[00:05] MoALTz (~no@92.18.15.88) joined #highaltitude. [00:06] MoALTz__ (~no@92.8.224.244) left irc: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [00:11] NigeyS (~EcEnTiAl@cpc5-cdif13-2-0-cust232.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer [00:15] grummund_ (~user@unaffiliated/grummund) left irc: Ping timeout: 276 seconds [00:19] MoALTz_ (~no@92.18.13.118) joined #highaltitude. [00:19] MoALTz (~no@92.18.15.88) left irc: Ping timeout: 248 seconds [00:23] @LVL1WhiteStar: Now testing flight antenna in free space. Note 6 foot Tim for scale. Working pretty well #arhab http://t.co/g90L0Ps http://t.co/F3jZZaU [http://twitter.com/LVL1WhiteStar/status/52163796382392320] [00:32] \o [00:44] GeekShadow (~Antoine@reactos/tester/GeekShadow) left irc: Quit: The cake is a lie ! [00:50] DarkCow (~DarkCow@02d98ef5.bb.sky.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 240 seconds [01:32] Jasperw (~jasperw@93.89.81.29) left irc: Quit: Leaving. [01:53] @LVL1WhiteStar: flight 1/4wav vert dipole in free space pales in comparison to 5/8wav car mount whip. any suggestions for better antenna? #arhab #hamradio [http://twitter.com/LVL1WhiteStar/status/52186399922864128] [02:13] mazzanet (~mazzanet@hpavc/mazzanet) left irc: Ping timeout: 255 seconds [02:16] Zuph (~bradluyst@69.64.6.69) joined #highaltitude. [02:17] It's zuph! [02:17] lulz [02:18] Hey dude [02:23] MoALTz_ (~no@92.18.13.118) left irc: Quit: Leaving [02:29] howdy [02:30] http://t.co/FzmForZ [02:32] http://yfrog.com/gzbkhgtj [02:33] http://yfrog.com/gz2iysj [03:22] Welp, our sat antenna sucks! [03:34] NigelMoby (~nigel@cpc5-cdif13-2-0-cust232.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 246 seconds [03:34] NigelMoby (~nigel@cpc5-cdif13-2-0-cust232.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com) joined #highaltitude. [04:06] Gillerire_ (Jamie@CPE-58-160-210-73.sa.bigpond.net.au) joined #highaltitude. [04:07] jasonb (~jasonb@adsl-66-124-73-250.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) joined #highaltitude. [04:10] Gillerire (Jamie@CPE-58-160-210-73.sa.bigpond.net.au) left irc: Ping timeout: 240 seconds [04:45] Zuph (~bradluyst@69.64.6.69) left irc: Ping timeout: 276 seconds [05:36] SpikeUK (d0331fa2@pdpc/supporter/monthlybyte/spikeuk) joined #highaltitude. [05:54] bhammet (~hellno@203.122.224.49) left irc: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [05:56] Simon-MPFH (~simon@phantom.mpfh.co.uk) joined #highaltitude. [05:58] bhammet (~hellno@203.122.224.49) joined #highaltitude. [06:06] SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) left irc: Ping timeout: 255 seconds [06:15] SpeedEvil (~user@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) joined #highaltitude. [06:37] DagoRed (~dago@208-58-114-73.c3-0.eas-ubr3.atw-eas.pa.cable.rcn.com) left irc: Quit: drifting [06:40] mazzanet (~mazzanet@hpavc/mazzanet) joined #highaltitude. [07:06] Meh morning [07:51] laurence__ (~laurence@host81-154-158-68.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude. [07:53] MoALTz (~no@92.18.13.118) joined #highaltitude. [07:54] Laurenceb__ (~laurence@host81-154-158-68.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 240 seconds [08:05] not that bad NigelMoby :p [08:22] mattltm-alt (~mattltm-a@mail.icm2.org.uk) joined #highaltitude. [08:47] Dooberry (~Dooberry@5ad9667d.bb.sky.com) joined #highaltitude. [08:47] morn. [08:50] MoALTz (~no@92.18.13.118) left irc: Quit: Leaving [09:06] MoALTz (~no@92.18.13.118) joined #highaltitude. [09:17] tis that [09:19] DarkCow (~DarkCow@02d98ef5.bb.sky.com) joined #highaltitude. [09:19] Hi :) [09:21] ello ello [09:28] MoALTz_ (~no@92.18.13.118) joined #highaltitude. [09:31] MoALTz (~no@92.18.13.118) left irc: Ping timeout: 240 seconds [09:31] what ever happened with that trans-atlantic attempt btw? [09:31] i've been off IRC / the radar for the last week [09:32] they had problems with a gps receiver, and a sat modem [09:32] but I think they're making progress on those now [09:32] ahh ok [09:33] ...and your launch? [09:33] can anyone here recommend a eps editor for linux? [09:33] no idea Laurence - i'm a Windows boy although not due to choice; more just out of laziness. [09:33] my launch window opens up in a few weeks -- everything seems to be ready [09:33] kj [09:34] I'm hoping to launch two -- still like the idea of the 'high and far as possible' launch [09:34] haha, unless "far" = taking it to Scotland [09:34] nah, I'm thinking denmark :p [09:35] lol [09:35] who'd pick up the payload?! [09:35] for this one, nobody - it's pretty certain to end up in the north sea [09:35] but I won't have any cameras on it [09:36] it's just a simple flight to see how high or far it can go [09:36] it would be ++epic if it drifted to Denmark though [09:36] that would be fantastic [09:37] or norway! [09:37] yeah, I was about to say that Norway would be more likely? [09:37] though tracking it that direction would be almost impossible [09:37] I'm no meterologist, but the atlantic winds would push it more that way I would have thought? [09:37] generally the winds seem to be south-east [09:38] but mostly just east [09:38] made an embeddable widget for the tracker: http://spacenear.us/tracker/embed-test.php [09:38] oh well, that's part of the run [09:38] still some things left to fix [09:38] *fun [09:41] nn [09:41] ooh nice natrium [09:42] aha inkscape [09:42] ooh this is sweet [09:42] proper gui based vector graphics editing for *nix [09:48] what were you using before? [09:48] gimp [09:49] now i just need to work out the bazillion menus [09:50] heh [09:51] i just use omnigraffle on OSX [09:51] freaking brilliant program [09:53] hmm stuck already :( [09:53] i need to edit an eps, i can import it, but its all one object [10:01] Yeah, no support for layers when importing from eps/ai [10:04] MoALTz (~no@92.18.28.33) joined #highaltitude. [10:06] MoALTz_ (~no@92.18.13.118) left irc: Ping timeout: 250 seconds [10:11] ive got ti working now - id imported an eps i edited with gnuplot [10:11] gnuplto rasterises everything [10:12] ah :) [10:13] bhammet (~hellno@203.122.224.49) left irc: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [10:14] this is very nice XD [10:16] 'It is likely that six or fewer Shillelagh missiles were fired at Iraqi bunkers; this appears to be the only occasion in which Shillelagh missiles were fired in a combat environment, from the inventory of the aforementioned 88,000 missiles produced.' [10:16] Fun [10:18] bhammet (~hellno@203.122.224.49) joined #highaltitude. [10:23] Is speedball still having gps antenna problems? [10:33] from the twitter messages it looks like they've identified the problem at least [10:49] grummund (~user@unaffiliated/grummund) joined #highaltitude. [10:51] So the problem is that the antenna is crap? [10:52] I was thinking that they should try a cross dipole. [10:52] Since I guess the polorisation from the sat is circular. [10:56] what the hell - http://www.reghardware.com/2011/03/28/ipad_2_stronger_than_ipad/ [10:56] how did they make it so flexible [10:57] or a helical antenna [10:57] laurence: The glass is 0.6mm thick or something [11:00] yeah, but its got to be tempeted or something [11:01] some kind of laminate? [11:01] It's clearly laminated. [11:01] oh yeah you can see it shattering [11:01] I question if it's toughened [11:02] See that it doesn't have propagating fractures [11:02] Also - toughening a .5mm thick bit of glass would be challenging. [11:03] It's a very misleading test anyway. [11:03] I don't care about that test - I care about the similar one where it's a whole ipad on the little blocks being pressed on. [11:04] fsphil: A helical would work nice. [11:05] Or better still a qfh antenna [11:05] pity ipad is so lame [11:05] SpeedEvil: see also http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpbOoQpwAFs [11:05] It's not lame - ipad is pretty neat. HW wise. [11:05] yes, hardware wise [11:06] russss: hes not pressing hard enough :P [11:06] heh [11:06] Action: SpeedEvil idly wonders about a silly thing. [11:06] bhammet (~hellno@203.122.224.49) left irc: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [11:07] ipad screen + broken n900. [11:07] lol [11:10] DarkCow (~DarkCow@02d98ef5.bb.sky.com) left irc: Remote host closed the connection [11:10] toshiba ac-100 is pretty good [11:10] pity about the screen [11:11] Idly wondering, as the ipad is damn nearly the only device with 4:3 screen. [11:12] bhammet (~hellno@203.122.224.49) joined #highaltitude. [11:17] heh [11:18] think ill try using inkscape for diagrams in future [11:18] its very nice [11:18] importing graphics from gnuplot as eps works quite well [11:20] juxta (~Terry@CPE-121-219-100-247.lnse2.lon.bigpond.net.au) joined #highaltitude. [11:22] it can also open certain pdfs pretty well [11:23] hmm yeah pdf editing XD [11:30] grummund (~user@unaffiliated/grummund) left irc: Read error: Operation timed out [11:34] grummund (~user@unaffiliated/grummund) joined #highaltitude. [11:46] http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL_v16/html/Shapes-Boxes.html <-nice [11:51] hacky :P [11:51] it's a nice piece of software though [11:54] Simon-MPFH (~simon@phantom.mpfh.co.uk) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer [11:54] Simon-MPFH (~simon@phantom.mpfh.co.uk) joined #highaltitude. [11:55] wonder if armadillo aerospace are finally launching their STIG yet [11:58] SpeedEvil: but you're missing out on this - http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/postmodernism-generator/id379838784?mt=8 [11:58] MoALTz_ (~no@92.18.28.33) joined #highaltitude. [12:02] MoALTz (~no@92.18.28.33) left irc: Ping timeout: 276 seconds [12:02] Nick change: Gillerire_ -> Gillerire [12:13] hi all [12:13] :) [12:25] GW8RAK (~chatzilla@host86-154-164-148.range86-154.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude. [12:28] fsphil (~phil@2001:8b0:34:1:21f:c6ff:fe44:b25b) left irc: Ping timeout: 264 seconds [12:39] grummund (~user@unaffiliated/grummund) left irc: Ping timeout: 240 seconds [12:42] fsphil (~phil@2001:8b0:34:1:21f:c6ff:fe44:b25b) joined #highaltitude. [13:07] Dan-K2VOL (~Adium@74-143-44-42.static.insightbb.com) joined #highaltitude. [13:07] mornign [13:07] Jasperw (~jasperw@skeleton2.london.iofc.org) joined #highaltitude. [13:15] Zuph (~bradluyst@2001:470:8:626:222:43ff:fe71:9992) joined #highaltitude. [13:17] Hi Dan [13:20] hi Matt [13:22] all recovered Dan-K2VOL? [13:22] yes, I've finally caught up on sleep [13:23] SpeedBall-1 is still languishing [13:24] uh-oh [13:26] Gillerire (Jamie@CPE-58-160-210-73.sa.bigpond.net.au) left irc: Quit: Quit [13:26] yeah, see yesterday's tweets from me- http://twitter.com/LVL1WhiteStar [13:27] SamSilver (2985f4df@gateway/web/freenode/ip.41.133.244.223) joined #highaltitude. [13:28] Howdy [13:33] Dan-K2VOL: Antenna problems? [13:38] indeed mattltm-alt [13:41] Turns out, we suck at being RF engineers more than we suck at being other types of engineers :-p [13:42] Afternoon guys. Reading the last tweet, do you mean a 1/4 wave vertical or a half wave dipole? [13:44] here is a great SA antenna http://zs4bfn.co.za/Antenna.asp [13:44] GW8RAK: Our current flight antenna is a 1/4 wave dipole. We have a 5/8ths wave car mount antenna for ground testing, and it picks up sats a *lot* better than the 1/4 wave [13:45] Do you mean a dipole with each element being a 1/4 wave, or a 1/4 wave overall length? [13:45] Orbcomm documentation suggests a 5/8th or 1/2 wave. A quad helix would be best, but we *probably* can't spare the weight. [13:45] Each element being 1/4 wave [13:45] Okay Zuph. Just confused there. Is this for the downlink? [13:45] Downlink and Uplink via the Orbcomm Satellite network. [13:46] Sat -> Balloon is 137 MHz, Balloon -> Sat is 149-150 MHz. [13:46] Of course, we might also be suffering from a bad SWR meter. [13:47] Bad SWR meter measures our flight antenna at 1.1:1. Two other SWR meters (Both cheaper rat shack models) measure at slower to 2:1. [13:47] s/bad/dubious [13:47] Okay. The "problem" with a dipole is that it has a radiation pattern like a doughnut around the centre of the dipole. For this application where satellites are all above, half the radiation is wasted as it goes to the horizon or downwards. [13:48] Could you fix a 1/4wave vertical and groundplane on top of your payload which transmits and receives from the horizon and upwards? [13:49] The maximum of the radiation pattern from this would be upwards at about 45 degrees [13:51] Well, that isn't too good either. Orbcomm documentation states that the best sat coverage is when the bird is between 25 and 55 degrees above the horizon. [13:52] The 1/4 vertical will perform well in the range of 25 to 55 degrees. [13:53] Jasperw (~jasperw@skeleton2.london.iofc.org) left irc: Read error: Operation timed out [13:54] Suggestions on the ground plane? Top of the payload box is 30cm x 30cm, and right below it sits all our RF sensitive electronics. [13:55] The ground plane can be just 4 * 1/4 radials (= stiff wire) spreading out from the central connector. The ground plane will tend to isolate the electronics below it, from the radiating element above it. [13:57] the more radials the better > thin copper foil would work [13:57] weight a factor though [13:57] grummund (~user@unaffiliated/grummund) joined #highaltitude. [13:58] Right now, we're leaning towards a 1/2 wave dipole, due to the documentation from Orbcomm showing its performance. [13:58] such an antenna would also work very well with our existing antenna mounting rigging. [13:58] Hoe about a cross dipole? What polorisation is the signal from the bird? [13:59] With the existing dipole having a redundant 1/4 wave length long element, this would equate to 2 short radials, so the only weight gain would be other 2 radials [13:59] Perhaps 30g or thereabouts [14:00] I would be tempted to try a phased crossed dipole. Works great for WX sat reception. [14:01] mattltm-alt: Circular, but we get good results with a 5/8ths wave verticle ground plane for testing. [14:01] Right now, we need a solution that we can bodge together with minimum time, effort, work and precision. [14:01] But the wide frequency split will certainly cause mismatch problems. A folded dipole could overcome that, but you'd need "wide" elements, i.e. not wire. [14:02] If you get good results from the 5/8ths vertical plus ground plane, why not replicate that? [14:03] Jasperw (~jasperw@skeleton2.london.iofc.org) joined #highaltitude. [14:04] We would if we could. The ground plane is a car roof. Unfortunately, we can't rig up multiple radial ground elements without reconfiguring our payload chain to ensure the antenna won't become fouled in our rigging. [14:05] Just some short radials across the top of the payload box would be sufficient. They may not be the ideal length at about 51cm, but you can fit 42cm in. [14:06] A cross dipole will be good for circular polarisation.. Here is a link to a simple one.. http://www.west.net/~jay/turnstile.html [14:08] i still say we fly the entire distance tethered [14:11] that circular one would it work verticle over horizontal? [14:13] spacefelix (809ecabb@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.158.202.187) joined #highaltitude. [14:13] WhiteStarMC-171 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) left irc: Ping timeout: 246 seconds [14:13] WhiteStarMC-174 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) left irc: Ping timeout: 246 seconds [14:13] WhiteStarMC-188 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) left irc: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [14:15] I dont see why not [14:16] Depends on where the bird is in relation to the antenna [14:16] smea (~smealum@89-156-20-102.rev.numericable.fr) joined #highaltitude. [14:18] Potentially anywhere in the sky. [14:19] http://www.tpub.com/content/neets/14182/img/14182_211_1.jpg [14:22] I would give it a go. They were origanly designed for circular polorised satalites. [14:22] Just make sure the correct circular polarisation is used i.e. Clockwise or Anti-clickwise. [14:24] Wikipedia has a good example of horizontal vs vertical mounting.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turnstile_antenna [14:25] WhiteStarMC-174 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) joined #highaltitude. [14:25] WhiteStarMC-188 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) joined #highaltitude. [14:25] WhiteStarMC-171 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) joined #highaltitude. [14:30] juxta (~Terry@CPE-121-219-100-247.lnse2.lon.bigpond.net.au) left irc: Ping timeout: 264 seconds [14:33] WhiteStarMC-188 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) left irc: Ping timeout: 246 seconds [14:33] WhiteStarMC-171 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) left irc: Ping timeout: 246 seconds [14:33] WhiteStarMC-174 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) left irc: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [14:36] @dbsnyder: Explorer Post 632 Flt 2011A was recovered, reached 89720ft traveled 90 miles (101deg) duration 99min #ARHAB will post link to photos [http://twitter.com/dbsnyder/status/52378472714207232] [14:37] Please look at this antenna http://www.sanav.com/gps_antennas/dbgca/au2-vhf.htm [14:39] GPS Antenna VHF Antenna > 1575.42MHz 130~150 MHz [14:39] duel purpose [14:46] WhiteStarMC-174 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) joined #highaltitude. [14:46] WhiteStarMC-188 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) joined #highaltitude. [14:46] WhiteStarMC-171 (~WhiteStar@69.64.6.69) joined #highaltitude. [14:51] spacefelix (809ecabb@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.158.202.187) left irc: Ping timeout: 253 seconds [14:53] _jkominar (~justin@64.235.97.218) joined #highaltitude. [14:56] spacefelix (8a734678@gateway/web/freenode/ip.138.115.70.120) joined #highaltitude. [15:01] Nick change: _jkominar -> jkominar_ [15:01] SpikeUK (d0331fa2@pdpc/supporter/monthlybyte/spikeuk) left irc: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [15:11] grummund (~user@unaffiliated/grummund) left irc: Ping timeout: 260 seconds [15:12] @dbsnyder: Explorer Post 632 Flt 2011A flight path http://bit.ly/ej31xK #ARHAB [http://twitter.com/dbsnyder/status/52387465314570240] [15:12] grummund (~user@unaffiliated/grummund) joined #highaltitude. [15:27] GW8RAK (~chatzilla@host86-154-164-148.range86-154.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86.1 [Firefox 3.6.16/20110319135224] [15:33] samsilver that antenna looks nice, but requires a ground plane, (i.e. vehicle roof or large metal plate) not included and looks pretty heavy [15:40] watching the footage from the stratHAB guys... looking sweet. [15:40] Daviey (~Daviey@ubuntu/member/daviey) left irc: Excess Flood [15:42] Dan-K2VOL True - was thinking ahead . I am sure WhiteStar will come up with a lighter one for there flight [15:43] Hibby > save me the effort and please post link [15:43] SamSilver: http://127.0.0.1 [15:43] Thanx [15:43] ;) [15:44] hmmmm [15:44] ... that's your localhost ip... essentially, I'm watching an AVI on my office desktop... [15:50] @fourgreenis: I'm impressed. RT @dbsnyder: Explorer Post 632 Flt 2011A flight path http://bit.ly/ej31xK #ARHAB [http://twitter.com/fourgreenis/status/52397119067271169] [15:51] they're going to edit it and stick it online, we were just having a brief chat about the progress of their project [15:53] Hiddy I look fwd to that [15:54] smea (~smealum@89-156-20-102.rev.numericable.fr) left irc: Ping timeout: 250 seconds [15:54] jasonb (~jasonb@adsl-66-124-73-250.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) left irc: Ping timeout: 250 seconds [16:02] Daviey (~Daviey@ubuntu/member/daviey) joined #highaltitude. [16:07] LazyLeopard (~irc-clien@chocky.demon.co.uk) joined #highaltitude. [16:14] Zuph (~bradluyst@2001:470:8:626:222:43ff:fe71:9992) left irc: Ping timeout: 260 seconds [16:17] grummund (~user@unaffiliated/grummund) left irc: Read error: Operation timed out [16:17] grummund (~user@unaffiliated/grummund) joined #highaltitude. [16:19] did you guys get to use the track.whitestarballoon.com page while it was under load on the White Star launch attempt? [16:22] Zupht0r (~Brad@2001:470:8:626:4966:ffe9:7f2b:1121) joined #highaltitude. [16:23] wondering how it performed under load, I was out at the launch [16:31] Action: LazyLeopard missed it, unfortunately. [16:33] yeah was rather late at night [16:36] Nick change: Zupht0r -> Zuph [16:36] Dan-K2VOL: Talking about the website? [16:36] zuph yeah [16:37] haven't heard much from anyone who was watching the flight about how things performed, I guess that means it didn't perform irritatingly [16:38] though a few complaints on the slowness and crashiness of mibbit embedded [16:38] Dan-K2VOL: FWIW, the servers didn't even *blink* under the load [16:38] Under 10% CPU for all but the SQL. SQL fluttered between 50% and 0%, depending on where in the update cycle it was. [16:39] I had track.whitestar up the whole time and it seemed fine. [16:40] Mibbit problems are going to be problems with mibbit, I'm afraid. [16:40] webchat.freenode has a better performance record, but is more difficult to use, and can't be embedded [16:40] Along with about 12 other browser tabs mind lol [16:42] Zuph: you could just iframe it, right? [16:43] I suppose, although they might block attempts to do things like that. [16:43] I thought natrium42 embedded it for a while; not 100% sure [16:44] zuph, I know the servers didn't blink, but that's not what matters in the real world, what matters is how the experience was perceived by the users [16:45] I'm not suggesting any changes at the moment, I"m just trying to get a feel for how it went for the viewers [16:46] got a thunder shower close by, gonna duck, later byeeeeee [16:46] ttyl sam [16:46] good to hear nigelmoby [16:47] did you have the ustream video up nigel? [16:47] SamSilver (2985f4df@gateway/web/freenode/ip.41.133.244.223) left irc: Quit: Page closed [16:48] Yup, it paused a few times but overall it was very stable. [16:51] Dan-K2VOL: Of course real world performance is all that matters. I only mean to eliminate one source of blame for poor performance. [16:54] Hey zuph! [16:54] Hey NigelMoby [16:54] How you doing Mr? [16:56] Heh, low on time, but caught up on sleep for once. [16:59] Yey good stuff, sleep is good! [17:04] Reading the list and Twitter, so it deems the sat issue is down to the antenna and not a modem fault? [17:04] Seems* [17:05] Yes [17:05] Our 5/8ths wave with a ground plane gives us excellent sat coverage. [17:06] Our 1/4 wave dipole gives us *marginal* coverage in free space, but crap on the ground. [17:07] Ohh that's interesting, same problem for the gps? Antenna or.... [17:08] Haven't looked at that yet. [17:09] That's my project for tonight. [17:10] Bet ure really looking forward to that lol [17:11] hah [17:11] I'm hoping it's a loose wire or something :-p [17:11] Just remember if it doesn't work you need a bigger hammer ;) [17:13] I bet its something really simple but important enough to cause no lock. [17:13] Yeah [17:14] Always the way. [17:16] spacefelix (8a734678@gateway/web/freenode/ip.138.115.70.120) left irc: Ping timeout: 252 seconds [17:17] well nigelmoby the nice thing is that our main payload GPS is working fine [17:18] Well that is good news Dan. [17:18] oh, btw, Dan-K2VOL, I finally got that Seeed studio order with their version of the openlog [17:19] Supposedly, it'll do I2C [17:19] awesome [17:19] Tigga (~Tigga@lanch-178-014.resnet.cranfield.ac.uk) joined #highaltitude. [17:19] also **finally** got those PCBs [17:19] transformers are more voodoo black magic than hf antennas are [17:20] BTW did ustream not archive the launch attempt video? [17:22] nice Zuph [17:22] haha imrcly [17:23] NigelMoby, it's unlikely. the guy who set up the streaming didn't do it thorugh the typical ustream broadcaster interface :-( [17:23] it's a shame you can't have a local high-resolution copy with u-stream [17:24] you can. [17:24] oooh [17:24] we could, just take more work [17:24] http://www.manycam.com/ [17:24] or similar [17:24] we're already using WireCast, which does the same, I believe [17:25] need to enable that next time [17:25] how was the video NigelMoby? [17:25] I loved the bit in the car -- worked really well [17:25] really! glad to hear that, I had no idea if it would come out [17:25] that was via Skype on the iphone [17:26] Ah that's a shame but mm. It was good Dan very clear, a few pauses but nothing major [17:26] must be good gsm coverage -- I doubt that would work here [17:26] could you hear the voice audio coming/going to us in that part too? [17:26] Oh BTW [17:26] In the car [17:26] well, it was good until it was gone on the car trip! [17:26] the voice in the car was a bit quiet [17:26] In the car it was skype to my *Android* phone :-p [17:27] it was Skype Video from my iPhone [17:27] Ure number got broadcast brad [17:28] Dan sorry not brad [17:28] the audio was using skype to brad's telephone phone part of his android phone [17:29] I was worried the video would be nothing but a mess with all the road bumps [17:29] we could hardly hear mission control in the car too [17:29] will have to bring headphones next time [17:29] MrCraig (~MrCraig@host86-161-119-216.range86-161.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude. [17:29] kd0mto (~dago@208-58-114-73.c3-0.eas-ubr3.atw-eas.pa.cable.rcn.com) joined #highaltitude. [17:30] my number got broadcast nigel? [17:30] the one I spoke to ATC ? [17:30] Also Dan, when it went to answerphone the msg got broadcast including cell number [17:30] I don't know when that happened [17:31] Ahh, I think it was when Skype dropped [17:31] I must have fell asleep before that [17:31] evening [17:32] ack, there's a big bee flying about my screen [17:32] Action: MrCraig hands fsphil a swatter [17:32] I tried to mute it in mumble but it wouldn't work [17:32] ah -- it actually found the open window [17:32] MNSP (Mit@cpc1-lutn3-0-0-cust700.9-3.cable.virginmedia.com) joined #highaltitude. [17:32] that's a first [17:33] spring is definitely here [17:33] hello all :) [17:33] hi MNSP [17:33] Lol Phil [17:33] hi hi MrCraig n' MNSP :) [17:34] trust all is well [17:34] long day, pesky time change [17:35] lol, thrown me a couple of times... forgot to change my wristwatch [17:37] I'm looking at Quadrifilar helical antenna designs, has anyone made one? [17:38] Dan-K2VOL: yeah, made one for listening to APT weather sats [17:40] Evening Jon [17:40] evening :) [17:40] Dan-K2VOL: what are you wanting one for? [17:40] evening jonsowman [17:41] evening MrCraig [17:41] What's a quad....thingy? [17:41] googled it just now [17:42] very dapper looking [17:42] I mean that in traditional sense of dapper not schoolboy [17:42] http://www.hexoc.com/pages/sgs-weather/satellite-receiver.php [17:42] towards the bottom [17:43] that's a 137MHz centre QFH [17:43] Very odd looking thing [17:44] Nick change: laurence__ -> Laurenceb [17:45] look a bit like vertical wind turbine thingys [17:45] why are antenna so expeeeensive and yet wire coat hangers so cheap? [17:45] MrCraig: hehe, yeah, we looked at buying a QFH but they're silly expensive [17:45] so we built one instead :) [17:46] I don't know the acronym - but yeah constructing has to be cheaper with most as I'm learning [17:47] quadrifilar helicoidal [17:47] "QFH" is quicker to type :P [17:47] still bemused lol - I don't know a lot about the different types as yet, still some learning to do [17:47] Much easier to say to :p [17:47] NigelMoby: haha indeed [17:47] what were you thiking of making MrCraig.. am thinking about my first own Yaggi [17:48] jonsowman I'm trying to figure out how to get better received gain on orbcomm [17:48] Thinking of a Yagi too [17:48] you seen the vid linked from ukhas? [17:49] yes [17:49] Dan-K2VOL: right. not too familiar with orbcomm but the QFH is a pretty good antenna. I assume it's circularly polarised [17:49] the woman with a slightly irritating voice video right? [17:49] yeah Right Hand CP [17:49] yeah [17:49] we found them very good for listening to NOAA weather sats [17:49] but to fly on a balloon I've got to figure out if it can be made as light as a moth's wing [17:50] yes mrcraig, she makes it look simple, but I watched it again last night... [17:50] while having higher gain than an equal weight dipole [17:50] and theres a few things she says, that info is avail on net [17:50] *nods [17:50] Dan-K2VOL: yeah we looked into this quite a bit a while back [17:51] they're not the easiest antenna to construct in a lightweight manner [17:51] and I bet the final decision was too heavy and too difficult? [17:51] that was part of it [17:51] we used eggbeaters instead in the end [17:51] have you considered those? [17:52] now its not everyday you hear that in a serious conversation [17:52] I've heard of them, any suggested links? I'm no RF guru [17:53] ha MNSP yeah, that seems to be the case for alot of these balloon convos [17:53] http://davehouston.net/eggbeater.htm [17:54] like - "the freezer won't warm up beyond 50C even with the power off!" [17:54] (i.e. the dry ice-air circulation fan power) [17:54] btw mrCraig, the chap I go tmy ft790 from recomended this chaps site : http://www.g0ksc.co.uk/ [17:54] he sells and provides free info too [17:54] thanks mnsp [17:55] Dan-K2VOL: I'll try and get some more info on the eggbeaters we used [17:55] Matt_soton will know more [17:56] thanks jonsowman [17:56] do they work well without groundplane? [17:56] I couldn't say really [17:57] did they work on the balloons OK? [17:57] our receiving one was mounted on a car roof, which is of course an excellent groundplane [17:57] Dan-K2VOL: yep [17:57] http://balloon.hexoc.com/gallery/displayimage.php?album=17&pos=45 [17:57] best pic I can find at the mo [17:58] payload groundplane was ali foil [17:59] _ (Mit@cpc1-lutn3-0-0-cust700.9-3.cable.virginmedia.com) joined #highaltitude. [17:59] MNSP (Mit@cpc1-lutn3-0-0-cust700.9-3.cable.virginmedia.com) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer [17:59] Nick change: _ -> Guest90639 [17:59] Guest90639 (Mit@cpc1-lutn3-0-0-cust700.9-3.cable.virginmedia.com) left irc: Client Quit [18:00] MNSP (Mit@cpc1-lutn3-0-0-cust700.9-3.cable.virginmedia.com) joined #highaltitude. [18:00] thanks johnsowman [18:01] interesting pics jonsowman [18:01] MNSP: :), was from the first Apex payload [18:01] raises questions... what is the average age of HABers (is that a word?) [18:02] but perhaps more relevant is camera lens exposed or not? [18:02] I've no idea, I was 17 when benoxley, Matt_soton and I started Apex I [18:02] smea (~smealum@89-156-20-102.rev.numericable.fr) joined #highaltitude. [18:02] MNSP: on Apex I it wasn't, but we've since learned that is a bad idea [18:02] Apex II has exposed cam lenses [18:02] smea (~smealum@89-156-20-102.rev.numericable.fr) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer [18:03] the box of apeex I had foil on the bottom as a ground plane [18:03] smea (~smealum@89-156-20-102.rev.numericable.fr) joined #highaltitude. [18:03] Action: MrCraig is 32 2 days before launch day [18:04] Matt_soton: yeah [18:04] what design did we use for the ants? [18:04] two loops seperated by some delay line [18:04] website etc? [18:04] cant remember [18:04] sorry jon I understand what you mean about apex 1 [18:04] there are sources [18:05] GeekShadow (~Antoine@reactos/tester/GeekShadow) joined #highaltitude. [18:05] I had a link at one point [18:05] we made a quad helicodial antenna as well i remember [18:05] yeah we were talking about that :) [18:05] that worked well [18:05] it did [18:06] so you were [18:06] :P [18:07] http://on6wg.pagesperso-orange.fr/Doc/Antenne%20Eggbeater-Engl-Part1-Full.pdf [18:07] i remember using tha [18:07] yeah that's the one [18:07] Dan-K2VOL: ^^ see that link [18:07] thanks Matt_soton [18:08] smea (~smealum@89-156-20-102.rev.numericable.fr) left irc: Ping timeout: 250 seconds [18:09] looking at that reminds of something else... how many use radar reflectors? [18:09] The one I wanted was a bugger to find, turns out they don't seem to sell them in uk [18:10] it's not a requirement in the UK (unlike some other places - US perhaps?) [18:10] I wouldn't bother if I were you [18:10] yeah that was my understanding [18:10] but am sure it asks if you do in the caa form [18:11] probably, has been a long time since I've filled one of those out, thank goodness [18:11] but there's no need to put one on [18:11] lol, have a proper look at that was first thing I did when I got interested in this [18:12] it asks, but I always just put "None" [18:12] no, it was clear on their that it wasn't a requirement [18:12] lol hello fsphil [18:12] right dineer time... [18:12] MNSP (Mit@cpc1-lutn3-0-0-cust700.9-3.cable.virginmedia.com) left irc: Quit: Leaving [18:13] smea (~smealum@89-156-20-102.rev.numericable.fr) joined #highaltitude. [18:13] thanks jonsowmand and matt for link [18:13] it's not a requirement for the small balloons [18:14] I suspect that adding a radar reflector will probably make the balloon more dangerous than not having one :P [18:14] NigeyS (~EcEnTiAl@cpc5-cdif13-2-0-cust232.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com) joined #highaltitude. [18:15] russss, I'm not sure what you mean? [18:15] well, in terms of adding more bulk/weight to it [18:16] I dunno [18:16] I'm not sure how easy it is to spot a small radar reflector on plane/ATC radar anyway [18:16] if it's tuned for the correct frequency, it will show up fine. if not, it will not [18:17] they require it for the purpose of spotting it on radar, otherwise they wouldn't require it. It's only needed on larger balloons, and will be superseded by ADS-B (Mode-S) anyway when airlines get around to implementing it [18:17]