highaltitude.log.20100412

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[00:15] <fsphil> night all
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[08:44] <juxta> earthshine: you in?
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[11:22] <Laurenceb> SpeedEvil: http://pastebin.com/UA3F83qs
[11:22] <Laurenceb> looks sensible?
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[11:25] <SpeedEvil> looks ballpark, yes.
[11:26] <SpeedEvil> that's the 'medium' length sequence?
[11:26] <Laurenceb> log
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[11:26] <Laurenceb> http://www.mauve.plus.com/log
[11:26] <Laurenceb> thats from that one
[11:26] <Laurenceb> the residual is equivalent to 0.2degrees rms error
[11:27] <Laurenceb> so pretty good
[11:32] <Laurenceb> I'm trying it on log2 now
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[11:45] <sbasuita> http://www.mauve.plus.com/output.03092009 http://www.mauve.plus.com/output.12092009
[11:45] <sbasuita> >_>
[11:47] <Laurenceb> awesome
[11:50] <Laurenceb> automated shopping ftw
[11:51] <SpeedEvil> ah
[11:52] <SpeedEvil> how'd you find those - not linked
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[11:59] <SpeedEvil> ah
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[12:07] <Laurenceb> hmm finding stationary points is actually fairly hard
[12:07] <Laurenceb> still seems to be missing a few...
[12:07] <user__> some may be slow drifts
[12:08] <Laurenceb> I'm going through the data with a rolling window 0.4s long and finding the standard deviation
[12:08] <user__> if the phone was not quite stationary
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[12:08] <Laurenceb> then if it goes below 3 times the accel noise floor a stationary point starts
[12:08] <Laurenceb> then if its inside a stationary period it has to go above 5 times the noise loor to come out
[12:09] <Laurenceb> could probably improve it by low pass filtering the standard dev data set
[12:12] <Laurenceb> http://pastebin.com/MyeYLtgY <- looks a good convergence, but the result seems dodgy
[12:14] <Laurenceb> 9.4% cross axis is very high
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[12:38] <SpeedEvil> hmm
[12:38] <SpeedEvil> do the different datasets produce different results?
[12:39] <Laurenceb> yes, but more importantly, if I tweak the stationary point finder so it find +-3 or so points
[12:39] <Laurenceb> that shifts the results by up to %5 :(
[12:39] <SpeedEvil> hmm
[12:40] <Laurenceb> maybe as the points arent spread out evenly
[12:40] <Laurenceb> its producing a good fit on one area and non in others, but the averaging effect makes that solution preferable
[12:41] <Laurenceb> maybe I could add some weighting...
[12:42] <Laurenceb> or perhaps a calibration procedure where its put in set positions designed to spread out the attitudes
[12:42] <SpeedEvil> yeah - I was somewhat trying to do that - but some attitudes are difficult.
[12:42] <Laurenceb> I think I actually go better results before, as it was tracing out arcs
[12:42] <SpeedEvil> I could setup something a bit less hacky
[12:42] <Laurenceb> despite the hand noise
[12:42] <Laurenceb> thing is I want an easy way to calibrate so it canbe done in the field
[12:43] <Laurenceb> bbl
[12:44] <SpeedEvil> yeah
[12:51] <juxta> hi all
[12:51] <jonsowman> hi juxta
[12:52] <juxta> hey jonsowman
[12:52] <juxta> I've been away a bit of late - looks like I missed a US flight
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[14:10] <ProjectCirrus> I'm having major issues trying to make a bazooka dipole
[14:11] <ProjectCirrus> just cannot get the braid to thread back over itself!
[14:12] <ProjectCirrus> would a 1/4 wave whip with no ground plane have a fairly spherical radiation pattern?
[14:13] <junderwood> ProjectCirrus, You can construct a ground plane using 4 radial wires.
[14:14] <ProjectCirrus> the problem is that i have another antennae that is out the bottom so i want to locate this one on the top of payload
[14:15] <junderwood> I'm pretty sure the impedance matching would be shot without either a ground plane or the braid reversed
[14:15] <earthshine> afternoon
[14:15] <ProjectCirrus> but ground plane would squash my radiation pattern
[14:15] <ProjectCirrus> can i use a ground plane that would still allow signal downwards?
[14:15] <junderwood> Hmm.
[14:16] <junderwood> Rather than using the braid, why not turn back and inch of braid and then extend using a different conductor (Aluminium foil)>
[14:16] <junderwood> ?
[14:16] <ProjectCirrus> was considering that
[14:16] <ProjectCirrus> would it work?
[14:17] <junderwood> as long as you get a good electrical connection between the foil and screen
[14:17] <junderwood> I would put the foil over the screen and secure using heat shrink
[14:17] <ProjectCirrus> would thickness of foil matter?
[14:18] <junderwood> I don't THINK so but IANAE
[14:18] <ProjectCirrus> i wonder what it would do to velocity factor
[14:21] <ProjectCirrus> might cut the braid slide it on then resolder
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[14:37] <Laurenceb> SpeedEvil: there was a coding error, just rerunning it
[14:37] <Laurenceb> http://pastebin.com/LQ0BSC42 <- thats the script
[14:40] <epictetus> 7
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[15:38] <earthshine> 8
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[15:55] <ProjectCirrus> good.... the soldered braid version seems to work.... hard to know if it hurt performance though
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[17:17] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[17:35] <earthshine> hi
[17:35] <Lunar_Lander> how
[17:35] <Lunar_Lander> 's life?
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[17:52] <earthshine> plodding along
[17:52] <earthshine> and you ?
[17:56] <Lunar_Lander> radioing
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[19:51] <ProjectCirrus> anyone ever installed microsoft net. framework 2 on a pda using vista or win 7?
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[20:58] <Upu> Evening guys
[20:58] <Upu> You got a new porject : http://ava.upuaut.net/ :)
[20:58] <Upu> project as well
[21:01] <DanielRichman> Upu, thank goodness you decided to join the IRC channel! Hello!
[21:03] <Upu> hi there :)
[21:03] <Upu> Well I tend to live on IRC so this is normal to me :)
[21:04] <DanielRichman> excellent
[21:04] <Upu> Going to be quite a while till I fly I suspect
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[21:15] <russss> just got my cheap chinese radios, heh
[21:16] <russss> came with a free pen!
[21:23] <Upu> lol
[21:23] <ProjectCirrus> thats the antennae!
[21:23] <russss> they are surprisingly good for £30 each
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[21:30] <Upu> so what's the cheapest place in the Uk to get the NTX2's ?
[21:31] <jonsowman> Upu: is it an educational project?
[21:31] <Upu> Well I'm learning as I go along :)
[21:31] <Upu> but no
[21:31] <jonsowman> if so, radiometrix are very good about educational discounts
[21:31] <jonsowman> ah right
[21:32] <jonsowman> perhaps farnell? their price for the NTX2 seems to vary a lot
[21:32] <Upu> so Farnell then ?
[21:32] <Upu> Yeah about £24 I think at the moment
[21:32] <jonsowman> hmm theyve been cheaper
[21:33] <Upu> I'm in no rush for one need to get the rest of it working first
[21:33] <jonsowman> fair enough :)
[21:33] <jonsowman> how far along are you in the project?
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[21:34] <Upu> Just started, had an interest for years but didn't think you could do it in the UK. I don't know why I just assumed they would end in the sea
[21:34] <Upu> then found this place :)
[21:35] <jonsowman> ah fair enough
[21:35] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/
[21:35] <jonsowman> good stuff, look forward to it
[21:35] <jonsowman> cool
[21:35] <jonsowman> will check that out
[21:35] <Upu> its not very interesting at the moment
[21:36] <Upu> I need to get the Surface Mount GPS on a surface :)
[21:36] <jonsowman> haha
[21:36] <jonsowman> sounds good
[21:37] <jonsowman> keep us updated on how it goes
[21:37] <jonsowman> a brief page/desc on the UKHAS wiki might be worth it
[21:39] <Upu> yeah sure
[21:39] <jonsowman> whereabouts are you based?
[21:39] <Upu> I need to learn most of this again, I have a degree in Electronic Engineering but I've not used it in 15 years
[21:39] <Upu> Halifax
[21:40] <Upu> 30 mins from Mr Icarus
[21:40] <jonsowman> cool
[21:40] <jonsowman> i'm sure it'll all come flooding back
[21:40] <jonsowman> haha
[21:40] <Upu> well things have moved on a little (sounding old now)
[21:40] <jonsowman> that's true
[21:40] <Upu> I wish I'd had an Arduino when I did my final year project
[21:40] <jonsowman> they're pretty fantastic
[21:41] <Upu> I used PICS
[21:42] <Upu> Always had an interest in this sort of thing, my dad tied a polaroid camera to a kite once :) It's all his fault
[21:42] <jonsowman> haha
[21:42] <jonsowman> produces very nice pictures and video that
[21:42] <jonsowman> i must try it
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[21:43] <jonsowman> can get car-key sized 720p video cameras for around £10
[21:43] <jonsowman> be interesting to strap to a kit
[21:43] <jonsowman> *kite
[21:43] <Upu> yeah sure deal extreme have something
[21:44] <Upu> http://www.dealextreme.com/ my favourite purveyors of all things tack
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[21:44] <jonsowman> something to look into during the summer I think
[21:44] <Laurenceb> hi all
[21:44] <jonsowman> hi Laurenceb
[21:45] <Upu> There you go http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.34384
[21:45] <Upu> Evening
[21:46] <jonsowman> brb
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[21:49] <Laurenceb> http://i.imgur.com/RliTm.png <- interesting - thats accel noise from the n900 over a 0.4s rolling window
[21:49] <Laurenceb> you can see where its put down quite clearly
[21:51] <SpeedEvil> hmm, yes.
[21:51] <SpeedEvil> jonsowman: seen the helicopter rotor mounted one?
[21:52] <Laurenceb> interestingly the noise floor is about 3 times higher than you would expect from the datahseet
[21:52] <russss> hm, well I can't pick up anything on 2m with this thing ;)
[21:52] <SpeedEvil> the datasheet barely mentions noise
[21:52] <russss> has a piddly little antenna anyhow
[21:52] <Laurenceb> 220ug/sqrt(hz) ?
[21:52] <SpeedEvil> YThat is also in 400hz mode - it's a lot quieter at 100hz
[21:52] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: it does? I don't recall that.
[21:52] <SpeedEvil> k
[21:53] <Laurenceb> maybe power supply noise, or the internal low pass filter was incorrectly set
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[21:54] <SpeedEvil> possibly
[21:54] <Laurenceb> interestingly I get 3KHz bandwidth exactly
[21:54] <Laurenceb> if I work out what bandwidth would lead to the observed noise
[21:55] <Laurenceb> isnt that the max setting?
[21:55] <SpeedEvil> I should have a look at the kernel driver
[21:55] <SpeedEvil> also want to enable tap events
[21:57] <Laurenceb> t some good results from log2 - it found 33 stationary points
[21:57] <Laurenceb> and the residual error was down to about 0.5millradians
[21:58] <Upu> Am I allowed to create an account on the wiki edit the projects page and add mine to it ?
[21:58] <Laurenceb> http://pastebin.com/YfqM9WzA
[21:58] <Laurenceb> Upu: yes, but youll need a password
[21:59] <Upu> It sent me one
[22:00] <Laurenceb> SpeedEvil: any chance you could do another dataset similar to log2 to check for consistency?
[22:00] <Laurenceb> sorry its rather tedious
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[22:12] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/projects:ava
[22:13] <Upu> There you go sorted half way there now ;)
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[22:25] <earthshine> evening
[22:26] <LazyLeopard> Hi Mike
[22:29] <earthshine> Hi Rick
[22:29] <earthshine> Haven't seen you on here for a while
[22:30] <LazyLeopard> Was away over Easter, and have been busy re-decorating some of the rest of the time. Computer's displaced, so is more of a pain to use...
[22:31] <LazyLeopard> How's your payload coming on?
[22:32] <earthshine> slowly - but i'm getting there
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[22:33] <LazyLeopard> Good.
[22:34] <earthshine> working on the code at the moment to take the NMEA string, parse it and sent it out to the transmitter in the UKHAS format
[22:34] <LazyLeopard> I've got an old Vaio laptop wit Ubuntu on it. Need to get dl-fldigi working on it sometime...
[22:35] <fsphil> hey all
[22:35] <fsphil> did some range tests today .. was able to decode an image from about 100 metres away, through about 5 houses and little more than a wire antenna
[22:36] <earthshine> good
[22:36] <fsphil> yep, bit more confident it'll work now
[22:36] <earthshine> Rick - the guys have been working on a ner version of dl-fldigi to transmit images
[22:36] <earthshine> *new
[22:37] <LazyLeopard> Yeah, I've caught bits of that conversation. ;)
[22:37] <fsphil> sort of like a very very slow scan tv ;)
[22:37] <earthshine> yep
[22:38] <earthshine> it will be cool to see images whilst the payload is in flight though
[22:39] <LazyLeopard> Aye
[22:39] <earthshine> got your licence yet ?
[22:40] Action: fsphil is now MI6VIM
[22:41] <fsphil> anyone know if DanielRichman got the win32 build working?
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[22:48] <earthshine> no idea
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[23:07] <fsphil> ping jcoxon
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[23:10] <jcoxon> hey fsphil
[23:10] <fsphil> hiya jcoxon, can I fire up the dl-client and send a few strings -- see if it all works?
[23:10] <jcoxon> sure
[23:11] <jcoxon> do you have an xml file?
[23:11] <fsphil> nope
[23:11] <jcoxon> can you post a copy of a telem string please
[23:11] <jcoxon> i'll make one
[23:11] <fsphil> k, one sec
[23:12] <fsphil> $$hadie,3,22:10:24,54.650406,-6.747797,114.1,13*FC93
[23:14] <jcoxon> what are the fields?
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[23:16] <fsphil> count, hh:mm:ss, lat (deg), lng (deg), altitude, status * checksum
[23:17] <jcoxon> and the rtty details?
[23:17] <fsphil> 300 baud, 530 shift (bit odd I know), 8-bit ascii, 1.5 stop bits, no parity
[23:18] <jcoxon> is 530 a setting on fldigi? or custom?
[23:19] <fsphil> custom
[23:19] <fsphil> it's not one of the presets
[23:19] <jcoxon> okay
[23:20] <jcoxon> will put it as 350 just to make the loading of the xml happy
[23:20] <fsphil> aye
[23:20] <jcoxon> using new fldigi?
[23:20] <fsphil> yep .. though it's not the latest
[23:21] <fsphil> must update that now
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[23:21] <jcoxon> okay well reload the xml list and you should be able to select hadie and then send some test strings
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[23:28] <fsphil> it sends out the strings between images, just waiting on that now
[23:29] <jcoxon> when is this going to fly?
[23:30] <fsphil> there they go
[23:30] <fsphil> friday I think
[23:30] <jcoxon> oh wow
[23:30] <fsphil> but I loose the payload tomorrow
[23:31] <fsphil> the module I mean, ProjectCirrus will be up tomorrow to intergrate it into the payload
[23:31] <jcoxon> oh okay
[23:31] <jcoxon> right need to fix the xml file, one sec
[23:31] <fsphil> k
[23:33] <jcoxon> right, altitude as a decimal
[23:33] <jcoxon> okay reload the xml now
[23:34] <fsphil> that did the trick
[23:34] <fsphil> it's showing the position on the hab interface
[23:34] <jcoxon> oh i pushed one string through to check
[23:35] <jcoxon> looks good
[23:35] <fsphil> checksum ok?
[23:35] <jcoxon> keep testing though
[23:36] <jcoxon> yeah checksum is valid
[23:36] <fsphil> more strings in a few minutes
[23:36] <fsphil> I wonder if that altitude is accurate
[23:38] <jcoxon> :-D
[23:39] <jcoxon> great
[23:39] <jcoxon> seems to be working
[23:39] <fsphil> fantastic
[23:40] <jcoxon> whats the flight called?
[23:40] <jcoxon> I'll change the title to that
[23:40] <fsphil> Project Cirrus
[23:41] <jcoxon> website?
[23:41] <fsphil> hmm.. there main module will also be sending strings
[23:41] <jcoxon> is that setup yet?
[23:41] <fsphil> http://projectcirrus.wordpress.com/
[23:41] <fsphil> I don't believe so ... ping ProjectCirrus
[23:41] <ProjectCirrus> nope
[23:42] <jcoxon> want it to be?
[23:43] <fsphil> ack, firefox crashed
[23:43] <ProjectCirrus> yes please!
[23:43] <jcoxon> ProjectCirrus, you'll have to send me an email with some sample telem and the field details and rtty details
[23:43] <jcoxon> as i've got to get some sleep
[23:44] <jcoxon> will fix it tomorrow
[23:44] <fsphil> sleep.. forgot about that!
[23:44] <jcoxon> haha i wish
[23:45] <fsphil> that's really neat -- who's responsible for the tracker, or is it a team effort?
[23:45] <jcoxon> myself and danielrichman do dl-fldigi, rjharrison does the listening server backend and natrium42 does the tracker
[23:45] <jcoxon> if you contact him in advance he'll setup the real time prediciton for your
[23:46] <fsphil> it's a brilliant system
[23:46] <jcoxon> needs to download the wind data a little in advance
[23:46] <jcoxon> lots more to do :-p
[23:46] <jcoxon> fsphil, there is actually a feature which would allow you to upload images to the tracker
[23:46] <fsphil> oh always :)
[23:46] <fsphil> that was my next question lol
[23:47] <jcoxon> if you refresh it'll now show the picture bar
[23:47] <fsphil> see it
[23:48] <jcoxon> see http://ukhas.org.uk/projects:tracker#usage about live images
[23:48] <jcoxon> easy bit of scripting
[23:48] <jcoxon> could even add it to dl-fldigi if you are bored
[23:49] <fsphil> I probably will, most of the curl + thread work has already been done there
[23:49] <fsphil> domain.com == spacenear.us?
[23:49] <jcoxon> yes
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[23:49] <ProjectCirrus> will send example telem tomorrow night
[23:49] <fsphil> thanks
[23:49] <jcoxon> right sleep
[23:49] <natrium42> fsphil, you can upload images to spacenear.us btw
[23:49] <jcoxon> any questions -> natrium42
[23:49] <jcoxon> haha
[23:49] <jcoxon> night
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[23:50] <natrium42> :)
[23:50] <fsphil> hiya natrium42, jcoxon was just telling me about that
[23:50] <natrium42> http://ukhas.org.uk/projects:tracker#live_pictures
[23:52] <fsphil> I've a bit more hacking to do on the module tomorrow, but I'll get back to the ssdv stuff after that. the image bit seems really easy
[23:52] <natrium42> it's quite easy to script, and i can enable the picture view on the tracker, if you want to play with it
[23:52] <natrium42> kk
[23:52] <fsphil> it's already on I think
[23:52] <natrium42> pics ftw :)
[23:52] <fsphil> pics are cool
[23:52] <fsphil> *if* it works
[23:52] <fsphil> ;-)
[23:52] <natrium42> oh, yeah
[23:52] <fsphil> yea it'll work
[23:54] <fsphil> midnight approaches, time to sleep. g'night all!
[23:55] <natrium42> nite
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[00:00] --- Tue Apr 13 2010