highaltitude.log.20100920

[00:00] <SpeedEvil> Unfortunately, with a constant pinhole, the effective diameter of the pinhole drops with altitude.
[00:01] <WB9SBD-NSS> youd be surprised how effective it is.
[00:01] <nv1k> as well as the differential pressure
[00:02] <SpeedEvil> The differential pressure in the balloon drops as it rises (until it rises again just before burst)
[00:02] <nv1k> which is what i said?
[00:02] <SpeedEvil> The gas density falls off lots.
[00:02] <SpeedEvil> This means the pinhole diameter effectively drops by lots more.
[00:02] <WB9SBD-NSS> yup, been doing thios for 22 years now, I'm one of the original three that started this back in the 80's
[00:02] <SpeedEvil> Ah. :)
[00:03] <nv1k> lol
[00:03] <WB9SBD-NSS> he he he
[00:03] <SpeedEvil> K, I won't bother thinking about the scaling laws then.
[00:03] <SpeedEvil> I shouldn't try to think at this time of night.
[00:03] <WB9SBD-NSS> been there done that before
[00:03] <nv1k> nonsense
[00:03] <nv1k> productivity goes up after midnight!
[00:04] <SpeedEvil> Only if not stupidly tired.
[00:04] <WB9SBD-NSS> well something goes up after midnight,,,, or is that in the morning?
[00:04] <nv1k> what's morning?
[00:06] <WB9SBD-NSS> that northern loop was weird to see happen.
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[00:08] <WB9SBD-NSS> nv1k where in iowa are ya?
[00:08] <nv1k> Ames, at ISU
[00:08] <WB9SBD-NSS> ahhh Ok, I should easily be in range os any of your flights
[00:09] <nv1k> for RX or visual?
[00:10] <WB9SBD-NSS> RX fro sure visual..... ~200 miles,
[00:10] <nv1k> We typically try to only fly in conditions with less than 60 miles net drift
[00:10] <nv1k> but yeah
[00:10] <SpeedEvil> yeah - it's going up really slowly.
[00:11] <SpeedEvil> Hence wierd loops.
[00:11] <W0OTM> howdy
[00:11] <nv1k> Hoping for a 36hr flight thanksgiving week
[00:11] <W0OTM> nv1k: you in Iowa?
[00:11] <nv1k> W0OTM, correct
[00:11] <SpeedEvil> nv1k: latex?
[00:11] <W0OTM> nv1k: ISU student?
[00:11] <WB9SBD-NSS> We go whenever we have a flight scheduled. which means it can land 5 miles away or we have had them go out into the big pond and i dont me lake michigan but the Atlantic ocean, oh well he he he
[00:12] <nv1k> SpeedEvil, polyethelene zero-pressure
[00:12] <SpeedEvil> See the recovery from the sea a bit ago?
[00:12] <nv1k> W0OTM, yes, student
[00:12] <SpeedEvil> nv1k: fun.
[00:12] <W0OTM> nv1k: im in Ottumwa
[00:12] <SpeedEvil> I want to try my foil superpressure.
[00:12] <WB9SBD-NSS> what the volume of the foil one?
[00:12] <SpeedEvil> Al foil/natural gas.
[00:13] <nv1k> WB9SBD-NSS, we usually know 3 or so days in advance if we can fly or not, all student labor so its hard to find time for more than 60miles of travel
[00:13] <SpeedEvil> Just small - a test balloon to get to 10km or so
[00:13] <nv1k> W0OTM, you iHab?
[00:13] <W0OTM> nv1k: yes
[00:13] <nv1k> ahhh
[00:14] <WB9SBD-NSS> yeah we got an awesome chase and recovery crew, 50 flights and not one lost yet, except the atlantic one.
[00:14] <nv1k> heh
[00:14] <WB9SBD-NSS> which was never intended to be recovered anyway.
[00:14] <nv1k> 140 some with 2 losses
[00:14] <nv1k> 1 which we watched sink in a pond
[00:14] <nv1k> the other was a StratoStar prototype that failed....
[00:14] <WB9SBD-NSS> he he he
[00:15] <nv1k> W0OTM, you guys will have to come down for our conference this summer
[00:15] <W0OTM> nv1k: what conf? where?
[00:15] <WB9SBD-NSS> where at?
[00:15] <WB9SBD-NSS> he he he
[00:15] <nv1k> academic high-altitude conference @ ISU
[00:15] <W0OTM> Pella was suppose to host the "great launch"
[00:15] <nv1k> second annual, first was this past summer in Indiana
[00:16] <W0OTM> I think it fell through
[00:16] <nv1k> Yeah super-launch is..... yeah....
[00:16] <WB9SBD-NSS> bills balloon i don't think is gonna level off i think it'l pop, it's dark there now and it's still rising fast
[00:17] <W0OTM> WB9SBD-NSS: whats the APRS callsign
[00:17] <WB9SBD-NSS> it's that direct thing bills running so it doesn't show up there at all.
[00:18] <W0OTM> ahh
[00:18] <nv1k> I don't really understand the stink about aprs network utilization
[00:18] <WB9SBD-NSS> or if it is I wasn't able to find it, the only place I found it was on http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[00:19] <WB9SBD-NSS> only two clowns complain, we ignore them.
[00:19] <nv1k> Good
[00:19] <nv1k> lol
[00:19] <nv1k> as long as you aren't spamming every 10 seconds, who cares
[00:20] <WB9SBD-NSS> I mean other than being the radio amateur version of Twitter,, so I can see you in your car going to the store to get a case of beer, what really is it used for?
[00:20] <nv1k> Yeah
[00:20] <nv1k> Does the spacenear tracker not update landing prediction?
[00:20] <SpeedEvil> .3m/s isn't really 'rising fast'.
[00:21] <SpeedEvil> nv1k: It should.
[00:21] <WB9SBD-NSS> ahh it did slow down after sundown, good it might have a chance now.
[00:22] <SpeedEvil> TRhere has been issues over the past few dfays about it not being able to download datra properly
[00:22] <SpeedEvil> Unless it's stupidly inflated, it's got a long way to go before burst.
[00:23] <nv1k> W0OTM, when is your next flight?
[00:23] <WB9SBD-NSS> But with the pin hole floater launched at sunset, and if the correct amount was inserted, it might just float right about now where it is.
[00:24] Action: nv1k Anyone know if he has a lighting system?
[00:24] <WB9SBD-NSS> Not a clue,
[00:25] <WB9SBD-NSS> I wish when guys have flights they have someone man the chat rooms, drives me crazy not to have contact with the launch crew.
[00:25] <nv1k> heh
[00:25] <SpeedEvil> :)
[00:26] <WB9SBD-NSS> and it's sooo easy now!! geez in the beginning we did all this on HF nets schedule nets, tracking nets etc. all done on HF. now with the net it's sooo easy and no one bothers, sucks
[00:27] <SpeedEvil> :)
[00:27] <nv1k> I think i'm the first person from ISU in this channel
[00:28] <WB9SBD-NSS> I always look for a chat room for a flight. we have one on every one of ours, every time.
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[00:29] <WB9SBD-NSS> yeah the prediction trace has gone away, I thought I'd do a hard refresh to see if it would up date and now it's gone altogether
[00:29] <nv1k> Yea I'm going to push it for our next flight
[00:29] <nv1k> We are striving for live video from launch and recovery as well
[00:29] <SpeedEvil> It may be upset with 0.1m/s rise-rarte
[00:31] <WB9SBD-NSS> thats true,, never thought of that a floater or very slow rise sure would push the computational points sky high to get it to go still to a burst altitude.
[00:31] <natrium42> <WB9SBD-NSS> have any contact info for who ever made the traking page? http://spacenear.us/tracker/ <-- sup?
[00:31] <WB9SBD-NSS> ?
[00:31] <natrium42> oh, i think there is not enough prediction data
[00:31] <natrium42> let me grab more
[00:31] <natrium42> it only had weather data for 48 hours
[00:32] <nv1k> should be a way to specify that it is a floater and once it hits <.2m/s or some other criteria switch to descent mode
[00:33] <natrium42> actually there is a predictor for floaters... it just doesn't let it burst
[00:34] <natrium42> i could enable it
[00:34] <nv1k> yeah i know
[00:34] <nv1k> but it should just do a descent only prediction
[00:34] <nv1k> after it has reached float
[00:34] <nv1k> just so you know where it would land
[00:34] <natrium42> if it burst at that moment?
[00:34] <nv1k> yeah
[00:34] <WB9SBD-NSS> I guess Bill is online, just not in here since he's sending out e mails to the lists, ug! BILL!!!!
[00:35] <nv1k> theres no real way of knowing when it wil burst, so just assume it would burst
[00:35] <nv1k> unless your prediction code is looking far enough ahead to know when it will start rising again
[00:35] <WB9SBD-NSS> natrium42 are you the creator of this page? the tracker page that is.
[00:36] <natrium42> it's not really clear how to do it for balloons with a pin hole
[00:36] <natrium42> WB9SBD-NSS, yes, though the distributed listening system was done by jcoxon and rjharrison
[00:36] <nv1k> have you tried treating it as a zero-pressure type balloon?
[00:37] <WB9SBD-NSS> well if Bill did it right, it should level off very soon, and if the 600 grammer has a flat spot like the arbornet pressure flight it will level off at zero pressure.. either because of the hole or sundown.
[00:37] <natrium42> nv1k, right now it assumes constant ascent rate
[00:37] <nv1k> natrium42, not really terribly valid
[00:37] <SpeedEvil> It's surprisingly valid.
[00:37] <SpeedEvil> At many ascent rates
[00:38] <nv1k> for a floater?
[00:38] <SpeedEvil> From - say - 3m/s to 10m/s
[00:38] <SpeedEvil> no
[00:38] <SpeedEvil> of course not.
[00:38] <nv1k> yes i won't disbute it is valid in that range
[00:38] <natrium42> buggy point...
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[00:38] <SpeedEvil> To work out floater alt would be hugely more complex
[00:38] <nv1k> have you looked at some of the AIAA papers?
[00:39] <SpeedEvil> Hugely more complex in comparison to assuming a constant.
[00:39] <nv1k> yes
[00:39] <natrium42> nv1k, the predictor code is on github if you would like to take a look
[00:39] <nv1k> i have it
[00:39] <natrium42> http://github.com/rjw57/cusf-landing-prediction
[00:39] <natrium42> kk
[00:39] <nv1k> we are working on our own
[00:39] <nv1k> actually have had our own for a couple of years but we started extending it last semester
[00:41] <natrium42> cool, where do you study?
[00:41] <WB9SBD-NSS> I think several months ago I was in contact with someone about this page and having it work on some of our up coming flights, for some reason I'm thinking of someone in Canada EH?
[00:41] <nv1k> Iowa State
[00:41] <natrium42> WB9SBD-NSS, might have been me
[00:41] <natrium42> i remember somebody wanting APRS integration
[00:41] <WB9SBD-NSS> u in canada?
[00:41] <natrium42> yes
[00:42] <SpeedEvil> More bogons.
[00:42] <WB9SBD-NSS> probably was you, we got some very special flights in the works for the future, and will need some special tracking systems hmmmmm?
[00:43] <nv1k> WB9SBD-NSS, special how?
[00:43] <natrium42> looks like it has enough weather data for predictions now
[00:43] <WB9SBD-NSS> it's preobably getting really cold, it at the cold layer and after sundown I bet it's freezing it's butt off
[00:43] <SpeedEvil> I get a predict track
[00:44] <WB9SBD-NSS> yup it's back!
[00:45] <WB9SBD-NSS> natrium, how is Bills data getting into to this now,,
[00:45] <nv1k> WB9SBD-NSS, we might be able to help with tracking as well
[00:46] <WB9SBD-NSS> Both of you drop me a note at nss@mwt.net so we can discuss this more,
[00:46] <natrium42> WB9SBD-NSS, it's running a modified fldigi that uploads data to server
[00:46] <natrium42> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:tracking_guide
[00:47] <nv1k> WB9SBD-NSS, will do
[00:47] <WB9SBD-NSS> Thanks!
[00:49] <WB9SBD-NSS> Looks like the pin hole was too big, or Bill diddn't have enough gas in and after the sun went down she's coming down it looks like.
[00:50] <SpeedEvil> That's very uneven.
[00:50] <SpeedEvil> Hmm
[00:50] Nick change: DagoRed -> DR_dsp_hw
[00:53] <SpeedEvil> Rising, then bumping into the really cold layer, so it stopped rising due to contraction - mostly
[00:53] <nv1k> contraction = badddd
[00:53] <SpeedEvil> Then as it outgassed, eventually it hit warmer air, which bouyed it up a bit
[00:54] <nv1k> how does the thermal profile look?
[00:54] <nv1k> is the cold layer still settling?
[00:54] <SpeedEvil> then that ran out, and the quite fast underlying deflation caught up with it
[00:54] <SpeedEvil> maybe
[00:54] <nv1k> Needs internal pressure sensor :)
[00:55] <WB9SBD-NSS> and sundown. this is ohhhh probably the 4th or 5th time Bill and I have done these types of flights, intentionally launch with the right amount of lift so when the sun goes down that lift is gone and it becomes a floater, with this technique Bill one year made it 1/2 way across the atlantic. but this time with the pin hole it may still come down.
[00:55] <SpeedEvil> yeah - that inital drop rate is quite fast
[00:56] <WB9SBD-NSS> never did it with a hole before, don't know why he did this time,
[00:56] <natrium42> bbl
[00:56] <SpeedEvil> Another 3-4 hours at that rate?
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[00:57] <nv1k> its going to take forever
[00:57] <nv1k> parachute will be fighting it
[00:58] <SpeedEvil> true
[00:58] <WB9SBD-NSS> depends also how much warmer it can get as it gets lower, If the balloon can get warmer than the air around it it may level off some again from IR absorbtion.
[00:58] <SpeedEvil> But not very much at 0.9m/s
[00:58] <SpeedEvil> As the balloon gets lower though, the pinhole emits more gas
[00:59] <WB9SBD-NSS> thats way I was surprised he went with a hole this time.
[00:59] <WB9SBD-NSS> speed ur in the UK?
[01:00] Action: SpeedEvil checks GPS.
[01:00] <SpeedEvil> Yes.
[01:00] <WB9SBD-NSS> he he he
[01:00] <SpeedEvil> Scotland.
[01:00] <WB9SBD-NSS> kinda sucks for u guys to have soo many restrictions.
[01:01] <SpeedEvil> I wish I had gotten stuff develiped faster.
[01:01] <SpeedEvil> I had a nice UAV designed before it became not legal.
[01:02] <WB9SBD-NSS> same here
[01:02] <SpeedEvil> http://www.mauve.plus.com/test.png - silly render of an overflight
[01:02] Action: DR_dsp_hw found a way for waivers in the US for UAV's
[01:02] <WB9SBD-NSS> stinkin' terrorists!
[01:02] <SpeedEvil> A vertical climb optimised helicopter/thruster
[01:02] <SpeedEvil> vectrored thrust.
[01:03] <SpeedEvil> 1Kg or so, ascend to 4Km, descend to landing spot, with a 10GP pan in the middle.
[01:03] <WB9SBD-NSS> not legal here,
[01:04] <SpeedEvil> It was not illegal here until early this year.
[01:04] <WB9SBD-NSS> bummer!
[01:05] <SpeedEvil> The fun part was that it was designed for hands-off.
[01:05] <SpeedEvil> And able to generate one of these pans every half an hour or so.
[01:05] <WB9SBD-NSS> we had a nice scale version of a U-2 Spyplane we wee gonna haul up as high as possible with the balloon and after pop try to fly it back to the launch site.
[01:06] <nv1k> reminds me of my guided parafoil recovery system...
[01:06] <WB9SBD-NSS> even that is not quite legal maybe,, as long as you control it in only two axis you may get away with it.
[01:07] <nv1k> parafoil :)
[01:07] <WB9SBD-NSS> we have been fighting with the FAA for over 15 years on some of this stuff
[01:07] <nv1k> perfectly legal
[01:07] <SpeedEvil> Sigh.
[01:07] <SpeedEvil> WB9SBD-NSS: Trained ducks. It's the way of the future.
[01:07] <nv1k> At least according to our FAA contact
[01:09] <WB9SBD-NSS> who is it? My self and Mike from EOSS would like to talk to him, because Washington says NO WAY can you steer a recovery device on a ballon flight. as soon as you start to control where it is going it no longer qualifies as regulated under far 101, it is not a un manned free vballoon,
[01:10] <nv1k> i will try to get contact info
[01:10] <WB9SBD-NSS> Washington would rather have a payload of a legal far 101 un manned free balloon land in the center of Ohare international airport, than allow you to steer it away from it.
[01:11] <nv1k> we were told since it launched as a balloon and was unpowered and if we turned it off it would still qualify it is ok
[01:11] <nv1k> and it would keep it out of their precious controlled airspace anyway
[01:11] <SpeedEvil> It's kinda ridiculous anyway.
[01:12] <nv1k> it's totally redic
[01:12] <SpeedEvil> Someone interested in doing nasty stuff isn't gonna drop it from balloons.
[01:12] <DR_dsp_hw> It's the FAA
[01:13] <SpeedEvil> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=geqip_0Vjec - aggressive quadrotor
[01:13] <WB9SBD-NSS> wow very different than what we were told and we have had to go all the way to washington DC to get answers, And I'm even one that got permission to do a Rockoon right here in the midwest with a 125 pound rocket launched from a balloon, I had a waiver for that! but anything steerable on a part 101 balloon is forbidden.
[01:13] <SpeedEvil> That sort of thing is scary.
[01:13] <nv1k> SpeedEvil, don't even get me started on that thing
[01:13] <SpeedEvil> From a terrorism POV
[01:13] <nv1k> WB9SBD-NSS, you did rockoon?
[01:13] <SpeedEvil> Though in many ways conventional steerable small rapidly manoevering airframes are just as bad.
[01:14] <WB9SBD-NSS> Had permision, but weather did not co operate, and by the time weather was good 9/11 happened and it was killed at least from here.
[01:15] <nv1k> WB9SBD-NSS, We are looking to do a rockoon, we were going to do a rockoon launch with SEDS and AeroPac over at Black Rock but it all fell through
[01:15] <nv1k> Looking into getting waiver here
[01:15] <WB9SBD-NSS> a 500 cuft PE baalloon has to be dead calm to fly.
[01:15] <nv1k> but ours is <30lb rocket
[01:16] <WB9SBD-NSS> I can't remember the engine we were using but the rocket was more or less the engine with nosecone and fins. It had a GPS for altitude and ATV tranny for the view. But it weighed 125 pounds and was like i said 99% motor he he he
[01:16] <nv1k> dang
[01:17] <SpeedEvil> 99% motor...
[01:17] <SpeedEvil> Wouldn't you hit both limits of GPSs?
[01:17] <WB9SBD-NSS> weight vs payload,
[01:17] <SpeedEvil> Or did you have a delimited one
[01:18] <nv1k> SpeedEvil, on our flight simulations its only above the velocity limit for <1 minute
[01:18] <WB9SBD-NSS> we have been delimited since they started making them, we had to sign our lives away to the manufacturer and government to get ones that were cleared for altitude and speed.
[01:18] <SpeedEvil> nv1k: You're assuming you won't go horizontal?
[01:19] <nv1k> SpeedEvil, correct
[01:19] <WB9SBD-NSS> that was the scaryest part,
[01:19] <nv1k> WB9SBD-NSS, what was your target alt?
[01:19] <WB9SBD-NSS> soo long ago I honestly do not remember. this was ohhhh like 1993 94 or so.
[01:20] <WB9SBD-NSS> for some reason 275K is poppin into my head
[01:20] <nv1k> yeah thats a bit higher than our target
[01:20] <nv1k> we are only going with a level 2 rocket though
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[01:21] <nv1k> we can't launch below 75kft or the drag will rip our fins off
[01:21] <WB9SBD-NSS> he he he
[01:21] <natrium42> o/
[01:21] <nv1k> Transitioning the plans from Black Rock desert to central iowa is a bit difficult
[01:22] <natrium42> cool, balloon still up
[01:22] <WB9SBD-NSS> but slowly coming down.
[01:23] <WB9SBD-NSS> Yeah it would be. Are there any restricted airspaces out there?
[01:23] <nv1k> not really
[01:24] <WB9SBD-NSS> that sucks then,
[01:24] <nv1k> Prelim talks with FAA seem promising though
[01:24] <nv1k> While we are <65kft we are a free balloon that just needs a weight waiver
[01:24] <nv1k> and we have flown 50lbs before w/o issue
[01:25] <nv1k> and this will only be 40lbs
[01:25] <WB9SBD-NSS> thats good,
[01:25] <nv1k> launch window 75-90kft
[01:25] <natrium42> nv1k: are you going for a long duration floater too?
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[01:26] <nv1k> natrium42, we are doing a zero-pressure extended duration around thanksgiving
[01:26] <natrium42> trans atlantic?
[01:26] <nv1k> only 24-48hrs for first flight
[01:26] <natrium42> ah, cool
[01:27] <nv1k> next semester a looonnnng duration to test our CubeSat hardware
[01:27] <natrium42> are you making our own envelope?
[01:27] <natrium42> *your
[01:27] <nv1k> Yes
[01:27] <creis> nv1k, we should probably start on that soon lol
[01:28] <SpeedEvil> nv1k: Head east!
[01:28] <natrium42> :D
[01:28] <nv1k> ideally
[01:28] <SpeedEvil> (the submarine + rocket people)
[01:28] <nv1k> ooops, crashed matlab
[01:29] <SpeedEvil> ah - copenhagen suborbital
[01:30] <natrium42> those guys are crazy
[01:31] <SpeedEvil> In a good way!
[01:31] <natrium42> oh yes :D
[01:31] <natrium42> it's pretty damn amazing
[01:31] <SpeedEvil> 'Launch failed due to lack of hairdrier'
[01:31] <WB9SBD-NSS> too bad you don't have a nice restricted airspace like we did we launched from Sheboygan and there is the HUGE no fly zone in the middle of lake michigan,
[01:31] <WB9SBD-NSS> http://www.maddyhome.com/ctr/index.html?z=9&ll=43.71354951931429,-87.308349609375
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[01:32] <natrium42> WB9SBD-NSS: nice, you are pretty close to me
[01:33] <SpeedEvil> Quite a lot in the lakes actually
[01:33] <nv1k> yeah
[01:33] <W0OTM-iPad> Yoyo
[01:33] <nv1k> w/b W0OTM
[01:33] <W0OTM-iPad> Thx
[01:33] <W0OTM-iPad> Had to sync
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[01:34] <SpeedEvil> Oh -right.
[01:34] <SpeedEvil> I just zoomed out.
[01:34] <natrium42> deleted buggy points, refresh
[01:34] <SpeedEvil> I diddn't realise they were quite that big!
[01:35] <WB9SBD-NSS> I wonder what the three are in northwest Iowa are all about,,, ya might want to check into them, it may make it easier for ya.
[01:35] <nv1k> could be a practice area for Ft Dodge
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[01:36] <nv1k> Nat Guard base
[01:37] <WB9SBD-NSS> natrium where r u?
[01:38] <natrium42> http://maps.google.ca/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=waterloo,+on&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Waterloo,+Waterloo+Regional+Municipality,+Ontario&ll=43.484812,-80.529785&spn=14.598948,17.006836&z=6
[01:38] <natrium42> surrounded by lakes :D
[01:39] Action: natrium42 hugs launch predictor
[01:40] <creis> Actually the MOA's by Ft Dodge are for the National Gaurd fighters out of Sioux Falls, SD
[01:40] <WB9SBD-NSS> 5 to 6 hundred km itt looks
[01:41] <WB9SBD-NSS> hey don't forget to drop me that e mail.
[01:41] <natrium42> k, will do
[01:45] <nv1k> already did
[01:45] Nick change: DR_dsp_hw -> DagoRed
[01:50] <WB9SBD-NSS> yup
[01:50] Action: nv1k meow
[01:53] <WB9SBD-NSS> meow meow
[01:53] <nv1k> stupid studying is keeping me from important things
[01:54] <natrium42> haha
[01:55] <nv1k> this class sucks, zero pressure simulations are much more relevant lol
[01:55] <WB9SBD-NSS> what classis it?
[01:55] <SpeedEvil> What're you supposed to be studying?
[01:56] <nv1k> dynamics
[01:56] <DagoRed> At least it's not DSP homework.
[01:56] <nv1k> i wouldn't mind the dsp
[01:56] <DagoRed> Not this part of it.
[01:57] <nv1k> dynamics is just busywork^3
[01:57] <DagoRed> Does anyone knows what causes a zero at the origin in a z trasnform?
[01:58] <nv1k> midgets with hammers?
[01:58] <DagoRed> I wish.
[02:00] <nv1k> that balloon is going to be a fun recovery
[02:00] <WB9SBD-NSS> I gotta run dudes, have fun and take care
[02:00] <natrium42> later WB9SBD-NSS
[02:00] <WB9SBD-NSS> Joe WB9SBD & Near Space Sciences
[02:00] <natrium42> has been nice to chat
[02:01] <SpeedEvil> Good luck
[02:01] <nv1k> adios
[02:02] <natrium42> arividerci
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[02:04] <natrium42> those buggy positions are weird
[02:04] <natrium42> it seems that the gps is acting up sometimes
[02:04] <nv1k> know anything about the tumble of the payload?
[02:06] <natrium42> what do you mean?
[02:07] <nv1k> is it tumbling strangely and loosing clear view of sky
[02:08] <natrium42> ah, i think gps would still work
[02:08] <natrium42> horizon is very large
[02:09] Action: natrium42 prefers to use omnidirectional gps antennas, though (geohelix)
[02:09] <nv1k> yeah we do too
[02:09] <nv1k> but on some of the smaller payloads they would tumble quite a bit and the ground plane gets in the way
[02:10] <natrium42> gps chipsets are so sensitive nowadays
[02:10] <natrium42> did you ever lose signal?
[02:10] <nv1k> yes
[02:11] <nv1k> only when there was a significant amount of the ground plane in the way
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[02:12] <natrium42> ah
[02:12] <nv1k> this was a tiny payload though
[02:14] <nv1k> oh my, its only 9pm and i'm dead
[02:14] <natrium42> :S
[02:14] <nv1k> must be all this diff eq
[02:14] <natrium42> university is serious business
[02:15] <nv1k> serious about the wrong things
[02:15] <nv1k> but yes
[02:18] Action: DagoRed nods
[02:18] <natrium42> are you in undergrad or grad?
[02:19] <DagoRed> nv1k is undergrad.
[02:19] <nv1k> for now
[02:19] <natrium42> what program?
[02:20] <nv1k> aerospace engineering w/ computer science minor
[02:20] <natrium42> cool
[02:20] <nv1k> debating between aerE and engineering mechanics graduate school
[02:20] <DagoRed> He's our lab manager.
[02:20] <natrium42> i wanted to do that, but they didn't take me :/
[02:21] <DagoRed> Heh, it was easy for me to get into grad school. Nerv racking on the timing though.
[02:21] Action: natrium42 is doing masters in CS
[02:21] <DagoRed> Nice.
[02:22] <DagoRed> I went from EE undergrad to AerE grad. and pushed for Ph. D in engineering mechanics.
[02:22] <nv1k> woot CS
[02:23] <natrium42> CS is too dry, engineering sounds more fun
[02:24] <DagoRed> natrium42: It's like math, just louder.
[02:41] <nv1k> on the ground yet?
[02:42] <natrium42> looks like it
[02:43] <Darkside> DagoRed: :D
[02:44] <Darkside> wondermark ftw
[02:44] <DagoRed> hehe
[02:45] <natrium42> the altitude graph looks... interesting
[02:45] <natrium42> almost like a parabola
[02:45] <DagoRed> http://gilesbowkett.blogspot.com/2010/06/its-like-math-but-louder.html
[02:46] <DagoRed> That's it Darkside
[02:46] <Darkside> mm
[02:46] <Darkside> i hope i get into postgrad resarch
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[02:47] <natrium42> lol
[02:47] <Darkside> my project supervisor has a few options that im interested in
[02:47] <DagoRed> go for it Darkside
[02:47] <Darkside> one is HF MIMO, for applications in oth radar
[02:48] <Darkside> the other is extending my project, and looking at designing high reliability data modes for nvis transmission
[02:48] <SpeedEvil> Using commercial transmitters is anothre interesting topic
[02:49] <SpeedEvil> How radar started of course.
[02:50] <Darkside> mm
[02:50] <Darkside> hf mimo could be fun
[02:50] <Darkside> making an experimental test setup will be a bitch tho
[02:51] <Darkside> you'd want the antennas a few wavelengths apart
[02:51] <Darkside> and at HF, you'll suddenly have a very large array of antennas...
[02:52] <Darkside> anyway, fun fun fun
[02:54] <SpeedEvil> Just steal a radio telescope
[02:54] <Darkside> wrong band lol
[02:54] <Darkside> anyway, first things first - need to get my class E amp working
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[02:58] <natrium42> gotta run off for a while
[02:58] <natrium42> later
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[06:56] <Laurenceb> hi
[07:03] <SpikeUK> Morning!
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[07:35] <m1x10> good morning
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[07:37] <SpikeUK> m1x10 - good morning!
[07:42] <m1x10> :)
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[10:10] <fsphil> nice altitude graph for wb8elk's flight last night
[10:12] <jonsowman> how did the iceland launch go?
[10:18] <Upu> well it didn't land in a volcano so that's good :)
[10:18] <m1x10> haha
[10:21] <fsphil> I didn't realise iceland was so big
[10:21] <Upu> it's a really odd place
[10:21] <Upu> alot of it you just can go "off road"
[10:22] <Upu> you would be hard pushed to walk on it, really sharp rocks
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[10:46] <rharrison> Did we get any snaps back from the Iceland venture?
[10:46] <rharrison> Website?
[10:55] <Upu> Hopefully soon
[10:55] <Upu> should make some stunning pics
[10:55] <fsphil> no word from them in a while
[10:56] <fsphil> I did find this though: http://arhab.blogspot.com/
[10:56] <fsphil> some folks seem to be doing trans-atlantic flights
[11:27] <rharrison> cool
[11:32] <fsphil> no updates since last year though
[11:32] <fsphil> they seem to be using oddly long lasting balloons
[11:34] <juxta> i remember seeing that mentioned in this channel last year sometime
[11:34] <juxta> when I was first looking into ballooning :)
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[13:56] <Darkside> hmm
[14:06] <juxta> evening Darkside
[14:06] <juxta> finished that battery isolator off for the carputer, woo
[14:09] <griffonbot> @dbsnyder: RT @WOKNSS: You will never see vista on any of our #ARHAB tracking computers. [http://twitter.com/dbsnyder/status/25028053869]
[14:09] <Darkside> cool juxta
[14:09] <Darkside> im getting closer and closer to a finished design for my hf transmitter
[14:09] <Darkside> still in prototype stages tho
[14:10] <Darkside> so its all on separate boards, linked with coax
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[14:17] <Stratisphere> hey all
[14:21] <Darkside> hmm, anyone here with any RF filter design experience?
[14:23] <fsphil> my hf antenna seems to be a pretty good attenuator :p
[14:25] <Darkside> lol
[14:25] <Darkside> http://lh6.ggpht.com/_6Fbe1pOKyOs/S8xFiXWoEXI/AAAAAAAADpw/gMF_iDXOZm0/s800/sparrow-DDS.jpg
[14:25] <Darkside> im wondering how to start analysing the filter just after the AD9835 in that schematic
[14:25] <Darkside> i've run some sims on it, it's a low pass filter with an 11MHz cutoff
[14:26] <Darkside> and its dropoff is stupidly fast
[14:27] <Randomskk> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_filter_topology
[14:27] <Randomskk> could be one of the vareients under passive there
[14:28] <Randomskk> the general thing is to reduce the entire circuit down to one thing
[14:28] <Randomskk> norten thevenin equivilents
[14:28] <Randomskk> admittedly that is kind of hard because of the grounds, I don't really know how that works. but it probably does
[14:29] <Darkside> it works really freaking well
[14:29] <Darkside> i built one today
[14:29] <Randomskk> I mean how you do the conversion
[14:29] <Darkside> hold on, i'll put up the frequency response
[14:29] <Randomskk> norten equivilents are for two terminal networks
[14:29] <Randomskk> but having grounds gives you more terminals
[14:29] <Darkside> yes you cant really do an equivalent circuit for that
[14:30] <Randomskk> but you can probably start to work out cutoffs and q factors
[14:30] <Randomskk> check the wikipedia link and see if any of them match up
[14:31] <Darkside> yeah i have
[14:31] <Darkside> none do
[14:32] <Darkside> i understand the parallel LC resonators
[14:32] <Darkside> and i see a low pass filter there
[14:32] <Darkside> http://imgur.com/ItNeX.png
[14:32] <Darkside> check that out
[14:33] <Darkside> the -16dB insertion loss you see there isn't quite what happens, its more of a result from altium being weird when simulating
[14:33] <Darkside> but you can see the ridiculously fast dropoff
[14:35] <Randomskk> that is crazy fast
[14:35] <Randomskk> comes up again quite fast too though?
[14:35] <Darkside> but only to -55dB
[14:35] <Randomskk> true
[14:35] <Darkside> which is more than enough
[14:36] <Randomskk> looks like it might be a lpf and a notch on 11mhz or such
[14:36] <Darkside> ACMA regs are all spurious emissions should be -30dB down
[14:36] <Darkside> yeah possibly
[14:36] <Randomskk> the lpf and the notch overlapping just after the cutoff would give that very sharp drop
[14:36] <Darkside> yeah
[14:37] <Randomskk> then the notch comes up again and just the lpf brings the rest quite far down
[14:37] <Randomskk> if you were expecting a lot of noise just above the cutoff that'd make sense
[14:37] <Darkside> 2nd harmonic of the fundamental
[14:37] <Randomskk> but it's not exactly a simple filter design
[14:37] <Darkside> with a DDS VFO you'll get harmonics
[14:37] <Randomskk> yea
[14:38] <Darkside> that filter will work really well for 40m
[14:38] <SpeedEvil> unless you are exactly at an integer multiple of the input clock, it won't be simple harmonics
[14:38] <Darkside> well you get clock feedthrough, and not much else tbh
[14:39] <Darkside> and you can get rid of the clock feedthrough with a relatively simple LPF
[14:39] <Darkside> my DDS is clocked at 50MHz
[14:39] <Darkside> still, i was testing it today, and it works very nicelt
[14:39] <Darkside> i might make some alternative filters for different bands, mainly 80m, and the 13MHz ISM band
[14:50] <Darkside> Randomskk: the parallel LC resonant bits have a resonant frequency of 18.67MHz
[14:50] <Darkside> right where that notch is
[14:51] <Randomskk> seems plausible then
[14:51] <Darkside> mm
[14:51] <Darkside> 2 of them..
[14:52] <Darkside> and its possible the standard pi arrangement is acting as the low pass filter
[14:52] <Darkside> still, its working very nicely
[14:52] <Darkside> i'll keep it for 40m operation
[14:53] <Darkside> and make another one for 80m
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[15:00] <Laurence_> hi
[15:01] Nick change: Laurence_ -> Laurenceb
[15:03] <SpeedEvil> i
[15:05] <Laurenceb> almost got the usb dongle layed out
[15:06] <Laurenceb> going with some sc70 dual fets and smd usb plug shoul solve the issues
[15:07] <Stratisphere> hey guys, planning a HAB project for the school I work at. I've been reading and researching over the last few months and came to the conclusion of using the xtend 900Mhz kit to transmit the data live. I've just realised today that thats illegal to use in the UK (I knew there were differenced but grrrrrr)
[15:08] <Stratisphere> so it looks like I'll be going down the 440mhz route, any tips on if thats the best way to go?
[15:08] <Laurenceb> yep
[15:08] <Laurenceb> cant use 900mhz
[15:08] <Laurenceb> 434 is best bet]
[15:08] <Stratisphere> ok cool
[15:08] <Stratisphere> it's cheaper too isnt it?
[15:08] <Laurenceb> hmm...
[15:09] <Stratisphere> i mean, I have a scanner which can pickup the 430-440 range so I got the receiving end sorted
[15:10] <Stratisphere> it's just the transmitter end which I was gunna get the ntx2
[15:10] <Stratisphere> obviously im simplifying things here lol I know there's more kit involved
[15:10] <Laurenceb> yes
[15:10] <Stratisphere> cool
[15:10] <Stratisphere> i just wanted to get some kinda confirmation im now headin in the right direction lol
[15:11] <Stratisphere> something which would be awesome but Im not sure really if it is possible (still researching) is transmitting live video or even transmitting pictures
[15:11] <fsphil> can your scanner handle side-band (SSB) signals?
[15:11] <Stratisphere> yes
[15:11] <fsphil> sweet - what model? I'm curious now :)
[15:12] <Stratisphere> lol to be honest, it's my granddad's scanner and he's told me it does
[15:12] <Stratisphere> however... i'll have it tomorrow so if you're around I can tell you then lol
[15:13] <Laurenceb> http://www.sanslogic.co.uk/images/warning-xp.png
[15:13] <Laurenceb> lol
[15:14] <Stratisphere> the ukhas site says video should be in the 2.4-2.4835Ghz range. what would be involved in transmitting the kinda ranges involved with a freq that high?
[15:14] <Stratisphere> lol Laurenceb
[15:18] <Stratisphere> any ideas on the video transmissions?
[15:21] <russss> have we done any video transmissions?
[15:21] <fsphil> massive antenna
[15:21] <russss> yeah, you need serious gain on your receive side
[15:21] <russss> 2.4GHz is limited to 70mW (IIRC) license-free
[15:22] <Stratisphere> hmm
[15:25] <fsphil> it's worse than that according to wikipedia: "the UK market only permits a 10 mW EIRP limit"
[15:26] <russss> oh yes, that's right
[15:26] <Stratisphere> lol
[15:26] <Stratisphere> so i'd need a bigass receiver
[15:26] <fsphil> a big satellite dish
[15:26] <russss> I'm just trying to work out how big
[15:27] <Stratisphere> Hmm
[15:27] <russss> but the answer is probably "unfeasibly"
[15:28] <Stratisphere> sorry for the amateur question lol... how directional is a dish? I mean is it as directional (or not) as a yagi?
[15:28] <russss> more, I think usually
[15:29] <Stratisphere> oky cool, well i think i've leave the video for the first flight then :)
[15:29] <Stratisphere> get the basics sorted! :D
[15:29] <russss> yes, probably worth it
[15:29] <Stratisphere> Ok, one last question if you guys dont mind
[15:30] <russss> (I get 40km of 2.4GHz FSPL as 363dB, but that can't be right, surely?)
[15:30] <Darkside> it could be..
[15:30] <Darkside> actually
[15:30] <Darkside> no
[15:30] <Darkside> lol
[15:30] <Darkside> friis?
[15:31] <Stratisphere> how many people are usually listening in to the 440 range for ukhas data. I mean, if we lose contact, could we rely on the data being picked up elsewhere and viewing the data on the tracker?
[15:31] <russss> Stratisphere: absolutely yes
[15:31] <russss> we've had 30 people on a good day I think
[15:31] <Stratisphere> awesome
[15:31] <fsphil> just give a few days warning
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[15:31] <russss> yeah, as long as you give enough notice people will be falling over themselves to receive it :P
[15:31] <Darkside> russss: should be 132dB loss
[15:32] <russss> ah, that's a bit more sensible
[15:32] <Stratisphere> to I guess technically assuming I had a decent net connection and alot of cake to send people I wouldnt even need a receiver setup?
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[15:32] <Darkside> you'll want one though
[15:32] <Stratisphere> yeh
[15:32] <Darkside> especially to track the balloon
[15:32] <russss> I was doing 20lg(40) + 20lg(2400) + 33 on google
[15:32] <fsphil> especially at the last few km of decent
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[15:32] <Stratisphere> yeh
[15:32] <Stratisphere> cool
[15:33] <russss> dude! google's broken
[15:33] <fsphil> end of the world!!
[15:33] <russss> wolframalpha gets it right
[15:33] <russss> wtf
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[15:33] <russss> http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=20lg(40)+%2B+20lg(2400)+%2B+33
[15:33] <russss> http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=+20lg(40)+%2B+20lg(2400)+%2B+33+
[15:33] <Stratisphere> well, we're adding a whole host of sensors to this project as it's a science extension thing so hopefully it should be of some interest to others aswell :)
[15:34] <Stratisphere> righto guys, hometime. (plus side of working in a school :D)
[15:34] <Stratisphere> thanks for your help guys
[15:35] <Stratisphere> no doubt i'll be around again :P
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[15:37] <russss> google thinks lg() means log2
[15:37] <russss> which is a load of crap
[15:38] <Darkside> ok, nn all
[15:38] <Darkside> 1am here..
[15:38] <russss> anyhow, yeah, 132dB of antenna gain and receiver sensitivity. I dunno if that's doable
[15:39] <Darkside> its doable
[15:39] <Darkside> but you'd be pusing it
[15:39] <Darkside> pushing it*
[15:39] <Darkside> also depends on the receiver sensitivity
[15:40] <Darkside> say you have a 24dB antenna, thats 108db loss then
[15:40] <russss> it would be awesome to get a couple megabits from 40km up, but my gut says that's optimistic to foolish with 10mW transmit power.
[15:40] <Darkside> ahh
[15:40] <Darkside> 10mw :/
[15:40] <Darkside> ok say you use 100mW
[15:40] <Darkside> 20dBm
[15:41] <Darkside> -88dBm at the receive antenna, with no transmit antenna gain
[15:41] <russss> yep. 10mW EIRP, in fact, is the legal limit. Which means you can't even boost it with transmit antenna gain
[15:41] <Darkside> wha
[15:41] <Darkside> is this 2.4GHz in general?
[15:41] <Darkside> in australia we can do half a watt EIRP on 2.4GHz
[15:42] <russss> yes, I believe so
[15:42] <Darkside> very weird...
[15:42] <Darkside> where is this?
[15:42] <russss> UK
[15:42] <russss> "However, the UK market only permits a 10 mW EIRP limit" from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_interference_at_2.4_GHz
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[15:43] <fsphil> hmm,, my big 2.4ghz vertical might be slightly not allowed
[15:43] <fsphil> sssshhh
[15:43] <russss> we can use 1W EIRP on 5.4-5.7GHz apparently
[15:44] <russss> 802.11a bands. Less interference too
[15:44] <russss> more FSPL though. But your increase in tx power probably outweighs that.
[15:45] <Darkside> ok for telecommand and telemetry (which incudes wifi) we can do 1W
[15:45] <Darkside> 1W EIRP that is
[15:45] <russss> nice. The UK sucks for unlicensed wireless
[15:45] <Darkside> thats for the 2.4GHz and 5GHz bands
[15:46] <Darkside> ooh, can even do 2W EIRP in some parts of the 5GHz band
[15:46] <russss> we can do 4W EIRP in one part of the 5GHz band but it's fixed installations only and requires a license.
[15:48] <russss> I think getting some decent data rates to 40km altitude would be pretty fun to do.
[15:48] <fsphil> what would you do with it?
[15:49] <russss> live video would be fun
[15:49] <Darkside> id say lock it to slow speed BPSK or something
[15:49] <Darkside> dont let it try and automatically change data rates
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[15:49] <fsphil> good idea
[15:49] <Darkside> also is there a hard distance limit to wifi?
[15:50] <Darkside> i.e. due to timing
[15:50] <russss> hmm. There is, yes.
[15:50] <SpeedEvil> no.
[15:50] <SpeedEvil> not ad-hoc
[15:50] <SpeedEvil> AIUI
[15:50] <russss> o rly
[15:50] <russss> you can tune it on some of the more hackable radios.
[15:50] <SpeedEvil> in principle you can do ad-hoc from the moon.
[15:50] <russss> like anything running DD-WRT
[15:50] <russss> moonbounce wifi pls
[15:50] <russss> (how big a dish would you need for *that*)
[15:51] <SpeedEvil> won't work without an antenna or high-gain reflector
[15:51] <SpeedEvil> the moon is too smeary for it to work
[15:51] <Darkside> fuuuuu i need to sleep
[15:51] <Darkside> nn
[15:51] <Darkside> got to get this bloody amp working tomorrow...
[15:54] <earthshine> evening
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[16:05] <russss> ISS transmits 50Mbps directly to the ground on Ku-band (12-16GHz). Not sure how big their receiving antennas are though
[16:08] <fsphil> probably big tx power too
[16:09] <russss> they don't have a massive power budget there, but I guess it's a couple tens of watts
[16:10] <fsphil> they might even have a steerable high gain dish, the station is a pretty stable platform
[16:10] <russss> yes, I believe it is steerable
[16:11] <fsphil> high gain on both sides would allow for fairly low power
[16:28] <SpeedEvil> 5GHz - 802.11a - may work better
[16:28] <SpeedEvil> but pretty much requires steerable
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[16:33] <russss> yeah I mentioned that earlier
[16:33] <russss> you have 1W EIRP on the 5.4-5.7GHz segment of that band
[16:36] <SpeedEvil> ah
[16:37] <SpeedEvil> You mean with a licence?
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[16:43] <russss> SpeedEvil: I believe not!
[16:43] <SpeedEvil> hmm
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[16:44] <russss> http://www.solwise.co.uk/wireless-5.htm
[16:44] <SpeedEvil> That's a quite modest dish though I guess.
[16:44] <SpeedEvil> at say 30mW outr
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[17:14] <m1x10> When using a regulator, is it good to put decoupling capacitors?
[17:17] <SpeedEvil> yes.
[17:17] <SpeedEvil> Almost all regulators requirethem.
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[17:25] <natrium42> o/
[17:25] <natrium42> sYx66, we should build a yagi antenna
[17:25] <natrium42> would be nice to do a launch while the weather is good
[17:26] <m1x10> thx SpeedEvil
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[18:17] <Laurenceb> hi
[18:18] <natrium42> hello laurence
[18:18] <Laurenceb> eh-oh
[18:19] <natrium42> uh oh
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[18:28] <jcoxon> evening
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[18:29] <W0OTM-iPad> Howdy
[18:29] <W0OTM-iPad> How do I register my nick
[18:30] <natrium42> /ns help
[18:30] <natrium42> /msg NickServ register nick you@email.com
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[18:36] <W0OTM-iPad> Thx
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[19:01] <fsphil> hmm, my front usb ports don't give out enough power to run a small hdd
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[19:24] <m1x10> I wonder if its possible to create power from sound waves
[19:24] <m1x10> :p
[19:27] <fsphil> the noise coming out of this little hdd could probably power a fair bit :)
[19:28] <m1x10> from voice waves
[19:28] <m1x10> speaking
[19:28] <m1x10> i red an article on slashdot about it
[19:28] <fsphil> well yea a little, that's how microphones work
[19:28] <fsphil> some of them anyway
[19:28] <SpeedEvil> slashdot are asshats.
[19:29] <SpeedEvil> The number of people that can work a calculator are tiny.
[19:29] <m1x10> re-power the battery while speaking
[19:29] <m1x10> but the idea is brilliant
[19:29] <m1x10> not the implementation though :)
[19:29] <SpeedEvil> No, i's not.
[19:30] <m1x10> hehe
[19:30] <SpeedEvil> A brilliant idea has to be realisable, or it's not brilliant.
[19:30] <SpeedEvil> If I decide to save time by levitating to work each morning, that's only a brilliant idea if I can actually levitate.
[19:32] <SpeedEvil> Conversation at the mouths delta-p is about .5Pa.
[19:32] <m1x10> Also, I heard another story, powering devices by catching radiowave power from the air !
[19:33] <SpeedEvil> With a 1mm^3 volume displaced by a piston, that's about 10^-9J/cycle.
[19:33] <SpeedEvil> At 400Hz say - that's on the order of half a microwatt.
[19:34] <SpeedEvil> An active phone will be using a few hundred milliwatts minimum.
[19:39] <m1x10> :p
[19:46] <m1x10> I just finished my Arduino Hab mobo schematic :)
[19:51] <fsphil> yay!
[19:51] <fsphil> totally ot: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUmrddqU4N4
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[20:18] <m1x10> good night all
[20:18] <m1x10> !
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[20:43] <Dadi> hi guys and thanks for the help last saturday
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[20:43] <Dadi> the launch on sunday went great
[20:43] <Dadi> recovered payload and got amazing pictures
[20:44] <Dadi> burst at 32.3km
[20:44] <Upu> was this the iceland one ?
[20:44] <Dadi> yes
[20:44] <Upu> gief pix
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[20:45] <Upu> :)
[20:46] <fsphil> great news .. the tracking worked well for most of the flight
[20:47] <Upu> have you had chance to put the pictures up yet ?
[20:47] <Dadi> haven't put pictures up yet, but there are 2 videos on youtube
[20:47] <Upu> link ?
[20:47] <Dadi> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBkDVdLzfy8
[20:48] <Upu> wow
[20:48] <Dadi> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zm9gaHNKDLg
[20:48] <Upu> what camera was that ?
[20:49] <Dadi> A480
[20:49] <Upu> ok doing the video as well kk
[20:50] <Upu> amazing
[20:50] <Upu> grats
[20:50] <Dadi> thanks
[20:50] <Upu> I love iceland great place
[20:51] <fsphil> wow that's brilliant
[20:52] <fsphil> tell you what, that mountain beside the launch site looks so much bigger in real life - compared to google maps
[20:52] <Upu> yeah that would make a hell of sledge track in winter
[20:52] <Dadi> hehe
[20:53] <Upu> can't wait to see the pictures
[20:53] <Upu> got any of the payload and computer etc ?
[20:54] <Dadi> none up yet
[20:54] <jcoxon> Dadi, nice work
[20:54] <Dadi> we'll make a flickr page and put them up soon
[20:54] <jcoxon> looks amazing
[20:54] <Dadi> thanks
[20:54] <Dadi> and that realtime tracking was just brilliant!
[20:54] <Dadi> prediction I mean
[20:55] <jcoxon> yeah - need another tracker station
[20:55] <Upu> how close was it ?
[20:55] <Upu> wish we could have another UK launch
[20:55] <Upu> so I could test my stuff :)
[20:55] <jcoxon> Upu, we will
[20:55] <Dadi> the balloon followed the track almost exactly
[20:55] <jcoxon> soon
[20:55] <Upu> smart :)
[20:55] <jcoxon> Dadi, i'll be in Iceland in 10 days time
[20:55] <jcoxon> :-p
[20:56] <Upu> Been there before jcoxon ?
[20:56] <jcoxon> nope
[20:57] <jcoxon> just going for a long weekend
[20:57] <Upu> its fantastic amazing extremes of everything
[20:57] <jcoxon> really looking forward to it
[20:57] <Dadi> nice
[20:57] <Upu> have a drive out and you'll soon see why Dadi has big kahunahs for launching :)
[20:57] <Upu> we took one of those Arctic Trucks out to a glacier
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[20:58] <Upu> found some bits of B52 bomber
[20:58] <Dadi> know which one?
[20:58] <Dadi> you can see a couple of glaciers in one of those youtube videos
[20:59] <Upu> no not sure tbh
[20:59] <Upu> http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/upuaut/200409Iceland#5379093899336421186
[20:59] <Upu> fancy landing there ? :)
[20:59] <Dadi> that would be a pain
[21:00] <Dadi> luckily ours landed about a 100m from a road
[21:00] <Upu> yeah
[21:00] <Dadi> one of the last roads for a long way too :p
[21:05] <earthshine> evening
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