highaltitude.log.20081005

[00:00] <fuzzylugnuts> mmmmm, baby lamb.
[00:27] <rharrison> right quick rebuild and total weight is 440g
[00:27] <rharrison> Using 25mm insulation board rather than 50mm any thoughts?
[00:29] <fuzzylugnuts> sure
[00:29] <natrium42> could add crumple zones
[00:29] <natrium42> to protect payload if chute fails
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[00:32] <fuzzylugnuts> mmmmm, ÿpomegranate
[00:33] <rharrison> Like a couple of leg type blocks to take the impact
[00:33] <rharrison> Like a coffee table if you follow me
[00:33] <natrium42> yep
[00:33] <fuzzylugnuts> Those would be great if you've got an antenna sticking out of the bottom
[00:33] <natrium42> bbl tennis
[00:34] <rharrison> bed here :)
[00:34] <rharrison> evening edmoore
[00:34] <fuzzylugnuts> finishing off the gin bottle here
[00:34] <natrium42> 7:34pm :P
[00:34] <edmoore> pub crawl back
[00:34] <edmoore> non functionallu
[00:34] <rharrison> fuzzylugnuts did my first tx today at radio course
[00:34] <fuzzylugnuts> oh nice!
[00:34] <fuzzylugnuts> congrads!
[00:35] <rharrison> In 4 weeks we do exam and I get a call sign
[00:35] <fuzzylugnuts> good luck : )
[00:36] <fuzzylugnuts> I ordered a vx-8r when it first came out, and its still backordered
[00:39] <fuzzylugnuts> rharrison: what rig do you have?
[00:53] <fuzzylugnuts> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCxgmPEt7Y4
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[01:04] <rharrison> yaesu ft817nd
[01:04] <rharrison> fuzzylugnuts
[01:05] <fuzzylugnuts> Huh, whats going on!
[01:05] <fuzzylugnuts> oh, I thought you were some kind of wacked out hippie gunna murder me.
[01:06] <fuzzylugnuts> I forgot, you and rob are the same person
[01:06] <fuzzylugnuts> rharrison: are you doing cw?
[01:07] <rharrison> yep
[01:07] <fuzzylugnuts> ah, fantastic
[01:07] <rharrison> Known by me radio :)
[01:08] <rharrison> I tested cw for 150 miles the other day and it worked perfect
[01:08] <fuzzylugnuts> awesome : )
[01:08] <rharrison> The signal was so clear I'm sure it would have been fine for 300 miles
[01:09] <fuzzylugnuts> what frequency
[01:09] <fuzzylugnuts> ?
[01:09] <rharrison> 434.650
[01:09] <fuzzylugnuts> oooh, your tracker xmiter
[01:09] <rharrison> 10milliwatts
[01:09] <fuzzylugnuts> nice
[01:10] <fuzzylugnuts> I'd listen, but that'd just be silly.
[01:11] <fnoble> hey guys, back
[01:11] <fuzzylugnuts> hey, its a fergus
[01:11] <fnoble> fuzzylugnuts, i have got your MCA here
[01:11] <rharrison> Not sure it would make it to the us
[01:11] <fuzzylugnuts> I've got your box of goodies
[01:11] <rharrison> But it's is quite high
[01:11] <fnoble> fuzzylugnuts, will post it on monday if you pm me your postal address
[01:11] <fuzzylugnuts> rharrison: yeah, I would be shocked and appalled if I heard anything
[01:27] <rharrison> Bed time
[01:27] <rharrison> 1:30 am
[01:27] <rharrison> nights all
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[09:55] <EI5GTB__> morninin
[09:55] Nick change: EI5GTB__ -> EI5GTB
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[11:05] <edmoore> mornin
[11:05] <fnoble> edmoore, hello
[11:05] <edmoore> hi
[11:05] <edmoore> just read uyour text
[11:06] <edmoore> it is not beer o'clock yet
[11:07] <fnoble> i sent it last night
[11:07] <edmoore> oh whoops
[11:07] <edmoore> my phone being odd
[11:24] <gordonjcp> edmoore: http://isitbeeroclock.com/
[11:24] <edmoore> :)
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[12:07] <Laurenceb_> ello
[12:07] <SpeedEvil> h
[12:19] <Laurenceb_> omg
[12:19] <Laurenceb_> I just discovered why I'm having problems with bootloaders
[12:19] <Laurenceb_> my USB voltage is ~4V
[12:20] <Laurenceb_> so the brown out detection is triggering
[12:40] <SpeedEvil> :)
[12:40] Action: SpeedEvil is recovering from getting high.
[12:40] <SpeedEvil> ladders--
[12:40] Action: SpeedEvil wants some nice scaffolding.
[12:41] <Laurenceb_> oohhh yesss
[12:41] Action: Laurenceb_ is flashing the parafoil over rs232
[12:41] <SpeedEvil> :)
[12:41] <SpeedEvil> It's only cool if it's at 10Km at the time.
[12:41] <Laurenceb_> hehe
[12:41] <Laurenceb_> looks like I've fixed the gyro - I was missing the last byte of data
[12:42] <SpeedEvil> Woho!
[12:42] <SpeedEvil> s/o/oo/
[12:42] <Laurenceb_> just had to slow it down
[12:42] <SpeedEvil> It's a digital gyro?
[12:42] <Laurenceb_> I was trying to run it at 10MHz
[12:42] <Laurenceb_> yes
[12:43] <Laurenceb_> the infamous mlx90609
[12:44] <Laurenceb_> actually I'm missing the last three bits
[12:45] <SpeedEvil> How's the drift working out?
[12:45] Action: SpeedEvil ponders saying fuckit, and doing the roof from the inside.
[12:46] <Laurenceb_> lol
[12:46] <Laurenceb_> not sure with this one
[12:47] <Laurenceb_> but the last melexis could hold a heading to +-10 degrees for a few minutes if I set it up right
[12:48] <Laurenceb_> hmm I have ~10cm of ps/2 cable to the gyro board, and some 0.1" headers running SPI at 1.25MHz clock speed
[12:49] <Laurenceb_> theres 1K resistors on the uC incase I spack up the code to avoid frying anything
[12:49] <Laurenceb_> could I still be running to too fast perhaps?
[12:50] <SpeedEvil> I wouldn't think so.
[12:50] <SpeedEvil> Do you have scope?
[12:50] <Laurenceb_> no
[12:50] <Laurenceb_> grr really need one
[12:50] <Laurenceb_> whats the capacitance going to be of the calble + headers?
[12:50] <Laurenceb_> a couple hundered pF ?
[12:50] <fnoble> maybe the resistors are slowing the rise times of the signal
[12:51] <fnoble> due to the capacitance of the cable etc
[12:51] <Laurenceb_> yeah, thats what I'm trying to work out
[12:52] <Laurenceb_> when I slowed it down from 5MHz I got 5 more bits appearing on the end of the response packet
[12:52] <Laurenceb_> how much bandwidth do I need for SPI to work in terms of the clock speed?
[12:53] <fnoble> canbe anything, SPI can be clocked at any speed
[12:53] <SpeedEvil> I'd expect 50pf or under.
[12:53] <Laurenceb_> sure
[12:53] <Laurenceb_> but if my SPI clock is x, how much bandwidth do I need for comms to work?
[12:53] <Laurenceb_> 5x? 10x ?
[12:53] <fnoble> so in theory you would need the bandwidth of the channel to be twice the clock speed miinimum
[12:54] <fnoble> due to nyquist
[12:54] <Laurenceb_> hmmm
[12:54] <Laurenceb_> yeah guess so
[12:54] <Laurenceb_> maybe the ADC is a bit slower than it says in the datasheet
[12:55] <Laurenceb_> and so by running slower spi I give it more time
[12:56] <fnoble> in practice you really want much more margin than that though
[12:56] <SpeedEvil> You are delaying at least the maximal time, and paying attention to the stated bits?
[12:56] <SpeedEvil> status bits
[12:56] <SpeedEvil> for 'end of conversion'
[12:57] <SpeedEvil> Nyquist is irrelevant.
[12:57] <SpeedEvil> It needs to be at a logic level valid voltage when the other end samples it.
[12:58] <Laurenceb_> well the datasheet says 115us, and I wait 200uS
[12:58] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[12:58] <Laurenceb_> I dont really see the relevance of nyquist
[12:58] <Laurenceb_> but checking the status bit would be a good plan
[12:58] <fnoble> SpeedEvil, nyquist is relevant, it tells you the theoretical upper bound, but in practice unless the system is designed for it you wont achieve that
[12:59] <Laurenceb_> fnoble, you put in a square wave
[12:59] <SpeedEvil> fnoble: nyquist will mislead in this case.
[13:00] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: 115us - after the conversion command finishes?
[13:00] <Laurenceb_> you need to look at it as an exponential approach
[13:00] <fnoble> i disagree, its good to know where the upper bound is when thinking about these things
[13:00] <Laurenceb_> SpeedEvil: yes
[13:02] <SpeedEvil> fnoble: sure - but you really don't care.
[13:03] <SpeedEvil> fnoble: yes, the upper bandwidth limit with OFDM of this wire may be 84 megabits/second.
[13:04] <SpeedEvil> fnoble: but given that it's connected to a TTL chip, which samples 43ns after clock rises to 2.45v, that's quite irrelevant.
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[13:04] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: I make it that you can run the clock at 6.25MHz (160na)
[13:04] <SpeedEvil> s
[13:06] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: what that cost you?
[13:06] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: using the temp sensor?
[13:13] <edmoore> Laurenceb_: at what altitude are you deploying your parachute?
[13:13] <edmoore> parafoil*
[13:13] <SpeedEvil> It's a fixed one
[13:13] <SpeedEvil> rollago
[13:13] <SpeedEvil> glo?
[13:13] <edmoore> Laurenceb_: not a ram-air parafoil then?
[13:18] <Laurenceb_> sorry, was cooking
[13:18] <Laurenceb_> yeah, a mini rogallo
[13:18] <Laurenceb_> I'm lanning on 10KM
[13:19] <Laurenceb_> *planning
[13:19] <Laurenceb_> as high as possible before dynamics become hard to predict
[13:20] <Laurenceb_> SpeedEvil: yeah I'm using the temp sensor as well, it was £32 from coolcomponents
[13:20] <Laurenceb_> bbl, lunch tim€e
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[13:49] <fuzzylugnuts> gordonjcp: I have dyndns set up, and I'm about to register my domain name with them for a fee... any other words of wisdom?
[13:57] <Laurenceb_> back
[13:59] <Laurenceb_> SpeedEvil: how did you arrive at 6.25MHZ ?
[14:00] <SpeedEvil> 80ns clock high and low minima
[14:00] <SpeedEvil> =160ns
[14:00] <SpeedEvil> =1/160ns
[14:00] <Laurenceb_> sure
[14:00] <Laurenceb_> but I have 1K resistors in the way
[14:01] <SpeedEvil> Say 50pf or so load.
[14:01] <SpeedEvil> 50pf*1K =
[14:01] <SpeedEvil> !maths 10^-12*50*10^3
[14:01] <SpeedEvil> err
[14:01] <SpeedEvil> 50ns I think ish.
[14:02] <SpeedEvil> 1MHz should be just fine.
[14:02] <Laurenceb_> I'm using 1.25
[14:02] <SpeedEvil> Do you have anything that actually needs faster?
[14:03] <Laurenceb_> no, it could be slowed down a bit
[14:03] <Laurenceb_> I guess theoretically this problem makes sence
[14:03] <Laurenceb_> if I'm building up a charge in the cable over time
[14:04] <Laurenceb_> and as it approaches 2.5V it reduces the maximum speed
[14:10] <Laurenceb_> guess its a case of getting a scope on it
[14:11] <fnoble> Laurenceb_, do you really need those resistors?
[14:11] <Laurenceb_> well
[14:11] <Laurenceb_> I'd kill myself if a type fried half my kit
[14:11] <Laurenceb_> *typo
[14:11] <fnoble> surely if youve got it working ish ow then you know there isnt any major problem
[14:12] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[14:12] <Laurenceb_> I might try removing them
[14:13] <fnoble> so what aspects arent working still?
[14:15] <Laurenceb_> its just the last three bits on the reply from the gyro
[14:15] <Laurenceb_> they are missing
[14:16] <fnoble> how can bits be missing on an SPI connection?
[14:16] <Laurenceb_> well they come through as 0
[14:16] <Laurenceb_> all the time
[14:16] <fnoble> ah i see
[14:16] <Laurenceb_> but I was "missing" the last 8 bits at 5MHz
[14:17] <Laurenceb_> so I'm pretty sure its a question of speed resistors and parasitic capacitance
[14:17] <fnoble> i see, funny it would only affect the end of the packet
[14:17] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[14:17] <fnoble> have you tried running it really slow? like a 10khz or something
[14:17] <Laurenceb_> no
[14:18] <Laurenceb_> fraid I'm packing atm
[14:18] <fnoble> see if it works then and work up
[14:18] <fnoble> ah cool
[14:18] <Laurenceb_> yeah, I'm sure it can be made to work, just ironing out the bugs now really
[14:19] <Laurenceb_> yeah, I'm setting off back to uni in 1/2 hour or so
[14:19] <fnoble> ah cool
[14:21] <Laurenceb_> I'm not 100% sure the optimal descent code is working correctly - I'll probably write some debug gps code that reads a kml file, then run it on my pc
[14:22] <fnoble> if your using linux and gpsd then look up fakegps
[14:22] <fnoble> that can read all sorts of files into gpsd to simulate a real gps
[14:22] <Laurenceb_> I see
[14:23] <Laurenceb_> yeah I'll need velocities and latitude,longitude, altitude at 1 second intervals
[14:23] <fnoble> might be overkill for your application to use gpsd though
[14:24] <Laurenceb_> problem is kml doesnt have velocities, so maybe just take a kml file then write a python script to make up velocity data from the change in lat,long,alt
[14:24] <fnoble> yup
[14:25] <Laurenceb_> then some groovy plots in gnuplot :P
[14:25] <SpeedEvil> You know you can change colour and size of dots ?
[14:25] <Laurenceb_> well time for me to head off, cya
[14:25] <SpeedEvil> wave
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[15:07] <fuzzylugnuts> kml is scary :(
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[15:19] <rharrison> Crystal clear skys up here (leeds) I want to launch
[15:19] <rharrison> Wyoming does put me in the north sea
[15:20] <fuzzylugnuts> whats up?
[15:22] <edmoore> north sea be damned
[15:22] <edmoore> crap weather here
[15:26] <rharrison> Today is the clearest day this year. I can see about 50 miles from the house
[15:26] <fuzzylugnuts> wow, sweet
[15:28] <rharrison> blue sky and no wing for 500meters
[15:28] <fuzzylugnuts> launch launch launch@
[15:28] <rharrison> but them there seems to be vary strong wind to the north sea !!!! Arse
[15:29] <fuzzylugnuts> launch anyways : 3 your payload is made of foam, right?
[15:31] <rharrison> Perhaps it will surf in afterwards
[15:33] <fuzzylugnuts> perhaps : )
[15:35] <fuzzylugnuts> I let radiometrix know that you folks use their stuff alot to do amazing things with low power in an email back to them about the pr article they are doing on the stuff I did for the idaho program.
[15:35] <fuzzylugnuts> hopefully they will do a follow-up about you guys milking the range of these units to its limits.
[15:43] <rharrison> edmoore: How do you attach your lines the payload?
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[15:44] <edmoore> normally wrap around the bottom
[15:44] <edmoore> or make little hooks
[15:46] <rharrison> I have some webbing I could use but i'm thinking just wrapping the string around the bottom
[15:52] <rharrison> fnoble ping
[16:10] <edmoore> webbing can be used with parachutes
[16:10] <edmoore> to stop them inverting and tangling
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[16:34] <fuzzylugnuts> hyena
[16:34] <fuzzylugnuts> whats up?
[16:41] <rharrison> Right Icarus is ready for launch well appart from a bit of duct tape
[16:42] <SpeedEvil> Better launch at night.
[16:42] <rharrison> I'm not launching today
[16:43] <rharrison> Next w/e or the one after depending on weather
[16:46] <Hiena> fuzzylugnuts, not much, painted my car, and cut the Fanta bottle for the UAV.
[16:47] <fuzzylugnuts> haha, product placement.
[16:47] <Hiena> My camera dome a little bit oversized, so it's look like a big Dragonfly.
[16:47] <fuzzylugnuts> very cool, are you taking pictures?
[16:48] <Hiena> Also, set the angle of the plastic ball, so the two half seam will be invisible for the camera.
[16:49] <fuzzylugnuts> right
[16:49] <Hiena> Yup. It will be a prop for my CV video.
[16:50] <fuzzylugnuts> cv?
[16:50] <Hiena> The camera will be fixed to the two degree rig and controlled with two ECO-6 servo.
[16:50] <Hiena> Curriculum Vitae
[16:51] <fuzzylugnuts> ahhh ok
[16:51] <fuzzylugnuts> very vcool
[16:52] <Hiena> I have a low school degree, so i have to sell myself. And a well edited video 10 times better than a sheet of paper.
[16:52] <fuzzylugnuts> Sure : )
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[16:54] <fuzzylugnuts> ok, I have to toss some laundry in. hopefully the weird chick from 3rd floor won't be there... again >.<
[16:54] <Hiena> Ehem... Same here. Except there is no chicks.
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[16:59] <natrium42> lol?
[16:59] <fuzzylugnuts> back.
[17:00] <fuzzylugnuts> yeah man, I think she's this one guy's wife... she keeps coming onto me when she gets me alone.
[17:01] <fuzzylugnuts> I hate apartment living.
[17:01] <Hiena> Be carefull, or you will be raped. ;)
[17:01] <fuzzylugnuts> can't rape the willing ;3
[17:02] <fuzzylugnuts> she might be this dude's sister, they are both about my age.
[17:04] <Hiena> Seems like the next week will be a MIB week, due i have no clean T-shirt and jeans, only black shirts and pants. Guess, i will hve a yet another akward meetings with the bosses.
[17:04] <gordonjcp> Hiena: awkward meetings?
[17:08] <Hiena> Yeah, as technician i'm usually wears a casual clothes, when i wears shirt and black pants, always starts the rumors at the office, about somejob-interviews, and quiting, etc. Usually at the second or third day, i have a meeting with the bosses due the rumors.
[17:09] <gordonjcp> heh
[17:09] <gordonjcp> so they call a meeting to ask why you're dressing differently?
[17:09] <gordonjcp> tell them to get to fuck
[17:16] <Hiena> Sure. About a years ago i worked for a security company on part time job, where the dress code was a suit+shirt+holster. After the graveyard shift i went directly to the office and slept a few hour there. When my first co-worker arrived, i was in the breaking room hanged my suit on the back of the chair. We talked fe words and i head back to the shop. Less than an hour i was in the bosses office...
[17:17] <SpeedEvil> Defuse the worries. Pink hair!
[17:20] <fuzzylugnuts> wow, because it doesn't mater what kind of person you are or what you do, its obviously the clothes that make you who you are.
[17:23] <Hiena> Yeah. But seems like it's only matter here in the eastside, because i had a business dinner with the guys from the university and some big-dog from the Airbus. We was, in a suit when that guy entered, in a T-shirt and jeans...
[17:26] <fuzzylugnuts> I think getting dressed up when you are meeting someone is a way of showing respect, but doesn't need to be the case during normal work. Like, I'd be more productive wearing something comfortable than if I was in a stuffy suit all day.
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[17:29] <jiffe88> hmm, alright, I installed soundmodem on my linux laptio
[17:29] <jiffe88> laptop
[17:30] <jiffe88> spectrum shows that it is picking up the mic, the ones counter continually counts up, I have no zeros, and its not picking up any data
[17:31] <Hiena> Hmm...
[17:31] <jiffe88> dcd light never turns on
[17:31] <fuzzylugnuts> what are you using for your packet source?
[17:32] <jiffe88> microtrak 300
[17:32] <fuzzylugnuts> cool I use that too.
[17:32] <fuzzylugnuts> jiffe88: is that the soundmodem that I modified?
[17:32] <jiffe88> cool, mixw in windows can pick it up
[17:33] <jiffe88> this isn't, that is still on my bsd machine, this is installed via apt-get
[17:33] <fuzzylugnuts> ah ok
[17:33] <fuzzylugnuts> because I think I took out the line that prints the packets to stdout and only have it log them to a file.
[17:34] <jiffe88> ah ok, well I'm just using the gui diagnostic tools right now
[17:35] <jiffe88> I pulled up the modem window where it shows received packets and received bits
[17:35] <jiffe88> this is via the soundmodem configurator
[17:36] <fuzzylugnuts> oh, right, ok
[17:36] <jiffe88> I'm wondering if the agc on the radio isn't screwing it up somehow
[17:36] <fuzzylugnuts> hmm
[17:37] <fuzzylugnuts> I'd have all that turned off, including any noise reduction
[17:38] <jiffe88> I don't think I can with this radio, its a pretty simple handheld
[17:38] <jiffe88> that wouldn't really explain why its seeing constant 1's and nothing else though
[17:40] <fuzzylugnuts> I don't know what that means, so ic an't help you there
[17:45] <jiffe88> suppose if I could tap into the mic input I could write my own tnc
[17:50] <fuzzylugnuts> I've found that hardware tncs work alot better anyways
[17:50] <fuzzylugnuts> http://www.kantronics.com/products/kpc3.html
[17:51] <fuzzylugnuts> that little thing works extremely well
[17:51] <fuzzylugnuts> then you just deal with parsing aprs packets
[17:53] <jiffe88> maybe might be better to find a radio/tnc combo
[17:56] <fuzzylugnuts> like, in the HT?
[17:57] <fuzzylugnuts> http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?sofocus=bs&sbrftog=1&dfsp=32&from=R40&satitle=kantronics&sacat=-1%26catref%3DC6&sargn=-1%26saslc%3D2&sadis=200&fpos=37831&sabfmts=1&saobfmts=insif&ftrt=1&ftrv=1&saprclo=&saprchi=&fsop=32&fsoo=2
[17:57] <fuzzylugnuts> because there are loads of hw tncs on ebay.
[17:57] <jiffe88> does that have a radio also, or just a tnc?
[17:57] <fuzzylugnuts> just the tnc
[17:58] <fuzzylugnuts> I have an old beat 2m with the tnc glued to the top
[18:01] <fuzzylugnuts> http://cgi.ebay.com/Midland-70-515B-Two-Way-Radio_W0QQitemZ300262950027QQihZ020QQcategoryZ4669QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[18:01] <fuzzylugnuts> thats what my radio looks like.
[18:01] <fuzzylugnuts> got it off ebay for 50 bucks. its tough as nuts
[18:01] <jiffe88> hah, I love the description on that :)
[18:02] <fuzzylugnuts> yeah : ) buyer beware
[18:03] <fuzzylugnuts> it took the PA out of it with the intention of putting in a preamp, but never did
[18:11] <jiffe88> ic
[18:12] <jiffe88> you ever have a problem with the gps light sticking on the microtrak 300?
[18:12] <fuzzylugnuts> nope, for me its just blinked when aquiring and stayed on when its got a lock
[18:14] <jiffe88> ah that is probably it
[18:15] <jiffe88> they don't seem to document functionality much in their pdf
[18:19] <fuzzylugnuts> yeah
[18:19] <fuzzylugnuts> I agree
[18:19] <fuzzylugnuts> I got to mess with some uTrack-8000s when I was in idaho
[18:20] <fuzzylugnuts> adjested for ~5w at balloon altitude, I wouldn't be surprised if people could pick us up states away
[18:21] <SpeedEvil> It's mostly line of sight issues which cause problems.
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[18:21] <fuzzylugnuts> more like the inverse of that
[18:21] <jcoxon> hey all
[18:21] <fuzzylugnuts> when our package was on the ground I could pick it up ~2 miles away
[18:21] <fuzzylugnuts> hey jcoxon
[18:22] <fuzzylugnuts> and that was through city terrain
[18:22] <jcoxon> Just passed my radio licence exam :-)
[18:22] <SpeedEvil> Wohoo!
[18:23] <fuzzylugnuts> the 300's are just fine and dandy for flight. on the ground I can pick them up about 1/4 mile away
[18:23] <fuzzylugnuts> jcoxon: yaaaaaaaaaaaay!
[18:23] <fuzzylugnuts> good job
[18:23] <fuzzylugnuts> now you're doomed
[18:23] <jcoxon> Haha
[18:23] <fuzzylugnuts> say goodbye to all your monies and hello to a garage full of ham gear
[18:23] <jcoxon> I plan to resist it
[18:24] <fuzzylugnuts> the force is strong in this one
[18:24] <jcoxon> Though i don't get my call sign for a few days
[18:25] <fuzzylugnuts> do you ahve a rig yet?
[18:25] <jcoxon> I have a ft 790r
[18:25] <jcoxon> Which we use for ballooning
[18:26] <fuzzylugnuts> nice!
[18:26] <jcoxon> Might get a vhf rig
[18:27] <fuzzylugnuts> yeah, seems like over here alot more people are on 2m than 70cm
[18:27] <jcoxon> Don't have space for a hf antenna
[18:27] <fuzzylugnuts> apartment?
[18:27] <jcoxon> Yeah 70cm is really quiet
[18:27] <jiffe88> yeah, we tried to run a line of sight test on the ground, we got about 20 miles
[18:27] <jcoxon> Yeah a 2nd floor flat
[18:28] <jiffe88> before mixw couldn't read it anymore
[18:28] <jcoxon> Now time to work on a balloon repeater
[18:28] <jiffe88> I think we were line of sight past that point still so I'm not sure why it dropped
[18:29] <fuzzylugnuts> how was the signal, audible still?
[18:29] <jiffe88> I'm thinking it was a crc error
[18:29] <jiffe88> still audible yes
[18:29] <jiffe88> well about as audible as before, there's a lot of noise
[18:30] <jcoxon> What format was it?
[18:31] <jiffe88> it was spitting aprs packet data out at 300bps
[18:32] <jcoxon> oh okay
[18:32] <jcoxon> Hmmm i need to correct the topic
[18:33] <jcoxon> The logs link is wrong
[18:33] <fuzzylugnuts> :O
[18:33] <fuzzylugnuts> noooooooooooo
[18:34] <jcoxon> Have to do it later, am on my phone so can't copy and paste
[18:37] #highaltitude: mode change '+o jcoxon' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
[18:40] Topic changed on #highaltitude by jcoxon!n=mirggi@212.183.134.130: Welcome to #highaltitude - discuss anything to do with high altitude projects (balloons, gliders, etc) www.ukhas.org.uk, wiki.ukhas.org.uk, logs: http://www.pegasushabproject.org.uk/zeusbot/
[18:40] <jcoxon> Bingo
[18:45] <jcoxon> Bbl
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[18:45] <fuzzylugnuts> hmmm... the solar cells I got off ebay seem to have been advertised as twice what you actually get from them
[18:45] <fuzzylugnuts> I made up 2 48v panels
[18:45] <fuzzylugnuts> and i get about 50w.
[18:46] <fuzzylugnuts> er *48w
[18:48] <SpeedEvil> You have them normal to the sun?
[18:48] <SpeedEvil> And you did check that the power is not the short circuit current multiplied by the open circuit voltage?
[18:51] <fuzzylugnuts> I have them behind a screen on my porch. The specs on the cell are 0.55v, 4amps
[18:51] <fuzzylugnuts> when I short circuit the cell I only get about 2
[18:51] <fuzzylugnuts> amps, that is.
[18:51] <SpeedEvil> they are pointed at the sun?
[18:51] <SpeedEvil> directly?
[18:51] <fuzzylugnuts> yeah
[18:52] <SpeedEvil> Is it midday?
[18:52] <fuzzylugnuts> 2pm
[18:52] <fuzzylugnuts> I'm sure the screen doesn't help
[18:53] <SpeedEvil> screen?
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[18:53] <SpeedEvil> well - put them in front of it.
[18:53] <SpeedEvil> See what you get.
[18:54] <fuzzylugnuts> yeah, thats the next step, take them outside.
[18:54] <SpeedEvil> Any high cloud?
[18:54] <fuzzylugnuts> nope
[18:54] <fuzzylugnuts> bbiab
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[18:59] <fuzzylugnuts> back
[18:59] <fuzzylugnuts> I get about 9v drop across a 2ohm load
[19:00] <fuzzylugnuts> I wish I had more resistors for a better dummy load.
[19:14] <SpeedEvil> what load for?
[19:14] <SpeedEvil> random copper or steel wire works well.
[19:14] <fuzzylugnuts> I got some nicrome out
[19:14] <SpeedEvil> as do kettles
[19:15] <gordonjcp> electric heaters
[19:15] <fuzzylugnuts> open voltage = 25v, 2amp load brings that to 20v.
[19:15] <fuzzylugnuts> so I've got about 40w to mess with
[19:17] <fuzzylugnuts> it seems like solar cells like to be run close to their open circuit voltage.
[19:18] Action: SpeedEvil passes fuzzylugnuts a phased plasma rifle in the 40w range.
[19:18] <SpeedEvil> IIRC that's about that.
[19:19] <SpeedEvil> about right - 0.8*open circuit
[19:19] <SpeedEvil> maybe a bit high
[19:20] <fuzzylugnuts> I'm still pretty new to the solar panel scene
[19:21] <SpeedEvil> a 3KW heater will give you 12.5 ohms.
[19:22] <fuzzylugnuts> ummm, ok?
[19:22] <SpeedEvil> for use as random loads for solar cells
[19:22] <SpeedEvil> find the peak power
[19:23] <fuzzylugnuts> this nichrome works well, its like a big variable resistor. All I have to do is measure the current through it and the voltage dropped across it to find my wattage.
[19:23] <SpeedEvil> if it works fine.
[19:24] <SpeedEvil> You seem to have gotten about half of the sticker power?
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[19:24] <fuzzylugnuts> yeah
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[19:29] <fuzzylugnuts> it would seem to me that a good efficient dc-dc converter would be beneficial when using solar panels.
[19:31] <Hiena> Actually better if you keeps the output voltage at high.
[19:31] <SpeedEvil> fuzzylugnuts: there is a special converter used - a peak power tracker.
[19:31] <Hiena> Go for the high output voltage panels.
[19:32] <SpeedEvil> fuzzylugnuts: it varies the input voltage to optimise power out.
[19:33] <fuzzylugnuts> I've seen those but looked too expensive for just s test setup
[19:33] <fuzzylugnuts> Hiena: like, lots of little panels in series?
[19:34] <Hiena> Yup. Higher output voltage, less current, less voltage drops, less heating, longer lifetime.
[19:34] <fuzzylugnuts> ahhh, ok
[19:35] <SpeedEvil> Only really an issue with long cable.s
[19:35] <fuzzylugnuts> there is the internal resistance of the cell too, though
[19:36] <SpeedEvil> Which isn't important to the configuration.
[19:36] <SpeedEvil> pure serial connection can be worse if one panel or the other is shaded.
[19:37] <SpeedEvil> series
[19:38] <Hiena> Actually it's a less problem, if the current is low.
[19:39] <fuzzylugnuts> I'm going to try a higher voltage, lower current panel next
[19:39] <fuzzylugnuts> the super good cells are back up on ebay
[19:39] <fuzzylugnuts> fred480v is the seller
[19:39] <fuzzylugnuts> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZfred480v
[19:43] <fuzzylugnuts> oh joy, tabbed cells.
[20:14] <fuzzylugnuts> laters
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[20:22] <Hiena> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&saddr=48.825114,2.198509&daddr=Ville-d'Avray,+Franciaorsz%A1g&hl=hu&geocode=%3BCbKjp8VF16zkFUsK6QIdj2UhAA&mra=mi&mrsp=0&sz=20&sll=48.825131,2.198499&sspn=0.00041,0.000864&ie=UTF8&ll=48.825131,2.198245&spn=0.00041,0.001373&t=k&z=20
[20:23] <Hiena> <=Somebody parked to the wrong place...
[20:23] <gordonjcp> lol
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[21:14] <SpeedEvil> Does anyone happen to have a LW radio handy? I'm wondering what's on 270/279Khz - as inspecting my ADSL modems spectral information it's not allocating any bits there indicating it's noisy.
[21:15] <gordonjcp> 7
[21:19] Action: SpeedEvil ponders the meaning of 7.
[21:29] <jiffe88> it means 3+4
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[21:35] <edmoore> hi jcoxon
[21:35] <edmoore> do you have a callsign now?
[21:36] <jcoxon> hey edmoore
[21:36] <jcoxon> nah i have to wait for my result to sent to Ofcom
[21:36] <edmoore> bah
[21:36] <jcoxon> should have it by tues
[21:37] <jcoxon> hows tricks?
[21:43] <edmoore> not bad
[21:43] <edmoore> programming, I am
[21:43] <edmoore> everyone run away and hide
[21:44] <jcoxon> haha
[21:44] <jcoxon> back in cam
[21:44] <jcoxon> ?
[21:45] <edmoore> oh yep
[21:45] <edmoore> 4 days now
[21:46] <jcoxon> oh did yesterday go well?
[21:47] <edmoore> what happened?
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[21:48] <jcoxon> weren't you giving a talk or something?
[21:54] <edmoore> no, that was others
[21:55] <jcoxon> oh okay
[21:55] <jcoxon> lucky we didn't launch this weekend
[21:55] <edmoore> hah yes
[21:55] <edmoore> was thinking that
[21:57] <rharrison> jcoxon CONGRATULATIONS SIR!!!
[21:57] <jcoxon> rharrison, hehe, thanks
[21:57] <jcoxon> it wasn't too difficult
[21:57] <rharrison> I assume by the history your passed with flying colours
[21:57] <rharrison> Not the hardest exam you have ever sat :)
[21:57] <jcoxon> indeed
[21:57] <jcoxon> they give you a very long time to very few questions
[21:58] <rharrison> No negative marking either
[21:59] <rharrison> I remember doing multichoice in gross anatomy and that was negativly marked
[21:59] <jcoxon> oh negative marking - don't remind me
[21:59] <rharrison> Histology wasn't much fun either at least Wheaters was helpfull for that
[22:00] <jcoxon> haha
[22:00] <jcoxon> i don't miss histology
[22:00] <rharrison> Apparently most medics don't
[22:00] <jcoxon> haha
[22:01] <jcoxon> right i better be off
[22:01] <rharrison> Any how they were electives on my comp sci course at leeds uni. I think I was the fist and probably the last to do an elective in medicine
[22:01] <jcoxon> night all
[22:01] <rharrison> nights jcoxon
[22:01] <jcoxon> night
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[22:04] <rharrison> fnobleyou there sir?
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[00:00] --- Mon Oct 6 2008