highaltitude.log.20091007

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[13:07] <juxta_> does anybody know of any suppliers for balloons and/or chutes in Australia?
[13:14] <juxta_> also, can anybody suggest a simple & reliable way to build a cutdown system?
[13:15] <SpeedEvil> A 10 megaton nuclear warhead.
[13:16] <SpeedEvil> Alternatively, I like to use ceramic resistors.
[13:16] <SpeedEvil> 1W ones, that are rated to operate up to 350C case temperature.
[13:16] <juxta_> to basically burn the string?
[13:16] <SpeedEvil> wrap a line round this, and then turn it on, and it will melt the string as it passes 100C or so in a minute
[13:16] <juxta_> ah good idea
[13:17] <juxta_> how do you power it?
[13:17] <SpeedEvil> Everything is completely in spec, it's completely testable and reusable
[13:17] <SpeedEvil> AA batteries would work
[13:17] <SpeedEvil> however - I've only done ground tests. I see no reason why this wouldn't work though.
[13:18] <juxta_> sounds valid enough to me
[13:18] <juxta_> using some kind of nylong string?
[13:18] <SpeedEvil> As the resistor is specified from -55 to 350, you're not putting any force on it - if you do it right, and it's nice and simple
[13:18] <SpeedEvil> yes
[13:18] <SpeedEvil> though nylon has a moderately high melting point, polythene is a bit lower
[13:18] <SpeedEvil> then there is hot-melt-glue - which again should work fine.
[13:18] <juxta_> ah
[13:19] <juxta_> that's an excellent idea
[13:19] <SpeedEvil> (though needs care as it may get a bit brittle at -55
[13:19] <juxta_> yeah, understandable
[13:22] <juxta_> i'll do some experimenting with those ideas SpeedEvil
[13:23] <SpeedEvil> htere are also some more ways on the wiki
[13:23] <SpeedEvil> Some people like things that go bang!
[13:23] <SpeedEvil> I don't - untestable, debatable legality, liabilty problems in theory
[13:30] <juxta_> thanks SpeedEvil - I couldnt find anything else on the wiki - can you link me?
[13:31] <SpeedEvil> afk, sorry
[13:31] <juxta_> no prob s
[13:31] <juxta_> probs*
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[16:22] <jcoxon> afternoon all
[16:22] <Randomskk> hi
[16:22] <sbasuita> jcoxon, afternoon
[16:22] <jcoxon> hey sbasuita ,Randomskk
[16:24] <jcoxon> hows it going?
[16:25] <Randomskk> still in manic first week mode
[16:26] <jcoxon> hehe Randomskk it won't calm down till the end of term!
[16:26] <jcoxon> which is only 7 weeks away remember
[16:26] <sbasuita> waiting on celotex....
[16:26] <Randomskk> heh true
[16:26] <Randomskk> well, 8 weeks as of tomorrow
[16:26] <Randomskk> today is day -1 :p
[16:27] <Randomskk> which ofc means I've already had lectures all morning and afternoon
[16:27] <Randomskk> and an email from the computing services dept asking why someone was port scanning me lol
[16:27] <jcoxon> indeed - its worth all the work in the end
[16:28] <jcoxon> going to start my work on ballasthalo3 this evening
[16:28] <jcoxon> which reminds me that i've got to go and get ballasthalo2 out of that tree one day
[16:28] <jcoxon> wonder if anything is salvagable now after over 2 months
[16:29] <Randomskk> how high was this tree? :p
[16:29] <jcoxon> high, going to need big ladders methinks
[16:29] <sbasuita> Why did nobody go back to get it?
[16:30] <jcoxon> cause i went away pretty much after it landed and its far away from everyone
[16:30] <sbasuita> jcoxon, btw, daniel currently has your radio
[16:31] <jcoxon> right, i think Josh wants to borrow it again
[16:31] <jcoxon> then i guess i better recall it someday
[16:31] <sbasuita> :/
[16:33] <jcoxon> sbasuita: also am going to look into updating dl-fldigi to the latest version of fldigi as that has a number of bug fixes and improvements
[16:34] <sbasuita> jcoxon, ok, just give me a bell when its done and i'll do the packages - also if configure breaks ; )
[16:35] <jcoxon> hehe, still don't understand configure - really isn't very intuative
[16:36] <Randomskk> I like using it, it's making a configure script that's a pain :p
[16:37] <jcoxon> Randomskk: do you have experience in C?
[16:37] <jcoxon> or C++?
[16:37] <Randomskk> both
[16:37] <Randomskk> but less in managing autotools
[16:38] <jcoxon> have you seen dl-fldigi?
[16:38] <Randomskk> is it the software that decodes the radio and sends sentences to ukhas?
[16:38] <jcoxon> yeah
[16:39] <Randomskk> briefly
[16:39] <Randomskk> seen a screenshot on the wiki, essentially.
[16:40] <jcoxon> we basically took fldigi ( a well known decoder program) and added curl
[16:40] <Randomskk> not got any radio kit (yet)
[16:40] <Randomskk> (have signed up for cuws though so...)
[16:40] <jcoxon> well if you are ever bored you are very welcome to help out with it - i'm defintiely not a born programmer
[16:40] <sbasuita> Randomskk, wine society?
[16:40] <jcoxon> wireless soc
[16:40] <sbasuita> : P
[16:41] <Randomskk> not posh enough for the wine society :p
[16:41] <Randomskk> the tea one looked fun but don't drink that much tea either so
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[16:42] <sbasuita> Would definitely join the tea society
[16:42] <DanielRichman> O...k... HMV shipped my CD from Gurnsey
[16:43] <sbasuita> DanielRichman, why didn't you just buy from their store?
[16:44] <DanielRichman> sbasuita, none nearby and I wasn't in a rush. It's actually cheaper online since there's no P&P and in store prices are generally £1 more
[16:45] <sbasuita> DanielRichman, download a torrent while you wait for the cd
[16:45] <DanielRichman> sbasuita, er no
[16:45] <jcoxon> i think there is some sort of tax break for them in the channel islands
[16:45] <jcoxon> as amazon and piximax are also based there i think
[16:45] <DanielRichman> hmm mebe. but it takes ~2 days longer to get here and has to go through customs kerfuffle
[16:46] <Randomskk> it's in the eu, shouldn't be any custos
[16:46] <Randomskk> customs
[16:46] <rjharrison> hey jcoxon
[16:46] <rjharrison> Need some good winds
[16:46] <rjharrison> I'm ready to launch a 3000g
[16:46] Action: SpeedEvil farts.
[16:46] <rjharrison> lol
[16:47] <rjharrison> That is about all the wind speed I want
[16:47] <jcoxon> rjharrison: hey
[16:47] <rjharrison> Doing very boring HR investigation
[16:47] <jcoxon> will keep an eye on the weather then
[16:47] <rjharrison> jcoxon sorry about not getting your payload back
[16:47] <sbasuita> What's the deal with payloads going through clouds on the whole water+electricity front?
[16:48] <jcoxon> does sound dull, perhaps not as dull as a morning of lectures on how to write medical notes and then an afternoon on death certificates
[16:48] <SpeedEvil> if it gets hit bu lightning, you're screwed.
[16:48] <SpeedEvil> Did it cover 'scrawl really illegibly' ?
[16:48] <jcoxon> rjharrison: no worries - we'll go on an expedition one day
[16:48] <jcoxon> SpeedEvil: thats a given
[16:48] <rjharrison> Just not been in that direction I did get some guys to check it out with a cherry picker
[16:49] <rjharrison> but access is too restricted
[16:49] <rjharrison> sbasuita there is no issue
[16:49] <rjharrison> well not to date
[16:49] <rjharrison> Have not launched in lightening storm yet
[16:50] <SpeedEvil> If you launch into a thunderstorm - or a prethunderstorm, it's gonna die anyway
[16:51] <SpeedEvil> hail + a couple of microns of latex are not good friends.
[16:53] <rjharrison> I'm not so sure. The balloon is quite floppy at cloud level
[16:54] <rjharrison> It's quite common to get condensation on the lense but that soon burns off
[16:54] <rjharrison> Well in day flights it does
[16:56] <SpeedEvil> By hail, I mean the quite large hail often found in thunderstorms
[16:56] <SpeedEvil> even if it melts on the way down
[16:57] <SpeedEvil> But flights into storms would be an interesting thing to try :)
[16:57] <SpeedEvil> Or just FOIA it
[16:57] <SpeedEvil> http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/ - met office
[16:57] <jcoxon> SpeedEvil: edmoore has plans for stormHAB
[16:57] <SpeedEvil> :)
[16:57] Action: SpeedEvil is up to 4 requests so far.
[17:02] <SpeedEvil> 5
[17:04] <Randomskk> heh, met office must have some pretty useful info on what happens to weather balloons
[17:05] <SpeedEvil> but google first of course
[17:05] <Randomskk> saves you ten pounds
[17:06] <SpeedEvil> Ten pounds is only for a subject access request
[17:06] <SpeedEvil> What data they hold on you.
[17:06] <Randomskk> oh, so it is. that's dpa
[17:06] <Randomskk> got mixed up
[17:06] <Randomskk> just saves time then :p
[17:06] <SpeedEvil> If you are asking general data - for example - how much local, central government and charities paid in license fees and other mapping products, it's free.
[17:06] <SpeedEvil> ^to the OS
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[18:17] <Laurenceb> hi
[18:17] <Laurenceb> whats new?
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[18:42] <Hiena> Shiny parts for my wind tunnel.
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[19:38] <jcoxon> hey all
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[19:58] <jcoxon> bbiab
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[20:13] <jcoxon> oops
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[21:46] <jcoxon> woohoo got my temp sensor working
[21:49] <SpeedEvil> :)
[21:49] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: I gtot some carbon foam off ebay
[21:49] <Laurenceb> hmm interesting
[21:49] <Laurenceb> any spacs?
[21:49] <Laurenceb> *specs
[21:49] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: I have no idea what its mechanical properties are - void fraction is maybe .8 - based on density
[21:49] <SpeedEvil> and cell-size 2mm or so
[21:49] <SpeedEvil> no
[21:53] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: http://www.fibretech.com/products_fibrecore.htm also
[21:54] <SpeedEvil> also - what's wrong with simple square bulkheads?
[21:55] <Laurenceb> too heavy
[21:55] <Laurenceb> msybe...
[21:55] <Laurenceb> I'm not sure
[21:56] <SpeedEvil> It is more annoying to make, yes.
[21:58] <Laurenceb> carbon fibre hemispheres or close to that appears to be the only good option
[21:59] <SpeedEvil> what's wrong with carbon fibre flat endplates, held in place by cylinders?
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[22:00] <Laurenceb> they have to be thick
[22:01] <Laurenceb> its the radius of curvature that counts
[22:01] <SpeedEvil> I know - but the alternative is quite a lot of dense foam
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[22:02] <Laurenceb> I guess you could let the space be filled by hot gas
[22:03] <Laurenceb> and put thermal protection over the end of the fuel and the surface of the CF
[22:04] <Laurenceb> taking thermal protection into account some sort of thermal protection - foam/honeycomb - carbon fibre
[22:04] <Laurenceb> may be best
[22:06] <Laurenceb> or a carbon fibre spar structure to reinforce the thermal protection
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[22:08] <SpeedEvil> What is the number for the weight of the flat bulkhead - is it really that bad?
[22:12] <Laurenceb> not sure
[22:12] <Laurenceb> I'm not sure of the best design
[22:12] <Laurenceb> a completely flat bulkhead will fail
[22:14] <Laurenceb> I think the best option is something intermediate betwen a hemispher and flat
[22:14] <Laurenceb> so you can think of the construction as tube - a section of torus - section of spherical shell
[22:15] <Laurenceb> then have two layers of thermal protection - one of hte top of the fuel and one of the fibre
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[22:39] <Laurenceb> of course you could stick the propellant on a lathe and machine it to fit
[22:39] <Laurenceb> I'm not sure if thats an "act of manufacture"
[22:41] <Randomskk> you'd put propellant on a lathe? don't they tend to get a bit hot?
[22:42] <Randomskk> I guess it does kinda depend on speed and such
[22:42] <Laurenceb> yeah just have to be sensible
[22:43] <Laurenceb> but AP composite prepellant is quite safe to machine
[22:43] <Laurenceb> wear protective clothing and have escape route planned out
[22:43] <Randomskk> heh yup
[22:44] <Randomskk> it wouldn't really explode though would it? just ignite and burn
[22:44] <Randomskk> obviously that'd still be kinda bad
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[22:44] <Laurenceb> in an unenclosed space it wouldnt be too bad
[22:44] <Laurenceb> the pressure speeds up the regression rate
[22:51] <Laurenceb> http://www.npwrc.usgs.gov/about/faqs/animals/names.htm <-lol
[22:53] <Laurenceb> An ostentation of Peacocks
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[00:00] --- Thu Oct 8 2009