highaltitude.log.20080913

[00:18] <Laurenceb_> do rc plane lipo cells (high discharge) have lower energy densities?
[00:18] <fuzzylugnuts> yeah
[00:21] Nick change: fuzzylugnuts -> fuzzywet
[00:27] <Laurenceb_> http://www2.dem.inpe.br/hkk/2007/COBEM2007-1982-Walter.pdf
[00:27] <Laurenceb_> edmoore: ^
[00:36] Nick change: fuzzywet -> fuzzylugnuts
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[01:05] <Laurenceb_> this is interesting as well http://openuav.astroplanes.com/library/docs/LTU-EX-00081-SE.pdf
[01:05] <Laurenceb_> not very well written in places
[01:05] <ShellEvil> A123 cells for the highest power density.
[01:06] <Laurenceb_> I'm interesting in energy
[01:06] <Laurenceb_> http://www.coolcomponents.co.uk/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=27&products_id=157
[01:07] <ShellEvil> energy density, you're looking at li-po
[01:07] <ShellEvil> Or Li-S if you can obtain it, which you can't.
[01:07] <Laurenceb_> I'll probably get that one I linked
[01:07] <Laurenceb_> I've got some rc plane chargers to charge it with
[01:08] <ShellEvil> That's what - 7Wh in 35g, or 210Wh/Kg/
[01:08] <ShellEvil> ?
[01:09] <Laurenceb_> something like
[01:09] <gordonjcp> hello
[01:09] <Laurenceb_> my charger here is ~1 amp
[01:09] <gordonjcp> well, as some of you may know, tonight I was sitting my radio amateur exam
[01:09] <Laurenceb_> that will be ok?
[01:09] <gordonjcp> which...
[01:09] <ShellEvil> gordonjcp: did you have a breakdown, and write 'Fish' all over the paper?
[01:09] <Laurenceb_> so it will charge at about 0.5C
[01:09] <gordonjcp> I have passed
[01:09] <ShellEvil> :)
[01:09] <gordonjcp> with 100%
[01:09] <ShellEvil> Laurenceb_: should be fine - if it's an actuall lithium charger.
[01:10] <gordonjcp> I've *never* got 100% on a test in my life
[01:10] <ShellEvil> Easy?
[01:10] <Laurenceb_> yeah, it does trickle charging and all the works
[01:10] <gordonjcp> ShellEvil: it was a bit
[01:11] <Laurenceb_> just doesnt go <1A charge
[01:11] <Laurenceb_> gordonjcp: well done :D
[01:11] <gordonjcp> Laurenceb_: ty
[01:11] <Laurenceb_> right time for some sleep
[01:11] <Laurenceb_> http://openuav.astroplanes.com/library/ <-- if your after something to read :P
[01:12] <Laurenceb_> cya all
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[01:12] <ShellEvil> Wave.
[01:32] <fuzzylugnuts> wooo
[01:32] <ShellEvil> fuzzylugnuts: you've achieved cold fusion?
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[01:32] <fuzzylugnuts> oh... did you find a youtube comment?
[01:33] <fuzzylugnuts> or were you looking at my web page?
[01:35] <fuzzylugnuts> ShellEvil: and btw, I have a hardon for the A123's. LifeBatt puts out some bigger capacity ones
[01:35] <fuzzylugnuts> http://lifebatt.com/
[01:37] <ShellEvil> No - random comments.
[01:37] <ShellEvil> Yeah - but can I buy one.
[01:37] <ShellEvil> Or ten.
[01:37] <fuzzylugnuts> ?
[01:38] <fuzzylugnuts> A123s?
[01:38] <ShellEvil> no - lifebat
[01:38] <fuzzylugnuts> of course
[01:38] <fuzzylugnuts> if you have the cash
[01:38] <fuzzylugnuts> they come in 3.3v, 10Ah cells that make up their packs
[01:39] <ShellEvil> low charge current
[01:39] <fuzzylugnuts> 12V 40Ah runs $910
[01:39] <fuzzylugnuts> hmm? low charge current?
[01:39] <ShellEvil> 3C
[01:39] <fuzzylugnuts> oh
[01:42] <fuzzylugnuts> they are still very groovy.
[01:42] <fuzzylugnuts> I'd like to buy just the cells
[01:45] <ShellEvil> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/WE-REBUILD-YOUR-36-VOLT-DEWALT-LITHIUM-BATTERY-DC9360_W0QQitemZ280264046464QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item280264046464&_trkparms=72%3A12|39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A12|240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14
[01:45] <ShellEvil> I wonder if they can get it.
[01:45] <ShellEvil> A123 cells.
[01:46] <ShellEvil> IIRC they're only really selling to dewalt.
[01:47] <fuzzylugnuts> you can buy developer kits straight from A123, but its cheaper to jus tpull them out of the dewalt 36V packs
[01:47] <fuzzylugnuts> the Black & Decker VPX packs contain 1.1Ah A123s
[01:47] <ShellEvil> yeah.
[01:48] <ShellEvil> Which aren't sold in the UK.
[01:48] <fuzzylugnuts> ah, lame
[01:49] <fuzzylugnuts> Oh, btw. I got some hot melt glue to mess with.
[01:49] <ShellEvil> I'm trying to get my hot-melt thread roller working.
[01:49] <ShellEvil> I have done some tests on foil with really good results.
[01:50] <ShellEvil> 15um foil, joined by a 0.2mm dia thread of glue ironed flat.
[01:50] <fuzzylugnuts> yeah? it holds well?
[01:50] <ShellEvil> Was getting about 80Kg/m of strength per bond.
[01:50] <ShellEvil> In peel.
[01:50] <ShellEvil> Not even in shear.
[01:50] <fuzzylugnuts> that'll do
[01:50] <ShellEvil> Which is _well_ over what's needed.
[01:51] <fuzzylugnuts> it would be so much easier than using tape.
[01:52] <ShellEvil> And foil balloons aren't actually that bad.
[01:52] <fuzzylugnuts> I like them
[01:52] <fuzzylugnuts> they are shiny
[01:53] <fuzzylugnuts> and that mylar film is pretty damned strong
[01:53] <ShellEvil> No - I mean actual foil.
[01:54] <fuzzylugnuts> oh
[01:57] <fuzzylugnuts> and for the record, this hot glue is holding nearly to the point of ripping the mylar.
[01:57] <ShellEvil> :)
[01:57] <ShellEvil> Try at -20C though
[01:57] <fuzzylugnuts> yeah...
[01:57] <ShellEvil> And try extended peel strength
[01:57] <fuzzylugnuts> I'll have to try and get some dry ice somewhere
[01:57] <fuzzylugnuts> extended peel strength?
[01:58] <ShellEvil> Rig up something to apply a constant load to it, and leave it for a while
[01:58] <fuzzylugnuts> ahh
[01:58] <fuzzylugnuts> if its cold I don't think creep will be a prob
[01:59] <ShellEvil> No - I was meaning failures where it starts failing at a slow rate across the joint
[02:00] <fuzzylugnuts> I'll mess around with it.
[02:00] <ShellEvil> Foil doesn't seem too bad either. 2700Kg/m^3 - sure - but it's availbale cheaply at 11um.
[02:01] <fuzzylugnuts> let me know how it works out
[02:02] <ShellEvil> I'm trying to do a test with what's in the kitchen. Trying to work out how to make a consistent thread of glue
[02:06] <fuzzylugnuts> *nod*
[02:06] <fuzzylugnuts> I'm cutting more gores.
[02:07] <ShellEvil> And trying to resist the source of lift gas in my kitchen :)
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[02:56] <fuzzylugnuts> this hot glue gun kinda sucks. it was cheap
[02:57] <fuzzylugnuts> if did this on a grand scale I'd get a good one
[03:04] <fuzzylugnuts> laters
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[03:38] <ShellEvil> Anyone happen to know if there is a mass limit below which you can release balloons without CAA/...
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[08:11] <SpeedEvil> ah
[08:11] <SpeedEvil>     fuzzylugnuts is now known as fuzzywet
[08:11] <SpeedEvil> <Laurenceb_> http://www2.dem.inpe.br/hkk/2007/COBEM2007-1982-Walter.pdf
[08:11] <SpeedEvil> <Laurenceb_> edmoore: ^
[08:11] <SpeedEvil>     fuzzywet is now known as fuzzylugnuts
[08:11] <SpeedEvil> [12:42am][SpeedEvil(+eiw)] [#highaltit(+cnt)] [Act: 1,5,4,3]
[08:13] <Hiena> Okay guys, i've got the funds for the next project. You could start, betting how well will burn sixty 120l trashbag ductaped together. ;)
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[08:51] <SpeedEvil> Filled with hydrogen?
[08:52] <edmoore> what's happening?
[08:52] <SpeedEvil> Hiena mentioned something about burning trashbags.
[08:55] <edmoore> :)
[08:58] <SpeedEvil> I'm still working on something to extrude 0.2-0.3mm dia hotmelt.
[08:59] <SpeedEvil> For my foil balloons.
[09:00] <Hiena> No, it will be filled with hot-air. I've got enough lunch money for a trashbags and the ducktapes. Also, made a new burner design.
[09:00] <SpeedEvil> What're you fixing them together with?
[09:00] <SpeedEvil> oh
[09:00] <edmoore> that RC balloon was fun
[09:00] <SpeedEvil> Very silly.
[09:00] <edmoore> not sure how much C you can really get
[09:00] <SpeedEvil> You getta de up, and you getta de down.
[09:01] <Hiena> I hopes 8 qubic meter will be enough for the 1 kg modells droptests.
[09:01] <SpeedEvil> That's about 10Kg of air.
[09:02] <SpeedEvil> If you heat it by 50C, you get 2Kg lift ish.
[09:02] <edmoore> not sure I'd rate plastic bags at ambient + 50
[09:02] <SpeedEvil> True.
[09:02] <Hiena> That is the plan. The trashbag mets at 80.
[09:02] <edmoore> unless you're in canada
[09:02] <Hiena> +l
[09:03] <edmoore> you are?
[09:03] <Hiena> Also, i want to use it in winter time, and around february the we goes below -10.
[09:04] <edmoore> that makes your life a lot easier then I guess
[09:05] <SpeedEvil> You could make a 'burner' from freezing water.
[09:07] <Hiena> I need nil wind condition for the tests, and here the only options the spring and autumn mornings when the temperature around 10 C or a calm winter days when the temperature is around -15 C.
[09:08] <SpeedEvil> 1Kg what model?
[09:08] <Hiena> Gliders and blended-wing-bodies.
[09:09] <Hiena> And some lifting bodies,
[09:09] <edmoore> fly like a pig
[09:09] <edmoore> sting like a pig
[09:10] <edmoore> glide like a pig, landing like a pig
[09:10] <edmoore> that's a crap haiku about lifting bodies
[09:10] <Hiena> Sure, but for the low Re conditions certifications have to do droptests.
[09:11] <Hiena> Also, with a well adjusted CG and control surfaces, even the steamiron id flyable.
[09:11] <Hiena> Khmm.. is...
[09:12] <edmoore> I can't argue with that :)
[09:13] <Hiena> At the same, my pals at the university, need something for the "morphing wing" tests.
[09:14] <Hiena> Btw, i've got a crappy video from our last tests. http://rht.bme.hu/~balazs/dir/OPENAIR_autnomous_flight_test.wmv
[09:15] <SpeedEvil> Droptests from what altitude>?
[09:16] <Hiena> At the second part you could see the onboard camera picture. The red line shows the horizont identification results, the short line shows the angle of the control surfaces.
[09:17] <Hiena> SpeedEvil, 50m. That is the legal maximum here for the modell balloons.
[09:17] <SpeedEvil> Have you considered compressed air guns?
[09:28] <Hiena> Yes. I use 8 atm "aircannon" for the high speed modell launch. But for the droptest need 0hv 0vv.
[09:29] Nick change: wickerwaka -> akawaka
[09:37] <Hiena> What i really don't likes with the pressure assisted lauch, how the start tube disturbs the flow around the the body. If the body has something supersonic shape or delta it's not a real problem, because it has enough lenght to hide the launch tube. But at the plank style flying-wigns almost useless.
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[09:49] <Laurenceb_> hi folks
[09:50] <SpeedEvil> hi.
[09:51] <Laurenceb_> I've been reading this - http://openuav.astroplanes.com/library/docs/LTU-EX-00081-SE.pdf
[09:52] <SpeedEvil> It's a bit weak on charachter development.
[09:56] <Laurenceb_> lol
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[09:57] <Laurenceb_> sections 2 and 4 are the most useful
[09:57] <SpeedEvil> Haven't read it yet
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[10:29] <edmoore> Laurenceb_: I found that paper very helpful, I remember
[10:30] <edmoore> restart time
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[10:37] <robert1971> morning all
[10:37] <robert1971> Bit of a hangover this morning
[10:37] <edmoore> :)
[10:38] <edmoore> solder fumes from a diligent and focussed all-nighter?
[10:38] <robert1971> Been soldering this morning. Learning to read pinout and desolder too
[10:38] <robert1971> being
[10:39] <edmoore> desoldering is a trick and a half
[10:39] <robert1971> Does anyone happen to knoe if the internal occilator is turned on by default?
[10:39] <edmoore> every time i have to desolder a chip I swear a lot
[10:39] <edmoore> Laurenceb_: a question for you ^
[10:40] <edmoore> robert1971: is joining the happy avr world, and you know your fusebits
[10:40] <edmoore> sorry, that was directed at Laurenceb_
[10:40] <robert1971> Seened to work very easy for me. Shoved brade on problem. Heated. Solder wicked away and remove wire. Might be more interesting with a 28 Pin DIL
[10:40] <robert1971> seemed
[10:41] <edmoore> big dills are the pain, yeah
[10:41] <edmoore> surface mount is ok
[10:41] <edmoore> when my a-level project 40-pin dil pic was soldered in the wrong way round by my friend, that made me a little jumpy :)
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[11:16] <jcoxon> morning all
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[11:16] <robert1971> morning
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[11:19] <jcoxon> robert1971, hows the beacon coming along?
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[11:21] <SpikeUK> Morning peps"
[11:23] <jcoxon> :-)
[11:24] <robert1971> Having a few teathers getting my avr to program
[11:27] <jcoxon> oh :-(
[11:28] <SpikeUK> Apologies if this has already been asked robert1971 but what programmer/software tools are you using?
[11:31] <SpikeUK> I ask as I'm having fun with an Atmel AVRISP mkII and AVR Studio 4.
[11:32] <jcoxon> its all about using an arduino
[11:32] <jcoxon> so much easier
[11:33] <SpikeUK> Thanks jcoxon - Robostix for me.
[11:34] <jcoxon> :-)
[11:35] <SpikeUK> Hey! Were we not going to collaborate on a project?
[11:35] <jcoxon> now that i've completed my beacon I'm going to start on the gumsix part of my payload
[11:35] <SpikeUK> Can I be of assistance?
[11:36] <jcoxon> i'm sure you can be of assistance
[11:36] <jcoxon> ooo tunnels
[11:36] <jcoxon> might disappear
[11:36] <jcoxon> what were our plans again?
[11:36] <SpikeUK> Not sure! I'm working with Gumstix and stuff for work - yes really!
[11:37] <jcoxon> sounds like a plan
[11:37] <jcoxon> :-)
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[11:38] <jcoxon> SpikeUK, send me an email and we could discuss this in detail if you want (jacoxon@googlemail.com)
[11:38] <jcoxon> quite a lot of the code is ready
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[11:38] <jcoxon> but its going to need lots of testing and debugging
[11:38] <robert1971> join #avr
[11:39] <jcoxon> robert1971, you missed a '/'
[11:40] <SpikeUK> jcoxon - done!
[11:40] <jcoxon> right i better be off
[11:40] <SpikeUK> ok! Bye!
[11:40] <jcoxon> getting into the station (the joys of mobile broadband)
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[12:25] <Xenion> hello
[12:27] <Xenion> is someone there ?
[12:28] <Xenion> i wan't to acquire helium
[12:28] <Xenion> about 2000 liter
[12:28] <Xenion> can someone hep
[12:28] <Xenion> can someone point me or help me to find a payable reseller ?
[12:36] <robert1971> boc
[12:37] <robert1971> http://www.bocballoongas.co.uk/
[12:51] <Xenion> thanks robert1971
[12:51] <Xenion> sorry to bother you but just a specific physiscs questrion
[12:53] <Xenion> just imagine
[12:54] <Xenion> i have a ballon with 5m³
[12:54] <Xenion> how much helium would i need to fill it up ?
[12:54] <Xenion> i calculated 2000liter but i cant fight the thought that i forgot something or miscalculated something
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[13:29] <edmoore> robert1971: it's arrived! thank you very much!
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[15:04] <robert1971> Afternnon all
[15:05] <edmoore> hello!
[15:05] <edmoore> it's arrived robert1971, thank you!
[15:05] <SpikeUK> Hi!
[15:05] <robert1971> Cool. Hopefull enough cable there
[15:05] <robert1971> Did the monitor survive
[15:06] <edmoore> ha yes, should have seen the look on mum's face when I was explaining when i explained where it would be layed
[15:06] <edmoore> yep, it is perfectly happen
[15:06] <robert1971> I can imagine
[15:07] <robert1971> I have put in four terminators for the cable in the box you'll have to squish them using pliers when making the cable. I'm sure it's not beyond you :)
[15:13] <edmoore> I'll manage :)
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[15:21] <neontube> hello all
[15:21] <edmoore> hi neontube
[15:22] <neontube> how u all been ?
[15:22] <jcoxon> hey neontube
[15:22] <jcoxon> good thanks
[15:23] <neontube> jcoxon: ever do anything else with that weather sat box?
[15:27] <jcoxon> my flat mates made me take down my antenna from the balcony during the summer as they wanted to sit out there
[15:27] <jcoxon> :-p
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[15:29] <neontube> lol
[15:29] <neontube> tell them that without it being up you wouldn't know when it was going to be a nice day to sit there!
[15:29] <jcoxon> hehe
[15:30] <jcoxon> i'm wondering if i can put it inside somewhere
[15:30] <neontube> do u havea licence key for wxtoimg ?
[15:30] <edmoore> jcoxon: would you/your parents put up with a 2ft tall truss tower with twin 4m auto-track yagis on top?
[15:30] <jcoxon> yeah
[15:30] <edmoore> 20ft*
[15:30] <jcoxon> not sure how well that would go down in london
[15:30] <jcoxon> and we live in a conservation area in suffolk
[15:30] <edmoore> indeed, was thinking suffolk
[15:30] <jcoxon> the mobile phone masts aren't even allowed
[15:30] <edmoore> oh well, no giant pointy robots 4 u then
[15:31] <neontube> is it worth paying for ?
[15:31] <jcoxon> shame
[15:31] <neontube> lol
[15:31] <jcoxon> neontube, it was pretty good
[15:31] <neontube> i don't seem to pay any attention to palnning laws
[15:31] <neontube> got a nice 1m dish and motor on a pole in the garden
[15:32] <neontube> and a nice 5m scaffolding pole strapped to the greenhouse to hole the weather sat antenna up
[15:32] <jcoxon> neontube, so you set up nicely for the weather sats?
[15:32] <neontube> antenna wise yes
[15:32] <neontube> but looking for a scanner radio at the mo
[15:33] <jcoxon> i'm getting my licence soon
[15:33] <neontube> as that old reciver box (like that one i gave you) doesn't have much scope to use the new ones due to lack of xtls in it
[15:34] <jcoxon> oh i miss have the sats passing
[15:34] <neontube> anyone got an old scanner they want rid off ?
[15:34] <neontube> 'tick tock - tick tock - tick tock - tick tock'
[15:34] <jcoxon> hmmm would being indoors massively affect the reception
[15:34] <jcoxon> neontube, trawlled ebay?
[15:34] <neontube> yer
[15:35] <neontube> over priced junk mainly
[15:35] <neontube> but i'm checking every day to spot if anything good comes up
[15:35] <edmoore> http://cam.balloonfacility.com/CgiStart?page=Single&Language=0
[15:35] <edmoore> getting ready for this HASP thing
[15:35] <edmoore> which is a bit behind schedule
[15:36] <neontube> cool
[15:36] <neontube> i wanna get something that will let me receive the SW weather faxes
[15:36] <edmoore> look now!
[15:36] <edmoore> that's what we need
[15:36] <edmoore> too late
[15:37] <neontube> what was it
[15:37] <neontube> giant tanker full of helium ?
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[15:37] <edmoore> tranking antenna on the roof
[15:38] <jcoxon> sooo cool
[15:39] <edmoore> we're not that far off this ourselves
[15:39] <edmoore> when we do sawn launches (rather than silly am launches) this kinda stuff will be quite feasable
[15:40] <neontube> has anyone sorted out sending live (or recorded) stills from the camera back to a base station yet
[15:40] <jcoxon> neontube, i'm nearly there there
[15:40] <neontube> :D
[15:40] <jcoxon> strike the second thre
[15:40] <jcoxon> there*
[15:40] <neontube> i want to set up some sort of cctv on my allotment
[15:41] <edmoore> once james super-beacon is finished he'll be putting us all to shame with crazy-bitch projects
[15:41] <neontube> and recieve it back at the house
[15:41] <neontube> i'm only about 500m away
[15:41] <jcoxon> superbeacon is finished!
[15:41] <jcoxon> needs testing but it works
[15:42] <SpikeUK> Hey jcoxon! Have you received my email?
[15:42] <jcoxon> yes
[15:42] <jcoxon> thanks
[15:42] <SpikeUK> ok
[15:45] <robert1971> jcoxon: Show off :-P
[15:45] <robert1971> I'm still building mine. Took me 6hr to program the avr on mine
[15:46] <jcoxon> i did the code on a big arduino then shifted it to a arduino mini
[15:46] <robert1971> In the end it was the fu@@ing programmer. Using the atmel programmer now
[15:46] <edmoore> I remember doug being delighted and amused that in the space of about 9 seconds, james had wrigged up the online radio tuner.
[15:47] <jcoxon> it was a few hours
[15:47] <jcoxon> :-p
[15:47] <edmoore> i exaggerated the time slight. but still cool.
[15:47] <edmoore> slightly*
[15:47] <jcoxon> hehe
[15:47] <robert1971> these doctors they need to use their time wisely :)
[15:48] <jcoxon> pah i haven't done any medicine for a few weeks
[15:48] <jcoxon> start again on monday
[15:48] <robert1971> I have three kids and a wife 4 my handicap
[15:49] <robert1971> My beacon is working now :-P
[15:49] <jcoxon> i might need to change my serial routines as it waits for a serial string from the gps, if the gps dies then so might the beacon
[15:50] <edmoore> can you not interrupt?
[15:50] <jcoxon> oh quite possibly - just the way i was doing the code
[15:50] <edmoore> i.e. '1hz beep until there's a new nmea string'
[15:50] <edmoore> which means there should never be 1hz beep unless the gps packs up
[15:51] <neontube> wouldn't a repeat of the last position be more useful than a 1hz beep ?
[15:51] <edmoore> you are quite right.
[15:52] <edmoore> though maybe with the warning that it's old data
[15:52] <neontube> adding a tone as part of the signal message is useful for tracking use though
[15:52] <edmoore> the rtty warble is nice - you always think oyu hear it in white noise.
[15:52] <robert1971> jcoxon: U got the gps connected too?
[15:52] <robert1971> bimey i'm slow
[15:52] <jcoxon> yup
[15:53] <jcoxon> hmmm that said a 1hz beacon is always nice to actually find by fox hunting
[15:53] <neontube> yup, somehting u can hear without having to be in sync with a data stream
[15:53] <robert1971> 1hz be my choice
[15:53] <jcoxon> i think my theory is all good
[15:54] <edmoore> it's more of a heart beat, which is nice.
[15:54] <jcoxon> just need change the code to continue working without a gps
[15:54] <jcoxon> which isn't difficult
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[15:55] <edmoore> jatkins - alive!
[15:55] <jatkins> hi
[15:55] <jatkins> :)
[15:56] <robert1971> Can GPS output be interfaced straight into the rx of the avr?
[15:57] <robert1971> Assuming it's tty
[15:57] <edmoore> ttl?
[15:57] <robert1971> :) slip of the brain
[15:57] <edmoore> yes
[15:58] <edmoore> if they're both 3.3V, definitely yes
[15:58] <edmoore> if they're 3.3/5V (one each, either way round) almost certainly yes but not best practice. though we don't care.
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[15:59] <jcoxon> so i've got a 3.3v gps and an arduino mini pro which runs at 3.3v
[16:00] <jcoxon> so all is good
[16:00] <robert1971> Talking of bad practice can I recieve input from the gps on the rx and TX to the gumstix on one avr
[16:00] <edmoore> anyone want to save shipping on a farnell order?
[16:00] <edmoore> if the gps doesn't need any input (not normally for defaults) then yep
[16:00] <robert1971> I'm going to pick up my order on monday :-P
[16:01] <edmoore> oh damn, you live next to it don't you
[16:01] <edmoore> not fair
[16:01] <robert1971> 10 low voltage atmega8s
[16:01] <edmoore> cute!
[16:01] <edmoore> what's the app?
[16:02] <robert1971> beacon in the main. Just a quid less each for 10
[16:02] <robert1971> I'll put them in the draw with the others :)
[16:03] <robert1971> the lassen SKII is 5v i think
[16:03] <edmoore> why that'n over the iQ?
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[16:04] <robert1971> it had the rf antenna attachment on it. I would go for the Iq next time
[16:05] <edmoore> the iQ does too :p
[16:06] <edmoore> still, will be good to have another gps validated on the altitude front
[16:07] <robert1971> arse
[16:08] <robert1971> well the SKII works at 5v at so does my avr at the momnet. @@uk it I'll order a couple of iQs up too :)
[16:08] <edmoore> :)
[16:08] <edmoore> not different connector - get a couple of hlf<>sma converters
[16:08] <edmoore> i say hlf - it's some combination of letters like that that the iQ uses
[16:08] <robert1971> They don't sell iQ's at farnell
[16:09] <robert1971> I'm going to use an avr to drive the beacon
[16:09] <edmoore> that's that then
[16:10] <robert1971> BTW edmoore: can you rx from the gps and tx to a gumstix on the avr
[16:10] <edmoore> yep
[16:10] <edmoore> you have pretty independant control of the pins
[16:11] <jcoxon> the AVR would need to be at 3.3v
[16:11] <robert1971> That is going to be perfect.
[16:11] <edmoore> they're happy with 5V
[16:11] <edmoore> unless they're the L versions
[16:11] <robert1971> jcoxon: Picing up 10 lv ones on Monday
[16:11] <robert1971> Picking :)
[16:11] <jcoxon> jsut hte gumstix will be 3.3v
[16:13] <robert1971> 3.3v thats a usless value. What do you power it all with?
[16:13] <jcoxon> 4.5v
[16:14] <robert1971> 3xAA witha resistor or a converter
[16:14] <jcoxon> robert1971, you mean the gumstix?
[16:15] <robert1971> oops no the beacon
[16:15] <jcoxon> of right
[16:15] <jcoxon> oh*
[16:15] <jcoxon> a 3.7v LiPo right now
[16:15] <edmoore> aargh not resistors!
[16:15] <edmoore> as a rule, with potential dividers, the current going out the divider shouldn't be more than about 10% the total current flowing through it
[16:15] <robert1971> Just runing it a bit high then
[16:16] <jcoxon> robert1971, not really
[16:16] <edmoore> robert1971: you want 'LDO's - low dropout regulators. They take some input (slight above output to a lot above out, eg 3.5V - 15V) and stick out 3.3V
[16:16] <jcoxon> the arduino mini and the gps have regulators
[16:16] <edmoore> or whatever voltage they happen to be rated at
[16:17] <edmoore> they turn the excess into heat though, so they're not that efficient. but fine most of the time. and a bit of heat doesn't hurt with ballooning.
[16:17] <robert1971> Ok that makes sense
[16:17] <robert1971> There is one hell of a heat sink up there
[16:18] <edmoore> yeah, it's pretty frosty
[16:19] <robert1971> I'm going to go and play with the helium in a bit
[16:20] <edmoore> give a u-stream presentation in all your smurf glory
[16:27] <jatkins> edmoore: have you used the logomatic? http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=752
[16:27] <edmoore> nope
[16:28] <jatkins> ok
[16:28] <jcoxon> jatkins, i've got a link for you, one sec
[16:29] <jcoxon> this is what you want to make:
[16:29] <jcoxon> http://www.ladyada.net/make/gpsshield/
[16:29] <jatkins> thx
[16:29] <jcoxon> but
[16:29] <jcoxon> you don't need to make it like that, but it shows you how to do gps and a mmc/sd card
[16:29] <jatkins> ok
[16:30] <jatkins> the logomatic takes 3.3V Vcc input
[16:30] <jcoxon> oh right
[16:30] <jatkins> so I was wondering if that means the serial comms is 3.3V CMOS?
[16:30] <jatkins> rather than ttl
[16:30] <jatkins> it doesn't say on the datasheet
[16:30] <jatkins> or product page
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[16:31] <edmoore> cmos and ttl are functionionally the same thing for what you're talking about
[16:31] <edmoore> treat them both the same
[16:31] <jatkins> ok
[16:31] <jatkins> so I don't need to convert the logic levels?
[16:31] <jcoxon> oooo one sec
[16:31] <jcoxon> the arduino is a 5v thingywhatsit
[16:31] <jatkins> with http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8745
[16:31] <jatkins> yeah
[16:32] <edmoore> if you're being anal :) if the logomatic is based on an lpc series arm, as I beleive it is, then it has 5V tolernat io
[16:32] <jcoxon> http://www.pegasushabproject.org.uk/wiki/doku.php/missions:pegasus6
[16:33] <jatkins> ok
[16:33] <edmoore> hooory!
[16:33] <edmoore> hooray*
[16:33] <edmoore> peg is back
[16:33] <edmoore> the godfather of uk ballooning
[16:33] <jcoxon> jatkins, using a arduino mini pro i've got it working with a gps
[16:34] <jatkins> ok
[16:34] <edmoore> I will wake up one day with a severed badger head in my bed
[16:34] <jatkins> lol
[16:37] <jatkins> oh I'm an idiot
[16:37] <jatkins> trying to log into the pegasus wiki when I wanted to log in to ukhas
[16:37] <edmoore> i am getting confused by the number of dokuwikis in my life too atm
[16:37] <jatkins> lol
[16:38] <jatkins> they should make it support openid
[16:38] <jatkins> http://openid.net
[16:45] <jatkins> edmoore: this is probably a stupid question, but do TX/RX lines need to be grounded?
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[16:50] <robert1971> yes
[16:50] <jatkins> ok
[16:51] <jatkins> the logomatic doesn't have a gnd pin for TX
[16:51] <jatkins> i'll get the spec link
[16:51] <jatkins> http://www.sparkfun.com/datasheets/Widgets/Logomatic/Logomatic_V1_0.PDF
[16:51] <jatkins> schematic*
[16:51] <robert1971> looking
[16:52] <jatkins> thx
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[16:53] <edmoore> jatkins: they don't have to be grounded, but the devices need to be on the same ground
[16:53] <jatkins> ok
[16:53] <robert1971> edmoore: KNow more on this than I
[16:53] <robert1971> knows
[16:54] <jatkins> what do you mean?
[16:54] <jatkins> the Vcc is grounded
[16:56] <edmoore> basically, gnd on one device needs to be connected to gnd on another
[16:56] <jatkins> ok
[16:56] <edmoore> be that via them having the same battery or whatever
[16:56] <edmoore> you should be able to put a multi meter on gnd on one device and gnd on the other, and see 0 ohms resistance between them
[16:56] <jatkins> ok
[16:57] <edmoore> or something very close <0.001 say
[16:58] <jatkins> i've got arduino power gnd -> logomatic power gnd, arduino 3v3 -> logomatic Vcc, arduino TX -> logomatic RX
[16:58] <edmoore> souns ok
[16:58] <jatkins> ok
[16:58] <jatkins> thx
[17:01] <edmoore> mum's pc, venerable old thing, just starting making ratcheting noises from the hdd
[17:02] <jatkins> lol
[17:03] <jatkins> yeah, logomatic uses an lpc ic
[17:13] <robert1971> edmoore: http://www.robertharrison.org/images/icarus/helium.jpg :)
[17:14] <robert1971> Needs a low pressure extension for the filler
[17:17] <edmoore> you have comedy reg
[17:19] <Hiena> robert1971, how much?
[17:20] <robert1971> For the trailer or the helium?
[17:21] <Hiena> The helium.
[17:23] <robert1971> 129.49
[17:24] <Hiena> USD or EUR? Btw, did you ever saw the Thermoplane concept?
[17:25] <robert1971> GBP
[17:25] <robert1971> uk pounds]
[17:28] <Hiena> Ouch... 8 week foodmoney.
[17:33] <robert1971> Some advantages to not being a student. No time to do anything but hae the funds
[17:33] <robert1971> have*
[17:34] <Hiena> Well, actually i'm so long not a student, yet no money for burn.
[17:46] <jatkins> bbl
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[19:12] <edmoore> robert1971: you might like this
[19:13] <edmoore> was just talking to my friend on skype
[19:13] <edmoore> and he said 'my internet is going to cut off in a few seconds'
[19:13] <edmoore> I asked him how he knew, and hes aid 'it's on 65000 packets swapped, and it just dies at 65536'
[19:14] <edmoore> sounds like some piece of windowsness can't deal with a word overflow
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[19:36] Nick change: edmoore -> edmoore|away
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[20:31] <robert1971> wow evening all
[20:32] <robert1971> Just driven 15 miles away from house leaving tx on roof and could still decode morse clear as a bell.
[20:33] <SpeedEvil> :)
[20:38] <natrium42> cool
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[20:41] <natrium42> robert1971: so when's tethered flight? :)
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[21:21] <natrium42> hmm, is there a good Dock replacement?
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[22:41] <Laurenceb_> hi all
[22:41] <Laurenceb_> robert1971: sorry I was away this morning
[22:42] <Laurenceb_> I think its enabled by default, but I never use it - for HAB stuff you need a stable oscillator
[22:42] <Laurenceb_> also the div8 fuse is enabled
[22:42] <Laurenceb_> so your clock is /8 internally
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[23:10] <ShellEvil> Oooh!
[23:10] <ShellEvil> http://www.eeproductcenter.com/analog/review/showArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=RMRLT33ICYRSAQSNDLPSKH0CJUNN2JVN?articleID=210601365
[23:11] <ShellEvil> ($2.50 gyro - checking)
[23:12] <ShellEvil> 0.1 degree/s / sqrt(Hz)
[23:13] <natrium42> LGA...
[23:13] <natrium42> and only one axis
[23:13] <ShellEvil> True.
[23:13] <ShellEvil> But considering comparable parts are 4 times the price per axis.
[23:13] <natrium42> LGA...
[23:13] <natrium42> whyyyy....
[23:17] <SpikeUK> But that's just the device - and prob. in multiples of 100 devices...
[23:18] <ShellEvil> Possibly 10K on reflection
[23:18] <SpikeUK> True! Worth asking for samples...
[23:18] <ShellEvil> I can't seem to find the specification of the A/D converted output
[23:22] Nick change: EI5GTB__ -> EI5GTB
[23:24] <ShellEvil> oh - my bad. Table 4 - 1.55 lsb/ degree/second
[23:26] <SpikeUK> ShellEvil - are we looking at the same device ;-)
[23:26] <ShellEvil> LY530AL
[23:27] <SpikeUK> Yup! http://www.st.com/stonline/products/literature/ds/14991/ly530al.pdf
[00:00] --- Sun Sep 14 2008