highaltitude.log.20100102

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[11:13] <jcoxon> morning all
[11:16] <edmoore> morning jc
[11:16] <edmoore> jcoxon: *
[11:16] <jcoxon> hey edmoore
[11:17] <jcoxon> hows it going?
[11:18] <edmoore> not bad, drinks party at gf's house this afternoon
[11:18] <jcoxon> ooo nice
[11:18] <edmoore> which is about 1 mile from ML&S....
[11:18] <jcoxon> i'm off back to suffolk to collect my car
[11:19] <edmoore> i'm getting a new car soon!
[11:19] <jcoxon> literally getting the train, car is at station and then driving back
[11:19] <edmoore> well, not new
[11:19] <jcoxon> hhe
[11:19] <edmoore> but new to me
[11:19] <jcoxon> good dash for ballooning?
[11:19] <edmoore> amazing how much my choice was shaped by ballooning
[11:19] <edmoore> eg shape of the dash for putting radios on
[11:19] <edmoore> flatness of roof to make a good ground plane for magmount
[11:19] <jcoxon> :-p
[11:20] <edmoore> boot space, ground clearence for the more ambitious chases
[11:20] <jcoxon> so i've made some BH4 progress
[11:20] <edmoore> ooh cool
[11:20] <jcoxon> rigged up an avr to the radio
[11:20] <jcoxon> and then have a photogate counting revs on the pump
[11:21] <edmoore> awesome
[11:21] <jcoxon> the photogate is on an external interrupt, just updates a counter - doesn't seem to trouble transmitting rtty
[11:22] <edmoore> had a thought
[11:22] <edmoore> not a v exciting one, but one nonetheless
[11:22] <edmoore> about radiation patterns on the antenna
[11:23] <jcoxon> uhuh
[11:25] <edmoore> something like a big wheel
[11:25] <edmoore> which radiaties very very horizontally
[11:25] <edmoore> would have really come into its own on BH3, I think
[11:26] <edmoore> http://www.hamtv.com/oal.html
[11:26] <edmoore> 4th one down
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[11:31] <jcoxon> mmm interesting
[11:31] <jcoxon> edmoore, how easy to make?
[11:32] <edmoore> i think it's just three loops of wire
[11:32] <edmoore> you can sandwich them between two sheets of polystyrene
[11:32] <edmoore> o've come across some good guides to making them on google
[11:32] <edmoore> including some habbers recommending them
[11:33] <jcoxon> just looking at that now
[11:33] <jcoxon> would also benefit with a reflector
[11:33] <jcoxon> it also looks a lot stronger then wire+ GP
[11:34] <edmoore> GP?
[11:34] <jcoxon> groundplane
[11:34] <jcoxon> http://www.hamtv.com/wheel.html
[11:35] <edmoore> cool
[11:35] <edmoore> though i think the effect would probably be detrimental when it's right near the horizon?
[11:36] <Hiena> Anybody has an idea to set a mobile VHF antenna with a minimal interference to the other wavelenghts?
[11:36] <edmoore> set?
[11:45] <Hiena> I need something to the VHF1-4 channel without disturbing the 30 MHz RC channel and the 400MHz channel.
[11:46] <edmoore> so you're transmitting?
[11:46] <Hiena> The problem is the VHF channel has 5W output power. and the other two is receiver mostly.
[11:46] <edmoore> I think usually the responsibility for this kind of thing lies further back in the chain, with the filtering on the amplifier
[11:48] <edmoore> but you may want to look at magnetic loop antennas, which have a very, very narrow bandwidth indeed http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_loop
[11:48] <Hiena> Yup. But these are not so suitable for a 2 meter modell.
[11:49] <edmoore> i think the battle is one that should be fought on the beaches of amplifier filtering
[11:50] Action: Hiena nods
[11:51] <Hiena> But until i can't get a decent oscilloscope, my hands tied.
[11:51] <edmoore> sure
[11:52] <edmoore> though I imagine there may be some good, proven designs for inline filters you can place between amp and antena
[11:52] <edmoore> #hamradio could be a good place to ask
[11:52] <Hiena> It tooks me half year until i could came up a decent, foolproof transmitter design.
[11:54] <Hiena> Due the limitation of the aviable measuring equipments, i approach the problem with the classic way.
[11:56] <Hiena> Pulled the classic headphone amplifire design and matched the supply voltage to the output.
[11:58] <Hiena> Heating a lot for sure, and needs a high input power, but it could transmit even with a nail.
[12:00] <Hiena> http://marsandme.blogspot.com/
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[12:10] <jcoxon> bbl
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[18:02] <jcoxon> evening all
[18:03] <Randomskk> yo
[18:04] <jcoxon> hey Randomskk
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[18:17] <SpeedEvil> Do gribs have precipitation info?
[18:20] <jcoxon> i don't think so
[18:20] <SpeedEvil> idly wondering.
[18:21] <SpeedEvil> What I really want is hourly xml of local weather conditions - but yr.no only supplies that as a graph
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[20:41] <Laurenceb> oh wow
[20:41] <Laurenceb> http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=9510
[20:42] <Laurenceb> couldnt be better
[20:42] <Randomskk> I still want all three gyros in one package
[20:42] <Randomskk> also for some reason they appear to have their axis all weird?
[20:43] <Randomskk> but besides that it is basically all their awesome sensors on one board and ready to tell you values over serial
[20:43] <Laurenceb> er yeah
[20:43] <Laurenceb> two axes wtf
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[20:43] <Randomskk> no, it's one 2axis and one 1axis
[20:43] <Randomskk> so you do get all three
[20:43] <Randomskk> but in two gyro packages
[20:43] <Laurenceb> sure
[20:43] <Laurenceb> I meant the silkscreen
[20:43] <Randomskk> yea
[20:43] <Randomskk> gyro x is rotation around acceleration y axis apparently
[20:43] <Randomskk> bit weird
[20:44] <Randomskk> though I guess it does kinda make sense
[20:44] <Laurenceb> of well *=-1;
[20:44] <Laurenceb> *oh well
[20:44] <Randomskk> an acceleration in the x direction gives a value on the same axis as a rotation in that 'direction'
[20:44] <Laurenceb> better be in stock on free day
[20:44] <Randomskk> and it's right-hand for z rotation
[20:44] <Randomskk> ntb
[20:44] <Randomskk> shit I really need tow ork out what I want for free day
[20:45] <russss> I think they will let you backorder on free day
[20:45] <Laurenceb> that :P
[20:45] <Laurenceb> oh sool
[20:45] <russss> (free day is my birthday =)
[20:45] <Randomskk> I already have all those sensors
[20:45] <Laurenceb> *cool
[20:45] <Laurenceb> hah
[20:45] <Laurenceb> me too
[20:45] <Randomskk> motor controller revision two is coming along really nicely
[20:45] <Laurenceb> I'll be 24 :-/
[20:45] <Randomskk> it's like a fifth the previous one's size. and better.
[20:45] <Laurenceb> too old
[20:45] <Laurenceb> nice, whats the size?
[20:46] <Randomskk> 1.9" by 0.8"
[20:46] <Laurenceb> neat, qfn avr ?
[20:46] <Randomskk> about 2mm longer than the mikrokopter one - except open source design, two layers instead of 4, uses to220 MOSFETs, drives both FETs with transistors not just the PNP one, uses real connectors instead of solder pads on the pcb for wires to be soldered to
[20:46] <Randomskk> yea.
[20:47] <Randomskk> wait no
[20:47] <Randomskk> mlf#
[20:47] <Laurenceb> same deal
[20:47] <Laurenceb> well almost
[20:47] <Randomskk> yea
[20:47] <Laurenceb> thats what tower pro use
[20:47] <Randomskk> https://randomskk.net/u/pics/mc2.png
[20:47] <Laurenceb> they have some pretty impressively small ones
[20:47] <Randomskk> c.f. https://randomskk.net/u/pics/mc.png revision 1
[20:48] <Randomskk> r1 didn't even get all the parts on the top side
[20:48] <Laurenceb> nice work
[20:48] <Randomskk> r2 has everything on top, so should be easy to reflow
[20:48] <Laurenceb> yeah
[20:48] <Randomskk> also vs mikrokopter's "loads of shit on both sides"
[20:48] <Randomskk> so basically it's the same size but way more awesome :P
[20:48] <Laurenceb> I was thinking of making a reflow oven with a toaster
[20:48] <Randomskk> seriously, what's up with just having solder pads for wires
[20:48] <Laurenceb> you can pick them up so cheap
[20:48] <Randomskk> such a pain
[20:49] <Laurenceb> connectors are a pain
[20:49] <Laurenceb> and fail
[20:49] <Randomskk> you'd rather solder wires to pads?
[20:49] <Laurenceb> yes
[20:49] <Laurenceb> any day
[20:49] <Randomskk> why?
[20:49] <Randomskk> I'd way rather a little 6pin ribbon cable on a polarised connector, and screw terminals, say, for the motor leads
[20:49] <Randomskk> and battery
[20:49] <Randomskk> otherwise changing anything is a massive pain in the arse, moving the board around is difficult...
[20:50] <Laurenceb> connectors are a pain to source, expensive, fail
[20:50] <Randomskk> 0.1" headers are not difficult to source :P
[20:50] <Laurenceb> wires are less hassle inless its real prototypey stuff
[20:50] <Randomskk> and if you really wanted you can solder wires straight to the holes in the pcb for the connectors
[20:50] <Laurenceb> true
[20:51] <Randomskk> but nah, definitely prefer connectors
[20:51] <Laurenceb> even 0.1'' headers you have to be really careful what you're buying
[20:51] <Randomskk> seriously, soldering your printer to your motherboard?
[20:51] <Laurenceb> for it to be very reliable
[20:51] <Laurenceb> heh
[20:51] <Laurenceb> wires its solder and forget
[20:51] <Randomskk> especially as wire count increases
[20:51] <Randomskk> connectors it's connect and forget
[20:52] <Randomskk> and then when you need to change something, or move it, or detach it, you just pull the connector out
[20:52] <Laurenceb> not in the real world
[20:52] <Randomskk> neither should be taking any stress anyway and a locking connector will work just as well as a wire soldered to copper on a pcb for that
[20:52] <Laurenceb> if you spoke to the guys who build sats at surrey they lol at excessive use of connectors
[20:53] <Laurenceb> even their modular ubergps with swappable front ends and processing boards is fully soldered
[20:53] <Randomskk> sounds like it'd just be a pita when you want to swap anything
[20:54] <Laurenceb> you dont, thats the point
[20:54] <Randomskk> otoh they are putting stuff in a gigantic rocket motor, where you might get significantly more vibrations than nromal
[20:54] <Laurenceb> s/rocket/quadcopter
[20:54] <Randomskk> pfft
[20:54] <Randomskk> betcha the rocket vibrates more
[20:56] <Laurenceb> well to be fair I'd use connectors too
[20:56] <russss> rockets have weird vibration modes
[20:56] <Laurenceb> as its good to have it fixable easily etc
[20:56] <Laurenceb> but you have to be careful not to overuse connectors
[20:56] <Laurenceb> its an easy trap to fall for
[20:56] <Randomskk> true
[20:57] <Randomskk> but in this case I definitely want to be able to plug/unplug my battery, motor, etc
[20:57] <Randomskk> without dicking around with a soldering iron every time
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[22:02] <Laurenceb> hmmm
[22:02] <Laurenceb> that board + flacom ublox5 on the uart and cc1020 on the spi
[22:02] <Laurenceb> epic awesomeness
[22:04] <Laurenceb> atmega328 is probably overpowered
[22:04] <Laurenceb> *under
[22:04] <Randomskk> underpowered to run calculations
[22:04] <Randomskk> just right to read the sensors and stream the data to you
[22:04] <Laurenceb> or maybe not...
[22:05] <Randomskk> I'd hook that up to a central controller (e.g. ARM) which connects to the gps, radio etc
[22:05] <Laurenceb> yeah - but I bet I could get a filter running at 50hz or so on the avr
[22:05] <Randomskk> then again, mikrokopter use an atmega
[22:05] <Randomskk> and tbh their quadcopters were perfectly stable
[22:06] <Laurenceb> stick the ublox5 on rx and data out tx
[22:06] <Randomskk> yup
[22:06] <Randomskk> that could work pretty well
[22:06] <Laurenceb> ooh the epicness
[22:06] <russss> yeah the atmegas are good at being I/O interfaces
[22:07] <russss> that's basically all I use them for...
[22:07] <Laurenceb> that quaternion based attitude code I posted on the wiki would run at 50Hz with float32 for everything
[22:08] <russss> I want to build a quadcopter, is mikrokopter the best one?
[22:08] <Laurenceb> on an atmega
[22:08] <Randomskk> eeh
[22:09] <Laurenceb> that sparkfun board + falcom ublox5 module + hacked tower pro controllers
[22:09] <Randomskk> mikrokopter is probably your best bet to get something up and running and working
[22:09] <Randomskk> right away
[22:09] <russss> yeah OK. I guess that was my question.
[22:09] <Randomskk> I don't like some of what they do really. or how their board files aren't released
[22:09] <russss> there seem to be so many projects, heh
[22:09] <Randomskk> also it's pretty expensive.
[22:10] <jcoxon> hey all
[22:10] <Randomskk> like 800 to 1000 eur to get a complete kit from them, and even then you need a transmitter
[22:10] <Randomskk> hi jcoxon
[22:10] <jcoxon> just got pictures of ballasthalo3
[22:10] <russss> ouch!
[22:10] <Laurenceb> hi jcoxon
[22:10] <russss> I have a transmitter, thankfully.
[22:10] <Randomskk> hopefully my motor controller board will end up being a bit cheaper than theirs
[22:10] <Randomskk> especially seeing as it's way easier to assemble and 2-layer not 4-layer
[22:10] <Laurenceb> use chipcon for the radio
[22:11] <Randomskk> I could probably make it protocol compatible over i2c, anyway
[22:11] <Laurenceb> then you could fly long range missions
[22:11] <Laurenceb> as in 10km or so :D
[22:11] <Randomskk> because your battery is definitely gonna last 10km :P
[22:11] <Laurenceb> actually yes
[22:11] <russss> GSM modem :P
[22:11] <Randomskk> really?
[22:11] <Laurenceb> 10km is easy
[22:11] <Randomskk> I mean, I've not actually tried it.
[22:11] <Randomskk> nice.
[22:11] <russss> with a good autopilot you don't have to worry about latency
[22:11] <Laurenceb> I got 30km if you go all out for range
[22:11] <Randomskk> this is why I wanna get mine totally automated
[22:12] <Randomskk> screw having to control it with little control sticks
[22:12] <Randomskk> all about gps positions
[22:12] <Laurenceb> yeah
[22:12] <Randomskk> and maybe cameras
[22:12] <russss> that said, the CAA frowns on that sort of stuff.
[22:12] <Randomskk> I bet my motor controllers will be cheaper actually
[22:12] <Laurenceb> yeah
[22:12] <Randomskk> theirs are like 40eur
[22:13] <Laurenceb> certainly need to put some limits on the altitude
[22:13] <jcoxon> http://www.flickr.com/photos/jcoxon77/4238693714/
[22:13] <Randomskk> jcoxon: woo!
[22:13] <Randomskk> have you got it back in your hands now?
[22:14] <jcoxon> no its in the hands of a ham in france
[22:14] <jcoxon> i think as a radio ham i can get him to strip it down and post back the pump and circuit boards
[22:15] <Randomskk> no point posting back polystyrene
[22:16] <Laurenceb> Randomskk: I was thinking about IMU code, I think you can use a metropolis Hastings algorithm to correcting sensor drift
[22:17] <Laurenceb> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metropolis%E2%80%93Hastings_algorithm
[22:17] <Laurenceb> basically you could have a "simple" extended kalman filter with no sensor biases in it
[22:18] <Laurenceb> then you use the size of the errors in sensor outputs to adjust the biases etc
[22:21] <jcoxon> what would be a good reward for the guys who recovered my payload?
[22:21] <Randomskk> I see
[22:21] <Randomskk> neat
[22:21] <Laurenceb> money?
[22:22] <Randomskk> keeping the EKF simple would be good
[22:22] <Laurenceb> Randomskk: its a bit hard to explain
[22:22] <Randomskk> the errors in the sensor outputs being their value compared to the current EKF value?
[22:22] <Laurenceb> the step by step instructions explain it best
[22:22] <Laurenceb> the errors are the residuals in the EKF measurement step
[22:23] <Randomskk> right, okay
[22:23] <Laurenceb> for the likelyhood ratio you use residuals
[22:25] <Laurenceb> actually a better technique would be slightly more complex
[22:25] Action: Randomskk bookmarks
[22:25] <Randomskk> will try and get the sensors all hooked up and streaming data asap
[22:25] <Randomskk> should get the motor controller entirely done soon enough and then it can at least start moving
[22:25] <Randomskk> bbl, time to watch 2010 :P
[22:26] <Laurenceb> you would compute three residuals, x_t residual, x' residual, and the residual from a filtered output of the M/H state
[22:26] <Laurenceb> the last one being what you use for the EKF
[22:27] <Laurenceb> ooh I didnt realise youd gone on the trans-siberian railway
[22:27] Action: Laurenceb is looking at randomskks flickr page
[22:28] <jcoxon> Randomskk, you been on the trans-siberian?
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[22:30] <Laurenceb> http://www.flickr.com/photos/randomskk/page4/
[22:31] <jcoxon> http://www.flickr.com/photos/jcoxon77/2083843684/in/set-72157603364687801/
[22:31] <jcoxon> hehe
[22:32] <Laurenceb> http://www.canucklehead.ca/look/1984.html
[22:33] <jcoxon> the trans-siberian is a good trip
[22:33] <Randomskk> it was loads of fun
[22:33] <Randomskk> we did moscow to vladivostok then ferry to japan
[22:34] <jcoxon> :-)
[22:34] <jcoxon> did london to kathmandu
[22:34] <Randomskk> train to amsterdam and then moscow, to start with
[22:34] <Randomskk> nice
[22:34] <jcoxon> yeah pretty much the same
[22:34] <jcoxon> but we went to china from ulan-ude
[22:34] <jcoxon> then up to tibet and accross the himlayas down into nepal
[22:35] <Randomskk> wow
[22:35] <Randomskk> sounds good
[22:35] <jcoxon> but i'm jealous that you complete the trans-a
[22:35] <jcoxon> would love to have gone to vlad
[22:35] <Randomskk> I have a photo of me at the final milepost :D
[22:35] <Randomskk> vladivostok itself isn't that great though I guess
[22:35] <Randomskk> I preferred ulan-bator when I was there. and irkutsk was pretty nice
[22:36] <jcoxon> its more the journet
[22:36] <Randomskk> yes
[22:36] <jcoxon> we didn't book our trans-a so had to take what we could get which was a ticket to ulan-ude
[22:36] <Randomskk> sounds like it still worked out pretty well
[22:37] <jcoxon> yeah, how long was your trip?
[22:37] <Randomskk> 5 weeks total
[22:37] <Randomskk> summer holiday thing
[22:37] <jcoxon> yeah we did our one the summer after graduating
[22:37] <Randomskk> just under a week for amsterdam, a day or two in moscow, 7 days on the trans sib, 2 in irkutsk, three weeks in japan
[22:37] <Randomskk> this was summer after school and before uni
[22:38] <Randomskk> but now I dunno what to do after graduation :P
[22:38] <Randomskk> I am tempted by the mongol rally
[22:38] <jcoxon> 3 days to moscow, 3 days in moscow, 4 days to ulan-ude, 3 days on the lake, 5 days mongolia, 5 days in bejing, 2 days on train to tibet, 3 days acclimatising in lhasa, 2 days to everest, 2 days to kathmandu and then 7 days in nepal
[22:38] <jcoxon> Randomskk, http://www.flickr.com/photos/jcoxon77/sets/72157594465849168/
[22:38] <jcoxon> this is what you do
[22:39] <jcoxon> :-p
[22:39] <Randomskk> ooh, nice
[22:39] <Randomskk> that'd be another fun option
[22:39] <Randomskk> marrakech is nice
[22:39] <jcoxon> http://www.sahara-overland.com/routes/routesmap.htm
[22:39] <Randomskk> have you seen http://www.theadventurists.com/ ?
[22:40] <jcoxon> i haven't - there are quite a few of these around
[22:40] <jcoxon> i've seen the mongol rally
[22:40] <Randomskk> yup
[22:40] <jcoxon> tis a classic
[22:41] <russss> my friends have spent the last 3 months in varying places in east asia
[22:41] <Randomskk> they also do the mongol derby but I do not think I am an experienced enough horse rider :P
[22:41] <russss> which I am slightly jealous of.
[22:41] <Randomskk> japan was lovely but not very wild
[22:41] <jcoxon> I'm beginning to get itch feet
[22:41] <Randomskk> there's also south america
[22:41] <jcoxon> i really enjoyed japan
[22:41] <jcoxon> itchy*
[22:41] <jcoxon> africa is calling me back :-p
[22:41] <jcoxon> and i only left 3 months ago
[22:41] <russss> I'm going to Seattle in 2 weeks. I don't think I've got the right idea of going somewhere warm in the winter.
[22:42] <Randomskk> I've only been to like moroocco and a few places in kenya for africa
[22:42] <Randomskk> well and some islands but they hardly count
[22:42] <jcoxon> hehe
[22:42] <jcoxon> today i was thinking - if we ever launch atlantic halo
[22:42] <jcoxon> i'm off to morrocco to track :-p
[22:43] <russss> hah
[22:43] <Randomskk> hehe
[22:43] <Randomskk> that'd be great
[22:44] <jcoxon> on that note its time to get organising
[22:44] <jcoxon> we need more help (and a bit more enthusiasm
[22:44] <jcoxon> )
[22:44] <Randomskk> I need to finish uploading all my japan photos to flickr
[22:44] <Randomskk> my internet was being superslow at uploading when I tried last
[22:44] <jcoxon> so if you want to help out please get in touch - there are lots of jobs
[22:44] <Randomskk> like half an hour per photo
[22:44] <jcoxon> outch
[22:44] <Randomskk> I mean, okay, they are like 10mb jpegs
[22:45] <Randomskk> but still
[22:45] <jcoxon> hehe
[22:45] <Randomskk> I'd be happy to help out with it
[22:45] <Randomskk> is cusf involved generally?
[22:46] <jcoxon> Randomskk, cusf are involved in an individual capacity
[22:46] <jcoxon> its more under a ukhas mantle
[22:46] <jcoxon> cusf itself has enough jobs as it is
[22:46] <Randomskk> :P yup
[22:46] <jcoxon> going to organise a meeting next week on irc/skype
[22:47] <Randomskk> I'll be on here and am on the ukhas list, so let me know
[22:47] <jcoxon> yeah
[22:47] <jcoxon> need to kick Laurenceb into working on the flight logic
[22:47] <Randomskk> anyway back to 2010
[22:48] <Randomskk> the future did not turn out like they might have hoped
[22:48] <Randomskk> but at least we are living in it, so that's pretty cool
[22:48] <Randomskk> otoh we are not flying to jupiter
[22:48] <Randomskk> win some, lose some
[22:49] <jcoxon> hehe
[22:50] <jcoxon> Randomskk, also: http://groups.google.com/group/ukhas-trans-a
[22:50] <jcoxon> bit more discussion goes on here as well
[22:50] <jcoxon> feel free to sign up
[22:51] <Laurenceb> ooh
[22:51] <Laurenceb> yeah I did offer
[22:51] <Laurenceb> ok
[22:52] <Randomskk> joined
[22:54] <Randomskk> ha, our computers are much better though
[23:09] <jcoxon> ping DanielRichman
[23:10] <Laurenceb> whats 2010?
[23:10] <DanielRichman> hello jcoxon
[23:10] <Laurenceb> oh follow on from 2001?
[23:10] <jcoxon> DanielRichman, any chance you can get alexbreton to contact me say tomorrow?
[23:11] <DanielRichman> jcoxon, it's certainly possible. I'll pass a message onto him too, if you want
[23:11] <DanielRichman> what would you like to talk to him about?
[23:11] <jcoxon> yeah please - just need to borrow his french to sort out the final return of the payload
[23:11] <DanielRichman> aha :)
[23:11] <DanielRichman> Ok I will pass it on as soon as he returns online.
[23:12] <Randomskk> Laurenceb: yea
[23:12] <Randomskk> our computers are definitely way better than they predicted
[23:14] <jcoxon> DanielRichman, thanks
[23:18] <SpeedEvil> Randomskk: I disagree.
[23:18] <SpeedEvil> Randomskk: My computer never tries to kill me, therefore it can't be that advanced.
[23:18] <Randomskk> my computer has more than 144 pixels
[23:19] <Laurenceb> 2001 is brilliant
[23:19] <Laurenceb> I havent seen 2010, but its not as famous
[23:20] <SpeedEvil> My most recent computer has a screen 1/5th the size of my first, 64 times the RAM, 50000 times the storage.
[23:21] <Randomskk> 2010 isn't as good really. I think the books are maybe good. I haven't read them, but there's a third too - 3001 or whatever
[23:21] <Randomskk> SpeedEvil: only 64 times the ram?
[23:21] <Randomskk> tiny screen though. netbook?
[23:21] <Randomskk> fsvo computer my most recent one could be an avr
[23:21] <SpeedEvil> Randomskk: n900
[23:22] <SpeedEvil> 2063 IIRC
[23:22] <Randomskk> nice
[23:22] <Randomskk> fair enough on the ram, then
[23:22] <SpeedEvil> But finding my laptop hard drive stuttering a bit, and simply being able to rsync it over onto my phone is unspeakably awesome.
[23:23] <Randomskk> indeed it is
[23:24] <SpeedEvil> There is very little I find wrong with the hardware.
[23:24] <jcoxon> what do people think about me starting a ukhas google code repos?
[23:24] <SpeedEvil> Not quite nothing.
[23:24] <Randomskk> personally I prefer git and github
[23:24] <SpeedEvil> jcoxon: I think you should start it with "#include "darkandstormynight.h"
[23:24] <Randomskk> especially since all our work is so distributed anyway
[23:25] <Randomskk> but if you did setup google code I can just git-svn it and for all intents and purposes it's git to me :P
[23:25] <jcoxon> its more that i'm about to put up the begins of the atlantichalo flight code/sim
[23:26] <jcoxon> and thought that i could do it as a branch of a ukhas svn
[23:27] <jcoxon> Randomskk, you reckon that github is better?
[23:27] <Randomskk> this is where I'd just start my own atlantichalo repo on github and then others can clone and commit and push and etc as needed
[23:27] <Randomskk> personally I prefer how git works to how svn works
[23:27] <Randomskk> also I think github as a website is better than google code
[23:28] <Randomskk> it looks prettier imho
[23:28] <Randomskk> same functionality - you still get a wiki, issue tracking, etc
[23:28] <Randomskk> mainly the thing is that github works with git where google code works with svn
[23:29] <jcoxon> lets go with github
[23:30] <Randomskk> woo
[23:31] <jcoxon> as google code wiki drives me mad
[23:35] <jcoxon> right: http://github.com/jamescoxon/Atlantic-Halo
[23:37] <Randomskk> cool
[23:38] Jos (i=Jos@Lithium.Jossie90.info) got netsplit.
[23:40] <Randomskk> github's guides on using git are generally excellent
[23:41] <jcoxon> okay so do local editing and then use git commit -a to stick it in your local copy and then git push to upload the changes
[23:42] Jos (i=Jos@Lithium.Jossie90.info) returned to #highaltitude.
[23:42] <Randomskk> that's the gist of it
[23:43] <Randomskk> branches are cheap and quick, so you can use them for whatever.
[23:44] <Randomskk> working withs others can work in one of two way, either on their own copies of the repository and send pull requests to you on github, or you can give others commit access to your own repository
[23:45] <Randomskk> the latter works most like the typical svn repo
[23:45] <Randomskk> the former is the new distributed way, by and large
[23:46] <Randomskk> or you could do both.
[23:47] Laurenceb (n=laurence@host86-140-198-16.range86-140.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Remote closed the connection
[23:52] DanielRichman (n=daniel@unaffiliated/danielrichman) left irc: "Leaving"
[23:53] Hiena (n=Hiena@81.93.195.181.datatrans.hu) left irc: "Leaving"
[23:58] <jcoxon> Randomskk, right - i've got a sort of job for you if you want...
[23:59] <Randomskk> go for it
[00:00] --- Sun Jan 3 2010