highaltitude.log.20100919

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[02:42] <Darkside> Control Systems Joke: A plane is flying from Poland to France. While on the landing path over Paris, the captain tells the passengers that the Eiffel tower is visible to the right of the plane. All the passengers move to see, and the plane becomes unbalanced and crashes.
[02:42] <Darkside> The cause of the crash is investigated, and the cause was found to be:
[02:42] <Darkside> Too many poles on the right hand side of the plane.
[02:48] <DagoRed> Darkside: Old joke. But so true.
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[03:04] <Darkside> :P
[03:05] <Darkside> hey juxta
[03:05] <juxta> heya Darkside
[03:05] <Darkside> have you ever had any problems with the internal fuse in your 706MKIIG?
[03:06] <juxta> neg, mine has been good
[03:06] <juxta> only issue i've had with is it when input voltage gets low
[03:06] <Darkside> ok
[03:06] <juxta> it sounds like a relay doesnt quite see enough juice to stay closed then, because it starts oscillating
[03:07] <Randomskk> my ic7000 also does funny things when on low voltage
[03:07] <Randomskk> in the way of nasty clicky noises
[03:09] <juxta> yeah thats the one, hehe
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[07:57] <jcoxon> morning all
[08:01] <jcoxon> bbiab
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[08:06] <rjharrison> moring all is dadi sorted for his flight now
[08:08] <rjharrison> I'm at a radio rally this morning. I have a table to show off the icarus project
[08:09] <rjharrison> Other than that I should be back later
[08:11] <DagoRed> icarus project?
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[08:17] #highaltitude: mode change '+o jcoxon' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
[08:23] Topic changed on #highaltitude by jcoxon!jcoxon@host81-153-116-135.range81-153.btcentralplus.com: Welcome to #highaltitude - discuss anything to do with high altitude projects (balloons, gliders, etc) www.ukhas.org.uk, Icelandic launch 19/9/10 12:00UTC http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[08:26] Topic changed on #highaltitude by jcoxon!jcoxon@host81-153-116-135.range81-153.btcentralplus.com: Welcome to #highaltitude - discuss anything to do with high altitude projects (balloons, gliders, etc) www.ukhas.org.uk, voyeurv launch Iceland 19/9/10 12:00UTC http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[08:26] <rjharrison> Hey jcoxon
[08:27] <rjharrison> is didi all set for launch today
[08:28] <rjharrison> It's about time we all did some launches
[08:28] <rjharrison> I have three on the cards for ASAP launches
[08:29] <jcoxon> hehe
[08:29] <rjharrison> Variations on photographic launches though the internal pressure sensor is going up
[08:29] <jcoxon> yeah apparently - tested the map yesterday so ready to roll
[08:29] <jcoxon> :-)
[08:29] <rjharrison> Cool
[08:29] <rjharrison> I'll look into the upper case issue
[08:30] <jcoxon> its getting quite a bit of use these days
[08:30] <m1x10> Hi all !
[08:30] <jcoxon> picking up in the states
[08:31] <jcoxon> yeah
[08:31] <jcoxon> hi m1x10
[08:35] <m1x10> Yestarday I got the prodigy experience :)
[08:35] <Darkside> oh?
[08:35] <jcoxon> i should add a function to zeusbot which detects a new telem string say over 1500m and pings the channel
[08:35] <m1x10> Keith is f** short !
[08:35] <Darkside> lol
[08:36] <Darkside> i never got to see the prodigy when they came to adelaide :(
[08:36] <jcoxon> so that we know when things have launched
[08:37] <rjharrison> jcoxon, the guys (i'm refraining from calling them boys) are getting on well with the planning of the new system
[08:38] <jcoxon> yeah they seem to have it undercontrol
[08:38] <jcoxon> much better then us :-p
[08:38] <rjharrison> Not sure I would use python but then what do I know and I have very little free time for further deveopment. I would rather be doing a few launches
[08:38] <jcoxon> yeah
[08:38] <rjharrison> jcoxon, oh to have free time again and nothing to do ..
[08:39] <jcoxon> i'm keeping an eye on dl-fldigi still
[08:39] <jcoxon> hoping to do a new release soon
[08:39] <m1x10> Darkside they came in my city for the first time, and propably they wont come again. So I went. My brother paid my ticket. So i didnt have a reason not to go :P
[08:39] <rjharrison> jcoxon, I just want out working system on habhub and then I'm happy to sit back for a bit and see where it goes
[08:40] <rjharrison> There is alot of stuff to do to get it back to where it is from a rewrite. But the new team have got a very good and clear plan
[08:40] <jcoxon> rjharrison, well steve and i are scheming a floater + hf radio flight
[08:40] <jcoxon> so that'll be relatively soon
[08:41] <rjharrison> Right I have to dash to radio rally to do HAB talk from 11:00-13:00
[08:41] <jcoxon> cool have fun
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[08:47] <fsphil> ah good haven't missed the Iceland launch
[08:50] <jcoxon> fsphil, tried to find an online radio in iceland to help out
[08:50] <fsphil> no luck?
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[08:51] <jcoxon> as i fear they'll need another stations
[08:51] <jcoxon> no nothing
[08:59] <fsphil> drat - there really is nothing even close
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[09:26] <juxta> hmm, how does one have 2 supply nets in eagle, say +5v and +12v?
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[09:59] <jcoxon> fsphil, you are probably the closest :-p
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[10:24] <fsphil> hehe, I doubt even going up the local mountain would help here
[10:26] <fsphil> maybe some freak highly persistent meteor scatter :)
[10:29] <jcoxon> hehe, ash cloud scatter
[10:54] <juxta> hey jcoxon, fsphil
[10:57] <fsphil> hiya juxta, how's things today?
[11:12] <juxta> hey fsphil, not too bad
[11:13] <juxta> hurrah for nice weather returning
[11:13] <juxta> slowly but surely
[11:13] <DanielRichman> that's evil.
[11:14] <juxta> you've had your turn, we want some summertime now ;p
[11:15] <DanielRichman> eeeh you get summer all year round
[11:15] <juxta> what's happening in iceland fsphil?
[11:15] <DanielRichman> we get about two weeks of summer spread over a couple of months
[11:16] <juxta> heh
[11:16] <juxta> we've had rain recently
[11:16] <juxta> a lot of rain by our standards too
[11:19] <juxta> DanielRichman, any chance you know how to do multiple supply nets in eagle?
[11:20] <fsphil> I wish I was in iceland today juxta :)
[11:20] <DanielRichman> Not 100% sure what you mean but if you use several of the little pointy-up arrows but with different values from supply 1 does that do what you want?
[11:21] <juxta> i'm not sure - I just assumed whatever I connected those to would all be linked together as one net, say 3v3
[11:21] <juxta> I want 2 separate nets - 5v and 12v
[11:21] <DanielRichman> well the arrows have values. I think stuff you join to a 5v arrow won't get connected to a 12v one
[11:22] <juxta> fsphil, yeah - there's a launch?
[11:22] <DanielRichman> yeah juxta have a look at this http://github.com/danielrichman/alien/blob/master/alien1/eagle/alien1.png
[11:22] <DanielRichman> note the 3v3 arrows and the 5v arrows
[11:23] <juxta> hmm. eagle tells me this part has no defineable value
[11:24] <juxta> ooh
[11:24] <juxta> actually
[11:24] <juxta> I see what you mean :)
[11:24] <juxta> thanks DanielRichman ;)
[11:24] <fsphil> there should be a launch today, but it's iffy if they'll have internet access to upload telemetry
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[12:06] <Darkside> DanielRichman: i managed to tune the code to work for dominoex8
[12:07] <DanielRichman> oooh, very nice
[12:07] <Darkside> and modified it to work with my signal generator
[12:07] <DanielRichman> did you just have to change the speed?
[12:07] <DanielRichman> oh, that's awesome :)
[12:07] <Darkside> yes, and the way it sets the output frequency
[12:07] <DanielRichman> so now you just need to transplant that into the sstv code and get cookies
[12:07] <Darkside> lol
[12:07] <Darkside> does the sstv code work with the NTX2?
[12:07] <DanielRichman> yeah
[12:08] <Darkside> oh man
[12:08] <Darkside> that means i can probably make it work with mine
[12:08] <DanielRichman> it works the same way as the domex code; just writing to that DAC variable to change the frequency
[12:08] <Darkside> cool
[12:08] <DanielRichman> it's a bit unfinished wrt timing
[12:09] <Darkside> heh
[12:09] <Darkside> i see you use the 2MHz clock on the xmega
[12:09] <Darkside> any reason why?
[12:09] <DanielRichman> that's the default
[12:09] <Darkside> heh
[12:09] <DanielRichman> in the final version I'll use 8MHz
[12:09] <Darkside> im using the 32MHz RC
[12:09] <DanielRichman> cool
[12:09] <DanielRichman> not very stable with temperature though?
[12:09] <Darkside> yeah
[12:10] <Darkside> which means for SSTV it wont work
[12:10] <Darkside> i was trying to use the 32KHz crystal on teh xplain board for timing, but couldnt get it to work
[12:10] <Darkside> right now all the code is using _delay_ms
[12:10] <Darkside> even dominoEX
[12:11] <Darkside> i just got rid of all the interrupt stuff
[12:13] <Darkside> ill work it back in, once i have my RF amp going
[12:13] <Darkside> thats currently my priority
[12:20] <DanielRichman> ahh, O
[12:20] <DanielRichman> *K
[12:21] <DanielRichman> yeah __delay_ms is evil
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[12:51] <Hiena> Blehh... Hates that soggy weather. Even with the forced ventilation and the fume hood, the workshop reeks within a few minutes mixing.
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[13:11] <greywolfdjc> Hello, I am new to high altitude balloon photography and have a few questions that I have not found answers for, if you wouldn't mind answering them.
[13:11] <greywolfdjc> 1) How long a cord is needed from the balloon to the parachute?
[13:11] <greywolfdjc> 2) Best method for tying off the balloon once filled?
[13:11] <greywolfdjc> 3) How do you know how much helium you have put into the balloon?
[13:11] <greywolfdjc> 4) Who to contact about using the Churchill launch site in Cambridge?
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[13:17] <SpeedEvil> 10-50m is common.
[13:17] <SpeedEvil> Unsure what's used.
[13:18] <SpeedEvil> Around a kilo of lift needs about 1m^3
[13:18] <rjharrison> greywolfdjc use the rule of 1/3rds
[13:18] <rjharrison> 2/3rds up the line tie the chute
[13:18] <rjharrison> at the end the balloon
[13:23] <jcoxon> no launch yet
[13:36] <greywolfdjc> Thanks SpeedEvil and rjharrison.
[13:42] <greywolfdjc> As a very keen amateur photographer I was wondering why a DSLR is not use more often with a wide lens. Is it purely on extra weight and cost?
[13:43] <jcoxon> greywolfdjc, risk really
[13:43] <jcoxon> lots of money goes to waste if it goes into the sea
[13:46] <greywolfdjc> Yeah thats true, just ive been eyeing up my old nikon d50 which just sits around.
[13:46] <SpeedEvil> When at high altitude, also you usually get enough air-blur that you can't really tell the difference between a DSLR and a point-and-shoot
[13:46] <SpeedEvil> Look at most of the at-altitude pictures - and you'll see that though they may be 8 or 12MP - there is almost no information at >1MP
[13:48] <jcoxon> greywolfdjc, once you'lve got a working telem system then its perhaps worth the risk
[13:51] <greywolfdjc> Thanks for the info.
[13:52] <jcoxon> ooo balloon on map
[13:56] <jcoxon> http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[13:58] <jcoxon> good flight path
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[13:59] <SpeedEvil> Does the tracker show a path for you - or are you entering in manually
[13:59] <jcoxon> i pulled the gfs data last night for them
[14:00] <SpeedEvil> ah
[14:00] <jcoxon> and so if there is a balloon flight in the deltas then it'll predict it
[14:47] <jcoxon> come on balloon - launch!
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[14:48] <Laurenceb> hi
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[14:56] <SpeedEvil> hi
[14:57] <SpeedEvil> Are the ism* gyros shipping?
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[15:00] <Laurenceb> itg?
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[15:01] <SpeedEvil> err - yes
[15:01] <SpeedEvil> I'm pondering things to add into my phone.
[15:01] <Laurenceb> yes, $10
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[15:02] <SpeedEvil> hmm.
[15:03] <SpeedEvil> Still wishing I could get thin sensors.
[15:03] <SpeedEvil> I'd love to be able to make a micro-sd card
[15:03] <SpeedEvil> But that would be hard.
[15:04] <SpeedEvil> It's insane that mag/accel/gyro has gone from maybe 60 quid last year to maybe 12 this
[15:05] <SpeedEvil> Volume kicking in.
[15:17] <Laurenceb> itg-3200 + lsm303dlh
[15:17] <Laurenceb> $10+$14 or so in single units
[15:19] <Laurenceb> remains to be seen if the hack to nice 1.8v off the itg to power the magno adc on the lsm works in practice
[15:19] <Laurenceb> otherwise you need an LDO as well
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[15:34] <Laurenceb> oh i worked out how to do that circular/linear polarized omni antenna thing
[15:34] <Laurenceb> use two ceramic chip ants on perpendicular sides of a pcb about 45mm square
[15:35] <Laurenceb> then use a microstrip coupler and 90degree delay line on the board - it only need about 70mm of line to get the 90degree phase lag
[15:35] <Laurenceb> also other tronics could sit in the middle
[15:38] <Laurenceb> two of these - http://uk.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=4352030
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[15:51] <SpeedEvil> hmm
[15:51] <SpeedEvil> Interesting
[15:52] <SpeedEvil> How efficient are the ants?
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[15:59] <fsphil> yay! the balloon has launched in iceland
[16:00] <SpeedEvil> :)
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[16:10] <Laurenceb> cool
[16:32] <SpeedEvil> hmm. Speaking of cool.
[16:32] <SpeedEvil> http://householdappliances.kelkoo.co.uk/p-freezers-145701/norfrost-c6aew-6088587#selectedTab=specs
[16:32] <SpeedEvil> Men are from mars, fridge freezers are from venus.
[16:32] <SpeedEvil> Daily Kwh 0.81 - yearly KWh - 189
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[17:28] <timbobel> guys anyone here
[17:28] <timbobel> i need my PCB's fast(=faster than the 3~4 weeks from batchpcb)
[17:28] <timbobel> how
[17:28] <Laurenceb> PW circuits
[17:32] <timbobel> thnaks
[17:32] <timbobel> any others?
[17:33] <timbobel> omg they dont have any clear pricing, i hate it when companies do that
[17:36] <Hiena> DIY?
[17:37] <Hiena> Toner transfer method works for single side boards.
[17:37] <Hiena> BTW, check the local companies. Most have express order which is 3 or 5 days.
[17:38] <timbobel> i am, but dutch hours are darn expensive
[17:38] <timbobel> but ill try the belgians ;)
[17:38] <timbobel> dont have a dremel either so its more expensive to drill myself, and that'll take ages.
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[17:43] <The-Compiler> timbobel: probably finding someone who has a dremel is easier/cheaper.
[17:44] <Laurenceb> http://i.imgur.com/deyi0.png
[17:44] <Laurenceb> grr wont fit
[17:44] <Laurenceb> need a smd usb plug i guess
[17:44] <The-Compiler> hmm, no signal from that icelandic balloon for a long time...
[17:44] <timbobel> thats a lof of stuff you need on there
[17:45] <timbobel> do you use an autorouter?
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[17:52] <The-Compiler> anyone here has even ordered a parachute from http://www.h-h-enterprises.com/ ?
[17:53] <The-Compiler> I mailed them asking about shipping to switzerland. Got an answer 3 hours later. I'm impressed so far, seeing it's a Sunday
[17:55] <BuffaloSouljah> secular, Godless culture, the Swiss.
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[18:04] <fsphil> always good to see progress
[18:06] <fsphil> iceland balloon is coming down!
[18:06] <SpeedEvil> Yup.
[18:06] <SpeedEvil> Fortunately, it looks like it's coming down in a clear white bit, far from any roads.
[18:06] <SpeedEvil> Which looks on the map easy to get to.
[18:06] <SpeedEvil> :)
[18:06] <fsphil> everything looks easier on a map ;-)
[18:07] <SpeedEvil> Actually dead on a river ATM
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[18:07] <jcoxon> evening
[18:07] <jcoxon> cool iceland flight
[18:07] <SpeedEvil> Evening.
[18:07] <SpeedEvil> yup.
[18:07] <jcoxon> recovered?
[18:07] <SpeedEvil> Latest prediction has it finding the only nearby river
[18:07] <SpeedEvil> 8km alt
[18:07] <SpeedEvil> 6.5
[18:08] <jcoxon> wb8elk is launching a pinhole floater this evening
[18:08] <jcoxon> thought might not work completely as its quite a small balloon
[18:08] <SpeedEvil> Interesting
[18:10] <fsphil> prediction has moved away from the river
[18:10] <fsphil> phew
[18:11] <jcoxon> oh is it still coming down?
[18:11] <fsphil> yep
[18:12] <SpeedEvil> landing in the next 15 mins
[18:12] <jcoxon> oh cool
[18:12] <The-Compiler> wait, the prediction is also live-updated?
[18:12] <jcoxon> yeah
[18:13] <The-Compiler> neat :)
[18:13] <The-Compiler> jcoxon: I bet I've seen your nick somewhere else... rockbox?
[18:13] <jcoxon> The-Compiler, nope
[18:14] <The-Compiler> DSLinux? Ubuntu? Or I'm just mistaken. :p
[18:14] <jcoxon> along time ago i did some ipod-linux
[18:14] <jcoxon> oh and ubuntu back in the early day
[18:14] <jcoxon> s
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[18:15] <SpeedEvil> Neat.
[18:15] <SpeedEvil> In around 20 minutes, there is an iridium flare.
[18:15] <SpeedEvil> That - if I have the position right - I will not actually need to get out of bed to see.
[18:16] <SpeedEvil> Oh - and it's down already
[18:16] <SpeedEvil> That's a sharp descent at the end
[18:17] <timbobel> icelandic launch
[18:17] <SpeedEvil> Got to 3km, then damn near freefell.
[18:17] <timbobel> lol! didnt know!
[18:17] <jcoxon> SpeedEvil, closer to the road
[18:17] <SpeedEvil> -21m/s is quite fast.
[18:17] <timbobel> iceland still uws us, uk & nl, quite a few millions!
[18:17] <SpeedEvil> yeah - it is.
[18:17] <The-Compiler> is there any information about that balloon?
[18:18] <jcoxon> The-Compiler, it was an ntx2 434.650mhz 10mW transmitter
[18:18] <jcoxon> they'll come on the channel later i'm sure
[18:18] <fsphil> hope so
[18:18] <jcoxon> they were on yesterday to sort out the tracker
[18:18] <The-Compiler> hmm looking on the sattelite imagery it looks like it landed REALLY near a lake...
[18:18] <The-Compiler> errr
[18:18] <The-Compiler> river
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[19:43] <W0OTM-iPad> Hi
[19:43] <jcoxon> hey W0OTM
[19:44] <W0OTM-iPad> Just bought an iPad
[19:45] <W0OTM-iPad> Love it!
[19:45] <jcoxon> hehe
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[19:58] <jcoxon> DagoRed, get that altitude attempt in the air in the end?
[19:59] <DagoRed> jcoxon: no.... it's pissing us off.
[19:59] <DagoRed> madEngineer can give you details on that one.
[19:59] <jcoxon> poor weather?
[19:59] <DagoRed> Amongst other things.
[20:00] <madEngineer> hmmm?
[20:00] Nick change: madEngineer -> nv1k
[20:00] <nv1k> what dago?
[20:00] <DagoRed> nv1k: jcoxon wanted to know about the high altitude record
[20:01] <jcoxon> attempt
[20:01] <jcoxon> just wondered if you had launched yet
[20:01] <nv1k> currently raining, surface winds were >10mph most of the weekend
[20:01] <jcoxon> yuk
[20:01] <nv1k> *hopefully* next weekend
[20:02] <nv1k> can't wait too much longer or it will be descending at night... heh
[20:02] <DagoRed> nv1k: Unless we end up predicting being in restricted air space again....
[20:03] <nv1k> someone is saying that balloons should be banned in #hamradio....
[20:04] <jcoxon> nv1k, oh thats a fun debate
[20:04] <jcoxon> not
[20:04] <DagoRed> wtf
[20:04] <nv1k> yeah...
[20:04] <nv1k> typical ignorance
[20:05] <nv1k> "But it will get sucked into an airplane engine!"
[20:06] <DagoRed> the potential is there
[20:06] <nv1k> # of birds in the air >> # of balloons in the air
[20:06] <nv1k> and bird injestion has happened before and is usually a non-incident
[20:07] <nv1k> only time an encounter is serious is on landing
[20:07] <nv1k> and we avoid those areas
[20:07] <nv1k> so its a non-issue
[20:08] <jcoxon> exactly
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[20:08] <jgc> Evening
[20:08] <nv1k> And as a pilot, if you get hit by a balloon, you deserve w/e happens to you
[20:08] <jcoxon> nv1k, perhaps not that far...
[20:08] <nv1k> also, my studying is getting in the way of my learning...
[20:08] <jcoxon> hi jgc
[20:08] Nick change: jgc -> Guest82113
[20:09] <Guest82113> Whoops jgc is not Guest82113 :-)
[20:09] <Guest82113> Hi, James. Long time since the Halo5 launch this summer
[20:10] <jcoxon> Guest82113, indeed
[20:10] <jcoxon> hows your project coming along
[20:10] <jcoxon> been following on twitter
[20:10] <Guest82113> It's coming along when I have time to work on it (which is hours snatched here and there)
[20:10] <jcoxon> yeah know the feeling
[20:11] <nv1k> who doesn't
[20:11] <Guest82113> But at least I am working on it. Next thing I'm working on is the GSM/GPS backup system
[20:12] Nick change: Guest82113 -> JohnGC
[20:12] <JohnGC> Hmm. Probably ought to use a real IRC client
[20:12] <JohnGC> What are you working on these days?
[20:13] <jcoxon> JohnGC, oh BallastHalo6
[20:13] <jcoxon> but am actually working so rarely get a chance
[20:13] <JohnGC> You have graduated, right? So, like the rest of us you have to work for a living :-)
[20:14] <jcoxon> yes
[20:14] <jcoxon> indeed i have
[20:14] <nv1k> heh
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[20:15] <JohnGC> What's the plan for 6?
[20:16] <jcoxon> to truely get it working, make it smaller and lighter
[20:17] <JohnGC> I assume the balloon burst on 5 when it flew too high, is that right?
[20:17] <jcoxon> yeah
[20:17] <jcoxon> so it floated, we dropped ballast and then it went up
[20:18] <jcoxon> but as the sensor failed it dumped all the ballas
[20:18] <jcoxon> t
[20:18] <nv1k> is this from a standard balloon?
[20:18] <jcoxon> rather then a small amount
[20:18] <jcoxon> nv1k, yes
[20:18] <nv1k> we have not attempted a ballast flight in several years
[20:18] <JohnGC> What was the sensor? IIRC you were using a peristaltic pump to let out the ballast
[20:19] <nv1k> i'm curious what you used as ballast?
[20:19] <jcoxon> yeah i was using a photogate to measure rotation
[20:19] <jcoxon> but the sensor got too cold it seems
[20:19] <jcoxon> and stopped measuring
[20:19] <nv1k> were you using straight water or something else?
[20:19] <JohnGC> Ah. I wonder if you'd be better off with something using the Hall Effect
[20:20] <jcoxon> nv1k, ethanol/methanol
[20:20] <jcoxon> JohnGC, yeah was going to do hall sensor + microswitch
[20:20] <jcoxon> nv1k, external tank - no problems with it
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[20:21] <JohnGC> Hall effect stuff is pretty robust. I used some in a factory environment where there was all sorts of nasty stuff going on. I'd imagine they have good low temp. characteristics.
[20:21] <nv1k> jcoxon, yeah we have done the same
[20:21] <jcoxon> JohnGC, the only issue is that the pump itself is well sealed
[20:21] <jcoxon> so will need an axle as such
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[20:23] <JohnGC> Does no one make such a pump with a built in feedback mechanism?
[20:23] <jcoxon> oh i'm sure tehy do
[20:23] <jcoxon> but not at the sort of cost i'm looking at
[20:23] <jcoxon> right bbiab
[20:23] <jcoxon> food
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[20:38] <jcoxon> back
[20:40] <nv1k> w/b
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[20:55] <JohnGC> I was messing around with the predictor earlier. Makes you realize how short the distance from Cambridge to the coast is!
[20:55] <jcoxon> JohnGC, never further then 70miles from the sea
[20:55] <jcoxon> here in the UK
[20:56] <JohnGC> Yes, that's a scary fact.
[20:56] <JohnGC> I wasn't planning to add a cutdown to my balloon, but I think I'd prefer to get the payload back.
[20:56] <jcoxon> its a good idea to
[20:57] <JohnGC> Had anyone looked at the relationship between the predictor and actual flight paths. Curious about accuracy.
[20:57] <jcoxon> yes and no
[20:57] <jcoxon> not a proper study as such
[20:57] <jcoxon> but 24hrs in advance its very accurate
[20:58] <JohnGC> OK. That's good to know. And by 'very accurate' do you have a sense of delta between actual landing point and predicted in km?
[20:58] <jcoxon> well the varying factor is actually the burst alt
[20:59] <jcoxon> so the flight path is similar
[20:59] <JohnGC> ah. good point
[20:59] <jcoxon> just it might go a little furhter or shorter depending on the alt
[21:00] <JohnGC> As I get deeper into the project I realize just how complex success is. It's great fun, but there's a lot to getting it right.
[21:00] <JohnGC> Happy that others went before me!
[21:00] <jcoxon> hehe
[21:00] <jcoxon> its good fun
[21:01] <Upu> http://francescobonomi.it/minihab/stratospera/pano_3/
[21:01] <Upu> it moves :)
[21:02] <jcoxon> hehe
[21:02] <jcoxon> you could use the HAPS-1/HAPS-D panoramas
[21:02] <jcoxon> i guess they could be made to move
[21:02] <JohnGC> nice
[21:02] <Upu> http://www.francescobonomi.it/minihab/stratospera/408.jpg
[21:03] <Upu> I like that one
[21:03] <jcoxon> thats a great pic
[21:03] <fsphil> jellyfish in space!!
[21:03] <Upu> Anyway I need to walk the dog : watch this with the sound on : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoTHrSpk1pA&feature=player_embedded
[21:09] <jcoxon> bbiab
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[21:44] <jcoxon> evening again
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[21:45] <nv1k> evening
[21:45] <jcoxon> wb8elk balloon about to launch
[21:45] <jcoxon> from the looks of it
[21:46] <nv1k> is that the pinhole hover?
[21:46] <jcoxon> yeah
[21:47] <nv1k> interesting idea
[21:47] <jcoxon> yeah works well - have flown a few myself
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[21:48] <nv1k> Some of the guys at Taylor made an electronic valve that they fly
[21:48] <jcoxon> yeah i guess thats the next step
[21:48] <nv1k> the issue they keep coming across is not being able to dump the gas fast enough
[21:49] <nv1k> the balloon essentially becomes a zero pressure balloon
[21:49] <jcoxon> indeed
[21:49] <nv1k> except a zp is better :)
[21:49] <jcoxon> hehe
[21:49] <jcoxon> indeed
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[21:50] <nv1k> although building them... tricky
[21:52] <jcoxon> nv1k, have you built your own for your future flights?
[21:53] <nv1k> currently building 3 of them
[21:53] <jcoxon> good luck :)
[21:54] <nv1k> the issue continues to be reliable heat sealing
[21:54] <nv1k> can't use an impulse sealer
[21:54] <nv1k> constant heat sealers are ~200USD
[21:54] <jcoxon> the cusf guys have managed to build their own
[21:54] <griffonbot> @WOKNSS: You will never see vista on any of our #ARHAB tracking computers. [http://twitter.com/WOKNSS/status/24969735034]
[21:54] <jcoxon> but it took a lot of prototyping
[21:55] <nv1k> yeah
[21:55] <nv1k> we used sandwich bag sealers for prototyping
[21:55] <nv1k> work.... ok
[21:55] <nv1k> i guess
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[21:55] <nv1k> i designed a heat sealer but our dept head who has to aprove all expenditures is unavailiable at the moment
[21:56] <nv1k> oh well
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[21:56] <nv1k> gives me more time to work on the radio telemetry
[21:56] <jcoxon> hehe
[21:57] <jcoxon> finally a 3d lock for wb8elk
[21:57] <nv1k> trying to decide between the simplicity of CW or the higher cost of PSK
[21:58] <jcoxon> for long duration?
[21:58] <nv1k> yeah
[21:58] <jcoxon> our think is CW + another digital mode
[21:58] <jcoxon> CW for the hardcore listeners
[21:58] <jcoxon> digital mode means you can nicely have a system to receive and relay the data
[21:58] <nv1k> yeah
[21:58] <jcoxon> as CW software decoders are rubbish
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[21:59] <nv1k> realtime software at least
[21:59] <jcoxon> - this is why we've developed out dl-fldigi / spacenear.us system
[21:59] <jcoxon> our*
[21:59] <nv1k> but i'm good up to 30wpm CW
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[21:59] <russss> I dunno if I posted this in this channel but this stream is absolutely worth the hassle of decoding windows media video: http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/isslivestream.asx
[21:59] <jcoxon> oh nothing beats CW
[21:59] <jcoxon> but not everyone can do that
[21:59] <jcoxon> and in my opinion you want as many listeners as possible
[22:00] <jcoxon> especially with HF propagation
[22:00] <nv1k> I would love PSK, but we aren't terribly hopeful about recovering this payload
[22:00] <nv1k> so the added expense of the PSK transmitter
[22:00] <nv1k> kind of hurts
[22:00] <jcoxon> how about CW and RTTY
[22:01] <nv1k> and we will still be in an APRS covered area
[22:01] <jcoxon> there is that
[22:01] <fsphil> the wspr mode might actually be better than cw, though much slower
[22:01] <nv1k> we aren't terribly worried about propagation
[22:01] <nv1k> just minimal cost
[22:01] <jcoxon> fair enough
[22:01] <nv1k> we did just get our aprs tracker to <50
[22:02] <jcoxon> wow
[22:02] <jcoxon> + gps?
[22:02] <nv1k> and thats including the 35 for GPS
[22:02] <jcoxon> hehe
[22:02] <jcoxon> that is good
[22:02] <nv1k> hoping to open source the design within the next month
[22:02] <jcoxon> what radio did you use? homebrew?
[22:03] <nv1k> adf7020
[22:03] <nv1k> which is a major PITA to solder, so will probably sell a assembled version
[22:03] <jcoxon> cool
[22:04] <nv1k> its only 1w
[22:04] <jcoxon> only :-p
[22:04] <nv1k> yeah
[22:05] <nv1k> as long as a decent antenna
[22:05] <nv1k> we have run it at 1mW
[22:05] <nv1k> but then again we have a ~30dB ground station
[22:18] <natrium42> looks like wb8elk is off
[22:20] <jcoxon> yay
[22:20] <jcoxon> hey natrium42
[22:20] <natrium42> hi
[22:20] <jcoxon> hows things/
[22:20] <jcoxon> ?
[22:21] <fsphil> this should be interesting
[22:21] <natrium42> pretty good, how are you?
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[22:21] <jcoxon> yeah not bad thanks
[22:21] <jcoxon> fsphil, indeed
[22:21] <jcoxon> though i fear i'll need to sleep at some point
[22:21] <fsphil> yea just looking at the clock
[22:22] <jcoxon> looks like a good ascent rate
[22:22] <jcoxon> between 2 and 3
[22:24] <fsphil> nice launch site
[22:27] <jcoxon> yeah
[22:27] <jcoxon> we should launch in the US
[22:32] <fsphil> I suppose for the trans-atlantic flight you'd have to launch on that side
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[22:33] <jcoxon> indeed
[22:33] <jcoxon> thats the plan
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[22:39] <fsphil> hehe, it's heading for Birmingham
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[22:46] <jcoxon> night all
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[23:31] <WB9SBD-NSS> Greetings!
[23:35] <WB9SBD-NSS> anyone here?
[23:35] <SpeedEvil> no.
[23:35] <WB9SBD-NSS> he hehe
[23:35] <nv1k> who is anyone
[23:35] <SpeedEvil> Were you the icelandic launch today?
[23:35] Action: SpeedEvil can't remember the callsign.
[23:35] <WB9SBD-NSS> me?
[23:36] <WB9SBD-NSS> does anyone know what freq(s) Bill is transmittingon?
[23:41] <WB9SBD-NSS> hello?
[23:42] <SpeedEvil> Several people around here have actual jobs - and as it's mostly a UK channel - it tends to be deadish after UK midnight.
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[23:44] <WB9SBD-NSS> is the list on the right all thats connected or what?
[23:44] <WB9SBD-NSS> yeah it's almost midnight there.
[23:45] <WB9SBD-NSS> almost 7 PM here
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[23:47] Nick change: SpeedEvil1 -> SpeedEvil
[23:53] <WB9SBD-NSS> have any contact info for who ever made the traking page? http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[23:55] <nv1k> no idea personally
[23:57] <SpeedEvil> I should remember who did it, but I forgot.
[23:57] <SpeedEvil> I'd suggest asking 4 hours ago or so.
[23:57] <SpeedEvil> Oh - I see - one in the air.
[23:59] <SpeedEvil> Was yours a floater with a pinhole?
[23:59] <WB9SBD-NSS> yup Bill elk is maybe flying a floater will have to wait to see if it levels off shortly.
[23:59] <SpeedEvil> that looks like a very unusual altitude profile
[23:59] <nv1k> it was a pinhole flight
[23:59] <WB9SBD-NSS> No Bills ELK is ther floater,
[00:00] --- Mon Sep 20 2010