highaltitude.log.20101122

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[00:06] <Lunar_Lander> hi natrium42
[00:06] <natrium42> o/
[00:06] <Lunar_Lander> http://winzenflyer.wordpress.com/2010/11/21/tracking-horus-11/
[00:07] <Nige|S> thats enough soldering for 1 night :/
[00:07] <Nige|S> morning natrium Lunar_Lander
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[00:11] <Lunar_Lander> natrium42 what do you think on the text?
[00:12] <natrium42> nice report
[00:12] <Lunar_Lander> thanks :)
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[08:08] <NigeyMoby> Morning
[08:12] <jonsowman> morning
[08:12] <jonsowman> :)
[08:13] <NigeyMoby> Hey Jon
[08:26] <NigeyMoby> I think its rather nippy out again :/
[08:26] <jonsowman> looks it
[08:26] <jonsowman> at least it's not raining here
[08:26] <jonsowman> famous last words & all
[08:27] <NigeyMoby> Lol its gonna pour down now u watch :p
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[08:32] <NigeyMoby> Jon would you know if the 790's were sold with ac adapters?
[08:33] <jonsowman> I've no idea I'm afraid
[08:34] <NigeyMoby> Dam, he doesnt mention one on the listing so I'm looking for a spare, no idea on ampage though.
[08:54] Nick change: Elwell_ -> Elwell
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[09:16] <Elwell> was there a launch at the weekend from EARS?
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[10:20] <juxta> hi all
[10:28] <Laurenceb_> hi
[10:31] <juxta> how it the UK today?
[10:31] <juxta> any cool weather to send our way? :(
[10:36] <Laurenceb_> col
[10:56] <SpeedEvil> juxta: Sure!
[10:56] <SpeedEvil> juxta: Come and get all of the 5C and rain you could want!
[10:57] <SpeedEvil> The person that implements CTCP HEATPIPE would win a nobel.
[10:57] <juxta> agreed
[10:57] <SpeedEvil> http://qkwv.com/power.gif I love linux.
[10:58] <SpeedEvil> webcam + power meter + 15 lines of script = graph of power usage
[10:58] <SpeedEvil> (for my house)
[10:58] <juxta> thats nice and low, well done
[10:58] <SpeedEvil> ~105W standby
[10:58] <juxta> are you doing it by sensing a blinking led or the spinning wheel on the meter or something SpeedEvil?
[10:58] <SpeedEvil> It should be ~60-70
[10:58] <SpeedEvil> spinning wheel
[11:01] <Laurenceb_> how does it calculate off the wheel?
[11:01] <SpeedEvil> http://qkwv.com/raw.gif is the raw data
[11:01] <SpeedEvil> It looks at a 5*5 ROI, and sums it per-frame.
[11:01] <SpeedEvil> averages
[11:01] <Laurenceb_> ROI?
[11:01] <SpeedEvil> region of interest
[11:02] <Laurenceb_> ah i see
[11:02] <Laurenceb_> region of interest tracking?
[11:02] <SpeedEvil> No. Duct tape.
[11:02] <Laurenceb_> lol
[11:02] <SpeedEvil> The waveform out is complex - see the raw gif - but fortunately has a nice feature
[11:03] <SpeedEvil> Which corresponds to the black bit on the disk
[11:04] <juxta> ive thought of doing something similar, my meter has a blinking LED though
[11:04] <shenki> juxta: hello
[11:04] <SpeedEvil> yeah - that'd be easier
[11:04] <juxta> which would make things easy
[11:04] <juxta> however the unit of measurement isn't specified
[11:04] <juxta> hey shea|eee
[11:04] <juxta> erm
[11:04] <juxta> shenki even
[11:05] <shenki> :)
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[11:05] <shenki> are you launching tomorrow still?
[11:05] <SpeedEvil> juxta: you sure? Mine says in small print 'one rev=166 2/3 turns'
[11:05] <juxta> yeah
[11:05] <SpeedEvil> Woo!
[11:05] <SpeedEvil> :)
[11:05] <shenki> i'm keen to come along, is there room for me?
[11:05] <juxta> i better update things to let people know
[11:05] <juxta> oh cool, that should be ok i think, maybe you can crew with adrian
[11:05] <juxta> will you drive to the launch site?
[11:05] <fsphil> another launch so soon?
[11:06] <juxta> spot of really good weather
[11:06] <juxta> we can't resist ;p
[11:06] <shenki> juxta: i was going to ask if i could come with you
[11:06] <fsphil> heck yea, any excuse for a launch ;-)
[11:06] <shenki> (to the site)
[11:06] <juxta> sure, that could work too shenki
[11:06] <fsphil> I'd love to go too, but I can't swim that far
[11:06] <juxta> hmm, actually, will have to see how much I can cram in the boot
[11:07] <juxta> maybe my buddy will drive up
[11:07] <shenki> okay. i don't have issues holding stuff on my lap too. i don't have a car to borrow tomorrow, unfortunatly
[11:07] <fsphil> I'm ordering some cable to the payload antenna, and was curious what sort of length and type of cable is normally used
[11:07] <fsphil> last time I had RG58, and it sort of went wrong on landing
[11:08] <juxta> i don't put my antennas externally like everybody else seems to
[11:08] <juxta> i build them into the payload itself
[11:08] <fsphil> yea, makes sense
[11:08] <fsphil> this payload is too small unfornatually
[11:08] <juxta> i have a small bit of coax on them to go to the board, i use erm
[11:08] <juxta> let me find the number
[11:09] <fsphil> the problem with the rg58 was it was too rigid, and the force of the landing ended up on the pcb
[11:10] <juxta> i use RG316
[11:11] <fsphil> thanks juxta, seen some of that on here
[11:11] <juxta> you can usually buy it SMA terminated too
[11:11] <fsphil> that and RG174 I think
[11:11] <juxta> which is handy
[11:11] <juxta> yeah 174 is nice and thin too, have used that too
[11:11] <juxta> I think that one is even thinner from memory
[11:12] <juxta> thats what we used to feed the antennas on the airborne repeaters
[11:12] <juxta> hmm wait maybe it's not
[11:12] <fsphil> yea, was listening to those samples yesterday. great job
[11:13] Action: Laurenceb_ just worked out why mfsk outperforms psk
[11:13] <Laurenceb_> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/Channel_Capacity_with_Power-_and_Bandwidth-Limited_Regimes.png
[11:13] <juxta> okay, that was rg178
[11:13] <juxta> seriously thin stuff
[11:14] <juxta> http://szwholesale.com/ebay/2/RG-178.jpg
[11:14] <juxta> shenki, i'll get back to you shortly about tomorrow, let me think about how we can do it :)
[11:14] <juxta> can you PM me your mobile number btw? I dont seem to have it
[11:14] <shenki> juxta: no worries
[11:14] <fsphil> ooch .. I think I'll use RG316 :)
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[11:46] <juxta> ping Darkside
[12:04] <Darkside> pong juxta
[12:04] <Darkside> just got home
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[12:18] <Laurenceb_> http://qkwv.com/power.gif
[12:18] <Laurenceb_> someones making power spikes
[12:25] <fsphil> rat chewed through a power cable
[12:30] Action: Laurenceb_ is reading about channel capacity
[12:31] <Laurenceb_> fsk wins over psk for raw data as it uses more bandwidth
[12:31] <Laurenceb_> freaky
[12:40] <Darkside> hold on
[12:40] <Darkside> FSK uses more bandwidth, right?
[12:45] <Laurenceb_> yes
[12:46] <Laurenceb_> so shannon says it gets more capacity
[12:47] <Darkside> but how does the carrier shift factor in?
[12:48] <Laurenceb_> how do you mean?
[12:48] <Laurenceb_> bandwidth is defined as the total width of the dodulated signal
[12:48] <Laurenceb_> *modulated
[12:48] <Darkside> mmm
[12:49] <Darkside> ok, so say you have a 300 baud signal with a carrier shift of 100Hz
[12:49] <Darkside> it will still hae a required bandwidth of whatever
[12:49] <Darkside> but it will need a higher SNR to be able to decode, right?
[12:49] <Laurenceb_> yes
[12:49] <Darkside> ok
[12:50] <Laurenceb_> i dont think thats a good example
[12:50] <Laurenceb_> its not quite the same effect
[12:51] <Darkside> i dont think FSK works well as an example for these things :P
[12:51] <Laurenceb_> if i were to use say 1024FSK, id get better performance than BFSK
[12:51] <Darkside> because you get confused between carrier shift and bandwidth
[12:51] <Laurenceb_> yes
[12:51] <Laurenceb_> the bandwidth requirements would be way more, but the SNR would be less demanding than BFSK
[12:51] <Laurenceb_> for the same bitrrate
[12:52] <Darkside> what about maxing out the 3KHz bandwidth or whatever you have
[12:52] <Laurenceb_> thats the weird bit
[12:52] <Darkside> like, have 300 carriers, spaced 10Hz apart
[12:52] <Darkside> i mean, 300FSK, 10Hz shift
[12:52] <Laurenceb_> hard to achieve reliably
[12:52] <Darkside> yeah
[12:52] <Laurenceb_> best bet imo is to do psk
[12:52] <Darkside> PSK is more reliable?
[12:52] <Laurenceb_> then use dsss onto the psk - gps style
[12:52] <Darkside> ooh
[12:53] <Darkside> lol
[12:53] <Laurenceb_> so you eat up the bandwidth
[12:53] <Darkside> convolutional coding
[12:53] <Laurenceb_> as long as you can find a way to use lots of bandwidth...
[12:53] <Darkside> and put in a nice big spreading factor
[12:53] <shenki> f. t. w.
[12:53] <Darkside> just like how CDMA works
[12:53] <Darkside> shenki: :D
[12:53] <Laurenceb_> thats the way shannon is weird
[12:53] <Darkside> should have a play with that on my HF transmitter
[12:54] <Darkside> since i can do QPSK
[12:54] <Laurenceb_> nice
[12:54] <Laurenceb_> whats the setup?
[12:54] <Darkside> DDS
[12:54] <Darkside> AD9835
[12:54] <Laurenceb_> sweet
[12:54] <Darkside> i've never actually done PSK on it, but the IC supports it
[12:54] <Darkside> and has 2 pins, so you can select between 4 phase registers
[12:55] <Darkside> so it adds the value in teh register into the phase accumulator when you select it
[12:55] <Laurenceb_> read the wikipedia page on psk - has some useful info on BER etc
[12:56] <Darkside> heh i got asked about that in an interview today :P
[12:56] <Darkside> i had NFI
[12:56] <Laurenceb_> - the thing i dont get - if i were to have psk with a "low" datarate, i.e. long symbol lenght, i could improve the performance no end by swapping each symbol for a DSSS symbol
[12:56] <Laurenceb_> shannon limits are just weird
[12:56] <Darkside> you mean just up the baud rate and convolutional code?
[12:57] <Darkside> then correlate at the other end?
[12:57] <Laurenceb_> no
[12:57] <Laurenceb_> instead of 0 or 1 symbols, swap 1 for a DSSS sequence
[12:57] <Laurenceb_> and 0 for the same in antiphase
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[12:58] <Laurenceb_> basically copy what gps does for the databits
[12:58] <Darkside> so you mean it actually hops around the section of spectrum
[12:59] <Laurenceb_> well yeah - it "spreads" it
[12:59] <Darkside> i thought GPS (and CDMA) just has a higher chip rate, and the fact that its at a higher rate spreads it
[12:59] <Laurenceb_> yes thats how they work
[12:59] <Darkside> yeah
[13:00] <Darkside> then you use OVSF or walsh codes or whatnot
[13:00] <Darkside> and you have another spreading code overlaud on top of that
[13:00] <Darkside> basically a PRBS
[13:01] <Laurenceb_> yep.. i want to try this with a ntx2 now
[13:01] <Darkside> hahaha
[13:01] <Darkside> they cant do psk tho
[13:02] <Laurenceb_> i think they can
[13:02] <Laurenceb_> but not with long term coherency
[13:02] <Darkside> heh
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[14:17] <Darkside> NigeyS: launch at 1:30UTC as usual
[14:17] <Darkside> im going to sleep now
[14:17] <NigeyS> oo another 1, great stuff, nn fella :)
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[14:30] <GW8RAK> ping earthshine
[14:32] <NigeyS> hey GW8RAK
[14:32] <GW8RAK> Hi NigeyS
[14:32] <NigeyS> how's you today ?
[14:33] <GW8RAK> Soak testing the flight computer. Everything's working and I just want to run it for 8 hours to see if it is still going tonight.
[14:33] <GW8RAK> Looks like most of the work is done.
[14:33] <NigeyS> excellent stuff :D
[14:34] <GW8RAK> I had one last problem last night, but solved that quickly and now it is already to be connected to the TX module
[14:34] <GW8RAK> Everything else is just optional.
[14:35] <NigeyS> :D when is you're launch planned for ?
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[14:47] <fsphil> man things are busy, loads of launches coming up
[14:49] <NigeyS> yups
[14:53] <WillDuckworth> i've got one ready to go on sat morning..... fingers crossed it'll all be ready!
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[14:54] <jonsowman> WillDuckworth: where you launching from? any details on the payload?
[14:54] <fsphil> ooh cool
[14:55] <jonsowman> WillDuckworth: definitely add it to the ukhas Upcoming Launches list
[14:55] <WillDuckworth> i shall get logged in and update it when i get home....
[14:56] <WillDuckworth> plenty of info to come.
[14:56] <WillDuckworth> jonsowman, are you able to help with the xml for the tracker?
[14:56] <WillDuckworth> (launching from Ledbury rugby club) 9am Sat
[14:57] <jonsowman> WillDuckworth: yep sure
[14:57] <jonsowman> I need a couple of sample strings
[14:57] <jonsowman> and all the RTTY telemetry details
[14:57] <NigeyS> if my yaesu is here by then i can help track.. yey!
[14:58] <WillDuckworth> excellent NigeyS - near your neck of the woods
[14:58] <NigeyS> yups, ideally situated :D
[14:59] <jonsowman> WillDuckworth: is the telem stuff complete? I can do the xml for you now
[15:00] <WillDuckworth> cool, it's very very nearly ready, making up a callsign for it... any ideas anyone?!? open to suggestions
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[15:03] <fsphil> rover
[15:05] <WillDuckworth> jonsowman, output similar to this: $$WDHAB,count,HH:MM:SS,latitude,longitude,altitude,groundspeed,intTemp,extTemp,pressure
[15:06] <fsphil> cygnus
[15:12] <jonsowman> WillDuckworth:
[15:12] <jonsowman> ok
[15:12] <jonsowman> what are the rtty params?
[15:13] <jonsowman> baud rate, frequency, shift, bits per char, stop bits, parity
[15:15] <WillDuckworth> 50 baud, 434.650 MHz, 425 shift, ....
[15:17] <jonsowman> are your lat/lon decimal degrees
[15:17] <jonsowman> ?
[15:18] <jonsowman> really seem some sample strings if you've got them
[15:19] <WillDuckworth> jonsowman, are you around this evening? - tricky from work
[15:19] <jonsowman> okay no problems
[15:19] <jonsowman> yes I'll be around later
[15:21] <WillDuckworth> cheers, for info, it's essentially borrowing juxta 's horus code ;-)
[15:22] <fsphil> wnat are
[15:22] <fsphil> what are you flying?
[15:23] <jonsowman> cool okay
[15:23] <WillDuckworth> it's a combination of stuff going up:
[15:24] <jonsowman> http://robertharrison.org/listen/wdhab.xml
[15:25] <jonsowman> that's how it looks currently
[15:25] <WillDuckworth> arduino duemilanove, ublox gps and diydrones.com breakout, gumstix verdex for logging and webcam (potential issues with audiostix SSTV-so ditching that)
[15:25] <jonsowman> I'll finish it later with some sample strings and get it tested
[15:25] <jonsowman> then it's probably best if you leave the payload running all evening and uploading to the tracker
[15:26] <jonsowman> to make sure we catch any bugs
[15:26] <WillDuckworth> thanks, that'd be great
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[16:31] <m1x10> Its possible that I will flight my balloon this summer
[16:31] <m1x10> Army gives me the oppurtiny to sleep at home because Im close to the camp.
[16:31] <m1x10> So I will have time to work during my army obligatio
[16:31] <m1x10> n
[16:32] <m1x10> 2-3 times each week I can sleep home
[16:32] <m1x10> but thats not 100% stable
[16:32] <m1x10> it can change
[16:32] <m1x10> depends on the services and exersices
[16:33] <m1x10> we got to do in the camp
[16:33] Nick change: m1x10 -> micronaut
[16:33] <Laurenceb_> learning how to kill people
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[16:34] <mixio> yeah, Im totally rejecting army but its an obligation here
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[16:35] Nick change: mixio -> micronaut
[16:36] <micronaut> Laurenceb where do u come from?
[16:40] <Laurenceb_> UK
[16:41] <Laurenceb_> gtg, cya
[16:42] <micronaut> bb
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[16:46] <fsphil> that's good news micronaut - how much more have you to do?
[16:48] Zuph (~bradluyst@lutz310-02.loutz.louisville.edu) joined #highaltitude.
[16:48] <Zuph> Morning :)
[16:50] <NigeyS> hey Zuph
[16:50] <NigeyS> hey fsphil
[16:52] <fsphil> evenin'!
[16:52] <fsphil> nearly home time
[16:53] <NigeyS> wrap up on ure way home it's cold! :/
[16:54] <Zuph> Cold? It's nearly 23C :-p
[16:55] <NigeyS> ach thats not fair :(
[16:55] <fsphil> haha
[16:55] <NigeyS> Min. Mon Night
[16:55] <NigeyS> (°C°F)
[16:55] <NigeyS> 2°C 36°F
[16:55] <NigeyS> Sunset 16:14
[16:56] <Zuph> Don't worry. 3 days from now, it's only going to be 8C and rainy.
[16:56] <fsphil> 0c is the low here for tonight
[16:56] <fsphil> and fog
[16:56] <fsphil> must get the green laser out :)
[16:57] <NigeyS> i'll take 8c over 2c !
[16:57] <NigeyS> lol phil
[16:57] <Zuph> I just hate the rapid swings.
[16:57] <NigeyS> clear skies wednesday, will have the telescope out i think
[16:57] <NigeyS> yeah Zuph 23 to 8 is kinda mad :|
[16:57] <NigeyS> http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/world/city_guides/results.shtml?tt=TT003770
[16:58] <fsphil> we do have relative sane weather here at least
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[16:59] <earthshine> GW8RAK: hi
[16:59] <NigeyS> yeah, constantly p*ssing it down or constantly cloudy..lol
[17:00] <GW8RAK> Hi earthshine. That was convenient. Just finished a meeting. A question about Arduinos.
[17:00] <earthshine> k
[17:00] <GW8RAK> Have you come across the Lily pad one please?
[17:00] <Zuph> White Star Balloon fundraising party was a huge success. We have shirts for sale too: http://hauswear.com/bm/hauswear-brands/white-star-balloon-t-shirts/white-star-balloon-t-shirts.shtml
[17:00] <earthshine> i've heard of it yeah
[17:00] <GW8RAK> I've just been talking about including it in some clothing for a project and was wondering if you had any experience.
[17:01] <NigeyS> Zuph, if you ship the u.k i'll buy 1 next payday :)
[17:01] <earthshine> No0 but it is just an Arduino on a smaller board without the USB interface
[17:02] <GW8RAK> We done some things with iPod controllers here and were wondering about using the touchpad as an interface to an arduino and then through to a radio
[17:02] <Zuph> NigeyS: I'll confirm with our shirt guy, but I think he'll ship to the UK no problem
[17:02] <GW8RAK> We have done
[17:02] <NigeyS> excellent cheers Zuph :D
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[17:03] <earthshine> Sounds like an interesting project
[17:03] <GW8RAK> There's a lot of interest in wearable technologies, but beyond iPod control, most of the ideas are just ideas.
[17:04] <GW8RAK> But I've got a project for a north pointing sensor on a garment.
[17:04] <earthshine> cool
[17:04] <GW8RAK> Doesn't need to be any more than just north+-5 degrees, but it would make life easier for North Pole expeditions
[17:05] <earthshine> well it would be a realitvely easy project to do
[17:05] <NigeyS> heh says you can wash them :|
[17:05] <SpeedEvil> You can't do that without GPS
[17:06] <SpeedEvil> Magnetic compasses are useless near the pole
[17:06] <GW8RAK> Easy, but very revolutionary. And another application would be a south pointing sleeve. But I may charge more for that one!
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[17:07] <GW8RAK> SpeedEvil, that is the problem. Many NP trekkers use shadows for short term navigation, but it's not ideal. And getting a GPS out in the early days when it's -45 or so, it not always convenient.
[17:08] <NigeyS> the poles gonna flip soon anway, give or take 50 years
[17:09] <SpeedEvil> GW8RAK: I mean - you cannot use a compass - a magnetic compass - near the poles. You'd need an integrated GPS/guro/accel
[17:09] <SpeedEvil> Or do you need an accel
[17:09] Action: SpeedEvil ponders
[17:09] <SpeedEvil> Broadly - at the poles, north is up/down
[17:09] <GW8RAK> I was thinking of an electronic compass.
[17:10] <SpeedEvil> Electronic compass is just a compass
[17:10] <SpeedEvil> It detects the pointing of the magnetic field.
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[17:10] <GW8RAK> But need to look into chip performance with high angles of magnetic field. Fluxgate compasses work at the pole.
[17:10] <SpeedEvil> But - if 'north' is pointing up within 5 degrees of vertical
[17:11] <SpeedEvil> then you need a very accurate platform to get closer to the pole
[17:11] <GW8RAK> Expeditions carry GPS anyway, so if we can use that, so much the better.
[17:11] <SpeedEvil> As you approach the pole, the residual error gets smaller and smaller, and more difficult to measure
[17:11] <SpeedEvil> and .1 degrees is quite a long way to walk.
[17:12] <GW8RAK> Later stages of the expedition are easier to navigate as tne conditions become much more favourable; relatively warm
[17:12] <SpeedEvil> GPS + gyro is practically what you're going to need to get accurate orientation to the pole.
[17:13] <GW8RAK> That is roughly what I am envisaging, but a simple electronic compass would be applicable to other users.
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[17:16] <GW8RAK> Interesting youtube video about sewing a lilypad to fabric with conductive thread.
[17:16] <GW8RAK> It would probably be neater than my soldering!
[17:16] <NigeyS> lol
[17:17] <SpeedEvil> http://sensebridge.net/projects/northpaw/
[17:17] <SpeedEvil> Seen that?
[17:18] <SpeedEvil> GW8RAK:
[17:18] <GW8RAK> Have done now, thanks SpeedEvil
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[17:21] <GW8RAK> The touch pads we've been experimenting with are at http://www.qiosystems.com/?page=products/textiletouchpads.php
[17:22] <GW8RAK> Time to go home and see if the flight computer has crashed this afternoon.
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[17:25] <griffonbot> @nearsys: Experimenting with a new GPS for the UltraLight flight computer. #ARHAB [http://twitter.com/nearsys/status/6760297041764352]
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[17:41] <micronaut> hi fsphil
[17:41] <micronaut> [18:46] <fsphil> that's good news micronaut - how much more have you to do?
[17:42] <micronaut> Im still stuck on the ttl cam protocol
[17:42] <micronaut> pcb is done but I'll make a new one to support GPSbee
[17:43] <micronaut> http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs928.snc4/74120_1483472571604_1377549819_1164163_1868676_n.jpg
[17:43] <micronaut> and then I need to build the styrofoam payload box
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[17:59] <fsphil> ah styrofoam is fun ;-)
[18:01] <fsphil> the pcb looks excellent
[18:15] <micronaut> the pcb needs some more work
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[18:28] Lunar_Lander (~lunar_lan@p54A07E3C.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #highaltitude.
[18:28] <Lunar_Lander> hello people
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[18:30] <fsphil> the pcb for hadie will not look half as good :)
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[18:43] <micronaut> what fsphil?
[18:43] <Laurenceb> hi
[18:43] <Laurenceb> anyone here familiar with channel capacity etc?
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[18:44] <micronaut> hi Lunar_Lander
[18:44] <micronaut> mixio here
[18:44] <Lunar_Lander> hello
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[19:33] <Zuph> NigeyS: Our shirt guy will ship to anywhere in Europe, but expect a price closer to 16-18 GBP to account for shipping.
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[19:42] <Lunar_Lander> Zuph are you based in the USA?
[19:44] <Zuph> Lunar_Lander: Yep, Louisville, KY
[19:44] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[19:45] <Lunar_Lander> are you one of the Spirit of Knoxville team members?
[19:45] <Lunar_Lander> sorry
[19:45] <Lunar_Lander> I messed up KY with Knoxville, Tennesse
[19:45] <Zuph> heh
[19:45] <Lunar_Lander> please excuse that
[19:45] <Zuph> Nope, that would be Dan-k2vol.
[19:45] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[19:45] <Zuph> We're taking up SNOX's charge, though, and trying to beat their record.
[19:46] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[19:46] <Lunar_Lander> yes, the coast of Ireland is the goal
[19:46] <Zuph> Well, anywhere's the goal.
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[19:47] <Lunar_Lander> true
[19:47] <Zuph> Looking at jetstream forecasts, we could end up anywhere from Norway to North Africa
[19:47] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[19:47] <Lunar_Lander> do you know the Double Eagle balloon?
[19:47] <Zuph> Scotland to Spain are most likely, though.
[19:48] <Zuph> Yep :)
[19:49] <Lunar_Lander> the book has a line which I didn't get
[19:49] <Lunar_Lander> on the first double eagle, anderson and abruzzo talk about reaching Iceland and anderson says: "Iceland is considered Europe"
[19:50] <Lunar_Lander> well that is true but would it count as a trans-atlantic flight if you fly from Maine to Iceland?
[19:50] <Lunar_Lander> I don't think so
[19:51] <Zuph> Our group doesn't think that counts :)
[19:51] <Lunar_Lander> yeah :)
[19:51] <Lunar_Lander> I mean
[19:51] <Lunar_Lander> Greenland belongs to denmark
[19:51] <Lunar_Lander> which also is then europe to some part
[19:52] <Lunar_Lander> and the hop between Canada and Greenland is small
[19:53] <Zuph> Yeah.
[19:54] <Zuph> We aren't satisfied unless we hit Mainland Europe, the British Isles, or Africa.
[19:54] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[19:55] <Lunar_Lander> the rule in the 1992 Chrysler Transatlantic Balloon Challenge was that the team would win which would first cross a major traffic route in Europe
[19:55] <Lunar_Lander> e.g. a motorway
[19:55] <Zuph> ah
[19:55] <Lunar_Lander> so that no one would like land on the beach or so
[19:56] <Zuph> hah
[19:57] <Zuph> Well, we'd be happy with a beach :)
[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> yes :)
[20:08] <Laurenceb> void cb_mnuPlaybackHAB(Fl_Widget *w, void *d);
[20:08] <Laurenceb> can anyone explaint he PlaybackHAB in /src/dialogs
[20:09] <Laurenceb> can anyone explaint he PlaybackHAB in /src/dialogs/fl_digi.cxx
[20:09] <Laurenceb> how does it differ from regular playback?
[20:09] <Laurenceb> - im thinking of adding a stream option
[20:14] <fsphil> should be identical, although I see it isn't
[20:17] <fsphil> it's used when in HAB mode -- the interface was cloned and then modified
[20:17] <fsphil> the original has been changed since then
[20:19] <Laurenceb> ah i see
[20:28] <Laurenceb> so how does it work..? cb_mnuPlaybackHAB sets a global variable to let sound.cxx know where to get the data from?
[20:35] <fsphil> hmm. the code isn't terribly clear about that
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[20:38] <Laurenceb> im trying to clone the pylaback checkbox and add a stream option
[20:39] <Laurenceb> so stream will be the same as playback except no delays in sound.cxx
[20:39] <Laurenceb> itll just empty the buffer then block waiting to read from the buffer
[20:39] <fsphil> might be better implemented as a proper sound source
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[20:40] <fsphil> then when you've selected the file, just switch the sound source to that
[20:40] <Laurenceb> yeah... not sure how to do that
[20:40] <Laurenceb> needs to accept ioctl ?
[20:41] <Laurenceb> streaming allows you to stream wav or flac
[20:41] <Laurenceb> potentially more useable
[20:41] <Laurenceb> e.g. flac over ip
[20:44] <fsphil> I only got as far as adding the menu items
[20:44] <fsphil> and having my 'source' the same as the null source
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[20:52] <Lunar_Lander> hello natrium42
[20:52] <Lunar_Lander> Carlos!
[20:53] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[20:54] <natrium42> bonjorno
[20:55] Nick change: stilldavid -> dave|wat
[20:56] <Lunar_Lander> carlos is the name of the guy who grades our math homework problems
[20:56] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[21:38] <Darkside> ohi
[21:39] <juxta> morning Darkside
[21:39] <juxta> i overslept, damnit
[21:39] <Darkside> lol
[21:40] <juxta> hey make sure to bring your inverter etc for the lp car :)
[21:40] <Darkside> yeah its already packed
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[21:40] <juxta> excellent :)
[21:43] <juxta> i hope we dont land in the mb township
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[21:45] <Darkside> juxta: what paramaters?
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[21:46] <juxta> 4,5,3.7
[21:46] <juxta> 4,5,37000 rather
[21:47] <SpeedEvil> Another busy day?
[21:47] <juxta> indeed
[21:47] <juxta> ':)
[21:47] <Darkside> oh yes
[21:47] <SpeedEvil> :)
[21:48] <Darkside> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=81102a71fefb56869fefecba537ccdfc53aa75bb
[21:48] <Darkside> eeek
[21:49] <Darkside> getting closer to mb..
[21:50] <juxta> oh well
[21:50] <juxta> not the end of the world if it does
[21:51] <Darkside> i think we're gonna have to head off to murray about an hour and a half adter launch
[21:51] <Darkside> and probably hang around the highest hill we can find until closer to landing
[21:53] <Darkside> oh yes, ill need to get oziplotter 0.8 and chasetracker from you
[21:53] <Darkside> could you email them now?
[21:53] <juxta> 0.9 you mean
[21:53] <Darkside> >_>
[21:53] <Darkside> yes
[21:54] <juxta> wanna get them at the launch site?
[21:54] <Darkside> version.max
[21:54] <Darkside> bah, ok :P
[21:54] <juxta> all my gear is packed up atm and im about to leave
[21:54] <Darkside> i guess i can get the wind data now
[21:54] <Darkside> ohh ok
[21:54] <Darkside> yeah im gonna go have a shower now
[21:55] <Darkside> ok windgrabber running
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[22:06] <juxta> morning grant
[22:06] <juxta> terry here, just heading off now
[22:09] Action: Laurenceb discovers he sucks at c++
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[22:12] <DanielRichman> I noticed something today; I think. The UK radio license defines "airborne" as including balloons, both tethered and free; so we can't use 400W on a tethered balloon (for some reason I thought we could?)
[22:12] <Laurenceb> kite
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[22:18] <jcoxon> evening
[22:18] <jonsowman> hi jcoxon
[22:18] <jonsowman> how's things
[22:18] <jcoxon> not bad thanks
[22:19] <jcoxon> you?
[22:19] <jonsowman> yea not too bad at all thanks :)
[22:19] <jonsowman> nearly the end of term
[22:19] <jonsowman> hehe
[22:19] <jcoxon> i was hoping to make some progress this week with atlas
[22:19] <jcoxon> so we can launch it again
[22:19] <jonsowman> excellent
[22:20] <jonsowman> sounds good
[22:21] <jcoxon> too late for tongith
[22:21] <DanielRichman> Aircraft and Airborne Vehicles includes full size and models and also includes
[22:21] <DanielRichman> balloons whether tethered or free;
[22:21] <DanielRichman> Laurenceb: ^^ I think kite might be included
[22:23] <Laurenceb> sucks
[22:23] <Laurenceb> i seem to have streaming working in fl-digi XD
[22:23] <Laurenceb> ill put it on github if it all works ok
[22:25] <jonsowman> jcoxon: any insights as to what happened last time?
[22:27] <jcoxon> jonsowman, must be nav mode
[22:27] <jonsowman> hmm yes
[22:27] <jonsowman> odd though
[22:27] <jcoxon> yeah the code should have worked
[22:27] <jcoxon> this time we'll ahve a telem field which is nav mode
[22:28] <jonsowman> wise plan
[22:28] <jcoxon> and perhaps recheck every 10 mins
[22:28] <jonsowman> or at least if the gps hasn't had a lock for > x minutes
[22:29] <jcoxon> nah, cause it probably thought it had a lock
[22:29] <jcoxon> best just keep setting it
[22:29] <jonsowman> hmm
[22:29] <jonsowman> yes, fair enough then
[22:31] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[22:33] <fsphil> shame there's no way of testing that on the ground
[22:33] <jonsowman> mm indeed
[22:34] <jcoxon> hence we'll just keep checking and settng the nav mode
[22:36] <jonsowman> yea
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[22:41] <jonsowman> man logrotate
[22:41] <jonsowman> haha oops
[22:42] <Upu> wrong window... :)
[22:42] <jonsowman> yep... :P
[22:42] <fsphil> command not found :p
[22:42] <jonsowman> thanks fsphil
[22:42] <jonsowman> lol
[22:42] <jonsowman> :D
[22:43] <fsphil> ah well, at least it wasn't a password
[22:43] <jonsowman> hehe true
[22:49] <RocketBoy> I don't think airborne vehicle apply to tethered kites and balloons as far as amateur radio is concerned - after all a Vehicle is a means of transport and tethered kites/balloons do not move
[22:50] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[22:50] <RocketBoy> hams have been using kites as antenna for years
[22:51] <Lunar_Lander> but in that US rule (FAA 101?) they put tethered and free balloons together
[22:52] <Lunar_Lander> I don't know why
[22:52] <Lunar_Lander> as, as you say, these are two kinds of vehicles
[22:52] <RocketBoy> fine - tats the view for avaition - not that for ham radio
[22:52] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[22:53] <RocketBoy> its the uk ham licence (and I suspect CEPT licensing too) that says not airborne Vehicles
[22:54] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[22:54] <Lunar_Lander> which is sad
[22:54] <RocketBoy> sure
[22:55] <Darkside> i know around here that some people do HF on tethered balloons
[22:55] <Darkside> 160m vertical antenna :P
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[22:56] <RocketBoy> do you mean a 1/4 wave on 160m - i.e. 40m?
[22:56] <Darkside> nah
[22:56] <Darkside> they load up a 160m vertical antenna
[22:56] <Darkside> not sure how it works better
[22:56] <Darkside> but apparently it does
[22:56] <Darkside> maybe they have a loading coil in the middle somewhere
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[22:58] <LazyLeopard> Hmmm... There's a 90 metre tower height restriction round here. Too close to Biggin Hill... ;)
[22:58] <Darkside> hey gm
[23:04] <vk5gr> morning darkside - you heading out for the flight? I cant make it unfortunately so it will be the stills camera payload today
[23:06] <Darkside> ok
[23:06] <Darkside> yeah i'm waiting for adrian
[23:06] <Darkside> i'm stalking him on APRS
[23:06] <Darkside> he's at BOC atm
[23:06] <vk5gr> no probs - will be lurking and watching while in my meetings
[23:07] <Darkside> haha ok
[23:07] <Lunar_Lander> good night!
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[23:14] Nick change: SpeedEvil1 -> SpeedEvil
[23:24] <Laurenceb> ok streaming is working in fldigi
[23:25] <Laurenceb> just done try to play wav....
[23:25] <Darkside> streaming?
[23:25] <Laurenceb> or itll hang
[23:25] <Laurenceb> streaming audio to fldigi
[23:27] <Darkside> from a wave file you mean?
[23:30] <Laurenceb> yes
[23:35] Jasperw (~jasperw@skeleton2.london.iofc.org) left irc: Quit: Leaving.
[23:36] <vk5gr> zsn is at your dorrstep :-)
[23:37] Nick change: dave|wat -> stilldavid
[00:00] --- Tue Nov 23 2010