highaltitude.log.20090922

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[00:17] <fuzzylugnuts> Hey
[00:18] <SpeedEvil> h
[00:20] <fuzzylugnuts> trossen robotics are re-doing the pan tilt kit
[00:20] <rjharrison> Hi
[00:20] <fuzzylugnuts> Hi
[00:20] <rjharrison> Opps I have just spamed the ukhas group by accident
[00:21] <fuzzylugnuts> mm, spam
[00:21] Action: natrium42 calls UPS to reverse rjharrison's parcel :D
[00:24] <rjharrison> hehe Its for the CUSF guys
[00:25] <rjharrison> made the mistake of responding to ed's email :) doh! as homer would say
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[00:29] <rjharrison> Nights all fuzzylugnuts natrium42 SpeedEvil et al ...
[00:29] <rjharrison> Bed is calling
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[00:30] <fuzzylugnuts> 'Night
[00:30] <fuzzylugnuts> aww.
[00:30] <fuzzylugnuts> margaritas make me slow.
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[00:34] <appletizer> so what do people make of justin and oliver's rig?
[00:34] <appletizer> :)
[00:37] <SpeedEvil1> ?
[00:37] <appletizer> http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2009/sep/21/mit-students-budget-space-photographs
[00:38] <fuzzylugnuts> hm
[00:41] <SpeedEvil1> Neat - but technically boring
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[00:42] <fuzzylugnuts> very simplistic and enjoyable
[00:43] <SpeedEvil1> A good first project
[00:43] <SpeedEvil1> but there is then nowhere to go
[00:44] <SpeedEvil1> Well - unless you fly a better phone...
[00:44] <fuzzylugnuts> ;P
[00:45] Nick change: SpeedEvil1 -> SpeefRevil
[00:45] Nick change: SpeefRevil -> SpeedEvil
[00:52] <SpeedEvil> And yay - my 2 line awk script generates the exact same figure for price from my pppd logs of bytes sent as vodaphone onlines shitty webapp.
[00:52] <forrestv> is there a better way to control a quadrotor than using a quaternion representing the rotation it's trying to do any converting it to euler angles? euler angles have a pattern of rotations, but the quadrotor rotates on the axes simultaneously, so it doesn't seem to match.
[00:52] <forrestv> *and converting it
[00:53] <SpeedEvil> Trained hampster. It's the only rational solution.
[00:54] <SpeedEvil> Remember the little flying goggles and hat - they are key to performance.
[00:56] <forrestv> SpeedEvil, i don't think they have the necessary reaction time.
[00:58] <SpeedEvil> Poke Laurenceb when he's awake.
[00:58] <fuzzylugnuts> its more fun when they're asleep
[00:58] <Laurenceb> hi
[00:59] <Laurenceb> IMO euler angles are more numerically stable
[01:00] <Laurenceb> but quadrotors shouldnt be doing crazy stuff
[01:00] <Laurenceb> so euler angles may work better
[01:00] <Laurenceb> in some circumstances, euler angles use less cpu clocks
[01:01] <Laurenceb> but th trig functions tend to eat them up
[01:01] <Laurenceb> its swings and roundabouts
[01:02] <Laurenceb> the order of rotations you are misunderstanding
[01:02] <Laurenceb> thats just the way they are defined
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[01:05] <Laurenceb> euler angles are unstable as at certain angles rounding issues and noise can be badly modeled by extended kalman filters as the trig becomes highly nonlinear
[01:06] <Laurenceb> extended kalman is basically taking the first term of a taylor expansion
[01:20] <Laurenceb> http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=9184
[01:20] <Laurenceb> I was thinking of buying one of those for a UAV
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[01:45] <fuzzylugnuts1> GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAh
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[08:18] <trialex> Anyone got any good links for material to use as flight line?
[08:30] <rjharrison_> Basically any cord that is not twisted
[08:30] <rjharrison_> trialex
[08:30] <grummund> how about kite line
[08:31] <rjharrison_> A polymer would be fine
[08:31] <rjharrison_> Yep kite line too
[08:35] <grummund> http://poolekites.co.uk/cliprice.htm#dyne
[08:35] <grummund> http://www.fsk.enta.net/pages/kite_lines.htm
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[11:15] <Laurenceb> hi
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[17:18] <rjharrison> Hi guys
[17:18] <rjharrison> quick question on CPS
[17:18] <rjharrison> CAPS
[17:18] <rjharrison> Ct = C1 + C2 in //
[17:20] <rjharrison> I have 6.3v Rating on my tantalum cap. Should it be ok to drive it using 4xAA ie ~6v
[17:20] <rjharrison> ir is there that 50% derating factor and hence this is not a good idea
[17:21] <rjharrison> The cap us used to trigger pyro and is NOT connected to the power supply of the uC
[17:21] <rjharrison> SpeedEvil you will probably have a comment on the above
[17:23] <rjharrison> http://uk.farnell.com/vishay/592d228x06r3x2t20h/capacitor-2200uf-6-3v-x-case-20/dp/1565087
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[17:24] <rjharrison> This is the cap in question and I'm going to solder two of the buggers together
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[18:27] <SpeedEvil> rjharrison: tantalums have this annoying habit of exploding and catching fire under the - relatively - slightest provocation.
[18:28] <SpeedEvil> 4AA - lithium I assume?
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[19:57] <rjharrison_> Evening all
[19:58] <SpeedEvil> ven
[19:58] <natrium42> yo
[20:01] <rjharrison_> hehe
[20:02] <rjharrison_> I'm just going to take the milk upstairs for the kids. Might be launching this w.e
[20:02] <natrium42> yay
[20:02] <natrium42> payload looks great btw
[20:03] <SpeedEvil> :)
[20:05] Action: DanielRichman finishes his GCSE electronic products prototype
[20:06] <DanielRichman> Playing notes with CTC PWM
[20:06] <DanielRichman> hell yes
[20:06] <DanielRichman> square wave <3
[20:06] <rjharrison_> hehe cool DanielRichman
[20:06] <rjharrison_> Is that for servo control?
[20:06] <rjharrison_> using timer1
[20:06] <DanielRichman> nah OC1a is connected to a piezo
[20:07] <DanielRichman> arpeggios go go go!
[20:07] <DanielRichman> C-E-G-C-G-E-C
[20:08] <DanielRichman> the notes sometimes sound a bit dodgey. Either the piezo is garbagey (entirely possible) or the square wave is dodgey (I don't think so). It's definitly the right note, but I might go cathode-ray-oscilloscope on it tomorrow to check
[20:09] <SpeedEvil> Pezios have a _very_ resonant output
[20:09] <SpeedEvil> their waveform will often be _really_ wierd at some freqs
[20:10] <natrium42> square wave
[20:10] <natrium42> produces all kinds of weird harmonics
[20:11] <DanielRichman> ah cool, that's probably the answer
[20:11] <DanielRichman> (no excuse to use the CRO now.)
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[21:53] <rjharrison_> Hey custom PCD dudes is it common to have loads of resistors around the uC ?
[21:53] <rjharrison_> It seems to work out quite well in my board
[21:53] <rjharrison_> PCD
[21:53] <rjharrison_> PCB
[21:54] <rjharrison_> I can't type any more must be the lead fumes
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[22:32] <Laurenceb> http://store.diydrones.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=KT-ArduIMU-01
[22:32] <Laurenceb> muhahaha
[22:32] <Laurenceb> perfect
[22:32] <Laurenceb> cheap as well
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[22:33] <Laurenceb> just needs their ublox5 and pitot sensor kit and your ready for action
[22:33] <DanielRichman> holy cow that's neat
[22:33] <DanielRichman> looks kinda groovy too
[22:33] <DanielRichman> I can't help but think that it would be better all in one chip
[22:34] <Laurenceb> I want to port their dspic code to it
[22:34] <Laurenceb> they built the same kit with a dspic but it should easily run on an avr
[22:34] <Laurenceb> I also want to try some more groovy wind estimation code
[22:35] <Laurenceb> but I think they really took the right approach with their code
[22:35] <Laurenceb> its a complete fudge from the point of view of statistical accuracy, but handles effects like centripetal accel and gyro drift extremely well
[22:35] <Laurenceb> and is extremely computationally efficient
[22:36] <DanielRichman> so this for a rocket?
[22:36] <DanielRichman> glider?
[22:36] <Laurenceb> UAV
[22:36] <Laurenceb> yeah
[22:36] <DanielRichman> cool
[22:38] <Laurenceb> the only thing they havent tackled properly is wind estimation
[22:38] <Laurenceb> they rely on the gyro bias estimation to sort of keep it under control
[22:39] <Laurenceb> but its a fudge - good enough for wind speed <~ 50% of the cruise airspeed IMO
[22:39] <Laurenceb> I'd like to try and improve that
[22:40] <Laurenceb> other wise their code is pretty much all you could ask for
[22:41] <Laurenceb> http://code.google.com/p/gentlenav/
[22:44] <Laurenceb> if you tried to full extrended kalman filter approach and wanted to track bias and wind ect so well even an ARM7 would struggle to get 50Hz or so update rate I think
[22:44] <Laurenceb> matrix bashing eats your processor
[22:45] <DanielRichman> dual core?
[22:45] <DanielRichman> :)
[22:45] <DanielRichman> how about you get 50 atmegas
[22:46] <DanielRichman> well... not 50 atmegas
[22:46] <DanielRichman> but yeah.
[22:46] <DanielRichman> guess that just bumps up the cost
[22:46] <Laurenceb> you could just erm use an ARM
[22:46] <Laurenceb> :P
[22:47] <DanielRichman> yeah but you said an ARM wasn't enough
[22:47] <DanielRichman> so use moar arm
[22:47] <Laurenceb> but I'm betting youd see only a small increase in performance with a fully statistically correct filter
[22:47] <Laurenceb> well ARM with FPU would laugh at it
[22:47] <Laurenceb> but its nice to be able to use something nice and simple
[22:48] <Laurenceb> anyway bbl
[22:48] <DanielRichman> bye
[22:48] <DanielRichman> simplicity is goood
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[23:37] <rjharrison_> any one know anythin about ground planes
[23:37] <rjharrison_> Actually I think I'm ok
[23:37] <rjharrison_> :)
[23:50] <natrium42> <rjharrison_> I can't type any more must be the lead fumes <-- you should switch to lead-free
[23:51] Action: natrium42 did the swtich a few years back
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[23:58] <rjharrison_> natrium42 I think most of it is lead free
[23:58] <rjharrison_> Though I do have some paste with lead in for the low MP
[23:59] <rjharrison_> Rev 1 = Revison 1 is that after you have made a change or is the first board rev 1. I'm going with the former
[00:00] --- Wed Sep 23 2009