highaltitude.log.20100713

[00:00] <Laurenceb> £50/meter is very cheap for space hardware
[00:00] <russss> trye
[00:01] <russss> true
[00:01] <Laurenceb> £5M would be expensive :P
[00:01] <SpeedEvil> The above fibre was fishing line
[00:01] <Laurenceb> yeah
[00:02] <Laurenceb> theres some poeple who claim to have better fibres, but spectra seems to be the best readily avaliable stuff
[00:02] <Laurenceb> " forces use of the solid rocket motors produced by Utah arms manufacturer ATK."
[00:02] <Laurenceb> argggg
[00:02] Action: Laurenceb facepalms
[00:02] <SpeedEvil> So broken.
[00:04] <SpeedEvil> Technology demonstration, encouraging the commercial sector, is what it should be doing.
[00:05] <Laurenceb> http://books.google.com/books?id=0xChTO0XbvoC&hl=en&dq=space%20tether&ei=d587TMWKKNeHOJnNvIoK&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CDkQ6AEwAw
[00:05] <Laurenceb> is an intersting read
[00:05] <russss> it is just stunning how this has completely flipped the political spectrum
[00:06] <russss> the liberals are arguing for a free market solution and the conservatives want heavy state intervention
[00:06] <russss> what the fuck
[00:06] <Laurenceb> heh
[00:06] Action: Laurenceb was wondering if you could deliberately set up oscillations on a rotovator to increase the tip speed
[00:07] <Laurenceb> would need to write some sim code
[00:07] <SpeedEvil> Spacex is awesome.
[00:07] <Laurenceb> sort of a whiplash effect
[00:07] <SpeedEvil> And the model of what should be attempted
[00:07] <Laurenceb> yeah - falcon9 is pretty much a perfect design
[00:08] <SpeedEvil> It will be especially interesting if they actually manage to demonstrate the flyback and recovery ideas
[00:08] <Laurenceb> yeah
[00:09] <russss> if I was in america I'd be getting quite pissed off at the government right now for this NASA bullshit
[00:09] <russss> as it stands I'm just amused.
[00:10] <SpeedEvil> The shuttle would have been awesome if it'd lived up to its promises.
[00:10] <SpeedEvil> It's just that it ended up - somewhat - being a money pit, and driving policy.
[00:10] <russss> the shuttle stopped living up to its promises about 5-10 years before it first flew.
[00:10] <SpeedEvil> 'Oh - we have a shuttle'
[00:10] <SpeedEvil> 'Therefore, we must launch shuttle sized payloads'.
[00:10] <SpeedEvil> -> Freedom ->Fred->ISS
[00:11] <SpeedEvil> Rather than considering stuff that might actually be more sane like on-orbit assembly skills, or inflatable structures.
[00:12] <russss> of course NASA was working on inflatable structures until they had to cancel it due to budget...
[00:12] <SpeedEvil> yes.
[00:13] <SpeedEvil> The political side of NASA _hates_ cheap solutions.
[00:14] <russss> they seem to have perfected the art of forcing NASA towards more expensive solutions by carefully modulating their budget.
[00:16] <SpeedEvil> venturestar/x33 was a comedic example.
[00:16] <SpeedEvil> Let's lower the cost of space access!
[00:16] <SpeedEvil> By using three seperate never-flown technologies on one vehicle!
[00:16] <SpeedEvil> Because that will be cheap!
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[00:35] <m1x10> I got an idea
[00:35] <m1x10> about controlled descending
[00:35] <m1x10> of the payload
[00:35] <m1x10> http://www.diydrones.com/profiles/blogs/arduimu-quadcopter-part-ii
[00:35] <m1x10> can a flight thing like this
[00:36] <m1x10> move the payload?
[00:36] <m1x10> we can give some target coordinates
[00:37] <m1x10> and make it fly there
[00:37] <m1x10> of course there is the usual parachute above
[00:39] <m1x10> or the payload is too heavy for it?
[00:39] <Randomskk> essentially the issue is legality, as well as things like jetstreams
[00:40] <m1x10> you command it to start the flight under some altitude
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[00:40] <m1x10> eg. at 5km
[00:40] <Randomskk> that's not the legality issue
[00:41] <Randomskk> the issue is that you're not allowed autonomous flying things, by and large
[00:41] <m1x10> hmm
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[01:21] <Laurenceb> if its a controlled chute then AIUI its legal
[01:21] <Laurenceb> a fixed wing isnt
[01:21] <Laurenceb> basically you're supposed to have a chute, and theres nothing to say it cant be controlled, but fixed wing is definately a UAV and has to be trated differently
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[08:28] <jcoxon> can someone explain the difference between so-239 and pl259
[08:29] <russss> SO is the SOcket and PL is the PLug :)
[08:30] <jcoxon> that was my conclusion :-p
[08:30] <jcoxon> thanks russss
[08:30] <russss> why they're 239 and 259 I don't know. Someone likes being awkward.
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[08:30] <jcoxon> i think its a very old standard
[08:30] <russss> also I dunno of any other sockets and plugs using the same notation
[08:31] <jcoxon> also is 10m of rg58 a bad idea
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[08:32] <russss> hmm
[08:32] <russss> I think there's something better than RG58
[08:32] <jcoxon> rg8x
[08:33] <jcoxon> of rg-213
[08:34] Action: jcoxon is buying a yagi
[08:34] <russss> that's the one, I have RG-213 I think
[08:36] <GW8RAK> Morning.
[08:36] <jcoxon> morning GW8RAK
[08:36] <jcoxon> hows the project going?
[08:37] <GW8RAK> If you are looking for a coax for 434 MHz, then I would recommend W103 from Westlake electronics. It's only a bit more expensive, but only half the attenutation.
[08:38] <GW8RAK> No progress on the project recently. Got back from 2 weeks in Italy on Sunday, so haven't thought about balloons at all.
[08:38] <jcoxon> GW8RAK, i'll have a look
[08:38] <GW8RAK> http://www.whwestlake.co.uk/
[08:40] <jcoxon> finally bitten the bullet and bought a yagi
[08:40] <jcoxon> fed up with my rubbishly made antennas
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[08:42] <GW8RAK> I've got to get a new driven element for my 21 ele 70cm yagi. Performance had deteriorated and on inspection, the connector was corroded. But it has been up a Welsh mountain for 10 years or so.
[08:42] <jcoxon> thats pretty good going - not always sunny there :-p
[08:43] <GW8RAK> And finally found a cheap Az/El rotator so need to install that. No controller with it, so there's another project.
[08:43] <jonsowman_work> morning jcoxon
[08:45] <jcoxon> good morning jonsowman
[08:45] <jcoxon> jonsowman_work,
[08:45] <jcoxon> nope bug not fixed yet
[08:45] <jonsowman_work> no worries :) wasn't around when you were on #highaltitude yesterday
[08:45] <jonsowman_work> how are things?
[08:45] <jcoxon> okay thanks
[08:45] <jcoxon> you?
[08:45] <jonsowman_work> yeh fine thanks
[08:46] <jonsowman_work> hoping weather improves a bit for saturday
[08:46] <jonsowman_work> http://hexoc.com/hab/predict/predict/#!/uuid=2779157a2648c92e830df001643f7408eab21ee2
[08:46] <jcoxon> hmmmm
[08:46] <jcoxon> does it have to be launched on sat?
[08:46] <jonsowman_work> yes, in reality
[08:46] <jcoxon> thats not a good flight path...
[08:47] <jonsowman_work> hmm i know
[08:47] <jonsowman_work> it was fine yesterday
[08:47] <jonsowman_work> cant really trust predictions this far before launch
[08:47] <jcoxon> it might settle down
[08:47] <jonsowman_work> yes
[08:47] <jonsowman_work> fingers crossed
[08:49] <jonsowman_work> http://balloon.hexoc.com/gallery/apex-ii/index.php/Launch-Predictions-for-17-07-10/set1-120710-1200
[08:49] <jonsowman_work> that was how it looked yesterday for the same parameters
[08:49] <jcoxon> oh well - you won't really know until thurs
[08:49] <jonsowman_work> yea
[08:51] <jonsowman_work> we can always whack the ascent rate up a bit
[08:51] <jonsowman_work> if that helps
[08:51] <jonsowman_work> also we have controlled cutdown (uplink), so we could use that to keep it on land if feasible
[08:54] <jcoxon> i'll be away for the launch but i'm sure it'll go well
[08:55] <jcoxon> if the weather is bad don't launch - you can always fly another day
[08:55] <jonsowman_work> indeed
[08:55] <jonsowman_work> thanks :)
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[08:57] <jonsowman_work> jcoxon: did you get anywhere at all with the bug?
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[08:58] <jonsowman_work> hi eroomde
[08:58] <eroomde> hi jonsowman_work
[08:58] <jcoxon> jonsowman_work, yeah i think i've pinpointed it
[08:59] <jonsowman_work> ah okay :)
[08:59] <jcoxon> but i need to build a cross-compiling environment to build a new binary
[08:59] <jcoxon> to test my theory
[08:59] <jonsowman_work> where's DanielRichman when you need him
[08:59] <eroomde> whatcha compiling for?
[09:00] <jcoxon> eroomde, there is a bug in the windows version of dl-fldigi
[09:00] <jcoxon> crashes if no internet
[09:00] <jcoxon> works fine on osx and linux
[09:01] <eroomde> h'ok
[09:01] <jonsowman_work> eroomde: it's going to cause problems on saturday for the launch as we'll be running it in the chase car
[09:01] <jonsowman_work> *cars
[09:01] <jonsowman_work> with unreliable 3g dongles
[09:01] <eroomde> there's always the python script :)
[09:01] <jonsowman_work> eroomde: python script?
[09:01] <jcoxon> eroomde, nnooooooo
[09:01] <jcoxon> ssshhhhhhh
[09:02] <eroomde> vanilla fldigi and a python script that parses the fldigi log file and plops it onto server
[09:02] <jonsowman_work> oh nice
[09:02] <jcoxon> it doesn't work any longer
[09:02] <eroomde> well it could be fixed
[09:02] <eroomde> afterall, all you need to do is curl a string top a server
[09:02] <eroomde> to*
[09:02] <jonsowman_work> i'm not sure how far back in dl-fldigi history the bug goes
[09:02] <jonsowman_work> wonder if older versions have it
[09:03] <jcoxon> jonsowman_work, its a new bug
[09:03] <jonsowman_work> oh right, so we could use an old version if nothing else...
[09:03] <jcoxon> oh yeah
[09:04] <eroomde> also i am on irc at work. this can only mean one thing - my Departmental wifi certificate is working finally! no more lapwing crap! jealous jonsowman_work?
[09:04] <jonsowman_work> D:
[09:04] <jcoxon> jonsowman_work, r85 is just fine
[09:04] <jcoxon> eroomde, would you like me to fix the python script just for you :-p
[09:04] <eroomde> :)
[09:05] <eroomde> it's nice to have alternatives
[09:05] <jonsowman_work> jcoxon: ok - so if the bug is unfixable by saturday we'll use r85
[09:05] <jcoxon> eroomde, just means that i have to maintain more things :-p
[09:05] <jonsowman_work> did that have custom shift?
[09:05] <jcoxon> no
[09:05] <jonsowman_work> ah
[09:05] <eroomde> would it be poss to have the option of supplying it a path to a log file as a command line argument?
[09:06] <eroomde> jcoxon, i don't mind being its maintainer iuw
[09:06] <jcoxon> eroomde, sure
[09:06] <eroomde> i'll happily takw that on
[09:06] <jcoxon> go for it - i'm not going to use it
[09:06] <jcoxon> :-p
[09:06] <eroomde> ok :)
[09:06] <eroomde> right, i should go and earn my keep
[09:06] <eroomde> see you all
[09:06] <jonsowman_work> bye eroomde
[09:07] <jcoxon> jonsowman_work, don't panic i've got a few days - will get something fixed
[09:07] <jonsowman_work> jcoxon: ok, thank you :)
[09:07] <jonsowman_work> i just don't trust the shift to stick at 425 with changing temperature
[09:07] <jcoxon> don't panic - we managed fine before custom shift
[09:08] <jonsowman_work> :)
[09:08] <jcoxon> it doesn't need to be exact
[09:08] <jonsowman_work> ah ok
[09:08] <jonsowman_work> to be honest the weather is my main concern at this point in time
[09:09] <jcoxon> right bbl
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[09:10] <jonsowman_work> !commands
[09:11] <jonsowman_work> :\
[09:11] <jonsowman_work> natrium42: ping
[09:17] <juxta> hey jonsowman_work
[09:18] <jonsowman_work> juxta: hello
[09:19] <juxta> are you planning to launch APEXII soon? :D
[09:19] <jonsowman_work> saturday
[09:19] <jonsowman_work> weather permitting
[09:19] <jonsowman_work> :)
[09:19] <juxta> awesome
[09:19] <juxta> if the weather behaves here I might launch again this weekend too
[09:20] <jonsowman_work> :D
[09:20] <jonsowman_work> good stuff
[09:20] <juxta> nothing fancy though
[09:20] <juxta> how'd you get on with the chase car plotting?
[09:21] <juxta> Rob gave me the heads up that my uploading data without altitude for the cars messes things up for those tracking in google earth, so it might be worth either modifying it to do alt also, or just passing say 500m
[09:27] <jonsowman_work> hmm ok
[09:27] <jonsowman_work> havent looked into it much yet
[09:27] <jonsowman_work> will do it soon though :)
[09:27] <juxta> no worries
[09:27] <jonsowman_work> waiting for the GPSes to arrive
[09:27] <jonsowman_work> should be here today I think
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[09:33] <jonsowman_work> hoping the weather gets a bit better before saturday!
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[09:34] <jonsowman_work> fergusnoble: hello :)
[09:34] <fergusnoble> hey jon
[09:34] <jonsowman_work> hows things?
[09:35] <jonsowman_work> havent spoken to you for ages
[09:35] <fergusnoble> not bad
[09:35] <fergusnoble> yeah i have been out of the scene for a while!
[09:36] <fergusnoble> how are you? anything new in the balloon world?
[09:36] <jonsowman_work> doing interesting things?
[09:36] <jonsowman_work> fergusnoble: yeah fine thanks! launching on saturday with any luck
[09:36] <fergusnoble> exams and now im working in the states over the summer
[09:36] <jonsowman_work> niice
[09:36] <jonsowman_work> what are you doing over there?
[09:36] <fergusnoble> high altitude wind power
[09:36] <fergusnoble> at a start up called joby energy
[09:37] <fergusnoble> mainly working on the gps henry sarted at cusf
[09:37] <jonsowman_work> fantastic
[09:37] <jonsowman_work> good stuff
[09:38] <fergusnoble> what are you up to over the summer?
[09:39] <fergusnoble> and what are you launching?
[09:41] <jonsowman_work> working for a few weeks, and just general relaxing
[09:41] <jonsowman_work> http://www.hexoc.com/pages/apex/apex-ii.php
[09:42] <jonsowman_work> standard payload but with loads of sensors including ionising radiation
[09:43] <fergusnoble> oh sweet
[09:43] <fergusnoble> right im going to bed
[09:43] <jonsowman_work> catch you later
[09:44] <fergusnoble> its a small world, just noticed adam is watching a repo on github of one of my flatmates here at joby :)
[09:44] <jonsowman_work> haha
[09:44] <jonsowman_work> nice
[09:44] <jonsowman_work> :)
[09:44] <fergusnoble> ok, speak to you later
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[09:45] <juxta> hey jonsowman, just looking at your photos now - what's the ATX PSU on the backseat for?
[09:45] <jonsowman_work> powering the IC-7000
[09:45] <juxta> why not just power it directly from the 12v in the car?
[09:45] <jonsowman_work> the manual says not to connect it directly to 12V cigarette lighter
[09:45] <juxta> oh, right
[09:46] <jonsowman_work> but I think that's only really for transmitting
[09:46] <juxta> yeah they suggest you do a direct battery connection
[09:46] <jonsowman_work> I think that's only an EMI thing
[09:46] <juxta> yeah, pretty much, and to protect it from spikes and the like you'll see when your A/C comes on and off
[09:47] <jonsowman_work> we will be using that radio for uplink so we'll need a direct battery connection
[09:47] <juxta> hmm
[09:47] <juxta> are you running the ATX psu from an inverter connected to the cig lighter?
[09:47] <jonsowman_work> for receiving when chasing we'll probably just whack it into the cig. lighter
[09:47] <jonsowman_work> juxta: yes
[09:47] <juxta> hm, how much TX power are you using?
[09:47] <jonsowman_work> up to 35W
[09:48] <jonsowman_work> likely to blow the fuse in the car
[09:48] <juxta> yeah
[09:48] <juxta> thats what I was thinking, usually only 10A
[09:48] <jonsowman_work> mm
[09:48] <juxta> plus the inneficiencies of the PSU and inverter
[09:48] <jonsowman_work> I believe its 20A in the only i'll be using
[09:48] <jonsowman_work> *one
[09:48] <juxta> you're probably down to 50% efficiency
[09:48] <jonsowman_work> will check the fuse and take spares though
[09:48] <jonsowman_work> anyway for uplink we'll connect direct to battery
[09:49] <juxta> oh right, no issues then, hehe
[09:49] <jonsowman_work> for listening I think we'll get away with cig lighter
[09:49] <fsphil> does it need to be 35 watts?
[09:49] <jonsowman_work> fsphil: we don't really know
[09:49] <jonsowman_work> we'll start lower, of course
[09:49] <jonsowman_work> i don't imaging the NiM2 receiver is all that sensitive
[09:49] <jonsowman_work> *imagine
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[09:49] <juxta> yeah you should be fine on the cig lighter, we did it like that earlier on too
[09:50] <jonsowman_work> :0
[09:50] <jonsowman_work> * :)
[09:50] <jonsowman_work> can't type today
[09:50] <jonsowman_work> I blame the keyboard
[09:50] <juxta> you coulld also put a 12v SLA in parallel between the cig lighter and the radio, help smooth any spikes out
[09:50] <juxta> and you could TX with that too
[09:51] <juxta> also, the ic-7000 looks awesome, hehe
[09:52] <jonsowman_work> it is a lovely radio
[09:52] <jonsowman_work> not mine - borrowed from Randomskk
[09:52] <jonsowman_work> might see if I can get a SLA anyway
[09:52] <juxta> i have the 706MKIIG, not as fancy as the 7000 though
[09:53] <jonsowman_work> by the way the car in the photos is not the one I'll be using for launch
[09:53] <jonsowman_work> the silver 307 in the photos only has a 10A fuse on the cig. lighter
[09:55] <juxta> do you have that big van that was on the Apex 1 page?
[09:55] <jonsowman_work> yep that's one of the chase vehicles again
[09:55] <juxta> awesome :D
[09:55] <jonsowman_work> park on hill, sit on roof with Yagi
[09:55] <jonsowman_work> \o/
[09:55] <juxta> how many chase cars are you having?
[09:56] <jonsowman_work> three inc. minibus
[09:56] <jonsowman_work> one doesn't have radio kit though
[09:56] <jonsowman_work> my car and the bus will have radio
[09:56] <juxta> nice, minibus for the rest of the team to go in?
[09:57] <jonsowman_work> yup
[09:57] <jonsowman_work> there's quite a lot of people involved as it was run by the school
[09:57] <juxta> nice, yeah I noticed the list was quite long
[09:57] <jonsowman_work> lots of the students did parts of the payload, eg Phone, Cameras, ionising radiation detectors
[09:57] <juxta> do you guys have to contend with bad roads there?
[09:57] <jonsowman_work> no they're mostly fine
[09:58] <juxta> lucky
[09:58] <juxta> I almost got bogged the other day ;p
[09:58] <jonsowman_work> ouch
[09:58] <jonsowman_work> no we definitely don't have that
[09:58] <juxta> haha
[09:59] <juxta> on 3 out of 3 launches we've had to deal with dirt roads in very poor condition
[09:59] <jonsowman_work> annoying
[09:59] <jonsowman_work> england is small :)
[09:59] <jonsowman_work> there's decent roads to pretty much wherever the payload lands
[10:00] <juxta> annoying for me, one of our chase cars is a big 4wd kitted out with diff lockers, adjustable suspension etc, he gets by no worries ;p
[10:00] <jonsowman_work> haha nice
[10:00] <jonsowman_work> that's what you want
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[10:10] <m1x10> hi mates
[10:12] <fsphil> aah your mag mount has rg58 .. mine has something thinner and I'm worried it's going to be too lossy :)
[10:12] <fsphil> morning m1x10
[10:14] <fsphil> what are you using the FT-60 for, or is that just testing?
[10:14] <jonsowman_work> we were using that for uplink
[10:15] <fsphil> playing the commands with a phone? cute
[10:15] <jonsowman_work> haha awful isn't it
[10:15] <jonsowman_work> I feel dirty
[10:15] <jonsowman_work> but USB-serial cables (or at least all the ones we've tried) have a strop when you try to make them to 37.5 baud
[10:16] <jonsowman_work> or in fact any baud other than the standard ones
[10:16] <jonsowman_work> so we just recorded the uplink commands as mp3s :)
[10:22] <m1x10> cool
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[10:34] <fsphil> man you'll have some explaining to do if you guys get pulled over by the police ;-)
[10:41] <jonsowman_work> haha
[10:41] <jonsowman_work> mm
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[10:45] <jonsowman_work> anyone know the command for zeusbot to state its commands?
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[10:46] <jonsowman_work> oh
[10:46] <jonsowman_work> what a guess
[10:46] <jonsowman_work> heh :)
[10:46] <jonsowman_work> oh
[10:47] <jonsowman_work> !learn melon "A fruit"
[10:47] <jonsowman_work> !learn add melon "A fruit"
[10:47] <jonsowman_work> maybe I should get on with some work now.
[10:53] Action: fsphil should, but fsphil is on holiday ;-)
[10:56] <jonsowman_work> lucky
[10:58] <fsphil> well kinda, going to have a mountain of work when I get back
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[11:38] <jonsowman_work> yay \o/
[11:38] <jonsowman_work> weather looking better for saturday again
[11:38] <jonsowman_work> http://hexoc.com/hab/predict/predict/#!/uuid=2779157a2648c92e830df001643f7408eab21ee2
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[11:58] <fsphil> is it changing much?
[12:08] <jonsowman_work> yeh
[12:09] <jonsowman_work> it was in the sea this morning
[12:09] <m1x10> Awesome tool
[12:09] <m1x10> HAB people got guts
[12:09] <m1x10> :)
[12:09] <m1x10> thats my map
[12:09] <m1x10> http://hexoc.com/hab/predict/predict/#!/uuid=943f73b2f4e29ec357263992760fdd2acc292034
[12:11] <fsphil> splish splash!
[12:11] <m1x10> hehe
[12:11] <fsphil> mine's in the atlantic if i launch this week, except wedensday - would be almost perfect
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[12:12] <fsphil> http://www.hexoc.com/hab/predict/predict/#!/uuid=9574259664ec130d2ebc34a37e168d3ab9311453
[12:12] <fsphil> Only a short drive, it would be ideal
[12:13] <m1x10> fsphil, you live in Ireland?
[12:13] <jonsowman_work> :)
[12:13] <m1x10> Irish ?
[12:13] <fsphil> well, northern irish :)
[12:13] <m1x10> wow
[12:13] <m1x10> are there redhead women ???????? :)
[12:13] <fsphil> there's a few about :)
[12:14] <m1x10> redhead chics rule
[12:14] <m1x10> Some people told me to look for work in Ireland.
[12:15] <m1x10> But I dont know if I can make it up there
[12:17] <fsphil> the economy in the republic is a bit iffy at the moment
[12:17] <fsphil> and it's not massively better here in the north
[12:18] <m1x10> yes, but here we got major problem. Young people start to plan about migrating to Europe
[12:19] <m1x10> Greece only at summer. :p
[12:20] <fsphil> aye, we don't have a summer ;-)
[12:20] <jonsowman_work> m1x10: did you just submit that location save request?
[12:21] <m1x10> yes
[12:21] <m1x10> was that bad?
[12:21] <m1x10> Agio Kyriaki is the name
[12:21] <jonsowman_work> no - no problem :)
[12:21] <m1x10> will you save it
[12:21] <m1x10> ?
[12:21] <jonsowman_work> yes
[12:21] <m1x10> Superb
[12:21] <jonsowman_work> will do it when I get home as I don't have access to my server from work
[12:21] <m1x10> is this software your work ?
[12:21] <jonsowman_work> no
[12:21] <jonsowman_work> fun :)
[12:21] <m1x10> who did this?
[12:21] <jonsowman_work> oh I see what you mean
[12:22] <jonsowman_work> yes, I did it
[12:22] <m1x10> omg
[12:22] <m1x10> and sometime ago
[12:22] <m1x10> i did some ajax and js
[12:22] <m1x10> and I though I know web programming
[12:22] <jonsowman_work> the predictor itself was written by Rich Wareham, and Randomskk helped with the python server-side
[12:22] <m1x10> :p
[12:22] <jonsowman_work> I wrote the interface etc
[12:23] <m1x10> awesome tool
[12:23] <jonsowman_work> the old one was terrible and annoying me, so I wrote the new one
[12:23] <m1x10> HAB is getting cooler and cooler
[12:23] <jonsowman_work> haha :)
[12:23] <m1x10> you brit or irish?
[12:23] <jonsowman_work> british
[12:23] <jonsowman_work> http://github.com/jonsowman/cusf-standalone-predictor
[12:23] <jonsowman_work> if you're interested
[12:24] <m1x10> cool
[12:24] <m1x10> cool, cooler, coolest
[12:31] <jonsowman_work> fsphil: how's the payload going?
[12:33] <m1x10> I just learned that using a barometer you can know your altitude :)
[12:33] <m1x10> reference: http://interactive-matter.org/2009/12/arduino-barometric-pressure-sensor-bmp085/
[12:33] <fsphil> pretty good now, the camera is behaving itself and I'm just soldering up the gps now
[12:34] <fsphil> lot more work on the receiving side to do, and I'm still missing the parachute
[12:34] <jonsowman_work> excellent
[12:34] <jonsowman_work> what's holding you back on parachute?
[12:34] <jonsowman_work> knowing payload mass?
[12:35] <fsphil> it was out of stock
[12:35] <jonsowman_work> oh ha
[12:35] <jonsowman_work> fair enough
[12:35] <fsphil> I have a smaller one but I don't think it would be all that effective
[12:38] <jonsowman_work> hmm yeh
[12:38] <jonsowman_work> same serial camera as last time?
[12:39] <fsphil> likely - I managed to get another version but with a lens instead of the pinhole
[12:39] <jonsowman_work> ah very nice
[12:40] <jonsowman_work> different encoding or anything to get round the missing blocks in images last time?
[12:40] <fsphil> I haven't tested it yet but I'm hoping the lens version captures less noisy images
[12:40] <jonsowman_work> :)
[12:40] <jonsowman_work> great stuff, sounds good
[12:40] <fsphil> it should be able to recover from small gaps better this time, I added code to pad out missing data
[12:40] <jonsowman_work> right
[12:41] <fsphil> it will probably still loose the odd block though, so I'm thinking of ways to fix the received jpeg
[12:49] <jonsowman_work> hmm yeh
[12:50] <jonsowman_work> definitely something i want to try in the future
[13:03] <fsphil> it is very neat seeing the images from through live
[13:03] <fsphil> from=come
[13:04] <GW8RAK> fsphil - using these serial interface cameras, do they store a picture and then download it on request, or is it downloaded automatically and the receiving unit has to be ready for it?
[13:05] <fsphil> in jpeg mode, they store the image and is downloaded in blocks
[13:06] <fsphil> raw mode they just dump the entire image in one go
[13:06] <GW8RAK> Okay, thanks for that info.
[13:06] <fsphil> they only store one image at a time, and you have to process it fairly quickly or it goes to sleep and the image is lost
[13:07] <fsphil> though I've found that re-sync'ing seems to keep it awake
[13:07] <GW8RAK> Understood. I don't have plans at this stage for "live" images, but if time, money and enthusisam permit.....
[13:10] Action: DanielRichman waves
[13:12] <fsphil> o/
[13:14] Nick change: MoALTz_ -> MoALTz
[13:18] <jonsowman_work> DanielRichman: hello!
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[13:19] <DanielRichman> note: high latency ssh for symbian connection
[13:20] <jonsowman_work> fair enough
[13:21] <jonsowman_work> hi natrium42
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[13:41] <jonsowman_work> DanielRichman: you on holiday?
[13:47] <DanielRichman> yeah
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[13:52] <DanielRichman> jonsowman_work, do you know if jcoxon managed to get his win32 build working?
[13:52] <jonsowman_work> that is what I was going to ask you about
[13:52] <jonsowman_work> I don't think he did
[13:52] <jonsowman_work> he hasn't managed to fix that bug anyhow
[13:56] <DanielRichman> :-(
[13:57] <jonsowman_work> i think he's found the source of the bug
[13:57] <jonsowman_work> but is unable to fix at the moment
[13:57] <DanielRichman> well in order to build on win32 it should be as simple as checking out my repo of bash scripts and running ./auto
[13:58] <DanielRichman> cool well at some point later this week I'll look to see if I've been hilighted
[13:58] <jonsowman_work> okay
[13:58] <jonsowman_work> james was wanting to speak to you yesterday but you weren't around
[13:59] <DanielRichman> it's easier if I can get the whole story from my hilight window rather than having to page up to the context though
[14:00] <jonsowman_work> OK
[14:00] <DanielRichman> cool :-)
[14:02] <jonsowman_work> that bug will cause issues if not fixed by saturday
[14:02] <jonsowman_work> i'm sure it will be though :)
[14:07] <DanielRichman> :x thread safety fun!
[14:08] <DanielRichman> has jcoxon given any clue as to where the bug lies?
[14:09] <jonsowman_work> yes, but helpfully, I don't remember
[14:09] <jonsowman_work> it'll be in my IRC logs at home
[14:10] <fsphil> my logs don't go back that far, but I remember when I looked at the line number he said it was an fprintf in dl_fldigi.cxx
[14:11] <fsphil> for when a call to curl failed
[14:14] <fsphil> trying your scripts on fedora DanielRichman
[14:20] <DanielRichman> so something in curl failed, but that was caught and it was the fprintf that caused the segfault? Sounds like two bugs, not one. Come to think of it, libc IO calls arm't t-safe, but such repeatability suggests something else
[14:21] <fsphil> that was my impression, though I didn't ask more about it
[14:22] <fsphil> though that fprint line seems innocent enough
[14:43] <DanielRichman> well the buffered libc file calls themselves are safe but not if two threads try to use the same FILE* struct
[14:44] <DanielRichman> anyway, be back later
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[16:39] <jonsowman_work> hi jcoxon - left you a msg via zeusbot
[16:41] <jcoxon> hi jonsowman
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[16:42] <jcoxon> hehe zeusbot msgs make me smile
[16:42] <jcoxon> especially when you get told by the person that they've left you a message
[16:43] #highaltitude: mode change '+o jcoxon' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
[16:43] Topic changed on #highaltitude by jcoxon!jcoxon@host86-163-57-94.range86-163.btcentralplus.com: Welcome to #highaltitude - discuss anything to do with high altitude projects (balloons, gliders, etc) www.ukhas.org.uk,
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[17:19] <m1x10> I heard that lithium batteries work better in cold places
[17:19] <m1x10> but why do we need them when the payload is protected from cold?
[17:20] <LA3QMA> less weight
[17:20] <jcoxon> because its not that cold
[17:20] <LA3QMA> more power
[17:20] <m1x10> I sew a graph where 20C was the average temperature inside the box
[17:20] <jcoxon> oops
[17:20] <jcoxon> not that warm
[17:20] <jcoxon> i mean
[17:20] <jcoxon> most batteries fail if they go below even 0degC
[17:21] <jcoxon> m1x10, that is very rare
[17:21] <jcoxon> most payloads go to about -10 or -20
[17:21] <m1x10> my canon A480 takes NiMH batteries
[17:21] <m1x10> is that bad?
[17:22] <jcoxon> m1x10, AA batteries?
[17:22] <m1x10> yes
[17:22] <jcoxon> just use lithiums instead
[17:22] <jcoxon> it should cope
[17:23] <m1x10> 2x Size-AA Alkaline or NiMH Batteries (Alkalines supplied)
[17:23] <m1x10> http://www.dpreview.com/news/0901/09011504canonpowershota480.asp
[17:23] <jcoxon> m1x10, http://www.energizer.com/products/hightech-batteries/lithium/pages/lithium-batteries.aspx
[17:23] <jcoxon> they are designed for cameras
[17:26] <m1x10> i should go check the supermarket
[17:26] <LA3QMA> have used them in -15 when we used a week skiing. the gps and this satelitebeacon thing was working all the time.
[17:27] <LA3QMA> cost a bit more but worth the money
[17:27] <jcoxon> LA3QMA, completely agree - they are worth the money
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[17:28] <LA3QMA> nothing more annoying when your magic gadget doesnt work because of powerfailiure
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[17:48] <m1x10> 1. supermarket got the lithium :)
[17:49] <m1x10> 2. cost 5.5 euros and weights less
[17:49] <m1x10> 3. powered on my canon
[17:49] <m1x10> :) :)
[17:51] <jonsowman> hi jcoxon
[17:51] <jonsowman> sorry - left work just as you spoke
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[18:13] <jonsowman> hi natrium42
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[19:24] <Randomskk> jonsowman: yo
[19:24] <Randomskk> did accommodation for me in cambridge get sorted in the end?
[19:28] <jonsowman> Randomskk: hi
[19:28] <jonsowman> i believe so, will check now
[19:29] <Randomskk> cool. apex still all green to go?
[19:29] <jonsowman> yup
[19:29] <jonsowman> indeed
[19:29] <jonsowman> predictions currently looking spot on
[19:30] <jonsowman> http://hexoc.com/hab/predict/predict/#!/uuid=2779157a2648c92e830df001643f7408eab21ee2
[19:31] <Randomskk> sweet
[19:31] <Randomskk> that would be very happy
[19:31] <Randomskk> fingers crossed
[19:33] <jonsowman> yup
[19:34] <Randomskk> was that yup a confirm of accommodation or just apex being good to go?
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[19:41] <Randomskk> hi fergusnoble
[19:42] <fergusnoble> hey adam
[19:42] <fergusnoble> hows it going?
[19:42] <Randomskk> not bad thanks, doing software dev in c++ for industrial exp/work this summer
[19:43] <Randomskk> but it's like a 30min drive down the A3 in a nice research park by the university of surrey
[19:43] <Randomskk> quadcopter is still mothballed until I get off work but I've got a little time in the evenings to do other stuff
[19:43] <Randomskk> I hear you're stateside now?
[19:45] <fergusnoble> yeah
[19:45] <Randomskk> sounds like fun times
[19:45] <jonsowman> Randomskk: apex
[19:45] <fergusnoble> working on high altitude wind power at a company called joby energy
[19:46] <Randomskk> is this the place that seems to be sucking all the cool people up? :P
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[19:46] <fergusnoble> yeah - piotr esden-tempski is there btw
[19:46] <fergusnoble> i saw you were watching his github
[19:47] <Randomskk> hehe yup
[19:47] <Randomskk> small world indeed
[19:47] <Randomskk> my work is mostly analysis of gps logs/live data from people driving, so not quite as exciting but still quite interesting
[19:47] <Randomskk> brb dinner
[19:47] <fergusnoble> kk
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[20:04] <Randomskk> back
[20:32] <SpeedEvil> La
[20:32] <SpeedEvil> oops
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[20:36] <rjharrison> FYI 4.7Kohms is not 4.7ohms :)
[20:36] <rjharrison> DS1821S likes 4.7k
[20:40] <Hiena> Nah, it's just a minor error.
[20:44] <Hiena> Btw, today i made a great catch. As i walked to home from the railway station, saw a few bended tubes and an UHF Yagi in the bushes. Both the tubes and the Yagi seemed as somebody just disposed there. I stop for a moment with a common "pick it up or not pick it up that is the question" puzzlement, and i was weak.
[20:46] <SpeedEvil> :)
[20:51] <Hiena> So i pick up the loot and a headed to home. The Yagi was made DIY style, very-very rusty screws, blackened at some pouint, had strange light green coating, and was kind of heavy. It made me suspicious, and at home dumped the tubes to the junkpile, and scratched the yagi dipoles with my pocket knife. Found out, the whole yagi was made from copper! It weights about 1.5 kg, the dipoles made from 6mm diameter rod, the holder made from 10mm rod.
[20:52] <russss> heh
[20:52] <russss> you can probably sell it as scrap, if nothing else
[20:57] <Hiena> No way. I'm thinking to polish it up, coat with transparent varnish, and fit to my roof.
[20:59] <Hiena> From it's size, it would be perfect for the DVB-T channel.
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[22:04] <jcoxon> evening all
[22:04] <Randomskk> hi jcoxon
[22:04] <jcoxon> jonsowman, need DanielRichman to fix the bug
[22:04] <jcoxon> no idea
[22:06] <jonsowman> okay no worries
[22:06] <jonsowman> thank you for trying :)
[22:06] <jcoxon> though managed to get the build environment up and running
[22:06] <jonsowman> :D
[22:07] <jcoxon> so can now roll windows binaries
[22:07] <jonsowman> excellent
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[22:27] <jcoxon> ping fsphil
[22:29] <jonsowman> DanielRichman: when are you back from holiday?
[22:29] <fsphil> pong!
[22:29] <jcoxon> dl-fldigi question for you
[22:30] <jcoxon> you know the configuration window - its different for the --hab version
[22:30] <jcoxon> what defines which tabs appear?
[22:31] <fsphil> hmm
[22:32] <jcoxon> if you open confdialog.fi you get the vanilla version
[22:33] <fsphil> there's a function in dl_fldigi.cxx called altTabs() that removes some tabs
[22:34] <fsphil> fl_digi.cxx even
[22:34] <jcoxon> oh great
[22:34] <jcoxon> thanks
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[22:46] <jonsowman> ping m1x10
[22:47] <jonsowman> added your location to the v2 predictor
[22:47] <m1x10> hwy
[22:48] <m1x10> hey :P
[22:48] <m1x10> thanks
[22:48] <jonsowman> you're welcome
[22:48] <m1x10> pretty cool
[22:49] <m1x10> its a potential location
[22:49] <m1x10> not sure yet if I launch from there
[22:49] <m1x10> first I need to know if there are HAMS digipiters around this place
[22:49] <jonsowman> :)
[22:49] <m1x10> so I get my balloon tracked by many
[22:49] <jonsowman> bedtime - night guys
[22:50] <m1x10> ok
[22:50] <m1x10> goodnight
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[23:38] <stilldavid> yay crowdsourcing!
[23:38] <stilldavid> http://www.flickr.com/photos/stilldavid/4628722258/in/set-72157624101347600/
[23:39] <stilldavid> I didn't even have to do any work :)
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[00:00] --- Wed Jul 14 2010