49] <juxta> getting off the ground would be the tricky bit
[08:49] <juxta> agreed, a hnagar would be awesome
[08:51] <eroomde> We have marshall aerospace nearby where they can fir several hercules in their big hangars. I migh send them a polite email. It's not like the airport intself will be busy during a big storm
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[08:56] <eroomde> test
[08:57] <Colin_> pong
[08:58] <eroomde> ta
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[10:05] <fsphil> re: storm launch -- getting the storm would be the tricky bit
[10:05] <fsphil> they're not that predictable, or frequent
[10:05] <fsphil> in the UK at least
[10:06] <SpikeUK> fsphil Just look for Bank Holidays ;-)
[10:15] <Colin_> When is the next scheduled launch in the UK? is there a list somewhere?
[10:17] <fsphil> http://ukhas.org.uk/general:upcoming_launches
[10:17] <fsphil> I'd love a thunderstorm on a bank holiday, at least I'd get to watch it ;-)
[10:18] <fsphil> normally it's just cloudy -- that awful dull grey dullness. blah
[10:20] <fsphil> if you do launch a storm mission, pls pls put a video camera on there :D
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[10:22] <Colin_> fsphil: Hmm... the Apex II launch dates have come and gone - is it delayed I wonder?
[10:22] <fsphil> and call it "Thor"
[10:22] <fsphil> I think so Colin_, not sure why
[10:23] Action: Colin_ nods
[10:28] <fsphil> it'll probably be soon .. jonsowman will know :)
[10:36] <eroomde> fsphil: back
[10:36] <eroomde> sorry, virgin came to give me internet
[10:36] <eroomde> finally no more silly dongle
[10:36] <eroomde> 50Mb of woooosh
[10:36] <eroomde> fsphil: a storm hab would definitely have video and pics!
[10:36] <eroomde> i think it'd be spectacular
[10:37] <eroomde> and accelerometers to measure all the buffeting, ice ball impacts or whatever
[10:37] <eroomde> Colin_: The Apex guys (jonsowman) are busy with their start of term work :)
[10:38] <eroomde> today is the first day of lectures, and jon (who did apex and is now CU) is a 2nd year, which is by far the toughest and busiest year. I don't envy him
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[10:43] <Colin_> Ah, okay - I knew things had started because I was talking to Tim on PI while driving to work this morning
[10:44] <eroomde> PI will be a super resource for co-ordinating chases for balloon heading dough-east out of cambridge
[10:44] <Colin_> actually I was on PY rather than PI but you are correct
[10:45] <Colin_> Actually the 6m repeater might be even better
[10:45] <eroomde> yeah
[10:45] <eroomde> more range and less intermod with the balloon receivers
[10:46] <eroomde> although I think fewer of us are likely to have 6m kit
[10:46] <Colin_> and not as busy either and with several 817's around easy to use
[10:46] <eroomde> we're quite keen to have a mission control and a couple of chase cars and good comms between all of them
[10:47] <Colin_> yes, well Flossie as mission control, possibly based at the school rather than the launch site
[10:47] <eroomde> we're encouraging all the new CUSF members o get their licenses to that end.
[10:47] <eroomde> yes, school would make an ideal mission control
[10:47] <eroomde> and we can comm with it from the launch site
[10:48] <Colin_> maybe do ATV from launch site to mission control too
[10:48] <eroomde> oh wow
[10:49] <eroomde> that'd be awesome
[10:49] <Colin_> via PX the 23cms ATV repeater
[10:49] <Colin_> I'm sure we could find pupils to operate cameras
[10:50] <Colin_> btw - I might end up at the Maypole tonight rather than the beer festival
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[10:51] <eroomde> OK. As I said, I'm sworn to go to the gym! A shame as I want to ctach up with the guys
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[11:00] <eroomde> Colin_: just checked to see that my vx-74 handie will do 6m, which I didn't realise. Perfect!
[11:00] <eroomde> vx-7r*
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[11:01] <Colin_> I have a tri-band on my car, although the usual rig in the car is the 7800 which only does 2m and 70cms
[11:01] <Colin_> the 817 usually lives at home or in my rucksack for SOTA
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[11:02] <eroomde> the 817 seems to be the radio of choice for habbing around here
[11:03] <eroomde> between CUSF and its members we have quite a good collection now - 3 ic-7000s, an 817, a 790R, and some handies
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[11:04] <eroomde> right, now the broadbeans have been fitted I have no excuse not to be at work
[11:04] <eroomde> ttyl
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[11:10] <NigeyS> mooooooooooorning
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[11:15] <juxta> hrm, google maps has removed a bunch of streets I use
[11:16] <NigeyS> :o they stole your streets?!
[11:17] <juxta> seems that way
[11:18] <Elwell> openstreetmap time
[11:18] <NigeyS> yush!
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[11:18] <NigeyS> how did the launch go juxta ?
[11:18] <juxta> good thanks NigeyS
[11:19] <NigeyS> all recovered intact ?
[11:19] <juxta> yup
[11:19] <juxta> no damage :)
[11:19] <NigeyS> excellent, congrats again :)
[11:20] <fsphil> you're getting too good at this juxta, will have to do something more daring :)
[11:21] <juxta> haha
[11:21] <NigeyS> hmm im wondering if what im doing with this arduino mega is actually possible phil..lol
[11:21] <juxta> we'll drink heavily before we launch next time
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[11:23] <eroomde> juxta: do you have a longer term plan for more ambitious launches?
[11:24] <fsphil> not sure how you can even begin testing it NigeyS, I'd normally program directly instead of using the bootloader
[11:24] <juxta> there are a few ideas in the pipeline, yeah
[11:24] <juxta> still haven't come up with anything revolutionary though I dont think :)
[11:24] <eroomde> allowed to leak?
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[11:24] <fsphil> onboard compressor for altitude control
[11:25] <NigeyS> well, ive done all ii can, even physically cut the trace to the mega's auto reset, and confirmed power to the 328 .. must be something on the mega blocking the tx/rxlines
[11:26] <fsphil> short the tx + rx lines, fire up a serial terminal app on the PC and see if the data is being looped back
[11:26] <juxta> eroomde, oh, a few of us want to get live video TX going from the balloon
[11:27] <NigeyS> tried that, nothing, it seems to be cause the mega doesnt use an ftdi chip anymore, it uses something new :/
[11:27] <fsphil> ooh
[11:27] <fsphil> you'll need to get some sort of serial to ttl adaptor I thinks
[11:27] <eroomde> juxta: that'd be awesome
[11:27] <eroomde> fsphil: a compressor would be cool
[11:27] <NigeyS> The Mega2560 differs from all preceding boards in that it does not use the FTDI USB-to-serial driver chip. Instead, it features the Atmega8U2 programmed as a USB-to-serial converter.
[11:28] <eroomde> I was wondering about using a ballonet - we use them in the air ship and they do a good job of trimming
[11:28] <NigeyS> and the 8u2 is less hackable apparently .. so ill get the adapter, save all this malarky lol
[11:28] <NigeyS> hi eroomde
[11:28] <eroomde> NigeyS: AVR Dragon is good
[11:29] <eroomde> at least, I like it
[11:29] <eroomde> and yo!
[11:29] <NigeyS> how's tricks ?
[11:31] <eroomde> good. just moved back to cambridge, litterally just got an internet connection to the house
[11:31] <eroomde> work is fun as ever
[11:31] <NigeyS> you lovr work really :p .. what do you do btw ?
[11:32] <eroomde> right now I'm working on robotic blimps
[11:32] <NigeyS> :o
[11:32] <eroomde> that will study hydrology in the alps
[11:32] <NigeyS> thats no small job.. crikey
[11:32] <eroomde> it's 3d reconstruction from oboard video cameras, and overlaying thermal data onto those models
[11:32] <Elwell> sounds fun
[11:32] <NigeyS> wow
[11:33] <Elwell> which part of the alps?
[11:33] <eroomde> I think the overal science purpose is to build thermal models of glaciers throughout their day/night cycle
[11:33] <eroomde> Elwell: testing in Davos in march
[11:33] <Elwell> nice
[11:33] <eroomde> previously we were in Val ferret
[11:34] <NigeyS> ah keeping an eye on the glaciers, climate change related research ?
[11:34] <eroomde> well, weather and hydrology models in general
[11:34] <eroomde> I guess all data helps improve climate models, but we're just really concentrating on the blimp and computer vision bit
[11:35] <eroomde> the partners in the project (EPFL) are the hydrologists
[11:35] <NigeyS> ah i see, sounds exciting stuff mind, you have a great job :D
[11:36] <eroomde> it's good fun, modulo all the usual problems with large european projects
[11:36] <Elwell> reminds me -- somewhat lower altitude balooning is on next week - http://www.chateau-doex.ch/en/Manifestations/topevent/festivalinternationaldeballon
[11:36] <eroomde> like the metric for project progress seems to be determined by the page count of microsoft word documents
[11:37] <NigeyS> lol eroomde thats bad !
[11:37] <Elwell> eroomde: +1 on EU project pain
[11:37] <NigeyS> Elwell, is that a big cock in the sky? .. lol
[11:37] <eroomde> nothing we haven't come across before with EU projects. Most research institutions try and avoid them for exactly that reason
[11:38] <NigeyS> i imagine every minute detail is documented to
[11:38] <eroomde> it has to be really worth doing to make the project 'management' pain and suffering worth bearing
[11:39] <eroomde> you can always tell, walking around the department, which researchers have worked on EU projects, from the depth of the furrow in their brow
[11:39] <NigeyS> lol, and the grey hair and bags under the eyes ?
[11:40] <eroomde> that too. ho hum. For once I'm sheilded from it quite nicely
[11:41] <eroomde> In previous projects I've had to be a lot nearer the interface
[11:41] <NigeyS> my fiance keeps teasing me with a box of just for men :/
[11:41] <NigeyS> 31 and going grey, somethings not right
[11:43] <eroomde> pavlovian response to knowing you're about to have a wife
[11:43] <NigeyS> haha i reckon so
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[12:45] <griffonbot> @LVL1WhiteStar: Vid tutorial on simple polyethylene bag sealing, for 4 mil thick - http://bit.ly/fclos2 #arhab [http://twitter.com/LVL1WhiteStar/status/28070546042257408]
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[14:10] <NigeyS> hi dan
[14:11] <Dan-K2VOL> Hi NigeyS
[14:15] <Dan-K2VOL> How's your day
[14:16] <NigeyS> not to bad, and you ?
[14:17] <Dan-K2VOL> Pretty good, just got to work
[14:17] <NigeyS> you must enjoy your job :p
[14:21] <SpikeUK> From twitter "NanoSail-D solar sail is alive, http://is.gd/2M6AmA. Ham operators needed to listen for beacon signal at 437.370MHz."
[14:21] <SpeedEvil> Wii!
[14:21] <NigeyS> oo
[14:21] <SpeedEvil> s/i/o/g
[14:22] <SpikeUK> More information about NanoSail-D at http://bit.ly/faNiVi. Ham operators can submit NanoSail-D beacon packets at http://bit.ly/h9LseF.
[14:22] <NigeyS> iccle bit out of range atm..
[14:26] <SpeedEvil> Some quite good passes here.
[14:26] <SpeedEvil> 6PM it's damn near overhead
[14:26] <SpeedEvil> (I have no radio)
[14:28] <NigeyS> oo
[14:30] <SpeedEvil> Well - I have dozens - no appropriate though.
[14:31] <NigeyS> eek, so 6pm, outside with my yagi ?
[14:32] <SpeedEvil> Something like that.
[14:32] <SpeedEvil> Where are you?
[14:32] <SpeedEvil> Oh - Wales.
[14:32] <Dan-K2VOL> Do the standard sat pass sites have it for predictions?
[14:32] <NigeyS> gonna check now, id like to try it from here if its overhead ish
[14:33] <SpeedEvil> yes
[14:34] <SpeedEvil> Go to www.heavens-above.com - Enter your location - under 'configuration' - then select 'select a sat from the database' - enter 37225 in the top box
[14:35] <NigeyS> http://www.heavens-above.com/PassSummary.aspx?satid=90027&lat=51.4865&lng=-3.14711&loc=Unspecified&alt=0&tz=GMT
[14:35] <NigeyS> 16:47
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[14:36] <m1x10> Hi people
[14:36] <NigeyS> hey m1x10
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[14:46] <fsphil> ooh cool, I wonder if I can hear that
[14:48] <fsphil> what kind of signal is it?
[14:50] <SpeedEvil> http://nanosaild.engr.scu.edu/dashboard.htm
[14:52] <fsphil> AX.25
[14:52] <SpeedEvil> Where did you see that?
[14:53] <fsphil> http://beacon.engr.scu.edu/BeaconProcessingSystem/NanoSailDBeaconDecoding.pdf
[14:55] <SpeedEvil> ah
[14:55] <fsphil> all the AX.25 stuff for linux seems to be about networking
[14:56] <Dan-K2VOL> Just look for "packet radio" decoders
[14:56] <Dan-K2VOL> Ham software
[14:56] <SpeedEvil> will fldigi do it?
[14:57] <Dan-K2VOL> If it decodes packet radio it should
[14:57] <Elwell> I've just worked out how to add the tle into gpredict
[14:57] <Dan-K2VOL> Heh wonder if spacenear.us could track decded telemetry
[14:58] <Elwell> http://elwell.pastebin.com/KGEibH50
[14:58] <SpeedEvil> No location unfortunately
[14:59] <Dan-K2VOL> Still, the location of the listener and the telemetry data would be useful
[14:59] <eroomde> AX.25 is often transmitted wider than ham radio audio output badnwidth, note
[14:59] <eroomde> so one uses other things
[14:59] <Elwell> http://wa4nzd.wordpress.com/ "The battery will only last for about 3 days"
[15:00] <Dan-K2VOL> i'm surprised no mission like that has ever enlisted hams in a coordinate fashion like we do in ballooning
[15:00] <Laurenceb> bah i dont have the SDR to hand :(
[15:00] <SpeedEvil> Dan-K2VOL: yeah - especially as it's relatively easy to tell people 'run this', and leave it on at these times.
[15:00] <Laurenceb> would be absolutely perfect for this
[15:00] <Laurenceb> whats the Tx power?
[15:00] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: yup
[15:01] Action: Laurenceb is at work atm
[15:01] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: Especially if you could do multiples, and phase tracking, to refine the orbit
[15:01] <Laurenceb> well yeah id just grab a ton of data to play with later
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[15:02] <SpeedEvil> Oh - I suppose it's useful data for your trajectory estimator thing
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[15:03] <NigeyS> is it hf or uhf ? trying to setup truetty
[15:03] <Dan-K2VOL> UHF
[15:03] <Dan-K2VOL> ~437MHz
[15:03] <NigeyS> tnx dan
[15:03] <NigeyS> roofers are here tomorrow with scaffolding, will get the yagi on the chimney i think haha
[15:04] <SpeedEvil> globaltuna?
[15:04] <Elwell> on a rotor?
[15:04] <fsphil> will truetty decode the packets?
[15:05] <NigeyS> says so phil, ax25 uhf and hf
[15:05] <Dan-K2VOL> Thanks, I'll have some on a cracker. Though localtuna is fresher
[15:05] <NigeyS> SpeedEvil, i was thinking just manually for an hour while the sat is overhead, would love a rotator though, could jerry rig an old eq mount ive got .. hmm
[15:06] <SpeedEvil> it's a few mins
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[15:07] <NigeyS> think ive got 6mins where i am :(
[15:07] <eroomde> Dan-K2VOL: cool article on leoweekly
[15:07] Action: fsphil is at work, when's the next pass?
[15:07] <SpeedEvil> NigeyS: you will never get more than about 4 min
[15:07] <eroomde> although the journalist's grasp of science is making me squirm a little
[15:07] <eroomde> " once the balloon reaches its desired altitude, there is nothing to keep it from continuing its ascent into outer space"
[15:08] <NigeyS> SpeedEvil, dam that sucks :(
[15:08] <Dan-K2VOL> Eroomde thank you, and it made me quite irate at his mangling of my explanations
[15:08] <Dan-K2VOL> He's a musician by trade, it's the entertainment weekly, so I am happy just to get in front of that sort of audience at all
[15:08] <eroomde> yes quite
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[15:09] <eroomde> we're more than used to it when mainstream journalism comes knocking
[15:09] <eroomde> but yeah, it certainly makes it sound engaging and exciting
[15:09] <eroomde> ...which of course it is, but to that target audience too
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[15:13] <eroomde> Dan-K2VOL: can i ask you a q?
[15:15] <Dan-K2VOL> Sure eroomde
[15:16] <eroomde> the qr code thing an LVL1 - is it as good as it looks at face value?
[15:16] <eroomde> i.e. having qr codes on equipment and (say) pcbs and having that whisk you to the relevent wiki page with info
[15:17] <Dan-K2VOL> Eh, it's useful for things that you can't figure out, but it's hardly ever used in my experience. The times it's useful are to figure out who owns something, and how to use a complex machine, like our blasted coffee maker.
[15:17] <Laurenceb> qr?
[15:18] <Dan-K2VOL> The 2-D barcodes
[15:18] <Laurenceb> 2d barcode?
[15:18] <Laurenceb> ah
[15:18] <eroomde> ok. it sounds all rather nice, especially on random PCBs that other people will pick up when I'm long gone
[15:18] <Dan-K2VOL> By the way, we mailed a cupcake to Nottingham over there
[15:18] <Laurenceb> i was thinking of qr t-shirts with offensive comments
[15:19] <eroomde> but I guess it means you could never re-arrange your wiki
[15:19] <Dan-K2VOL> That's a nice idea eroomde, or you could just silkscreen the URL - QR codes may fall out of fashion long after you're gone too :-P
[15:19] <SpeedEvil> QRfitti.
[15:19] <Dan-K2VOL> To NottingHack hackerspace I think
[15:19] <SpeedEvil> Take a QRcode in an advert or in a public place.
[15:19] <Laurenceb> like t-shirt hell but with QR codes
[15:19] <Dan-K2VOL> Someone did that with a projector on a building once I think
[15:19] <SpeedEvil> Work out the least number of bits you need to fill in to make a valid URL you can register.
[15:20] <Dan-K2VOL> Lol just use http://j.mp or something
[15:20] <SpeedEvil> I mean you take someone elses QRcode, and fill in a few squares
[15:21] <Laurenceb> http://qrcode.kaywa.com/
[15:21] <Laurenceb> does it allow text and url?
[15:23] <fsphil> is the ax25 stuff decoded with the radio in FM mode?
[15:23] <SpeedEvil> As I understand it, yes
[15:23] <Laurenceb> yes
[15:31] <Hibby> yep
[15:31] Action: Hibby arrives late to the party
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[15:45] <NigeyS> hey Zuph
[15:45] <Zuph> Hey NigeyS
[15:46] <Dan-K2VOL> Morning Zuph, the flow data is in the dropbox testing folder, BTW
[15:46] <Zuph> Dan-K2VOL: Awesome, I'll try to take a look today.
[15:47] <Zuph> Once again, sorry I couldn't stick around for that.
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[15:48] <Dan-K2VOL> Heh no problem, staying out till 2am on work night isn't my idea of normal operations anyway
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[15:49] <Dan-K2VOL> I ended up having to sleep in till 1PM yesterday to catch up
[15:49] <Zuph> Yuck!
[15:49] <Zuph> At least you're doing better than December.
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[16:03] <Zuph> Dan-K2VOL: Any insight on what the best time of day to call Brian might be?
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[16:04] <Dan-K2VOL> Probably afternoon
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[16:35] <NigeyS> 5 mins.. then try to find the nano sail :D
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[16:43] <Hibby> is it that soon? I thought there was one at 1800 or something
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[16:56] <NigeyS> not a sausage, next 1 should be a bit better
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[17:14] <m1x10> 3rd modular uart is ready: http://imagebin.org/133559 !
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[17:28] <jcoxon> evening all
[17:28] Action: jcoxon is going to listen out for NanoSailD later - should have a nice fly over the UK
[17:30] <NigeyS> evening james
[17:30] <jcoxon> hey NigeyS
[17:31] <NigeyS> 18:25 i think the flyby is .. should be gd!
[17:31] <jcoxon> yeah
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[17:50] <fsphil> hmm.. nanosail-d is mag 1.9 on the next pass, it's actually visible
[17:51] <NigeyS> yup :D
[17:51] <jcoxon> just raised my vertical a bit more
[17:51] <jcoxon> hopefully will help
[17:51] <fsphil> I got d/c earlier, did anyone receive anything?
[17:51] <NigeyS> i tried but nada :/
[17:53] <jcoxon> hows your pico-nonameyet going?
[17:53] <NigeyS> going good, ordered that breakout, and the headers i need, should be here monday / tuesday
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[18:01] <jcoxon> i've been working on power savings
[18:02] <NigeyS> oh, how's it coming along ?
[18:02] <jcoxon> its not that easy
[18:02] <jcoxon> the GPS is quite a power hog
[18:03] <NigeyS> phil was thinking the same about the lassen
[18:03] <jcoxon> and the power saving options aren't that good
[18:04] <NigeyS> yikes, you going to run the smaller lip next time to ?
[18:04] <NigeyS> lipo*
[18:04] <jcoxon> yes
[18:05] <jcoxon> it'll all be about clever schemes to turn things on and off
[18:05] <NigeyS> yeah, have to perfect those cycles
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[18:08] <fsphil> could just turn the gps off entirely? with a transistor switch
[18:09] <jcoxon> yup
[18:09] <jcoxon> i've found a way to turn off the RF part of the ublox by command
[18:09] <fsphil> with a battery backup it should get a lock pretty quickly
[18:12] <jcoxon> it does slightly scare me though rebooting a gps mid flight
[18:13] <NigeyS> would be a bit of an arse if it failed for some reason
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[18:14] <fsphil> yea, a literal cold start
[18:21] <jcoxon> even putting the ublox in eco mode doesn't really help
[18:21] <NigeyS> da :/
[18:21] <NigeyS> m*
[18:21] <NigeyS> lassen is even more power hungry i think
[18:21] <jcoxon> only saves you 4mA
[18:23] <jcoxon> a lot is how we plan to track these flights
[18:23] <jcoxon> e.g. could you turn the GPS off for ten minutes at a time at night but keep txing say ever minute
[18:24] <jcoxon> keep rebroadcasting the same position for 10 minutes, power it up again and update and then shutdown for 10 minutes
[18:25] <NigeyS> seems like a good idea, i was thinking of dropping the tx from the ntx 2 to every few minutes after a certain time aswell
[18:29] <griffonbot> @stilldavid: Going through the balloon archives at NCAR. Like a boss. #arhab http://gdzl.la/9bM3Fi [http://twitter.com/stilldavid/status/28157236261953537]
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[18:30] Action: Hibby can't hear nanosailD. Sad times
[18:31] <Hibby> I take that back
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[18:31] <jcoxon> nothing here
[18:32] <jcoxon> but i think my antenna is bust
[18:32] <Hibby> I've only heard 2 bursts, and because of my set up, I'm currently having to do a full 270degree rotate
[18:32] <jcoxon> decode any?
[18:32] <Hibby> it's really messy
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[18:33] <Hibby> really noisy signal
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[18:40] <NigeyS> i got a few lines, had to record to the mobile though :(
[18:40] <NigeyS> saw it too
[18:44] <fsphil> saw it!
[18:44] <fsphil> recorded some sounds but no idea if it will decode
[18:44] <NigeyS> mines not decoding at all :(
[18:44] <Laurenceb_> did you get enough bandwidth?
[18:44] <Laurenceb_> id take a look at the data
[18:45] <NigeyS> not enough the waterfall isnt looking good
[18:45] <Laurenceb_> people are using NBFW ?
[18:45] <Laurenceb_> ah
[18:46] <fsphil> my hands are freezing!
[18:46] <griffonbot> @LVL1WhiteStar: RT @stilldavid: Going through the balloon archives at NCAR. Like a boss. #arhab http://gdzl.la/9bM3Fi [http://twitter.com/LVL1WhiteStar/status/28161454033084416]
[18:47] <Dan-K2VOL> Neat
[18:47] <NigeyS> mine to phil, did you see it brighten then go dim aswell ?
[18:50] <fsphil> didn't see that, fighting with the antennas too much :)
[18:50] <fsphil> it moved a lot quicker than I expected
[18:50] <NigeyS> well ive got 5 mins of jibberish
[18:50] <NigeyS> yeah fast little bugger
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[18:53] <Laurenceb_> maybe it really is jibberish
[18:53] <Laurenceb_> are you using NBFM to receive?
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[19:00] <NigeyS> meh better luck tomorrow
[19:00] <NigeyS> laurenceb i was on fm yup
[19:01] <Laurenceb_> i see - any idea what the deviation is?
[19:01] <NigeyS> no idea, never tried recording / decoding a sat b4 .. i can upload the wav from the phone if you want to take a listen though ?
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[19:03] <Laurenceb_> k, thanks
[19:04] <NigeyS> ew, its actually an amr file, that ok ?
[19:04] <Laurenceb_> should be
[19:05] Action: Laurenceb_ hasnt a clue what that is
[19:06] <NigeyS> vlc plays it ..
[19:06] <NigeyS> www.nigey.co.uk/nanosail.amr .. can hear it best after 3minutes .. but verrrrrrrrrry faint
[19:11] <Laurenceb_> yeah youd struggle
[19:12] <NigeyS> yup, wouldve been better if had the yagi a bit higher up, had a clear line of sight just couldnt wangle the recording, tuning, and rotating the yagi on my own lol
[19:12] <fsphil|m> I think I've recorded it too loud
[19:12] <NigeyS> eek
[19:13] <NigeyS> phil you should get another chance tomorrow night
[19:13] <NigeyS> or maybe the 8pm pass
[19:13] <fsphil|m> yea might have another go tonight
[19:14] <NigeyS> think the 8pm pass is way to far west for me :/
[19:14] <NigeyS> 25th jan looks good though almost directly over cardiff
[19:15] <fsphil|m> http://www.sanslogic.co.uk/files/nanosat-20110120-1830.flac
[19:15] <fsphil|m> anyone get anything from that?
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[19:19] <eroomde> is it naked-eye viewable?
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[19:20] <fsphil|m> yea
[19:20] <NigeyS> yeah, i saw it, brightened then buggered off just as quick :/
[19:20] <NigeyS> no joy on that with truetty phil :(
[19:20] <eroomde> cloudy here
[19:20] <fsphil|m> drat
[19:20] <fsphil|m> are there any other apps?
[19:20] <NigeyS> ill have a look
[19:20] <fsphil|m> the linux ones seem too invasive -- requiring kernal modules and stuffs
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[19:28] <Laurenceb_> what signal strenght is it txing?
[19:28] <Laurenceb_> i might have a go tomorrow with the sdr
[19:30] <Laurenceb_> hmf i cant find a way to convert amr to something sane under ubuntu
[19:31] <NigeyS> eek
[19:32] <Laurenceb_> theres a few horrible and tedious hacks to make it work... but i cant be bothered as its so weak
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[19:32] <Laurenceb_> its not going to decode
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[19:33] <Laurenceb_> does it look like FSK on a waterfall?
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[19:40] <fsphil> nah, found a little program called multimon -- no luck with it either
[19:41] <Laurenceb_> movie player works
[19:41] <Laurenceb_> apparently it uses ffmpeg, same as audacity
[19:41] <Laurenceb_> but audacity says the file is corrupted
[19:41] <jcoxon> Truetty is the best
[19:41] <jcoxon> Works in wine
[19:42] <fsphil> didn't get far with it -- could be something I'm doing, not sure
[19:42] <Laurenceb_> i cant convert amr to something sane
[19:42] <fsphil> have you tried the file I uploaded?
[19:44] <Laurenceb_> no
[19:46] <NigeyS> sorry, ill use the laptop next time and save it as a wav
[19:47] <fsphil|m> the spectrum display in truetty shows two peaks, further apart than expected
[19:47] <Laurenceb_> fsphil: are you playing with the agc?
[19:48] <fsphil|m> not yet
[19:48] <Laurenceb_> the noise floor fluctuates a lot
[19:48] <Laurenceb_> is agc off?
[19:49] <fsphil|m> ln
[19:49] <fsphil|m> oh, I adjusted the volume when I was recording
[19:51] <Laurenceb_> theres a short lenght of fsk in there
[19:51] <fsphil|m> I think the recording is too loud, too much over-modulation
[19:52] <Laurenceb_> dunno what the data format of the fsk is
[19:53] <eroomde> fsphil|m: do you have a link for the over-mod singal?
[19:53] <fsphil|m> http://www.sanslogic.co.uk/files/nanosat-20110120-1830.flac
[19:53] <eroomde> making sense of it sounds like a job for (drum roll) bayesian singla processing!
[19:54] <fsphil|m> I adjusted the volume on the laptop, not the radio
[19:54] <fsphil|m> should have been the other way around
[19:54] <Laurenceb_> those fsk periods look strong enough to decode
[19:55] <fsphil|m> they sound strong enough
[19:55] <Laurenceb_> i see at least 2 on the waterfall
[19:55] <Laurenceb_> fldigi cant make sense of them
[19:55] <fsphil|m> it faded very quickly
[19:55] <fsphil|m> there's another pass coming up
[19:55] <Laurenceb_> exactly 10 seconds between them - 20s and 30s
[19:56] <jcoxon> Its ax.25 packet isn't it?
[19:56] <Laurenceb_> yes
[19:59] <Laurenceb_> aiui ax.25 doesnt define the low level format
[20:00] <jcoxon> If you go on the twitter feed you can seen one of the telemarketing strings
[20:00] <jcoxon> Well its on a blog linked on the twitter feed
[20:00] <jcoxon> Telemetry *
[20:02] <Laurenceb_> lol
[20:04] <NigeyS> james..
[20:04] <NigeyS> http://www.heavens-above.com/gtrack.asp?date=40565.7346213426&lat=51.4865&lng=-3.14711&alt=0&loc=Unspecified&TZ=GMT&satid=90027
[20:04] <NigeyS> its right above you in a couple of days
[20:06] <Laurenceb_> bl
[20:08] <fsphil> should be hearing it now, but noting
[20:08] <fsphil> nothing
[20:08] <NigeyS> its pretty far west this orbit isnt it ?
[20:08] <fsphil> yea
[20:09] <NigeyS> :(
[20:10] <fsphil> there's a few more passes overnight
[20:10] <fsphil> might leave truetty running
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[20:13] <fsphil|m> might try truetty on something else
[20:13] <fsphil|m> just to see if it even works :)
[20:15] <NigeyS> good idea lol
[20:15] <fsphil> no iss passes for a while
[20:15] <fsphil> I wonder if any other satellites use it
[20:18] <NigeyS> cubesat does
[20:19] <NigeyS> http://www.amsat.org/amsat-new/satellites/satInfo.php?satID=116&retURL=/satellites/status.php
[20:20] <NigeyS> that's due to pass right over us soonish
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[20:50] <jcoxon> I've switched backed to my old android phone,its so much better!
[20:51] <Dan-K2VOL> Than?
[20:52] <jcoxon> HTC wildfire back to HTC magic
[20:55] <Hibby> hahah
[20:55] <Hibby> welcome back to the first gen
[20:56] Action: Hibby is working with this uni these days on cubesat work
[20:56] <Hibby> http://rax.engin.umich.edu/
[20:56] <Hibby> we're talking to them quite a lot, as we want to use gmsk for our up/downlink
[20:57] <Hibby> being psk derived, and thus about 100x less prone to error than fsk :)
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[21:01] <jcoxon> Hibby,could they add a hab style TX,we could track it with dl fldigi!
[21:02] <Hibby> haha, dunno - it's already up there.
[21:03] <Hibby> they do have on board gps though
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[21:21] Action: Zuph wishes the cubesat team at his uni weren't a bunch of slackers.
[21:22] <Dan-K2VOL> Haha zuph, it seems that non-slackness is a rarity
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[21:23] <Zuph> Dan-K2VOL: The trouble is that it's a statewide coalition of student organization, so there's too much red tape for reasonable accomplishment.
[21:25] <Hibby> Zuph: all cubesat teams are slackers...
[21:25] <Hibby> because, realistically, student group driven cubesats are pretty tough to do well
[21:26] <NigeyS> jcoxon, get a desire hd you'll not go back then :P
[21:26] <jcoxon> NigeyS, the HTC wildfire is the smaller verison of the desire
[21:26] <jcoxon> the desire is just too big
[21:26] <Hibby> Call me controversial, I quite enjoy BBOS 6... and Web OS.
[21:27] <NigeyS> it is quite "clunky" i must admit, but the o/s .. everything just seems alot smoother and well.. better
[21:27] <Dan-K2VOL> Or just get a 2m and join a repeater club that owns a fancy autopatch, Now with DTMF"
[21:27] <jcoxon> nah the htc magic with 2.2.1 is awesome
[21:27] <NigeyS> wonder when 3.0 is coming out
[21:28] <Hibby> Dan-K2VOL: I'm more of an AX25 type... The VHF and UHF conversation to be had here is terrible...
[21:28] <Zuph> Hibby: Well, for some perspective, This team had completed their first cubesat and sent it off for launch integration immediately prior to me becoming aware of their existence. In the mean time, they've suffered 3 years of launch delays, and haven't been building much in the mean time.
[21:28] <Zuph> And, personally, I like the building :)
[21:28] <Hibby> NigeyS: the tablet only build?
[21:28] <Dan-K2VOL> Hibby: it must be universally awful, it is here too :-P
[21:28] <NigeyS> yeah, wouldnt mind gett a v3 tablet
[21:28] <Dan-K2VOL> What, iOS 4.2?
[21:28] <NigeyS> getting*
[21:28] <Dan-K2VOL> :-P
[21:29] <Zuph> Were I independently wealthy, I'd get a tubesat :-p
[21:29] <Hibby> Zuph: that's better than ours. I wrote a whole spec on radio kit for them, with input from the company that sponsors our research group, pricing, feasability etc, and it's really gone nowhere...
[21:29] <fsphil> we should get together and do our own cubesat
[21:29] <Hibby> so I'm a bit bitter about it. The cubesat project has been taken over by the group and we're now giving the students specific projects to solve, which is going much, much better.
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[21:29] <Hibby> **group being research group.
[21:29] <Zuph> Actually, Dan-K2VOL, a tubesat would be cheaper than the balloon project :-p
[21:30] <Dan-K2VOL> hahahahahhahaha
[21:30] <Hibby> I've got a regular supply of cubesat bodies as we test & throw them away..
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[21:31] <fsphil> I'll pay for launch and everything, right after I win the lottery. which will be really soon now ;-)
[21:31] <Hibby> launch won't cost alot - piggy back on an existing mission...
[21:32] Action: Hibby goes afk....
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[21:45] <jcoxon> this aluminium bubblewrap makes a great GP for gps antennas
[21:46] <NigeyS> aluminium bubblewrap?
[21:47] Action: fsphil read that as aluminium bubblegum ...
[21:47] <jcoxon> http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=10617653&fh_view_size=12&fh_eds=%3f&fh_location=%2f%2fcatalog01%2fen_GB%2fcategories%3C{9372016}%2fcategories%3C{9372050}%2fcategories%3C{9372230}&fh_refview=lister&isSearch=false
[21:48] <fsphil> did you fly any on pico?
[21:49] <jcoxon> well initially it was main insulation
[21:49] <jcoxon> but we cut it off
[21:49] <jcoxon> apart from a small bit on top n
[21:49] <jcoxon> under the antenna
[21:49] <jcoxon> (it conducts so there is a bit of duct tape on top
[21:49] <NigeyS> james, did you keep your gps connections standard on atlas .. RE the lassen breakout, matching pin assignments ?
[21:49] <fsphil> excellent -- might make a good ground plane for the uhf antenna too
[21:49] <jcoxon> NigeyS, can't remember
[21:50] <NigeyS> kk no worries, looking into it
[21:50] <jcoxon> fsphil, yes
[21:50] <jcoxon> NigeyS, shall i send you the schematic
[21:50] <NigeyS> got it now, i got confused about rx going to tx and the fact pin 1 is opposite on the breakout
[21:52] Action: jcoxon is playing with his multimeter + u-center
[21:53] <jcoxon> working out how to reduce current consumption
[21:54] <fsphil> getting anywhere? I'm going to be trying myself soon once I get the breadboarding finished
[21:54] <jcoxon> yeah
[21:54] <Zuph> Well, this is interesting: https://www.faasafety.gov/files/notices/2011/Jan/GPS_Flight_Advisory_CSFTL11-01_Rel.pdf
[21:55] <jcoxon> i can turn the gps rf off and it drops my consumption including the arduino to 20mA
[21:55] <Zuph> GPS to be unreliable in the southeast US in the coming weeks.
[21:55] <jcoxon> of course all gps lock is lost
[21:55] <jcoxon> but you can easily turn it back on
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[21:56] <fsphil> how much of that is the arduino?
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[21:56] <fsphil> I've never measured the atmega I'm using
[21:56] <jcoxon> about 5mA
[21:56] <jcoxon> but i've got a lib to drop that even more
[21:56] <fsphil> ah, that's tiny
[21:56] <jcoxon> but
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[21:56] <jcoxon> we are now struggling to get lock again
[21:56] <jcoxon> i think i need to make it cold start
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[21:57] <fsphil> drat
[21:57] <jcoxon> here we go...
[21:57] <jcoxon> restarted cold start
[21:57] <fsphil> odd though - the manual mentions switching of the rf to save power
[21:58] <jcoxon> interesting its keeping time
[22:05] <Laurenceb_> sounds like the fsa03 is a pain
[22:05] <jcoxon> it is
[22:05] <jcoxon> this ain't one :-)
[22:05] Action: Laurenceb_ has discovered an issue with the bus pirate
[22:05] <Laurenceb_> the 3v3 supply oscillates at ~10khz
[22:05] <Laurenceb_> about 20mv sawtooth oscillation
[22:06] <Laurenceb_> they used a 1uF ceramic cap - datasheet for their vreg says thats the minimum for stability - ive fixed it now
[22:06] <Laurenceb_> rather poor design :-/
[22:07] <Laurenceb_> 4u
[22:08] <Laurenceb_> 4u7 on the output and 22pF on the bias pin and its really clean now
[22:08] <jcoxon> hmm i perhaps shouldn't have coldstarted this gps
[22:08] <jcoxon> now no sats at all
[22:09] <NigeyS> :o
[22:10] <jcoxon> power cycle and we are now doing better
[22:14] <Laurenceb_> hmm what are you powering it with?
[22:14] <jcoxon> my arduino regulator
[22:14] <jcoxon> arduino's
[22:15] <Laurenceb_> for 3.3v?
[22:16] <jcoxon> yes
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[22:16] <Laurenceb_> oh from the FTDI
[22:16] <jcoxon> i'm running the atmega at 3.3v as well
[22:16] <jcoxon> no
[22:16] <Laurenceb_> hmm not sure how fast it is
[22:16] <Laurenceb_> you need a fast regulator
[22:16] <jcoxon> oh it works well, i'm just messing with the ubx commands
[22:17] <Laurenceb_> do you have a low esr 47uF cap right next to the ublox?
[22:17] <jcoxon> nope
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[22:19] <Laurenceb_> ublox5 needs 47uF low ESR cap and a fast regulator
[22:19] <Laurenceb_> as in responds quickly to current demand fluctuations
[22:20] <Laurenceb_> also FTDI can only source 50ma, and less if you want stable voltage
[22:20] <Laurenceb_> ublox uses >50ma on average, and much more for short dirations
[22:20] <jcoxon> Laurenceb_ its not the FTDI
[22:20] <jcoxon> thats providing the 3.3
[22:20] <Laurenceb_> is there a ldo?
[22:21] <jcoxon> i'm using an arduino pro
[22:21] <jcoxon> so yes
[22:21] <Laurenceb_> ah right
[22:21] <Laurenceb_> ive gtg, cya
[22:31] <jcoxon> okay, reseting and then restarting with hotstart setting seems to work over a short time period
[22:31] <jcoxon> now to test over 10 minutes
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[22:41] <jcoxon> hooray
[22:41] <jcoxon> it worked
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[23:03] <fsphil> this should last for days with the 1000ma battery
[23:04] <jcoxon> i'm not sure how much we'll squeeze though
[23:05] <jcoxon> as continous txing is useful at times
[23:06] <jcoxon> cool i've got my flight computer powering it down :-)
[23:06] <fsphil> reduce tx'ing if the altitude remains steady -- either through landing or floating
[23:06] <jcoxon> i'm thinking continous txing for first 500 cycles (pre-launch and ascent)
[23:07] <jcoxon> then an evening mode of continous txing say for 2hrs
[23:07] <jcoxon> to allow easy finding of the payload by receivers
[23:07] <jcoxon> night - 10 minute shutdowns
[23:08] <NigeyS> woot headers all done phil :D continuity checked on both .. perfect!
[23:08] <jcoxon> and day - tx gaps of 30 seconds (haven't decided on gps power down)
[23:08] <NigeyS> whats the ntx2 like for power drain ?
[23:09] <fsphil> just the programming to get done now NigeyS
[23:09] <jcoxon> NigeyS, you can shut it down to something like 1ma
[23:09] <jcoxon> using the En pin
[23:09] <NigeyS> oh sweet
[23:09] <SpeedEvil> jcoxon: And tx continually when under 5km?
[23:10] <jcoxon> but you need to give some time after turning it on
[23:10] <jcoxon> SpeedEvil, i was thinking 1km
[23:10] <jcoxon> considering the last flight didn't go that high
[23:10] <NigeyS> fsphil almost, ftdi breakout to enable me to test the hardware, if i wire the gps up now it wont turn on will it? unless the avr tells it to ..
[23:10] <SpeedEvil> jcoxon: oh - right
[23:10] <jcoxon> but yeah good point
[23:10] <fsphil> NigeyS, it will start as soon as it gets power
[23:11] <NigeyS> ok, well coffee.. and wire this baby up .. and hope it dont go bang :p
[23:11] <SpeedEvil> jcoxon: also - I wonder about ground detection - maybe if it moves 40m in height, turn off ground mode.
[23:11] <SpeedEvil> What do you want to happen if it goes bouncing along
[23:11] <fsphil> re-hab
[23:13] <jcoxon> bouncing along the ground?
[23:14] <jcoxon> okay flight computer can turn on and off
[23:14] <jcoxon> which reduces current down to ~ 30mA
[23:15] <SpeedEvil> yeah - along the ground. Seems likely it might land, take off again, and repeat a few times, as it goes in/out of sunlight, or ...
[23:15] <SpeedEvil> Rain, ...
[23:15] <jcoxon> not much we can do
[23:15] <SpeedEvil> True - other than work out what you'd like it to do on the telemetry side in that case.
[23:15] <SpeedEvil> Can you monitor batt-v?
[23:16] <jcoxon> i think i'm going to try to
[23:16] <jcoxon> its a v. useful thing to know in these cases
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[23:17] <fsphil> question about that ... how do you know when vcc starts dropping? if the adc uses vcc as its reference
[23:17] <SpeedEvil> you can monitor a reference.
[23:17] <SpeedEvil> so, for example, a 1.6V LED or reference chip
[23:17] <jcoxon> fsphil monitor raw batt vs 3.3v output?
[23:18] <fsphil> yep jcoxon, when the raw battery starts to drop below 3.3v, the avr might not be able to detect it as it's vcc is also dropping at the same rate
[23:18] <fsphil> SpeedEvil, that makes sense actually
[23:19] <fsphil> a lower reference voltage than the battery minimum
[23:20] <Zuph> AVR also has a 1.1v bandgap reference built in.
[23:20] <SpeedEvil> you can even save power - resistor to GPIO and LED and ADC
[23:20] <SpeedEvil> oh
[23:20] <SpeedEvil> that too
[23:20] <fsphil> so use a voltage divider to bring the battery voltage down to below 1.1v
[23:20] <fsphil> nice
[23:25] <jcoxon> http://code.google.com/p/tinkerit/wiki/SecretVoltmeter
[23:25] <jcoxon> voila
[23:29] <jcoxon> night all
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[23:35] <stilldavid> annnnnd we're back
[23:36] <stilldavid> that's the singular "we".
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[23:47] <NigeyS> dammit i ned more volts
[23:47] Action: NigeyS steals 2 volts from stilldavid
[23:47] Action: stilldavid WTF just happened to my zener diode?!
[23:47] <NigeyS> lol
[23:48] <fsphil> someone's got potential
[23:52] <NigeyS> oo phil, what about 5 110mah batteries? 2.6gms each
[23:55] <Darkside> you're all quite positive today!
[23:55] <Darkside> (with reference to ground of course)
[23:55] <NigeyS> haha hey Darkside can you lend me 2 volts ?
[23:55] <Darkside> sure
[23:55] Action: Darkside mails NigeyS a lithium cell
[23:55] <NigeyS> thank you sir
[23:55] <NigeyS> nooooo its extra weight .. lol
[23:56] Action: fsphil is ex-static
[23:56] <NigeyS> pmsl good one !!
[23:57] <NigeyS> could save .003 of a volt if i kill the led phil
[23:57] <NigeyS> .03*
[23:57] <fsphil> flashy light is too important
[23:57] <NigeyS> true
[23:58] <NigeyS> tell you what doesnt help, is the antennae for the gps also requires 3.3v
[23:58] SpeedEvil (1000@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) left irc: Ping timeout: 264 seconds
[23:58] <fsphil> I'd have thought the battery would have a better voltage
[23:58] <stilldavid> http://www.flickr.com/photos/stilldavid/5372808151/in/photostream/
[23:59] <stilldavid> oh, I guess that showed up here in twitter, huh
[23:59] <stilldavid> ping Zuph
[23:59] <NigeyS> well in fairness it does provide 4.2 but were regulating a bit to much :/
[23:59] <Zuph> ping stilldavid
[23:59] <stilldavid> Zuph, so yeah, I looked at a *lot* of docuements today.
[23:59] <Zuph> Cool!
[23:59] <Zuph> How was it?
[00:00] --- Fri Jan 21 2011