highaltitude.log.20100208

[00:21] rjmunro (~chatzilla@87.127.91.51) left irc: Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.5.7/20091221151141]
[00:22] edmoore (~ed@pluto.trinhall.cam.ac.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[00:25] Laurenceb_ (~laurence@host86-141-239-7.range86-141.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 248 seconds
[00:26] edmoore (~ed@pluto.trinhall.cam.ac.uk) left irc: Client Quit
[00:29] edmoore_ (~836f0142@gateway/web/freenode/x-rejcuftrkqysglrn) left irc: Ping timeout: 248 seconds
[00:43] Endeavour (~Endeavour@r74-192-221-200.bcstcmta02.clsttx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer
[00:54] Endeavour (~Endeavour@r74-192-221-200.bcstcmta02.clsttx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net) joined #highaltitude.
[00:57] natrium42 (~natrium42@CPE000625d867e2-CM0014045885be.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 246 seconds
[01:42] Endeavour (~Endeavour@r74-192-221-200.bcstcmta02.clsttx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer
[01:53] Endeavour (~Endeavour@r74-192-221-200.bcstcmta02.clsttx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net) joined #highaltitude.
[02:19] natrium42 (~natrium42@CPE000625d867e2-CM0014045885be.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #highaltitude.
[02:20] <natrium42> o/
[02:22] Nick change: natrium42 -> natriumCA
[03:17] natrium_ (~natrium42@CPE000625d867e2-CM0014045885be.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #highaltitude.
[03:20] natriumCA (~natrium42@CPE000625d867e2-CM0014045885be.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 252 seconds
[03:40] SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) left irc: Ping timeout: 245 seconds
[03:41] N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) left irc: Ping timeout: 245 seconds
[03:56] N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) joined #highaltitude.
[03:57] SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) joined #highaltitude.
[05:07] darknesslord_ (~darknessl@189.164.19.87) joined #highaltitude.
[06:00] darknesslord_ (~darknessl@189.164.19.87) left irc: Quit: c'ya
[06:10] bittwist (~User@unaffiliated/bittwist) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[06:41] bittwist (~User@unaffiliated/bittwist) joined #highaltitude.
[06:55] Simon-MPFH (~simon@phantom.mpfh.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[06:55] jasonb (~jasonb@adsl-66-124-73-250.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer
[06:59] jonsowman (~jonsowman@93-97-184-163.zone5.bethere.co.uk) left irc: Ping timeout: 240 seconds
[07:00] jonsowman (~jonsowman@93-97-184-163.zone5.bethere.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[07:02] jasonb (~jasonb@adsl-66-124-73-250.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) joined #highaltitude.
[07:03] edmoore (~ed@pluto.trinhall.cam.ac.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] gamers600 (~gamers600@ip68-99-224-199.ph.ph.cox.net) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] gamers600 (~gamers600@ip68-99-224-199.ph.ph.cox.net) left irc: Client Quit
[07:39] edmoore (~ed@pluto.trinhall.cam.ac.uk) left irc: Quit: edmoore
[07:59] gamers600 (~gamers600@ip68-99-224-199.ph.ph.cox.net) joined #highaltitude.
[07:59] gamers600 (~gamers600@ip68-99-224-199.ph.ph.cox.net) left irc: Client Quit
[08:20] b3cft (~abrock@nat/yahoo/x-jxvcvwnvwsjeqxtq) joined #highaltitude.
[08:57] rjharrison (~rharrison@gateway.hgf.com) joined #highaltitude.
[08:58] <rjharrison> morning all
[08:59] <rjharrison> Hi Juxta, not sure if you're around did you get that graph in the end?
[09:07] <natrium_> he has a graph on his blog
[09:21] GeekShadow (~Antoine@reactos/tester/GeekShadow) joined #highaltitude.
[09:28] <natrium_> Endeavour is in space
[09:29] <Endeavour> Yes.
[09:29] <Endeavour> Yes it is.
[09:29] <Endeavour> Sad day.
[09:29] <Endeavour> Last flight of the old shuttle.
[09:30] <natrium_> there are 4 more flights, i think one of them is by Endeavour
[09:30] <Endeavour> Nope.
[09:30] <natrium_> are you sure?
[09:30] <Endeavour> That's what I read.
[09:30] <natrium_> then :(
[09:31] <Endeavour> Probably something to do with payload.
[09:31] <Endeavour> They all have different capacities.
[09:36] <russss> more likely just because they don't want to run one of them more times than the others
[09:37] <russss> also: it's not. STS-134 is Endeavour http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STS-134
[09:38] <russss> (and that's the second-to-last flight, with STS-133 being the last one)
[09:43] <Endeavour> Is it? Guess the article I read was wrong.
[09:45] <russss> wikipedia and nasa.gov both confirm
[09:45] <russss> http://www.nasa.gov/missions/highlights/schedule.html
[09:52] <Endeavour> russss: That's odd.
[09:53] <Endeavour> Missions are always chronological
[09:53] <Endeavour> STS-132, STS-134, then STS-133
[09:53] <Endeavour> Unusual.
[09:53] <Endeavour> But fair enough, I stand corrected! :)
[09:58] <juxta> hey rjharrison, I did get the graph
[09:58] <juxta> I haven't had a chance to put it up yet though
[10:02] natrium_ (~natrium42@CPE000625d867e2-CM0014045885be.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[10:02] icez (~icez@unaffiliated/icez) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[10:02] Laurenceb_ (~laurence@host86-141-239-7.range86-141.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[10:11] Endeavour (~Endeavour@r74-192-221-200.bcstcmta02.clsttx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net) left irc: Quit: Endeavour
[10:16] <russss> well he left, but the reason STS-134 isn't in chronological order is because it got added afterwards
[11:00] junderwood (~John@adsl.jcu.me.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[11:24] adhoc (~khawtin@ppp121-45-24-62.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net) joined #highaltitude.
[11:33] Laurenceb_ (~laurence@host86-141-239-7.range86-141.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 245 seconds
[11:44] ms7821 (~Mark@flat.ms) left irc: Disconnected by services
[11:44] ms7821 (~Mark@flat.ms) joined #highaltitude.
[11:49] DanielRichman (~526f17c6@gateway/web/freenode/x-ycueplbqkxyehumm) joined #highaltitude.
[12:05] <russss> btw on the topic of the shuttle, this looks fun:
[12:05] <russss> http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Aeronautics-and-Astronautics/16-885JFall-2005/CourseHome/index.htm
[12:07] <rjharrison> juxta cool np
[12:20] Angus (~Angus@CPE-121-217-210-40.lnse3.cht.bigpond.net.au) joined #highaltitude.
[12:29] <russss> also one of the speakers on that course has an eye patch!
[12:29] <russss> space pirates!
[12:35] DanielRichman (~526f17c6@gateway/web/freenode/x-ycueplbqkxyehumm) left irc: Quit: Page closed
[12:37] Angus (~Angus@CPE-121-217-210-40.lnse3.cht.bigpond.net.au) left irc: Quit: Angus
[13:13] SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) left irc: Ping timeout: 245 seconds
[13:15] N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) left irc: Ping timeout: 245 seconds
[13:30] SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) joined #highaltitude.
[13:30] N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) joined #highaltitude.
[13:38] <MikeMc68> afternoon
[13:47] <rjharrison> MikeMc68 afternoon to you too sir
[14:06] <MikeMc68> hi
[14:06] <MikeMc68> Snowing here in Kent
[15:03] N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) left irc: Ping timeout: 245 seconds
[15:21] N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) joined #highaltitude.
[15:33] N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) left irc: Ping timeout: 245 seconds
[15:54] N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) joined #highaltitude.
[16:00] jasonb (~jasonb@adsl-66-124-73-250.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) left irc: Ping timeout: 265 seconds
[16:12] jasonb (~jasonb@m170e36d0.tmodns.net) joined #highaltitude.
[16:39] jcoxon (~jcoxon@host86-173-135-66.range86-173.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[16:41] <jcoxon> afternoon
[16:53] <MikeMc68> hey
[16:54] <jcoxon> hey MikeMc68
[17:01] jasonb (~jasonb@m170e36d0.tmodns.net) left irc: Ping timeout: 240 seconds
[17:10] Twiner (~blah@81.191.131.67) joined #highaltitude.
[17:18] <jcoxon> hi Twiner
[17:20] <Twiner> Hey!
[17:20] <jcoxon> welcome to #highaltitude
[17:20] <Twiner> Thak you. (:
[17:20] <Twiner> n*
[17:20] Action: Twiner can't write toay.
[17:21] <Twiner> d*
[17:21] <jcoxon> :-)
[17:22] <Twiner> (Hm. My ramblings must qualify for a quote.)
[17:23] <rjharrison> Hey jcoxon
[17:24] <jcoxon> hey rjharrison
[17:29] Endeavour (~Endeavour@r74-192-221-200.bcstcmta02.clsttx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net) joined #highaltitude.
[17:55] rjharrison (~rharrison@gateway.hgf.com) left irc:
[17:55] Lunar_Lander (~lunar_lan@p5488677D.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #highaltitude.
[17:55] <Lunar_Lander> hello people
[17:56] <Lunar_Lander> hi SpeedEvil
[17:56] <jcoxon> bbl
[17:56] jcoxon (~jcoxon@host86-173-135-66.range86-173.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[17:59] rjharrison (~rharrison@gateway.hgf.com) joined #highaltitude.
[18:00] rjharrison (~rharrison@gateway.hgf.com) left irc: Client Quit
[18:00] <SpeedEvil> hi :/
[18:01] Action: SpeedEvil is a bit pissed as driving instructor diddn't turn up for driving test - there goes 62 quid I can't afford.
[18:02] <Lunar_Lander> he didn't turn up?
[18:03] <Lunar_Lander> that is really bad
[18:03] <SpeedEvil> yeah.
[18:04] <Lunar_Lander> actually it is a word that I may not say here
[18:05] <SpeedEvil> I have very limited recourse though. And no way to get the cash back.
[18:05] <SpeedEvil> :/
[18:05] <SpeedEvil> Oh well.
[18:10] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[18:11] <Lunar_Lander> :(
[18:17] b3cft (~abrock@nat/yahoo/x-jxvcvwnvwsjeqxtq) left irc: Quit: laters potaters
[18:24] N900evil_ (~Speedevil@genld-216-044.t-mobile.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[18:26] N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) left irc: Ping timeout: 245 seconds
[18:27] jcoxon (~jcoxon@host86-173-135-66.range86-173.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[18:27] N900evil_ (~Speedevil@genld-216-044.t-mobile.co.uk) left irc: Client Quit
[18:31] <Lunar_Lander> wb jcoxon
[18:34] Xenion (~robert@p579720EF.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #highaltitude.
[18:38] <jcoxon> hey Lunar_Lander
[18:41] <Lunar_Lander> how's life?
[18:42] <jcoxon> not bad thanks
[18:42] <jcoxon> preparing for a balloon launch
[18:44] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[18:44] <Lunar_Lander> BH4?
[18:47] Endeavour (~Endeavour@r74-192-221-200.bcstcmta02.clsttx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net) left irc: Quit: Endeavour
[18:48] <jcoxon> yeah
[18:48] <jcoxon> just about to run it through a simulated flight to test the flight computer
[18:57] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[18:59] <Lunar_Lander> so you'll feed the computer with mock sensor data?
[19:01] <jcoxon> yeah
[19:01] <jcoxon> based on previous flights
[19:01] <jcoxon> while the plan is to have the balloon float at altitude i'm currently testing it with a normal up/down flight with no float
[19:01] <jcoxon> just in case we don't get float
[19:03] <Lunar_Lander> ah ok
[19:03] <Lunar_Lander> so that the ballast mechanism will still be worked?
[19:05] <jcoxon> yeah, ive got an emergency mode
[19:05] <jcoxon> where if it finds its descending it just dumps ballast
[19:06] jasonb (~jasonb@dsl027-180-244.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net) joined #highaltitude.
[19:07] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[19:07] <Lunar_Lander> that is good
[19:10] <Lunar_Lander> how much ethanol will you take?
[19:10] <jcoxon> 500mls
[19:14] junderwood (~John@adsl.jcu.me.uk) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer
[19:14] junderwood (~John@adsl.jcu.me.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[19:16] <jcoxon> it'll be dumped in 100mls portions
[19:18] <Lunar_Lander> ah ok
[19:19] <Lunar_Lander> but then you only have five ballast opportunities
[19:21] <jcoxon> yup, remember we are only testing the tanks/pump at altitude rather then trying to extend the flight time
[19:22] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[19:22] <jcoxon> so what we should see is that when we dump ballast to make sure its actually left teh payload we should have an increased ascent rate
[19:24] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[19:25] <Lunar_Lander> that sounds good
[19:25] <jcoxon> should be fun :-)
[19:26] <jcoxon> just need to get some more people to listen in with radios :-p
[19:27] <Lunar_Lander> :P
[19:27] <Lunar_Lander> I showed the prediction to a friend of mine
[19:27] <Lunar_Lander> and he said that the 300 km is impossible because we couldn't drive that much every flight and that we would have to thether the balloon and stuff
[19:28] <Lunar_Lander> I think it is perfectly OK to let the balloon fly and then we can find it again
[19:30] <jcoxon> Lunar_Lander, often good weatehr means it'll only travel 30-50km
[19:30] <jcoxon> weather*
[19:32] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[19:32] <Lunar_Lander> so that prediction machine is only the best/worst case?
[19:33] <jcoxon> its fairly accurate however we are at the moment experiencing very strong jet stream winds
[19:34] <jcoxon> it'll calm down especially during the summer
[19:35] <Lunar_Lander> ah ok
[19:36] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[19:38] icez (~icez@unaffiliated/icez) joined #highaltitude.
[19:41] <Lunar_Lander> how does the computer respond jcoxon?
[19:47] <jcoxon> its running right now
[19:47] <jcoxon> though its realtime so it takes a couple of hours
[19:47] <jcoxon> :-p
[19:47] <Lunar_Lander> ah ok :P
[19:48] G8DSU (~chatzilla@cpc3-mort4-0-0-cust192.croy.cable.virginmedia.com) joined #highaltitude.
[19:55] DanielRichman (~DanielRic@unaffiliated/danielrichman) joined #highaltitude.
[19:58] <Lunar_Lander> hi Daniel
[19:58] Lunar_Lander (~lunar_lan@p5488677D.dip.t-dialin.net) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer
[19:58] Lunar_Lander (~lunar_lan@p5488677D.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #highaltitude.
[20:02] bittwist (~User@unaffiliated/bittwist) left irc:
[20:04] <Lunar_Lander> hmm
[20:04] <Lunar_Lander> what happened?
[20:15] rjharrison_ (~rharrison@62.49.185.11) joined #highaltitude.
[20:16] <MikeMc68> hi
[20:17] <rjharrison_> PING jcoxon
[20:18] <rjharrison_> Hi MikeMc68
[20:52] jonsowman (~jonsowman@93-97-184-163.zone5.bethere.co.uk) left irc: Ping timeout: 264 seconds
[20:52] jonsowman (~jonsowman@93-97-184-163.zone5.bethere.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[20:53] N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) joined #highaltitude.
[20:53] Laurenceb_ (~laurence@host86-141-239-7.range86-141.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[20:55] <Laurenceb_> hi
[20:55] <SpeedEvil> hi
[20:56] <Lunar_Lander> hi
[20:59] <Laurenceb_> whats the common thickness of copper on pcbs ?
[21:00] <SpeedEvil> 1 ounce per square foot
[21:00] <SpeedEvil> which ends up as single digit um
[21:01] <Laurenceb_> ah I see
[21:01] <Laurenceb_> http://home.comcast.net/~pcb.george/trace.html
[21:01] Action: Laurenceb_ is thinking pcb trace anemometer
[21:11] <SpeedEvil> I hnn
[21:11] <SpeedEvil> hmm
[21:11] <SpeedEvil> sounds not fundamentally insane - but tricky
[21:12] <SpeedEvil> the above inkjet copper place would be handy
[21:12] <Laurenceb_> tantalum cap into trace through a pwm driven logic level fet would work
[21:12] <Laurenceb_> wondering if you could build a thermocouple into the pcb as well - to measure delta temperature directly
[21:13] <Laurenceb_> inkjet place?
[21:13] <SpeedEvil> http://inkjetflex.com/site/pricing-structure/
[21:13] <SpeedEvil> thermocouple requires different metals
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> yeah, copper for one and a bit of something else soldered on
[21:17] RocketBoy (~Steve@217.47.75.8) joined #highaltitude.
[21:18] RocketBoy (~Steve@217.47.75.8) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer
[21:19] <jcoxon> oops - manged to dump nearly the whole tank of ballast on the floor
[21:19] RocketBoy (~Steve@217.47.75.8) joined #highaltitude.
[21:25] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[21:25] <Lunar_Lander> fortunately it
[21:25] <Lunar_Lander> it'll evapourate quickly
[21:25] <jcoxon> but it did work :-p
[21:25] <jcoxon> its just water right now
[21:25] <Lunar_Lander> oh :)
[21:28] <Laurenceb_> thats lucky
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> well the C2H6O would have disappeared quickly ;)
[21:29] <Lunar_Lander> but we got that hygiene spray which basically is ethanol and it says "Danger: Fumes can cause dizzyness"
[21:30] Simon-MPFH (~simon@phantom.mpfh.co.uk) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[21:35] sbasuita (~sbasuita@unaffiliated/drebellion) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer
[21:35] sbasuita_ (~sbasuita@unaffiliated/drebellion) joined #highaltitude.
[21:35] Nick change: sbasuita_ -> sbasuita
[21:46] DanielRichman (~DanielRic@unaffiliated/danielrichman) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[21:46] <Lunar_Lander> good night
[21:46] natrium42 (~natrium@CPE000625d867e2-CM0014045885be.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #highaltitude.
[21:46] Lunar_Lander (~lunar_lan@p5488677D.dip.t-dialin.net) left irc: Quit: Lunar_Lander
[21:46] <natrium42> good day
[21:58] <Laurenceb_> hi natrium42
[22:00] <natrium42> hey
[22:00] <natrium42> brb food
[22:21] Twiner (~blah@81.191.131.67) left irc: Ping timeout: 240 seconds
[22:31] Xenion (~robert@p579720EF.dip.t-dialin.net) left irc: Quit: Verlassend
[22:34] Endeavour (~Endeavour@r74-192-221-200.bcstcmta02.clsttx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net) joined #highaltitude.
[22:37] N900evil (~Speedevil@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer
[22:39] natrium42 (~natrium@CPE000625d867e2-CM0014045885be.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[22:40] natrium42 (~natrium@CPE000625d867e2-CM0014045885be.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #highaltitude.
[22:41] <natrium42> o/
[22:41] <RocketBoy> ethanol: "Danger: Fumes can cause dizzyness" - pish Rocketboy found a bottle of ether in a cupboard at work - and thought he would give it a good sniff - I had a headache for the rest of the day
[22:41] <Laurenceb_> apparently it can get you high
[22:41] <Laurenceb_> possible stratospheric
[22:42] <natrium42> LSD?
[22:43] <RocketBoy> clearly I didn't take in enough
[22:43] <natrium42> ah
[22:43] <natrium42> rofl
[22:43] <natrium42> poor RocketBoy
[22:46] <Laurenceb_> any luck with the IMU board?
[22:47] <natrium42> uh, erm, i accidentally left my house on fire...
[22:47] junderwood (~John@adsl.jcu.me.uk) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[22:47] Action: natrium42 runs away
[22:48] <Laurenceb_> lol
[22:55] scotty (~sj86@94-195-51-124.zone9.bethere.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[22:56] <scotty> hi is this the high altitude IRC channel
[22:56] <scotty> ?
[22:56] <SpeedEvil> yes.
[22:57] <natrium42> hi scotty
[22:57] <scotty> awesome can i get some expert advice concerning my high altitude project. Regarding payload/ sounding weather balloons
[22:57] <Laurenceb_> SpeedEvil: pcb based anemometer looks vaguely possible - but the trace can only be about 50mohm
[22:57] <Laurenceb_> cool a new project :P
[22:57] <Laurenceb_> welcome :D
[22:57] <Laurenceb_> sure thing
[22:58] <scotty> Basically i have a 1.3 kg payload. I was looking at the kaymont weather balloons
[22:59] <scotty> due to the payload, and i want the payload to reach 30km which balloon is best
[22:59] <scotty> KCI 800 or above?
[22:59] <natrium42> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:balloon_data
[22:59] <Laurenceb_> yeah ^
[22:59] <scotty> yeah i looked at that.
[22:59] <natrium42> did you fill in burst1a.xml?
[22:59] <natrium42> err .*xls
[23:00] <natrium42> i would go with KCI 1200
[23:00] <Laurenceb_> heh I detect the effects of too much coding
[23:00] <scotty> no i will do that know
[23:00] <natrium42> Laurenceb_, :D
[23:00] <scotty> im thinking that the 30km is the best altitude for the best photos.
[23:00] <scotty> and the kci 800 burst diameter is around 31Km
[23:00] <natrium42> well, it's just a nice and round number :)
[23:01] <natrium42> which is ~ 100k feet
[23:01] <scotty> but thats based on a 250 gram paylaod
[23:02] <natrium42> you could also use hydrogen
[23:02] <natrium42> instead of helium
[23:02] <scotty> humm i looked into that. helium is the only option.
[23:02] <natrium42> ok, well the bigger balloons are not that much more
[23:02] <natrium42> KCI1200 should work well for 1.3kg payload
[23:03] <scotty> another question is the parachute size i was quoted an 48" parachute for a 1.3 kg payload
[23:03] <scotty> but on the another site is 30"for 800 g to 1.4 kg
[23:03] <natrium42> sounds reasonable
[23:03] <natrium42> you want around 20ft/s descent
[23:04] <natrium42> http://www.onlinetesting.net/cgi-bin/descent3.3.cgi
[23:05] <Laurenceb_> SpeedEvil: is kapton pcb obtainable?
[23:05] <natrium42> 48" and 1.3kg gives me 15.59 ft/sec
[23:05] <natrium42> so that's OK
[23:05] <scotty> 24.95 ft/sec for the 30"parachute
[23:05] <scotty> so whats the best? the slower the better i am reckoning?
[23:06] <scotty> but i dont want to wait around for ever
[23:06] <natrium42> you don't want it too slow though
[23:06] <scotty> yeah
[23:06] <natrium42> as it will travel further
[23:06] <scotty> that too
[23:06] <Randomskk> hmm
[23:06] <scotty> lol
[23:06] <Randomskk> anyone following the nosiebridge space mailing list?
[23:06] <scotty> i have little experience in descents
[23:06] <scotty> rate of descents
[23:06] <natrium42> Randomskk, not me, what's there?
[23:06] <Randomskk> well they launched yesterday
[23:07] <Randomskk> managed to recover with SMSs from a G1 sending GPS positions, their APRS radio unit cut out pretty early on
[23:07] <natrium42> scotty, have you seen the CUSF predictor?
[23:07] <scotty> the landing predictor yeah
[23:07] <scotty> the program that is
[23:07] <Randomskk> they are quite impressed with what they accomplished
[23:07] <natrium42> Randomskk, cool, i always wanted to try sending a smartphone-as-payload :)
[23:07] <natrium42> link?
[23:07] <scotty> i have reserached the UKHAS fourm allo
[23:07] <scotty> t
[23:07] <Randomskk> "We need to get an article written about this. Maybe for National Space Society, MAKE mag., maybe even WIRED."
[23:08] <natrium42> scotty, it will let you play around with ascent/descent rates
[23:08] <natrium42> to see where you end up
[23:08] <Randomskk> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/space
[23:08] <scotty> kk
[23:08] <Randomskk> it's a lot of fairly smart people with time, money and resources
[23:09] <Randomskk> but not much experience yet
[23:09] <natrium42> invite them to #highaltitude :)
[23:09] <Laurenceb_> its rather annoying
[23:09] <Randomskk> Laurenceb_: noisebridge?
[23:09] <Laurenceb_> that would be a _bad_ idea
[23:09] <Laurenceb_> yes
[23:09] <Randomskk> yes, quite
[23:09] <Randomskk> are you also watching their mailing list?
[23:09] <Laurenceb_> imagine inviting 4chan to irc
[23:09] <natrium42> ah.
[23:10] <Randomskk> specifically the part where one guy suggests a suborbital telescope and another says "nah let's do a rockoon"
[23:10] GeekShadow (~Antoine@reactos/tester/GeekShadow) left irc: Quit: The cake is a lie !
[23:10] <scotty> i have another quick question. When sending up a payload with a camera (which tilts/ captures images etc) will there be much condensation on the lense above the cloud cover.
[23:10] <scotty> Due to if there is any, the pictures can be reuined
[23:10] <Randomskk> perhaps specifically because the guy suggesting the suborbital telescope has the same last name as edmoore and the rockoon is pretty much CUSF's raison d'etre
[23:10] <natrium42> scotty, depends
[23:11] <natrium42> i didn't have problems with camera lenses exposed
[23:11] <natrium42> some also use UV filters as a windows from payload
[23:11] <natrium42> you gotta be more careful there as there is humidity inside the payload
[23:12] <scotty> my payload has a window.
[23:12] <scotty> the payload inside will be air tight
[23:12] <scotty> just wondering about the outside
[23:17] <Laurenceb_> the CUSF launch rail idea is a bit crazy
[23:17] <Laurenceb_> martlet is really nice, if maybe overengineered
[23:19] <Randomskk> apparently that is what happens when people doing postgrads in rockets get let loose with as much carbon fibre and rocket motors as they can get their hands on :P
[23:19] <Laurenceb_> personally I'd remove the fins and spin it at 2000rpm
[23:19] <Randomskk> the problem with that was starting it spinning
[23:20] <Randomskk> fins seemed easier than something to make a rocket spin at 2krpm
[23:20] <Laurenceb_> not that hard
[23:20] <Randomskk> compared to sticking fins on?
[23:20] <Laurenceb_> CF truss structure and brushless motor
[23:20] <Laurenceb_> with fins you need a horribly hard launch rail
[23:21] <Randomskk> that's true
[23:21] <scotty> right i used the landing predictor. seems with a 1200 gram payload with a descent rate of 7.6m/s will land in the channel, by dunkirk haha
[23:21] <Laurenceb_> the spin up structure also anables you to do very accurate pointing
[23:21] <scotty> sorry dunkerque
[23:21] <Laurenceb_> <1 degree error
[23:21] <Randomskk> I think we even considered spinning the entire launch rail
[23:22] <Randomskk> but basically so long as it is pointing "up" we are relying on the jetstream to take it over the ocean before ignition
[23:22] <natrium42> <scotty> the payload inside will be air tight <-- juxta had a problem with that
[23:22] <russss> scotty: well it's difficult to make sure that the inside of your payload is moisture-free.
[23:22] <russss> easier to keep it vented I think
[23:22] <natrium42> scotty --> http://projecthorus.org
[23:22] <Laurenceb_> Randomskk: you can set elevation with the rigging, and azimuth by throttling the spinup motor
[23:22] <natrium42> rjharrison_ recommends to flush the payload with helium before you launch, but YMMV
[23:23] <russss> I guess you could do that
[23:23] <scotty> yeah
[23:23] <scotty> humm
[23:23] <scotty> right ill look into that
[23:23] <scotty> and looking at the link
[23:24] <natrium42> you can see the condensate in his pic :S
[23:24] <russss> I hadn't seen the project horus web site, very nice.
[23:24] <natrium42> yeah, he did a great job
[23:24] <scotty> my tech engineers at kent uni are helping me with airtight solutions and i am testing everything in the eviromental chamber at the same conditions of 30km. 1 atmosphere and -50 celsus
[23:24] <scotty> so if anything goes wrong like condensation i can fix it
[23:25] <natrium42> oh, cool
[23:25] <natrium42> that should help yes
[23:25] <scotty> but yeah i dont want blurry pics
[23:26] <scotty> so any other advice other than flush with helium before launch?
[23:29] <natrium42> well, another way would be to have your camera (or just the lens) in a separate compartment
[23:29] <natrium42> which would have some ventillation
[23:31] <scotty> yeah was thinking about that. but my housing for all my pcbs are solid. and so is the axil for the tiliting camera
[23:31] <scotty> so not really an option.
[23:31] <natrium42> does your payload really have to be airtight?
[23:31] <scotty> but will look at ventalition techniques
[23:31] <scotty> well to stop condensation wont it need to be airtight
[23:32] <scotty> otherwise the -50 celsus will freeze the inside components
[23:32] <jcoxon> hey scotty, you planning to launch this weekend?
[23:32] <natrium42> scotty, with ventillation at least the humidity will get out
[23:32] <scotty> not this weekend, as i heard something is on at the site. but hopefully next or week after
[23:32] <scotty> right
[23:32] <jcoxon> oh cool
[23:32] <jcoxon> i've placed you - at kent uni?
[23:33] <scotty> yeah im at kent uni.
[23:33] <jcoxon> you sent me an email a while back :-)
[23:33] <scotty> oh right.
[23:33] <scotty> let me check
[23:33] <natrium42> oh cool, so you're close to launch, scotty?
[23:33] <SpeedEvil> Much stuff actually works fine at -50C
[23:33] <Randomskk> jcoxon: given as EARS is somewhat harder to get to, I could probably do tracking from here with the yagi until it's high enough to be picked up all ver the place
[23:34] <Randomskk> depends on if there is gonna be transport to EARS :P
[23:34] <jcoxon> i might be passing that way :-p
[23:34] <SpeedEvil> and -50C and 1 atmosphere is very far from conditions at 40km
[23:34] <scotty> i have been told by ED that there is Churchill College Spring Ball so that friday and saturday coming up is not free for flight
[23:34] <jcoxon> Randomskk, that said i'd appreciate early tracking with a solid internet connection
[23:34] <jcoxon> scotty, yeah thats true
[23:35] <SpeedEvil> Condensation occurs because a surface is colder than the dew point of the surrounding atmosphere.
[23:35] <scotty> hav ejust sent him an email back saying i can do next week or week after
[23:35] <jcoxon> though i'm still launching this weekend - just from our alternative site
[23:35] <natrium42> jcoxon, make a webcast :P
[23:35] <SpeedEvil> This will not typically be the case for a camera that's generating several watts, and has come from an environment 70c hotter
[23:35] <scotty> oh cheers, but i will not be ready till next week.
[23:35] <scotty> as the enviromental chamber is this week
[23:35] <Randomskk> jcoxon: on saturday my internet gets unthrottled =D
[23:35] <scotty> right
[23:35] <jcoxon> scotty, yeah its best to be completely ready
[23:36] <Randomskk> though also I can use the college wireless and jonsowman's internet which is a 100mbps connection that is not throttled atm :P
[23:36] <jcoxon> hehe i was more comparing mobile broadband against cabled :-p
[23:36] <jcoxon> if you are free come along to the launch
[23:36] <scotty> well the enviromental chamber will show me any spots where humdity or condensation occurs and so i will try to ventailate that in the next enviromental chamber tests
[23:36] <Randomskk> mine is reliable but 1.2s+ latency and 40KB/s max speed is a bit painful
[23:36] <Randomskk> my fault for leaving a 10MB/s download on a few seconds too long
[23:36] <jcoxon> just need to be able to update the tracker
[23:37] <Randomskk> however mine will be fine by then
[23:37] <jcoxon> i can easily pop by selwyn on my way up
[23:37] <Randomskk> hmmm :P
[23:38] <Randomskk> I could probably get someone here with the radio and a laptop fairly easily, not sure
[23:38] <Randomskk> going to a launch would be fun but so is tracking it
[23:38] <Randomskk> or potentially one of jon or I could wait here and swap around next time
[23:38] <natrium42> Randomskk, use your robot to control radio back home :P
[23:39] <Randomskk> hehe true
[23:39] <Randomskk> the issue is getting wireless access at EARS I guess
[23:39] <jcoxon> we get 3g there
[23:39] <Randomskk> my phone's internet tends to work (even in the middle of devon)
[23:39] <Randomskk> it has wifi tethering
[23:39] <Randomskk> best thing ever
[23:39] <Randomskk> you just put it anywhere it gets signal
[23:39] <Randomskk> and any laptops nearby can join its wireless and get internet
[23:40] <jcoxon> rooted android?
[23:40] <Randomskk> yea
[23:40] <jcoxon> i'm not brave enough to root my phone
[23:40] <jcoxon> :-p
[23:41] RocketBoy (~Steve@217.47.75.8) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[23:41] <jcoxon> well perhaps we can get hung over ed to track from cambridge
[23:41] <Randomskk> it's hardly even rooting, just load a new firmware onto the SD, hold home when rebooting, select 'upgrade', job done
[23:41] <Randomskk> haha
[23:41] <Randomskk> I wasn't hung over at all after snow ball here
[23:41] <Randomskk> alcohol was very watered it seems
[23:41] <scotty> One last quick question if i may. Obviously depending on the rate of descent, and the air currents wind speed etc. how will i make sure other than looking on the predictor that the payload wont go into the sea lol
[23:41] <Randomskk> which is crazy since they poured it from bottles, I had several glasses of baileys from the bottle and yet nothing
[23:41] <scotty> Because this predictor is showing it in the sea all the time
[23:41] <jcoxon> look directly at teh weather maps
[23:41] <Randomskk> was barely tipsy directly afterwards
[23:42] <jcoxon> scotty, oh teh weather is terrible right now
[23:42] <Randomskk> fergus might be able to
[23:42] <jcoxon> the worse stretch of jet stream winds in ages
[23:42] <Randomskk> the autorotator is pretty awesome too
[23:42] <scotty> oh ok
[23:42] <scotty> it is snowing in kent heavily lol
[23:42] <jcoxon> i'm in kent right now
[23:42] <jcoxon> :-p
[23:42] <Randomskk> the CUSF yagi is shorter than mine but better made and can automatically track the balloon, helps
[23:42] <scotty> oh cool
[23:42] <scotty> yeah crazy weather
[23:42] <jcoxon> scotty, so yeah best wait for better weather
[23:43] <scotty> yeah
[23:43] Action: jcoxon is launching cause its going to France!
[23:43] <scotty> i should go back to LA and do a launch there. alot better weather lol
[23:44] <jcoxon> okay well Randomskk we can discuss plans a little later in the week - you are very welcome to come along to the launch, we'll be able to track for quite a long time from EARS
[23:44] <jcoxon> and by that time others e.g. rjharrison will be able to take over
[23:44] <Randomskk> I could even come along and bring the radio and yagi though I guess that would be superflous - my little whip could get BH3 before it even got over london last time
[23:45] <Randomskk> also I need to get a battery for my radio at some point :P
[23:45] <jcoxon> Randomskk, perhaps leave you radio set up back in college ready to track
[23:45] <jcoxon> your*
[23:45] <Randomskk> yup
[23:45] <jcoxon> we'll have loads out in the field which you can use
[23:46] <Randomskk> could probably leave it with the whip and on a nearby freq, plus fl-digi with auto freq tracking on
[23:46] <jcoxon> then we could drop you back and you could track while we move onwards
[23:46] <Randomskk> I suspect it'd get it
[23:46] <jcoxon> what is your radio?
[23:46] <Randomskk> icom ic7000
[23:46] <jcoxon> does it do CAT?
[23:46] <Randomskk> CAT as in...?
[23:46] <Randomskk> it probably does, it's a pretty awesome radio
[23:46] <jcoxon> as in computer controlled
[23:46] <Randomskk> it can be
[23:46] <Randomskk> I do not have suitable cables atm
[23:46] <Randomskk> I could probablyt rig that together by saturday though
[23:47] <jcoxon> Randomskk, hmmmm perhaps we should create a package for remote controlled radios
[23:47] <Randomskk> could be neat
[23:47] <jcoxon> as i could easily set up my ft790r to track from london
[23:47] <Randomskk> how'd it work though? just have a human change freq to try and find the signal or what?
[23:47] <Randomskk> I've love to have my yagi on an autorotator
[23:47] <jcoxon> how about:
[23:48] <Randomskk> but the whip should be more than good enough to pick up EARS and onwards until I get back
[23:48] <jcoxon> a php page hosted on a webserver which controls the freq
[23:48] <jcoxon> up/down etc
[23:48] <Randomskk> yea, that would work
[23:48] <jcoxon> then some how pass on the waterfall of fldigi
[23:48] <Randomskk> or if someone tracking manually reports the last freq
[23:48] <Randomskk> fldigi can try and find the signal inside its waterfall
[23:48] <jcoxon> it doesn't go too far
[23:48] <Randomskk> well, or at least try and follow it as it changes
[23:48] <Randomskk> ideally we'd have fldigi g[Btrue
[23:49] <Randomskk> ideally some kind of custom rtty that has better noise performance would be nice
[23:49] <jcoxon> hehe stick to the simple stuff
[23:49] <Randomskk> :P
[23:50] <Randomskk> also I could probably get someone here to click on the fldigi waterfall to locate it pretty easily
[23:50] <scotty> P.S one quick question if i may apart from the sites listed on the UKHAS website (http://randomsolutions.co.uk/ etc) are there any other sites to get weather balloons in the uk?
[23:50] <scotty> takes so long to get from the states
[23:51] <jcoxon> scotty, randomsolutions is the only one i know of
[23:51] <jcoxon> its run by Rocketboy who was on here earlier
[23:51] <scotty> oh cool. its just i dont have paypal up yet
[23:51] <jcoxon> Randomskk, we could expand the AFC of dl-fldigi
[23:53] <Randomskk> true
[23:53] <Randomskk> is fldigi remote-controllable?
[23:53] <jcoxon> yeah if you compile XML-RPC into it
[23:54] <jcoxon> so fldigi can control your radio
[23:54] <jcoxon> and you can script fldigi
[23:54] <jcoxon> the only issue is being able to view the waterfall to find the signal
[23:54] <Randomskk> true I[B[B[B[Bneat
[23:54] <Randomskk> I think mine is, or certainly I can do that
[23:54] <Randomskk> yea
[23:54] <Randomskk> I could VNC but that is a lot of data for 3g
[23:54] <jcoxon> well i was more thinking say giving control to natrium42 or some with good internet
[23:54] <Randomskk> getting a person to use the computer at this end would be easier
[23:54] <Randomskk> that'd work too actually
[23:55] <natrium42> :)
[23:55] <jcoxon> yeah
[23:55] <jcoxon> natrium42, still might rig it for you to use my london radio
[23:55] <jcoxon> shall have to see :-p
[23:55] <natrium42> i be in ur computer, messing with ur radio
[23:55] <jcoxon> hehe right ,night all - work tomorrow :-(
[23:55] <natrium42> nite jcoxon
[23:55] jcoxon (~jcoxon@host86-173-135-66.range86-173.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[23:57] <natrium42> though NX would be better than VNC if you run linux
[23:57] <natrium42> it's much faster
[23:57] <Randomskk> oh of course, yea
[23:57] <Randomskk> I am already running SSH, setting you up with a user and having you run flgidi with X forwarding would be easy
[23:57] <Randomskk> if the cambridge net actually allows you to access the relevent ports - not sure
[23:58] <natrium42> yep
[23:58] <Randomskk> what happens if you SSH to ag611.sel.cam.ac.uk?
[23:58] <natrium42> no response
[23:58] <Randomskk> :(
[23:59] <Randomskk> could probably reverse tunnel or something
[00:00] --- Tue Feb 9 2010