highaltitude.log.20100811

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[00:10] <Randomskk> hah, excellent square waves here https://randomskk.net/u/eth_rxd1.bmp
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[03:34] <griffonbot> @nearsys: I have new BalloonSat flight computers. Will get relays before long and then I'm ready to market them. #ARHAB [http://twitter.com/nearsys/status/20848231545]
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[04:37] <juxta> anybody have a rough idea what duct tape weighs per meter?
[04:39] <SpeedEvil> I would guess at around 20 grams
[04:49] <juxta> cheers SpeedEvil
[04:49] <juxta> you're up early by the way :)
[04:49] <SpeedEvil> Well - how much does a roll weigh?
[04:49] <juxta> or late maybe ;p
[04:49] <SpeedEvil> late
[04:49] <SpeedEvil> and how long is it
[04:50] <juxta> that's a good question. I suspect my no brand duct tape isnt labelled for length
[04:50] <juxta> let me check
[04:50] <SpeedEvil> say 1m*50mm*1mm would be 50000mm^3, or 50cc, call it 80g.
[04:50] <SpeedEvil> You can probably get 3 or 4 layers in a mm, so 20-40g/m would be sane
[04:51] <juxta> okay, so my roll weighs 200grams
[04:52] <juxta> i'll have a google and see if i can find the length as it's not market
[04:52] <SpeedEvil> or just fold a bit 4 times, measure with calipers, divide by 16
[04:52] <juxta> marked even*
[04:54] <juxta> hmm. can't find the exact brand, though it looks like it would be a 50m roll if the thickness is consistent with other brands
[04:55] <juxta> I dont have any calipers to check with sadly
[04:56] <juxta> that comes down to ~5g/m ignoring the cardboard tubes weight, which sounds a bit light
[04:56] <SpeedEvil> .25mm is quite thick tape
[04:57] <SpeedEvil> I may be thinking of different stuff than what you mean
[04:57] <juxta> mine is like this: http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Apico-Duct-Tape-50-Meter-Roll-Yellow-/120603578392?cmd=ViewItem&pt=AU_Motorcycle_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1c14889018
[04:57] <SpeedEvil> yeah - but even with fingers you can tell between 4mm = 0.25mm and 1mm = 1/16thmm
[04:58] <juxta> folding some now :)
[04:58] <SpeedEvil> I love my kitchen scales. http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.17483
[04:58] <juxta> hehe, I have a digital fish scale from DX that I use for calculating lift
[04:59] <Darkside> juxta: going to adelaide hackerspce?
[04:59] <juxta> Darkside, didn't realse we had one - I'll check it out! :)
[05:00] <Darkside> tonight, 6pm :P
[05:01] <Darkside> in the city
[05:01] <juxta> alrighty - are you going?
[05:01] <Darkside> yep
[05:01] <juxta> SpeedEvil, 4 layers looks to be around 1mm
[05:02] <juxta> as best I can tell with my eyes and a ruler at least
[05:14] <Darkside> juxta: http://groups.google.com/group/hackerspace-adelaide
[05:20] <juxta> cheers Darkside
[05:20] <juxta> I'll try make it down tonight
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[09:43] <jonsowman> morning all
[09:43] <jonsowman> :)
[09:46] <jonsowman> eroomde: ping
[09:52] <Darkside> ohi
[10:29] <m1x10> hi !
[10:29] <m1x10> 35C in my room and keep increasing
[10:29] <m1x10> until afternoon 38C for sure :)
[10:43] <Darkside> w00
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[12:20] <jonsowman> DanielRichman, Randomskk ping
[12:20] <DanielRichman> hi
[12:21] <jonsowman> yo
[12:21] <jonsowman> http://hexoc.com/hab/predict/predict/
[12:21] <jonsowman> set with map somehwere, then hit save location
[12:22] <DanielRichman> :o
[12:22] <jonsowman> :)
[12:22] <jonsowman> also tooltips
[12:22] <DanielRichman> yeah
[12:22] <DanielRichman> very nice
[12:22] <jonsowman> anything you think i should do/change?
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[12:24] <m1x10> jonsowman: I added my location
[12:24] <m1x10> but the dropdown box is not refreshed dynamically
[12:24] <jonsowman> m1x10: it won't appear in the dropdown
[12:24] <m1x10> Launch site dropdown.
[12:25] <jonsowman> m1x10: click Custom next to Launch Site
[12:25] <m1x10> ah ok
[12:25] <m1x10> but theres not use to the dropdown
[12:25] <jonsowman> yeh that is only for Preset options
[12:25] <jonsowman> ie. available everywhere
[12:25] <jonsowman> the custom ones are only local (cookie)
[12:26] <m1x10> put some keyword inside it
[12:26] <m1x10> dont leave it empty
[12:26] <m1x10> looks incomplete
[12:26] <m1x10> to the simple user
[12:26] <jonsowman> the dropdown should change to "Other"
[12:26] <m1x10> I chose my custom site
[12:26] <m1x10> but nothing happened to dropdown
[12:27] <jonsowman> hmm, try refreshing and see if it works now :)
[12:27] <m1x10> by the way you have done pretty good work. I havent see the predictor for some time and it looks faster/smoother/pretier
[12:28] <jonsowman> thanks :)
[12:28] <m1x10> jonsowman: we shouldnt refresh the page to get the dropdown working
[12:28] <m1x10> you must do it
[12:28] <jonsowman> no there was an error in my JSON
[12:28] <juxta> jonsowman, I was going to ask you - which is the best version to run, the version on hexoc.com or the version on SRCF?
[12:28] <m1x10> after choosing a custom site just add "Custom site" to dropdown
[12:29] <jonsowman> juxta: SRCF is deployment stable and working
[12:29] <jonsowman> hexoc is where I test stuff and is "beta", as it were
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[12:29] <juxta> alrighty
[12:29] <m1x10> I think hexoc in the future will replace SRCF
[12:30] <jonsowman> hehe I doubt it
[12:30] <jonsowman> juxta: in general, use the SRCF one
[12:30] <jonsowman> unless you're looking at/testing the beta features
[12:31] <m1x10> jonsowman: the JSON error comes 100% from your coding. try debug it and add custom site's name to dropdown
[12:31] <jonsowman> i know - I think i've fixed the error
[12:31] <jonsowman> there was a trailing comma
[12:31] <m1x10> eg. I add it a site called Marmaras. Then without refreshing it should appear to dropdown .
[12:32] <jonsowman> I don't want it to appear in dropdown really
[12:32] <jonsowman> the dropdown should change to "Other"
[12:32] <jonsowman> for custom sites, the Custom link is used to view/manage/delete/use
[12:33] <m1x10> ok now says other
[12:33] <jonsowman> that's what I was after
[12:33] <jonsowman> there needs to be some differentiation between custom sites and preset ones
[12:34] <m1x10> the custom sites are saved in browser cookies? not at your database?
[12:34] <jonsowman> correct
[12:34] <m1x10> ahh
[12:34] <m1x10> why not save it to database?
[12:34] <jonsowman> because the list will become enormous
[12:34] <m1x10> you might have a dozen
[12:34] <m1x10> !
[12:34] <m1x10> that would make it popular man
[12:34] <jonsowman> that dropdown will become huge
[12:35] <jonsowman> since deploying on the SRCF I've had about 200 requests
[12:35] <m1x10> And by what circumstances do you add a static site?
[12:35] <m1x10> for example I see only some UK sites.
[12:35] <jonsowman> if it really needs it, have to contact CUSF for the CUSF predictor, or me for the hexoc ones
[12:36] <jonsowman> but people can run this predictor on their own servers
[12:36] <m1x10> lol
[12:36] <jonsowman> so then they can add their own static sites if they link
[12:36] <jonsowman> *like
[12:36] <m1x10> its open source? can i use it?
[12:36] <jonsowman> yup
[12:36] <m1x10> oh
[12:36] <m1x10> lol
[12:36] <m1x10> !
[12:36] <m1x10> what kind of packages?
[12:36] <jonsowman> http://github.com/jonsowman/cusf-standalone-predictor
[12:36] <m1x10> ha
[12:37] <m1x10> nice
[12:37] <m1x10> I should help more on this project
[12:37] <m1x10> if its for the public
[12:37] <jonsowman> hehe it's fine - has been a good project for me over the last 3-4 months
[12:38] <m1x10> sure. its unique man.
[12:38] <jonsowman> and other people who have helped of course
[12:38] <m1x10> Still the IE transparency boxes issue remains.
[12:38] <jonsowman> oh yes
[12:38] <jonsowman> forgot about that
[12:39] <jonsowman> :\
[12:39] <m1x10> just append a css line below the argb line
[12:39] <m1x10> you have argb()
[12:39] <m1x10> then append arg()
[12:39] <m1x10> sorry, rgb()
[12:40] <jonsowman> done
[12:40] <m1x10> wiat
[12:40] <m1x10> wait
[12:40] <m1x10> nothing
[12:41] <m1x10> put rgb first then argb
[12:41] <jonsowman> right
[12:41] <jonsowman> done
[12:41] <m1x10> nothing
[12:42] <jonsowman> hmm
[12:42] <jonsowman> wonder why
[12:42] <m1x10> wait
[12:45] <m1x10> .box {
[12:45] <m1x10> background-attachment:initial;
[12:45] <m1x10> background-clip:initial;
[12:45] <m1x10> background-color:rgba(255, 255, 255, 0.746094);
[12:45] <m1x10> background-image:initial;
[12:45] <m1x10> background-origin:initial;
[12:45] <m1x10> background-position:initial initial;
[12:45] <m1x10> background-repeat:initial initial;
[12:45] <m1x10> ---- background-color:rgba(255, 255, 255, 0.746094);
[12:45] <m1x10> add above
[12:45] <m1x10> ---- background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);
[12:45] <m1x10> so its:
[12:45] <m1x10> background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255);
[12:45] <m1x10> background-color:rgba(255, 255, 255, 0.746094);
[12:48] <jonsowman> like that?
[12:48] <jonsowman> (see source)
[12:49] <m1x10> there are no updates
[12:49] <m1x10> to the pred.css
[12:49] <jonsowman> force refresh?
[12:50] <jonsowman> there are here
[12:50] <m1x10> forced twice
[12:50] <jonsowman> again?
[12:50] <jonsowman> restarted webserver
[12:51] <m1x10> nothing
[12:51] <jonsowman> no changes?
[12:52] <m1x10> no update to css
[12:52] <jonsowman> .box { background-attachment:initial; background-clip:initial; background-color:rgb(255, 255, 255); background-color:rgba(255, 255, 255, 0.746094); background-image:initial;
[12:52] <jonsowman> urgh. that failed
[12:53] <m1x10> jonsowman I opened opera and safari which i never use and the css still remains old
[12:54] <m1x10> I did that just to exclude my caching issues.
[12:55] <jonsowman> weird
[12:55] <jonsowman> it's fine here
[12:55] <jonsowman> has all the lines that you gave me
[12:56] <juxta> shall I look?
[12:56] <m1x10> now IE shows ok
[12:56] <m1x10> just instead of 255,255,255
[12:57] <m1x10> but some grey
[12:57] <jonsowman> yes I was just using white to test :)
[12:57] <jonsowman> juxta: if you don't mind :)
[12:57] <m1x10> I can confirm for white
[12:57] <juxta> what's the jonsowman?
[12:57] <juxta> the URL, rather
[12:57] <juxta> ;p
[12:58] <jonsowman> http://hexoc.com/hab/predict/predict/
[12:58] <jonsowman> well
[12:58] <jonsowman> http://hexoc.com/hab/predict/predict/css/pred.css
[12:58] <m1x10> i think the update is done
[12:58] <m1x10> just the browsers sucks
[12:58] <jonsowman> hehe yes
[12:58] <m1x10> suck*
[12:58] <juxta> http://pastebin.com/0V15FeRv
[12:58] <jonsowman> tell me about it
[12:58] <jonsowman> yeh its worked
[12:59] <jonsowman> thanks juxta
[12:59] <juxta> np
[12:59] <m1x10> thats correct
[13:00] <m1x10> jonsowman: why theres a connection to maps.gstatic.com/intl/el_gr/mapfiles/api-3/2/0/main.js?
[13:02] <jonsowman> google maps API
[13:02] <m1x10> ok
[13:04] <m1x10> I dont find any other cross browser issues
[13:05] <jonsowman> excellent
[13:05] <jonsowman> i'll close that github issue then
[13:05] <m1x10> Now the global browser market can use your predictor :):
[13:05] <jonsowman> :)
[13:05] <jonsowman> thank you
[13:06] <timbobel> in eagle, when my design is done, why should i put the whole sheet coppered?
[13:07] <m1x10> hi timbobel, I never used eagle.
[13:07] <m1x10> timbobel: about ublox not saving the settings I found out the reason.
[13:08] <timbobel> oh?
[13:08] <timbobel> is yours working again
[13:08] <m1x10> Its just because you have to send another command to ublox.
[13:09] <m1x10> you do the settings and then you have to send a command
[13:09] <m1x10> when command is send then settings are preserved by the battery
[13:10] <m1x10> in conclusion ublox is just awesome
[13:10] <m1x10> should be the number one for habing
[13:10] <m1x10> if you open the gps with u-center
[13:11] <m1x10> you will understand how it works
[13:11] <m1x10> never before sew something like this
[13:11] <m1x10> also check: http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:falcom_fsa03
[13:11] <m1x10> at the end
[13:13] <m1x10> I used my aprs with these stuff with 6 duracell batteries and system was working for 3 days
[13:14] <m1x10> and kept working but I just plug it off
[13:15] <m1x10> with ultimate lithium it will work for a week i think :)
[13:16] <timbobel> i dont get it
[13:16] <timbobel> so why does it suddenly work now
[13:16] <m1x10> mine?
[13:16] <m1x10> or yours?
[13:19] <m1x10> the fsa with breakout should be first configured from ucenter, then used.
[13:19] <timbobel> still weird.
[13:19] <timbobel> how did you hook it up to ucenter
[13:19] <m1x10> made a circuit on a breaboard
[13:20] <m1x10> http://imagebin.org/109123
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[13:45] <m1x10> Is there any way to make the balloon stay on a average height for some time?
[13:46] <m1x10> To reach its altitude but not burst immediately. For example to stay there 1 hour.
[13:47] <timbobel> ask jcoxon with his ballashalo's
[13:47] <timbobel> or just read up on ukhas.org
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[13:48] <m1x10> have anyone tried this before?
[13:50] <russss> yes
[13:50] <m1x10> with success?
[13:50] <juxta> m1x10, http://ukhas.org.uk/general:uk_records
[13:50] <russss> the japanese did it during WW2 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fire_balloon
[13:50] <juxta> see the float duration section
[13:51] <russss> juxta: the ironic thing is that BH2 float record wasn't really to do with the ballast.
[13:51] <m1x10> and while the balloon is up it stays in orbit ?
[13:52] <LazyLeopard> Check out the BallastHalo launches on the ukhas wiki: http://ukhas.org.uk/projects:pegasus
[13:52] <m1x10> haha to many funny names
[13:52] <m1x10> alien 1
[13:52] <m1x10> lol
[13:53] <m1x10> reminds me of old alien 1 movie. epic.
[13:54] <m1x10> Float Duration means how much time it remained on the air ?
[13:54] <m1x10> at certain altitude?
[13:54] <juxta> m1x10, how long it remained at more or less a constant altitude
[13:54] <m1x10> BallastHalo 2 - 7hrs 15mins
[13:54] <m1x10> thats crazy
[13:55] <m1x10> where did the balloon go ?
[13:55] <m1x10> on another continent ?!?!
[13:55] <m1x10> or it stays in orbit?
[13:55] <russss> it landed in northern france
[13:56] <m1x10> launched from?
[13:56] <russss> cambridge
[13:56] <m1x10> oh
[13:56] <m1x10> LOL
[13:56] <m1x10> thats a flight !!!!!!!!!!!!
[14:03] <m1x10> ah SSTV images
[14:03] <m1x10> at which baud rate?
[14:03] <m1x10> pegasus VI mission
[14:04] <Darkside> hmm
[14:04] <Darkside> i need to look at implementing some kind of MFSK mode..
[14:04] <m1x10> SSTV has fixed baudrate?
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[14:11] <DanielRichman> sort of.
[14:12] <DanielRichman> there are several SSTV modes; each has a defined speed
[14:12] <DanielRichman> but SSTV is not digital.
[14:13] <m1x10> DanielRichman is there any other way of sending images in HAM frequencies?
[14:13] <DanielRichman> yes. fsphil has tried sending JPEG images over 300 baud RTTY
[14:14] <m1x10> with success?
[14:15] <DanielRichman> to a certain extent. The problem is that some data would get corrupted and due to the nature of the JPEG format the whole of the image would be ruined. He's since been working on a way of recovering from corrupted data in a way that means that the "block" - but not the whole image - is lost.
[14:15] <DanielRichman> in preparation for his next flight, I believe
[14:15] <m1x10> I see
[14:31] <m1x10> DanielRichman can I use afsk 1200baud modulation to send pics?
[14:31] <DanielRichman> It's possible.
[14:31] <Darkside> getting a bit high bit rate there
[14:32] <Darkside> i'm limiting my HF project to 600 baud
[14:32] <m1x10> instead of sending ax25 frames
[14:32] <m1x10> send some pics
[14:32] <m1x10> :)
[14:32] <m1x10> its all bits!
[14:33] <Darkside> what about data loss tho :P
[14:33] <m1x10> eee ok !
[14:33] <m1x10> :)
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[14:35] <Darkside> i'm looking at error correction (or at least detection) for my HF system
[14:35] <Darkside> currently i'm just using 300 baud RTTY, but i want to try some MFSK or something like that
[14:35] <m1x10> DanielRichman what are the possible problems I will face if I use 1200baud afsk ?
[14:36] <m1x10> except data loss
[14:36] <DanielRichman> well yeah; data loss/corruption is the main one
[14:36] <Darkside> at that rate you're goign to want a damn good SNR
[14:37] <m1x10> I have ready the afsk implementation in software for arduino. Its easy for me to buy a cmos camera and send small images at 144.8mhz
[14:37] <m1x10> and start testing
[14:37] <Darkside> m1x10: how are you generating the RF?
[14:37] <Darkside> the TI chip?
[14:37] <m1x10> radiometrix :)
[14:37] <Darkside> ahh
[14:38] <Darkside> that can work at 1200 baud?
[14:38] <m1x10> HX1
[14:38] <m1x10> sure
[14:38] <Darkside> nice
[14:38] <m1x10> 144.8 NBFM 1200baud
[14:38] <Darkside> i'm using an AD9835 DDS for my work :P
[14:39] <m1x10> Darkside: Im really noob to telecommunications and electronics.
[14:39] <Darkside> heh
[14:39] <m1x10> HAB its my first attempt to learn some things
[14:39] <Darkside> the AD9835 is a direct digital synthesis chip
[14:39] <Darkside> generates a sine wave basically
[14:39] <m1x10> well
[14:39] <m1x10> arduino fast pwm mode can generate sine waves
[14:39] <Darkside> yeah but not at 7MHz :P
[14:39] <m1x10> ee maybe :)
[14:39] <m1x10> at 1200/2200
[14:40] <Darkside> yeah but then you need to shift it up to RF somehow
[14:40] <Darkside> modulate it with a carrier or something
[14:40] <m1x10> yes
[14:40] <m1x10> afsk
[14:40] <Darkside> i'm just generatinghte carrier wave directly
[14:40] <m1x10> then then radio also does the FM
[14:40] <m1x10> heh
[14:41] <m1x10> Darkside because im noob i always try to find the easy way
[14:41] <Darkside> heh
[14:41] <m1x10> for me arduino is very helpful
[14:41] <Darkside> yeah
[14:41] <m1x10> while other will laugh now
[14:41] <m1x10> others*
[14:41] <Darkside> i actually first wrote my first AD9835 driver code in arduino code
[14:41] <m1x10> :)
[14:42] <Darkside> also got RTTY code for it too
[14:42] <Darkside> but yeah, i much prefer the AD9835 - lets me generate HF easily
[14:42] <Darkside> all i just have to do is amplify the output
[14:42] <m1x10> So except the data loss is there a good posibilty to transmit picture using AFSK 1200baud at 144.8 ?
[14:43] <Darkside> do you have a decoder?
[14:43] <Darkside> that can demodulate 1200 baud AFSK?
[14:44] <m1x10> Radioshield
[14:44] <m1x10> will do that for me
[14:44] <Darkside> :/
[14:44] <Darkside> weird
[14:45] <m1x10> now I see that the radioshield will decode the information in a ax25 format
[14:45] <Darkside> i'm keeping all my code to data modes i know i can demodulate with stuff like fldigi
[14:45] <m1x10> so I must include the image bits to ax25 !
[14:45] <m1x10> ah its too small
[14:46] <m1x10> I can move about 200bits of payload inside ax25
[14:46] <m1x10> so for 1kb pic i need 5 ax25 frames
[14:47] <m1x10> would be funny !
[14:47] <m1x10> https://www.argentdata.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=136
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[14:53] <m1x10> thats a cool camera: http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=9334
[14:55] <m1x10> http://projectcirrus.wordpress.com/payload/hadie/
[14:55] <m1x10> that guy received his image with corruption
[14:56] <jonsowman> m1x10: that's fsphil's :)
[14:56] <m1x10> lol
[14:56] <m1x10> so corrupted information doesnt mean you wont see anythig
[14:57] <m1x10> you see something
[14:57] <m1x10> at least
[14:58] <Darkside> i reckon sending SSTV would be best
[14:58] <Darkside> then you might get part of a frame, even with corruption
[14:59] <Darkside> but doing SSTV modulation wouldn't be easy
[15:01] <m1x10> I prefer afsk which I have ready !
[15:01] <m1x10> :):)
[15:01] <Darkside> yes, you'd need a very different transmitter
[15:01] <Darkside> i could *probably* do that kind of thing with what i have
[15:02] <m1x10> what do u mean different transmitter?
[15:02] <Darkside> well not a FM one for a start :P
[15:02] <Darkside> though technically that could work
[15:04] <m1x10> Darkside just to let you know
[15:05] <m1x10> my aprs system is transmitting know. Indoors with a diamond 9dbi omni antenna
[15:05] <Darkside> cool
[15:05] <m1x10> I am heard at 75km distance away
[15:05] <m1x10> behind lots of mountains
[15:05] <m1x10> directly to radio from an amateur station at a place 75km from me
[15:06] <m1x10> no LOS nothing
[15:06] <m1x10> imagine how it would be on air
[15:06] <m1x10> straight LOS clear path
[15:06] <m1x10> I think I might try it.
[15:08] <m1x10> http://aprs.fi/?c=raw&call=SW2HYX-11&limit=5&view=normal
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[16:00] <simhed> guys, i'm trying to run a test transmission using my Arduino and NTX2.. can anyone point me to some guides on how to connect them together?
[16:01] <simhed> can't find anything concrete..
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[16:02] <m1x10> 36C in my room !!!!!
[16:03] <SpeedEvil> simhed: htere are links on wiki
[16:04] <simhed> hm, yup, saw them.. i am wondering if using TXD pin is enough...? with antena connected to RF out
[16:04] <m1x10> yeah
[16:05] <m1x10> I do it the same way
[16:05] <simhed> ok, will try that, thanks
[16:05] <m1x10> a simple wire from arduino tx to rf out
[16:05] <simhed> hmm
[16:06] <m1x10> sory not to rf out. to radio's rx
[16:06] <simhed> i was talking about ntx2's TXD pin
[16:06] <simhed> right
[16:06] <m1x10> yeah
[16:06] <m1x10> bah
[16:06] <m1x10> ntx2
[16:06] <m1x10> i got hx1
[16:06] <m1x10> its far different
[16:06] <simhed> um
[16:06] <m1x10> sory to confuse u
[16:07] <simhed> no worries
[16:07] <SpeedEvil> a simple wire gives you 10KHz (?) deviation
[16:08] <SpeedEvil> this is too wide for many recievers
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[18:11] <DanielRichman> jonsowman:
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[18:55] <Randomskk> DanielRichman: pong
[18:55] <DanielRichman> Randomskk: is http://pastebin.com/sxk3MgZY ok?
[18:56] <Randomskk> I think it's 2008-2010
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[18:56] <DanielRichman> ok
[18:57] <DanielRichman> and would you and jon like your names in the list?
[18:57] <Randomskk> I will add mine if/when I contribute anything useful
[18:58] <DanielRichman> ok
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[22:06] <Randomskk> quiet this evening
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[22:06] <m1x10> :)
[22:06] Action: SpeedEvil is huntin wabbits!
[22:06] <Randomskk> wabbits eh
[22:06] <m1x10> I have visitors :)
[22:07] Action: Laurenceb is trying to swap round the freaking pins
[22:08] <m1x10> Randomskk seems that you woke up the whole hab team :)
[22:08] <Randomskk> hah everyone is reporting in
[22:09] <m1x10> yeah like morning report in army
[22:09] <m1x10> "all report to commander Randomskk"
[22:10] <Randomskk> well
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[22:14] <m1x10> ping SpeedEvil
[22:15] <m1x10> [18:08] <SpeedEvil> a simple wire gives you 10KHz (?) deviation
[22:15] <m1x10> [18:08] <SpeedEvil> this is too wide for many recievers
[22:16] <SpeedEvil> ?
[22:16] <m1x10> you ask if thats happens or you declare it?
[22:17] <SpeedEvil> The output of the AVR is 0/5V. This is the maximum possible deviation of the ntx2 - so the deviation will be the maximum specified - 10KHz I think.
[22:17] <SpeedEvil> Resistors let you reduce the swing from an output - and hence reduce the deviation
[22:17] <SpeedEvil> To - say - 450hz or something
[22:17] <m1x10> I use simple wire from arduino pin to radio receiver pin
[22:18] <m1x10> and i get received from far
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[22:23] <DanielRichman> If you have a 5V avr I don't think you're meant to wire it direct to the ntx pin since the ntx is a 3v3 device
[22:24] <DanielRichman> http://www.radiometrix.co.uk/products/ntx2nrx2.htm see the section "TX Modulation Requirements"
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[22:30] <Upu> hmm I am but I'm making the voltages <3V
[22:30] <m1x10> hx1 is a 5v device
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[22:31] <Upu> your supply to the NTX2 can be 5V
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[22:34] <DanielRichman> yes it has a regulator inside it; so the supply can be up to 5v or more (I forget the limit) but the TXD pin should be <3.3
[22:35] <Randomskk> I still reckon 0V for one of your input signals, and a potential divider to get 5V down to 0.2 or so
[22:36] <DanielRichman> you can do 1pin rtty even at 0.9 and 1.2 with 3 resistors
[22:37] <Randomskk> my way uses two
[22:37] <DanielRichman> PS: the hx1's maximum deviation is 3KHz so the 0-5v wire will produce a shift that's just fine
[22:37] <Randomskk> so ner :P
[22:37] <DanielRichman> well that datasheet gives the impedence of the txd pin so really you should be able to do it with one
[22:37] <Upu> I think all my maths came out at 1.79v / 2.00 v for a 425Hz shift
[22:37] <Randomskk> DanielRichman: hehe
[22:37] <Upu> on the NTX2 from an Arduino
[22:37] <Randomskk> excellent
[22:37] <Randomskk> I'll do it with just one
[22:37] <DanielRichman> you do that then
[22:37] <Randomskk> though tbh if I'm flying an STM32 I can just DAC it
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[22:38] <DanielRichman> likewise with my xmega :P
[22:38] <Randomskk> :P
[22:38] <DanielRichman> potential dividers, pssh
[22:40] <m1x10> DanielRichman: where did you find the deviation info for HX1 ?
[22:41] <DanielRichman> on the website
[22:41] <DanielRichman> http://www.radiometrix.co.uk/products/hx1.htm
[22:42] <m1x10> the FM deviation (peak) ?
[22:42] <DanielRichman> that's the one
[22:42] <m1x10> I never noticed it
[22:42] <m1x10> :Pp
[22:46] <Upu> anyway night all o7
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[22:50] <m1x10> DanielRichman
[22:50] <DanielRichman> hi there
[22:51] <m1x10> pins 1,3 RF Ground
[22:51] <m1x10> I never wire them to gnd
[22:51] <m1x10> and radio is working
[22:51] <m1x10> can this cause problems?
[22:51] <Randomskk> do you wire them to the shield of the coax to your antenna?
[22:51] <m1x10> noo
[22:51] <Randomskk> do you have coax to your antenna?
[22:51] <m1x10> nooo
[22:51] <Randomskk> how about to your antenna's ground radials?
[22:52] <m1x10> I just habe a wire
[22:52] <Randomskk> I'd probably try improving on that
[22:52] <Randomskk> I mean, it'l probably work, but you won't get great range and it probably isn't really 50 ohms
[22:52] <m1x10> its 5cm wire
[22:52] <DanielRichman> he hasn't told you about the breadboard yet
[22:52] <Randomskk> 5cm?
[22:52] <m1x10> from rfout to antenna
[22:52] <m1x10> y
[22:52] <Randomskk> oh, 5cm of wire from the ntx2 to the antenna
[22:53] <Randomskk> that wire is an antenna
[22:53] <Randomskk> it should be coax
[22:53] <Randomskk> as a cheap hack, wrap it in tinfoil and connect that to RFGND
[22:53] <Randomskk> =D
[22:53] <Randomskk> note that doing that will get you nothing like 50 ohms characteristic impedance
[22:53] <m1x10> the usual color wire for wiring on breadboards
[22:54] <m1x10> can someone give me a link of this coax ?
[22:54] <m1x10> the same that u usually use
[22:55] <Randomskk> what would I normally use. tricky
[22:55] <Randomskk> we used whatever was lying around the lab
[22:55] <Randomskk> something thin
[22:55] <m1x10> i have some pigtails for 2.4ghz wifi ;)
[22:56] <m1x10> Also i noticed that using a ground plain is better than my diamond omni
[22:57] <m1x10> datasheet says: TXD DC coupled input for 5V CMOS logic. Rin = 100k©
[22:57] <m1x10> I need a resistor ?!?!!
[22:57] <Randomskk> 100kohm input impedance for txd eh
[22:57] <m1x10> i dont use resistor !
[22:57] <Randomskk> no, you still need resistors to form a voltage divider
[22:57] <m1x10> is that bad?
[22:58] <m1x10> why to divide?
[22:58] <m1x10> its 5v
[22:58] <Randomskk> because 0V to 5V swing will generate a very large frequency shift
[22:59] <m1x10> what about the 100kohm? do i need to put it?
[22:59] <Randomskk> no, that's what it has inside
[22:59] <m1x10> ok
[23:00] <m1x10> the divided voltage will go to Vin of radio?
[23:00] <Randomskk> well, to TXD
[23:01] <m1x10> it says it needs 5v
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[23:01] <Randomskk> that's not what it means
[23:02] <m1x10> TXD input level (logic low) = 0v
[23:02] <m1x10> TXD input level (logic high) = 5.0
[23:03] <m1x10> it says with these voltages i will achieve up to 3khz deviation
[23:03] <Randomskk> however the produced frequency will vary with input voltage and you want about 350Hz shift between the mark and space frequencies so it can be decoded as RTTY
[23:04] <m1x10> anyway
[23:14] <m1x10> gnite all
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[00:00] --- Thu Aug 12 2010