highaltitude.log.20090115

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[01:18] <Laurenceb> hello
[01:41] <Laurenceb> http://www3.sympatico.ca/colin.kydd.campbell/
[02:09] <fnoble_> does anyone have the coords for EARS?
[02:20] <Laurenceb> IIRC its on the website
[02:20] <fnoble_> Laurenceb: check the predictor now
[02:20] <Laurenceb> where is it?
[02:20] <fnoble_> http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~cuspaceflight/pred/
[02:21] <Laurenceb> wow sweet
[02:21] <Laurenceb> so it uses GFS data then the drag factor and ascent rate to weight each layer of atmosphere?
[02:22] <fnoble_> the ascent rate is for the way up - it just uses const ascent on the way up
[02:22] <Laurenceb> yeah
[02:22] <fnoble_> then the descent speed uses the drag factor together with a simple atmosphere model
[02:23] <Laurenceb> sounds pretty sensible
[02:23] <Laurenceb> you use the model off the wiki?
[02:23] <Laurenceb> http://wiki.ukhas.org.uk/code:sqrt_density_lookup_table_calculator_for_fast_drag_coefficient_calculations
[02:24] <fnoble_> Laurenceb: not sure, rob did thsat part
[02:24] <fnoble_> i think it was a nasa model
[02:24] <Laurenceb> cool
[02:24] <Laurenceb> anyone worked with pll/vco stuff?
[02:25] <Laurenceb> I'm thinking the VCO seems to be the main thing putting limits on frequency range, so is it a mad idea to multiplex more than one VCO onto a sinlge PLL ?
[02:26] <fnoble_> no idea
[02:26] <fnoble_> all that stuff is black magic to me
[02:26] <Laurenceb> nvm then :P
[02:26] <Laurenceb> I've got the current consumption for my scanner design down to 250ma
[02:26] <fnoble_> your designing a scanner?
[02:26] <Laurenceb> which is verging on acceptable
[02:26] <fnoble_> awesome
[02:27] <Laurenceb> yeah, in a usb stick (hopefully)
[02:27] <Laurenceb> its really a matter of searching through loads of different sites comparing the specs... really tedious
[02:28] <natrium42> fnoble_: great work with the predictor
[02:29] <natrium42> now we can scrap the wyoming one :D
[02:29] <Laurenceb> fnoble_: are you using the google maps api?
[02:29] <fnoble_> yeah, in a very crude way
[02:29] <fnoble_> natrium42: thanks
[02:30] <fnoble_> natrium42: there is still an issue with getting it to download the GRIB data by itself
[02:30] <Laurenceb> where do you get the GRIB data?
[02:31] <fnoble_> nasa nomads
[02:31] <Laurenceb> ?
[02:31] <fnoble_> sorry, noaa nomads
[02:31] <Laurenceb> a server?
[02:31] <natrium42> fnoble_: it's too large?
[02:31] <fnoble_> http://nomads.ncdc.noaa.gov/
[02:32] <fnoble_> natrium42: no, its hard to determine which chunk to download
[02:32] <Laurenceb> nice
[02:32] <Laurenceb> what are you using?
[02:32] <Laurenceb> I dont know what to look at :P
[02:32] <natrium42> fnoble_: can't you download all of it?
[02:32] <fnoble_> you cant tell weather a chunk of grib is todays or yesterdays until you download it and process it
[02:33] <natrium42> aah, you mean temporal chunk
[02:33] <fnoble_> yeah
[02:33] <natrium42> isn't it encoded in the folder name?
[02:34] <fnoble_> no, they just overwrite the previous one with the current one
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[02:34] <fnoble_> so if you download say the midnight data, if it hasnt been updated yet you get yesterdays data
[02:34] <fnoble_> and the update schedule isnt that predictable
[02:36] <natrium42> are you using GFS ANL?
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[02:36] <Laurenceb> it killed my machine
[02:36] <natrium42> it bastard!
[02:36] <Laurenceb> how do you interpret the GRIB files?
[02:37] <fnoble_> rob wrote some code to unpack them to a csv of wind velocities
[02:37] <Laurenceb> nice
[02:37] <fnoble_> the grib format is not nice to use
[02:38] <Laurenceb> its not ascii atm
[02:38] <fnoble_> directly that is
[02:38] <fnoble_> its binary with all kinds of variable size fields
[02:38] <Laurenceb> can we put robs code on the wiki?
[02:38] <fnoble_> Laurenceb: its going into our svn soon as its tidied up a bit
[02:38] <Laurenceb> neat ok
[02:38] <fnoble_> svn is publicly accessable
[02:39] <Laurenceb> is there anything on your svn atm?
[02:39] <fnoble_> the code and pcb design for the badger
[02:39] <fnoble_> thats about it
[02:39] <Laurenceb> cool
[02:39] <Laurenceb> the code was a bit messy tho :P
[02:41] <Laurenceb> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GRIB
[02:41] <Laurenceb> ^ theres a list of applications
[02:41] <fnoble_> yeah, i think it would have been easier to use a library to access the grib
[02:41] <fnoble_> as there are many in existance
[02:42] <fnoble_> dont know why rob didnt
[02:43] <Laurenceb> http://www.ecmwf.int/publications/manuals/grib_api/index.html
[02:43] <Laurenceb> ^ looks like a good starting point
[02:50] <Laurenceb> eww fortran
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[08:44] <rharrison> Successfull soak test on icarus last night :)
[08:45] <rharrison> morning all
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[09:06] <edmoore> rharrison, morning
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[16:20] <SpeedEvil> Todays pointless fact.
[16:20] <SpeedEvil> Per area, pork crackling is cheaper than carpet.
[16:20] <gordonjcp> heh
[16:23] Action: SpeedEvil is cooking. Pork roast, with crackling, potatos.
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[17:00] <Laurenceb> SpeedEvil: you can get til;es cheaper than carpet
[17:02] <Laurenceb> carpet and lino are a expensive and you have to rweplace the whole lot if theres heavy damage
[17:02] Action: SpeedEvil was not seriously suggesting crackling as a flooring.
[17:02] <SpeedEvil> I suspect it might start to whiff somewhat after a week.
[17:03] <SpeedEvil> yeah - I've got some stick-on vinyl tiles I'm going to be replacing my bathroom floor with.
[17:04] <Laurenceb> problem with those if leaks can go between them
[17:04] <SpeedEvil> rip up floorboards, put down WBP, with lots of insulation underneath, add vinyl.
[17:04] <Laurenceb> ah ok
[17:04] <SpeedEvil> probably add some coloured silicone as a grout between them.
[17:04] <Laurenceb> hmm ok
[17:05] <SpeedEvil> and probably varnish the wbp too.
[17:05] <Laurenceb> yeah I'm worried about grout absorbing dirt
[17:05] <Laurenceb> hmm
[17:05] <Laurenceb> maybe you could varnish grout
[17:06] <Laurenceb> http://www.flickr.com/photos/34315036@N04/3193003900/ <-- thats our kitchen atm
[17:06] <Laurenceb> its got a bitumen on concrete finish
[17:07] <SpeedEvil> bitchin.
[17:07] <Laurenceb> so it doesnt matter too much if stuff soaks through... unless its oil
[17:08] <SpeedEvil> yeah - I want to put underfloor in the bathroom + tiles, but can't at the moment.
[17:09] <Laurenceb> I'm worried the adhesive wont stick to the bitumen
[17:09] <Laurenceb> I spoke to a guy who does tiling and he reacons it will stick.. but I dont see it working as the finish is so smooth
[17:10] <SpeedEvil> consult the product datasheets.
[17:10] <SpeedEvil> Or just scatter some sand, hit it with a blowtorch, and call it done.
[17:10] <Laurenceb> lol one plan
[17:11] <SpeedEvil> how much have you to do in the house?
[17:11] <Laurenceb> the kitchen and dining area - just that room on the photo
[17:12] <Laurenceb> may do the hall with quarry tiles
[17:13] <Laurenceb> upstairs is just going to be carpet
[17:13] <Laurenceb> same in the living room
[17:15] <Laurenceb> we ripped out all the downstairs floor and most of the upstairs - downstairs has been redone with concrete and upstairs we ripped out the old concrete floor and used floorboards
[17:17] <gordonjcp> 17:02 * SpeedEvil was not seriously suggesting crackling as a flooring.
[17:17] <gordonjcp> 17:02 < SpeedEvil> I suspect it might start to whiff somewhat after a week.
[17:17] <gordonjcp> SpeedEvil: it won't last that long if you have a couple of cats and a labrador
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[17:17] Action: SpeedEvil only has outside cats.
[17:17] <SpeedEvil> cat.
[17:18] <gordonjcp> how long do you think they'll stay outside if you cover the floor with pork crackling?
[17:18] <SpeedEvil> :)
[17:18] <SpeedEvil> I figure I have it confused enough.
[17:18] <SpeedEvil> It's eating lidl dogfood ATM.
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[17:54] <Laurenceb> I like the predictor
[17:54] <Laurenceb> funky icons now :P
[17:54] <fergusnoble> edmoore: about?
[17:54] <fergusnoble> Laurenceb: yeah just added them
[17:54] <fergusnoble> Laurenceb: try clicking them
[17:55] <Laurenceb> ah blaunch,burst,landing
[17:55] <fergusnoble> the balloon burst icon isnt the most self explainatory
[17:55] <fergusnoble> but meh
[17:56] <Laurenceb> hmm
[17:56] <Laurenceb> I'f I was really lazy I could write a script to extract wind from the kml file
[17:56] <fergusnoble> should be fast again now so long as you are launching around cambridge
[17:57] <fergusnoble> Laurenceb: you can have the source code if you want
[17:57] <Laurenceb> for the GRIB reader?
[17:57] <fergusnoble> yeah
[17:57] <Laurenceb> yes pls :P
[17:57] <fergusnoble> well, we convert the gribs to a nice csv
[17:57] <Laurenceb> yeah
[17:58] <fergusnoble> oh actually the code for the grib stuff is on the eee with the broken screen stupidly
[17:58] <Laurenceb> l<dot>blaxter<at>surrey<dot>ac<dot>uk
[17:58] <Laurenceb> you broke the screen :-?
[17:58] <fergusnoble> have to go to the dept to use a screen
[17:58] <fergusnoble> yeah, it sucks
[17:58] <fergusnoble> Laurenceb: have an older version though
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[17:58] <fergusnoble> ill commit it to the svn
[17:59] <Laurenceb> ok
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[18:00] <Laurenceb> where the svn?
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[18:01] <fergusnoble> jcoxon: http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~cuspaceflight/pred/
[18:01] <jcoxon> fergusnoble, amazing - i had a play this morning
[18:01] <jcoxon> excellent work
[18:02] <jcoxon> really speedy now as well
[18:02] <fergusnoble> yeah, i made it speedy but in the process broke it for anyone outside of the uk
[18:02] <fergusnoble> :(
[18:03] <fergusnoble> also only predicts up to 6 hours ahead atm too
[18:03] <jcoxon> hmmm perhaps a checkbox for uk speedy or worldwide a bit slower
[18:04] <fergusnoble> yeah
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[18:04] <jcoxon> wow lots of G8KHW
[18:05] <fergusnoble> jcoxon: have thought of a way to make it transparantly grab the data it needs only if it doesnt already have it
[18:05] <fergusnoble> i think
[18:05] <fergusnoble> thats what was making it slow before, it redownloaded the GRIB data every time
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[18:07] <jcoxon> fergusnoble (and rob) , thanks for making it, will be really helpful for predictions
[18:07] <jcoxon> silly wyoming and its set ascent and drag rates
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[18:10] <jcoxon> wohoo i've finished for the weekend :-p
[18:10] <jcoxon> been a really tough week
[18:10] <fergusnoble> jcoxon: will update the interface so you have the option of just typing in a parasheet diameter
[18:10] Action: SpeedEvil ponders parakeet diameter.
[18:11] <jcoxon> fergusnoble, yeah, drag is not the easiest to work out
[18:11] <Laurenceb> yeah, hence why ultrahab ended up in the sea
[18:11] <jcoxon> fergusnoble, next you have to make an open hysplit model
[18:11] <jcoxon> that might be a little harder
[18:11] <fergusnoble> any other launch sites people want added?
[18:12] <SpeedEvil> Glenrothes.
[18:12] <SpeedEvil> But /me suspects it may be some time before he launches anything.
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[18:12] <fergusnoble> SpeedEvil: thats no problem, just let me know the gps coords
[18:12] <jcoxon> right, after a bit of halo jcoxon is going to make a 2m antenna for his radio
[18:12] <jcoxon> got some coax
[18:12] <SpeedEvil> 56.13, 3.06W
[18:13] <Laurenceb> jcoxon: didnt know you were religious
[18:15] <jcoxon> religous?
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[18:15] <Laurenceb> halo
[18:15] <jcoxon> halo? the game that recently lead to a 17yr being charged for murder for killing his parents for banning him playing it?
[18:16] <jcoxon> nah that ain't religious :-p
[18:17] <akawaka> 3?
[18:18] <jcoxon> yup
[18:18] <akawaka> i gotta take a look at that
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[18:18] <akawaka> i wasn't a big fan of 2
[18:19] <jcoxon> oh multiplayer 3 is great
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[18:20] <jcoxon> only play is socially - no ranked matches - trying to do cool stuff like run as many people over etc
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[18:24] <Laurenceb> jcoxon: your a doctor your supposed to save them
[18:25] <jcoxon> true
[18:25] <jcoxon> did a lot of doctoring today
[18:25] <jcoxon> exhausted
[18:26] <fergusnoble> SpeedEvil: try running it now, has Glenrothes
[18:26] <SpeedEvil> :)
[18:27] <fergusnoble> unfortunately it was outside the area that was covered by the data we were downloading, so it will break at the next update (quater past the hour)
[18:27] <fergusnoble> but i will fix it soon
[18:28] <SpeedEvil> nEAT!
[18:28] <SpeedEvil> Many thaks.
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[18:33] <jcoxon> damn i wish i had a swr meter
[18:34] <jcoxon> oh maybe 817 has one
[18:34] <jcoxon> woho it does
[18:38] <jcoxon> gordonjcp, ping
[18:38] <natrium42> hi
[18:38] <jcoxon> hey natrium42
[18:38] <natrium42> how are you?
[18:38] <jcoxon> good thanks
[18:39] <jcoxon> had a heavy week but have finished for now
[18:39] <natrium42> good, good
[18:39] <jcoxon> you?
[18:40] <natrium42> the usual, business & learning
[18:40] <natrium42> started to work on some iphone apps
[18:40] <gordonjcp> jcoxon: pong
[18:40] <jcoxon> hey gordonjcp what HF bands do you work
[18:41] <gordonjcp> 40 and 20m
[18:41] <gordonjcp> I'm qrv on 40 just now actually
[18:42] <jcoxon> hmmm i've got 8m of rg58 coax and a bnc connector...
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[18:43] <Laurenceb> jcoxon: tethered balloon antenna
[18:43] <jcoxon> hehe
[18:43] <jcoxon> gordonjcp, what is the most popular band?
[18:43] <natrium42> that's actually a great idea
[18:44] <jcoxon> Laurenceb, the fabled skyhook
[18:44] <natrium42> could use that for transatlantic mission
[18:44] <Laurenceb> flown outside of model area error during ascent
[18:44] <gordonjcp> jcoxon: depends
[18:44] <Laurenceb> fnoble ^
[18:44] <SpeedEvil> natrium42: not really that brilliant - it only greatly increases range if you've got local obstructions
[18:44] <SpeedEvil> you need to get up to the same height as your target to double range
[18:45] <Laurenceb> we need balloon to balloon networking
[18:45] <jcoxon> gordonjcp, :-)
[18:45] <natrium42> SpeedEvil: well, it's hard to build long HF antennas
[18:45] <jcoxon> gordonjcp, i might go for just a 2m and upgrade in the future
[18:45] <jcoxon> still pretty new at all this
[18:45] <gordonjcp> jcoxon: well
[18:46] <gordonjcp> you're an M3 licence too, IIRC?
[18:46] <SpeedEvil> natrium42: that is true
[18:46] <jcoxon> M6 yeah
[18:46] <jcoxon> M6JCX
[18:47] <gordonjcp> so 10W
[18:47] <gordonjcp> it's enough to get going on psk31, that much is clear
[18:47] <jcoxon> i've got a ft-817 so 5w
[18:48] <SpeedEvil> natrium42: 100m dipoles aren't really trivial otherwise :)
[18:48] <natrium42> hehe
[18:52] <Laurenceb> I was considering a TDMA acess system for balloon to balloon
[18:52] <akawaka> Laurenceb, over what distance?
[18:53] <Laurenceb> hundereds of Km
[18:53] <SpeedEvil> Optical networking.
[18:55] <Laurenceb> if you could share a band for tx/rx on all balloons, its easier to make the hardware, but the software is tricky (relativelky)
[18:55] <fergusnoble> Laurenceb: sorry, thats because i moved th grib window over for speedevil
[18:55] <fergusnoble> Laurenceb: will move it ack now
[18:55] <Laurenceb> SpeedEvil: well if you just want downlink thats possible
[18:55] <jcoxon> gordonjcp, i'm going to go for 10m
[18:55] <jcoxon> got enough coax for that
[18:56] <Laurenceb> with a scope, filter, and PIN diode on the ground you can get Mbps
[18:56] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: gimbals and pointing, and balloon-balloon.
[18:56] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: yeah.
[18:56] <Laurenceb> then a laser and lense to diverge the beam on the balloon
[18:56] <gordonjcp> jcoxon: the coax doesn't make much differnece
[18:56] <gordonjcp> *difference
[18:56] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: I've got a fliter and laser diode I mean to make into a laser ranger.
[18:56] <gordonjcp> jcoxon: more importantly how much space have you got?
[18:56] <jcoxon> http://www.hamuniverse.com/10metercoaxdipole.html
[18:56] <Laurenceb> SpeedEvil: HDTV
[18:57] <SpeedEvil> The numbers aren't that bad actually.
[18:57] <jcoxon> gordonjcp, well i was thinking of running it along the gutter outside my flat
[18:57] <Laurenceb> you need a large filter for the front of the sciope
[18:57] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: well...
[18:57] <Laurenceb> and some sort of linux board to run the HDTV codec
[18:57] <Laurenceb> on the balloon
[18:58] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: you can somewhat finesse the thing as you can have a divergance of a few degrees without having filter problems.
[18:58] <gordonjcp> jcoxon: that won't work very well
[18:58] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: so you can put the filter after some optics rather than needing a full diameter filter.
[18:58] <jcoxon> hmmmm
[18:58] <Laurenceb> yeah, maybe a reflector scope with the filter on the secondary mirror or something
[18:58] <gordonjcp> jcoxon: the wire will essentially be one half of a capacitor to ground
[18:59] <Laurenceb> uswe one of those motorised ones
[18:59] <Laurenceb> with a webcam sight
[18:59] <jcoxon> gordonjcp, even a plastic gutter?
[18:59] <fergusnoble> Laurenceb: fixed now i hope
[18:59] <Laurenceb> or maybe 4 diodes
[18:59] <Laurenceb> and a tracking loop
[19:00] <gordonjcp> jcoxon: what's the distance to the wall? what's 1/4 wavelength at the frequency in use?
[19:00] <Laurenceb> SpeedEvil: balloon to balloon is mucgh harder
[19:00] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: use the laser diode on the payload to illume the bottom of the balloon.
[19:00] <Laurenceb> you need to aim
[19:00] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: yeah
[19:01] <Laurenceb> maybe you could have an omnidirectional detector and aimed laser
[19:01] <jcoxon> gordonjcp, oh good point - yeah its going to be pretty close to the wall
[19:01] <Laurenceb> with mems IMU and voice coil actuated mirror
[19:01] Action: SpeedEvil wishes there was some neat cheap way to modulate a reteroreflector.
[19:01] <Laurenceb> liquid crystals?
[19:01] <SpeedEvil> other than mechanical ones. (shutters)
[19:01] <SpeedEvil> ^fast
[19:01] <Laurenceb> yeah
[19:02] <SpeedEvil> point a laser at something, send data directly, and get data back from the modulated reteroreflector.
[19:02] <SpeedEvil> no pointing on the remote object.
[19:05] <fergusnoble> http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~cuspaceflight/websvn/
[19:06] <fergusnoble> there we go, now everyone can access the SVN repo
[19:06] <jcoxon> fergusnoble, you are on fire with development
[19:06] <fergusnoble> hehe
[19:06] <Laurenceb> subversion?
[19:06] Action: Laurenceb subverts
[19:08] <Laurenceb> whats the radio modem for?
[19:08] <Laurenceb> hmm we need this on the ukhas site
[19:09] <fergusnoble> Laurenceb: an old project
[19:10] <fergusnoble> Laurenceb: when the badger was going to have a radio on a separate board with its own avr
[19:12] <Laurenceb> I see - sounds like my radio board
[19:15] <fergusnoble> yes, would have been a lot like it i think
[19:18] <Laurenceb> your welcome to the gerbers/brd files if you ever want to make some
[19:18] <fergusnoble> oh thanks
[19:19] <Laurenceb> I have one on the mini rogallo atm
[19:19] <fergusnoble> might be handy when we outgrow our crude use of the onboard dac
[19:19] <fergusnoble> pulse shaping with the onboard dac will eat up a lot of cup that could be better used elsewhere i think
[19:20] <fergusnoble> *cpu
[19:21] <Laurenceb> yeah - its a struggle for the AVR at 12Mhz
[19:21] <Laurenceb> its doing 8 bit resolution
[19:21] <Laurenceb> I may do a v3 board with a QFN attiny and smaller crystal
[19:22] <Laurenceb> that would fit completely inside the existing radiometrix casing
[19:23] <fergusnoble> that would be cool
[19:24] <fergusnoble> ok, g2g, bbl
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[20:34] <Laurenceb> greetings
[20:39] <Laurenceb> fergusnobel: you need a cache of csv files
[20:39] <Laurenceb> so each time a user submits a request, the correct file is identified, then the cache logfile searched
[20:40] <Laurenceb> if a cached file is found, its timestamp is cheched to see if a more recent model will exist
[20:41] <Laurenceb> if it does exist or the file isnt found, a new GRIB is downloaded and passed through the GRIB to CSV converter, with the user beign informed there will be a delay
[20:41] <Laurenceb> also old cached files that are no longer useful are deleted
[20:42] <Laurenceb> as there arent going to be a huge number of files, it could be a simple loop to search the cache logfile
[20:44] <Laurenceb> the logfile might take the for of lines of CSV e.g lat, long, time, model runtime for each cached CSVed GRIB file
[20:44] <Laurenceb> form*
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[21:01] <rjharrison> fergusnoble I gather you have been busy sir
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[21:54] <rjharrison> anyine any thoughts on launching
[21:55] <rjharrison> I'm provisionally going for the 1st feb or 7th/8th
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[22:50] <rjharrison> I asume you have all seen the news about the plane comming down in NYC all safe
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[23:04] <jcoxon> evening all
[23:10] <edmoore> fergusnoble: am around now
[23:10] <edmoore> Laurenceb: i have the latest grib-to-scv software if it itsn't already on the svn
[23:11] <edmoore> csv*
[23:11] <edmoore> fergusnoble: re: sep radio board - we should chat about that tomorrow
[23:12] <edmoore> henry came out with the desire for a sep board randomly the other day too
[23:12] <edmoore> also we can prob kill two birds with it... anyway will chat about it tomorrow no doubt
[23:12] <edmoore> Laurenceb: oh the converter code is up there
[23:13] <edmoore> just updated my local copy
[23:14] <jcoxon> evening edmoore
[23:15] <edmoore> hi jcoxon
[23:15] <jcoxon> did you enjoy your BLAST viewing?
[23:17] <rjharrison> hi all
[23:17] <rjharrison> what is a seb board?
[23:17] <rjharrison> sep even
[23:18] <jcoxon> seperate
[23:18] <rjharrison> hehe
[23:18] <Laurenceb> edmoore thanks
[23:18] <rjharrison> being dumb here
[23:18] <edmoore> Laurenceb: no probs
[23:18] <edmoore> jcoxon: yes it was great thanks
[23:18] <edmoore> a good evening
[23:18] Action: jcoxon is going to buy some more coat hangers tomorrow to remake his coxon moxon antenna
[23:18] <rjharrison> Is the radio causing interfeerence
[23:19] <Laurenceb> edmoore: I can email you my board design if you want
[23:19] <edmoore> jcoxon: i am honestly suspicious of their elevation radioation profile
[23:19] <edmoore> mext flight we should definitely do analysis on when/if the quality of the data lapses
[23:20] <edmoore> Laurenceb: it's ok, it's just a DAC into a radiometrix afterall
[23:20] <edmoore> it's more a question of offloading cpu time to run modulation
[23:20] <jcoxon> edmoore, oh its not for ballooning necessarily
[23:20] <Laurenceb> or PWM based dac
[23:20] <jcoxon> its a pretty good small antenna
[23:20] <edmoore> Laurenceb: indeed - if you don't happen to have a built in 10-bit DAC :)
[23:21] <Laurenceb> what uC has that?
[23:21] <edmoore> LPC2148 (along with very many other arm7 parts)
[23:21] <edmoore> which is what we use on badger
[23:21] <Laurenceb> so you have 2 arms ?
[23:22] <edmoore> I do yes
[23:22] <rjharrison> and 2 legs
[23:22] <edmoore> and 2 legs
[23:22] <edmoore> hush
[23:22] <edmoore> right now the one ARM runs the radio
[23:22] <edmoore> and everything else
[23:22] <edmoore> i.e. all on one board
[23:22] <edmoore> but there's always be talk of the relative merits of a seperate board/ all in one solution
[23:23] <rjharrison> so physically it could stay on one board but just 2 processors
[23:23] <edmoore> probably wouldn't want to do that
[23:23] <rjharrison> ?
[23:23] <edmoore> one of the merits of a seperate radio board is thermal and electrical/RF isolation
[23:24] <edmoore> for example on the current badger we have the radio in a heat-shrunk sausage of insulation
[23:24] <rjharrison> Oh
[23:24] <edmoore> it's more on an inline unit between board and antenna
[23:24] <rjharrison> I just cool the tx down befor launch I got very little drift on the last launch
[23:24] <rjharrison> jcoxon would have a better idea
[23:25] <edmoore> we insulate and achieve a similar result
[23:25] <rjharrison> as he was working reomtely
[23:25] <jcoxon> ?
[23:25] <jcoxon> i'm confused
[23:25] <Laurenceb> http://photoblog.petrenko.cc/photos/arts/moscow_life_800.jpg
[23:25] <edmoore> on drift, i think
[23:25] <rjharrison> radio stability of freq on icarus
[23:25] <edmoore> I only had to retune a little from west sussex
[23:26] <edmoore> it did move about though
[23:26] <rjharrison> ok
[23:26] <rjharrison> I can't really remember tuing till after burst but I was playing antenna then
[23:26] <edmoore> but only by maye 200Hz
[23:26] <edmoore> I had it on narow band so i was more sensitive to it
[23:26] <rjharrison> edmoore I forgor you were listening so you probably know better than any of us
[23:27] <rjharrison> I'm so ready for a launch
[23:27] <rjharrison> all bugs ironed out now
[23:27] <edmoore> jcoxon: did fergusnoble mention that we had a QSO in DOminoEX?
[23:29] <jcoxon> edmoore, oh cool
[23:29] <jcoxon> bbl
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[23:29] <rjharrison> edmoore does the sausage of insulation work or does it just slow the drift down
[23:30] <rjharrison> he's bloody quick on the exiting
[23:30] <edmoore> rjharrison: it works by insulation...
[23:30] <edmoore> slows thermal transfer
[23:31] <rjharrison> Does the tx actually generate any heat?
[23:31] <edmoore> sure, all components do
[23:31] <rjharrison> ok then
[23:31] <rjharrison> I'm surprised that it's enought to maintain a steady freq
[23:32] <edmoore> you'd have to actively control it to keep it bang on
[23:32] <rjharrison> In tests the tx is very suseptable to delta T
[23:32] <edmoore> where it comes into its own is during high rate of temp change things like descent
[23:32] <edmoore> where you'd rather concentrate on other things
[23:33] <rjharrison> I guess I have nothing else to think about other than to keep the signal tuned
[23:33] <rjharrison> I haven't noticed it fly off
[23:34] <rjharrison> having the data cable in the back for audio helps too as you can listen to hear any changes
[23:34] <edmoore> oh we have fairly mental chase banter
[23:34] <rjharrison> without affecting the rtty
[23:34] <edmoore> trying to second guess where it's going to come down and how quickly to get there
[23:34] <rjharrison> cool
[23:34] <rjharrison> Like I can see the ####er up there above the car
[23:35] <edmoore> there are modes for which drift doesn't really matter
[23:35] <rjharrison> I can see that would be cool
[23:35] <rjharrison> I'll be having a bit of that myself with the next launch
[23:35] <edmoore> perhaps they'd be better. Cat skinning comes to mind
[23:35] <rjharrison> Now the tracking is working properly
[23:37] <rjharrison> Laurenceb are you part of the cusf stuff or are you doing a solo mission
[23:37] <rjharrison> Trying to work out who is actively launching in '09 UK
[23:38] <edmoore> he wishes :p
[23:38] <Laurenceb> oi
[23:38] <edmoore> Laurenceb has launched a lot of stuff
[23:38] <Laurenceb> yeah, some time ago :P
[23:38] <rjharrison> HAB or other?
[23:38] <Laurenceb> then HAB
[23:39] <Laurenceb> erm HAB
[23:39] <SpeedEvil> Nena - the comeback tour.
[23:39] <rjharrison> U going to be up in the sky '09
[23:39] <Laurenceb> but I got dragged into renovation work
[23:39] <rjharrison> i'm taking some time out did a house for the last 5 years sold in october
[23:40] <Laurenceb> neat
[23:40] <edmoore> rjharrison: a time out from habbing?
[23:40] <Laurenceb> rjharrison: have you seen my gallery?
[23:41] <rjharrison> opps that cam out wrong. Time out from DIY to do HABBING
[23:41] <edmoore> Laurenceb: that's a very forward question
[23:41] <rjharrison> nar where is it
[23:41] <rjharrison> not the rude pics
[23:41] <Laurenceb> lulz
[23:41] <rjharrison> the hab ones
[23:42] <Laurenceb> nah building workz http://www.flickr.com/photos/34315036@N04/sets/72157612453844929/
[23:42] <rjharrison> actually didn't you make a small HAB tracker
[23:42] <rjharrison> nice oake frme
[23:42] <rjharrison> oak frame even
[23:43] <Laurenceb> yeah it about 350 years old
[23:44] <Laurenceb> alot of its been replaced with reclaimed pitch pine
[23:45] <rjharrison> we are going to build our own house
[23:45] <rjharrison> just waiting on some investments to come in
[23:46] <Laurenceb> thats my dream project
[23:46] <rjharrison> we have about 800k inc. big mortgage to play with
[23:46] <Laurenceb> god thats some house
[23:46] <rjharrison> There is a company called borderoak
[23:46] <Laurenceb> right
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[23:47] <rjharrison> and they seem to do nice oak frames. I got my 16th edition and elec. and plumbing qualifications the year b4 last
[23:48] <rjharrison> so hopefully will be able to do a bit on the property and make sure it's all done right
[23:48] <rjharrison> Will wait out the drop in house prices first
[23:48] <Laurenceb> ah nicely done
[23:48] <rjharrison> perhaps buy one for a bit at the end and ride the recovery and then build
[23:49] <rjharrison> time plan 5 years
[23:49] Action: SpeedEvil wishes houses weren
[23:49] <SpeedEvil> 't an investment
[23:49] <Laurenceb> yeah I did some of the work but as I dont have the right qualifications, we had to get "the proffesionals"
[23:49] <SpeedEvil> screws those not on the ladder utterly,
[23:49] <rjharrison> Yep
[23:50] <rjharrison> It does, I'm concerned for my kids
[23:50] <rjharrison> I found it hard enough to start and it's alot harder now
[23:50] <Laurenceb> who decided to drill huge 30mm holes through all my lovely cleaned off reclaimed floor joist
[23:50] <SpeedEvil> that, and because a large fraction of households are two income, in many places one partner simply can't do childcare.
[23:51] <rjharrison> We we're very lucky about 7 years ago we brough a hugh farm house and I did it up over 5 years and sold it last october
[23:51] <SpeedEvil> As they have to work to afford the house.
[23:51] <rjharrison> We have to workers. Wife was head of global emarketing for astra zenneca
[23:51] <SpeedEvil> but absent a truly massive house building program, ...
[23:51] <rjharrison> two
[23:52] <edmoore> bbl
[23:52] <rjharrison> and I'm the IT director for a national law firm
[23:52] <SpeedEvil> Sure, we have to have workers. And sure it's good for the economy.
[23:52] <rjharrison> so I guess we're lucky
[23:52] <rjharrison> but it v hard on the kids
[23:52] <SpeedEvil> Yeah.
[23:53] <rjharrison> and family time is eroded
[23:53] <rjharrison> It's tricky you only have one shot at this and there are a lot of pressures on us all these days comp. to 50 years ago
[23:54] <Laurenceb> he says... talking on IRC for hours
[23:54] <rjharrison> hehe
[23:54] Action: Laurenceb runs
[23:54] <rjharrison> Well you have to have a brak
[23:54] <rjharrison> break
[23:54] <rjharrison> kids all down
[23:54] <rjharrison> wife asleep
[23:54] <rjharrison> this is my free time 9 - 1am:)
[23:55] <rjharrison> and a bit of work time chatting
[23:55] <rjharrison> In fact HAB has not been good for work or family
[23:55] <rjharrison> but the results are nice
[23:56] <Laurenceb> as a phd student I do virtually no work whatsoever
[23:56] <rjharrison> lol
[23:56] <rjharrison> Wait till the write up and the viva
[23:56] <Laurenceb> just sit about trying to not look bored in meetings/pretending to read papers
[23:57] <Laurenceb> well I still might quit
[23:57] <rjharrison> I was going to do a phd after my degree in Leeds. But in IT you actully loose dosh by not been in the market for 3 years
[23:57] <Laurenceb> unfortunately that means no longer being totally lazy
[23:57] <rjharrison> So i decided to go to work + I needed to earn some moneny
[23:58] <rjharrison> PHD in IT does not seem to count for much
[23:58] <Laurenceb> my neighbour did something kind of IT related
[23:58] <Laurenceb> it was more EE/Comp Sci
[23:59] <Laurenceb> devices for blind people to interact with PCs
[23:59] <rjharrison> I just did the easy Comp Sci got a IIi for my efforts in Leeds Uni
[23:59] <Laurenceb> Leeds is quite good
[23:59] <rjharrison> Though the really easy one was Information Systems
[23:59] <rjharrison> Yep still here havn't left yet
[23:59] <fergusnoble> edmoore: still here? back in now
[00:00] --- Fri Jan 16 2009